First automatic
#21
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: First automatic
Fred.
You start off by saying you have a "GRAND CHEROKEE". Then in the body you
keep calling it a Cherokee! There's a big difference between my Cherokee
with it's ASIN/WARNER AW4 auto tranny and your Grand with it's Chrysler
tanny.
JoBo
"Fred Klingener" <gigabitbucket@brockeng.com> wrote in message
news:B8N9f.4497$Lv.1799@newssvr24.news.prodigy.net ...
> My new Grand Cherokee Limited >
> But the Cherokee in 4L undriveable. >
> Believe me. I understand the overlay of marketing hype, and I get the
> fact
> that the Cherokee isn't a real off-roader, talking up the zoomy
> drivetrain on
> the Cherokee, the guy came out, looked in the driver's side window and
> recoiled, "It's a GIRL'S Jeep!"). > Cheers,
> Fred Klingener
>
>
You start off by saying you have a "GRAND CHEROKEE". Then in the body you
keep calling it a Cherokee! There's a big difference between my Cherokee
with it's ASIN/WARNER AW4 auto tranny and your Grand with it's Chrysler
tanny.
JoBo
"Fred Klingener" <gigabitbucket@brockeng.com> wrote in message
news:B8N9f.4497$Lv.1799@newssvr24.news.prodigy.net ...
> My new Grand Cherokee Limited >
> But the Cherokee in 4L undriveable. >
> Believe me. I understand the overlay of marketing hype, and I get the
> fact
> that the Cherokee isn't a real off-roader, talking up the zoomy
> drivetrain on
> the Cherokee, the guy came out, looked in the driver's side window and
> recoiled, "It's a GIRL'S Jeep!"). > Cheers,
> Fred Klingener
>
>
#22
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: First automatic
Fred.
You start off by saying you have a "GRAND CHEROKEE". Then in the body you
keep calling it a Cherokee! There's a big difference between my Cherokee
with it's ASIN/WARNER AW4 auto tranny and your Grand with it's Chrysler
tanny.
JoBo
"Fred Klingener" <gigabitbucket@brockeng.com> wrote in message
news:B8N9f.4497$Lv.1799@newssvr24.news.prodigy.net ...
> My new Grand Cherokee Limited >
> But the Cherokee in 4L undriveable. >
> Believe me. I understand the overlay of marketing hype, and I get the
> fact
> that the Cherokee isn't a real off-roader, talking up the zoomy
> drivetrain on
> the Cherokee, the guy came out, looked in the driver's side window and
> recoiled, "It's a GIRL'S Jeep!"). > Cheers,
> Fred Klingener
>
>
You start off by saying you have a "GRAND CHEROKEE". Then in the body you
keep calling it a Cherokee! There's a big difference between my Cherokee
with it's ASIN/WARNER AW4 auto tranny and your Grand with it's Chrysler
tanny.
JoBo
"Fred Klingener" <gigabitbucket@brockeng.com> wrote in message
news:B8N9f.4497$Lv.1799@newssvr24.news.prodigy.net ...
> My new Grand Cherokee Limited >
> But the Cherokee in 4L undriveable. >
> Believe me. I understand the overlay of marketing hype, and I get the
> fact
> that the Cherokee isn't a real off-roader, talking up the zoomy
> drivetrain on
> the Cherokee, the guy came out, looked in the driver's side window and
> recoiled, "It's a GIRL'S Jeep!"). > Cheers,
> Fred Klingener
>
>
#23
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: First automatic
Fred Klingener did pass the time by typing:
> Any suggestions? I mean besides trading it in on a truck with sticks.
darn. there goes my contribution. :(
Actually, I've found that if you turn off the overdrive that helps in 4W low.
The other thing is that new transmissions need time to break in.
The ZJ when I first got it would rip your __ out in 4low but now
it just bumbles along. Being computer controlled, the dealership might
be able to adjust some of the shift points a bit to help.
