Re: Tomb Raider Rubicon
08-23-2003, 09:23 PM
#11
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Tomb Raider Rubicon
Ok, Earle, we were there at 9 AM, stopped at the Sinclair where we always
air down & buy coffee & snacks for the day. Took my neighbor Jim for his
first trip around the Alpine Loop. Stopped at American Basin, then headed to
Lake City,. but stopped at a GREAT little surprise of a place in Sherman
called the A&A Guest Ranch for a fantastic Italian lunch (this place is a
gem).
We were going to head up to Carson but it was SNOWING on the peaks. Rained
like an SOB all the way from Lake City back over to Silverton, where we
stopped at the Conoco to air back up & hose all the clay & muck off the YJ.
Oh, hey Earle, I ain't rich, and my girlfriend says I ain't a sissy, but I
do live in Durango. You've probably seen my rig up there a lot. I have a
Hunter Green '94 YJ with Dana 44 & ARB front, D60 & Detroit rear, Atlas II,
35" BFG MTs on Eagles, 4.5" RE suspension, Warn XD9000i, Durango bumpers and
Avalanche rocker guards (shows Avalanche in relief on the side in support of
my friend Steve Rumore). Next time I'm up there (might be tomorrow) throw a
rock at my Jeep and I'll know it's you.
Buy the way Earle, if you want to try out a Rubicon the guy at the Conoco
has one you can rent.....
"Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in message
news:bi7v3b$65loc$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> Heh, like George I could go down to Montrose and buy that new Patriot
> Rubicon on the lot with cash today, and pay someone to buff off all those
> stupid flag decals this afternoon, but I don't need one. I don't even
need
> to build one, because the stock YJ that I have is sufficient for my uses,
> thank you. I learned to drive off road in places where "rich sissies"
from
> California and Texas (like George) would be afraid to walk. I was
thinking
> of getting a rear Trash-Lock, but I am not yet convinced I need it.
>
> If I were a young guy with a family to raise however, there is no way in
> hell I would be paying $500 a month for a toy like the Rubicon for myself.
>
> George if you are actually coming to Silverton this AM please spend some
> money. My friends with the gift shops and restaurants really love "rich
> sissies" like you, honest!
>
> Earle
>
> "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> news:vkenruqvbsvi3e@corp.supernews.com...
> > Ah, but one can come to the wrong assumptions in haste, can't one? I
> > presently own three Jeeps and an MB E430 Sport. Price is not the issue,
I
> > can write check for one this morning, thank you.
> >
> > My point here, my overly sensitive Jeeping friends, is that the thing
was
> > priced unreasonably high given its content, then, due to its restricted
> > production volume, the dealers did their usual opportunistic optioning
and
> > price gouging, luring many of those who bought them out of the "don't
get
> > it dirty it's just a hip car for cruising" crowd.
> >
> > Those of us who've spent a bundle to build our Jeeps just chuckle.
Perhaps
> > as they get out on the used market more will get into the hands of true
> Jeep
> > enthusiasts, right now the owner base seems to be more attuned the
quality
> > of the CD players than the performance of the 4.1 xfer case or the
> lockers.
> >
> > There was absolutely no justification for the price premium Chrysler put
> on
> > the thing. The content's combined incremental build cost premium to
> Chrysler
> > can't be much more than $1000 over a D44 Sport. (They could have simply
> made
> > the axles, lockers and xfer case a check-off option.) Folks that ordered
> > them from larger metro-area dealerships complain about paying
over-sticker
> > premiums and having to take them with silly options they didn't order,
> want
> > or need (yes, power mirrors ARE an option on the Rubicon), or finding
out
> > once they arrived that the dealer had peppered the things with glass
tint,
> > mud guards, stone shields, etc. Some dealers then told the buyer who
> ordered
> > them to "take it or leave it". Typical car dealer BS. Our local dealer
was
> > merciful and sold them at sticker.
> >
> > Sorry if I offended any enthusiast Rubicon owners out there, was not my
> > intent and I should have been more specific. It's a great product, just
> > riles many of us who loathe the way manufacturers and dealers take
> advantage
> > of consumers.
> >
> > ...but, Earle DOES live in God's country and we're heading that way this
> AM!
> >
> > "Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in
message
> > news:bi6msk$5inl2$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> > > news:vkdgi0pkuncte3@corp.supernews.com...
> > > > Frankly, there's getting to be a school of thought among veteran
> > > > Jeepers that the Rubicon simply SUCKS, mostly due to its owners.
> > > > There must have been 500 of the things at Moab last year and
> > > > eventually everyone avoided them like the plague. This months JP
> > > > mag lists them among the 10 Jeeps they wouldn't own.
> > > > ...
> > >
> > > A FAMISHED FOX saw some clusters of ripe black grapes hanging from a
> > > trellised vine. She resorted to all her tricks to get at them, but
> wearied
> > > herself in vain, for she could not reach them. At last she turned
away,
> > > hiding her disappointment and saying: "The Grapes are sour, and not
ripe
> > as
> > > I thought."
> > >
> > > --Aesop, pretty darn smart Ancient Greek
> > >
> > > Earle
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
air down & buy coffee & snacks for the day. Took my neighbor Jim for his
first trip around the Alpine Loop. Stopped at American Basin, then headed to
Lake City,. but stopped at a GREAT little surprise of a place in Sherman
called the A&A Guest Ranch for a fantastic Italian lunch (this place is a
gem).
We were going to head up to Carson but it was SNOWING on the peaks. Rained
like an SOB all the way from Lake City back over to Silverton, where we
stopped at the Conoco to air back up & hose all the clay & muck off the YJ.
Oh, hey Earle, I ain't rich, and my girlfriend says I ain't a sissy, but I
do live in Durango. You've probably seen my rig up there a lot. I have a
Hunter Green '94 YJ with Dana 44 & ARB front, D60 & Detroit rear, Atlas II,
35" BFG MTs on Eagles, 4.5" RE suspension, Warn XD9000i, Durango bumpers and
Avalanche rocker guards (shows Avalanche in relief on the side in support of
my friend Steve Rumore). Next time I'm up there (might be tomorrow) throw a
rock at my Jeep and I'll know it's you.
Buy the way Earle, if you want to try out a Rubicon the guy at the Conoco
has one you can rent.....
"Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in message
news:bi7v3b$65loc$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> Heh, like George I could go down to Montrose and buy that new Patriot
> Rubicon on the lot with cash today, and pay someone to buff off all those
> stupid flag decals this afternoon, but I don't need one. I don't even
need
> to build one, because the stock YJ that I have is sufficient for my uses,
> thank you. I learned to drive off road in places where "rich sissies"
from
> California and Texas (like George) would be afraid to walk. I was
thinking
> of getting a rear Trash-Lock, but I am not yet convinced I need it.
>
> If I were a young guy with a family to raise however, there is no way in
> hell I would be paying $500 a month for a toy like the Rubicon for myself.
>
> George if you are actually coming to Silverton this AM please spend some
> money. My friends with the gift shops and restaurants really love "rich
> sissies" like you, honest!
>
> Earle
>
> "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> news:vkenruqvbsvi3e@corp.supernews.com...
> > Ah, but one can come to the wrong assumptions in haste, can't one? I
> > presently own three Jeeps and an MB E430 Sport. Price is not the issue,
I
> > can write check for one this morning, thank you.
> >
> > My point here, my overly sensitive Jeeping friends, is that the thing
was
> > priced unreasonably high given its content, then, due to its restricted
> > production volume, the dealers did their usual opportunistic optioning
and
> > price gouging, luring many of those who bought them out of the "don't
get
> > it dirty it's just a hip car for cruising" crowd.
> >
> > Those of us who've spent a bundle to build our Jeeps just chuckle.
Perhaps
> > as they get out on the used market more will get into the hands of true
> Jeep
> > enthusiasts, right now the owner base seems to be more attuned the
quality
> > of the CD players than the performance of the 4.1 xfer case or the
> lockers.
> >
> > There was absolutely no justification for the price premium Chrysler put
> on
> > the thing. The content's combined incremental build cost premium to
> Chrysler
> > can't be much more than $1000 over a D44 Sport. (They could have simply
> made
> > the axles, lockers and xfer case a check-off option.) Folks that ordered
> > them from larger metro-area dealerships complain about paying
over-sticker
> > premiums and having to take them with silly options they didn't order,
> want
> > or need (yes, power mirrors ARE an option on the Rubicon), or finding
out
> > once they arrived that the dealer had peppered the things with glass
tint,
> > mud guards, stone shields, etc. Some dealers then told the buyer who
> ordered
> > them to "take it or leave it". Typical car dealer BS. Our local dealer
was
> > merciful and sold them at sticker.
> >
> > Sorry if I offended any enthusiast Rubicon owners out there, was not my
> > intent and I should have been more specific. It's a great product, just
> > riles many of us who loathe the way manufacturers and dealers take
> advantage
> > of consumers.
> >
> > ...but, Earle DOES live in God's country and we're heading that way this
> AM!
> >
> > "Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in
message
> > news:bi6msk$5inl2$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> > > news:vkdgi0pkuncte3@corp.supernews.com...
> > > > Frankly, there's getting to be a school of thought among veteran
> > > > Jeepers that the Rubicon simply SUCKS, mostly due to its owners.
> > > > There must have been 500 of the things at Moab last year and
> > > > eventually everyone avoided them like the plague. This months JP
> > > > mag lists them among the 10 Jeeps they wouldn't own.
> > > > ...
> > >
> > > A FAMISHED FOX saw some clusters of ripe black grapes hanging from a
> > > trellised vine. She resorted to all her tricks to get at them, but
> wearied
> > > herself in vain, for she could not reach them. At last she turned
away,
> > > hiding her disappointment and saying: "The Grapes are sour, and not
ripe
> > as
> > > I thought."
> > >
> > > --Aesop, pretty darn smart Ancient Greek
> > >
> > > Earle
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
08-23-2003, 09:48 PM
#12
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Tomb Raider Rubicon
Peace!
"Nathan W. Collier" <abuse@A0L.com> wrote in message
news:EqN1b.10501$r15.681050@twister.southeast.rr.c om...
> "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> news:vkenruqvbsvi3e@corp.supernews.com...
> > my overly sensitive Jeeping friends
>
> i guess it must be our fault.
>
>
> > the thing was
> > priced unreasonably high given its content
>
> i dont think so. sure, id love it if it was $5000.
>
> go buy a new sport with the d44 rear option. call up warn and get a rear
> disk conversion (yes, the rear disks DO make one hell of a difference and
is
> an integral function of the rubicon). then call up currie and order a d44
> front (if you want to be an elitist ***, just get the center section if
that
> proves some point). when youre done, call up arb and get lockers front
and
> rear (sorry, thats the closest comparable product like it or not).
