More New Scrambler Details
#161
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: More New Scrambler Details
If you want bang for the buck it's nitrous oxide, an additional
hundred and fifty horse power, (350" no other changes) none of it robbed
to pull a blower, or push through clogged exhaust.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Goat Crapp wrote:
>
> just for the record, awd tsi's and other stock turbo'd with that particular
> engine (the new EVO for isntance) vehicles can usually break into the 11's
> without too much trouble.
>
> the older chrysler turbo 2.2's have more than a few minivans in the high 12's
> with no more modding than a homemade dawes device to let them up the boost, and
> maybe an aftermarket fpr.
>
> yes all else being equal (ie: build the larger engine up to handle 20psi of
> forced induction) i would still put my money on the larger engine. but ANY
> vehicle in the 11's with under 1,000 in mods (total cost to get most of the
> chrysler/mitsubishi turbo motors into the 11's, or 12's with the heavier
> minivans) is pretty impressive...
>
> It just seems too many on the boards get worked up over any possible threat to
> their "american muscle" and refuse to just look at the facts out there. (and
> yes, a properly built 4g63 (engine code for the tsi in question) with maybe 5k
> in mods will outrun many if not most of the naturally aspirated v8's out there
> (it will be in the 10's down the 1320 - however they tend to have a lot of
> trouble keeping their trannys together at that point)
>
> but as with most turbo vehicles, you are correct... as for low end torque, an
> engine designed around a turbo usually doesnt have much. Take the new wrx's..
> great rally car - if you keep it above 3500 rpm. below that a motor scoorter
> with a leaf blower engine could outrun it.
>
> but you would be surprised at what could keep up with (gasp blasphemy) even a
> TT'd 5.0 (me and a buddy are working on one right now in fact. dual super60's
> with 400cc secondary injectors, on a windsor block with 8:1 pistons (handle
> more boost) and whatever else he had done before i got invovled) you know the
> difference between a 1000HP mustang and a 600hp mustang? theyre both gonna run
> within .4 seconds of eachother, they key problem being traction.. one will have
> a trap speed in the high 120's tho, the other in the 11x's.
>
> i've owned several of both types of engines (and the cars surrounding them)
> from a stock jeep, to a built 305 camaro (yah i know "built" and "305" dont get
> mentioend in the same sentence much haha) to my current vehcile, a built turbo
> rx7 (no pistons) that spins to 9,000 rpm... i appreciate both applications,
> and where each would be better suited... i agree wholeheartedly that offroad i
> prefer a torquey off idle engine. the new generation of smaller turbo engines
> however are being built to take ungodly amounts of boost and are easy/cheap to
> upgrade.. letting them hang quite comfortably with naturally aspirated cars of
> much greater displacement
hundred and fifty horse power, (350" no other changes) none of it robbed
to pull a blower, or push through clogged exhaust.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Goat Crapp wrote:
>
> just for the record, awd tsi's and other stock turbo'd with that particular
> engine (the new EVO for isntance) vehicles can usually break into the 11's
> without too much trouble.
>
> the older chrysler turbo 2.2's have more than a few minivans in the high 12's
> with no more modding than a homemade dawes device to let them up the boost, and
> maybe an aftermarket fpr.
>
> yes all else being equal (ie: build the larger engine up to handle 20psi of
> forced induction) i would still put my money on the larger engine. but ANY
> vehicle in the 11's with under 1,000 in mods (total cost to get most of the
> chrysler/mitsubishi turbo motors into the 11's, or 12's with the heavier
> minivans) is pretty impressive...
>
> It just seems too many on the boards get worked up over any possible threat to
> their "american muscle" and refuse to just look at the facts out there. (and
> yes, a properly built 4g63 (engine code for the tsi in question) with maybe 5k
> in mods will outrun many if not most of the naturally aspirated v8's out there
> (it will be in the 10's down the 1320 - however they tend to have a lot of
> trouble keeping their trannys together at that point)
>
> but as with most turbo vehicles, you are correct... as for low end torque, an
> engine designed around a turbo usually doesnt have much. Take the new wrx's..