--
-- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.***.net/wilsond
HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
Banks Header - and BEER, in the fridge!
> Any suggestions? I mean besides trading it in on a truck with sticks.
darn. there goes my contribution. :(
Actually, I've found that if you turn off the overdrive that helps in 4W low.
The other thing is that new transmissions need time to break in.
The ZJ when I first got it would rip your __ out in 4low but now
it just bumbles along. Being computer controlled, the dealership might
be able to adjust some of the shift points a bit to help.
--
-- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.***.net/wilsond
HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
Banks Header - and BEER, in the fridge!
#24
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: First automatic
Fred Klingener did pass the time by typing:
> Any suggestions? I mean besides trading it in on a truck with sticks.
darn. there goes my contribution. :(
Actually, I've found that if you turn off the overdrive that helps in 4W low.
The other thing is that new transmissions need time to break in.
The ZJ when I first got it would rip your __ out in 4low but now
it just bumbles along. Being computer controlled, the dealership might
be able to adjust some of the shift points a bit to help.
--
-- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.***.net/wilsond
HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
Banks Header - and BEER, in the fridge!
> Any suggestions? I mean besides trading it in on a truck with sticks.
darn. there goes my contribution. :(
Actually, I've found that if you turn off the overdrive that helps in 4W low.
The other thing is that new transmissions need time to break in.
The ZJ when I first got it would rip your __ out in 4low but now
it just bumbles along. Being computer controlled, the dealership might
be able to adjust some of the shift points a bit to help.
--
-- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.***.net/wilsond
HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
Banks Header - and BEER, in the fridge!
#25
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: First automatic
Fred Klingener did pass the time by typing:
> Any suggestions? I mean besides trading it in on a truck with sticks.
darn. there goes my contribution. :(
Actually, I've found that if you turn off the overdrive that helps in 4W low.
The other thing is that new transmissions need time to break in.
The ZJ when I first got it would rip your __ out in 4low but now
it just bumbles along. Being computer controlled, the dealership might
be able to adjust some of the shift points a bit to help.
--
-- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.***.net/wilsond
HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
Banks Header - and BEER, in the fridge!
> Any suggestions? I mean besides trading it in on a truck with sticks.
darn. there goes my contribution. :(
Actually, I've found that if you turn off the overdrive that helps in 4W low.
The other thing is that new transmissions need time to break in.
The ZJ when I first got it would rip your __ out in 4low but now
it just bumbles along. Being computer controlled, the dealership might
be able to adjust some of the shift points a bit to help.
--
-- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.***.net/wilsond
HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
Banks Header - and BEER, in the fridge!
#26
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: First automatic
There are many Real Americans that would like to buy a "New" as the
Original Poster called his or even a four year old XJ.
God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Jo Bo wrote:
>
> Fred.
>
> You start off by saying you have a "GRAND CHEROKEE". Then in the body you
> keep calling it a Cherokee! There's a big difference between my Cherokee
> with it's ASIN/WARNER AW4 auto tranny and your Grand with it's Chrysler
> tanny.
>
> JoBo
Original Poster called his or even a four year old XJ.
God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Jo Bo wrote:
>
> Fred.
>
> You start off by saying you have a "GRAND CHEROKEE". Then in the body you
> keep calling it a Cherokee! There's a big difference between my Cherokee
> with it's ASIN/WARNER AW4 auto tranny and your Grand with it's Chrysler
> tanny.
>
> JoBo
#27
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: First automatic
There are many Real Americans that would like to buy a "New" as the
Original Poster called his or even a four year old XJ.
God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Jo Bo wrote:
>
> Fred.
>
> You start off by saying you have a "GRAND CHEROKEE". Then in the body you
> keep calling it a Cherokee! There's a big difference between my Cherokee
> with it's ASIN/WARNER AW4 auto tranny and your Grand with it's Chrysler
> tanny.
>
> JoBo
Original Poster called his or even a four year old XJ.
God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Jo Bo wrote:
>
> Fred.
