weld-on accessories
10-15-2003, 01:32 AM
#61
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: weld-on accessories
The old International I drove for a while had notices stamped all over
the frame that expressly prohibited any welding on the frame rails.
On Tue, 14 Oct 2003 23:24:00 UTC "Nathan Collier"
<JeepMail@7SlotGrille.com> wrote:
> "L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
> news:3F8C7685.1258A9BF@***.net...
> > Just in case you're tempted to weld to a friend commercial truck,
> > know you can't per Department of Transportation:
> > http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rulesregs/f...gs/393.201.htm
>
> hi bill,
> welding is not excluded _anywhere_ on that page. the closest that youll see
> is "d) All accessories mounted to the truck tractor frame must be bolted or
> riveted." but even that does not exclude welding the truck frame. once
> something is welded to the frame it is an integral part of the structure
> anyway, it is not an "accessory". the accessories referenced would include
> fuel tanks, hangers, air tanks, etc.
>
> > And pretty
> > much any welded repair will deadline the truck:
> > http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rulesregs/fmcsr/regs/appng.htm
>
> welding is referenced many times in that page as well.
> "(b) Any welds or parent metal cracked."
> "(d) Any slider component cracked in parent metal or weld."
> "(a) Any cracks in attachment welds."
> "(1) Any cracks in welds attaching disc wheel disc to rim."
> "(2) Any crack in welds attaching tubeless demountable rim to adapter."
> "Appendix G rejects vehicles with any fifth wheel mounting fastener missing
> or ineffective. The out of service criteria allows up to 20% missing or
> ineffective fasteners on frame mountings and pivot bracket mountings and 25%
> on sliderlatching fasteners. The out of service criteria also allows some
> latitude on cracked welds."
>
> etc. these are references to improper or broken welds, welding repairs are
> only excluded on certain things such as aluminum wheels and universal joints
> as i read it.
>
> > I had to use
> > Explorer to view these sites.
>
> you oughtta be using IE anyway. ;-)
>
>
--
Will Honea <whonea@codenet.net>
the frame that expressly prohibited any welding on the frame rails.
On Tue, 14 Oct 2003 23:24:00 UTC "Nathan Collier"
<JeepMail@7SlotGrille.com> wrote:
> "L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
> news:3F8C7685.1258A9BF@***.net...
> > Just in case you're tempted to weld to a friend commercial truck,
> > know you can't per Department of Transportation:
> > http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rulesregs/f...gs/393.201.htm
>
> hi bill,
> welding is not excluded _anywhere_ on that page. the closest that youll see
> is "d) All accessories mounted to the truck tractor frame must be bolted or
> riveted." but even that does not exclude welding the truck frame. once
> something is welded to the frame it is an integral part of the structure
> anyway, it is not an "accessory". the accessories referenced would include
> fuel tanks, hangers, air tanks, etc.
>
> > And pretty
> > much any welded repair will deadline the truck:
> > http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rulesregs/fmcsr/regs/appng.htm
>
> welding is referenced many times in that page as well.
> "(b) Any welds or parent metal cracked."
> "(d) Any slider component cracked in parent metal or weld."
> "(a) Any cracks in attachment welds."
> "(1) Any cracks in welds attaching disc wheel disc to rim."
> "(2) Any crack in welds attaching tubeless demountable rim to adapter."
> "Appendix G rejects vehicles with any fifth wheel mounting fastener missing
> or ineffective. The out of service criteria allows up to 20% missing or
> ineffective fasteners on frame mountings and pivot bracket mountings and 25%
> on sliderlatching fasteners. The out of service criteria also allows some
> latitude on cracked welds."
>
> etc. these are references to improper or broken welds, welding repairs are
> only excluded on certain things such as aluminum wheels and universal joints
> as i read it.
>
> > I had to use
> > Explorer to view these sites.
>
> you oughtta be using IE anyway. ;-)
>
>
--
Will Honea <whonea@codenet.net>
10-15-2003, 01:47 AM
#62
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: weld-on accessories
I'm not too sure about the latest TJ's but the Wrangler bumpers are
pretty rigid extruded steel by design. They are not one of those 15 MPH
absorption bumpers in the average safety conscious car. Unless you think
a bumperette can offer you some protection.