> great rally car - if you keep it above 3500 rpm. below that a motor scoorter
> with a leaf blower engine could outrun it.
>
> but you would be surprised at what could keep up with (gasp blasphemy) even a
> TT'd 5.0 (me and a buddy are working on one right now in fact. dual super60's
> with 400cc secondary injectors, on a windsor block with 8:1 pistons (handle
> more boost) and whatever else he had done before i got invovled) you know the
> difference between a 1000HP mustang and a 600hp mustang? theyre both gonna run
> within .4 seconds of eachother, they key problem being traction.. one will have
> a trap speed in the high 120's tho, the other in the 11x's.
>
> i've owned several of both types of engines (and the cars surrounding them)
> from a stock jeep, to a built 305 camaro (yah i know "built" and "305" dont get
> mentioend in the same sentence much haha) to my current vehcile, a built turbo
> rx7 (no pistons) that spins to 9,000 rpm... i appreciate both applications,
> and where each would be better suited... i agree wholeheartedly that offroad i
> prefer a torquey off idle engine. the new generation of smaller turbo engines
> however are being built to take ungodly amounts of boost and are easy/cheap to
> upgrade.. letting them hang quite comfortably with naturally aspirated cars of
> much greater displacement
#162
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: More New Scrambler Details
> If you want bang for the buck it's nitrous oxide, an additional
>hundred and fifty horse power, (350" no other changes) none of it robbed
>to pull a blower, or push through clogged exhaust.
Oh i agree whole heartedly.. and a lot of turbo'd cars will use n2o (a 34/24
jetting, very small) to help with the spool up times,. Dan (the stang we're
building) plans on using the equivalent of a 75 shot for exactly this purpose..
a super 60 running off of just one exhaust bank (he's running one off of each)
will take a good bit to spool... the n2o will help with that as well as the
added benefit of cooling the intake charge. He just wanted to to not rely on
his bottle pressure, capacity etc to be able to make power.. running a large
jetting, as the 150 would be, would empty a 15lb bottle in 3-4 passes. On a
test and tune day at his track, (open from the AM, no noise ordinances :) he
can get in 10 passes easy... the same 15lb bottle will last him all day using
the smaller shot, and only until hes sufficiently dipping into the boost.
he's thought about a super charger setup as well, but he's a welder by trade,
so in terms of cost, and expertise, it was nothing for him to fab up some
flanges and piping... and not have to worry about a drivershaft for the s/c or
the added pulleys.
-Steve 98 TJ
>hundred and fifty horse power, (350" no other changes) none of it robbed
>to pull a blower, or push through clogged exhaust.
Oh i agree whole heartedly.. and a lot of turbo'd cars will use n2o (a 34/24
jetting, very small) to help with the spool up times,. Dan (the stang we're
building) plans on using the equivalent of a 75 shot for exactly this purpose..
a super 60 running off of just one exhaust bank (he's running one off of each)
will take a good bit to spool... the n2o will help with that as well as the
added benefit of cooling the intake charge. He just wanted to to not rely on
his bottle pressure, capacity etc to be able to make power.. running a large
jetting, as the 150 would be, would empty a 15lb bottle in 3-4 passes. On a
test and tune day at his track, (open from the AM, no noise ordinances :) he
can get in 10 passes easy... the same 15lb bottle will last him all day using
the smaller shot, and only until hes sufficiently dipping into the boost.
he's thought about a super charger setup as well, but he's a welder by trade,
so in terms of cost, and expertise, it was nothing for him to fab up some
flanges and piping... and not have to worry about a drivershaft for the s/c or
the added pulleys.
-Steve 98 TJ
#163
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: More New Scrambler Details
> If you want bang for the buck it's nitrous oxide, an additional
>hundred and fifty horse power, (350" no other changes) none of it robbed
>to pull a blower, or push through clogged exhaust.