>
> You start off by saying you have a "GRAND CHEROKEE". Then in the body you
> keep calling it a Cherokee! There's a big difference between my Cherokee
> with it's ASIN/WARNER AW4 auto tranny and your Grand with it's Chrysler
> tanny.
>
> JoBo
#28
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: First automatic
There are many Real Americans that would like to buy a "New" as the
Original Poster called his or even a four year old XJ.
God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Jo Bo wrote:
>
> Fred.
>
> You start off by saying you have a "GRAND CHEROKEE". Then in the body you
> keep calling it a Cherokee! There's a big difference between my Cherokee
> with it's ASIN/WARNER AW4 auto tranny and your Grand with it's Chrysler
> tanny.
>
> JoBo
Original Poster called his or even a four year old XJ.
God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Jo Bo wrote:
>
> Fred.
>
> You start off by saying you have a "GRAND CHEROKEE". Then in the body you
> keep calling it a Cherokee! There's a big difference between my Cherokee
> with it's ASIN/WARNER AW4 auto tranny and your Grand with it's Chrysler
> tanny.
>
> JoBo
#29
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: First automatic
I am somewhat confused about his complaint.
If he is trying to shift into 4Lo at any engine speed above idle he should
certainly expect a sudden jolt and perhaps some grinding from the 4Lo
non-synchromeshed gears
When I was in Canada this summer in my WJ (with Select-Trac) I was in 4Hi
for the smoother parts and in 4Lo for the fun parts (please see Mike
Romain's excellent Labor Day pix) and do not recall any jerking other than
the initial shift into 4Lo but then I wasn't trying to set any speed records
either.
When the going was rough I was in 4Lo in 1st gear and when the roadway
smoothed for an extended bit I would slide the gear shifter to 2, 3, or
sometimes into Drive. The only 'unusual' effect was caused by the 2.71:1
reduction..... The acceleration/deceleration is proportionally greater and
should be expected because that is the result of torque multiplication ....
that is the reason you wanted to be in 4Lo in the first place.
I'm not sure how to comment on your shifter mishaps, perhaps you are just
not used to 'gateless" shifters. The shifter, in my WJ, operates in the
same manner as every automatic I have driven since the pushbutton and thumb
lever days.
That being said it is certainly different than the throws requires to change
gears in a manual transmission.
How fast are you trying to go in 4Lo?
Mike's Pix
http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=2120343242
--
Billy_Ray@SPAM.fuse.net (remove SPAM)
2002 Jeep WJ 4 Liter Automatic
Sharing is why we are all here....... or should be.
..
"KJ.Kate" <KJ.Kate@WhoseHotMail.com> wrote in message
news:PRR9f.28184$wG.21502@bignews4.bellsouth.net.. .
> Hey Fred,
> Loved your post, really. Well written, informative and entertaining.
> From one 'girls jeep' owner to another
> I wish I could hug ya....
>
> KJKate
> 2O|||||||O5 Liberty
>
> "Fred Klingener" <gigabitbucket@brockeng.com> wrote in message
> news:B8N9f.4497$Lv.1799@newssvr24.news.prodigy.net ...
> : My new Grand Cherokee Limited (the one with all the trick differentials)
> is
> : my first automatic, and I'm baffled by the shifting program (of the
> complete
> : lack of one) in 4L.
> :
> : I'm no off-road expert, but I've driven lots of trucks off road for work
> and
> : play. usually, once I get the technique and timing down for a given
> vehicle,
> : things go ok. I use 4L mostly to control speed, but also to finesse
> stream
> : crossings, rock fields, or slimy climbs - places where smoothness is
> : rewarded and jerky moves can make me have a bad day.
> :
> : But the Cherokee in 4L undriveable. Things are sort of ok as long as I
> stay
> : in one gear, but shifting down is like driving into a concrete wall (I
> was
> : even worried about tripping the airbags), and shifting up is like being
> : rammed from behind by a semi.
