Michigan Jeepers Loose member to strapping accident..
#121
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Michigan Jeepers Loose member to strapping accident..
That's ingenious. I'm keeping a copy of that pic in my glovebox.
"Steve" <xjlifter@bogus.com> wrote in message
news:2t55ncF1r6m88U1@uni-berlin.de...
> http://xjeep.dyndns.org/slipstrap.jpg
>
> Steve
> http://xjeep.dyndns.org
>
"Steve" <xjlifter@bogus.com> wrote in message
news:2t55ncF1r6m88U1@uni-berlin.de...
> http://xjeep.dyndns.org/slipstrap.jpg
>
> Steve
> http://xjeep.dyndns.org
>
#122
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Michigan Jeepers Loose member to strapping accident..
Umm, the strap was wrapped around the cross member and I only needed one
length....
Mike
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>
> Yep. I'd wager a dowel would have kept your crossmember from ripping off.
> What was the strap hooked to on your vehicle that it would remove the
> crossmember?
>
> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:416D5703.E7159BAA@sympatico.ca...
> > Have you ever seen how hard a strap can come up?
> >
> > Hard enough of an 'impact' to shear hooks and bolts and tear off
> > bumpers.
> >
> > The stick sees the exact same impact.
> >
> > The impact from trying to ****** Steve Seppala's YJ out of a snowbank
> > snapped off my rear cross member. We are talking channel steel
> > structurally welded onto the frame.
> >
> > This thread started because a gent got killed when a 'steel' clamp let
> > loose in between two straps due to that same impact. A chunk of wood is
> > 'just' as deadly stuck in the same place that steel clamp was if it lets
> > loose!
> >
> > To each their own I guess, but 'I' sure won't recommend using a freaking
> > stick as a structural point in a tow setup that is for sure and that
> > Mark gent still needs to be slapped!
> >
> > Mike
> >
> > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > >
> > > Of course the dowel sees the forces of towing, but it is not impact
> forces
> > > like a bat and baseball contacting.
> > >
> > > If a tow hook goes, then using a dowel as a toggle will mean the
> connection
> > > will immediately loosen and absorb some of the projectile energy that
> would
> > > otherwise be transmitted to the hook. By using the dowel as a means to
> > > disconnect the looped-together straps, it becomes part of the projectile
> as
> > > well.
> > >
> > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > > news:416D4A19.601CB0C1@sympatico.ca...
> > > > Have you ever snapped a baseball bat? Hooks have even been known to
> > > > snap and hook bolts shear.
> > > >
> > > > The dowel certainly 'does' see the impact forces. 100% of them as a
> > > > matter of fact.
> > > >
> > > > Wow.....
> > > >
> > > > Mike
> > > >
> > > > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Down boy. I said that tongue-in-cheek. Mr. Smith demonstrated with a
> 2"
> > > > > hardwood dowel. How he instructed us is exactly how I said it, using
> a
> > > the
> > > > > dowel as a toggle through the loop of one of the straps. The dowel
> > > doesn't
> > > > > see impact forces. I never said he'd cut down a sapling and strip
> the
> > > bark
> > > > > off. It's just something you carry with you.
> > > > >
> > > > > It stuck with me because (a) he never looped a strap back on itself
> and
> > > (b)
> > > > > as soon as he pulled the dowel out, the straps came right apart
> without
> > > > > unlooping.
> > > > >
> > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > > > > news:416D3EDB.22505CF4@sympatico.ca...
> > > > > > Wow, that is freaking amazing!!!!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I cannot believe someone who seems so 'Jeep savvy' would be stupid
> > > > > > enough to rely on an unknown stick to trust his life too.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Maybe he has a death wish?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Are you sure you just didn't mistake his using the stick as a knot
> > > > > > holder like I describe below so it can be undone for using the
> stick
> > > as
> > > > > > part of the structure?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > My straps are rated for 30,000 lb each.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The shear force on a baseball bat or on an ax handle or hammer
> handle
> > > > > > under impact is 'not' very high. I have busted more than one by
> just
> > > > > > hitting a ball or a log or a board slightly wrong. And you are
> > > talking
> > > > > > an unknown freaking chunk of tree?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So when I take my Jeep and '******' a stuck vehicle using vehicle
> > > > > > momentum to the point of breaking a strap or ripping bumpers off,
> I
> > > sure
> > > > > > as hell wouldn't want to be relying on a stupid stick as the
> 'fuse' in
> > > > > > the equation!!!!!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > That would just be suicidal. Literally.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I would recommend you watch a Logger's safety video to see just
> how
> > > fast
> > > > > > and hard pieces or chips of wood will fly when broken under
> pressure.
> > > > > > Or even hurricane test videos where 2x4's go right through
> concrete
> > > > > > walls.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Sorry Matt, but you must be mistaken on the placement of the
> stick.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Mike
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Mark Smith...
> > > > > > > http://jeepjamboreeusa.com/aboutus.htm
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Like Steve said, it's a tree with the bark peeled off...
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > > > > > > news:416C52F5.D28CAF86@sympatico.ca...
> > > > > > > > He just didn't know the right way to use the dowel. :-(
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > You put the two loops together so they lock. The dowel just
> goes
> > > > > > > > between them so you can pry them apart.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Hole one loop up. Put second strap's loop over one you are
> > > holding
> > > > > then
> > > > > > > > feed the second straps other end through the first loop.
> Bingo,
> > > two
> > > > > > > > locked together loops.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Wood can go just as ballistic as steel if it snaps under
> pressure.
> > > In
> > > > > > > > my mind the person who showed you that method should be
> slapped.
> > > > > Hard!.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Mike
> > > > > > > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> > > > > > > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I met Mark Smith at a Jeep Jamboree a few years ago, and he
> > > showed
> > > > > us a
> > > > > > > > > different way of connecting straps with a dowel...pull the
> end
> > > of
> > > > > Strap
> > > > > > > 1
> > > > > > > > > through the loop of Strap 2, then insert the dowel into the
> loop
> > > of
> > > > > > > Strap 1,
> > > > > > > > > essentially making the dowel a toggle. If the dowel breaks,
> it
> > > will
> > > > > > > break
> > > > > > > > > inward, and the wood pieces won't fly toward either vehicle.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I made a dowel out of a hardwood sledgehammer handle. It
> should
> > > have
> > > > > a
> > > > > > > > > minimum diameter of 2 inches. I've used this method several
> > > times
> > > > > and
> > > > > > > have
> > > > > > > > > yet to have a problem with breakage, and when done, you slip
> the
> > > > > dowel
> > > > > > > out
> > > > > > > > > and the two straps instantly come apart.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I've never personally met the fellow that was killed, but I
> am
> > > sure
> > > > > some
> > > > > > > > > members of my off-road club know him. What a tragedy.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > "Jerry Bransford" <jerrypb@***.net> wrote in message
> > > > > > > > > news:R0Tad.29426$_a3.9250@fed1read05...
> > > > > > > > > > The dowel doesn't really hold the straps, they are (should
> be)
> > > > > looped
> > > > > > > > > > through each other. The dowel is only (should only) be
> there
> > > so
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > straps
> > > > > > > > > > can be pulled apart after the pull has been completed.
> > > Without
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > dowel,
> > > > > > > > > > they can be difficult to disengage the straps from each
> other
> > > due
> > > > > to
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > force of the pull.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Jerry
> > > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > > Jerry Bransford
> > > > > > > > > > PP-ASEL N6TAY
> > > > > > > > > > See the Geezer Jeep at
> > > > > > > > > > http://members.***.net/jerrypb/
> > > > > > > > > > "aGraham" <aarongraham@mac.com.removeme> wrote in message
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > news:aarongraham-86F2F0.11170112102004@corp-radius.supernews.com...
