Snow-crawl on steep incline--LONG
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Snow-crawl on steep incline--LONG
Jeff Strickland wrote:
>
> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:41E45C92.41B8A9A1@sympatico.ca...
> > You 'desert rats' have no idea what it is like to have absolutely 'no'
> > control at all no matter what you do. LOL!
> >
>
> That's entirely true ;-). We only think we know what slippery means because
> we drive on hardpack with a thin layer of sand that acts like BBs under the
> tires.
>
> > It is a really spooky feeling just sitting there and the damn vehicle is
> > going to do what 'it' wants to, no matter how hard you curse at it or
> > hit pedals!
> >
> > All you can do is lock it up to attempt to stop or aim it right to the
> > 'correct' ditch and hope it isn't too deep a ditch or too long a walk
> > out....
> >
> > We were in those conditions over New Years.....
> >
> That is also true, but when you are trying to get everything locked up and
> battoned down, mashing the clutch pedal seems to be contrary to the affect
> one is trying to achieve.
>
> I once observed a newbie in a CJ7 depress the clutch on a decent - a long
> decent - and use the brakes to keep thinigs under contol. As we watched
> things go from bad to worse, he finally let the clutch out suddenly. It
> couldn't take it and literally exploded. At least the guy had the mechanical
> understanding to be able to shift with out his clutch, and he was able to
> get home once we got him back to the highway. My ONLY point was that the
> engine is your friend, and you want it connected to the tires pretty much
> all of the time.
I agree 100%. Doing a decent in snow or dirt needs the engine and 4x4
to have the best control.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>
> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:41E45C92.41B8A9A1@sympatico.ca...
> > You 'desert rats' have no idea what it is like to have absolutely 'no'
> > control at all no matter what you do. LOL!
> >
>
> That's entirely true ;-). We only think we know what slippery means because
> we drive on hardpack with a thin layer of sand that acts like BBs under the
> tires.
>
> > It is a really spooky feeling just sitting there and the damn vehicle is
> > going to do what 'it' wants to, no matter how hard you curse at it or
> > hit pedals!
> >
> > All you can do is lock it up to attempt to stop or aim it right to the
> > 'correct' ditch and hope it isn't too deep a ditch or too long a walk
> > out....
> >
> > We were in those conditions over New Years.....
> >
> That is also true, but when you are trying to get everything locked up and
> battoned down, mashing the clutch pedal seems to be contrary to the affect
> one is trying to achieve.
>
> I once observed a newbie in a CJ7 depress the clutch on a decent - a long
> decent - and use the brakes to keep thinigs under contol. As we watched
> things go from bad to worse, he finally let the clutch out suddenly. It
> couldn't take it and literally exploded. At least the guy had the mechanical
> understanding to be able to shift with out his clutch, and he was able to
> get home once we got him back to the highway. My ONLY point was that the
> engine is your friend, and you want it connected to the tires pretty much
> all of the time.
I agree 100%. Doing a decent in snow or dirt needs the engine and 4x4
to have the best control.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Snow-crawl on steep incline--LONG
Jeff Strickland wrote:
>
> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:41E45C92.41B8A9A1@sympatico.ca...
> > You 'desert rats' have no idea what it is like to have absolutely 'no'
> > control at all no matter what you do. LOL!
> >
>
> That's entirely true ;-). We only think we know what slippery means because
> we drive on hardpack with a thin layer of sand that acts like BBs under the
> tires.
>
> > It is a really spooky feeling just sitting there and the damn vehicle is
> > going to do what 'it' wants to, no matter how hard you curse at it or
> > hit pedals!
> >
> > All you can do is lock it up to attempt to stop or aim it right to the
> > 'correct' ditch and hope it isn't too deep a ditch or too long a walk
> > out....
> >
> > We were in those conditions over New Years.....
> >
> That is also true, but when you are trying to get everything locked up and
> battoned down, mashing the clutch pedal seems to be contrary to the affect
> one is trying to achieve.
>
> I once observed a newbie in a CJ7 depress the clutch on a decent - a long
> decent - and use the brakes to keep thinigs under contol. As we watched
> things go from bad to worse, he finally let the clutch out suddenly. It
> couldn't take it and literally exploded. At least the guy had the mechanical
> understanding to be able to shift with out his clutch, and he was able to
> get home once we got him back to the highway. My ONLY point was that the
> engine is your friend, and you want it connected to the tires pretty much
> all of the time.
I agree 100%. Doing a decent in snow or dirt needs the engine and 4x4
to have the best control.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>
> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:41E45C92.41B8A9A1@sympatico.ca...
> > You 'desert rats' have no idea what it is like to have absolutely 'no'
> > control at all no matter what you do. LOL!
> >
>
> That's entirely true ;-). We only think we know what slippery means because
> we drive on hardpack with a thin layer of sand that acts like BBs under the
> tires.
>
> > It is a really spooky feeling just sitting there and the damn vehicle is
> > going to do what 'it' wants to, no matter how hard you curse at it or
> > hit pedals!
> >
> > All you can do is lock it up to attempt to stop or aim it right to the
> > 'correct' ditch and hope it isn't too deep a ditch or too long a walk
> > out....
> >
> > We were in those conditions over New Years.....
> >
> That is also true, but when you are trying to get everything locked up and
> battoned down, mashing the clutch pedal seems to be contrary to the affect
> one is trying to achieve.
>
> I once observed a newbie in a CJ7 depress the clutch on a decent - a long
> decent - and use the brakes to keep thinigs under contol. As we watched
> things go from bad to worse, he finally let the clutch out suddenly. It
> couldn't take it and literally exploded. At least the guy had the mechanical
> understanding to be able to shift with out his clutch, and he was able to
> get home once we got him back to the highway. My ONLY point was that the
> engine is your friend, and you want it connected to the tires pretty much
> all of the time.
I agree 100%. Doing a decent in snow or dirt needs the engine and 4x4
to have the best control.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Snow-crawl on steep incline--LONG
Jeff Strickland wrote:
>
> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:41E45C92.41B8A9A1@sympatico.ca...
> > You 'desert rats' have no idea what it is like to have absolutely 'no'
> > control at all no matter what you do. LOL!
> >
>
> That's entirely true ;-). We only think we know what slippery means because
> we drive on hardpack with a thin layer of sand that acts like BBs under the
> tires.
>
> > It is a really spooky feeling just sitting there and the damn vehicle is
> > going to do what 'it' wants to, no matter how hard you curse at it or
> > hit pedals!
> >
> > All you can do is lock it up to attempt to stop or aim it right to the
> > 'correct' ditch and hope it isn't too deep a ditch or too long a walk
> > out....