> afterwards, get an atlas 2 (dont give me any ---- about chain vs. gear,
its
> the closest thing comparable) and get some form of rocker protection.
when
> youre done with that, get a 1" suspension lift on it, better shocks, and
> some 31" mtrs (i really hope you dont think think the gsa is adequate off
> road). when youre done, total it all up. guess what?
>
> you just paid for a new escalade! :-)
>
>
> > then, due to its restricted
> > production volume, the dealers did their usual opportunistic optioning
and
> > price gouging, luring many of those who bought them out of the "don't
get
> > it dirty it's just a hip car for cruising" crowd.
>
> and none of that makes the rubicon a piece of ---- as your original
message
> suggested.
>
>
> > Those of us who've spent a bundle to build our Jeeps just chuckle.
>
> ......and those of us who are true jeepers are to concerned with what
we're
> doing to worry about how somebody else is doing it or judge them for it.
> jeep and let jeep!
>
>
> > There was absolutely no justification for the price premium Chrysler put
> on
> > the thing.
>
> go buy a new sport with the d44 rear option. call up warn and get a rear
> disk conversion (yes, the rear disks DO make one hell of a difference and
is
> an integral function of the rubicon). then call up currie and order a d44
> front (if you want to be an elitist ***, just get the center section if
that
> proves some point). when youre done, call up arb and get lockers front
and
> rear (sorry, thats the closest comparable product like it or not).
> afterwards, get an atlas 2 (dont give me any ---- about chain vs. gear,
its
> the closest thing comparable) and get some form of rocker protection.
when
> youre done with that, get a 1" suspension lift on it, better shocks, and
> some 31" mtrs (i really hope you dont think think the gsa is adequate off
> road). when youre done, total it all up. guess what?
>
> you just paid for a new escalade! :-)
>
>
> > The content's combined incremental build cost premium to Chrysler
> > can't be much more than $1000 over a D44 Sport.
>
> --------. go buy a new sport with the d44 rear option. call up warn and
> get a rear disk conversion (yes, the rear disks DO make one hell of a
> difference and is an integral function of the rubicon). then call up
currie
> and order a d44 front (if you want to be an elitist ***, just get the
center
> section if that proves some point). when youre done, call up arb and get
> lockers front and rear (sorry, thats the closest comparable product like
it
> or not). afterwards, get an atlas 2 (dont give me any ---- about chain
vs.
> gear, its the closest thing comparable) and get some form of rocker
> protection. when youre done with that, get a 1" suspension lift on it,
> better shocks, and some 31" mtrs (i really hope you dont think think the
gsa
> is adequate off road). when youre done, total it all up. guess what?
>
> you just paid for a new escalade! :-)
>
>
> > Our local dealer was
> > merciful and sold them at sticker.
>
> i bought mine below sticker (after rebate) and the dealer still gave me
> $2000 more than i was trying to sell my trade in for.
>
> > Sorry if I offended any enthusiast Rubicon owners out there, was not my
> > intent and I should have been more specific.
>
> fine. hi gerald, im nathan.
>
> > It's a great product, just riles many of us who loathe the way
> manufacturers and dealers take advantage of consumers.
>
> i think everybody feels manufacturers and dealers stick it to us. had
that
> been your initial statement (instead of veteran jeepers say its a piece of
> ----) i think you would have seen a very different outcome.
>
>
> --
> Nathan W. Collier
> http://7SlotGrille.com
>
>
"Nathan W. Collier" <abuse@A0L.com> wrote in message
news:EqN1b.10501$r15.681050@twister.southeast.rr.c om...
> "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> news:vkenruqvbsvi3e@corp.supernews.com...
> > my overly sensitive Jeeping friends
>
> i guess it must be our fault.
>
>
> > the thing was
> > priced unreasonably high given its content
>
> i dont think so. sure, id love it if it was $5000.
>
> go buy a new sport with the d44 rear option. call up warn and get a rear
> disk conversion (yes, the rear disks DO make one hell of a difference and
is
> an integral function of the rubicon). then call up currie and order a d44
> front (if you want to be an elitist ***, just get the center section if
that
> proves some point). when youre done, call up arb and get lockers front
and
> rear (sorry, thats the closest comparable product like it or not).
> afterwards, get an atlas 2 (dont give me any ---- about chain vs. gear,
its
> the closest thing comparable) and get some form of rocker protection.
when
> youre done with that, get a 1" suspension lift on it, better shocks, and
> some 31" mtrs (i really hope you dont think think the gsa is adequate off
> road). when youre done, total it all up. guess what?
>
> you just paid for a new escalade! :-)
>
>
> > then, due to its restricted
> > production volume, the dealers did their usual opportunistic optioning
and
> > price gouging, luring many of those who bought them out of the "don't
get
> > it dirty it's just a hip car for cruising" crowd.
>
> and none of that makes the rubicon a piece of ---- as your original
message
> suggested.
>
>
> > Those of us who've spent a bundle to build our Jeeps just chuckle.
>
> ......and those of us who are true jeepers are to concerned with what
we're
> doing to worry about how somebody else is doing it or judge them for it.
> jeep and let jeep!
>
>
> > There was absolutely no justification for the price premium Chrysler put
> on
> > the thing.
>
> go buy a new sport with the d44 rear option. call up warn and get a rear
> disk conversion (yes, the rear disks DO make one hell of a difference and
is
> an integral function of the rubicon). then call up currie and order a d44
> front (if you want to be an elitist ***, just get the center section if
that
> proves some point). when youre done, call up arb and get lockers front
and
> rear (sorry, thats the closest comparable product like it or not).
> afterwards, get an atlas 2 (dont give me any ---- about chain vs. gear,
its
> the closest thing comparable) and get some form of rocker protection.
when
> youre done with that, get a 1" suspension lift on it, better shocks, and
> some 31" mtrs (i really hope you dont think think the gsa is adequate off
> road). when youre done, total it all up. guess what?
>
> you just paid for a new escalade! :-)
>
>
> > The content's combined incremental build cost premium to Chrysler
> > can't be much more than $1000 over a D44 Sport.
>
> --------. go buy a new sport with the d44 rear option. call up warn and
> get a rear disk conversion (yes, the rear disks DO make one hell of a
> difference and is an integral function of the rubicon). then call up
currie
> and order a d44 front (if you want to be an elitist ***, just get the
center
> section if that proves some point). when youre done, call up arb and get
> lockers front and rear (sorry, thats the closest comparable product like
it
> or not). afterwards, get an atlas 2 (dont give me any ---- about chain
vs.
> gear, its the closest thing comparable) and get some form of rocker
> protection. when youre done with that, get a 1" suspension lift on it,
> better shocks, and some 31" mtrs (i really hope you dont think think the
gsa
> is adequate off road). when youre done, total it all up. guess what?
>
> you just paid for a new escalade! :-)
>
>
> > Our local dealer was
> > merciful and sold them at sticker.
>
> i bought mine below sticker (after rebate) and the dealer still gave me
> $2000 more than i was trying to sell my trade in for.
>
> > Sorry if I offended any enthusiast Rubicon owners out there, was not my
> > intent and I should have been more specific.
>
> fine. hi gerald, im nathan.
>
> > It's a great product, just riles many of us who loathe the way
> manufacturers and dealers take advantage of consumers.
>
> i think everybody feels manufacturers and dealers stick it to us. had
that
> been your initial statement (instead of veteran jeepers say its a piece of
> ----) i think you would have seen a very different outcome.
>
>
> --
> Nathan W. Collier
> http://7SlotGrille.com
>
>
08-23-2003, 09:48 PM
#13
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Tomb Raider Rubicon
Peace!
"Nathan W. Collier" <abuse@A0L.com> wrote in message
news:EqN1b.10501$r15.681050@twister.southeast.rr.c om...
> "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> news:vkenruqvbsvi3e@corp.supernews.com...
> > my overly sensitive Jeeping friends
>
> i guess it must be our fault.
>
>
> > the thing was
> > priced unreasonably high given its content
>
> i dont think so. sure, id love it if it was $5000.
>
> go buy a new sport with the d44 rear option. call up warn and get a rear
> disk conversion (yes, the rear disks DO make one hell of a difference and
is
> an integral function of the rubicon). then call up currie and order a d44
> front (if you want to be an elitist ***, just get the center section if
that
> proves some point). when youre done, call up arb and get lockers front
and
> rear (sorry, thats the closest comparable product like it or not).
> afterwards, get an atlas 2 (dont give me any ---- about chain vs. gear,
its
> the closest thing comparable) and get some form of rocker protection.
when
> youre done with that, get a 1" suspension lift on it, better shocks, and
> some 31" mtrs (i really hope you dont think think the gsa is adequate off
> road). when youre done, total it all up. guess what?
>
> you just paid for a new escalade! :-)
>
>
> > then, due to its restricted
> > production volume, the dealers did their usual opportunistic optioning
and
> > price gouging, luring many of those who bought them out of the "don't
get
> > it dirty it's just a hip car for cruising" crowd.
>
> and none of that makes the rubicon a piece of ---- as your original
message
> suggested.
>
>
> > Those of us who've spent a bundle to build our Jeeps just chuckle.
>
> ......and those of us who are true jeepers are to concerned with what
we're
> doing to worry about how somebody else is doing it or judge them for it.
> jeep and let jeep!
>
>
> > There was absolutely no justification for the price premium Chrysler put
> on
> > the thing.
>
> go buy a new sport with the d44 rear option. call up warn and get a rear
> disk conversion (yes, the rear disks DO make one hell of a difference and
is
> an integral function of the rubicon). then call up currie and order a d44
> front (if you want to be an elitist ***, just get the center section if
that
> proves some point). when youre done, call up arb and get lockers front
and
> rear (sorry, thats the closest comparable product like it or not).
> afterwards, get an atlas 2 (dont give me any ---- about chain vs. gear,
its
> the closest thing comparable) and get some form of rocker protection.
when
> youre done with that, get a 1" suspension lift on it, better shocks, and
> some 31" mtrs (i really hope you dont think think the gsa is adequate off
> road). when youre done, total it all up. guess what?
>
> you just paid for a new escalade! :-)
>
>
> > The content's combined incremental build cost premium to Chrysler
> > can't be much more than $1000 over a D44 Sport.