> :
> : I've tried mightily to match engine speed between the time I select a
> gear
> : and the time that the computer gets around to actually engaging the
> clutch,
> : but the driver has no control over the timing of the shift. It just
> happens
> : sometime after the gear lever is bumped. I haven't ever been able to do
> : anything but make things worse.
> :
> : Here's my complaint: the damn thing is run by a computer that knows
> exactly
> : how fast each wheel is turning, how fast the engine is turning. It knows
> : damn well what is going to happen when it bangs in the clutch, but it
> does
> : it anyway. I'm medium-certain that this vehicle has throttle-by-wire, so
> it
> : would be a simple programming exercise to match everything up before
> : engaging the clutch, and the whole thing could happen more smoothly than
> on
> : a manual operated by any but the most expert off-roader.
> :
> : But they evidently didn't even try.
> :
> : While I was on the road this summer, I talked to a lot of dealer service
> : guys about this. Their attack approach was amazingly uniform (I think
> DC
> : must send them all to some central campus to learn how to do it) - 1.)
> : Emasculation - "You don't know how to drive off road. Maybe you should
> : stick to pavement around the mall," 2.) Denial - "No, you don't know
> what
> : you're talking about. It doesn't do that," 3.) Obfuscation - "You're not
> : supposed to shift between 4H and 4L while you're driving," 4.) Guilt -
> : "You're abusing this fine vehicle. It's intended for driving on pavement
> : around the mall," 5.) They-All-Do-That - "They all do that," and finally
> 6.)
> : Get-Outa-Here-Kid-There're-People-In-Line-Behind-You - "You're supposed
> to
> : come to a complete stop before you change gears in 4L."
> :
> : So far, I've selected 7.) None-Of-The-Above, stayed in 4H, and relied on
> the
> : brakes with the ABS to control speed. So far, I've managed to stay out
> of
> : trouble.
> :
> : But I payed a shitload of money for this car, gulled, I suppose, by the
> : "Trail Rated" business, and I expected a functioning 4L.
> :
> : Believe me. I understand the overlay of marketing hype, and I get the
> fact
> : that the Cherokee isn't a real off-roader, with its leather, its
> : take-off-your-shoes-and-put-on-these-paper-slippers carpets, its
> "no-step"
> : door jambs, and its frilly plastic skirts. (I was buying some stuff in
> a
> : logging equipment store in northern BC, talking up the zoomy drivetrain
> on
> : the Cherokee, the guy came out, looked in the driver's side window and
> : recoiled, "It's a GIRL'S Jeep!"). I had expected (hoped?) that there
> would
> : be some moles in the organization that cared about the basics. Guess
> maybe
> : they all took early-out packages during the last reorganization.
> :
> : Any suggestions? I mean besides trading it in on a truck with sticks.
> :
> : Cheers,
> : Fred Klingener
> :
> :
>
>
If he is trying to shift into 4Lo at any engine speed above idle he should
certainly expect a sudden jolt and perhaps some grinding from the 4Lo
non-synchromeshed gears
When I was in Canada this summer in my WJ (with Select-Trac) I was in 4Hi
for the smoother parts and in 4Lo for the fun parts (please see Mike
Romain's excellent Labor Day pix) and do not recall any jerking other than
the initial shift into 4Lo but then I wasn't trying to set any speed records
either.
When the going was rough I was in 4Lo in 1st gear and when the roadway
smoothed for an extended bit I would slide the gear shifter to 2, 3, or
sometimes into Drive. The only 'unusual' effect was caused by the 2.71:1
reduction..... The acceleration/deceleration is proportionally greater and
should be expected because that is the result of torque multiplication ....
that is the reason you wanted to be in 4Lo in the first place.
I'm not sure how to comment on your shifter mishaps, perhaps you are just
not used to 'gateless" shifters. The shifter, in my WJ, operates in the
same manner as every automatic I have driven since the pushbutton and thumb
lever days.
That being said it is certainly different than the throws requires to change
gears in a manual transmission.
