Shackles
#111
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Shackles
I've ruined so many "A" frame bushings, but what the hey just means
I got the job again in a couple of years.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Jeepster wrote:
>
> Thanks...I should have thought of that myself.
I got the job again in a couple of years.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Jeepster wrote:
>
> Thanks...I should have thought of that myself.
#112
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Shackles
I've ruined so many "A" frame bushings, but what the hey just means
I got the job again in a couple of years.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Jeepster wrote:
>
> Thanks...I should have thought of that myself.
I got the job again in a couple of years.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Jeepster wrote:
>
> Thanks...I should have thought of that myself.
#113
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Shackles
I've ruined so many "A" frame bushings, but what the hey just means
I got the job again in a couple of years.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Jeepster wrote:
>
> Thanks...I should have thought of that myself.
I got the job again in a couple of years.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Jeepster wrote:
>
> Thanks...I should have thought of that myself.
#114
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Shackles
Here is one way to think on it.....
The spring has an arch in it with one end fixed. Say it has a 2"
shackle.
Put the spring under compression and the moving end can only go 2" until
the arch in the spring comes under serious stress. This means the arch
can only straighten out 2" and means some of the U shape is retained.
Now put 6" shackles on it and compress the spring. The spring now can
get 6" longer which can completely flatten the spring and allow it to
even pass flat to reverse arch.
It does not take too many flexes past flat center to take the arch out
of a chunk of spring steel.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Roy J wrote:
>
> But you just defined FORCE, not TORQUE. There is a difference you
> know. I presume you know.
>
> The only way you can get TORQUE on a shackle is to have
> completely frozen shackle bolts in the bushings.
>
> I'd also suggest that YOUR force model is completely backward.
> The LONGER the shackle the LESS forward force is exerted on the
> spring. Standard resolution of forces diagram.
>
> L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> > You really can't see the leverage exerted on the length of spring
> > by a longer shackle? You will need to plug in the value at:
> > http://www.trebuchet.com/hardware/load.html We know that for the shackle
> > for the sake of argument the weight each shackle supports is about one
> > eighth of the Jeep, and that the stock shackle is nearly straight down,
> > in the short stock position, like a stilt, where nearly no energy is
> > trying to straighten the spring out, but you put the longer shackle on
> > it, it then tilts forward, that distance is the figure you may plug into
> > your model, a force that wasn't there before, you may take a breaker bar
> > and try to force it back underneath, but you'll soon learn that new
> > force is now too great. I suggest taking one of your classes.
> > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> >
> > Roy J wrote:
> >
> >>Sure do, I teach this stuff at the undergrad level. That's why I
> >>asked.
The spring has an arch in it with one end fixed. Say it has a 2"
shackle.
Put the spring under compression and the moving end can only go 2" until
the arch in the spring comes under serious stress. This means the arch
can only straighten out 2" and means some of the U shape is retained.
Now put 6" shackles on it and compress the spring. The spring now can
get 6" longer which can completely flatten the spring and allow it to
even pass flat to reverse arch.
It does not take too many flexes past flat center to take the arch out
of a chunk of spring steel.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Roy J wrote:
>
> But you just defined FORCE, not TORQUE. There is a difference you
> know. I presume you know.
>
> The only way you can get TORQUE on a shackle is to have
> completely frozen shackle bolts in the bushings.
>
> I'd also suggest that YOUR force model is completely backward.
> The LONGER the shackle the LESS forward force is exerted on the
> spring. Standard resolution of forces diagram.
>
> L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> > You really can't see the leverage exerted on the length of spring
> > by a longer shackle? You will need to plug in the value at:
> > http://www.trebuchet.com/hardware/load.html We know that for the shackle
> > for the sake of argument the weight each shackle supports is about one
> > eighth of the Jeep, and that the stock shackle is nearly straight down,
> > in the short stock position, like a stilt, where nearly no energy is
> > trying to straighten the spring out, but you put the longer shackle on
> > it, it then tilts forward, that distance is the figure you may plug into
> > your model, a force that wasn't there before, you may take a breaker bar
> > and try to force it back underneath, but you'll soon learn that new
> > force is now too great. I suggest taking one of your classes.
> > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> >
> > Roy J wrote:
> >
> >>Sure do, I teach this stuff at the undergrad level. That's why I
> >>asked.
#115
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Shackles
Here is one way to think on it.....
The spring has an arch in it with one end fixed. Say it has a 2"
shackle.
Put the spring under compression and the moving end can only go 2" until
the arch in the spring comes under serious stress. This means the arch
can only straighten out 2" and means some of the U shape is retained.
Now put 6" shackles on it and compress the spring. The spring now can
get 6" longer which can completely flatten the spring and allow it to
even pass flat to reverse arch.
It does not take too many flexes past flat center to take the arch out
of a chunk of spring steel.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Roy J wrote:
>
> But you just defined FORCE, not TORQUE. There is a difference you
> know. I presume you know.
>
> The only way you can get TORQUE on a shackle is to have
> completely frozen shackle bolts in the bushings.
>
> I'd also suggest that YOUR force model is completely backward.
> The LONGER the shackle the LESS forward force is exerted on the
> spring. Standard resolution of forces diagram.
>
> L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> > You really can't see the leverage exerted on the length of spring
> > by a longer shackle? You will need to plug in the value at:
> > http://www.trebuchet.com/hardware/load.html We know that for the shackle
> > for the sake of argument the weight each shackle supports is about one
> > eighth of the Jeep, and that the stock shackle is nearly straight down,
> > in the short stock position, like a stilt, where nearly no energy is
> > trying to straighten the spring out, but you put the longer shackle on
> > it, it then tilts forward, that distance is the figure you may plug into
> > your model, a force that wasn't there before, you may take a breaker bar
> > and try to force it back underneath, but you'll soon learn that new
> > force is now too great. I suggest taking one of your classes.
> > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> >
> > Roy J wrote:
> >
> >>Sure do, I teach this stuff at the undergrad level. That's why I
> >>asked.
The spring has an arch in it with one end fixed. Say it has a 2"
shackle.
Put the spring under compression and the moving end can only go 2" until
the arch in the spring comes under serious stress. This means the arch
can only straighten out 2" and means some of the U shape is retained.
Now put 6" shackles on it and compress the spring. The spring now can
get 6" longer which can completely flatten the spring and allow it to
even pass flat to reverse arch.
It does not take too many flexes past flat center to take the arch out
of a chunk of spring steel.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Roy J wrote:
>
> But you just defined FORCE, not TORQUE. There is a difference you
> know. I presume you know.
>
> The only way you can get TORQUE on a shackle is to have
> completely frozen shackle bolts in the bushings.
>
> I'd also suggest that YOUR force model is completely backward.
> The LONGER the shackle the LESS forward force is exerted on the
> spring. Standard resolution of forces diagram.
>
> L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> > You really can't see the leverage exerted on the length of spring
> > by a longer shackle? You will need to plug in the value at:
> > http://www.trebuchet.com/hardware/load.html We know that for the shackle
> > for the sake of argument the weight each shackle supports is about one
> > eighth of the Jeep, and that the stock shackle is nearly straight down,
> > in the short stock position, like a stilt, where nearly no energy is
> > trying to straighten the spring out, but you put the longer shackle on
> > it, it then tilts forward, that distance is the figure you may plug into
> > your model, a force that wasn't there before, you may take a breaker bar
> > and try to force it back underneath, but you'll soon learn that new
> > force is now too great. I suggest taking one of your classes.
> > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> >
> > Roy J wrote:
> >
> >>Sure do, I teach this stuff at the undergrad level. That's why I
> >>asked.
#116
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Shackles
Here is one way to think on it.....
The spring has an arch in it with one end fixed. Say it has a 2"
shackle.