> >
> > We were in those conditions over New Years.....
> >
> That is also true, but when you are trying to get everything locked up and
> battoned down, mashing the clutch pedal seems to be contrary to the affect
> one is trying to achieve.
>
> I once observed a newbie in a CJ7 depress the clutch on a decent - a long
> decent - and use the brakes to keep thinigs under contol. As we watched
> things go from bad to worse, he finally let the clutch out suddenly. It
> couldn't take it and literally exploded. At least the guy had the mechanical
> understanding to be able to shift with out his clutch, and he was able to
> get home once we got him back to the highway. My ONLY point was that the
> engine is your friend, and you want it connected to the tires pretty much
> all of the time.
I agree 100%. Doing a decent in snow or dirt needs the engine and 4x4
to have the best control.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>
> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:41E45C92.41B8A9A1@sympatico.ca...
> > You 'desert rats' have no idea what it is like to have absolutely 'no'
> > control at all no matter what you do. LOL!
> >
>
> That's entirely true ;-). We only think we know what slippery means because
> we drive on hardpack with a thin layer of sand that acts like BBs under the
> tires.
>
> > It is a really spooky feeling just sitting there and the damn vehicle is
> > going to do what 'it' wants to, no matter how hard you curse at it or
> > hit pedals!
> >
> > All you can do is lock it up to attempt to stop or aim it right to the
> > 'correct' ditch and hope it isn't too deep a ditch or too long a walk
> > out....
> >
> > We were in those conditions over New Years.....
> >
> That is also true, but when you are trying to get everything locked up and
> battoned down, mashing the clutch pedal seems to be contrary to the affect
> one is trying to achieve.
>
> I once observed a newbie in a CJ7 depress the clutch on a decent - a long
> decent - and use the brakes to keep thinigs under contol. As we watched
> things go from bad to worse, he finally let the clutch out suddenly. It
> couldn't take it and literally exploded. At least the guy had the mechanical
> understanding to be able to shift with out his clutch, and he was able to
> get home once we got him back to the highway. My ONLY point was that the
> engine is your friend, and you want it connected to the tires pretty much
> all of the time.
I agree 100%. Doing a decent in snow or dirt needs the engine and 4x4
to have the best control.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Snow-crawl on steep incline--LONG
Well you found the 'only' example where I will agree with you. Most
folks have matching diffs though and 'none' have brakes that split
50/50.
They started putting combination valve into Jeeps in the 70's to prevent
rear wheel lock up, so your brake setup is only valid for old beasts and
is extremely dangerous for normal driving because the rear wheels will
lock up causing you to do instant 360's. They even put a weight switch
in the Comanche to prevent rear wheel lock when unloaded.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Rich Hampel wrote:
>
> Absolutely NOT.
> Once you *start to slide/slip* on ice or snow with the vehicle in 4WD
> the different speeds of the front and rear axels will prevent at least
> two wheels from gaining traction/adhesion. For example a 411 rear
> differential will be matched with a 410 front differential .... one is
> either pulling or dragging the other, front and rear ARE running at
> 'different speeds'. The difference in wheel rpm is small, but is still
> different.; Its probably the reason that a 4WD once it starts to
> slide/slip (on ice or hardpack) is much harder to recover than a 2WD.
> No problem when there is traction and idling down in 4WD; but, when
> there isnt sufficient traction, feathering the brakes in neutral will
> usually allow faster recovery ... but like I stated the brakes had
> better be applying the same torque to all wheels.
> ;-)
>
> In article <10u8at9scehn724@corp.supernews.com>, Jeff Strickland
> <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > "Rich Hampel" <RhmpL33@nospam.net> wrote in message
> > news:110120051251586525%RhmpL33@nospam.net...
> > > An alternative is to put it in neutral and feather the brakes. ....
> > > this requires that the brakes are well set-up and 'equal' front to
> > > rear.
> > > Works well on solid 'black' ice as well as hardpack snow.
> > >
> > > If the tires are dry you can spray on a rosin based belt dressing onto
> > > the tread for additional 'traction' on hardpack or ice. Better is to
> > > use cable chains on the rear and 'feather' the hand brake to keep the
> > > rear end where it belongs. For super slippery conditions, increased
> > > tire pressure than normal seems best.
> > >
> > > Too bad they dont allow studded tires anymore. They do but you can
> > > only run them (in PA) when its icy or snow-covered ..... not worth the
> > > bother.
> > >
> > > Am a ski-patroller.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > Selecting the lowest possible gear and idling is the best possible condition
> > for directional stability and control, especially going backwards.
> > Feathering the brakes in this condition is advised, UNLESS this results in
> > locking the brakes and stopping the tire rotation. Bear in mind, I am
> > speaking of the situation where the vehicle has been stopped, and proceeding
> > down a hill is the desired action. Driving along at 40 and having an
> > emergency develop in front of you is entirely another matter, but in that
> > condition it is a very poor plan to depress the clutch pedal.
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > In article <10u82ih2oishk57@corp.supernews.com>, Jeff Strickland
> > > <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > >
> > >> "Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message
> > >> news:9-KdnWdDfOIgQn_cRVn-tw@comcast.com...
> > >> > >
> > >> >> This was your first mistake. Thankfully, it wasn't your last.
> > >> >>
> > >> >> WHAT YOU SHOULD HAVE DONE
> > >> >> Assuming you were insistant on climbing the hill ...
> > >> >
> > >> > Ever driven up a hill covered with wet, packed snow, Jeff? I was riding
> > >> > a
> > >> > trail recently on such conditions with about 7 jeeps ahead of me. Once
> > >> > I
> > >> > got
> > >> > to the hill, the snow had packed considerably and was fairly slick, but
> > >> > not
> > >> > terribly steep, I had enough traction to inch up the hill. But when I
> > >> > had
> > >> > to
> > >> > stop just shy of the top, I could feel myself slowly inching down, even
> > >> > with
> > >> > my foot on the brake. (And no, Bill or Mike, the ABS was not
> > >> > activating.)
> > >> > It
> > >> > was sliding just about half a foot per second, so I had enough time to
> > >> > radio
> > >> > to the fellow behind me to get out of the way. I couldn't get enough
> > >> > traction to get back up at that point, so my only choice was to slide
> > >> > all
> > >> > the way back down and have another go. Spinning the wheels just makes a
> > >> > situation like that worse...the tires melt a layer of snow and so now
> > >> > you
> > >> > have a water-slicked layer of snow that won't give any traction at all.
