Superwinch = junk
#71
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Superwinch = junk
"For more information on the Ramsey Winch Accessory Kit, click the picture
of the kit above. "
What picture?
There's no picture there, Nate.
:-)
"Nathan W. Collier" <JeepTalk@7SlotGrille.com> wrote in message
news:ViJ5b.5519$rb3.115047@twister.southeast.rr.co m...
> "Joshua Nelson" <spam_box@ev1.net> wrote in message
> news:b102b6e4.0309040606.19600208@posting.google.c om...
> > Looking at the articles I still didn't see much explanation for what
> > some of these accessories are (****** block, shackles, etc.) Would
> > appreciate any reference explaining how they work with a winch.
>
> hi joshua,
> see http://7slotgrille.com/projects/00sa...ckit/index.htm
>
> you run the cable through the ****** block, you put the strap around the
> tree, you connect the ****** block and strap together using the shackle,
and
> then you connect the cable either to another stationary object or back to
> the same jeep being pulled.
>
> if you want to see how all this works together in real time video, ramsey
> has a free video available for download. its about 11 megs, so right
click
> and "save as".
> http://ramsey.com/video/Ramsey_Safety100k.wmv
>
>
> --
> Nathan W. Collier
> http://7SlotGrille.com
>
>
>
of the kit above. "
What picture?
There's no picture there, Nate.
:-)
"Nathan W. Collier" <JeepTalk@7SlotGrille.com> wrote in message
news:ViJ5b.5519$rb3.115047@twister.southeast.rr.co m...
> "Joshua Nelson" <spam_box@ev1.net> wrote in message
> news:b102b6e4.0309040606.19600208@posting.google.c om...
> > Looking at the articles I still didn't see much explanation for what
> > some of these accessories are (****** block, shackles, etc.) Would
> > appreciate any reference explaining how they work with a winch.
>
> hi joshua,
> see http://7slotgrille.com/projects/00sa...ckit/index.htm
>
> you run the cable through the ****** block, you put the strap around the
> tree, you connect the ****** block and strap together using the shackle,
and
> then you connect the cable either to another stationary object or back to
> the same jeep being pulled.
>
> if you want to see how all this works together in real time video, ramsey
> has a free video available for download. its about 11 megs, so right
click
> and "save as".
> http://ramsey.com/video/Ramsey_Safety100k.wmv
>
>
> --
> Nathan W. Collier
> http://7SlotGrille.com
>
>
>
#72
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Superwinch = junk
"TJim" <jim@ranlet.nospam.com> wrote in message
news:Z-6dnZQP3tNZ-MqiXTWJkw@comcast.com...
> What picture?
> There's no picture there, Nate.
? click refresh, must not have loaded for you for some reason.
--
Nathan W. Collier
http://7SlotGrille.com
news:Z-6dnZQP3tNZ-MqiXTWJkw@comcast.com...
> What picture?
> There's no picture there, Nate.
? click refresh, must not have loaded for you for some reason.
--
Nathan W. Collier
http://7SlotGrille.com
#73
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Superwinch = junk
"TJim" <jim@ranlet.nospam.com> wrote in message
news:Z-6dnZQP3tNZ-MqiXTWJkw@comcast.com...
> What picture?
> There's no picture there, Nate.
? click refresh, must not have loaded for you for some reason.
--
Nathan W. Collier
http://7SlotGrille.com
news:Z-6dnZQP3tNZ-MqiXTWJkw@comcast.com...
> What picture?
> There's no picture there, Nate.
? click refresh, must not have loaded for you for some reason.
--
Nathan W. Collier
http://7SlotGrille.com
#74
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Superwinch = junk
"Joshua Nelson" <spam_box@ev1.net> wrote in message
news:b102b6e4.0309031349.7de95559@posting.google.c om...
> > You can't expect *anyone's* 4500 lb. winch to pull a TJ out
> > of axle-deep mud! 8000-10000 lb. winches would probably have been able
to
> > do it, but would have had to work pretty hard at it.
>
> That's ridiculous. A 4500 lb winch ought to be able to pull 4500 lbs
> or it isn't a 4500 lb winch. Seems pretty straightforward to me.
> What are you going to tell me next, my 2.5L engine is actually only
> 1.3L and the rest refers to the size of the engine compartment?
>
> This is a stock jeep, darn near its factory curb weight. And no one
> was sitting in the vehicle. Probably the only extra weight on this
> jeep is the winch itself!! So I was well below 4500lbs. Mud might be
> heavy but there is no way that there wer 1800 lbs of it on the jeep!