Oh i agree whole heartedly.. and a lot of turbo'd cars will use n2o (a 34/24
jetting, very small) to help with the spool up times,. Dan (the stang we're
building) plans on using the equivalent of a 75 shot for exactly this purpose..
a super 60 running off of just one exhaust bank (he's running one off of each)
will take a good bit to spool... the n2o will help with that as well as the
added benefit of cooling the intake charge. He just wanted to to not rely on
his bottle pressure, capacity etc to be able to make power.. running a large
jetting, as the 150 would be, would empty a 15lb bottle in 3-4 passes. On a
test and tune day at his track, (open from the AM, no noise ordinances :) he
can get in 10 passes easy... the same 15lb bottle will last him all day using
the smaller shot, and only until hes sufficiently dipping into the boost.
he's thought about a super charger setup as well, but he's a welder by trade,
so in terms of cost, and expertise, it was nothing for him to fab up some
flanges and piping... and not have to worry about a drivershaft for the s/c or
the added pulleys.
-Steve 98 TJ
>hundred and fifty horse power, (350" no other changes) none of it robbed
>to pull a blower, or push through clogged exhaust.
Oh i agree whole heartedly.. and a lot of turbo'd cars will use n2o (a 34/24
jetting, very small) to help with the spool up times,. Dan (the stang we're
building) plans on using the equivalent of a 75 shot for exactly this purpose..
a super 60 running off of just one exhaust bank (he's running one off of each)
will take a good bit to spool... the n2o will help with that as well as the
added benefit of cooling the intake charge. He just wanted to to not rely on
his bottle pressure, capacity etc to be able to make power.. running a large
jetting, as the 150 would be, would empty a 15lb bottle in 3-4 passes. On a
test and tune day at his track, (open from the AM, no noise ordinances :) he
can get in 10 passes easy... the same 15lb bottle will last him all day using
the smaller shot, and only until hes sufficiently dipping into the boost.
he's thought about a super charger setup as well, but he's a welder by trade,
so in terms of cost, and expertise, it was nothing for him to fab up some
flanges and piping... and not have to worry about a drivershaft for the s/c or
the added pulleys.
-Steve 98 TJ
#164
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: More New Scrambler Details
> If you want bang for the buck it's nitrous oxide, an additional
>hundred and fifty horse power, (350" no other changes) none of it robbed
>to pull a blower, or push through clogged exhaust.
Oh i agree whole heartedly.. and a lot of turbo'd cars will use n2o (a 34/24
jetting, very small) to help with the spool up times,. Dan (the stang we're
building) plans on using the equivalent of a 75 shot for exactly this purpose..
a super 60 running off of just one exhaust bank (he's running one off of each)
will take a good bit to spool... the n2o will help with that as well as the
added benefit of cooling the intake charge. He just wanted to to not rely on
his bottle pressure, capacity etc to be able to make power.. running a large
jetting, as the 150 would be, would empty a 15lb bottle in 3-4 passes. On a
test and tune day at his track, (open from the AM, no noise ordinances :) he
can get in 10 passes easy... the same 15lb bottle will last him all day using
the smaller shot, and only until hes sufficiently dipping into the boost.
he's thought about a super charger setup as well, but he's a welder by trade,
so in terms of cost, and expertise, it was nothing for him to fab up some
flanges and piping... and not have to worry about a drivershaft for the s/c or
the added pulleys.
-Steve 98 TJ
>hundred and fifty horse power, (350" no other changes) none of it robbed
>to pull a blower, or push through clogged exhaust.