>
> --------. go buy a new sport with the d44 rear option. call up warn and
> get a rear disk conversion (yes, the rear disks DO make one hell of a
> difference and is an integral function of the rubicon). then call up
currie
> and order a d44 front (if you want to be an elitist ***, just get the
center
> section if that proves some point). when youre done, call up arb and get
> lockers front and rear (sorry, thats the closest comparable product like
it
> or not). afterwards, get an atlas 2 (dont give me any ---- about chain
vs.
> gear, its the closest thing comparable) and get some form of rocker
> protection. when youre done with that, get a 1" suspension lift on it,
> better shocks, and some 31" mtrs (i really hope you dont think think the
gsa
> is adequate off road). when youre done, total it all up. guess what?
>
> you just paid for a new escalade! :-)
>
>
> > Our local dealer was
> > merciful and sold them at sticker.
>
> i bought mine below sticker (after rebate) and the dealer still gave me
> $2000 more than i was trying to sell my trade in for.
>
> > Sorry if I offended any enthusiast Rubicon owners out there, was not my
> > intent and I should have been more specific.
>
> fine. hi gerald, im nathan.
>
> > It's a great product, just riles many of us who loathe the way
> manufacturers and dealers take advantage of consumers.
>
> i think everybody feels manufacturers and dealers stick it to us. had
that
> been your initial statement (instead of veteran jeepers say its a piece of
> ----) i think you would have seen a very different outcome.
>
>
> --
> Nathan W. Collier
> http://7SlotGrille.com
>
>
"Nathan W. Collier" <abuse@A0L.com> wrote in message
news:EqN1b.10501$r15.681050@twister.southeast.rr.c om...
> "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> news:vkenruqvbsvi3e@corp.supernews.com...
> > my overly sensitive Jeeping friends
>
> i guess it must be our fault.
>
>
> > the thing was
> > priced unreasonably high given its content
>
> i dont think so. sure, id love it if it was $5000.
>
> go buy a new sport with the d44 rear option. call up warn and get a rear
> disk conversion (yes, the rear disks DO make one hell of a difference and
is
> an integral function of the rubicon). then call up currie and order a d44
> front (if you want to be an elitist ***, just get the center section if
that
> proves some point). when youre done, call up arb and get lockers front
and
> rear (sorry, thats the closest comparable product like it or not).
> afterwards, get an atlas 2 (dont give me any ---- about chain vs. gear,
its
> the closest thing comparable) and get some form of rocker protection.
when
> youre done with that, get a 1" suspension lift on it, better shocks, and
> some 31" mtrs (i really hope you dont think think the gsa is adequate off
> road). when youre done, total it all up. guess what?
>
> you just paid for a new escalade! :-)
>
>
> > then, due to its restricted
> > production volume, the dealers did their usual opportunistic optioning
and
> > price gouging, luring many of those who bought them out of the "don't
get
> > it dirty it's just a hip car for cruising" crowd.
>
> and none of that makes the rubicon a piece of ---- as your original
message
> suggested.
>
>
> > Those of us who've spent a bundle to build our Jeeps just chuckle.
>
> ......and those of us who are true jeepers are to concerned with what
we're
> doing to worry about how somebody else is doing it or judge them for it.
> jeep and let jeep!
>
>
> > There was absolutely no justification for the price premium Chrysler put
> on
> > the thing.
>
> go buy a new sport with the d44 rear option. call up warn and get a rear
> disk conversion (yes, the rear disks DO make one hell of a difference and
is
> an integral function of the rubicon). then call up currie and order a d44
> front (if you want to be an elitist ***, just get the center section if
that
> proves some point). when youre done, call up arb and get lockers front
and
> rear (sorry, thats the closest comparable product like it or not).
> afterwards, get an atlas 2 (dont give me any ---- about chain vs. gear,
its
> the closest thing comparable) and get some form of rocker protection.
when
> youre done with that, get a 1" suspension lift on it, better shocks, and
> some 31" mtrs (i really hope you dont think think the gsa is adequate off
> road). when youre done, total it all up. guess what?
>
> you just paid for a new escalade! :-)
>
>
> > The content's combined incremental build cost premium to Chrysler
> > can't be much more than $1000 over a D44 Sport.
>
> --------. go buy a new sport with the d44 rear option. call up warn and
> get a rear disk conversion (yes, the rear disks DO make one hell of a
> difference and is an integral function of the rubicon). then call up
currie
> and order a d44 front (if you want to be an elitist ***, just get the
center
> section if that proves some point). when youre done, call up arb and get
> lockers front and rear (sorry, thats the closest comparable product like
it
> or not). afterwards, get an atlas 2 (dont give me any ---- about chain
vs.
> gear, its the closest thing comparable) and get some form of rocker
> protection. when youre done with that, get a 1" suspension lift on it,
> better shocks, and some 31" mtrs (i really hope you dont think think the
gsa
> is adequate off road). when youre done, total it all up. guess what?
>
> you just paid for a new escalade! :-)
>
>
> > Our local dealer was
> > merciful and sold them at sticker.
>
> i bought mine below sticker (after rebate) and the dealer still gave me
> $2000 more than i was trying to sell my trade in for.
>
> > Sorry if I offended any enthusiast Rubicon owners out there, was not my
> > intent and I should have been more specific.
>
> fine. hi gerald, im nathan.
>
> > It's a great product, just riles many of us who loathe the way
> manufacturers and dealers take advantage of consumers.
>
> i think everybody feels manufacturers and dealers stick it to us. had
that
> been your initial statement (instead of veteran jeepers say its a piece of
> ----) i think you would have seen a very different outcome.
>
>
> --
> Nathan W. Collier
> http://7SlotGrille.com
>
>
08-23-2003, 09:53 PM
#14
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Tomb Raider Rubicon
"Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
news:vkg6il45fles1b@corp.supernews.com...
> Peace!
werd!
--
Nathan W. Collier
http://7SlotGrille.com
news:vkg6il45fles1b@corp.supernews.com...
> Peace!
werd!
--
Nathan W. Collier
http://7SlotGrille.com
08-23-2003, 09:53 PM
#15
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Tomb Raider Rubicon
"Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
news:vkg6il45fles1b@corp.supernews.com...
> Peace!
werd!
--
Nathan W. Collier
http://7SlotGrille.com
news:vkg6il45fles1b@corp.supernews.com...
> Peace!
werd!
--
Nathan W. Collier
http://7SlotGrille.com
08-23-2003, 09:55 PM
#16
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Tomb Raider Rubicon
"Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
news:vkg53ss2033b90@corp.supernews.com...
> Ok, Earle, we were there at 9 AM, stopped at the Sinclair where we always
> air down & buy coffee & snacks for the day. Took my neighbor Jim for his
> first trip around the Alpine Loop. Stopped at American Basin, then headed
> to
> Lake City,. but stopped at a GREAT little surprise of a place in Sherman
> called the A&A Guest Ranch for a fantastic Italian lunch (this place is a
> gem).
>
> We were going to head up to Carson but it was SNOWING on the peaks. Rained
> like an SOB all the way from Lake City back over to Silverton, where we
> stopped at the Conoco to air back up & hose all the clay & muck off the
> YJ.
It rained some here too. Ever tried Poughkeepsie Gulch in the rain?
>
> Oh, hey Earle, I ain't rich, and my girlfriend says I ain't a sissy, but I
> do live in Durango. You've probably seen my rig up there a lot. I have a
> Hunter Green '94 YJ with Dana 44 & ARB front, D60 & Detroit rear, Atlas
> II,
> 35" BFG MTs on Eagles, 4.5" RE suspension, Warn XD9000i, Durango bumpers
> and
> Avalanche rocker guards (shows Avalanche in relief on the side in support
> of
> my friend Steve Rumore). Next time I'm up there (might be tomorrow) throw
> a rock at my Jeep and I'll know it's you.
Hunter green huh? I must have seen twenty rigs like that this summer. Up
here you can't swing a dead cat around without hitting one. The coolest
looking Jeep I saw had half moon yellow smiley face hub caps.
>
> Buy the way Earle, if you want to try out a Rubicon the guy at the
> Conoco has one you can rent.....
>
I live right behind the place. Black house, white FJ40 with a red roof and
Nine Inch Nails logo painted on top sitting next to it, grey (sort of) three
quarter ton Suburban parked behind that. If you don't believe me ask the
guys at the Conoca station who lives there. Why would I want to try out a
Rubicon?
Earle
>
>
> "Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in message
> news:bi7v3b$65loc$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > Heh, like George I could go down to Montrose and buy that new Patriot
> > Rubicon on the lot with cash today, and pay someone to buff off all
those
> > stupid flag decals this afternoon, but I don't need one. I don't even
> need
> > to build one, because the stock YJ that I have is sufficient for my
uses,
> > thank you. I learned to drive off road in places where "rich sissies"
> from
> > California and Texas (like George) would be afraid to walk. I was
> thinking
> > of getting a rear Trash-Lock, but I am not yet convinced I need it.
> >
> > If I were a young guy with a family to raise however, there is no way in
> > hell I would be paying $500 a month for a toy like the Rubicon for
myself.
> >
> > George if you are actually coming to Silverton this AM please spend some
> > money. My friends with the gift shops and restaurants really love "rich
> > sissies" like you, honest!
> >
> > Earle
> >
> > "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> > news:vkenruqvbsvi3e@corp.supernews.com...
> > > Ah, but one can come to the wrong assumptions in haste, can't one? I
> > > presently own three Jeeps and an MB E430 Sport. Price is not the
issue,
> I
> > > can write check for one this morning, thank you.
> > >
> > > My point here, my overly sensitive Jeeping friends, is that the thing
> was
> > > priced unreasonably high given its content, then, due to its
restricted
> > > production volume, the dealers did their usual opportunistic optioning
> and
> > > price gouging, luring many of those who bought them out of the "don't
> get
> > > it dirty it's just a hip car for cruising" crowd.
> > >
> > > Those of us who've spent a bundle to build our Jeeps just chuckle.
> Perhaps
> > > as they get out on the used market more will get into the hands of
true
> > Jeep
> > > enthusiasts, right now the owner base seems to be more attuned the
> quality
> > > of the CD players than the performance of the 4.1 xfer case or the
> > lockers.
> > >
> > > There was absolutely no justification for the price premium Chrysler
put
> > on
> > > the thing. The content's combined incremental build cost premium to
> > Chrysler
> > > can't be much more than $1000 over a D44 Sport. (They could have
simply
> > made
> > > the axles, lockers and xfer case a check-off option.) Folks that
ordered
> > > them from larger metro-area dealerships complain about paying
> over-sticker
> > > premiums and having to take them with silly options they didn't
order,
> > want
> > > or need (yes, power mirrors ARE an option on the Rubicon), or finding
> out
> > > once they arrived that the dealer had peppered the things with glass
> tint,
> > > mud guards, stone shields, etc. Some dealers then told the buyer who
> > ordered
> > > them to "take it or leave it". Typical car dealer BS. Our local dealer
> was
> > > merciful and sold them at sticker.