>
When you are stuck, you can easily DOUBLE the weight of your vehicle. The
curb weight, stock, is close to 3500 pounds. You need at least a 7000 pound
capacity for your winch, MINIMUM. They don't make a winch this size, and the
nearest is 8000 pounds, and 9000 pounds is even better.
We know this because we frequently have to anchor a Jeep with a winch with
another Jeep in order to recover a Jeep that is stuck. A stuck vehicle can
easily pull the winch equipped vehicle when the winch is reeling in the
cable. This happens all the time, maybe not every time, but frequently
enough that we know that we need two vehicles to recover one.
You bought the wrong winch. Period. End of story.
#75
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Superwinch = junk
"Joshua Nelson" <spam_box@ev1.net> wrote in message
news:b102b6e4.0309031349.7de95559@posting.google.c om...
> > You can't expect *anyone's* 4500 lb. winch to pull a TJ out
> > of axle-deep mud! 8000-10000 lb. winches would probably have been able
to
> > do it, but would have had to work pretty hard at it.
>
> That's ridiculous. A 4500 lb winch ought to be able to pull 4500 lbs
> or it isn't a 4500 lb winch. Seems pretty straightforward to me.
> What are you going to tell me next, my 2.5L engine is actually only
> 1.3L and the rest refers to the size of the engine compartment?
>
> This is a stock jeep, darn near its factory curb weight. And no one
> was sitting in the vehicle. Probably the only extra weight on this
> jeep is the winch itself!! So I was well below 4500lbs. Mud might be
> heavy but there is no way that there wer 1800 lbs of it on the jeep!
>
When you are stuck, you can easily DOUBLE the weight of your vehicle. The
curb weight, stock, is close to 3500 pounds. You need at least a 7000 pound
capacity for your winch, MINIMUM. They don't make a winch this size, and the
nearest is 8000 pounds, and 9000 pounds is even better.
We know this because we frequently have to anchor a Jeep with a winch with
another Jeep in order to recover a Jeep that is stuck. A stuck vehicle can
easily pull the winch equipped vehicle when the winch is reeling in the
cable. This happens all the time, maybe not every time, but frequently
enough that we know that we need two vehicles to recover one.
You bought the wrong winch. Period. End of story.
#76
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Superwinch = junk
"Joshua Nelson" <spam_box@ev1.net> wrote in message
news:b102b6e4.0309040606.19600208@posting.google.c om...
> rdbillsjr@aol.comxxxxxxxx (Robert Bills) wrote:
>
> > Also, you need a
> > ****** block, tree strap, tow strap, shackles and other accessories to
ensure
> > that you have the right tools when the need arises. The winching
articles
> > should lead you in the right direction.
> >
> >
> >
> > Robert Bills
> > KG6LMV
> > Orange County CA
> >
> > http://www.outdoorwire.com/4x4/jeep/...p-l/billsr.htm
> > http://www.RobertBills.com
>
>
> Thanks. This is helpful. I am trying to get into this hobby and I
> appreciate it when folks don't treat me like a moron just because I'm
> not as experienced as they are. It is thoughtful replies like yours
> that make this forum worth returning to in spite of the hostility.
>
> Looking at the articles I still didn't see much explanation for what
> some of these accessories are (****** block, shackles, etc.) Would
> appreciate any reference explaining how they work with a winch.
>
> Thanks again.
A ****** block is nothing more than a pulley with a tree bark-friendly strap
on it. The winch cable goes from the vehicle to the pulley and back to the
vehicle. You could put a block on the vehilce as well, and run the winch
cable through that pulley and anchor it back on the tree. The more pullies
you introduce to the system, the less pulling force is needed to move the
load, but the slower the load will move when the force is applied. Of
course, the anchor point must be strong enough to hold the load because even
though we might only need 500 pounds of pulling force to pull 3000 pounds,
the anchor still has to be able to support those 3000 pounds.
If you have a sturdy tree in your yard, you can try using some pullies and
rope to lift a few cinder blocks. You will notice that with a single pulley,
you lift the full weight of the blocks. This is the same as connecting your
winch directly to a tree. If you tie the rope to the pulley, route it
through a pulley on the cinder blocks, through the pulley on the tree, then
pull on the rope, the load is easier to lift, but it lifts slower. As you
add more and more pullies, it becomes easier and easier to lift the load,
but the load move less and less with each pull. There is a way to calculate
the force needed and the distance the load will move, but I don't think you
are really interested in this level of detail, and I don't know the
calculation, but I could probably figure it out. The fact that I can find
that the load becomes easier to move is all I really need to know.