How fast are you trying to go in 4Lo?
Mike's Pix
http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=2120343242
--
Billy_Ray@SPAM.fuse.net (remove SPAM)
2002 Jeep WJ 4 Liter Automatic
Sharing is why we are all here....... or should be.
..
"KJ.Kate" <KJ.Kate@WhoseHotMail.com> wrote in message
news:PRR9f.28184$wG.21502@bignews4.bellsouth.net.. .
> Hey Fred,
> Loved your post, really. Well written, informative and entertaining.
> From one 'girls jeep' owner to another
> I wish I could hug ya....
>
> KJKate
> 2O|||||||O5 Liberty
>
> "Fred Klingener" <gigabitbucket@brockeng.com> wrote in message
> news:B8N9f.4497$Lv.1799@newssvr24.news.prodigy.net ...
> : My new Grand Cherokee Limited (the one with all the trick differentials)
> is
> : my first automatic, and I'm baffled by the shifting program (of the
> complete
> : lack of one) in 4L.
> :
> : I'm no off-road expert, but I've driven lots of trucks off road for work
> and
> : play. usually, once I get the technique and timing down for a given
> vehicle,
> : things go ok. I use 4L mostly to control speed, but also to finesse
> stream
> : crossings, rock fields, or slimy climbs - places where smoothness is
> : rewarded and jerky moves can make me have a bad day.
> :
> : But the Cherokee in 4L undriveable. Things are sort of ok as long as I
> stay
> : in one gear, but shifting down is like driving into a concrete wall (I
> was
> : even worried about tripping the airbags), and shifting up is like being
> : rammed from behind by a semi.
> :
> : I've tried mightily to match engine speed between the time I select a
> gear
> : and the time that the computer gets around to actually engaging the
> clutch,
> : but the driver has no control over the timing of the shift. It just
> happens
> : sometime after the gear lever is bumped. I haven't ever been able to do
> : anything but make things worse.
> :
> : Here's my complaint: the damn thing is run by a computer that knows
> exactly
> : how fast each wheel is turning, how fast the engine is turning. It knows
> : damn well what is going to happen when it bangs in the clutch, but it
> does
> : it anyway. I'm medium-certain that this vehicle has throttle-by-wire, so
> it
> : would be a simple programming exercise to match everything up before
> : engaging the clutch, and the whole thing could happen more smoothly than
> on
> : a manual operated by any but the most expert off-roader.
> :
> : But they evidently didn't even try.
> :
> : While I was on the road this summer, I talked to a lot of dealer service
> : guys about this. Their attack approach was amazingly uniform (I think
> DC
> : must send them all to some central campus to learn how to do it) - 1.)
> : Emasculation - "You don't know how to drive off road. Maybe you should
> : stick to pavement around the mall," 2.) Denial - "No, you don't know
> what
> : you're talking about. It doesn't do that," 3.) Obfuscation - "You're not
> : supposed to shift between 4H and 4L while you're driving," 4.) Guilt -
> : "You're abusing this fine vehicle. It's intended for driving on pavement
> : around the mall," 5.) They-All-Do-That - "They all do that," and finally
> 6.)
> : Get-Outa-Here-Kid-There're-People-In-Line-Behind-You - "You're supposed
> to
> : come to a complete stop before you change gears in 4L."
> :
> : So far, I've selected 7.) None-Of-The-Above, stayed in 4H, and relied on
> the
> : brakes with the ABS to control speed. So far, I've managed to stay out
> of
> : trouble.
> :
> : But I payed a shitload of money for this car, gulled, I suppose, by the
> : "Trail Rated" business, and I expected a functioning 4L.
