J J

Robert penned:

>>
> Kenneth, with all due respect, you are an idiot.


Kenneth relax you are not an idiot. You just could not afford the H2 Hummer
and air fair to Greenland.

Keep saving the money from your paper route and someday......


--
jj w/ a yj

TJim

WOW! Look at the front and rear axle clearance on the Wrangler! 70.9"
front and 68.4" rear!!! Those must be some big-a$$ tires they're putting on
it these days! :-P

"L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
news:3F3D4871.C1FE620D@***.net...
> Hi Jeff,
> A side by side dimension comparison chart at:
> http://www.----------.com/jeepDimensions.jpg I think we can say it has
> smaller, but more pig like as compared to the sleeker Cherokee.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:--------------------
>
> Jeff Strickland wrote:
> >
> > I said the Libby was smaller than the Cherokee, and somebody said that I
was
> > wrong. I don't really know how big they are, but they LOOK smaller than
the
> > XJ by a significant margin. And, you are completely right, the XJ offers
> > capability and features that are not available on the KJ.

TJim

Does the north pole qualify as the suburbs?

"Joe" <jo_ratner@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:_Tf%a.23466$vo2.4160@newsread1.news.atl.earth link.net...
> H2=Suburban
>
> "J J" <jj@footballmail.com> wrote in message
> news:JJf%a.4840$Nf3.3806@newsread4.news.pas.earthl ink.net...
> > Robert penned:
> >
> > >>
> > > Kenneth, with all due respect, you are an idiot.
> >
> >
> > Kenneth relax you are not an idiot. You just could not afford the H2
> Hummer
> > and air fair to Greenland.
> >
> > Keep saving the money from your paper route and someday......
> >
> >
> > --
> > jj w/ a yj
> >
> >
>
>

MJ w/ 2 TJ's

Ken
I understand your anxiety, however, when i bought my first jeep at a
dealership, i made sure i knew more than the salesperson (not very tough in
some cases)...meaning, i researched my @ss off to make sure i knew what i
was getting...with that sort of investment, there is no way in hell that i
am going to listen to what a salesperson has to say. their job at that
point is to get me the best price for me. if you truly did your research,
read this group and read reviews, you certainly wouldn't be in this
situation. so shame on you.

secondly, i have never been to MOAB, however, from everything i have read in
magazines, internet and this NG, i would be nervous taking my Rube out
there, simply because as an off-roader, i am smart enough not to bite off
more than i can chew, especially with out an experienced driver/guide with
me. i have been in 4x4's for 20 years. again, shame on you.

finally, mopar parts do not make a jeep off road worthy. (at least not for
MOAB from what i read). did they have skid plates? that would have been a
nice investment from what i hear.

ken, we all make are mistakes, however, i don't think it is fair to
broadbrush a great line of vehicles because of some poor choices on your
part. i think you were truly naive in this purchase and your mindset. cool
down, go on a trailride with some off-roaders, and then make your judgement.
good luck, and hope you find what your looking for.

IMHO

--
MJ w/ 2 TJ's (Rube and Trevor James, yes he was named after a TJ)
2003 Rubicon 4" Teraflex Long Arm Kit 33x12.50 Goodyear MTR's Warn
XD9000i
'86 CJ 7 Chev 350, 350 Turbo Tran, Dana 44's 33x12.50 Goodyear MTR
www.tazjeep.com