Shackles are merely temporary anchor points that you can affix to stuff.
Maybe you need to put a shackle on a tree, or chain it to a rock, or mount
it on the vehicle itself.
What you need to know is something I posted earlier. You need a winch
capacity that is a minimum of double the weight of your Jeep. Everybody that
has a winch on thier Jeep has one that is a minimum of 8000 pound capacity.
There is a pretty even distribution of 8000 and 9000 pound winches, a few
10000 pounders and some 12500 pounders. The larger size winches are going to
be found on Excursions, Suburbans, Grand Cherokees, and those sorts of
vehicles. A few TJs, YJs and CJs will have 10000 pound winches, but the vast
majority of Jeeps have either a 9000 or 8000 pound winch.The 9000 pound
models will generally have a faster line speed, and the owners feel this is
a worthy feature to spend a few extra dollars on. Also, the winch capacity
is when there is only one wrap of cable on the spool, by the time the cable
is fully wound on the spool, the capacity drops significantly, so if you
have a 9000 pound winch and the tree you are using as an anchor is only 10
or 15 feet away, the real capacity of your winch is closer to 5000 pounds,
and your TJ weighs 3500 pounds, and is stuck in 1600 pounds of muck, so you
are over stressing your equipment by 100 pounds. You could need to use a
****** block for no other reason than to wind out 30 feet of cable so the
load is not over the winch capacity because there are so many wraps on the
spool.
#77
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Superwinch = junk
"Joshua Nelson" <spam_box@ev1.net> wrote in message
news:b102b6e4.0309040606.19600208@posting.google.c om...
> rdbillsjr@aol.comxxxxxxxx (Robert Bills) wrote:
>
> > Also, you need a
> > ****** block, tree strap, tow strap, shackles and other accessories to
ensure
> > that you have the right tools when the need arises. The winching
articles
> > should lead you in the right direction.
> >
> >
> >
> > Robert Bills
> > KG6LMV
> > Orange County CA
> >
> > http://www.outdoorwire.com/4x4/jeep/...p-l/billsr.htm
> > http://www.RobertBills.com
>
>
> Thanks. This is helpful. I am trying to get into this hobby and I
> appreciate it when folks don't treat me like a moron just because I'm
> not as experienced as they are. It is thoughtful replies like yours
> that make this forum worth returning to in spite of the hostility.
>
> Looking at the articles I still didn't see much explanation for what
> some of these accessories are (****** block, shackles, etc.) Would
> appreciate any reference explaining how they work with a winch.
>
> Thanks again.
A ****** block is nothing more than a pulley with a tree bark-friendly strap
on it. The winch cable goes from the vehicle to the pulley and back to the
vehicle. You could put a block on the vehilce as well, and run the winch
cable through that pulley and anchor it back on the tree. The more pullies
you introduce to the system, the less pulling force is needed to move the
load, but the slower the load will move when the force is applied. Of
course, the anchor point must be strong enough to hold the load because even
though we might only need 500 pounds of pulling force to pull 3000 pounds,
the anchor still has to be able to support those 3000 pounds.
If you have a sturdy tree in your yard, you can try using some pullies and
rope to lift a few cinder blocks. You will notice that with a single pulley,
you lift the full weight of the blocks. This is the same as connecting your
winch directly to a tree. If you tie the rope to the pulley, route it
through a pulley on the cinder blocks, through the pulley on the tree, then
pull on the rope, the load is easier to lift, but it lifts slower. As you
add more and more pullies, it becomes easier and easier to lift the load,
but the load move less and less with each pull. There is a way to calculate
the force needed and the distance the load will move, but I don't think you
are really interested in this level of detail, and I don't know the
calculation, but I could probably figure it out. The fact that I can find
that the load becomes easier to move is all I really need to know.
Shackles are merely temporary anchor points that you can affix to stuff.
Maybe you need to put a shackle on a tree, or chain it to a rock, or mount
it on the vehicle itself.
What you need to know is something I posted earlier. You need a winch
capacity that is a minimum of double the weight of your Jeep. Everybody that
has a winch on thier Jeep has one that is a minimum of 8000 pound capacity.