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> That is all well and good, but my point is that depressing the clutch
> > >> pedal
> > >> can't possibly be an improvement in your situation. When something like
> > >> this
> > >> happens, the best thing is to keep the tires turning in the direction you
> > >> want to go. I understand that this is TOTALLY counter intuitive and very
> > >> difficult to accomplish, but a tire that is turning is a tire that can
> > >> help
> > >> with directional control, a tire that is not turning is a tire that is
> > >> subject to the slope and the imposed direction of travel. This holds true
> > >> going forward or backward. I know the instinct is to smash the brake
> > >> pedal
> > >> into the carpet, but I submit that resisting the impulse is often times
> > >> the
> > >> better course of action.
> > >>
> > >> But, no, I have no experience in snow, but I am well versed in steep
> > >> hills
> > >> covered with sand and dirt.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> >>
> > >> >> > i was told by a friend that i would have gotten better traction if i
> > >> >> > had aired-down my tires, to 5-10 pounds,
> > >> >> > is this true on packed slick snow on a very steep incline??
> > >> >>
> > >> >>
> > >> >> Of course it's true. You will always get better traction with low air
> > >> >> pressure.
> > >> >>
> > >> > Assuming there is any traction to be had, and on a snow-packed slick
> > >> > incline
> > >> > ther is almost zero. if the snow isn't too deep, taller and narrow
> > >> > tires
> > >> > will work better, especially on the street, but for really deep stuff,
> > >> > if
> > >> > it's firm enough you *can* float on top, or at least not sink all the
> > >> > way
> > >> > to
> > >> > your frame. However, spin your tires once and you literally get that
> > >> > sinking
> > >> > feeling...the jeep just drops and there you are, with your jeep doing
> > >> > an
> > >> > impersonation of an igloo.
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >>
> >
> >
folks have matching diffs though and 'none' have brakes that split
50/50.
They started putting combination valve into Jeeps in the 70's to prevent
rear wheel lock up, so your brake setup is only valid for old beasts and
is extremely dangerous for normal driving because the rear wheels will
lock up causing you to do instant 360's. They even put a weight switch
in the Comanche to prevent rear wheel lock when unloaded.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Rich Hampel wrote:
>
> Absolutely NOT.
> Once you *start to slide/slip* on ice or snow with the vehicle in 4WD
> the different speeds of the front and rear axels will prevent at least
> two wheels from gaining traction/adhesion. For example a 411 rear
> differential will be matched with a 410 front differential .... one is
> either pulling or dragging the other, front and rear ARE running at
> 'different speeds'. The difference in wheel rpm is small, but is still
> different.; Its probably the reason that a 4WD once it starts to
> slide/slip (on ice or hardpack) is much harder to recover than a 2WD.
> No problem when there is traction and idling down in 4WD; but, when
> there isnt sufficient traction, feathering the brakes in neutral will
> usually allow faster recovery ... but like I stated the brakes had
> better be applying the same torque to all wheels.
> ;-)
>
> In article <10u8at9scehn724@corp.supernews.com>, Jeff Strickland
> <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > "Rich Hampel" <RhmpL33@nospam.net> wrote in message
> > news:110120051251586525%RhmpL33@nospam.net...
> > > An alternative is to put it in neutral and feather the brakes. ....
> > > this requires that the brakes are well set-up and 'equal' front to
> > > rear.
> > > Works well on solid 'black' ice as well as hardpack snow.
> > >
> > > If the tires are dry you can spray on a rosin based belt dressing onto
> > > the tread for additional 'traction' on hardpack or ice. Better is to
> > > use cable chains on the rear and 'feather' the hand brake to keep the
> > > rear end where it belongs. For super slippery conditions, increased
> > > tire pressure than normal seems best.
> > >
> > > Too bad they dont allow studded tires anymore. They do but you can
> > > only run them (in PA) when its icy or snow-covered ..... not worth the
> > > bother.
> > >
> > > Am a ski-patroller.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > Selecting the lowest possible gear and idling is the best possible condition
> > for directional stability and control, especially going backwards.
> > Feathering the brakes in this condition is advised, UNLESS this results in
> > locking the brakes and stopping the tire rotation. Bear in mind, I am
> > speaking of the situation where the vehicle has been stopped, and proceeding
> > down a hill is the desired action. Driving along at 40 and having an
> > emergency develop in front of you is entirely another matter, but in that
> > condition it is a very poor plan to depress the clutch pedal.
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > In article <10u82ih2oishk57@corp.supernews.com>, Jeff Strickland
> > > <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > >
> > >> "Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message
> > >> news:9-KdnWdDfOIgQn_cRVn-tw@comcast.com...
> > >> > >
> > >> >> This was your first mistake. Thankfully, it wasn't your last.
> > >> >>
> > >> >> WHAT YOU SHOULD HAVE DONE
> > >> >> Assuming you were insistant on climbing the hill ...
> > >> >
> > >> > Ever driven up a hill covered with wet, packed snow, Jeff? I was riding
> > >> > a
> > >> > trail recently on such conditions with about 7 jeeps ahead of me. Once
> > >> > I
> > >> > got
> > >> > to the hill, the snow had packed considerably and was fairly slick, but
> > >> > not
> > >> > terribly steep, I had enough traction to inch up the hill. But when I
> > >> > had
> > >> > to
> > >> > stop just shy of the top, I could feel myself slowly inching down, even
> > >> > with
> > >> > my foot on the brake. (And no, Bill or Mike, the ABS was not
> > >> > activating.)
> > >> > It
> > >> > was sliding just about half a foot per second, so I had enough time to
> > >> > radio
> > >> > to the fellow behind me to get out of the way. I couldn't get enough
> > >> > traction to get back up at that point, so my only choice was to slide
> > >> > all
> > >> > the way back down and have another go. Spinning the wheels just makes a
> > >> > situation like that worse...the tires melt a layer of snow and so now
> > >> > you
> > >> > have a water-slicked layer of snow that won't give any traction at all.
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> That is all well and good, but my point is that depressing the clutch
> > >> pedal
> > >> can't possibly be an improvement in your situation. When something like
> > >> this
> > >> happens, the best thing is to keep the tires turning in the direction you
> > >> want to go. I understand that this is TOTALLY counter intuitive and very
> > >> difficult to accomplish, but a tire that is turning is a tire that can
> > >> help
> > >> with directional control, a tire that is not turning is a tire that is
> > >> subject to the slope and the imposed direction of travel. This holds true
> > >> going forward or backward. I know the instinct is to smash the brake
> > >> pedal
> > >> into the carpet, but I submit that resisting the impulse is often times
> > >> the
> > >> better course of action.
> > >>
> > >> But, no, I have no experience in snow, but I am well versed in steep
> > >> hills
> > >> covered with sand and dirt.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> >>
> > >> >> > i was told by a friend that i would have gotten better traction if i
> > >> >> > had aired-down my tires, to 5-10 pounds,
> > >> >> > is this true on packed slick snow on a very steep incline??