> > >
> > > Sorry if I offended any enthusiast Rubicon owners out there, was not
my
> > > intent and I should have been more specific. It's a great product,
just
> > > riles many of us who loathe the way manufacturers and dealers take
> > advantage
> > > of consumers.
> > >
> > > ...but, Earle DOES live in God's country and we're heading that way
this
> > AM!
> > >
> > > "Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in
> message
> > > news:bi6msk$5inl2$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > > "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> > > > news:vkdgi0pkuncte3@corp.supernews.com...
> > > > > Frankly, there's getting to be a school of thought among veteran
> > > > > Jeepers that the Rubicon simply SUCKS, mostly due to its owners.
> > > > > There must have been 500 of the things at Moab last year and
> > > > > eventually everyone avoided them like the plague. This months JP
> > > > > mag lists them among the 10 Jeeps they wouldn't own.
> > > > > ...
> > > >
> > > > A FAMISHED FOX saw some clusters of ripe black grapes hanging from a
> > > > trellised vine. She resorted to all her tricks to get at them, but
> > wearied
> > > > herself in vain, for she could not reach them. At last she turned
> away,
> > > > hiding her disappointment and saying: "The Grapes are sour, and not
> ripe
> > > as
> > > > I thought."
> > > >
> > > > --Aesop, pretty darn smart Ancient Greek
> > > >
> > > > Earle
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
news:vkg53ss2033b90@corp.supernews.com...
> Ok, Earle, we were there at 9 AM, stopped at the Sinclair where we always
> air down & buy coffee & snacks for the day. Took my neighbor Jim for his
> first trip around the Alpine Loop. Stopped at American Basin, then headed
> to
> Lake City,. but stopped at a GREAT little surprise of a place in Sherman
> called the A&A Guest Ranch for a fantastic Italian lunch (this place is a
> gem).
>
> We were going to head up to Carson but it was SNOWING on the peaks. Rained
> like an SOB all the way from Lake City back over to Silverton, where we
> stopped at the Conoco to air back up & hose all the clay & muck off the
> YJ.
It rained some here too. Ever tried Poughkeepsie Gulch in the rain?
>
> Oh, hey Earle, I ain't rich, and my girlfriend says I ain't a sissy, but I
> do live in Durango. You've probably seen my rig up there a lot. I have a
> Hunter Green '94 YJ with Dana 44 & ARB front, D60 & Detroit rear, Atlas
> II,
> 35" BFG MTs on Eagles, 4.5" RE suspension, Warn XD9000i, Durango bumpers
> and
> Avalanche rocker guards (shows Avalanche in relief on the side in support
> of
> my friend Steve Rumore). Next time I'm up there (might be tomorrow) throw
> a rock at my Jeep and I'll know it's you.
Hunter green huh? I must have seen twenty rigs like that this summer. Up
here you can't swing a dead cat around without hitting one. The coolest
looking Jeep I saw had half moon yellow smiley face hub caps.
>
> Buy the way Earle, if you want to try out a Rubicon the guy at the
> Conoco has one you can rent.....
>
I live right behind the place. Black house, white FJ40 with a red roof and
Nine Inch Nails logo painted on top sitting next to it, grey (sort of) three
quarter ton Suburban parked behind that. If you don't believe me ask the
guys at the Conoca station who lives there. Why would I want to try out a
Rubicon?
Earle
>
>
> "Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in message
> news:bi7v3b$65loc$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > Heh, like George I could go down to Montrose and buy that new Patriot
> > Rubicon on the lot with cash today, and pay someone to buff off all
those
> > stupid flag decals this afternoon, but I don't need one. I don't even
> need
> > to build one, because the stock YJ that I have is sufficient for my
uses,
> > thank you. I learned to drive off road in places where "rich sissies"
> from
> > California and Texas (like George) would be afraid to walk. I was
> thinking
> > of getting a rear Trash-Lock, but I am not yet convinced I need it.
> >
> > If I were a young guy with a family to raise however, there is no way in
> > hell I would be paying $500 a month for a toy like the Rubicon for
myself.
> >
> > George if you are actually coming to Silverton this AM please spend some
> > money. My friends with the gift shops and restaurants really love "rich
> > sissies" like you, honest!
> >
> > Earle
> >
> > "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> > news:vkenruqvbsvi3e@corp.supernews.com...
> > > Ah, but one can come to the wrong assumptions in haste, can't one? I
> > > presently own three Jeeps and an MB E430 Sport. Price is not the
issue,
> I
> > > can write check for one this morning, thank you.
> > >
> > > My point here, my overly sensitive Jeeping friends, is that the thing
> was
> > > priced unreasonably high given its content, then, due to its
restricted
> > > production volume, the dealers did their usual opportunistic optioning
> and
> > > price gouging, luring many of those who bought them out of the "don't
> get
> > > it dirty it's just a hip car for cruising" crowd.
> > >
> > > Those of us who've spent a bundle to build our Jeeps just chuckle.
> Perhaps
> > > as they get out on the used market more will get into the hands of
true
> > Jeep
> > > enthusiasts, right now the owner base seems to be more attuned the
> quality
> > > of the CD players than the performance of the 4.1 xfer case or the
> > lockers.
> > >
> > > There was absolutely no justification for the price premium Chrysler
put
> > on
> > > the thing. The content's combined incremental build cost premium to
> > Chrysler
> > > can't be much more than $1000 over a D44 Sport. (They could have
simply
> > made
> > > the axles, lockers and xfer case a check-off option.) Folks that
ordered
> > > them from larger metro-area dealerships complain about paying
> over-sticker
> > > premiums and having to take them with silly options they didn't
order,
> > want
> > > or need (yes, power mirrors ARE an option on the Rubicon), or finding
> out
> > > once they arrived that the dealer had peppered the things with glass
> tint,
> > > mud guards, stone shields, etc. Some dealers then told the buyer who
> > ordered
> > > them to "take it or leave it". Typical car dealer BS. Our local dealer
> was
> > > merciful and sold them at sticker.
> > >
> > > Sorry if I offended any enthusiast Rubicon owners out there, was not
my
> > > intent and I should have been more specific. It's a great product,
just
> > > riles many of us who loathe the way manufacturers and dealers take
> > advantage
> > > of consumers.
> > >
> > > ...but, Earle DOES live in God's country and we're heading that way
this
> > AM!
> > >
> > > "Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in
> message
> > > news:bi6msk$5inl2$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > > "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> > > > news:vkdgi0pkuncte3@corp.supernews.com...
> > > > > Frankly, there's getting to be a school of thought among veteran
> > > > > Jeepers that the Rubicon simply SUCKS, mostly due to its owners.
> > > > > There must have been 500 of the things at Moab last year and
> > > > > eventually everyone avoided them like the plague. This months JP
> > > > > mag lists them among the 10 Jeeps they wouldn't own.
> > > > > ...
> > > >
> > > > A FAMISHED FOX saw some clusters of ripe black grapes hanging from a
> > > > trellised vine. She resorted to all her tricks to get at them, but
> > wearied
> > > > herself in vain, for she could not reach them. At last she turned
> away,
> > > > hiding her disappointment and saying: "The Grapes are sour, and not
> ripe
> > > as
> > > > I thought."
> > > >
> > > > --Aesop, pretty darn smart Ancient Greek
> > > >
> > > > Earle
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
08-23-2003, 09:55 PM
#17
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Tomb Raider Rubicon
"Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
news:vkg53ss2033b90@corp.supernews.com...
> Ok, Earle, we were there at 9 AM, stopped at the Sinclair where we always
> air down & buy coffee & snacks for the day. Took my neighbor Jim for his
> first trip around the Alpine Loop. Stopped at American Basin, then headed
> to
> Lake City,. but stopped at a GREAT little surprise of a place in Sherman
> called the A&A Guest Ranch for a fantastic Italian lunch (this place is a
> gem).
>
> We were going to head up to Carson but it was SNOWING on the peaks. Rained
> like an SOB all the way from Lake City back over to Silverton, where we
> stopped at the Conoco to air back up & hose all the clay & muck off the
> YJ.
It rained some here too. Ever tried Poughkeepsie Gulch in the rain?
>
> Oh, hey Earle, I ain't rich, and my girlfriend says I ain't a sissy, but I
> do live in Durango. You've probably seen my rig up there a lot. I have a
> Hunter Green '94 YJ with Dana 44 & ARB front, D60 & Detroit rear, Atlas
> II,
> 35" BFG MTs on Eagles, 4.5" RE suspension, Warn XD9000i, Durango bumpers
> and
> Avalanche rocker guards (shows Avalanche in relief on the side in support
> of
> my friend Steve Rumore). Next time I'm up there (might be tomorrow) throw
> a rock at my Jeep and I'll know it's you.
Hunter green huh? I must have seen twenty rigs like that this summer. Up
here you can't swing a dead cat around without hitting one. The coolest
looking Jeep I saw had half moon yellow smiley face hub caps.
>
> Buy the way Earle, if you want to try out a Rubicon the guy at the
> Conoco has one you can rent.....
>
I live right behind the place. Black house, white FJ40 with a red roof and
Nine Inch Nails logo painted on top sitting next to it, grey (sort of) three
quarter ton Suburban parked behind that. If you don't believe me ask the
guys at the Conoca station who lives there. Why would I want to try out a
Rubicon?
Earle
>
>
> "Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in message
> news:bi7v3b$65loc$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > Heh, like George I could go down to Montrose and buy that new Patriot
> > Rubicon on the lot with cash today, and pay someone to buff off all
those
> > stupid flag decals this afternoon, but I don't need one. I don't even
> need
> > to build one, because the stock YJ that I have is sufficient for my
uses,
> > thank you. I learned to drive off road in places where "rich sissies"
> from
> > California and Texas (like George) would be afraid to walk. I was
> thinking
> > of getting a rear Trash-Lock, but I am not yet convinced I need it.
> >
> > If I were a young guy with a family to raise however, there is no way in
> > hell I would be paying $500 a month for a toy like the Rubicon for
myself.
> >
> > George if you are actually coming to Silverton this AM please spend some
> > money. My friends with the gift shops and restaurants really love "rich
> > sissies" like you, honest!
> >
> > Earle
> >
> > "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> > news:vkenruqvbsvi3e@corp.supernews.com...