> :
> : Believe me. I understand the overlay of marketing hype, and I get the
> fact
> : that the Cherokee isn't a real off-roader, with its leather, its
> : take-off-your-shoes-and-put-on-these-paper-slippers carpets, its
> "no-step"
> : door jambs, and its frilly plastic skirts. (I was buying some stuff in
> a
> : logging equipment store in northern BC, talking up the zoomy drivetrain
> on
> : the Cherokee, the guy came out, looked in the driver's side window and
> : recoiled, "It's a GIRL'S Jeep!"). I had expected (hoped?) that there
> would
> : be some moles in the organization that cared about the basics. Guess
> maybe
> : they all took early-out packages during the last reorganization.
> :
> : Any suggestions? I mean besides trading it in on a truck with sticks.
> :
> : Cheers,
> : Fred Klingener
> :
> :
>
>
#30
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: First automatic
I am somewhat confused about his complaint.
If he is trying to shift into 4Lo at any engine speed above idle he should
certainly expect a sudden jolt and perhaps some grinding from the 4Lo
non-synchromeshed gears
When I was in Canada this summer in my WJ (with Select-Trac) I was in 4Hi
for the smoother parts and in 4Lo for the fun parts (please see Mike
Romain's excellent Labor Day pix) and do not recall any jerking other than
the initial shift into 4Lo but then I wasn't trying to set any speed records
either.
When the going was rough I was in 4Lo in 1st gear and when the roadway
smoothed for an extended bit I would slide the gear shifter to 2, 3, or
sometimes into Drive. The only 'unusual' effect was caused by the 2.71:1
reduction..... The acceleration/deceleration is proportionally greater and
should be expected because that is the result of torque multiplication ....
that is the reason you wanted to be in 4Lo in the first place.
I'm not sure how to comment on your shifter mishaps, perhaps you are just
not used to 'gateless" shifters. The shifter, in my WJ, operates in the
same manner as every automatic I have driven since the pushbutton and thumb
lever days.
That being said it is certainly different than the throws requires to change
gears in a manual transmission.
How fast are you trying to go in 4Lo?
Mike's Pix
http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=2120343242
--
Billy_Ray@SPAM.fuse.net (remove SPAM)
2002 Jeep WJ 4 Liter Automatic
Sharing is why we are all here....... or should be.
..
"KJ.Kate" <KJ.Kate@WhoseHotMail.com> wrote in message
news:PRR9f.28184$wG.21502@bignews4.bellsouth.net.. .
> Hey Fred,
> Loved your post, really. Well written, informative and entertaining.
> From one 'girls jeep' owner to another
> I wish I could hug ya....
>
> KJKate
> 2O|||||||O5 Liberty
>
> "Fred Klingener" <gigabitbucket@brockeng.com> wrote in message
> news:B8N9f.4497$Lv.1799@newssvr24.news.prodigy.net ...
> : My new Grand Cherokee Limited (the one with all the trick differentials)
> is
> : my first automatic, and I'm baffled by the shifting program (of the
> complete
> : lack of one) in 4L.
> :
> : I'm no off-road expert, but I've driven lots of trucks off road for work
> and
> : play. usually, once I get the technique and timing down for a given
> vehicle,
> : things go ok. I use 4L mostly to control speed, but also to finesse
> stream
> : crossings, rock fields, or slimy climbs - places where smoothness is
> : rewarded and jerky moves can make me have a bad day.
> :
> : But the Cherokee in 4L undriveable. Things are sort of ok as long as I
> stay
> : in one gear, but shifting down is like driving into a concrete wall (I
> was
> : even worried about tripping the airbags), and shifting up is like being
> : rammed from behind by a semi.
> :
> : I've tried mightily to match engine speed between the time I select a
> gear
> : and the time that the computer gets around to actually engaging the
> clutch,
> : but the driver has no control over the timing of the shift. It just
> happens
> : sometime after the gear lever is bumped. I haven't ever been able to do
> : anything but make things worse.
> :
> : Here's my complaint: the damn thing is run by a computer that knows
> exactly
> : how fast each wheel is turning, how fast the engine is turning. It knows
> : damn well what is going to happen when it bangs in the clutch, but it
> does
> : it anyway. I'm medium-certain that this vehicle has throttle-by-wire, so
> it
> : would be a simple programming exercise to match everything up before
> : engaging the clutch, and the whole thing could happen more smoothly than
> on
> : a manual operated by any but the most expert off-roader.