> > > > > > > > > > > Very sad....
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > I know I have used a clevis for this purpose in the
> past,
> > > but
> > > > > > > recently a
> > > > > > > > > > > wheeling buddy showed me how to use a 1.5" diameter
> wooden
> > > dowel
> > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > > > connect 2 straps when one is not long enough. Would
> believe
> > > the
> > > > > > > dowel
> > > > > > > > > > > would be the first thing to break, or if not it would
> not
> > > have
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > weight/inertia to become a projectile.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Any one have any ideas/cautions on using this instead?
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > In article <OaSad.79414$vO1.445558@nnrp1.uunet.ca>,
> > > > > > > > > > > "Jeff" <jrhiltz@av.easlink.ca> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >> This is sooo sad....it breaks my heart...the tears have
> > > been
> > > > > > > shed....I
> > > > > > > > > > >> don't
> > > > > > > > > > >> know the man, but is a Jeeper and means he is all our
> > > friend...
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> I'm a new Jeeper and our club has had many discussions
> on
> > > > > tugging
> > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > > >> what
> > > > > > > > > > >> to use and not to use...
> > > > > > > > > > >> and I have already seen this joining two straps
> together by
> > > a
> > > > > > > > > cleavis....
> > > > > > > > > > >> I
> > > > > > > > > > >> know I will never see it again NOW....I will never let
> this
> > > > > happen
> > > > > > > in
> > > > > > > > > my
> > > > > > > > > > >> presence as it has really opened my eyes...
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> God Bless the family and friends of the deceased...
> > > > > > > > > > >> you are in our prayers....
> > > > > > > > > > >> Jeff
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> "JeepNutz" <jeepinDAMMITgene@ISAID.NO.SPAM> wrote in
> > > message
> > > > > > > > > > >> news:RhCad.243631$3l3.183113@attbi_s03...
> > > > > > > > > > >> > To all the newbies out there.. straps are
> dangerous
> > > > > > > animals...
> > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > >
> > >
> http://michiganjeepers.com/eve/ubb.x...109322&m=90210
> > > > > > > > > > >> 6753&p=1
> > > > > > > > > > >> > --
> > > > > > > > > > >> > Gene
> > > > > > > > > > >> > Jeep, because life is an adventure, not a race.
> > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > > > o_o_o_o
> > > > > > > > > > > /| ,[_____],
> > > > > > > > > > > |¯¯¯L --O|||||||O-
> > > > > > > > > > > ()_)¯()_) ¯¯¯¯¯ )_)
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
length....
Mike
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>
> Yep. I'd wager a dowel would have kept your crossmember from ripping off.
> What was the strap hooked to on your vehicle that it would remove the
> crossmember?
>
> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:416D5703.E7159BAA@sympatico.ca...
> > Have you ever seen how hard a strap can come up?
> >
> > Hard enough of an 'impact' to shear hooks and bolts and tear off
> > bumpers.
> >
> > The stick sees the exact same impact.
> >
> > The impact from trying to ****** Steve Seppala's YJ out of a snowbank
> > snapped off my rear cross member. We are talking channel steel
> > structurally welded onto the frame.
> >
> > This thread started because a gent got killed when a 'steel' clamp let
> > loose in between two straps due to that same impact. A chunk of wood is
> > 'just' as deadly stuck in the same place that steel clamp was if it lets
> > loose!
> >
> > To each their own I guess, but 'I' sure won't recommend using a freaking
> > stick as a structural point in a tow setup that is for sure and that
> > Mark gent still needs to be slapped!
> >
> > Mike
> >
> > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > >
> > > Of course the dowel sees the forces of towing, but it is not impact
> forces
> > > like a bat and baseball contacting.
> > >
> > > If a tow hook goes, then using a dowel as a toggle will mean the
> connection
> > > will immediately loosen and absorb some of the projectile energy that
> would
> > > otherwise be transmitted to the hook. By using the dowel as a means to
> > > disconnect the looped-together straps, it becomes part of the projectile
> as
> > > well.
> > >
> > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > > news:416D4A19.601CB0C1@sympatico.ca...
> > > > Have you ever snapped a baseball bat? Hooks have even been known to
> > > > snap and hook bolts shear.
> > > >
> > > > The dowel certainly 'does' see the impact forces. 100% of them as a
> > > > matter of fact.
> > > >
> > > > Wow.....
> > > >
> > > > Mike
> > > >
> > > > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Down boy. I said that tongue-in-cheek. Mr. Smith demonstrated with a
> 2"
> > > > > hardwood dowel. How he instructed us is exactly how I said it, using
> a
> > > the
> > > > > dowel as a toggle through the loop of one of the straps. The dowel
> > > doesn't
> > > > > see impact forces. I never said he'd cut down a sapling and strip
> the
> > > bark
> > > > > off. It's just something you carry with you.
> > > > >
> > > > > It stuck with me because (a) he never looped a strap back on itself
> and
> > > (b)
> > > > > as soon as he pulled the dowel out, the straps came right apart
> without
> > > > > unlooping.
> > > > >
> > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > > > > news:416D3EDB.22505CF4@sympatico.ca...
> > > > > > Wow, that is freaking amazing!!!!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I cannot believe someone who seems so 'Jeep savvy' would be stupid
> > > > > > enough to rely on an unknown stick to trust his life too.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Maybe he has a death wish?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Are you sure you just didn't mistake his using the stick as a knot
> > > > > > holder like I describe below so it can be undone for using the
> stick
> > > as
> > > > > > part of the structure?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > My straps are rated for 30,000 lb each.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The shear force on a baseball bat or on an ax handle or hammer
> handle
> > > > > > under impact is 'not' very high. I have busted more than one by
> just
> > > > > > hitting a ball or a log or a board slightly wrong. And you are
> > > talking
> > > > > > an unknown freaking chunk of tree?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So when I take my Jeep and '******' a stuck vehicle using vehicle
> > > > > > momentum to the point of breaking a strap or ripping bumpers off,
> I
> > > sure
> > > > > > as hell wouldn't want to be relying on a stupid stick as the
> 'fuse' in
> > > > > > the equation!!!!!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > That would just be suicidal. Literally.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I would recommend you watch a Logger's safety video to see just
> how
> > > fast
> > > > > > and hard pieces or chips of wood will fly when broken under
> pressure.
> > > > > > Or even hurricane test videos where 2x4's go right through
> concrete
> > > > > > walls.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Sorry Matt, but you must be mistaken on the placement of the
> stick.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Mike
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Mark Smith...
> > > > > > > http://jeepjamboreeusa.com/aboutus.htm
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Like Steve said, it's a tree with the bark peeled off...
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > > > > > > news:416C52F5.D28CAF86@sympatico.ca...
> > > > > > > > He just didn't know the right way to use the dowel. :-(
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > You put the two loops together so they lock. The dowel just
> goes
> > > > > > > > between them so you can pry them apart.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Hole one loop up. Put second strap's loop over one you are
> > > holding
> > > > > then
> > > > > > > > feed the second straps other end through the first loop.
> Bingo,
> > > two
> > > > > > > > locked together loops.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Wood can go just as ballistic as steel if it snaps under
> pressure.
> > > In
> > > > > > > > my mind the person who showed you that method should be
> slapped.