> > > Ah, but one can come to the wrong assumptions in haste, can't one? I
> > > presently own three Jeeps and an MB E430 Sport. Price is not the
issue,
> I
> > > can write check for one this morning, thank you.
> > >
> > > My point here, my overly sensitive Jeeping friends, is that the thing
> was
> > > priced unreasonably high given its content, then, due to its
restricted
> > > production volume, the dealers did their usual opportunistic optioning
> and
> > > price gouging, luring many of those who bought them out of the "don't
> get
> > > it dirty it's just a hip car for cruising" crowd.
> > >
> > > Those of us who've spent a bundle to build our Jeeps just chuckle.
> Perhaps
> > > as they get out on the used market more will get into the hands of
true
> > Jeep
> > > enthusiasts, right now the owner base seems to be more attuned the
> quality
> > > of the CD players than the performance of the 4.1 xfer case or the
> > lockers.
> > >
> > > There was absolutely no justification for the price premium Chrysler
put
> > on
> > > the thing. The content's combined incremental build cost premium to
> > Chrysler
> > > can't be much more than $1000 over a D44 Sport. (They could have
simply
> > made
> > > the axles, lockers and xfer case a check-off option.) Folks that
ordered
> > > them from larger metro-area dealerships complain about paying
> over-sticker
> > > premiums and having to take them with silly options they didn't
order,
> > want
> > > or need (yes, power mirrors ARE an option on the Rubicon), or finding
> out
> > > once they arrived that the dealer had peppered the things with glass
> tint,
> > > mud guards, stone shields, etc. Some dealers then told the buyer who
> > ordered
> > > them to "take it or leave it". Typical car dealer BS. Our local dealer
> was
> > > merciful and sold them at sticker.
> > >
> > > Sorry if I offended any enthusiast Rubicon owners out there, was not
my
> > > intent and I should have been more specific. It's a great product,
just
> > > riles many of us who loathe the way manufacturers and dealers take
> > advantage
> > > of consumers.
> > >
> > > ...but, Earle DOES live in God's country and we're heading that way
this
> > AM!
> > >
> > > "Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in
> message
> > > news:bi6msk$5inl2$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > > "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> > > > news:vkdgi0pkuncte3@corp.supernews.com...
> > > > > Frankly, there's getting to be a school of thought among veteran
> > > > > Jeepers that the Rubicon simply SUCKS, mostly due to its owners.
> > > > > There must have been 500 of the things at Moab last year and
> > > > > eventually everyone avoided them like the plague. This months JP
> > > > > mag lists them among the 10 Jeeps they wouldn't own.
> > > > > ...
> > > >
> > > > A FAMISHED FOX saw some clusters of ripe black grapes hanging from a
> > > > trellised vine. She resorted to all her tricks to get at them, but
> > wearied
> > > > herself in vain, for she could not reach them. At last she turned
> away,
> > > > hiding her disappointment and saying: "The Grapes are sour, and not
> ripe
> > > as
> > > > I thought."
> > > >
> > > > --Aesop, pretty darn smart Ancient Greek
> > > >
> > > > Earle
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
news:vkg53ss2033b90@corp.supernews.com...
> Ok, Earle, we were there at 9 AM, stopped at the Sinclair where we always
> air down & buy coffee & snacks for the day. Took my neighbor Jim for his
> first trip around the Alpine Loop. Stopped at American Basin, then headed
> to
> Lake City,. but stopped at a GREAT little surprise of a place in Sherman
> called the A&A Guest Ranch for a fantastic Italian lunch (this place is a
> gem).
>
> We were going to head up to Carson but it was SNOWING on the peaks. Rained
> like an SOB all the way from Lake City back over to Silverton, where we
> stopped at the Conoco to air back up & hose all the clay & muck off the
> YJ.
It rained some here too. Ever tried Poughkeepsie Gulch in the rain?
>
> Oh, hey Earle, I ain't rich, and my girlfriend says I ain't a sissy, but I
> do live in Durango. You've probably seen my rig up there a lot. I have a
> Hunter Green '94 YJ with Dana 44 & ARB front, D60 & Detroit rear, Atlas
> II,
> 35" BFG MTs on Eagles, 4.5" RE suspension, Warn XD9000i, Durango bumpers
> and
> Avalanche rocker guards (shows Avalanche in relief on the side in support
> of
> my friend Steve Rumore). Next time I'm up there (might be tomorrow) throw
> a rock at my Jeep and I'll know it's you.
Hunter green huh? I must have seen twenty rigs like that this summer. Up
here you can't swing a dead cat around without hitting one. The coolest
looking Jeep I saw had half moon yellow smiley face hub caps.
>
> Buy the way Earle, if you want to try out a Rubicon the guy at the
> Conoco has one you can rent.....
>
I live right behind the place. Black house, white FJ40 with a red roof and
Nine Inch Nails logo painted on top sitting next to it, grey (sort of) three
quarter ton Suburban parked behind that. If you don't believe me ask the
guys at the Conoca station who lives there. Why would I want to try out a
Rubicon?
Earle
>
>
> "Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in message
> news:bi7v3b$65loc$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > Heh, like George I could go down to Montrose and buy that new Patriot
> > Rubicon on the lot with cash today, and pay someone to buff off all
those
> > stupid flag decals this afternoon, but I don't need one. I don't even
> need
> > to build one, because the stock YJ that I have is sufficient for my
uses,
> > thank you. I learned to drive off road in places where "rich sissies"
> from
> > California and Texas (like George) would be afraid to walk. I was
> thinking
> > of getting a rear Trash-Lock, but I am not yet convinced I need it.
> >
> > If I were a young guy with a family to raise however, there is no way in
> > hell I would be paying $500 a month for a toy like the Rubicon for
myself.
> >
> > George if you are actually coming to Silverton this AM please spend some
> > money. My friends with the gift shops and restaurants really love "rich
> > sissies" like you, honest!
> >
> > Earle
> >
> > "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> > news:vkenruqvbsvi3e@corp.supernews.com...
> > > Ah, but one can come to the wrong assumptions in haste, can't one? I
> > > presently own three Jeeps and an MB E430 Sport. Price is not the
issue,
> I
> > > can write check for one this morning, thank you.
> > >
> > > My point here, my overly sensitive Jeeping friends, is that the thing
> was
> > > priced unreasonably high given its content, then, due to its
restricted
> > > production volume, the dealers did their usual opportunistic optioning
> and
> > > price gouging, luring many of those who bought them out of the "don't
> get
> > > it dirty it's just a hip car for cruising" crowd.
> > >
> > > Those of us who've spent a bundle to build our Jeeps just chuckle.
> Perhaps
> > > as they get out on the used market more will get into the hands of
true
> > Jeep
> > > enthusiasts, right now the owner base seems to be more attuned the
> quality
> > > of the CD players than the performance of the 4.1 xfer case or the
> > lockers.
> > >
> > > There was absolutely no justification for the price premium Chrysler
put
> > on
> > > the thing. The content's combined incremental build cost premium to
> > Chrysler
> > > can't be much more than $1000 over a D44 Sport. (They could have
simply
> > made
> > > the axles, lockers and xfer case a check-off option.) Folks that
ordered
> > > them from larger metro-area dealerships complain about paying
> over-sticker
> > > premiums and having to take them with silly options they didn't
order,
> > want
> > > or need (yes, power mirrors ARE an option on the Rubicon), or finding
> out
> > > once they arrived that the dealer had peppered the things with glass
> tint,
> > > mud guards, stone shields, etc. Some dealers then told the buyer who
> > ordered
> > > them to "take it or leave it". Typical car dealer BS. Our local dealer
> was
> > > merciful and sold them at sticker.
> > >
> > > Sorry if I offended any enthusiast Rubicon owners out there, was not
my
> > > intent and I should have been more specific. It's a great product,
just
> > > riles many of us who loathe the way manufacturers and dealers take
> > advantage
> > > of consumers.
> > >
> > > ...but, Earle DOES live in God's country and we're heading that way
this
> > AM!
> > >
> > > "Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in
> message
> > > news:bi6msk$5inl2$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > > "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> > > > news:vkdgi0pkuncte3@corp.supernews.com...
> > > > > Frankly, there's getting to be a school of thought among veteran
> > > > > Jeepers that the Rubicon simply SUCKS, mostly due to its owners.
> > > > > There must have been 500 of the things at Moab last year and
> > > > > eventually everyone avoided them like the plague. This months JP
> > > > > mag lists them among the 10 Jeeps they wouldn't own.
> > > > > ...
> > > >
> > > > A FAMISHED FOX saw some clusters of ripe black grapes hanging from a
> > > > trellised vine. She resorted to all her tricks to get at them, but
> > wearied
> > > > herself in vain, for she could not reach them. At last she turned
> away,
> > > > hiding her disappointment and saying: "The Grapes are sour, and not
> ripe
> > > as
> > > > I thought."
> > > >
> > > > --Aesop, pretty darn smart Ancient Greek
> > > >
> > > > Earle
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
08-23-2003, 10:12 PM
#18
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Tomb Raider Rubicon
Why try a Rubicon? Hey, you don't want to miss out on the action, do you?
(He removed the locker switch before someone locked themselves off a shelf.)
Actually Poughkeepsie is the only trail up there I've not done. Can't get a
group from here to go up and do it, and our local club (Creeper Jeepers)
sponsors Black Bear and Blanca Peak trail, so everyone's always tied up
doing trail repair, etc. Anyway, heard it's kinda sloppy!
"Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in message
news:bi96i2$6sd17$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> news:vkg53ss2033b90@corp.supernews.com...
> > Ok, Earle, we were there at 9 AM, stopped at the Sinclair where we
always
> > air down & buy coffee & snacks for the day. Took my neighbor Jim for his
> > first trip around the Alpine Loop. Stopped at American Basin, then
headed
> > to
> > Lake City,. but stopped at a GREAT little surprise of a place in Sherman
> > called the A&A Guest Ranch for a fantastic Italian lunch (this place is
a
> > gem).
> >
> > We were going to head up to Carson but it was SNOWING on the peaks.
Rained
> > like an SOB all the way from Lake City back over to Silverton, where we
> > stopped at the Conoco to air back up & hose all the clay & muck off the
> > YJ.
>
> It rained some here too. Ever tried Poughkeepsie Gulch in the rain?
>
> >
> > Oh, hey Earle, I ain't rich, and my girlfriend says I ain't a sissy, but
I
> > do live in Durango. You've probably seen my rig up there a lot. I have a
> > Hunter Green '94 YJ with Dana 44 & ARB front, D60 & Detroit rear, Atlas
> > II,
> > 35" BFG MTs on Eagles, 4.5" RE suspension, Warn XD9000i, Durango bumpers
> > and
> > Avalanche rocker guards (shows Avalanche in relief on the side in
support
> > of
> > my friend Steve Rumore). Next time I'm up there (might be tomorrow)
throw
> > a rock at my Jeep and I'll know it's you.