I built a rigid bumper for my jeep to allow me to deflect up and over
rather than through the offending obstacle. Though I haven't climbed a
tree yet, knock on wood! (chuckle, chuckle)
Most top of the line after market off road bumpers are far more rigid
than the stock bumpers and offer no absorption benefits that I can see.
Perry
87YJ 36x12.5 MT Baja's
MikeG wrote:
> Hi Nathan,
> I don't think it is a good idea to make the bumper to 'strong'. The whole
> idea behind a bumper is to absorb an impact. If the bumper is bullet proof,
> all the impact will be transferred to the frame and jeep. It's alot cheaper
> to replace a bumper than deal with a tweaked frame.
> MikeG
>
>
> "Nathan Collier" <JeepMail@7SlotGrille.com> wrote in message
> news:htKib.1580$En4.1384@twister.southeast.rr.com. ..
>
>>i wanna sample the market a little bit to help with some designs im
>
> working
>
>>on. im really curious if you as jeepers would be interested in bumpers
>
> that
>
>>weld to the frame instead of bolting? what if such a bumper was stronger
>>than what is currently avialable yet much cheaper? assume the design was
>>such that you couldnt destroy the bumper if you tried. how about sliders
>>that also weld on instead of bolt?
>>thanks,
>>
>>--
>>
>>Nathan W. Collier
>>http://7SlotGrille.com
>>
>>
>
>
>
pretty rigid extruded steel by design. They are not one of those 15 MPH
absorption bumpers in the average safety conscious car. Unless you think
a bumperette can offer you some protection.
I built a rigid bumper for my jeep to allow me to deflect up and over
rather than through the offending obstacle. Though I haven't climbed a
tree yet, knock on wood! (chuckle, chuckle)
Most top of the line after market off road bumpers are far more rigid
than the stock bumpers and offer no absorption benefits that I can see.
Perry
87YJ 36x12.5 MT Baja's
MikeG wrote:
> Hi Nathan,
> I don't think it is a good idea to make the bumper to 'strong'. The whole
> idea behind a bumper is to absorb an impact. If the bumper is bullet proof,
> all the impact will be transferred to the frame and jeep. It's alot cheaper
> to replace a bumper than deal with a tweaked frame.
> MikeG
>
>
> "Nathan Collier" <JeepMail@7SlotGrille.com> wrote in message
> news:htKib.1580$En4.1384@twister.southeast.rr.com. ..
>
>>i wanna sample the market a little bit to help with some designs im
>
> working
>
>>on. im really curious if you as jeepers would be interested in bumpers
>
> that
>
>>weld to the frame instead of bolting? what if such a bumper was stronger
>>than what is currently avialable yet much cheaper? assume the design was
>>such that you couldnt destroy the bumper if you tried. how about sliders
>>that also weld on instead of bolt?
>>thanks,
>>
>>--
>>
>>Nathan W. Collier
>>http://7SlotGrille.com
>>
>>
>
>
>
10-15-2003, 01:47 AM
#63
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: weld-on accessories
I'm not too sure about the latest TJ's but the Wrangler bumpers are
pretty rigid extruded steel by design. They are not one of those 15 MPH
absorption bumpers in the average safety conscious car. Unless you think
a bumperette can offer you some protection.
I built a rigid bumper for my jeep to allow me to deflect up and over
rather than through the offending obstacle. Though I haven't climbed a
tree yet, knock on wood! (chuckle, chuckle)
Most top of the line after market off road bumpers are far more rigid
than the stock bumpers and offer no absorption benefits that I can see.
Perry
87YJ 36x12.5 MT Baja's
MikeG wrote:
> Hi Nathan,
> I don't think it is a good idea to make the bumper to 'strong'. The whole
> idea behind a bumper is to absorb an impact. If the bumper is bullet proof,
> all the impact will be transferred to the frame and jeep. It's alot cheaper
> to replace a bumper than deal with a tweaked frame.
> MikeG
>
>
> "Nathan Collier" <JeepMail@7SlotGrille.com> wrote in message
> news:htKib.1580$En4.1384@twister.southeast.rr.com. ..
>
>>i wanna sample the market a little bit to help with some designs im
>
> working
>
>>on. im really curious if you as jeepers would be interested in bumpers
>
> that
>
>>weld to the frame instead of bolting? what if such a bumper was stronger
>>than what is currently avialable yet much cheaper? assume the design was
>>such that you couldnt destroy the bumper if you tried. how about sliders
>>that also weld on instead of bolt?
