More New Scrambler Details
#141
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: More New Scrambler Details
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> In article <b102b6e4.0310100552.48a57e0a@posting.google.com >,
> spam_box@ev1.net (Joshua Nelson) writes:
>
>> And I stand by my argument that there are plenty of things you can
>> use to replace diplacement, the definition of "replace" being to
>> take away one thing and add something else instead. In your
>> example, perhaps you could arrange a nitrous oxide setup on your
>> rice burner to compensate for the fact that you are so much smaller
>> than Matt.
>
> Yet again, you're missing the point entirely. Can you get as much
> low-end torque out of a turbocharged 2.5L four cylinder as you can
> out of a Ford 427 V8 or a Chevy 454? I think not. Apples <> oranges!
> * * *
> Matt Macchiarolo
> www.townpeddler.com
> www.wolverine4wd.org
> http://wolverine4wd.org/rigs/macchiarolo_ml.html
Talk to someone that owns/owned on of those Toyota trucks with the turbo 4
banger. You need some god awful gears to make those things pull anything.
Turbos don't do ---- for power unless they are spinning fast enough to
create boost. I had a Shelby Charger back in the late 80s and it was a blast
to drive, but you had to rev the **** out of it to get any power. Lug the
engine down at all and bye bye power. The power peak on that thing was
higher than anyone here would rev their 258 or 4.0.
Chris
> In article <b102b6e4.0310100552.48a57e0a@posting.google.com >,
> spam_box@ev1.net (Joshua Nelson) writes:
>
>> And I stand by my argument that there are plenty of things you can
>> use to replace diplacement, the definition of "replace" being to
>> take away one thing and add something else instead. In your
>> example, perhaps you could arrange a nitrous oxide setup on your
>> rice burner to compensate for the fact that you are so much smaller
>> than Matt.
>
> Yet again, you're missing the point entirely. Can you get as much
> low-end torque out of a turbocharged 2.5L four cylinder as you can
> out of a Ford 427 V8 or a Chevy 454? I think not. Apples <> oranges!
> * * *
> Matt Macchiarolo
> www.townpeddler.com
> www.wolverine4wd.org
> http://wolverine4wd.org/rigs/macchiarolo_ml.html
Talk to someone that owns/owned on of those Toyota trucks with the turbo 4
banger. You need some god awful gears to make those things pull anything.
Turbos don't do ---- for power unless they are spinning fast enough to
create boost. I had a Shelby Charger back in the late 80s and it was a blast
to drive, but you had to rev the **** out of it to get any power. Lug the
engine down at all and bye bye power. The power peak on that thing was
higher than anyone here would rev their 258 or 4.0.
Chris
#142
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: More New Scrambler Details
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> In article <b102b6e4.0310100552.48a57e0a@posting.google.com >,
> spam_box@ev1.net (Joshua Nelson) writes:
>
>> And I stand by my argument that there are plenty of things you can
>> use to replace diplacement, the definition of "replace" being to
>> take away one thing and add something else instead. In your
>> example, perhaps you could arrange a nitrous oxide setup on your
>> rice burner to compensate for the fact that you are so much smaller
>> than Matt.
>
> Yet again, you're missing the point entirely. Can you get as much
> low-end torque out of a turbocharged 2.5L four cylinder as you can
> out of a Ford 427 V8 or a Chevy 454? I think not. Apples <> oranges!
> * * *
> Matt Macchiarolo
> www.townpeddler.com
> www.wolverine4wd.org
> http://wolverine4wd.org/rigs/macchiarolo_ml.html
Talk to someone that owns/owned on of those Toyota trucks with the turbo 4
banger. You need some god awful gears to make those things pull anything.
Turbos don't do ---- for power unless they are spinning fast enough to
create boost. I had a Shelby Charger back in the late 80s and it was a blast
to drive, but you had to rev the **** out of it to get any power. Lug the
engine down at all and bye bye power. The power peak on that thing was
higher than anyone here would rev their 258 or 4.0.
Chris
> In article <b102b6e4.0310100552.48a57e0a@posting.google.com >,
> spam_box@ev1.net (Joshua Nelson) writes:
>
>> And I stand by my argument that there are plenty of things you can
>> use to replace diplacement, the definition of "replace" being to
>> take away one thing and add something else instead. In your
>> example, perhaps you could arrange a nitrous oxide setup on your
>> rice burner to compensate for the fact that you are so much smaller
>> than Matt.