>
> Hunter green huh? I must have seen twenty rigs like that this summer. Up
> here you can't swing a dead cat around without hitting one. The coolest
> looking Jeep I saw had half moon yellow smiley face hub caps.
>
> >
> > Buy the way Earle, if you want to try out a Rubicon the guy at the
> > Conoco has one you can rent.....
> >
>
> I live right behind the place. Black house, white FJ40 with a red roof
and
> Nine Inch Nails logo painted on top sitting next to it, grey (sort of)
three
> quarter ton Suburban parked behind that. If you don't believe me ask the
> guys at the Conoca station who lives there. Why would I want to try out a
> Rubicon?
>
> Earle
>
> >
> >
> > "Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in
message
> > news:bi7v3b$65loc$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > Heh, like George I could go down to Montrose and buy that new Patriot
> > > Rubicon on the lot with cash today, and pay someone to buff off all
> those
> > > stupid flag decals this afternoon, but I don't need one. I don't even
> > need
> > > to build one, because the stock YJ that I have is sufficient for my
> uses,
> > > thank you. I learned to drive off road in places where "rich sissies"
> > from
> > > California and Texas (like George) would be afraid to walk. I was
> > thinking
> > > of getting a rear Trash-Lock, but I am not yet convinced I need it.
> > >
> > > If I were a young guy with a family to raise however, there is no way
in
> > > hell I would be paying $500 a month for a toy like the Rubicon for
> myself.
> > >
> > > George if you are actually coming to Silverton this AM please spend
some
> > > money. My friends with the gift shops and restaurants really love
"rich
> > > sissies" like you, honest!
> > >
> > > Earle
> > >
> > > "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> > > news:vkenruqvbsvi3e@corp.supernews.com...
> > > > Ah, but one can come to the wrong assumptions in haste, can't one? I
> > > > presently own three Jeeps and an MB E430 Sport. Price is not the
> issue,
> > I
> > > > can write check for one this morning, thank you.
> > > >
> > > > My point here, my overly sensitive Jeeping friends, is that the
thing
> > was
> > > > priced unreasonably high given its content, then, due to its
> restricted
> > > > production volume, the dealers did their usual opportunistic
optioning
> > and
> > > > price gouging, luring many of those who bought them out of the
"don't
> > get
> > > > it dirty it's just a hip car for cruising" crowd.
> > > >
> > > > Those of us who've spent a bundle to build our Jeeps just chuckle.
> > Perhaps
> > > > as they get out on the used market more will get into the hands of
> true
> > > Jeep
> > > > enthusiasts, right now the owner base seems to be more attuned the
> > quality
> > > > of the CD players than the performance of the 4.1 xfer case or the
> > > lockers.
> > > >
> > > > There was absolutely no justification for the price premium Chrysler
> put
> > > on
> > > > the thing. The content's combined incremental build cost premium to
> > > Chrysler
> > > > can't be much more than $1000 over a D44 Sport. (They could have
> simply
> > > made
> > > > the axles, lockers and xfer case a check-off option.) Folks that
> ordered
> > > > them from larger metro-area dealerships complain about paying
> > over-sticker
> > > > premiums and having to take them with silly options they didn't
> order,
> > > want
> > > > or need (yes, power mirrors ARE an option on the Rubicon), or
finding
> > out
> > > > once they arrived that the dealer had peppered the things with glass
> > tint,
> > > > mud guards, stone shields, etc. Some dealers then told the buyer who
> > > ordered
> > > > them to "take it or leave it". Typical car dealer BS. Our local
dealer
> > was
> > > > merciful and sold them at sticker.
> > > >
> > > > Sorry if I offended any enthusiast Rubicon owners out there, was not
> my
> > > > intent and I should have been more specific. It's a great product,
> just
> > > > riles many of us who loathe the way manufacturers and dealers take
> > > advantage
> > > > of consumers.
> > > >
> > > > ...but, Earle DOES live in God's country and we're heading that way
> this
> > > AM!
> > > >
> > > > "Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in
> > message
> > > > news:bi6msk$5inl2$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > > > "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> > > > > news:vkdgi0pkuncte3@corp.supernews.com...
> > > > > > Frankly, there's getting to be a school of thought among veteran
> > > > > > Jeepers that the Rubicon simply SUCKS, mostly due to its owners.
> > > > > > There must have been 500 of the things at Moab last year and
> > > > > > eventually everyone avoided them like the plague. This months JP
> > > > > > mag lists them among the 10 Jeeps they wouldn't own.
> > > > > > ...
> > > > >
> > > > > A FAMISHED FOX saw some clusters of ripe black grapes hanging from
a
> > > > > trellised vine. She resorted to all her tricks to get at them, but
> > > wearied
> > > > > herself in vain, for she could not reach them. At last she turned
> > away,
> > > > > hiding her disappointment and saying: "The Grapes are sour, and
not
> > ripe
> > > > as
> > > > > I thought."
> > > > >
> > > > > --Aesop, pretty darn smart Ancient Greek
> > > > >
> > > > > Earle
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
>
(He removed the locker switch before someone locked themselves off a shelf.)
Actually Poughkeepsie is the only trail up there I've not done. Can't get a
group from here to go up and do it, and our local club (Creeper Jeepers)
sponsors Black Bear and Blanca Peak trail, so everyone's always tied up
doing trail repair, etc. Anyway, heard it's kinda sloppy!
"Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in message
news:bi96i2$6sd17$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> news:vkg53ss2033b90@corp.supernews.com...
> > Ok, Earle, we were there at 9 AM, stopped at the Sinclair where we
always
> > air down & buy coffee & snacks for the day. Took my neighbor Jim for his
> > first trip around the Alpine Loop. Stopped at American Basin, then
headed
> > to
> > Lake City,. but stopped at a GREAT little surprise of a place in Sherman
> > called the A&A Guest Ranch for a fantastic Italian lunch (this place is
a
> > gem).
> >
> > We were going to head up to Carson but it was SNOWING on the peaks.
Rained
> > like an SOB all the way from Lake City back over to Silverton, where we
> > stopped at the Conoco to air back up & hose all the clay & muck off the
> > YJ.
>
> It rained some here too. Ever tried Poughkeepsie Gulch in the rain?
>
> >
> > Oh, hey Earle, I ain't rich, and my girlfriend says I ain't a sissy, but
I
> > do live in Durango. You've probably seen my rig up there a lot. I have a
> > Hunter Green '94 YJ with Dana 44 & ARB front, D60 & Detroit rear, Atlas
> > II,
> > 35" BFG MTs on Eagles, 4.5" RE suspension, Warn XD9000i, Durango bumpers
> > and
> > Avalanche rocker guards (shows Avalanche in relief on the side in
support
> > of
> > my friend Steve Rumore). Next time I'm up there (might be tomorrow)
throw
> > a rock at my Jeep and I'll know it's you.
>
> Hunter green huh? I must have seen twenty rigs like that this summer. Up
> here you can't swing a dead cat around without hitting one. The coolest
> looking Jeep I saw had half moon yellow smiley face hub caps.
>
> >
> > Buy the way Earle, if you want to try out a Rubicon the guy at the
> > Conoco has one you can rent.....
> >
>
> I live right behind the place. Black house, white FJ40 with a red roof
and
> Nine Inch Nails logo painted on top sitting next to it, grey (sort of)
three
> quarter ton Suburban parked behind that. If you don't believe me ask the
> guys at the Conoca station who lives there. Why would I want to try out a
> Rubicon?
>
> Earle
>
> >
> >
> > "Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in
message
> > news:bi7v3b$65loc$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > Heh, like George I could go down to Montrose and buy that new Patriot
> > > Rubicon on the lot with cash today, and pay someone to buff off all
> those
> > > stupid flag decals this afternoon, but I don't need one. I don't even
> > need
> > > to build one, because the stock YJ that I have is sufficient for my
> uses,
> > > thank you. I learned to drive off road in places where "rich sissies"
> > from
> > > California and Texas (like George) would be afraid to walk. I was
> > thinking
> > > of getting a rear Trash-Lock, but I am not yet convinced I need it.
> > >
> > > If I were a young guy with a family to raise however, there is no way
in
> > > hell I would be paying $500 a month for a toy like the Rubicon for
> myself.
> > >
> > > George if you are actually coming to Silverton this AM please spend
some
> > > money. My friends with the gift shops and restaurants really love
"rich
> > > sissies" like you, honest!
> > >
> > > Earle
> > >
> > > "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> > > news:vkenruqvbsvi3e@corp.supernews.com...
> > > > Ah, but one can come to the wrong assumptions in haste, can't one? I
> > > > presently own three Jeeps and an MB E430 Sport. Price is not the
> issue,
> > I
> > > > can write check for one this morning, thank you.
> > > >
> > > > My point here, my overly sensitive Jeeping friends, is that the
thing
> > was
> > > > priced unreasonably high given its content, then, due to its
> restricted
> > > > production volume, the dealers did their usual opportunistic
optioning
> > and
> > > > price gouging, luring many of those who bought them out of the
"don't
> > get
> > > > it dirty it's just a hip car for cruising" crowd.
> > > >
> > > > Those of us who've spent a bundle to build our Jeeps just chuckle.
> > Perhaps
> > > > as they get out on the used market more will get into the hands of
> true
> > > Jeep
> > > > enthusiasts, right now the owner base seems to be more attuned the
> > quality
> > > > of the CD players than the performance of the 4.1 xfer case or the
> > > lockers.
> > > >
> > > > There was absolutely no justification for the price premium Chrysler
> put
> > > on
> > > > the thing. The content's combined incremental build cost premium to
> > > Chrysler
> > > > can't be much more than $1000 over a D44 Sport. (They could have
> simply
> > > made
> > > > the axles, lockers and xfer case a check-off option.) Folks that
> ordered
> > > > them from larger metro-area dealerships complain about paying
> > over-sticker
> > > > premiums and having to take them with silly options they didn't
> order,
> > > want
> > > > or need (yes, power mirrors ARE an option on the Rubicon), or
finding
> > out
> > > > once they arrived that the dealer had peppered the things with glass
> > tint,
> > > > mud guards, stone shields, etc. Some dealers then told the buyer who
> > > ordered
> > > > them to "take it or leave it". Typical car dealer BS. Our local
dealer
> > was
> > > > merciful and sold them at sticker.