"Kenneth Garman" <kenny_g@ev1.net> wrote in message
news:c7ff7456.0308150407.6e640d8e@posting.google.c om...
> jmeyer21@aol.com (Jim Meyer) wrote:
>
> > Per an posting you sent earlier this month, you have an older Jeep.
> >
> > Now you bought a new Liberty and took it Moab? It doesn't smell
right...
> >
>
> So what? I don't see what a broken down 30 year old AMC-built beater
> has to do with the situation on the new Liberty. Is there some secret
> rule here that you're only allowed to own one vehicle at a time?
>
> I also don't understand why there is so much hostility and negative
> resposne to me here. What, are you all investors in the stock of
> Third Reich motors, err, I mean, Daimler Chrysler Corporation?
>
> Maybe it is "obvious" to you blue collar people who have been raised
> as grease monkeys and could build your own jeep from some spare wiring
> and raw sheet metal, but the vast majority of the public buys a car
> for a specific purpose as advertised by the manufacturer, and can't
> change their own oil or flat tire, much less re-engineer the
> automobile to determine if it's appropriate for a particular use
> contrary to the manufacturer's statements. If I bought a truck, I
> would expect it to have a cargo bed. If I bought an economy coupe, I
> would expect it to get good gas mileage. When I bought a jeep, I
> expected it to be able to go off road.
>
> Much has been made by the brainwashed Chrysler slaves here of how the
> Liberty is so much worse than the other jeep lines. Well even if
> that's true, how is the typical consumer supposed to know that? Yes,
> I know that all true jeep geniuses such as you people are born with
> the knowledge already programmed into their infant brains, but what
> about the rest of us mortals? The Liberty is proclaimed in all
> Chrylser publications as merely another member of the jeep line. All
> the commercials show it right along with hte Grand Cherokee and
> Wrangler, each climbing happily over rocks together. They even say
> in their literature that all JEep vehicles - Liberty included - are
> Rubicon capable. NOWHERE is it EVER pointed out that one jeep vehicle
> might be less capable than others.

jfc

I think you are right.Chrysler does bull the capabilities of the
liberty,as does all other manufacturers of their suv models.We live in a
buyer beware marketplace though. The fact is 95% of the suv's are never
taken any farther of road than the grass at the park.Many people just want
the 4x4 "I am capable of going where I want even if it's only on the
pavement " look. That is where the money is and thats what marketing is
going to go after.The salesman was correct in saying it was never designed
for what you tried.Unfortunately , you wanted to really go for it.I don't
think there are too many factory vehicles that can handle tough trails.The
market is too small.A bit of research and talking to off roaders would have
saved you a lot of trouble and money. Jeeps ( excluding the liberty) are
good capable vehicles. I just hope that Daimler/Chrysler doesn't ruin a good
line by doing things like making Libertys.Look for used wrangler ( research
it well ! ) start out on some mild trails and work your way up.You just may
change your mind.Remember you can tell a car salesman is lying if his lips
are moving.



"MJ w/ 2 TJ's" <tazgpXXX@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:eep%a.93496$o27.2134443@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> Ken
> I understand your anxiety, however, when i bought my first jeep at a
> dealership, i made sure i knew more than the salesperson (not very tough
in
> some cases)...meaning, i researched my @ss off to make sure i knew what i
> was getting...with that sort of investment, there is no way in hell that i
> am going to listen to what a salesperson has to say. their job at that
> point is to get me the best price for me. if you truly did your research,
> read this group and read reviews, you certainly wouldn't be in this
> situation. so shame on you.
>
> secondly, i have never been to MOAB, however, from everything i have read
in
> magazines, internet and this NG, i would be nervous taking my Rube out
> there, simply because as an off-roader, i am smart enough not to bite off
> more than i can chew, especially with out an experienced driver/guide with
> me. i have been in 4x4's for 20 years. again, shame on you.
>
> finally, mopar parts do not make a jeep off road worthy. (at least not
for
> MOAB from what i read). did they have skid plates? that would have been
a
> nice investment from what i hear.
>
> ken, we all make are mistakes, however, i don't think it is fair to
> broadbrush a great line of vehicles because of some poor choices on your
> part. i think you were truly naive in this purchase and your mindset.
cool
> down, go on a trailride with some off-roaders, and then make your
judgement.
> good luck, and hope you find what your looking for.
>
> IMHO
>
> --
> MJ w/ 2 TJ's (Rube and Trevor James, yes he was named after a TJ)
> 2003 Rubicon 4" Teraflex Long Arm Kit 33x12.50 Goodyear MTR's Warn
> XD9000i
> '86 CJ 7 Chev 350, 350 Turbo Tran, Dana 44's 33x12.50 Goodyear MTR
> www.tazjeep.com
>
>
>
> "Kenneth Garman" <kenny_g@ev1.net> wrote in message
> news:c7ff7456.0308150407.6e640d8e@posting.google.c om...
> > jmeyer21@aol.com (Jim Meyer) wrote:
> >
> > > Per an posting you sent earlier this month, you have an older Jeep.
> > >
> > > Now you bought a new Liberty and took it Moab? It doesn't smell
> right...
> > >
> >
> > So what? I don't see what a broken down 30 year old AMC-built beater
> > has to do with the situation on the new Liberty. Is there some secret
> > rule here that you're only allowed to own one vehicle at a time?
> >
> > I also don't understand why there is so much hostility and negative
> > resposne to me here. What, are you all investors in the stock of
> > Third Reich motors, err, I mean, Daimler Chrysler Corporation?
> >
> > Maybe it is "obvious" to you blue collar people who have been raised
> > as grease monkeys and could build your own jeep from some spare wiring
> > and raw sheet metal, but the vast majority of the public buys a car
> > for a specific purpose as advertised by the manufacturer, and can't
> > change their own oil or flat tire, much less re-engineer the
> > automobile to determine if it's appropriate for a particular use
> > contrary to the manufacturer's statements. If I bought a truck, I
> > would expect it to have a cargo bed. If I bought an economy coupe, I
> > would expect it to get good gas mileage. When I bought a jeep, I
> > expected it to be able to go off road.
> >
> > Much has been made by the brainwashed Chrysler slaves here of how the
> > Liberty is so much worse than the other jeep lines. Well even if
> > that's true, how is the typical consumer supposed to know that? Yes,
> > I know that all true jeep geniuses such as you people are born with
> > the knowledge already programmed into their infant brains, but what
> > about the rest of us mortals? The Liberty is proclaimed in all
> > Chrylser publications as merely another member of the jeep line. All
> > the commercials show it right along with hte Grand Cherokee and
> > Wrangler, each climbing happily over rocks together. They even say
> > in their literature that all JEep vehicles - Liberty included - are
> > Rubicon capable. NOWHERE is it EVER pointed out that one jeep vehicle
> > might be less capable than others.
>
>