Put the spring under compression and the moving end can only go 2" until
the arch in the spring comes under serious stress. This means the arch
can only straighten out 2" and means some of the U shape is retained.
Now put 6" shackles on it and compress the spring. The spring now can
get 6" longer which can completely flatten the spring and allow it to
even pass flat to reverse arch.
It does not take too many flexes past flat center to take the arch out
of a chunk of spring steel.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Roy J wrote:
>
> But you just defined FORCE, not TORQUE. There is a difference you
> know. I presume you know.
>
> The only way you can get TORQUE on a shackle is to have
> completely frozen shackle bolts in the bushings.
>
> I'd also suggest that YOUR force model is completely backward.
> The LONGER the shackle the LESS forward force is exerted on the
> spring. Standard resolution of forces diagram.
>
> L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> > You really can't see the leverage exerted on the length of spring
> > by a longer shackle? You will need to plug in the value at:
> > http://www.trebuchet.com/hardware/load.html We know that for the shackle
> > for the sake of argument the weight each shackle supports is about one
> > eighth of the Jeep, and that the stock shackle is nearly straight down,
> > in the short stock position, like a stilt, where nearly no energy is
> > trying to straighten the spring out, but you put the longer shackle on
> > it, it then tilts forward, that distance is the figure you may plug into
> > your model, a force that wasn't there before, you may take a breaker bar
> > and try to force it back underneath, but you'll soon learn that new
> > force is now too great. I suggest taking one of your classes.
> > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> >
> > Roy J wrote:
> >
> >>Sure do, I teach this stuff at the undergrad level. That's why I
> >>asked.
The spring has an arch in it with one end fixed. Say it has a 2"
shackle.
Put the spring under compression and the moving end can only go 2" until
the arch in the spring comes under serious stress. This means the arch
can only straighten out 2" and means some of the U shape is retained.
Now put 6" shackles on it and compress the spring. The spring now can
get 6" longer which can completely flatten the spring and allow it to
even pass flat to reverse arch.
It does not take too many flexes past flat center to take the arch out
of a chunk of spring steel.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Roy J wrote:
>
> But you just defined FORCE, not TORQUE. There is a difference you
> know. I presume you know.
>
> The only way you can get TORQUE on a shackle is to have
> completely frozen shackle bolts in the bushings.
>
> I'd also suggest that YOUR force model is completely backward.
> The LONGER the shackle the LESS forward force is exerted on the
> spring. Standard resolution of forces diagram.
>
> L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> > You really can't see the leverage exerted on the length of spring
> > by a longer shackle? You will need to plug in the value at:
> > http://www.trebuchet.com/hardware/load.html We know that for the shackle
> > for the sake of argument the weight each shackle supports is about one
> > eighth of the Jeep, and that the stock shackle is nearly straight down,
> > in the short stock position, like a stilt, where nearly no energy is
> > trying to straighten the spring out, but you put the longer shackle on
> > it, it then tilts forward, that distance is the figure you may plug into
> > your model, a force that wasn't there before, you may take a breaker bar
> > and try to force it back underneath, but you'll soon learn that new
> > force is now too great. I suggest taking one of your classes.
> > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> >
> > Roy J wrote:
> >
> >>Sure do, I teach this stuff at the undergrad level. That's why I
> >>asked.
#117
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Shackles
Here is one way to think on it.....
The spring has an arch in it with one end fixed. Say it has a 2"
shackle.
Put the spring under compression and the moving end can only go 2" until
the arch in the spring comes under serious stress. This means the arch
can only straighten out 2" and means some of the U shape is retained.
Now put 6" shackles on it and compress the spring. The spring now can
get 6" longer which can completely flatten the spring and allow it to
even pass flat to reverse arch.
It does not take too many flexes past flat center to take the arch out
of a chunk of spring steel.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Roy J wrote:
>
> But you just defined FORCE, not TORQUE. There is a difference you
> know. I presume you know.