> > > >
> > > > Sorry if I offended any enthusiast Rubicon owners out there, was not
> my
> > > > intent and I should have been more specific. It's a great product,
> just
> > > > riles many of us who loathe the way manufacturers and dealers take
> > > advantage
> > > > of consumers.
> > > >
> > > > ...but, Earle DOES live in God's country and we're heading that way
> this
> > > AM!
> > > >
> > > > "Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in
> > message
> > > > news:bi6msk$5inl2$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > > > "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> > > > > news:vkdgi0pkuncte3@corp.supernews.com...
> > > > > > Frankly, there's getting to be a school of thought among veteran
> > > > > > Jeepers that the Rubicon simply SUCKS, mostly due to its owners.
> > > > > > There must have been 500 of the things at Moab last year and
> > > > > > eventually everyone avoided them like the plague. This months JP
> > > > > > mag lists them among the 10 Jeeps they wouldn't own.
> > > > > > ...
> > > > >
> > > > > A FAMISHED FOX saw some clusters of ripe black grapes hanging from
a
> > > > > trellised vine. She resorted to all her tricks to get at them, but
> > > wearied
> > > > > herself in vain, for she could not reach them. At last she turned
> > away,
> > > > > hiding her disappointment and saying: "The Grapes are sour, and
not
> > ripe
> > > > as
> > > > > I thought."
> > > > >
> > > > > --Aesop, pretty darn smart Ancient Greek
> > > > >
> > > > > Earle
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
>
08-23-2003, 10:12 PM
#19
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Tomb Raider Rubicon
Why try a Rubicon? Hey, you don't want to miss out on the action, do you?
(He removed the locker switch before someone locked themselves off a shelf.)
Actually Poughkeepsie is the only trail up there I've not done. Can't get a
group from here to go up and do it, and our local club (Creeper Jeepers)
sponsors Black Bear and Blanca Peak trail, so everyone's always tied up
doing trail repair, etc. Anyway, heard it's kinda sloppy!
"Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in message
news:bi96i2$6sd17$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> news:vkg53ss2033b90@corp.supernews.com...
> > Ok, Earle, we were there at 9 AM, stopped at the Sinclair where we
always
> > air down & buy coffee & snacks for the day. Took my neighbor Jim for his
> > first trip around the Alpine Loop. Stopped at American Basin, then
headed
> > to
> > Lake City,. but stopped at a GREAT little surprise of a place in Sherman
> > called the A&A Guest Ranch for a fantastic Italian lunch (this place is
a
> > gem).
> >
> > We were going to head up to Carson but it was SNOWING on the peaks.
Rained
> > like an SOB all the way from Lake City back over to Silverton, where we
> > stopped at the Conoco to air back up & hose all the clay & muck off the
> > YJ.
>
> It rained some here too. Ever tried Poughkeepsie Gulch in the rain?
>
> >
> > Oh, hey Earle, I ain't rich, and my girlfriend says I ain't a sissy, but
I
> > do live in Durango. You've probably seen my rig up there a lot. I have a
> > Hunter Green '94 YJ with Dana 44 & ARB front, D60 & Detroit rear, Atlas
> > II,
> > 35" BFG MTs on Eagles, 4.5" RE suspension, Warn XD9000i, Durango bumpers
> > and
> > Avalanche rocker guards (shows Avalanche in relief on the side in
support
> > of
> > my friend Steve Rumore). Next time I'm up there (might be tomorrow)
throw
> > a rock at my Jeep and I'll know it's you.
>
> Hunter green huh? I must have seen twenty rigs like that this summer. Up
> here you can't swing a dead cat around without hitting one. The coolest
> looking Jeep I saw had half moon yellow smiley face hub caps.
>
> >
> > Buy the way Earle, if you want to try out a Rubicon the guy at the
> > Conoco has one you can rent.....
> >
>
> I live right behind the place. Black house, white FJ40 with a red roof
and
> Nine Inch Nails logo painted on top sitting next to it, grey (sort of)
three
> quarter ton Suburban parked behind that. If you don't believe me ask the
> guys at the Conoca station who lives there. Why would I want to try out a
> Rubicon?
>
> Earle
>
> >
> >
> > "Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in
message
> > news:bi7v3b$65loc$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > Heh, like George I could go down to Montrose and buy that new Patriot
> > > Rubicon on the lot with cash today, and pay someone to buff off all
> those
> > > stupid flag decals this afternoon, but I don't need one. I don't even
> > need
> > > to build one, because the stock YJ that I have is sufficient for my
> uses,
> > > thank you. I learned to drive off road in places where "rich sissies"
> > from
> > > California and Texas (like George) would be afraid to walk. I was
> > thinking
> > > of getting a rear Trash-Lock, but I am not yet convinced I need it.
> > >
> > > If I were a young guy with a family to raise however, there is no way
in
> > > hell I would be paying $500 a month for a toy like the Rubicon for
> myself.
> > >
> > > George if you are actually coming to Silverton this AM please spend
some
> > > money. My friends with the gift shops and restaurants really love
"rich
> > > sissies" like you, honest!
> > >
> > > Earle
> > >
> > > "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> > > news:vkenruqvbsvi3e@corp.supernews.com...
> > > > Ah, but one can come to the wrong assumptions in haste, can't one? I
> > > > presently own three Jeeps and an MB E430 Sport. Price is not the
> issue,
> > I
> > > > can write check for one this morning, thank you.
> > > >
> > > > My point here, my overly sensitive Jeeping friends, is that the
thing
> > was
> > > > priced unreasonably high given its content, then, due to its
> restricted
> > > > production volume, the dealers did their usual opportunistic
optioning
> > and
> > > > price gouging, luring many of those who bought them out of the
"don't
> > get
> > > > it dirty it's just a hip car for cruising" crowd.
> > > >
> > > > Those of us who've spent a bundle to build our Jeeps just chuckle.
> > Perhaps
> > > > as they get out on the used market more will get into the hands of
> true
> > > Jeep
> > > > enthusiasts, right now the owner base seems to be more attuned the
> > quality
> > > > of the CD players than the performance of the 4.1 xfer case or the
> > > lockers.
> > > >
> > > > There was absolutely no justification for the price premium Chrysler
> put
> > > on
> > > > the thing. The content's combined incremental build cost premium to
> > > Chrysler
> > > > can't be much more than $1000 over a D44 Sport. (They could have
> simply
> > > made
> > > > the axles, lockers and xfer case a check-off option.) Folks that
> ordered
> > > > them from larger metro-area dealerships complain about paying
> > over-sticker
> > > > premiums and having to take them with silly options they didn't
> order,
> > > want
> > > > or need (yes, power mirrors ARE an option on the Rubicon), or
finding
> > out
> > > > once they arrived that the dealer had peppered the things with glass
> > tint,
> > > > mud guards, stone shields, etc. Some dealers then told the buyer who
> > > ordered
> > > > them to "take it or leave it". Typical car dealer BS. Our local
dealer
> > was
> > > > merciful and sold them at sticker.
> > > >
> > > > Sorry if I offended any enthusiast Rubicon owners out there, was not
> my
> > > > intent and I should have been more specific. It's a great product,
> just
> > > > riles many of us who loathe the way manufacturers and dealers take
> > > advantage
> > > > of consumers.
> > > >
> > > > ...but, Earle DOES live in God's country and we're heading that way
> this
> > > AM!
> > > >
> > > > "Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in
> > message
> > > > news:bi6msk$5inl2$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > > > "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> > > > > news:vkdgi0pkuncte3@corp.supernews.com...
> > > > > > Frankly, there's getting to be a school of thought among veteran
> > > > > > Jeepers that the Rubicon simply SUCKS, mostly due to its owners.
> > > > > > There must have been 500 of the things at Moab last year and
> > > > > > eventually everyone avoided them like the plague. This months JP
> > > > > > mag lists them among the 10 Jeeps they wouldn't own.
> > > > > > ...
> > > > >
> > > > > A FAMISHED FOX saw some clusters of ripe black grapes hanging from
a
> > > > > trellised vine. She resorted to all her tricks to get at them, but
> > > wearied
> > > > > herself in vain, for she could not reach them. At last she turned
> > away,
> > > > > hiding her disappointment and saying: "The Grapes are sour, and
not
> > ripe
> > > > as
> > > > > I thought."
> > > > >
> > > > > --Aesop, pretty darn smart Ancient Greek
> > > > >
> > > > > Earle
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
>
(He removed the locker switch before someone locked themselves off a shelf.)
Actually Poughkeepsie is the only trail up there I've not done. Can't get a
group from here to go up and do it, and our local club (Creeper Jeepers)
sponsors Black Bear and Blanca Peak trail, so everyone's always tied up
doing trail repair, etc. Anyway, heard it's kinda sloppy!
"Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in message
news:bi96i2$6sd17$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> news:vkg53ss2033b90@corp.supernews.com...
> > Ok, Earle, we were there at 9 AM, stopped at the Sinclair where we
always
> > air down & buy coffee & snacks for the day. Took my neighbor Jim for his
> > first trip around the Alpine Loop. Stopped at American Basin, then
headed
> > to
> > Lake City,. but stopped at a GREAT little surprise of a place in Sherman
> > called the A&A Guest Ranch for a fantastic Italian lunch (this place is
a
> > gem).
> >
> > We were going to head up to Carson but it was SNOWING on the peaks.
Rained
> > like an SOB all the way from Lake City back over to Silverton, where we
> > stopped at the Conoco to air back up & hose all the clay & muck off the
> > YJ.
>
> It rained some here too. Ever tried Poughkeepsie Gulch in the rain?
>
> >
> > Oh, hey Earle, I ain't rich, and my girlfriend says I ain't a sissy, but
I
> > do live in Durango. You've probably seen my rig up there a lot. I have a
> > Hunter Green '94 YJ with Dana 44 & ARB front, D60 & Detroit rear, Atlas
> > II,
> > 35" BFG MTs on Eagles, 4.5" RE suspension, Warn XD9000i, Durango bumpers
> > and
> > Avalanche rocker guards (shows Avalanche in relief on the side in
support
> > of
> > my friend Steve Rumore). Next time I'm up there (might be tomorrow)
throw
> > a rock at my Jeep and I'll know it's you.
>
> Hunter green huh? I must have seen twenty rigs like that this summer. Up
> here you can't swing a dead cat around without hitting one. The coolest
> looking Jeep I saw had half moon yellow smiley face hub caps.
>
> >
> > Buy the way Earle, if you want to try out a Rubicon the guy at the
> > Conoco has one you can rent.....