There is a pretty even distribution of 8000 and 9000 pound winches, a few
10000 pounders and some 12500 pounders. The larger size winches are going to
be found on Excursions, Suburbans, Grand Cherokees, and those sorts of
vehicles. A few TJs, YJs and CJs will have 10000 pound winches, but the vast
majority of Jeeps have either a 9000 or 8000 pound winch.The 9000 pound
models will generally have a faster line speed, and the owners feel this is
a worthy feature to spend a few extra dollars on. Also, the winch capacity
is when there is only one wrap of cable on the spool, by the time the cable
is fully wound on the spool, the capacity drops significantly, so if you
have a 9000 pound winch and the tree you are using as an anchor is only 10
or 15 feet away, the real capacity of your winch is closer to 5000 pounds,
and your TJ weighs 3500 pounds, and is stuck in 1600 pounds of muck, so you
are over stressing your equipment by 100 pounds. You could need to use a
****** block for no other reason than to wind out 30 feet of cable so the
load is not over the winch capacity because there are so many wraps on the
spool.
#78
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Superwinch = junk
"pithy"? Yeth!
"Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
news:6wK5b.522$cm1.6618350@news-text.cableinet.net...
> a pithy riposte indeed !
>
> Dave Milne, Scotland
> '99 TJ 4.0 Sahara
>
> "Joshua Nelson" <spam_box@ev1.net> wrote in message
> news:b102b6e4.0309040600.1463fc7@posting.google.co m...
> : "Jeepaholic" <jeepahoilcs@earthlink.net> wrote:
> : >
> : > Idiot.
> : >
> :
> : I'm rubber and you're glue. Whatever you say bounces off me and sticks
to
> you.
>
>
"Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
news:6wK5b.522$cm1.6618350@news-text.cableinet.net...
> a pithy riposte indeed !
>
> Dave Milne, Scotland
> '99 TJ 4.0 Sahara
>
> "Joshua Nelson" <spam_box@ev1.net> wrote in message
> news:b102b6e4.0309040600.1463fc7@posting.google.co m...
> : "Jeepaholic" <jeepahoilcs@earthlink.net> wrote:
> : >
> : > Idiot.
> : >
> :
> : I'm rubber and you're glue. Whatever you say bounces off me and sticks
to
> you.
>
>
#79
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Superwinch = junk
"pithy"? Yeth!
"Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
news:6wK5b.522$cm1.6618350@news-text.cableinet.net...
> a pithy riposte indeed !
>
> Dave Milne, Scotland
> '99 TJ 4.0 Sahara
>
> "Joshua Nelson" <spam_box@ev1.net> wrote in message
> news:b102b6e4.0309040600.1463fc7@posting.google.co m...
> : "Jeepaholic" <jeepahoilcs@earthlink.net> wrote:
> : >
> : > Idiot.
> : >
> :
> : I'm rubber and you're glue. Whatever you say bounces off me and sticks
to
> you.
>
>
"Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
news:6wK5b.522$cm1.6618350@news-text.cableinet.net...
> a pithy riposte indeed !
>
> Dave Milne, Scotland
> '99 TJ 4.0 Sahara
>
> "Joshua Nelson" <spam_box@ev1.net> wrote in message
> news:b102b6e4.0309040600.1463fc7@posting.google.co m...
> : "Jeepaholic" <jeepahoilcs@earthlink.net> wrote:
> : >
> : > Idiot.
> : >
> :
> : I'm rubber and you're glue. Whatever you say bounces off me and sticks
to
> you.
>
>
#80
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Superwinch = junk
Approximately 9/4/03 08:58, Nathan W. Collier uttered for posterity:
> "Joshua Nelson" <spam_box@ev1.net> wrote in message
> news:b102b6e4.0309040606.19600208@posting.google.c om...
>> Looking at the articles I still didn't see much explanation for what
>> some of these accessories are (****** block, shackles, etc.) Would
>> appreciate any reference explaining how they work with a winch.
>
> hi joshua,
> see http://7slotgrille.com/projects/00sa...ckit/index.htm
>
> you run the cable through the ****** block, you put the strap around the
> tree, you connect the ****** block and strap together using the shackle, and
> then you connect the cable either to another stationary object or back to
> the same jeep being pulled.
And you just created a lever that halves the needed pull power
at the expense of twice the distance pull.
> "Joshua Nelson" <spam_box@ev1.net> wrote in message
> news:b102b6e4.0309040606.19600208@posting.google.c om...
>> Looking at the articles I still didn't see much explanation for what
>> some of these accessories are (****** block, shackles, etc.) Would
>> appreciate any reference explaining how they work with a winch.
>
> hi joshua,
> see http://7slotgrille.com/projects/00sa...ckit/index.htm
>
> you run the cable through the ****** block, you put the strap around the
> tree, you connect the ****** block and strap together using the shackle, and
> then you connect the cable either to another stationary object or back to
> the same jeep being pulled.
And you just created a lever that halves the needed pull power
at the expense of twice the distance pull.