> > >> >>
> > >> >>
> > >> >> Of course it's true. You will always get better traction with low air
> > >> >> pressure.
> > >> >>
> > >> > Assuming there is any traction to be had, and on a snow-packed slick
> > >> > incline
> > >> > ther is almost zero. if the snow isn't too deep, taller and narrow
> > >> > tires
> > >> > will work better, especially on the street, but for really deep stuff,
> > >> > if
> > >> > it's firm enough you *can* float on top, or at least not sink all the
> > >> > way
> > >> > to
> > >> > your frame. However, spin your tires once and you literally get that
> > >> > sinking
> > >> > feeling...the jeep just drops and there you are, with your jeep doing
> > >> > an
> > >> > impersonation of an igloo.
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >>
> >
> >
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Snow-crawl on steep incline--LONG
Well you found the 'only' example where I will agree with you. Most
folks have matching diffs though and 'none' have brakes that split
50/50.
They started putting combination valve into Jeeps in the 70's to prevent
rear wheel lock up, so your brake setup is only valid for old beasts and
is extremely dangerous for normal driving because the rear wheels will
lock up causing you to do instant 360's. They even put a weight switch
in the Comanche to prevent rear wheel lock when unloaded.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Rich Hampel wrote:
>
> Absolutely NOT.
> Once you *start to slide/slip* on ice or snow with the vehicle in 4WD
> the different speeds of the front and rear axels will prevent at least
> two wheels from gaining traction/adhesion. For example a 411 rear
> differential will be matched with a 410 front differential .... one is
> either pulling or dragging the other, front and rear ARE running at
> 'different speeds'. The difference in wheel rpm is small, but is still
> different.; Its probably the reason that a 4WD once it starts to
> slide/slip (on ice or hardpack) is much harder to recover than a 2WD.
> No problem when there is traction and idling down in 4WD; but, when
> there isnt sufficient traction, feathering the brakes in neutral will
> usually allow faster recovery ... but like I stated the brakes had
> better be applying the same torque to all wheels.
> ;-)
>
> In article <10u8at9scehn724@corp.supernews.com>, Jeff Strickland
> <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > "Rich Hampel" <RhmpL33@nospam.net> wrote in message
> > news:110120051251586525%RhmpL33@nospam.net...
> > > An alternative is to put it in neutral and feather the brakes. ....
> > > this requires that the brakes are well set-up and 'equal' front to
> > > rear.
> > > Works well on solid 'black' ice as well as hardpack snow.
> > >
> > > If the tires are dry you can spray on a rosin based belt dressing onto
> > > the tread for additional 'traction' on hardpack or ice. Better is to
> > > use cable chains on the rear and 'feather' the hand brake to keep the
> > > rear end where it belongs. For super slippery conditions, increased
> > > tire pressure than normal seems best.
> > >
> > > Too bad they dont allow studded tires anymore. They do but you can
> > > only run them (in PA) when its icy or snow-covered ..... not worth the
> > > bother.
> > >
> > > Am a ski-patroller.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > Selecting the lowest possible gear and idling is the best possible condition
> > for directional stability and control, especially going backwards.
> > Feathering the brakes in this condition is advised, UNLESS this results in
> > locking the brakes and stopping the tire rotation. Bear in mind, I am
> > speaking of the situation where the vehicle has been stopped, and proceeding
> > down a hill is the desired action. Driving along at 40 and having an
> > emergency develop in front of you is entirely another matter, but in that
> > condition it is a very poor plan to depress the clutch pedal.
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > In article <10u82ih2oishk57@corp.supernews.com>, Jeff Strickland
> > > <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > >
> > >> "Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message
> > >> news:9-KdnWdDfOIgQn_cRVn-tw@comcast.com...
> > >> > >
> > >> >> This was your first mistake. Thankfully, it wasn't your last.
> > >> >>
> > >> >> WHAT YOU SHOULD HAVE DONE
> > >> >> Assuming you were insistant on climbing the hill ...
> > >> >
> > >> > Ever driven up a hill covered with wet, packed snow, Jeff? I was riding
> > >> > a
> > >> > trail recently on such conditions with about 7 jeeps ahead of me. Once
> > >> > I
> > >> > got
> > >> > to the hill, the snow had packed considerably and was fairly slick, but
> > >> > not
> > >> > terribly steep, I had enough traction to inch up the hill. But when I
> > >> > had
> > >> > to
> > >> > stop just shy of the top, I could feel myself slowly inching down, even
> > >> > with
> > >> > my foot on the brake. (And no, Bill or Mike, the ABS was not
> > >> > activating.)
> > >> > It
> > >> > was sliding just about half a foot per second, so I had enough time to
> > >> > radio
> > >> > to the fellow behind me to get out of the way. I couldn't get enough
> > >> > traction to get back up at that point, so my only choice was to slide
> > >> > all
> > >> > the way back down and have another go. Spinning the wheels just makes a
> > >> > situation like that worse...the tires melt a layer of snow and so now
> > >> > you
> > >> > have a water-slicked layer of snow that won't give any traction at all.
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> That is all well and good, but my point is that depressing the clutch
> > >> pedal
> > >> can't possibly be an improvement in your situation. When something like
> > >> this
> > >> happens, the best thing is to keep the tires turning in the direction you
> > >> want to go. I understand that this is TOTALLY counter intuitive and very
> > >> difficult to accomplish, but a tire that is turning is a tire that can
> > >> help
> > >> with directional control, a tire that is not turning is a tire that is
> > >> subject to the slope and the imposed direction of travel. This holds true
> > >> going forward or backward. I know the instinct is to smash the brake
> > >> pedal
> > >> into the carpet, but I submit that resisting the impulse is often times
> > >> the
> > >> better course of action.
> > >>
> > >> But, no, I have no experience in snow, but I am well versed in steep
> > >> hills
> > >> covered with sand and dirt.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> >>
> > >> >> > i was told by a friend that i would have gotten better traction if i
> > >> >> > had aired-down my tires, to 5-10 pounds,
> > >> >> > is this true on packed slick snow on a very steep incline??
> > >> >>
> > >> >>
> > >> >> Of course it's true. You will always get better traction with low air
> > >> >> pressure.
> > >> >>
> > >> > Assuming there is any traction to be had, and on a snow-packed slick
> > >> > incline
> > >> > ther is almost zero. if the snow isn't too deep, taller and narrow
> > >> > tires
> > >> > will work better, especially on the street, but for really deep stuff,
> > >> > if
> > >> > it's firm enough you *can* float on top, or at least not sink all the
> > >> > way
> > >> > to
> > >> > your frame. However, spin your tires once and you literally get that
> > >> > sinking
> > >> > feeling...the jeep just drops and there you are, with your jeep doing
> > >> > an
> > >> > impersonation of an igloo.