>
> Yet again, you're missing the point entirely. Can you get as much
> low-end torque out of a turbocharged 2.5L four cylinder as you can
> out of a Ford 427 V8 or a Chevy 454? I think not. Apples <> oranges!
> * * *
> Matt Macchiarolo
> www.townpeddler.com
> www.wolverine4wd.org
> http://wolverine4wd.org/rigs/macchiarolo_ml.html
Talk to someone that owns/owned on of those Toyota trucks with the turbo 4
banger. You need some god awful gears to make those things pull anything.
Turbos don't do ---- for power unless they are spinning fast enough to
create boost. I had a Shelby Charger back in the late 80s and it was a blast
to drive, but you had to rev the **** out of it to get any power. Lug the
engine down at all and bye bye power. The power peak on that thing was
higher than anyone here would rev their 258 or 4.0.
Chris
#143
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: More New Scrambler Details
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> In article <b102b6e4.0310100552.48a57e0a@posting.google.com >,
> spam_box@ev1.net (Joshua Nelson) writes:
>
>> And I stand by my argument that there are plenty of things you can
>> use to replace diplacement, the definition of "replace" being to
>> take away one thing and add something else instead. In your
>> example, perhaps you could arrange a nitrous oxide setup on your
>> rice burner to compensate for the fact that you are so much smaller
>> than Matt.
>
> Yet again, you're missing the point entirely. Can you get as much
> low-end torque out of a turbocharged 2.5L four cylinder as you can
> out of a Ford 427 V8 or a Chevy 454? I think not. Apples <> oranges!
> * * *
> Matt Macchiarolo
> www.townpeddler.com
> www.wolverine4wd.org
> http://wolverine4wd.org/rigs/macchiarolo_ml.html
Talk to someone that owns/owned on of those Toyota trucks with the turbo 4
banger. You need some god awful gears to make those things pull anything.
Turbos don't do ---- for power unless they are spinning fast enough to
create boost. I had a Shelby Charger back in the late 80s and it was a blast
to drive, but you had to rev the **** out of it to get any power. Lug the
engine down at all and bye bye power. The power peak on that thing was
higher than anyone here would rev their 258 or 4.0.
Chris
> In article <b102b6e4.0310100552.48a57e0a@posting.google.com >,
> spam_box@ev1.net (Joshua Nelson) writes:
>
>> And I stand by my argument that there are plenty of things you can
>> use to replace diplacement, the definition of "replace" being to
>> take away one thing and add something else instead. In your
>> example, perhaps you could arrange a nitrous oxide setup on your
>> rice burner to compensate for the fact that you are so much smaller
>> than Matt.
>
> Yet again, you're missing the point entirely. Can you get as much
> low-end torque out of a turbocharged 2.5L four cylinder as you can
> out of a Ford 427 V8 or a Chevy 454? I think not. Apples <> oranges!
> * * *
> Matt Macchiarolo
> www.townpeddler.com
> www.wolverine4wd.org
> http://wolverine4wd.org/rigs/macchiarolo_ml.html
Talk to someone that owns/owned on of those Toyota trucks with the turbo 4
banger. You need some god awful gears to make those things pull anything.
Turbos don't do ---- for power unless they are spinning fast enough to
create boost. I had a Shelby Charger back in the late 80s and it was a blast
to drive, but you had to rev the **** out of it to get any power. Lug the
engine down at all and bye bye power. The power peak on that thing was
higher than anyone here would rev their 258 or 4.0.
Chris
#144
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: More New Scrambler Details
c did pass the time by typing:
> Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>> (Joshua Nelson) writes:
>>
>>> And I stand by my argument that there are plenty of things you can
>>> use to replace diplacement, the definition of "replace" being to
>>> take away one thing and add something else instead. In your
>>> example, perhaps you could arrange a nitrous oxide setup on your
>>> rice burner to compensate for the fact that you are so much smaller
>>> than Matt.
>>
>> Yet again, you're missing the point entirely. Can you get as much
>> low-end torque out of a turbocharged 2.5L four cylinder as you can
>> out of a Ford 427 V8 or a Chevy 454? I think not. Apples <> oranges!
> Talk to someone that owns/owned on of those Toyota trucks with the turbo 4
> banger....
<snipppies>
> ....Lug the
> engine down at all and bye bye power.
Which is why I stuffed a blower on the 4.0 :)
Turbos are good for high RPM boost but superchargers give
you low end umph.