Oh i agree whole heartedly.. and a lot of turbo'd cars will use n2o (a 34/24
jetting, very small) to help with the spool up times,. Dan (the stang we're
building) plans on using the equivalent of a 75 shot for exactly this purpose..
a super 60 running off of just one exhaust bank (he's running one off of each)
will take a good bit to spool... the n2o will help with that as well as the
added benefit of cooling the intake charge. He just wanted to to not rely on
his bottle pressure, capacity etc to be able to make power.. running a large
jetting, as the 150 would be, would empty a 15lb bottle in 3-4 passes. On a
test and tune day at his track, (open from the AM, no noise ordinances :) he
can get in 10 passes easy... the same 15lb bottle will last him all day using
the smaller shot, and only until hes sufficiently dipping into the boost.
he's thought about a super charger setup as well, but he's a welder by trade,
so in terms of cost, and expertise, it was nothing for him to fab up some
flanges and piping... and not have to worry about a drivershaft for the s/c or
the added pulleys.
-Steve 98 TJ
#165
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: More New Scrambler Details
if it's not spun up, you are driving a 8:1 low compression engine..
--
Dave Milne, Scotland
'99 TJ 4.0 Sahara
"L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
news:3F86FACF.EEDD8A61@***.net...
: Plus your blower gives you power instantly, no lag time like a
: turbo, they have to count one thousand one, one thousand two, before
: anything happens. On a five speed they spend more time un-powered upon
: shifts as I do to clear the whole quarter mile drag.
: God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
: mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
:
: DougW wrote:
: >
: > Which is why I stuffed a blower on the 4.0 :)
: > Turbos are good for high RPM boost but superchargers give
: > you low end umph.
: >
: > I rilly want to stroke it out to 4.7, but that's going to have
: > to wait.
: >
: > --
: > -- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.***.net/wilsond
: > HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
: > Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
--
Dave Milne, Scotland
'99 TJ 4.0 Sahara
"L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
news:3F86FACF.EEDD8A61@***.net...
: Plus your blower gives you power instantly, no lag time like a
: turbo, they have to count one thousand one, one thousand two, before
: anything happens. On a five speed they spend more time un-powered upon
: shifts as I do to clear the whole quarter mile drag.
: God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
: mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
:
: DougW wrote:
: >
: > Which is why I stuffed a blower on the 4.0 :)
: > Turbos are good for high RPM boost but superchargers give
: > you low end umph.
: >
: > I rilly want to stroke it out to 4.7, but that's going to have
: > to wait.
: >
: > --
: > -- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.***.net/wilsond
: > HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
: > Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
#166
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: More New Scrambler Details
if it's not spun up, you are driving a 8:1 low compression engine..
--
Dave Milne, Scotland
'99 TJ 4.0 Sahara
"L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
news:3F86FACF.EEDD8A61@***.net...
: Plus your blower gives you power instantly, no lag time like a
: turbo, they have to count one thousand one, one thousand two, before
: anything happens. On a five speed they spend more time un-powered upon
: shifts as I do to clear the whole quarter mile drag.
: God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
: mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
:
: DougW wrote:
: >
: > Which is why I stuffed a blower on the 4.0 :)
: > Turbos are good for high RPM boost but superchargers give
: > you low end umph.
: >
: > I rilly want to stroke it out to 4.7, but that's going to have
: > to wait.
: >
: > --
: > -- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.***.net/wilsond
: > HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
: > Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
--
Dave Milne, Scotland
'99 TJ 4.0 Sahara
"L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
news:3F86FACF.EEDD8A61@***.net...
: Plus your blower gives you power instantly, no lag time like a
: turbo, they have to count one thousand one, one thousand two, before
: anything happens. On a five speed they spend more time un-powered upon
: shifts as I do to clear the whole quarter mile drag.
: God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
: mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
:
: DougW wrote:
: >
: > Which is why I stuffed a blower on the 4.0 :)
: > Turbos are good for high RPM boost but superchargers give
: > you low end umph.
: >
: > I rilly want to stroke it out to 4.7, but that's going to have
: > to wait.
: >
: > --
: > -- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.***.net/wilsond
: > HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
: > Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
#167
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: More New Scrambler Details
if it's not spun up, you are driving a 8:1 low compression engine..