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >>
> >
> >
folks have matching diffs though and 'none' have brakes that split
50/50.
They started putting combination valve into Jeeps in the 70's to prevent
rear wheel lock up, so your brake setup is only valid for old beasts and
is extremely dangerous for normal driving because the rear wheels will
lock up causing you to do instant 360's. They even put a weight switch
in the Comanche to prevent rear wheel lock when unloaded.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Rich Hampel wrote:
>
> Absolutely NOT.
> Once you *start to slide/slip* on ice or snow with the vehicle in 4WD
> the different speeds of the front and rear axels will prevent at least
> two wheels from gaining traction/adhesion. For example a 411 rear
> differential will be matched with a 410 front differential .... one is
> either pulling or dragging the other, front and rear ARE running at
> 'different speeds'. The difference in wheel rpm is small, but is still
> different.; Its probably the reason that a 4WD once it starts to
> slide/slip (on ice or hardpack) is much harder to recover than a 2WD.
> No problem when there is traction and idling down in 4WD; but, when
> there isnt sufficient traction, feathering the brakes in neutral will
> usually allow faster recovery ... but like I stated the brakes had
> better be applying the same torque to all wheels.
> ;-)
>
> In article <10u8at9scehn724@corp.supernews.com>, Jeff Strickland
> <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > "Rich Hampel" <RhmpL33@nospam.net> wrote in message
> > news:110120051251586525%RhmpL33@nospam.net...
> > > An alternative is to put it in neutral and feather the brakes. ....
> > > this requires that the brakes are well set-up and 'equal' front to
> > > rear.
> > > Works well on solid 'black' ice as well as hardpack snow.
> > >
> > > If the tires are dry you can spray on a rosin based belt dressing onto
> > > the tread for additional 'traction' on hardpack or ice. Better is to
> > > use cable chains on the rear and 'feather' the hand brake to keep the
> > > rear end where it belongs. For super slippery conditions, increased
> > > tire pressure than normal seems best.
> > >
> > > Too bad they dont allow studded tires anymore. They do but you can
> > > only run them (in PA) when its icy or snow-covered ..... not worth the
> > > bother.
> > >
> > > Am a ski-patroller.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > Selecting the lowest possible gear and idling is the best possible condition
> > for directional stability and control, especially going backwards.
> > Feathering the brakes in this condition is advised, UNLESS this results in
> > locking the brakes and stopping the tire rotation. Bear in mind, I am
> > speaking of the situation where the vehicle has been stopped, and proceeding
> > down a hill is the desired action. Driving along at 40 and having an
> > emergency develop in front of you is entirely another matter, but in that
> > condition it is a very poor plan to depress the clutch pedal.
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > In article <10u82ih2oishk57@corp.supernews.com>, Jeff Strickland
> > > <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > >
> > >> "Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message
> > >> news:9-KdnWdDfOIgQn_cRVn-tw@comcast.com...
> > >> > >
> > >> >> This was your first mistake. Thankfully, it wasn't your last.
> > >> >>
> > >> >> WHAT YOU SHOULD HAVE DONE
> > >> >> Assuming you were insistant on climbing the hill ...
> > >> >
> > >> > Ever driven up a hill covered with wet, packed snow, Jeff? I was riding
> > >> > a
> > >> > trail recently on such conditions with about 7 jeeps ahead of me. Once
> > >> > I
> > >> > got
> > >> > to the hill, the snow had packed considerably and was fairly slick, but
> > >> > not
> > >> > terribly steep, I had enough traction to inch up the hill. But when I
> > >> > had
> > >> > to
> > >> > stop just shy of the top, I could feel myself slowly inching down, even
> > >> > with
> > >> > my foot on the brake. (And no, Bill or Mike, the ABS was not
> > >> > activating.)
> > >> > It
> > >> > was sliding just about half a foot per second, so I had enough time to
> > >> > radio
> > >> > to the fellow behind me to get out of the way. I couldn't get enough
> > >> > traction to get back up at that point, so my only choice was to slide
> > >> > all
> > >> > the way back down and have another go. Spinning the wheels just makes a
> > >> > situation like that worse...the tires melt a layer of snow and so now
> > >> > you
> > >> > have a water-slicked layer of snow that won't give any traction at all.
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> That is all well and good, but my point is that depressing the clutch
> > >> pedal
> > >> can't possibly be an improvement in your situation. When something like
> > >> this
> > >> happens, the best thing is to keep the tires turning in the direction you
> > >> want to go. I understand that this is TOTALLY counter intuitive and very
> > >> difficult to accomplish, but a tire that is turning is a tire that can
> > >> help
> > >> with directional control, a tire that is not turning is a tire that is
> > >> subject to the slope and the imposed direction of travel. This holds true
> > >> going forward or backward. I know the instinct is to smash the brake
> > >> pedal
> > >> into the carpet, but I submit that resisting the impulse is often times
> > >> the
> > >> better course of action.
> > >>
> > >> But, no, I have no experience in snow, but I am well versed in steep
> > >> hills
> > >> covered with sand and dirt.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> >>
> > >> >> > i was told by a friend that i would have gotten better traction if i
> > >> >> > had aired-down my tires, to 5-10 pounds,
> > >> >> > is this true on packed slick snow on a very steep incline??
> > >> >>
> > >> >>
> > >> >> Of course it's true. You will always get better traction with low air
> > >> >> pressure.
> > >> >>
> > >> > Assuming there is any traction to be had, and on a snow-packed slick
> > >> > incline
> > >> > ther is almost zero. if the snow isn't too deep, taller and narrow
> > >> > tires
> > >> > will work better, especially on the street, but for really deep stuff,
> > >> > if
> > >> > it's firm enough you *can* float on top, or at least not sink all the
> > >> > way
> > >> > to
> > >> > your frame. However, spin your tires once and you literally get that
> > >> > sinking
> > >> > feeling...the jeep just drops and there you are, with your jeep doing
> > >> > an
> > >> > impersonation of an igloo.
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >>
> >
> >
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Snow-crawl on steep incline--LONG
Well you found the 'only' example where I will agree with you. Most
folks have matching diffs though and 'none' have brakes that split
50/50.
They started putting combination valve into Jeeps in the 70's to prevent
rear wheel lock up, so your brake setup is only valid for old beasts and
is extremely dangerous for normal driving because the rear wheels will
lock up causing you to do instant 360's. They even put a weight switch
in the Comanche to prevent rear wheel lock when unloaded.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Rich Hampel wrote:
>
> Absolutely NOT.