> :
> : But they evidently didn't even try.
> :
> : While I was on the road this summer, I talked to a lot of dealer service
> : guys about this. Their attack approach was amazingly uniform (I think
> DC
> : must send them all to some central campus to learn how to do it) - 1.)
> : Emasculation - "You don't know how to drive off road. Maybe you should
> : stick to pavement around the mall," 2.) Denial - "No, you don't know
> what
> : you're talking about. It doesn't do that," 3.) Obfuscation - "You're not
> : supposed to shift between 4H and 4L while you're driving," 4.) Guilt -
> : "You're abusing this fine vehicle. It's intended for driving on pavement
> : around the mall," 5.) They-All-Do-That - "They all do that," and finally
> 6.)
> : Get-Outa-Here-Kid-There're-People-In-Line-Behind-You - "You're supposed
> to
> : come to a complete stop before you change gears in 4L."
> :
> : So far, I've selected 7.) None-Of-The-Above, stayed in 4H, and relied on
> the
> : brakes with the ABS to control speed. So far, I've managed to stay out
> of
> : trouble.
> :
> : But I payed a shitload of money for this car, gulled, I suppose, by the
> : "Trail Rated" business, and I expected a functioning 4L.
> :
> : Believe me. I understand the overlay of marketing hype, and I get the
> fact
> : that the Cherokee isn't a real off-roader, with its leather, its
> : take-off-your-shoes-and-put-on-these-paper-slippers carpets, its
> "no-step"
> : door jambs, and its frilly plastic skirts. (I was buying some stuff in
> a
> : logging equipment store in northern BC, talking up the zoomy drivetrain
> on
> : the Cherokee, the guy came out, looked in the driver's side window and
> : recoiled, "It's a GIRL'S Jeep!"). I had expected (hoped?) that there
> would
> : be some moles in the organization that cared about the basics. Guess
> maybe
> : they all took early-out packages during the last reorganization.
> :
> : Any suggestions? I mean besides trading it in on a truck with sticks.
> :
> : Cheers,
> : Fred Klingener
> :
> :
>
>
If he is trying to shift into 4Lo at any engine speed above idle he should
certainly expect a sudden jolt and perhaps some grinding from the 4Lo
non-synchromeshed gears
When I was in Canada this summer in my WJ (with Select-Trac) I was in 4Hi
for the smoother parts and in 4Lo for the fun parts (please see Mike
Romain's excellent Labor Day pix) and do not recall any jerking other than
the initial shift into 4Lo but then I wasn't trying to set any speed records
either.
When the going was rough I was in 4Lo in 1st gear and when the roadway
smoothed for an extended bit I would slide the gear shifter to 2, 3, or
sometimes into Drive. The only 'unusual' effect was caused by the 2.71:1
reduction..... The acceleration/deceleration is proportionally greater and
should be expected because that is the result of torque multiplication ....
that is the reason you wanted to be in 4Lo in the first place.
I'm not sure how to comment on your shifter mishaps, perhaps you are just
not used to 'gateless" shifters. The shifter, in my WJ, operates in the
same manner as every automatic I have driven since the pushbutton and thumb
lever days.
That being said it is certainly different than the throws requires to change
gears in a manual transmission.
How fast are you trying to go in 4Lo?
Mike's Pix
http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=2120343242
--
Billy_Ray@SPAM.fuse.net (remove SPAM)
2002 Jeep WJ 4 Liter Automatic
Sharing is why we are all here....... or should be.
..
"KJ.Kate" <KJ.Kate@WhoseHotMail.com> wrote in message
news:PRR9f.28184$wG.21502@bignews4.bellsouth.net.. .
> Hey Fred,
> Loved your post, really. Well written, informative and entertaining.