--
Dave Milne, Scotland
'99 TJ 4.0 Sahara
"L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
news:3F86FACF.EEDD8A61@***.net...
: Plus your blower gives you power instantly, no lag time like a
: turbo, they have to count one thousand one, one thousand two, before
: anything happens. On a five speed they spend more time un-powered upon
: shifts as I do to clear the whole quarter mile drag.
: God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
: mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
:
: DougW wrote:
: >
: > Which is why I stuffed a blower on the 4.0 :)
: > Turbos are good for high RPM boost but superchargers give
: > you low end umph.
: >
: > I rilly want to stroke it out to 4.7, but that's going to have
: > to wait.
: >
: > --
: > -- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.***.net/wilsond
: > HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
: > Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
--
Dave Milne, Scotland
'99 TJ 4.0 Sahara
"L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
news:3F86FACF.EEDD8A61@***.net...
: Plus your blower gives you power instantly, no lag time like a
: turbo, they have to count one thousand one, one thousand two, before
: anything happens. On a five speed they spend more time un-powered upon
: shifts as I do to clear the whole quarter mile drag.
: God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
: mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
:
: DougW wrote:
: >
: > Which is why I stuffed a blower on the 4.0 :)
: > Turbos are good for high RPM boost but superchargers give
: > you low end umph.
: >
: > I rilly want to stroke it out to 4.7, but that's going to have
: > to wait.
: >
: > --
: > -- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.***.net/wilsond
: > HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
: > Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
#168
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: More New Scrambler Details
>if it's not spun up, you are driving a 8:1 low compression engine..
thats why you launch at 3k rpm ;) when it IS spun up, that 8:1 (vs 10.5:1 i
think? well on the stang's motor) will let you run 5-7lbs more boost before
pinging, which more than makes up for it :)
totally useless offroad tho- i think the topic has kinda split into 2 separate
arguments ;) well.. ok, discussions.
-Steve 98 TJ
thats why you launch at 3k rpm ;) when it IS spun up, that 8:1 (vs 10.5:1 i
think? well on the stang's motor) will let you run 5-7lbs more boost before
pinging, which more than makes up for it :)
totally useless offroad tho- i think the topic has kinda split into 2 separate
arguments ;) well.. ok, discussions.
-Steve 98 TJ
#169
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: More New Scrambler Details
>if it's not spun up, you are driving a 8:1 low compression engine..
thats why you launch at 3k rpm ;) when it IS spun up, that 8:1 (vs 10.5:1 i
think? well on the stang's motor) will let you run 5-7lbs more boost before
pinging, which more than makes up for it :)
totally useless offroad tho- i think the topic has kinda split into 2 separate
arguments ;) well.. ok, discussions.
-Steve 98 TJ
thats why you launch at 3k rpm ;) when it IS spun up, that 8:1 (vs 10.5:1 i
think? well on the stang's motor) will let you run 5-7lbs more boost before
pinging, which more than makes up for it :)
totally useless offroad tho- i think the topic has kinda split into 2 separate
arguments ;) well.. ok, discussions.
-Steve 98 TJ
#170
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: More New Scrambler Details
>if it's not spun up, you are driving a 8:1 low compression engine..
thats why you launch at 3k rpm ;) when it IS spun up, that 8:1 (vs 10.5:1 i
think? well on the stang's motor) will let you run 5-7lbs more boost before
pinging, which more than makes up for it :)
totally useless offroad tho- i think the topic has kinda split into 2 separate
arguments ;) well.. ok, discussions.
-Steve 98 TJ
thats why you launch at 3k rpm ;) when it IS spun up, that 8:1 (vs 10.5:1 i
think? well on the stang's motor) will let you run 5-7lbs more boost before
pinging, which more than makes up for it :)
totally useless offroad tho- i think the topic has kinda split into 2 separate
arguments ;) well.. ok, discussions.
-Steve 98 TJ