> Once you *start to slide/slip* on ice or snow with the vehicle in 4WD
> the different speeds of the front and rear axels will prevent at least
> two wheels from gaining traction/adhesion. For example a 411 rear
> differential will be matched with a 410 front differential .... one is
> either pulling or dragging the other, front and rear ARE running at
> 'different speeds'. The difference in wheel rpm is small, but is still
> different.; Its probably the reason that a 4WD once it starts to
> slide/slip (on ice or hardpack) is much harder to recover than a 2WD.
> No problem when there is traction and idling down in 4WD; but, when
> there isnt sufficient traction, feathering the brakes in neutral will
> usually allow faster recovery ... but like I stated the brakes had
> better be applying the same torque to all wheels.
> ;-)
>
> In article <10u8at9scehn724@corp.supernews.com>, Jeff Strickland
> <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > "Rich Hampel" <RhmpL33@nospam.net> wrote in message
> > news:110120051251586525%RhmpL33@nospam.net...
> > > An alternative is to put it in neutral and feather the brakes. ....
> > > this requires that the brakes are well set-up and 'equal' front to
> > > rear.
> > > Works well on solid 'black' ice as well as hardpack snow.
> > >
> > > If the tires are dry you can spray on a rosin based belt dressing onto
> > > the tread for additional 'traction' on hardpack or ice. Better is to
> > > use cable chains on the rear and 'feather' the hand brake to keep the
> > > rear end where it belongs. For super slippery conditions, increased
> > > tire pressure than normal seems best.
> > >
> > > Too bad they dont allow studded tires anymore. They do but you can
> > > only run them (in PA) when its icy or snow-covered ..... not worth the
> > > bother.
> > >
> > > Am a ski-patroller.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > Selecting the lowest possible gear and idling is the best possible condition
> > for directional stability and control, especially going backwards.
> > Feathering the brakes in this condition is advised, UNLESS this results in
> > locking the brakes and stopping the tire rotation. Bear in mind, I am
> > speaking of the situation where the vehicle has been stopped, and proceeding
> > down a hill is the desired action. Driving along at 40 and having an
> > emergency develop in front of you is entirely another matter, but in that
> > condition it is a very poor plan to depress the clutch pedal.
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > In article <10u82ih2oishk57@corp.supernews.com>, Jeff Strickland
> > > <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > >
> > >> "Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message
> > >> news:9-KdnWdDfOIgQn_cRVn-tw@comcast.com...
> > >> > >
> > >> >> This was your first mistake. Thankfully, it wasn't your last.
> > >> >>
> > >> >> WHAT YOU SHOULD HAVE DONE
> > >> >> Assuming you were insistant on climbing the hill ...
> > >> >
> > >> > Ever driven up a hill covered with wet, packed snow, Jeff? I was riding
> > >> > a
> > >> > trail recently on such conditions with about 7 jeeps ahead of me. Once
> > >> > I
> > >> > got
> > >> > to the hill, the snow had packed considerably and was fairly slick, but
> > >> > not
> > >> > terribly steep, I had enough traction to inch up the hill. But when I
> > >> > had
> > >> > to
> > >> > stop just shy of the top, I could feel myself slowly inching down, even
> > >> > with
> > >> > my foot on the brake. (And no, Bill or Mike, the ABS was not
> > >> > activating.)
> > >> > It
> > >> > was sliding just about half a foot per second, so I had enough time to
> > >> > radio
> > >> > to the fellow behind me to get out of the way. I couldn't get enough
> > >> > traction to get back up at that point, so my only choice was to slide
> > >> > all
> > >> > the way back down and have another go. Spinning the wheels just makes a
> > >> > situation like that worse...the tires melt a layer of snow and so now
> > >> > you
> > >> > have a water-slicked layer of snow that won't give any traction at all.
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> That is all well and good, but my point is that depressing the clutch
> > >> pedal
> > >> can't possibly be an improvement in your situation. When something like
> > >> this
> > >> happens, the best thing is to keep the tires turning in the direction you
> > >> want to go. I understand that this is TOTALLY counter intuitive and very
> > >> difficult to accomplish, but a tire that is turning is a tire that can
> > >> help
> > >> with directional control, a tire that is not turning is a tire that is
> > >> subject to the slope and the imposed direction of travel. This holds true
> > >> going forward or backward. I know the instinct is to smash the brake
> > >> pedal
> > >> into the carpet, but I submit that resisting the impulse is often times
> > >> the
> > >> better course of action.
> > >>
> > >> But, no, I have no experience in snow, but I am well versed in steep
> > >> hills
> > >> covered with sand and dirt.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> >>
> > >> >> > i was told by a friend that i would have gotten better traction if i
> > >> >> > had aired-down my tires, to 5-10 pounds,
> > >> >> > is this true on packed slick snow on a very steep incline??
> > >> >>
> > >> >>
> > >> >> Of course it's true. You will always get better traction with low air
> > >> >> pressure.
> > >> >>
> > >> > Assuming there is any traction to be had, and on a snow-packed slick
> > >> > incline
> > >> > ther is almost zero. if the snow isn't too deep, taller and narrow
> > >> > tires
> > >> > will work better, especially on the street, but for really deep stuff,
> > >> > if
> > >> > it's firm enough you *can* float on top, or at least not sink all the
> > >> > way
> > >> > to
> > >> > your frame. However, spin your tires once and you literally get that
> > >> > sinking
> > >> > feeling...the jeep just drops and there you are, with your jeep doing
> > >> > an
> > >> > impersonation of an igloo.
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >>
> >
> >
folks have matching diffs though and 'none' have brakes that split
50/50.
They started putting combination valve into Jeeps in the 70's to prevent
rear wheel lock up, so your brake setup is only valid for old beasts and
is extremely dangerous for normal driving because the rear wheels will
lock up causing you to do instant 360's. They even put a weight switch
in the Comanche to prevent rear wheel lock when unloaded.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Rich Hampel wrote:
>
> Absolutely NOT.
> Once you *start to slide/slip* on ice or snow with the vehicle in 4WD
> the different speeds of the front and rear axels will prevent at least
> two wheels from gaining traction/adhesion. For example a 411 rear
> differential will be matched with a 410 front differential .... one is
> either pulling or dragging the other, front and rear ARE running at
> 'different speeds'. The difference in wheel rpm is small, but is still
> different.; Its probably the reason that a 4WD once it starts to
> slide/slip (on ice or hardpack) is much harder to recover than a 2WD.