>
> The only way you can get TORQUE on a shackle is to have
> completely frozen shackle bolts in the bushings.
>
> I'd also suggest that YOUR force model is completely backward.
> The LONGER the shackle the LESS forward force is exerted on the
> spring. Standard resolution of forces diagram.
>
> L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> > You really can't see the leverage exerted on the length of spring
> > by a longer shackle? You will need to plug in the value at:
> > http://www.trebuchet.com/hardware/load.html We know that for the shackle
> > for the sake of argument the weight each shackle supports is about one
> > eighth of the Jeep, and that the stock shackle is nearly straight down,
> > in the short stock position, like a stilt, where nearly no energy is
> > trying to straighten the spring out, but you put the longer shackle on
> > it, it then tilts forward, that distance is the figure you may plug into
> > your model, a force that wasn't there before, you may take a breaker bar
> > and try to force it back underneath, but you'll soon learn that new
> > force is now too great. I suggest taking one of your classes.
> > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> >
> > Roy J wrote:
> >
> >>Sure do, I teach this stuff at the undergrad level. That's why I
> >>asked.
The spring has an arch in it with one end fixed. Say it has a 2"
shackle.
Put the spring under compression and the moving end can only go 2" until
the arch in the spring comes under serious stress. This means the arch
can only straighten out 2" and means some of the U shape is retained.
Now put 6" shackles on it and compress the spring. The spring now can
get 6" longer which can completely flatten the spring and allow it to
even pass flat to reverse arch.
It does not take too many flexes past flat center to take the arch out
of a chunk of spring steel.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Roy J wrote:
>
> But you just defined FORCE, not TORQUE. There is a difference you
> know. I presume you know.
>
> The only way you can get TORQUE on a shackle is to have
> completely frozen shackle bolts in the bushings.
>
> I'd also suggest that YOUR force model is completely backward.
> The LONGER the shackle the LESS forward force is exerted on the
> spring. Standard resolution of forces diagram.
>
> L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> > You really can't see the leverage exerted on the length of spring
> > by a longer shackle? You will need to plug in the value at:
> > http://www.trebuchet.com/hardware/load.html We know that for the shackle
> > for the sake of argument the weight each shackle supports is about one
> > eighth of the Jeep, and that the stock shackle is nearly straight down,
> > in the short stock position, like a stilt, where nearly no energy is
> > trying to straighten the spring out, but you put the longer shackle on
> > it, it then tilts forward, that distance is the figure you may plug into
> > your model, a force that wasn't there before, you may take a breaker bar
> > and try to force it back underneath, but you'll soon learn that new
> > force is now too great. I suggest taking one of your classes.
> > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> >
> > Roy J wrote:
> >
> >>Sure do, I teach this stuff at the undergrad level. That's why I
> >>asked.
#118
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Shackles
It will settle down as the suspension flexes.
"Jeepster" <yj_driver@NOSPAM___.com> wrote in message
news:u66j90l58upommnv5fb5jhp738u2k7e08l@4ax.com...
> I took the shackles off and put the original shackles back on, the
> funny thing is the front end sits 1" higher than it did before.
> ( I measured 19" to the bottom of the bumper before I started and now
> it is 20")
>
> On Tue, 04 May 2004 19:44:08 -0700, L.W.(ßill) ------ III
> <----------@***.net> wrote:
>
> > Too late, notice how straight the springs are. Compare then to
> >stock arc: http://www.angelfire.com/ok/beakl/jeepixpage.html
> > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> >mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> >
> >Jeepster wrote:
> >>
> >> Do these look like they would be beefy enough?
> >>
> >> http://clubweb.interbaun.com/kb57/
>
"Jeepster" <yj_driver@NOSPAM___.com> wrote in message
news:u66j90l58upommnv5fb5jhp738u2k7e08l@4ax.com...
> I took the shackles off and put the original shackles back on, the
> funny thing is the front end sits 1" higher than it did before.