I rilly want to stroke it out to 4.7, but that's going to have
to wait.
--
-- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.***.net/wilsond
HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
> Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>> (Joshua Nelson) writes:
>>
>>> And I stand by my argument that there are plenty of things you can
>>> use to replace diplacement, the definition of "replace" being to
>>> take away one thing and add something else instead. In your
>>> example, perhaps you could arrange a nitrous oxide setup on your
>>> rice burner to compensate for the fact that you are so much smaller
>>> than Matt.
>>
>> Yet again, you're missing the point entirely. Can you get as much
>> low-end torque out of a turbocharged 2.5L four cylinder as you can
>> out of a Ford 427 V8 or a Chevy 454? I think not. Apples <> oranges!
> Talk to someone that owns/owned on of those Toyota trucks with the turbo 4
> banger....
<snipppies>
> ....Lug the
> engine down at all and bye bye power.
Which is why I stuffed a blower on the 4.0 :)
Turbos are good for high RPM boost but superchargers give
you low end umph.
I rilly want to stroke it out to 4.7, but that's going to have
to wait.
--
-- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.***.net/wilsond
HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
#145
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: More New Scrambler Details
c did pass the time by typing:
> Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>> (Joshua Nelson) writes:
>>
>>> And I stand by my argument that there are plenty of things you can
>>> use to replace diplacement, the definition of "replace" being to
>>> take away one thing and add something else instead. In your
>>> example, perhaps you could arrange a nitrous oxide setup on your
>>> rice burner to compensate for the fact that you are so much smaller
>>> than Matt.
>>
>> Yet again, you're missing the point entirely. Can you get as much
>> low-end torque out of a turbocharged 2.5L four cylinder as you can
>> out of a Ford 427 V8 or a Chevy 454? I think not. Apples <> oranges!
> Talk to someone that owns/owned on of those Toyota trucks with the turbo 4
> banger....
<snipppies>
> ....Lug the
> engine down at all and bye bye power.
Which is why I stuffed a blower on the 4.0 :)
Turbos are good for high RPM boost but superchargers give
you low end umph.
I rilly want to stroke it out to 4.7, but that's going to have
to wait.
--
-- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.***.net/wilsond
HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
> Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>> (Joshua Nelson) writes:
>>
>>> And I stand by my argument that there are plenty of things you can
>>> use to replace diplacement, the definition of "replace" being to
>>> take away one thing and add something else instead. In your
>>> example, perhaps you could arrange a nitrous oxide setup on your
>>> rice burner to compensate for the fact that you are so much smaller
>>> than Matt.
>>
>> Yet again, you're missing the point entirely. Can you get as much
>> low-end torque out of a turbocharged 2.5L four cylinder as you can
>> out of a Ford 427 V8 or a Chevy 454? I think not. Apples <> oranges!
> Talk to someone that owns/owned on of those Toyota trucks with the turbo 4
> banger....
<snipppies>
> ....Lug the
> engine down at all and bye bye power.
Which is why I stuffed a blower on the 4.0 :)
Turbos are good for high RPM boost but superchargers give
you low end umph.
I rilly want to stroke it out to 4.7, but that's going to have
to wait.
--
-- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.***.net/wilsond
HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
#146
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: More New Scrambler Details
c did pass the time by typing:
> Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>> (Joshua Nelson) writes:
>>
>>> And I stand by my argument that there are plenty of things you can
>>> use to replace diplacement, the definition of "replace" being to
>>> take away one thing and add something else instead. In your
>>> example, perhaps you could arrange a nitrous oxide setup on your
>>> rice burner to compensate for the fact that you are so much smaller
>>> than Matt.
>>
>> Yet again, you're missing the point entirely. Can you get as much
>> low-end torque out of a turbocharged 2.5L four cylinder as you can
>> out of a Ford 427 V8 or a Chevy 454? I think not. Apples <> oranges!
> Talk to someone that owns/owned on of those Toyota trucks with the turbo 4
> banger....
<snipppies>
> ....Lug the
> engine down at all and bye bye power.
Which is why I stuffed a blower on the 4.0 :)
Turbos are good for high RPM boost but superchargers give
you low end umph.
I rilly want to stroke it out to 4.7, but that's going to have
to wait.