> No problem when there is traction and idling down in 4WD; but, when
> there isnt sufficient traction, feathering the brakes in neutral will
> usually allow faster recovery ... but like I stated the brakes had
> better be applying the same torque to all wheels.
> ;-)
>
> In article <10u8at9scehn724@corp.supernews.com>, Jeff Strickland
> <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > "Rich Hampel" <RhmpL33@nospam.net> wrote in message
> > news:110120051251586525%RhmpL33@nospam.net...
> > > An alternative is to put it in neutral and feather the brakes. ....
> > > this requires that the brakes are well set-up and 'equal' front to
> > > rear.
> > > Works well on solid 'black' ice as well as hardpack snow.
> > >
> > > If the tires are dry you can spray on a rosin based belt dressing onto
> > > the tread for additional 'traction' on hardpack or ice. Better is to
> > > use cable chains on the rear and 'feather' the hand brake to keep the
> > > rear end where it belongs. For super slippery conditions, increased
> > > tire pressure than normal seems best.
> > >
> > > Too bad they dont allow studded tires anymore. They do but you can
> > > only run them (in PA) when its icy or snow-covered ..... not worth the
> > > bother.
> > >
> > > Am a ski-patroller.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > Selecting the lowest possible gear and idling is the best possible condition
> > for directional stability and control, especially going backwards.
> > Feathering the brakes in this condition is advised, UNLESS this results in
> > locking the brakes and stopping the tire rotation. Bear in mind, I am
> > speaking of the situation where the vehicle has been stopped, and proceeding
> > down a hill is the desired action. Driving along at 40 and having an
> > emergency develop in front of you is entirely another matter, but in that
> > condition it is a very poor plan to depress the clutch pedal.
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > In article <10u82ih2oishk57@corp.supernews.com>, Jeff Strickland
> > > <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > >
> > >> "Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message
> > >> news:9-KdnWdDfOIgQn_cRVn-tw@comcast.com...
> > >> > >
> > >> >> This was your first mistake. Thankfully, it wasn't your last.
> > >> >>
> > >> >> WHAT YOU SHOULD HAVE DONE
> > >> >> Assuming you were insistant on climbing the hill ...
> > >> >
> > >> > Ever driven up a hill covered with wet, packed snow, Jeff? I was riding
> > >> > a
> > >> > trail recently on such conditions with about 7 jeeps ahead of me. Once
> > >> > I
> > >> > got
> > >> > to the hill, the snow had packed considerably and was fairly slick, but
> > >> > not
> > >> > terribly steep, I had enough traction to inch up the hill. But when I
> > >> > had
> > >> > to
> > >> > stop just shy of the top, I could feel myself slowly inching down, even
> > >> > with
> > >> > my foot on the brake. (And no, Bill or Mike, the ABS was not
> > >> > activating.)
> > >> > It
> > >> > was sliding just about half a foot per second, so I had enough time to
> > >> > radio
> > >> > to the fellow behind me to get out of the way. I couldn't get enough
> > >> > traction to get back up at that point, so my only choice was to slide
> > >> > all
> > >> > the way back down and have another go. Spinning the wheels just makes a
> > >> > situation like that worse...the tires melt a layer of snow and so now
> > >> > you
> > >> > have a water-slicked layer of snow that won't give any traction at all.
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> That is all well and good, but my point is that depressing the clutch
> > >> pedal
> > >> can't possibly be an improvement in your situation. When something like
> > >> this
> > >> happens, the best thing is to keep the tires turning in the direction you
> > >> want to go. I understand that this is TOTALLY counter intuitive and very
> > >> difficult to accomplish, but a tire that is turning is a tire that can
> > >> help
> > >> with directional control, a tire that is not turning is a tire that is
> > >> subject to the slope and the imposed direction of travel. This holds true
> > >> going forward or backward. I know the instinct is to smash the brake
> > >> pedal
> > >> into the carpet, but I submit that resisting the impulse is often times
> > >> the
> > >> better course of action.
> > >>
> > >> But, no, I have no experience in snow, but I am well versed in steep
> > >> hills
> > >> covered with sand and dirt.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> >>
> > >> >> > i was told by a friend that i would have gotten better traction if i
> > >> >> > had aired-down my tires, to 5-10 pounds,
> > >> >> > is this true on packed slick snow on a very steep incline??
> > >> >>
> > >> >>
> > >> >> Of course it's true. You will always get better traction with low air
> > >> >> pressure.
> > >> >>
> > >> > Assuming there is any traction to be had, and on a snow-packed slick
> > >> > incline
> > >> > ther is almost zero. if the snow isn't too deep, taller and narrow
> > >> > tires
> > >> > will work better, especially on the street, but for really deep stuff,
> > >> > if
> > >> > it's firm enough you *can* float on top, or at least not sink all the
> > >> > way
> > >> > to
> > >> > your frame. However, spin your tires once and you literally get that
> > >> > sinking
> > >> > feeling...the jeep just drops and there you are, with your jeep doing
> > >> > an
> > >> > impersonation of an igloo.
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >>
> >
> >
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Snow-crawl on steep incline--LONG
> I agree with Mike... it can seem really easy to drive on ice when you
are not
> doing it. Sometimes, when you ARE doing it, you are just plain
screwed; the
> rig is on the verge of getting away from you and that's just how it
is!
>
> -jeff
Ya, and yr butts all puckered up around the seat, yr foreheads sweatin,
and the heaters OFF,yr armpits have the stink of death, reaking from
them,
yr minds going over every ESCAPE senario you ever learned growing up in
Maine-
(when snow used to be fun)and you come up with two options, leave
it-(and the two-legged buzzards will pick it clean in hours) or just go
for it.
so you say a prayer, telling him if he alows you out of this STUPID
asinine,
situation you got yrself into you promise,,,promise,,never,,ever to do
it again,
letting off the emargency brake(after high-jacking yrself outa the
ditch again,
tires sitting very close to the ditch sholder) you look at yr wife, and
she waves
bye,bye, and you wonder what shes realy thinking,,,hmmm, i am
inshured,,,new jeep for her,,and the dawg,,
looking back down the slope, you know what a stupid human you are, and
put it into gear,4low, and let off the clutch, slowly creeping
foreward, ***-puckerd up nicely,head sticking out the door looking at
the side of the ditch keeping yr tires on the edge.
then as you say sh%T the jeep starts a slow slide, rear outward cutting
the wheel does nuthing,
stupid maybe, pushing in the clutch you start rolling with the weels.
and just drive it back into the ditch.
you hard-drive the ditch(leaning over enough to later see i lost
powersteeering fluid outa the container vent hole)
then hitting a culvert and folding a leafspring back,,sh&T, shackles
suck.
highlift again, digging again, then another attenp over the culvert.
weeee. now im high-centered with my two drive wheels up in the air,
another rig, a short tug. im freee.
flat drivers front tire,(i believe this was a GOD-send,
i made it around the hairpin-corner where ther plumbing-cargo-van was
***-end
over the cliff with a broken rear axel, hes been there awhile lotta
snow on his windshield.
now safely back down elevation, far enough to have stickiee snow.
slow drive down. change tire, look at damage,
HE got me off the mountain, "I" WAS Stupid,
And my folded leaf is keeping me from doing anything stupid in the
upcoming
future.
hence the question about doubleing up on the second leaf
Hi- im john and im a jeep-addict, a telescope-addict
and i need alot of theripy,
and i dont spell vry wel ieder.