> ( I measured 19" to the bottom of the bumper before I started and now
> it is 20")
>
> On Tue, 04 May 2004 19:44:08 -0700, L.W.(ßill) ------ III
> <----------@***.net> wrote:
>
> > Too late, notice how straight the springs are. Compare then to
> >stock arc: http://www.angelfire.com/ok/beakl/jeepixpage.html
> > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> >mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> >
> >Jeepster wrote:
> >>
> >> Do these look like they would be beefy enough?
> >>
> >> http://clubweb.interbaun.com/kb57/
>
#119
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Shackles
It will settle down as the suspension flexes.
"Jeepster" <yj_driver@NOSPAM___.com> wrote in message
news:u66j90l58upommnv5fb5jhp738u2k7e08l@4ax.com...
> I took the shackles off and put the original shackles back on, the
> funny thing is the front end sits 1" higher than it did before.
> ( I measured 19" to the bottom of the bumper before I started and now
> it is 20")
>
> On Tue, 04 May 2004 19:44:08 -0700, L.W.(ßill) ------ III
> <----------@***.net> wrote:
>
> > Too late, notice how straight the springs are. Compare then to
> >stock arc: http://www.angelfire.com/ok/beakl/jeepixpage.html
> > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> >mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> >
> >Jeepster wrote:
> >>
> >> Do these look like they would be beefy enough?
> >>
> >> http://clubweb.interbaun.com/kb57/
>
"Jeepster" <yj_driver@NOSPAM___.com> wrote in message
news:u66j90l58upommnv5fb5jhp738u2k7e08l@4ax.com...
> I took the shackles off and put the original shackles back on, the
> funny thing is the front end sits 1" higher than it did before.
> ( I measured 19" to the bottom of the bumper before I started and now
> it is 20")
>
> On Tue, 04 May 2004 19:44:08 -0700, L.W.(ßill) ------ III
> <----------@***.net> wrote:
>
> > Too late, notice how straight the springs are. Compare then to
> >stock arc: http://www.angelfire.com/ok/beakl/jeepixpage.html
> > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> >mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> >
> >Jeepster wrote:
> >>
> >> Do these look like they would be beefy enough?
> >>
> >> http://clubweb.interbaun.com/kb57/
>
#120
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Shackles
It will settle down as the suspension flexes.
"Jeepster" <yj_driver@NOSPAM___.com> wrote in message
news:u66j90l58upommnv5fb5jhp738u2k7e08l@4ax.com...
> I took the shackles off and put the original shackles back on, the
> funny thing is the front end sits 1" higher than it did before.
> ( I measured 19" to the bottom of the bumper before I started and now
> it is 20")
>
> On Tue, 04 May 2004 19:44:08 -0700, L.W.(ßill) ------ III
> <----------@***.net> wrote:
>
> > Too late, notice how straight the springs are. Compare then to
> >stock arc: http://www.angelfire.com/ok/beakl/jeepixpage.html
> > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> >mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> >
> >Jeepster wrote:
> >>
> >> Do these look like they would be beefy enough?
> >>
> >> http://clubweb.interbaun.com/kb57/
>
"Jeepster" <yj_driver@NOSPAM___.com> wrote in message
news:u66j90l58upommnv5fb5jhp738u2k7e08l@4ax.com...
> I took the shackles off and put the original shackles back on, the
> funny thing is the front end sits 1" higher than it did before.
> ( I measured 19" to the bottom of the bumper before I started and now
> it is 20")
>
> On Tue, 04 May 2004 19:44:08 -0700, L.W.(ßill) ------ III
> <----------@***.net> wrote:
>
> > Too late, notice how straight the springs are. Compare then to
> >stock arc: http://www.angelfire.com/ok/beakl/jeepixpage.html
> > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> >mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> >
> >Jeepster wrote:
> >>
> >> Do these look like they would be beefy enough?
> >>
> >> http://clubweb.interbaun.com/kb57/
>