> > > > > Hard!.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Mike
> > > > > > > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> > > > > > > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I met Mark Smith at a Jeep Jamboree a few years ago, and he
> > > showed
> > > > > us a
> > > > > > > > > different way of connecting straps with a dowel...pull the
> end
> > > of
> > > > > Strap
> > > > > > > 1
> > > > > > > > > through the loop of Strap 2, then insert the dowel into the
> loop
> > > of
> > > > > > > Strap 1,
> > > > > > > > > essentially making the dowel a toggle. If the dowel breaks,
> it
> > > will
> > > > > > > break
> > > > > > > > > inward, and the wood pieces won't fly toward either vehicle.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I made a dowel out of a hardwood sledgehammer handle. It
> should
> > > have
> > > > > a
> > > > > > > > > minimum diameter of 2 inches. I've used this method several
> > > times
> > > > > and
> > > > > > > have
> > > > > > > > > yet to have a problem with breakage, and when done, you slip
> the
> > > > > dowel
> > > > > > > out
> > > > > > > > > and the two straps instantly come apart.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I've never personally met the fellow that was killed, but I
> am
> > > sure
> > > > > some
> > > > > > > > > members of my off-road club know him. What a tragedy.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > "Jerry Bransford" <jerrypb@***.net> wrote in message
> > > > > > > > > news:R0Tad.29426$_a3.9250@fed1read05...
> > > > > > > > > > The dowel doesn't really hold the straps, they are (should
> be)
> > > > > looped
> > > > > > > > > > through each other. The dowel is only (should only) be
> there
> > > so
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > straps
> > > > > > > > > > can be pulled apart after the pull has been completed.
> > > Without
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > dowel,
> > > > > > > > > > they can be difficult to disengage the straps from each
> other
> > > due
> > > > > to
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > force of the pull.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Jerry
> > > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > > Jerry Bransford
> > > > > > > > > > PP-ASEL N6TAY
> > > > > > > > > > See the Geezer Jeep at
> > > > > > > > > > http://members.***.net/jerrypb/
> > > > > > > > > > "aGraham" <aarongraham@mac.com.removeme> wrote in message
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > news:aarongraham-86F2F0.11170112102004@corp-radius.supernews.com...
> > > > > > > > > > > Very sad....
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > I know I have used a clevis for this purpose in the
> past,
> > > but
> > > > > > > recently a
> > > > > > > > > > > wheeling buddy showed me how to use a 1.5" diameter
> wooden
> > > dowel
> > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > > > connect 2 straps when one is not long enough. Would
> believe
> > > the
> > > > > > > dowel
> > > > > > > > > > > would be the first thing to break, or if not it would
> not
> > > have
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > weight/inertia to become a projectile.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Any one have any ideas/cautions on using this instead?
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > In article <OaSad.79414$vO1.445558@nnrp1.uunet.ca>,
> > > > > > > > > > > "Jeff" <jrhiltz@av.easlink.ca> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >> This is sooo sad....it breaks my heart...the tears have
> > > been
> > > > > > > shed....I
> > > > > > > > > > >> don't
> > > > > > > > > > >> know the man, but is a Jeeper and means he is all our
> > > friend...
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> I'm a new Jeeper and our club has had many discussions
> on
> > > > > tugging
> > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > > >> what
> > > > > > > > > > >> to use and not to use...
> > > > > > > > > > >> and I have already seen this joining two straps
> together by
> > > a
> > > > > > > > > cleavis....
> > > > > > > > > > >> I
> > > > > > > > > > >> know I will never see it again NOW....I will never let
> this
> > > > > happen
> > > > > > > in
> > > > > > > > > my
> > > > > > > > > > >> presence as it has really opened my eyes...
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> God Bless the family and friends of the deceased...
> > > > > > > > > > >> you are in our prayers....
> > > > > > > > > > >> Jeff
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> "JeepNutz" <jeepinDAMMITgene@ISAID.NO.SPAM> wrote in
> > > message
> > > > > > > > > > >> news:RhCad.243631$3l3.183113@attbi_s03...
> > > > > > > > > > >> > To all the newbies out there.. straps are
> dangerous
> > > > > > > animals...
> > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > >
> > >
> http://michiganjeepers.com/eve/ubb.x...109322&m=90210
> > > > > > > > > > >> 6753&p=1
> > > > > > > > > > >> > --
> > > > > > > > > > >> > Gene
> > > > > > > > > > >> > Jeep, because life is an adventure, not a race.
> > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > > > o_o_o_o
> > > > > > > > > > > /| ,[_____],
> > > > > > > > > > > |¯¯¯L --O|||||||O-
> > > > > > > > > > > ()_)¯()_) ¯¯¯¯¯ )_)
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
#123
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Michigan Jeepers Loose member to strapping accident..
Umm, the strap was wrapped around the cross member and I only needed one
length....
Mike
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>
> Yep. I'd wager a dowel would have kept your crossmember from ripping off.
> What was the strap hooked to on your vehicle that it would remove the
> crossmember?
>
> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:416D5703.E7159BAA@sympatico.ca...
> > Have you ever seen how hard a strap can come up?
> >
> > Hard enough of an 'impact' to shear hooks and bolts and tear off
> > bumpers.
> >
> > The stick sees the exact same impact.
> >
> > The impact from trying to ****** Steve Seppala's YJ out of a snowbank
> > snapped off my rear cross member. We are talking channel steel
> > structurally welded onto the frame.
> >
> > This thread started because a gent got killed when a 'steel' clamp let
> > loose in between two straps due to that same impact. A chunk of wood is
> > 'just' as deadly stuck in the same place that steel clamp was if it lets
> > loose!
> >
> > To each their own I guess, but 'I' sure won't recommend using a freaking
> > stick as a structural point in a tow setup that is for sure and that
> > Mark gent still needs to be slapped!
> >
> > Mike
> >
> > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > >
> > > Of course the dowel sees the forces of towing, but it is not impact
> forces
> > > like a bat and baseball contacting.
> > >
> > > If a tow hook goes, then using a dowel as a toggle will mean the
> connection
> > > will immediately loosen and absorb some of the projectile energy that
> would
> > > otherwise be transmitted to the hook. By using the dowel as a means to
> > > disconnect the looped-together straps, it becomes part of the projectile
> as
> > > well.
> > >
> > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > > news:416D4A19.601CB0C1@sympatico.ca...
> > > > Have you ever snapped a baseball bat? Hooks have even been known to
> > > > snap and hook bolts shear.
> > > >
> > > > The dowel certainly 'does' see the impact forces. 100% of them as a
> > > > matter of fact.
> > > >
> > > > Wow.....
> > > >
> > > > Mike
> > > >
> > > > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Down boy. I said that tongue-in-cheek. Mr. Smith demonstrated with a
> 2"
> > > > > hardwood dowel. How he instructed us is exactly how I said it, using
> a
> > > the
> > > > > dowel as a toggle through the loop of one of the straps. The dowel
> > > doesn't
> > > > > see impact forces. I never said he'd cut down a sapling and strip
> the
> > > bark
> > > > > off. It's just something you carry with you.
> > > > >
> > > > > It stuck with me because (a) he never looped a strap back on itself
> and
> > > (b)
> > > > > as soon as he pulled the dowel out, the straps came right apart
> without
> > > > > unlooping.
> > > > >
> > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > > > > news:416D3EDB.22505CF4@sympatico.ca...