> >
>
> I live right behind the place. Black house, white FJ40 with a red roof
and
> Nine Inch Nails logo painted on top sitting next to it, grey (sort of)
three
> quarter ton Suburban parked behind that. If you don't believe me ask the
> guys at the Conoca station who lives there. Why would I want to try out a
> Rubicon?
>
> Earle
>
> >
> >
> > "Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in
message
> > news:bi7v3b$65loc$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > Heh, like George I could go down to Montrose and buy that new Patriot
> > > Rubicon on the lot with cash today, and pay someone to buff off all
> those
> > > stupid flag decals this afternoon, but I don't need one. I don't even
> > need
> > > to build one, because the stock YJ that I have is sufficient for my
> uses,
> > > thank you. I learned to drive off road in places where "rich sissies"
> > from
> > > California and Texas (like George) would be afraid to walk. I was
> > thinking
> > > of getting a rear Trash-Lock, but I am not yet convinced I need it.
> > >
> > > If I were a young guy with a family to raise however, there is no way
in
> > > hell I would be paying $500 a month for a toy like the Rubicon for
> myself.
> > >
> > > George if you are actually coming to Silverton this AM please spend
some
> > > money. My friends with the gift shops and restaurants really love
"rich
> > > sissies" like you, honest!
> > >
> > > Earle
> > >
> > > "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> > > news:vkenruqvbsvi3e@corp.supernews.com...
> > > > Ah, but one can come to the wrong assumptions in haste, can't one? I
> > > > presently own three Jeeps and an MB E430 Sport. Price is not the
> issue,
> > I
> > > > can write check for one this morning, thank you.
> > > >
> > > > My point here, my overly sensitive Jeeping friends, is that the
thing
> > was
> > > > priced unreasonably high given its content, then, due to its
> restricted
> > > > production volume, the dealers did their usual opportunistic
optioning
> > and
> > > > price gouging, luring many of those who bought them out of the
"don't
> > get
> > > > it dirty it's just a hip car for cruising" crowd.
> > > >
> > > > Those of us who've spent a bundle to build our Jeeps just chuckle.
> > Perhaps
> > > > as they get out on the used market more will get into the hands of
> true
> > > Jeep
> > > > enthusiasts, right now the owner base seems to be more attuned the
> > quality
> > > > of the CD players than the performance of the 4.1 xfer case or the
> > > lockers.
> > > >
> > > > There was absolutely no justification for the price premium Chrysler
> put
> > > on
> > > > the thing. The content's combined incremental build cost premium to
> > > Chrysler
> > > > can't be much more than $1000 over a D44 Sport. (They could have
> simply
> > > made
> > > > the axles, lockers and xfer case a check-off option.) Folks that
> ordered
> > > > them from larger metro-area dealerships complain about paying
> > over-sticker
> > > > premiums and having to take them with silly options they didn't
> order,
> > > want
> > > > or need (yes, power mirrors ARE an option on the Rubicon), or
finding
> > out
> > > > once they arrived that the dealer had peppered the things with glass
> > tint,
> > > > mud guards, stone shields, etc. Some dealers then told the buyer who
> > > ordered
> > > > them to "take it or leave it". Typical car dealer BS. Our local
dealer
> > was
> > > > merciful and sold them at sticker.
> > > >
> > > > Sorry if I offended any enthusiast Rubicon owners out there, was not
> my
> > > > intent and I should have been more specific. It's a great product,
> just
> > > > riles many of us who loathe the way manufacturers and dealers take
> > > advantage
> > > > of consumers.
> > > >
> > > > ...but, Earle DOES live in God's country and we're heading that way
> this
> > > AM!
> > > >
> > > > "Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in
> > message
> > > > news:bi6msk$5inl2$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > > > > "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> > > > > news:vkdgi0pkuncte3@corp.supernews.com...
> > > > > > Frankly, there's getting to be a school of thought among veteran
> > > > > > Jeepers that the Rubicon simply SUCKS, mostly due to its owners.
> > > > > > There must have been 500 of the things at Moab last year and
> > > > > > eventually everyone avoided them like the plague. This months JP
> > > > > > mag lists them among the 10 Jeeps they wouldn't own.
> > > > > > ...
> > > > >
> > > > > A FAMISHED FOX saw some clusters of ripe black grapes hanging from
a
> > > > > trellised vine. She resorted to all her tricks to get at them, but
> > > wearied
> > > > > herself in vain, for she could not reach them. At last she turned
> > away,
> > > > > hiding her disappointment and saying: "The Grapes are sour, and
not
> > ripe
> > > > as
> > > > > I thought."
> > > > >
> > > > > --Aesop, pretty darn smart Ancient Greek
> > > > >
> > > > > Earle
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
>
08-25-2003, 03:41 PM
#20
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Tomb Raider Rubicon
I fail to see how the price and the relative suckiness have anything to do
with one another.
You have said twice how bad the Rubicon sucks, but your sole support to your
assertion is the price they get for some silly options. I want to know why
it sucks, not how poorly the accessory list is put together.
"Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
news:vkenruqvbsvi3e@corp.supernews.com...
> Ah, but one can come to the wrong assumptions in haste, can't one? I
> presently own three Jeeps and an MB E430 Sport. Price is not the issue, I
> can write check for one this morning, thank you.
>
> My point here, my overly sensitive Jeeping friends, is that the thing was
> priced unreasonably high given its content, then, due to its restricted
> production volume, the dealers did their usual opportunistic optioning and
> price gouging, luring many of those who bought them out of the "don't get
> it dirty it's just a hip car for cruising" crowd.
>
> Those of us who've spent a bundle to build our Jeeps just chuckle. Perhaps
> as they get out on the used market more will get into the hands of true
Jeep
> enthusiasts, right now the owner base seems to be more attuned the quality
> of the CD players than the performance of the 4.1 xfer case or the
lockers.
>
> There was absolutely no justification for the price premium Chrysler put
on
> the thing. The content's combined incremental build cost premium to
Chrysler
> can't be much more than $1000 over a D44 Sport. (They could have simply
made
> the axles, lockers and xfer case a check-off option.) Folks that ordered
> them from larger metro-area dealerships complain about paying over-sticker
> premiums and having to take them with silly options they didn't order,
want
> or need (yes, power mirrors ARE an option on the Rubicon), or finding out
> once they arrived that the dealer had peppered the things with glass tint,
> mud guards, stone shields, etc. Some dealers then told the buyer who
ordered
> them to "take it or leave it". Typical car dealer BS. Our local dealer was
> merciful and sold them at sticker.
>
> Sorry if I offended any enthusiast Rubicon owners out there, was not my
> intent and I should have been more specific. It's a great product, just
> riles many of us who loathe the way manufacturers and dealers take
advantage
> of consumers.
>
> ...but, Earle DOES live in God's country and we're heading that way this
AM!
>
> "Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in message
> news:bi6msk$5inl2$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> > news:vkdgi0pkuncte3@corp.supernews.com...
> > > Frankly, there's getting to be a school of thought among veteran
> > > Jeepers that the Rubicon simply SUCKS, mostly due to its owners.
> > > There must have been 500 of the things at Moab last year and
> > > eventually everyone avoided them like the plague. This months JP
> > > mag lists them among the 10 Jeeps they wouldn't own.
> > > ...
> >
> > A FAMISHED FOX saw some clusters of ripe black grapes hanging from a
> > trellised vine. She resorted to all her tricks to get at them, but
wearied
> > herself in vain, for she could not reach them. At last she turned away,
> > hiding her disappointment and saying: "The Grapes are sour, and not ripe
> as
> > I thought."
> >
> > --Aesop, pretty darn smart Ancient Greek
> >
> > Earle
> >
> >
>
>
with one another.
You have said twice how bad the Rubicon sucks, but your sole support to your
assertion is the price they get for some silly options. I want to know why
it sucks, not how poorly the accessory list is put together.
"Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
news:vkenruqvbsvi3e@corp.supernews.com...
> Ah, but one can come to the wrong assumptions in haste, can't one? I
> presently own three Jeeps and an MB E430 Sport. Price is not the issue, I
> can write check for one this morning, thank you.
>
> My point here, my overly sensitive Jeeping friends, is that the thing was
> priced unreasonably high given its content, then, due to its restricted
> production volume, the dealers did their usual opportunistic optioning and
> price gouging, luring many of those who bought them out of the "don't get
> it dirty it's just a hip car for cruising" crowd.
>
> Those of us who've spent a bundle to build our Jeeps just chuckle. Perhaps
> as they get out on the used market more will get into the hands of true
Jeep
> enthusiasts, right now the owner base seems to be more attuned the quality
> of the CD players than the performance of the 4.1 xfer case or the
lockers.
>
> There was absolutely no justification for the price premium Chrysler put
on
> the thing. The content's combined incremental build cost premium to
Chrysler
> can't be much more than $1000 over a D44 Sport. (They could have simply
made
> the axles, lockers and xfer case a check-off option.) Folks that ordered
> them from larger metro-area dealerships complain about paying over-sticker
> premiums and having to take them with silly options they didn't order,
want
> or need (yes, power mirrors ARE an option on the Rubicon), or finding out
> once they arrived that the dealer had peppered the things with glass tint,
> mud guards, stone shields, etc. Some dealers then told the buyer who
ordered
> them to "take it or leave it". Typical car dealer BS. Our local dealer was
> merciful and sold them at sticker.
>
> Sorry if I offended any enthusiast Rubicon owners out there, was not my
> intent and I should have been more specific. It's a great product, just
> riles many of us who loathe the way manufacturers and dealers take
advantage
> of consumers.
>
> ...but, Earle DOES live in God's country and we're heading that way this
AM!
>
> "Earle Horton" <enfermero_diabolico@registerednurses.com> wrote in message
> news:bi6msk$5inl2$1@ID-147790.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > "Gerald G. McGeorge" <gmcgeorge@frontier.net> wrote in message
> > news:vkdgi0pkuncte3@corp.supernews.com...
> > > Frankly, there's getting to be a school of thought among veteran
> > > Jeepers that the Rubicon simply SUCKS, mostly due to its owners.
> > > There must have been 500 of the things at Moab last year and
> > > eventually everyone avoided them like the plague. This months JP
> > > mag lists them among the 10 Jeeps they wouldn't own.
> > > ...
> >
> > A FAMISHED FOX saw some clusters of ripe black grapes hanging from a
> > trellised vine. She resorted to all her tricks to get at them, but
wearied
> > herself in vain, for she could not reach them. At last she turned away,
> > hiding her disappointment and saying: "The Grapes are sour, and not ripe
> as
> > I thought."
> >
> > --Aesop, pretty darn smart Ancient Greek
> >
> > Earle
> >
> >
>
>