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Snow-crawl on steep incline--LONG
> I agree with Mike... it can seem really easy to drive on ice when you
are not
> doing it. Sometimes, when you ARE doing it, you are just plain
screwed; the
> rig is on the verge of getting away from you and that's just how it
is!
>
> -jeff
Ya, and yr butts all puckered up around the seat, yr foreheads sweatin,
and the heaters OFF,yr armpits have the stink of death, reaking from
them,
yr minds going over every ESCAPE senario you ever learned growing up in
Maine-
(when snow used to be fun)and you come up with two options, leave
it-(and the two-legged buzzards will pick it clean in hours) or just go
for it.
so you say a prayer, telling him if he alows you out of this STUPID
asinine,
situation you got yrself into you promise,,,promise,,never,,ever to do
it again,
letting off the emargency brake(after high-jacking yrself outa the
ditch again,
tires sitting very close to the ditch sholder) you look at yr wife, and
she waves
bye,bye, and you wonder what shes realy thinking,,,hmmm, i am
inshured,,,new jeep for her,,and the dawg,,
looking back down the slope, you know what a stupid human you are, and
put it into gear,4low, and let off the clutch, slowly creeping
foreward, ***-puckerd up nicely,head sticking out the door looking at
the side of the ditch keeping yr tires on the edge.
then as you say sh%T the jeep starts a slow slide, rear outward cutting
the wheel does nuthing,
stupid maybe, pushing in the clutch you start rolling with the weels.
and just drive it back into the ditch.
you hard-drive the ditch(leaning over enough to later see i lost
powersteeering fluid outa the container vent hole)
then hitting a culvert and folding a leafspring back,,sh&T, shackles
suck.
highlift again, digging again, then another attenp over the culvert.
weeee. now im high-centered with my two drive wheels up in the air,
another rig, a short tug. im freee.
flat drivers front tire,(i believe this was a GOD-send,
i made it around the hairpin-corner where ther plumbing-cargo-van was
***-end
over the cliff with a broken rear axel, hes been there awhile lotta
snow on his windshield.
now safely back down elevation, far enough to have stickiee snow.
slow drive down. change tire, look at damage,
HE got me off the mountain, "I" WAS Stupid,
And my folded leaf is keeping me from doing anything stupid in the
upcoming
future.
hence the question about doubleing up on the second leaf
Hi- im john and im a jeep-addict, a telescope-addict
and i need alot of theripy,
and i dont spell vry wel ieder.
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Snow-crawl on steep incline--LONG
> I agree with Mike... it can seem really easy to drive on ice when you
are not
> doing it. Sometimes, when you ARE doing it, you are just plain
screwed; the
> rig is on the verge of getting away from you and that's just how it
is!
>
> -jeff
Ya, and yr butts all puckered up around the seat, yr foreheads sweatin,
and the heaters OFF,yr armpits have the stink of death, reaking from
them,
yr minds going over every ESCAPE senario you ever learned growing up in
Maine-
(when snow used to be fun)and you come up with two options, leave
it-(and the two-legged buzzards will pick it clean in hours) or just go
for it.
so you say a prayer, telling him if he alows you out of this STUPID
asinine,
situation you got yrself into you promise,,,promise,,never,,ever to do
it again,
letting off the emargency brake(after high-jacking yrself outa the
ditch again,
tires sitting very close to the ditch sholder) you look at yr wife, and
she waves
bye,bye, and you wonder what shes realy thinking,,,hmmm, i am
inshured,,,new jeep for her,,and the dawg,,
looking back down the slope, you know what a stupid human you are, and
put it into gear,4low, and let off the clutch, slowly creeping
foreward, ***-puckerd up nicely,head sticking out the door looking at
the side of the ditch keeping yr tires on the edge.
then as you say sh%T the jeep starts a slow slide, rear outward cutting
the wheel does nuthing,
stupid maybe, pushing in the clutch you start rolling with the weels.
and just drive it back into the ditch.
you hard-drive the ditch(leaning over enough to later see i lost
powersteeering fluid outa the container vent hole)
then hitting a culvert and folding a leafspring back,,sh&T, shackles
suck.
highlift again, digging again, then another attenp over the culvert.
weeee. now im high-centered with my two drive wheels up in the air,
another rig, a short tug. im freee.
flat drivers front tire,(i believe this was a GOD-send,
i made it around the hairpin-corner where ther plumbing-cargo-van was
***-end
over the cliff with a broken rear axel, hes been there awhile lotta
snow on his windshield.
now safely back down elevation, far enough to have stickiee snow.
slow drive down. change tire, look at damage,
HE got me off the mountain, "I" WAS Stupid,
And my folded leaf is keeping me from doing anything stupid in the
upcoming
future.
hence the question about doubleing up on the second leaf
Hi- im john and im a jeep-addict, a telescope-addict
and i need alot of theripy,
and i dont spell vry wel ieder.
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Snow-crawl on steep incline--LONG
"Rich Hampel" <RhmpL33@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:120120050850027313%RhmpL33@nospam.net...
> Absolutely NOT.
> Once you *start to slide/slip* on ice or snow with the vehicle in 4WD
> the different speeds of the front and rear axels will prevent at least
> two wheels from gaining traction/adhesion. For example a 411 rear
> differential will be matched with a 410 front differential .... one is
> either pulling or dragging the other, front and rear ARE running at
> 'different speeds'. The difference in wheel rpm is small, but is still
> different.; Its probably the reason that a 4WD once it starts to
> slide/slip (on ice or hardpack) is much harder to recover than a 2WD.
> No problem when there is traction and idling down in 4WD; but, when
> there isnt sufficient traction, feathering the brakes in neutral will
> usually allow faster recovery ... but like I stated the brakes had
> better be applying the same torque to all wheels.
> ;-)
>
Think that if you want, but when you get to the bottom of the ditch, or
wrapped around a tree, ALWAYS remember to put the gear selector back into
gear. It is illegal in many states, if not all, to coast in Neutral.