> > > > > > Wow, that is freaking amazing!!!!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I cannot believe someone who seems so 'Jeep savvy' would be stupid
> > > > > > enough to rely on an unknown stick to trust his life too.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Maybe he has a death wish?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Are you sure you just didn't mistake his using the stick as a knot
> > > > > > holder like I describe below so it can be undone for using the
> stick
> > > as
> > > > > > part of the structure?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > My straps are rated for 30,000 lb each.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The shear force on a baseball bat or on an ax handle or hammer
> handle
> > > > > > under impact is 'not' very high. I have busted more than one by
> just
> > > > > > hitting a ball or a log or a board slightly wrong. And you are
> > > talking
> > > > > > an unknown freaking chunk of tree?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So when I take my Jeep and '******' a stuck vehicle using vehicle
> > > > > > momentum to the point of breaking a strap or ripping bumpers off,
> I
> > > sure
> > > > > > as hell wouldn't want to be relying on a stupid stick as the
> 'fuse' in
> > > > > > the equation!!!!!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > That would just be suicidal. Literally.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I would recommend you watch a Logger's safety video to see just
> how
> > > fast
> > > > > > and hard pieces or chips of wood will fly when broken under
> pressure.
> > > > > > Or even hurricane test videos where 2x4's go right through
> concrete
> > > > > > walls.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Sorry Matt, but you must be mistaken on the placement of the
> stick.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Mike
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Mark Smith...
> > > > > > > http://jeepjamboreeusa.com/aboutus.htm
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Like Steve said, it's a tree with the bark peeled off...
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > > > > > > news:416C52F5.D28CAF86@sympatico.ca...
> > > > > > > > He just didn't know the right way to use the dowel. :-(
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > You put the two loops together so they lock. The dowel just
> goes
> > > > > > > > between them so you can pry them apart.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Hole one loop up. Put second strap's loop over one you are
> > > holding
> > > > > then
> > > > > > > > feed the second straps other end through the first loop.
> Bingo,
> > > two
> > > > > > > > locked together loops.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Wood can go just as ballistic as steel if it snaps under
> pressure.
> > > In
> > > > > > > > my mind the person who showed you that method should be
> slapped.
> > > > > Hard!.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Mike
> > > > > > > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> > > > > > > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I met Mark Smith at a Jeep Jamboree a few years ago, and he
> > > showed
> > > > > us a
> > > > > > > > > different way of connecting straps with a dowel...pull the
> end
> > > of
> > > > > Strap
> > > > > > > 1
> > > > > > > > > through the loop of Strap 2, then insert the dowel into the
> loop
> > > of
> > > > > > > Strap 1,
> > > > > > > > > essentially making the dowel a toggle. If the dowel breaks,
> it
> > > will
> > > > > > > break
> > > > > > > > > inward, and the wood pieces won't fly toward either vehicle.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I made a dowel out of a hardwood sledgehammer handle. It
> should
> > > have
> > > > > a
> > > > > > > > > minimum diameter of 2 inches. I've used this method several
> > > times
> > > > > and
> > > > > > > have
> > > > > > > > > yet to have a problem with breakage, and when done, you slip
> the
> > > > > dowel
> > > > > > > out
> > > > > > > > > and the two straps instantly come apart.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I've never personally met the fellow that was killed, but I
> am
> > > sure
> > > > > some
> > > > > > > > > members of my off-road club know him. What a tragedy.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > "Jerry Bransford" <jerrypb@***.net> wrote in message
> > > > > > > > > news:R0Tad.29426$_a3.9250@fed1read05...
> > > > > > > > > > The dowel doesn't really hold the straps, they are (should
> be)
> > > > > looped
> > > > > > > > > > through each other. The dowel is only (should only) be
> there
> > > so
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > straps
> > > > > > > > > > can be pulled apart after the pull has been completed.
> > > Without
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > dowel,
> > > > > > > > > > they can be difficult to disengage the straps from each
> other
> > > due
> > > > > to
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > force of the pull.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Jerry
> > > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > > Jerry Bransford
> > > > > > > > > > PP-ASEL N6TAY
> > > > > > > > > > See the Geezer Jeep at
> > > > > > > > > > http://members.***.net/jerrypb/
> > > > > > > > > > "aGraham" <aarongraham@mac.com.removeme> wrote in message
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > news:aarongraham-86F2F0.11170112102004@corp-radius.supernews.com...
> > > > > > > > > > > Very sad....
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > I know I have used a clevis for this purpose in the
> past,
> > > but
> > > > > > > recently a
> > > > > > > > > > > wheeling buddy showed me how to use a 1.5" diameter
> wooden
> > > dowel
> > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > > > connect 2 straps when one is not long enough. Would
> believe
> > > the
> > > > > > > dowel
> > > > > > > > > > > would be the first thing to break, or if not it would
> not
> > > have
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > weight/inertia to become a projectile.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Any one have any ideas/cautions on using this instead?
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > In article <OaSad.79414$vO1.445558@nnrp1.uunet.ca>,
> > > > > > > > > > > "Jeff" <jrhiltz@av.easlink.ca> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >> This is sooo sad....it breaks my heart...the tears have
> > > been
> > > > > > > shed....I
> > > > > > > > > > >> don't
> > > > > > > > > > >> know the man, but is a Jeeper and means he is all our
> > > friend...
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> I'm a new Jeeper and our club has had many discussions
> on
> > > > > tugging
> > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > > >> what
> > > > > > > > > > >> to use and not to use...
> > > > > > > > > > >> and I have already seen this joining two straps
> together by
> > > a
> > > > > > > > > cleavis....
> > > > > > > > > > >> I
> > > > > > > > > > >> know I will never see it again NOW....I will never let
> this
> > > > > happen
> > > > > > > in
> > > > > > > > > my
> > > > > > > > > > >> presence as it has really opened my eyes...
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> God Bless the family and friends of the deceased...
> > > > > > > > > > >> you are in our prayers....
> > > > > > > > > > >> Jeff
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> "JeepNutz" <jeepinDAMMITgene@ISAID.NO.SPAM> wrote in
> > > message
> > > > > > > > > > >> news:RhCad.243631$3l3.183113@attbi_s03...
> > > > > > > > > > >> > To all the newbies out there.. straps are
> dangerous
> > > > > > > animals...
> > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > >
> > >
> http://michiganjeepers.com/eve/ubb.x...109322&m=90210
> > > > > > > > > > >> 6753&p=1
> > > > > > > > > > >> > --
> > > > > > > > > > >> > Gene
> > > > > > > > > > >> > Jeep, because life is an adventure, not a race.
> > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > > > o_o_o_o
> > > > > > > > > > > /| ,[_____],
> > > > > > > > > > > |¯¯¯L --O|||||||O-
> > > > > > > > > > > ()_)¯()_) ¯¯¯¯¯ )_)
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
length....
Mike
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>
> Yep. I'd wager a dowel would have kept your crossmember from ripping off.
> What was the strap hooked to on your vehicle that it would remove the
> crossmember?
>
> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:416D5703.E7159BAA@sympatico.ca...
> > Have you ever seen how hard a strap can come up?
> >
> > Hard enough of an 'impact' to shear hooks and bolts and tear off
> > bumpers.
> >
> > The stick sees the exact same impact.
> >
> > The impact from trying to ****** Steve Seppala's YJ out of a snowbank
> > snapped off my rear cross member. We are talking channel steel
> > structurally welded onto the frame.
> >
> > This thread started because a gent got killed when a 'steel' clamp let
> > loose in between two straps due to that same impact. A chunk of wood is
> > 'just' as deadly stuck in the same place that steel clamp was if it lets
> > loose!
> >
> > To each their own I guess, but 'I' sure won't recommend using a freaking
> > stick as a structural point in a tow setup that is for sure and that
> > Mark gent still needs to be slapped!
> >
> > Mike
> >
> > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > >
> > > Of course the dowel sees the forces of towing, but it is not impact
> forces
> > > like a bat and baseball contacting.
> > >
> > > If a tow hook goes, then using a dowel as a toggle will mean the
> connection
> > > will immediately loosen and absorb some of the projectile energy that
> would
> > > otherwise be transmitted to the hook. By using the dowel as a means to
> > > disconnect the looped-together straps, it becomes part of the projectile
> as
> > > well.