> From one 'girls jeep' owner to another
> I wish I could hug ya....
>
> KJKate
> 2O|||||||O5 Liberty
>
> "Fred Klingener" <gigabitbucket@brockeng.com> wrote in message
> news:B8N9f.4497$Lv.1799@newssvr24.news.prodigy.net ...
> : My new Grand Cherokee Limited (the one with all the trick differentials)
> is
> : my first automatic, and I'm baffled by the shifting program (of the
> complete
> : lack of one) in 4L.
> :
> : I'm no off-road expert, but I've driven lots of trucks off road for work
> and
> : play. usually, once I get the technique and timing down for a given
> vehicle,
> : things go ok. I use 4L mostly to control speed, but also to finesse
> stream
> : crossings, rock fields, or slimy climbs - places where smoothness is
> : rewarded and jerky moves can make me have a bad day.
> :
> : But the Cherokee in 4L undriveable. Things are sort of ok as long as I
> stay
> : in one gear, but shifting down is like driving into a concrete wall (I
> was
> : even worried about tripping the airbags), and shifting up is like being
> : rammed from behind by a semi.
> :
> : I've tried mightily to match engine speed between the time I select a
> gear
> : and the time that the computer gets around to actually engaging the
> clutch,
> : but the driver has no control over the timing of the shift. It just
> happens
> : sometime after the gear lever is bumped. I haven't ever been able to do
> : anything but make things worse.
> :
> : Here's my complaint: the damn thing is run by a computer that knows
> exactly
> : how fast each wheel is turning, how fast the engine is turning. It knows
> : damn well what is going to happen when it bangs in the clutch, but it
> does
> : it anyway. I'm medium-certain that this vehicle has throttle-by-wire, so
> it
> : would be a simple programming exercise to match everything up before
> : engaging the clutch, and the whole thing could happen more smoothly than
> on
> : a manual operated by any but the most expert off-roader.
> :
> : But they evidently didn't even try.
> :
> : While I was on the road this summer, I talked to a lot of dealer service
> : guys about this. Their attack approach was amazingly uniform (I think
> DC
> : must send them all to some central campus to learn how to do it) - 1.)
> : Emasculation - "You don't know how to drive off road. Maybe you should
> : stick to pavement around the mall," 2.) Denial - "No, you don't know
> what
> : you're talking about. It doesn't do that," 3.) Obfuscation - "You're not
> : supposed to shift between 4H and 4L while you're driving," 4.) Guilt -
> : "You're abusing this fine vehicle. It's intended for driving on pavement
> : around the mall," 5.) They-All-Do-That - "They all do that," and finally
> 6.)
> : Get-Outa-Here-Kid-There're-People-In-Line-Behind-You - "You're supposed
> to
> : come to a complete stop before you change gears in 4L."
> :
> : So far, I've selected 7.) None-Of-The-Above, stayed in 4H, and relied on
> the
> : brakes with the ABS to control speed. So far, I've managed to stay out
> of
> : trouble.
> :
> : But I payed a shitload of money for this car, gulled, I suppose, by the
> : "Trail Rated" business, and I expected a functioning 4L.
> :
> : Believe me. I understand the overlay of marketing hype, and I get the
> fact
> : that the Cherokee isn't a real off-roader, with its leather, its
> : take-off-your-shoes-and-put-on-these-paper-slippers carpets, its
> "no-step"
> : door jambs, and its frilly plastic skirts. (I was buying some stuff in
> a
> : logging equipment store in northern BC, talking up the zoomy drivetrain
> on
> : the Cherokee, the guy came out, looked in the driver's side window and
> : recoiled, "It's a GIRL'S Jeep!"). I had expected (hoped?) that there
> would
> : be some moles in the organization that cared about the basics. Guess
> maybe
> : they all took early-out packages during the last reorganization.
> :
> : Any suggestions? I mean besides trading it in on a truck with sticks.
> :
> : Cheers,
> : Fred Klingener
> :
> :
>
>