L.W.(=?iso-8859-1?Q?=DFill?=) Hughes III

Sorry, I was thinking of my Jeep.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/

TJim wrote:
>
> WOW! Look at the front and rear axle clearance on the Wrangler! 70.9"
> front and 68.4" rear!!! Those must be some big-a$$ tires they're putting on
> it these days! :-P

Grumman581

"TJim" wrote ...
> Does the north pole qualify as the suburbs?

Yeah, it's in the northern suburbs of Houston... Just a little past the
little community of Dallas...

Grumman581

"Joe" wrote ...
> H2=Suburban

Tahoe, actually... The Suburban is a little longer... The Tahoe was designed
for those people who just don't quite have a garage long enough for a
Suburban... Or for those people who want to park their vehicle in the garage
and be able to walk around it without opening the garage door...

Or possibly for those people so spatially challenged that they cannot park a
Suburban... Kind of a trainer vehicle, I guess... Of course, the Suburban is
just a trainer vehicle for driving a school bus...

Desert YJ

The fact that he compares a Jeep to a "car" is telling. What a moron.


"Kenneth Garman" <kenny_g@ev1.net> wrote in message
news:c7ff7456.0308131028.64077c00@posting.google.c om...
> I realize the title of this message is somewhat inflammatory, and no
> offense is intended to those few of you who have built a worthwhile
> jeep out of aftermarket parts or your own ingenuity. But the vehicles
> as they are being offered for sale by Chrysler corporation are
> absolutely worthless off-road.
>
> About 4 months ago I took delivery of my new Jeep Liberty. The main
> reason I bought a jeep instead of some other kind of car was because
> of the tough off-road features touted in Jeep commercials.

Desert YJ

Course it doesn't. They assume that the buyer knows what he wants. You
bought a soccer-mom vehicle.


"Kenneth Garman" <kenny_g@ev1.net> wrote in message
news:c7ff7456.0308132056.67c8579d@posting.google.c om...
> "Snow" <snowball_2004@msn.com> wrote in message
news:<F%v_a.8702$VG.271644@news20.bellglobal.com>. ..
> > > About 4 months ago I took delivery of my new Jeep Liberty.
> >
> > This was your first problem.. you bought a car based suvee thing.. not a
> > J**P...
> >
>
> Oh, that's just wonderful. Thank you so much for that insight. Can you
> please refer me to where in the Chrysler catalog it points out that
> the Liberty is any less capable than the rest of the jeep product
> line?