> > >
> > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > > news:416D4A19.601CB0C1@sympatico.ca...
> > > > Have you ever snapped a baseball bat? Hooks have even been known to
> > > > snap and hook bolts shear.
> > > >
> > > > The dowel certainly 'does' see the impact forces. 100% of them as a
> > > > matter of fact.
> > > >
> > > > Wow.....
> > > >
> > > > Mike
> > > >
> > > > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Down boy. I said that tongue-in-cheek. Mr. Smith demonstrated with a
> 2"
> > > > > hardwood dowel. How he instructed us is exactly how I said it, using
> a
> > > the
> > > > > dowel as a toggle through the loop of one of the straps. The dowel
> > > doesn't
> > > > > see impact forces. I never said he'd cut down a sapling and strip
> the
> > > bark
> > > > > off. It's just something you carry with you.
> > > > >
> > > > > It stuck with me because (a) he never looped a strap back on itself
> and
> > > (b)
> > > > > as soon as he pulled the dowel out, the straps came right apart
> without
> > > > > unlooping.
> > > > >
> > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > > > > news:416D3EDB.22505CF4@sympatico.ca...
> > > > > > Wow, that is freaking amazing!!!!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I cannot believe someone who seems so 'Jeep savvy' would be stupid
> > > > > > enough to rely on an unknown stick to trust his life too.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Maybe he has a death wish?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Are you sure you just didn't mistake his using the stick as a knot
> > > > > > holder like I describe below so it can be undone for using the
> stick
> > > as
> > > > > > part of the structure?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > My straps are rated for 30,000 lb each.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The shear force on a baseball bat or on an ax handle or hammer
> handle
> > > > > > under impact is 'not' very high. I have busted more than one by
> just
> > > > > > hitting a ball or a log or a board slightly wrong. And you are
> > > talking
> > > > > > an unknown freaking chunk of tree?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So when I take my Jeep and '******' a stuck vehicle using vehicle
> > > > > > momentum to the point of breaking a strap or ripping bumpers off,
> I
> > > sure
> > > > > > as hell wouldn't want to be relying on a stupid stick as the
> 'fuse' in
> > > > > > the equation!!!!!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > That would just be suicidal. Literally.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I would recommend you watch a Logger's safety video to see just
> how
> > > fast
> > > > > > and hard pieces or chips of wood will fly when broken under
> pressure.
> > > > > > Or even hurricane test videos where 2x4's go right through
> concrete
> > > > > > walls.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Sorry Matt, but you must be mistaken on the placement of the
> stick.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Mike
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Mark Smith...
> > > > > > > http://jeepjamboreeusa.com/aboutus.htm
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Like Steve said, it's a tree with the bark peeled off...
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > > > > > > news:416C52F5.D28CAF86@sympatico.ca...
> > > > > > > > He just didn't know the right way to use the dowel. :-(
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > You put the two loops together so they lock. The dowel just
> goes
> > > > > > > > between them so you can pry them apart.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Hole one loop up. Put second strap's loop over one you are
> > > holding
> > > > > then
> > > > > > > > feed the second straps other end through the first loop.
> Bingo,
> > > two
> > > > > > > > locked together loops.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Wood can go just as ballistic as steel if it snaps under
> pressure.
> > > In
> > > > > > > > my mind the person who showed you that method should be
> slapped.
> > > > > Hard!.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Mike
> > > > > > > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> > > > > > > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I met Mark Smith at a Jeep Jamboree a few years ago, and he
> > > showed
> > > > > us a
> > > > > > > > > different way of connecting straps with a dowel...pull the
> end
> > > of
> > > > > Strap
> > > > > > > 1
> > > > > > > > > through the loop of Strap 2, then insert the dowel into the
> loop
> > > of
> > > > > > > Strap 1,
> > > > > > > > > essentially making the dowel a toggle. If the dowel breaks,
> it
> > > will
> > > > > > > break
> > > > > > > > > inward, and the wood pieces won't fly toward either vehicle.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I made a dowel out of a hardwood sledgehammer handle. It
> should
> > > have
> > > > > a
> > > > > > > > > minimum diameter of 2 inches. I've used this method several
> > > times
> > > > > and
> > > > > > > have
> > > > > > > > > yet to have a problem with breakage, and when done, you slip
> the
> > > > > dowel
> > > > > > > out
> > > > > > > > > and the two straps instantly come apart.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I've never personally met the fellow that was killed, but I
> am
> > > sure
> > > > > some
> > > > > > > > > members of my off-road club know him. What a tragedy.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > "Jerry Bransford" <jerrypb@***.net> wrote in message
> > > > > > > > > news:R0Tad.29426$_a3.9250@fed1read05...
> > > > > > > > > > The dowel doesn't really hold the straps, they are (should
> be)
> > > > > looped
> > > > > > > > > > through each other. The dowel is only (should only) be
> there
> > > so
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > straps
> > > > > > > > > > can be pulled apart after the pull has been completed.
> > > Without
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > dowel,
> > > > > > > > > > they can be difficult to disengage the straps from each
> other
> > > due
> > > > > to
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > force of the pull.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Jerry
> > > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > > Jerry Bransford
> > > > > > > > > > PP-ASEL N6TAY
> > > > > > > > > > See the Geezer Jeep at
> > > > > > > > > > http://members.***.net/jerrypb/
> > > > > > > > > > "aGraham" <aarongraham@mac.com.removeme> wrote in message
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > news:aarongraham-86F2F0.11170112102004@corp-radius.supernews.com...
> > > > > > > > > > > Very sad....
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > I know I have used a clevis for this purpose in the
> past,
> > > but
> > > > > > > recently a
> > > > > > > > > > > wheeling buddy showed me how to use a 1.5" diameter
> wooden
> > > dowel
> > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > > > connect 2 straps when one is not long enough. Would
> believe
> > > the
> > > > > > > dowel
> > > > > > > > > > > would be the first thing to break, or if not it would
> not
> > > have
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > weight/inertia to become a projectile.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Any one have any ideas/cautions on using this instead?
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > In article <OaSad.79414$vO1.445558@nnrp1.uunet.ca>,
> > > > > > > > > > > "Jeff" <jrhiltz@av.easlink.ca> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >> This is sooo sad....it breaks my heart...the tears have
> > > been
> > > > > > > shed....I
> > > > > > > > > > >> don't
> > > > > > > > > > >> know the man, but is a Jeeper and means he is all our
> > > friend...
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> I'm a new Jeeper and our club has had many discussions
> on
> > > > > tugging
> > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > > >> what
> > > > > > > > > > >> to use and not to use...
> > > > > > > > > > >> and I have already seen this joining two straps
> together by
> > > a
> > > > > > > > > cleavis....
> > > > > > > > > > >> I
> > > > > > > > > > >> know I will never see it again NOW....I will never let
> this
> > > > > happen
> > > > > > > in
> > > > > > > > > my
> > > > > > > > > > >> presence as it has really opened my eyes...
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> God Bless the family and friends of the deceased...
> > > > > > > > > > >> you are in our prayers....
> > > > > > > > > > >> Jeff
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> "JeepNutz" <jeepinDAMMITgene@ISAID.NO.SPAM> wrote in
> > > message
> > > > > > > > > > >> news:RhCad.243631$3l3.183113@attbi_s03...
> > > > > > > > > > >> > To all the newbies out there.. straps are
> dangerous
> > > > > > > animals...
> > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > >
> > >
> http://michiganjeepers.com/eve/ubb.x...109322&m=90210
> > > > > > > > > > >> 6753&p=1
> > > > > > > > > > >> > --
> > > > > > > > > > >> > Gene
> > > > > > > > > > >> > Jeep, because life is an adventure, not a race.
> > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > > > o_o_o_o
> > > > > > > > > > > /| ,[_____],
> > > > > > > > > > > |¯¯¯L --O|||||||O-
> > > > > > > > > > > ()_)¯()_) ¯¯¯¯¯ )_)
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
#124
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Michigan Jeepers Loose member to strapping accident..
Umm, the strap was wrapped around the cross member and I only needed one
length....
Mike
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>
> Yep. I'd wager a dowel would have kept your crossmember from ripping off.
> What was the strap hooked to on your vehicle that it would remove the
> crossmember?
>
> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:416D5703.E7159BAA@sympatico.ca...
> > Have you ever seen how hard a strap can come up?
> >
> > Hard enough of an 'impact' to shear hooks and bolts and tear off
> > bumpers.
> >
> > The stick sees the exact same impact.
> >
> > The impact from trying to ****** Steve Seppala's YJ out of a snowbank
> > snapped off my rear cross member. We are talking channel steel
> > structurally welded onto the frame.
> >
> > This thread started because a gent got killed when a 'steel' clamp let
> > loose in between two straps due to that same impact. A chunk of wood is
> > 'just' as deadly stuck in the same place that steel clamp was if it lets
> > loose!
> >
> > To each their own I guess, but 'I' sure won't recommend using a freaking
> > stick as a structural point in a tow setup that is for sure and that
> > Mark gent still needs to be slapped!
> >
> > Mike
> >
> > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > >
> > > Of course the dowel sees the forces of towing, but it is not impact
> forces
> > > like a bat and baseball contacting.
> > >
> > > If a tow hook goes, then using a dowel as a toggle will mean the
> connection
> > > will immediately loosen and absorb some of the projectile energy that
> would
> > > otherwise be transmitted to the hook. By using the dowel as a means to
> > > disconnect the looped-together straps, it becomes part of the projectile
> as
> > > well.
> > >
> > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > > news:416D4A19.601CB0C1@sympatico.ca...
> > > > Have you ever snapped a baseball bat? Hooks have even been known to
> > > > snap and hook bolts shear.
> > > >
> > > > The dowel certainly 'does' see the impact forces. 100% of them as a
> > > > matter of fact.
> > > >
> > > > Wow.....
> > > >
> > > > Mike
> > > >
> > > > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Down boy. I said that tongue-in-cheek. Mr. Smith demonstrated with a
> 2"
> > > > > hardwood dowel. How he instructed us is exactly how I said it, using
> a
> > > the
> > > > > dowel as a toggle through the loop of one of the straps. The dowel
> > > doesn't
> > > > > see impact forces. I never said he'd cut down a sapling and strip
> the
> > > bark
> > > > > off. It's just something you carry with you.
> > > > >
> > > > > It stuck with me because (a) he never looped a strap back on itself
> and
> > > (b)
> > > > > as soon as he pulled the dowel out, the straps came right apart
> without
> > > > > unlooping.
> > > > >
> > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > > > > news:416D3EDB.22505CF4@sympatico.ca...
> > > > > > Wow, that is freaking amazing!!!!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I cannot believe someone who seems so 'Jeep savvy' would be stupid
> > > > > > enough to rely on an unknown stick to trust his life too.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Maybe he has a death wish?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Are you sure you just didn't mistake his using the stick as a knot
> > > > > > holder like I describe below so it can be undone for using the
> stick
> > > as
> > > > > > part of the structure?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > My straps are rated for 30,000 lb each.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The shear force on a baseball bat or on an ax handle or hammer
> handle
> > > > > > under impact is 'not' very high. I have busted more than one by
> just
> > > > > > hitting a ball or a log or a board slightly wrong. And you are
> > > talking
> > > > > > an unknown freaking chunk of tree?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So when I take my Jeep and '******' a stuck vehicle using vehicle
> > > > > > momentum to the point of breaking a strap or ripping bumpers off,
> I
> > > sure
> > > > > > as hell wouldn't want to be relying on a stupid stick as the
> 'fuse' in
> > > > > > the equation!!!!!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > That would just be suicidal. Literally.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I would recommend you watch a Logger's safety video to see just
> how
> > > fast
> > > > > > and hard pieces or chips of wood will fly when broken under
> pressure.
> > > > > > Or even hurricane test videos where 2x4's go right through
> concrete
> > > > > > walls.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Sorry Matt, but you must be mistaken on the placement of the
> stick.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Mike
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Mark Smith...
> > > > > > > http://jeepjamboreeusa.com/aboutus.htm
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Like Steve said, it's a tree with the bark peeled off...
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > > > > > > news:416C52F5.D28CAF86@sympatico.ca...
> > > > > > > > He just didn't know the right way to use the dowel. :-(
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > You put the two loops together so they lock. The dowel just
> goes
> > > > > > > > between them so you can pry them apart.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Hole one loop up. Put second strap's loop over one you are
> > > holding
> > > > > then
> > > > > > > > feed the second straps other end through the first loop.
> Bingo,
> > > two
> > > > > > > > locked together loops.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Wood can go just as ballistic as steel if it snaps under
> pressure.
> > > In
> > > > > > > > my mind the person who showed you that method should be
> slapped.
> > > > > Hard!.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Mike
> > > > > > > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> > > > > > > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I met Mark Smith at a Jeep Jamboree a few years ago, and he
> > > showed
> > > > > us a
> > > > > > > > > different way of connecting straps with a dowel...pull the
> end
> > > of
> > > > > Strap
> > > > > > > 1
> > > > > > > > > through the loop of Strap 2, then insert the dowel into the
> loop
> > > of
> > > > > > > Strap 1,
> > > > > > > > > essentially making the dowel a toggle. If the dowel breaks,
> it
> > > will
> > > > > > > break
> > > > > > > > > inward, and the wood pieces won't fly toward either vehicle.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I made a dowel out of a hardwood sledgehammer handle. It
> should
> > > have
> > > > > a
> > > > > > > > > minimum diameter of 2 inches. I've used this method several
> > > times
> > > > > and
> > > > > > > have
> > > > > > > > > yet to have a problem with breakage, and when done, you slip
> the
> > > > > dowel
> > > > > > > out
> > > > > > > > > and the two straps instantly come apart.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I've never personally met the fellow that was killed, but I
> am
> > > sure
> > > > > some
> > > > > > > > > members of my off-road club know him. What a tragedy.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > "Jerry Bransford" <jerrypb@***.net> wrote in message
> > > > > > > > > news:R0Tad.29426$_a3.9250@fed1read05...
> > > > > > > > > > The dowel doesn't really hold the straps, they are (should
> be)
> > > > > looped
> > > > > > > > > > through each other. The dowel is only (should only) be
> there
> > > so
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > straps
> > > > > > > > > > can be pulled apart after the pull has been completed.
> > > Without
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > dowel,
> > > > > > > > > > they can be difficult to disengage the straps from each
> other
> > > due
> > > > > to
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > force of the pull.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Jerry
> > > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > > Jerry Bransford
> > > > > > > > > > PP-ASEL N6TAY
> > > > > > > > > > See the Geezer Jeep at
> > > > > > > > > > http://members.***.net/jerrypb/
> > > > > > > > > > "aGraham" <aarongraham@mac.com.removeme> wrote in message
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > news:aarongraham-86F2F0.11170112102004@corp-radius.supernews.com...
> > > > > > > > > > > Very sad....