--
-- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.***.net/wilsond
HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
> Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>> (Joshua Nelson) writes:
>>
>>> And I stand by my argument that there are plenty of things you can
>>> use to replace diplacement, the definition of "replace" being to
>>> take away one thing and add something else instead. In your
>>> example, perhaps you could arrange a nitrous oxide setup on your
>>> rice burner to compensate for the fact that you are so much smaller
>>> than Matt.
>>
>> Yet again, you're missing the point entirely. Can you get as much
>> low-end torque out of a turbocharged 2.5L four cylinder as you can
>> out of a Ford 427 V8 or a Chevy 454? I think not. Apples <> oranges!
> Talk to someone that owns/owned on of those Toyota trucks with the turbo 4
> banger....
<snipppies>
> ....Lug the
> engine down at all and bye bye power.
Which is why I stuffed a blower on the 4.0 :)
Turbos are good for high RPM boost but superchargers give
you low end umph.
I rilly want to stroke it out to 4.7, but that's going to have
to wait.
--
-- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.***.net/wilsond
HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
#147
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: More New Scrambler Details
In the old days we'd just chain the rear bumper together.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>
> Yet again, you're missing the point entirely. Can you get as much low-end
> torque out of a turbocharged 2.5L four cylinder as you can out of a Ford 427
> V8 or a Chevy 454? I think not. Apples <> oranges!
> * * *
> Matt Macchiarolo
> www.townpeddler.com
> www.wolverine4wd.org
> http://wolverine4wd.org/rigs/macchiarolo_ml.html
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>
> Yet again, you're missing the point entirely. Can you get as much low-end
> torque out of a turbocharged 2.5L four cylinder as you can out of a Ford 427
> V8 or a Chevy 454? I think not. Apples <> oranges!
> * * *
> Matt Macchiarolo
> www.townpeddler.com
> www.wolverine4wd.org
> http://wolverine4wd.org/rigs/macchiarolo_ml.html
#148
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: More New Scrambler Details
In the old days we'd just chain the rear bumper together.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>
> Yet again, you're missing the point entirely. Can you get as much low-end
> torque out of a turbocharged 2.5L four cylinder as you can out of a Ford 427
> V8 or a Chevy 454? I think not. Apples <> oranges!
> * * *
> Matt Macchiarolo
> www.townpeddler.com
> www.wolverine4wd.org
> http://wolverine4wd.org/rigs/macchiarolo_ml.html
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>
> Yet again, you're missing the point entirely. Can you get as much low-end
> torque out of a turbocharged 2.5L four cylinder as you can out of a Ford 427
> V8 or a Chevy 454? I think not. Apples <> oranges!
> * * *
> Matt Macchiarolo
> www.townpeddler.com
> www.wolverine4wd.org
> http://wolverine4wd.org/rigs/macchiarolo_ml.html
#149
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: More New Scrambler Details
In the old days we'd just chain the rear bumper together.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>
> Yet again, you're missing the point entirely. Can you get as much low-end
> torque out of a turbocharged 2.5L four cylinder as you can out of a Ford 427
> V8 or a Chevy 454? I think not. Apples <> oranges!
> * * *
> Matt Macchiarolo
> www.townpeddler.com
> www.wolverine4wd.org
> http://wolverine4wd.org/rigs/macchiarolo_ml.html
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>
> Yet again, you're missing the point entirely. Can you get as much low-end
> torque out of a turbocharged 2.5L four cylinder as you can out of a Ford 427
> V8 or a Chevy 454? I think not. Apples <> oranges!
> * * *
> Matt Macchiarolo
> www.townpeddler.com
> www.wolverine4wd.org
> http://wolverine4wd.org/rigs/macchiarolo_ml.html
#150
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: More New Scrambler Details
just for the record, awd tsi's and other stock turbo'd with that particular
engine (the new EVO for isntance) vehicles can usually break into the 11's
without too much trouble.
the older chrysler turbo 2.2's have more than a few minivans in the high 12's
with no more modding than a homemade dawes device to let them up the boost, and
maybe an aftermarket fpr.
yes all else being equal (ie: build the larger engine up to handle 20psi of
forced induction) i would still put my money on the larger engine. but ANY
vehicle in the 11's with under 1,000 in mods (total cost to get most of the
chrysler/mitsubishi turbo motors into the 11's, or 12's with the heavier
minivans) is pretty impressive...