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > I know I have used a clevis for this purpose in the
> past,
> > > but
> > > > > > > recently a
> > > > > > > > > > > wheeling buddy showed me how to use a 1.5" diameter
> wooden
> > > dowel
> > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > > > connect 2 straps when one is not long enough. Would
> believe
> > > the
> > > > > > > dowel
> > > > > > > > > > > would be the first thing to break, or if not it would
> not
> > > have
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > weight/inertia to become a projectile.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Any one have any ideas/cautions on using this instead?
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > In article <OaSad.79414$vO1.445558@nnrp1.uunet.ca>,
> > > > > > > > > > > "Jeff" <jrhiltz@av.easlink.ca> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >> This is sooo sad....it breaks my heart...the tears have
> > > been
> > > > > > > shed....I
> > > > > > > > > > >> don't
> > > > > > > > > > >> know the man, but is a Jeeper and means he is all our
> > > friend...
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> I'm a new Jeeper and our club has had many discussions
> on
> > > > > tugging
> > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > > >> what
> > > > > > > > > > >> to use and not to use...
> > > > > > > > > > >> and I have already seen this joining two straps
> together by
> > > a
> > > > > > > > > cleavis....
> > > > > > > > > > >> I
> > > > > > > > > > >> know I will never see it again NOW....I will never let
> this
> > > > > happen
> > > > > > > in
> > > > > > > > > my
> > > > > > > > > > >> presence as it has really opened my eyes...
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> God Bless the family and friends of the deceased...
> > > > > > > > > > >> you are in our prayers....
> > > > > > > > > > >> Jeff
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> "JeepNutz" <jeepinDAMMITgene@ISAID.NO.SPAM> wrote in
> > > message
> > > > > > > > > > >> news:RhCad.243631$3l3.183113@attbi_s03...
> > > > > > > > > > >> > To all the newbies out there.. straps are
> dangerous
> > > > > > > animals...
> > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > >
> > >
> http://michiganjeepers.com/eve/ubb.x...109322&m=90210
> > > > > > > > > > >> 6753&p=1
> > > > > > > > > > >> > --
> > > > > > > > > > >> > Gene
> > > > > > > > > > >> > Jeep, because life is an adventure, not a race.
> > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > > > o_o_o_o
> > > > > > > > > > > /| ,[_____],
> > > > > > > > > > > |¯¯¯L --O|||||||O-
> > > > > > > > > > > ()_)¯()_) ¯¯¯¯¯ )_)
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
length....
Mike
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>
> Yep. I'd wager a dowel would have kept your crossmember from ripping off.
> What was the strap hooked to on your vehicle that it would remove the
> crossmember?
>
> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:416D5703.E7159BAA@sympatico.ca...
> > Have you ever seen how hard a strap can come up?
> >
> > Hard enough of an 'impact' to shear hooks and bolts and tear off
> > bumpers.
> >
> > The stick sees the exact same impact.
> >
> > The impact from trying to ****** Steve Seppala's YJ out of a snowbank
> > snapped off my rear cross member. We are talking channel steel
> > structurally welded onto the frame.
> >
> > This thread started because a gent got killed when a 'steel' clamp let
> > loose in between two straps due to that same impact. A chunk of wood is
> > 'just' as deadly stuck in the same place that steel clamp was if it lets
> > loose!
> >
> > To each their own I guess, but 'I' sure won't recommend using a freaking
> > stick as a structural point in a tow setup that is for sure and that
> > Mark gent still needs to be slapped!
> >
> > Mike
> >
> > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > >
> > > Of course the dowel sees the forces of towing, but it is not impact
> forces
> > > like a bat and baseball contacting.
> > >
> > > If a tow hook goes, then using a dowel as a toggle will mean the
> connection
> > > will immediately loosen and absorb some of the projectile energy that
> would
> > > otherwise be transmitted to the hook. By using the dowel as a means to
> > > disconnect the looped-together straps, it becomes part of the projectile
> as
> > > well.
> > >
> > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > > news:416D4A19.601CB0C1@sympatico.ca...
> > > > Have you ever snapped a baseball bat? Hooks have even been known to
> > > > snap and hook bolts shear.
> > > >
> > > > The dowel certainly 'does' see the impact forces. 100% of them as a
> > > > matter of fact.
> > > >
> > > > Wow.....
> > > >
> > > > Mike
> > > >
> > > > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Down boy. I said that tongue-in-cheek. Mr. Smith demonstrated with a
> 2"
> > > > > hardwood dowel. How he instructed us is exactly how I said it, using
> a
> > > the
> > > > > dowel as a toggle through the loop of one of the straps. The dowel
> > > doesn't
> > > > > see impact forces. I never said he'd cut down a sapling and strip
> the
> > > bark
> > > > > off. It's just something you carry with you.
> > > > >
> > > > > It stuck with me because (a) he never looped a strap back on itself
> and
> > > (b)
> > > > > as soon as he pulled the dowel out, the straps came right apart
> without
> > > > > unlooping.
> > > > >
> > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > > > > news:416D3EDB.22505CF4@sympatico.ca...
> > > > > > Wow, that is freaking amazing!!!!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I cannot believe someone who seems so 'Jeep savvy' would be stupid
> > > > > > enough to rely on an unknown stick to trust his life too.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Maybe he has a death wish?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Are you sure you just didn't mistake his using the stick as a knot
> > > > > > holder like I describe below so it can be undone for using the
> stick
> > > as
> > > > > > part of the structure?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > My straps are rated for 30,000 lb each.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The shear force on a baseball bat or on an ax handle or hammer
> handle
> > > > > > under impact is 'not' very high. I have busted more than one by
> just
> > > > > > hitting a ball or a log or a board slightly wrong. And you are
> > > talking
> > > > > > an unknown freaking chunk of tree?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So when I take my Jeep and '******' a stuck vehicle using vehicle
> > > > > > momentum to the point of breaking a strap or ripping bumpers off,
> I
> > > sure
> > > > > > as hell wouldn't want to be relying on a stupid stick as the
> 'fuse' in
> > > > > > the equation!!!!!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > That would just be suicidal. Literally.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I would recommend you watch a Logger's safety video to see just
> how
> > > fast
> > > > > > and hard pieces or chips of wood will fly when broken under
> pressure.
> > > > > > Or even hurricane test videos where 2x4's go right through
> concrete
> > > > > > walls.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Sorry Matt, but you must be mistaken on the placement of the
> stick.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Mike
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Mark Smith...
> > > > > > > http://jeepjamboreeusa.com/aboutus.htm
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Like Steve said, it's a tree with the bark peeled off...
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > > > > > > news:416C52F5.D28CAF86@sympatico.ca...
> > > > > > > > He just didn't know the right way to use the dowel. :-(
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > You put the two loops together so they lock. The dowel just
> goes
> > > > > > > > between them so you can pry them apart.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Hole one loop up. Put second strap's loop over one you are
> > > holding
> > > > > then
> > > > > > > > feed the second straps other end through the first loop.
> Bingo,
> > > two
> > > > > > > > locked together loops.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Wood can go just as ballistic as steel if it snaps under
> pressure.
> > > In
> > > > > > > > my mind the person who showed you that method should be
> slapped.
> > > > > Hard!.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Mike
> > > > > > > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> > > > > > > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I met Mark Smith at a Jeep Jamboree a few years ago, and he
> > > showed
> > > > > us a
> > > > > > > > > different way of connecting straps with a dowel...pull the
> end
> > > of
> > > > > Strap
> > > > > > > 1
> > > > > > > > > through the loop of Strap 2, then insert the dowel into the
> loop
> > > of
> > > > > > > Strap 1,
> > > > > > > > > essentially making the dowel a toggle. If the dowel breaks,
> it
> > > will
> > > > > > > break
> > > > > > > > > inward, and the wood pieces won't fly toward either vehicle.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I made a dowel out of a hardwood sledgehammer handle. It
> should
> > > have
> > > > > a
> > > > > > > > > minimum diameter of 2 inches. I've used this method several
> > > times
> > > > > and
> > > > > > > have
> > > > > > > > > yet to have a problem with breakage, and when done, you slip
> the
> > > > > dowel
> > > > > > > out
> > > > > > > > > and the two straps instantly come apart.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I've never personally met the fellow that was killed, but I
> am
> > > sure
> > > > > some
> > > > > > > > > members of my off-road club know him. What a tragedy.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > "Jerry Bransford" <jerrypb@***.net> wrote in message
> > > > > > > > > news:R0Tad.29426$_a3.9250@fed1read05...
> > > > > > > > > > The dowel doesn't really hold the straps, they are (should
> be)
> > > > > looped
> > > > > > > > > > through each other. The dowel is only (should only) be
> there
> > > so
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > straps
> > > > > > > > > > can be pulled apart after the pull has been completed.
> > > Without
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > dowel,
> > > > > > > > > > they can be difficult to disengage the straps from each
> other
> > > due
> > > > > to
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > force of the pull.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Jerry
> > > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > > Jerry Bransford
> > > > > > > > > > PP-ASEL N6TAY
> > > > > > > > > > See the Geezer Jeep at
> > > > > > > > > > http://members.***.net/jerrypb/
> > > > > > > > > > "aGraham" <aarongraham@mac.com.removeme> wrote in message
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > news:aarongraham-86F2F0.11170112102004@corp-radius.supernews.com...
> > > > > > > > > > > Very sad....
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > I know I have used a clevis for this purpose in the
> past,
> > > but
> > > > > > > recently a
> > > > > > > > > > > wheeling buddy showed me how to use a 1.5" diameter
> wooden
> > > dowel
> > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > > > connect 2 straps when one is not long enough. Would
> believe
> > > the
> > > > > > > dowel
> > > > > > > > > > > would be the first thing to break, or if not it would
> not
> > > have
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > weight/inertia to become a projectile.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Any one have any ideas/cautions on using this instead?
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > In article <OaSad.79414$vO1.445558@nnrp1.uunet.ca>,
> > > > > > > > > > > "Jeff" <jrhiltz@av.easlink.ca> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >> This is sooo sad....it breaks my heart...the tears have
> > > been
> > > > > > > shed....I
> > > > > > > > > > >> don't
> > > > > > > > > > >> know the man, but is a Jeeper and means he is all our
> > > friend...
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> I'm a new Jeeper and our club has had many discussions
> on
> > > > > tugging
> > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > > >> what
> > > > > > > > > > >> to use and not to use...
> > > > > > > > > > >> and I have already seen this joining two straps
> together by
> > > a
> > > > > > > > > cleavis....
> > > > > > > > > > >> I
> > > > > > > > > > >> know I will never see it again NOW....I will never let
> this
> > > > > happen
> > > > > > > in
> > > > > > > > > my
> > > > > > > > > > >> presence as it has really opened my eyes...
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> God Bless the family and friends of the deceased...
> > > > > > > > > > >> you are in our prayers....
> > > > > > > > > > >> Jeff
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> "JeepNutz" <jeepinDAMMITgene@ISAID.NO.SPAM> wrote in
> > > message
> > > > > > > > > > >> news:RhCad.243631$3l3.183113@attbi_s03...
> > > > > > > > > > >> > To all the newbies out there.. straps are
> dangerous
> > > > > > > animals...
> > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > >
> > >
> http://michiganjeepers.com/eve/ubb.x...109322&m=90210
> > > > > > > > > > >> 6753&p=1
> > > > > > > > > > >> > --
> > > > > > > > > > >> > Gene
> > > > > > > > > > >> > Jeep, because life is an adventure, not a race.
> > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > > > o_o_o_o
> > > > > > > > > > > /| ,[_____],
> > > > > > > > > > > |¯¯¯L --O|||||||O-
> > > > > > > > > > > ()_)¯()_) ¯¯¯¯¯ )_)
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
#125
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Michigan Jeepers Loose member to strapping accident..
You make one, just like you "toggle" two tow straps together,
toggle two slingshots together, put it up to your eye and pull. Do you
feel lucky?
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>
> How many slingshots are made with a hole in the end where the projectile
> slips through?
toggle two slingshots together, put it up to your eye and pull. Do you
feel lucky?
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>
> How many slingshots are made with a hole in the end where the projectile
> slips through?
#126
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Michigan Jeepers Loose member to strapping accident..
You make one, just like you "toggle" two tow straps together,
toggle two slingshots together, put it up to your eye and pull. Do you
feel lucky?
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>
> How many slingshots are made with a hole in the end where the projectile
> slips through?
toggle two slingshots together, put it up to your eye and pull. Do you
feel lucky?
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>
> How many slingshots are made with a hole in the end where the projectile
> slips through?
#127
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Michigan Jeepers Loose member to strapping accident..
You make one, just like you "toggle" two tow straps together,
toggle two slingshots together, put it up to your eye and pull. Do you
feel lucky?
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>
> How many slingshots are made with a hole in the end where the projectile
> slips through?
toggle two slingshots together, put it up to your eye and pull. Do you
feel lucky?
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>
> How many slingshots are made with a hole in the end where the projectile
> slips through?
#128
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Michigan Jeepers Loose member to strapping accident..
Next time I am doing a Paul Bunyan and yanking out a stuck jeep with my bare
hands, I'll remember your analogy.
"L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
news:416D6F25.D566FA26@***.net...
> You make one, just like you "toggle" two tow straps together,
> toggle two slingshots together, put it up to your eye and pull. Do you
> feel lucky?
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> >
> > How many slingshots are made with a hole in the end where the projectile
> > slips through?
hands, I'll remember your analogy.
"L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
news:416D6F25.D566FA26@***.net...
> You make one, just like you "toggle" two tow straps together,
> toggle two slingshots together, put it up to your eye and pull. Do you
> feel lucky?
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> >
> > How many slingshots are made with a hole in the end where the projectile
> > slips through?
#129
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Michigan Jeepers Loose member to strapping accident..
Next time I am doing a Paul Bunyan and yanking out a stuck jeep with my bare
hands, I'll remember your analogy.
"L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
news:416D6F25.D566FA26@***.net...
> You make one, just like you "toggle" two tow straps together,
> toggle two slingshots together, put it up to your eye and pull. Do you
> feel lucky?
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> >
> > How many slingshots are made with a hole in the end where the projectile
> > slips through?
hands, I'll remember your analogy.
"L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
news:416D6F25.D566FA26@***.net...
> You make one, just like you "toggle" two tow straps together,
> toggle two slingshots together, put it up to your eye and pull. Do you
> feel lucky?
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> >
> > How many slingshots are made with a hole in the end where the projectile
> > slips through?
#130
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Michigan Jeepers Loose member to strapping accident..
Next time I am doing a Paul Bunyan and yanking out a stuck jeep with my bare
hands, I'll remember your analogy.
"L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
news:416D6F25.D566FA26@***.net...
> You make one, just like you "toggle" two tow straps together,
> toggle two slingshots together, put it up to your eye and pull. Do you
> feel lucky?
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> >
> > How many slingshots are made with a hole in the end where the projectile
> > slips through?
hands, I'll remember your analogy.
"L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
news:416D6F25.D566FA26@***.net...
> You make one, just like you "toggle" two tow straps together,
> toggle two slingshots together, put it up to your eye and pull. Do you
> feel lucky?
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> >
> > How many slingshots are made with a hole in the end where the projectile
> > slips through?