It just seems too many on the boards get worked up over any possible threat to
their "american muscle" and refuse to just look at the facts out there. (and
yes, a properly built 4g63 (engine code for the tsi in question) with maybe 5k
in mods will outrun many if not most of the naturally aspirated v8's out there
(it will be in the 10's down the 1320 - however they tend to have a lot of
trouble keeping their trannys together at that point)
but as with most turbo vehicles, you are correct... as for low end torque, an
engine designed around a turbo usually doesnt have much. Take the new wrx's..
great rally car - if you keep it above 3500 rpm. below that a motor scoorter
with a leaf blower engine could outrun it.
but you would be surprised at what could keep up with (gasp blasphemy) even a
TT'd 5.0 (me and a buddy are working on one right now in fact. dual super60's
with 400cc secondary injectors, on a windsor block with 8:1 pistons (handle
more boost) and whatever else he had done before i got invovled) you know the
difference between a 1000HP mustang and a 600hp mustang? theyre both gonna run
within .4 seconds of eachother, they key problem being traction.. one will have
a trap speed in the high 120's tho, the other in the 11x's.
i've owned several of both types of engines (and the cars surrounding them)
from a stock jeep, to a built 305 camaro (yah i know "built" and "305" dont get
mentioend in the same sentence much haha) to my current vehcile, a built turbo
rx7 (no pistons) that spins to 9,000 rpm... i appreciate both applications,
and where each would be better suited... i agree wholeheartedly that offroad i
prefer a torquey off idle engine. the new generation of smaller turbo engines
however are being built to take ungodly amounts of boost and are easy/cheap to
upgrade.. letting them hang quite comfortably with naturally aspirated cars of
much greater displacement
>As for smoking a 5.0 Mustang, there are several levels of tune
> for that engine. Some of them wouldn't let the TSi get close
> enough to see if there is a rear license plate. With a twin
> turbo in the mucking fustang, it probably couldn't even get
> close enough to recognize it as a mustang.
>
>--
>My governor can kick your governor's ***
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
-Steve 98 TJ
engine (the new EVO for isntance) vehicles can usually break into the 11's
without too much trouble.
the older chrysler turbo 2.2's have more than a few minivans in the high 12's
with no more modding than a homemade dawes device to let them up the boost, and
maybe an aftermarket fpr.
yes all else being equal (ie: build the larger engine up to handle 20psi of
forced induction) i would still put my money on the larger engine. but ANY
vehicle in the 11's with under 1,000 in mods (total cost to get most of the
chrysler/mitsubishi turbo motors into the 11's, or 12's with the heavier
minivans) is pretty impressive...
It just seems too many on the boards get worked up over any possible threat to
their "american muscle" and refuse to just look at the facts out there. (and
yes, a properly built 4g63 (engine code for the tsi in question) with maybe 5k
in mods will outrun many if not most of the naturally aspirated v8's out there
(it will be in the 10's down the 1320 - however they tend to have a lot of
trouble keeping their trannys together at that point)
but as with most turbo vehicles, you are correct... as for low end torque, an
engine designed around a turbo usually doesnt have much. Take the new wrx's..
great rally car - if you keep it above 3500 rpm. below that a motor scoorter
with a leaf blower engine could outrun it.
but you would be surprised at what could keep up with (gasp blasphemy) even a
TT'd 5.0 (me and a buddy are working on one right now in fact. dual super60's
with 400cc secondary injectors, on a windsor block with 8:1 pistons (handle
more boost) and whatever else he had done before i got invovled) you know the
difference between a 1000HP mustang and a 600hp mustang? theyre both gonna run
within .4 seconds of eachother, they key problem being traction.. one will have
a trap speed in the high 120's tho, the other in the 11x's.
i've owned several of both types of engines (and the cars surrounding them)
from a stock jeep, to a built 305 camaro (yah i know "built" and "305" dont get
mentioend in the same sentence much haha) to my current vehcile, a built turbo
rx7 (no pistons) that spins to 9,000 rpm... i appreciate both applications,
and where each would be better suited... i agree wholeheartedly that offroad i
prefer a torquey off idle engine. the new generation of smaller turbo engines
however are being built to take ungodly amounts of boost and are easy/cheap to
upgrade.. letting them hang quite comfortably with naturally aspirated cars of
much greater displacement
>As for smoking a 5.0 Mustang, there are several levels of tune
> for that engine. Some of them wouldn't let the TSi get close
> enough to see if there is a rear license plate. With a twin
> turbo in the mucking fustang, it probably couldn't even get
> close enough to recognize it as a mustang.
>
>--
>My governor can kick your governor's ***
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
-Steve 98 TJ