>>thanks,
>>
>>--
>>
>>Nathan W. Collier
>>http://7SlotGrille.com
>>
>>
>
>
>
pretty rigid extruded steel by design. They are not one of those 15 MPH
absorption bumpers in the average safety conscious car. Unless you think
a bumperette can offer you some protection.
I built a rigid bumper for my jeep to allow me to deflect up and over
rather than through the offending obstacle. Though I haven't climbed a
tree yet, knock on wood! (chuckle, chuckle)
Most top of the line after market off road bumpers are far more rigid
than the stock bumpers and offer no absorption benefits that I can see.
Perry
87YJ 36x12.5 MT Baja's
MikeG wrote:
> Hi Nathan,
> I don't think it is a good idea to make the bumper to 'strong'. The whole
> idea behind a bumper is to absorb an impact. If the bumper is bullet proof,
> all the impact will be transferred to the frame and jeep. It's alot cheaper
> to replace a bumper than deal with a tweaked frame.
> MikeG
>
>
> "Nathan Collier" <JeepMail@7SlotGrille.com> wrote in message
> news:htKib.1580$En4.1384@twister.southeast.rr.com. ..
>
>>i wanna sample the market a little bit to help with some designs im
>
> working
>
>>on. im really curious if you as jeepers would be interested in bumpers
>
> that
>
>>weld to the frame instead of bolting? what if such a bumper was stronger
>>than what is currently avialable yet much cheaper? assume the design was
>>such that you couldnt destroy the bumper if you tried. how about sliders
>>that also weld on instead of bolt?
>>thanks,
>>
>>--
>>
>>Nathan W. Collier
>>http://7SlotGrille.com
>>
>>
>
>
>
10-15-2003, 01:47 AM
#64
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: weld-on accessories
I'm not too sure about the latest TJ's but the Wrangler bumpers are
pretty rigid extruded steel by design. They are not one of those 15 MPH
absorption bumpers in the average safety conscious car. Unless you think
a bumperette can offer you some protection.
I built a rigid bumper for my jeep to allow me to deflect up and over
rather than through the offending obstacle. Though I haven't climbed a
tree yet, knock on wood! (chuckle, chuckle)
Most top of the line after market off road bumpers are far more rigid
than the stock bumpers and offer no absorption benefits that I can see.
Perry
87YJ 36x12.5 MT Baja's
MikeG wrote:
> Hi Nathan,
> I don't think it is a good idea to make the bumper to 'strong'. The whole
> idea behind a bumper is to absorb an impact. If the bumper is bullet proof,
> all the impact will be transferred to the frame and jeep. It's alot cheaper
> to replace a bumper than deal with a tweaked frame.
> MikeG
>
>
> "Nathan Collier" <JeepMail@7SlotGrille.com> wrote in message
> news:htKib.1580$En4.1384@twister.southeast.rr.com. ..
>
>>i wanna sample the market a little bit to help with some designs im
>
> working
>
>>on. im really curious if you as jeepers would be interested in bumpers
>
> that
>
>>weld to the frame instead of bolting? what if such a bumper was stronger
>>than what is currently avialable yet much cheaper? assume the design was
>>such that you couldnt destroy the bumper if you tried. how about sliders
>>that also weld on instead of bolt?
>>thanks,
>>
>>--
>>
>>Nathan W. Collier
>>http://7SlotGrille.com
>>
>>
>
>
>
pretty rigid extruded steel by design. They are not one of those 15 MPH
absorption bumpers in the average safety conscious car. Unless you think
a bumperette can offer you some protection.
I built a rigid bumper for my jeep to allow me to deflect up and over
rather than through the offending obstacle. Though I haven't climbed a
tree yet, knock on wood! (chuckle, chuckle)
Most top of the line after market off road bumpers are far more rigid
than the stock bumpers and offer no absorption benefits that I can see.
Perry
87YJ 36x12.5 MT Baja's
MikeG wrote:
> Hi Nathan,
> I don't think it is a good idea to make the bumper to 'strong'. The whole
> idea behind a bumper is to absorb an impact. If the bumper is bullet proof,
> all the impact will be transferred to the frame and jeep. It's alot cheaper
> to replace a bumper than deal with a tweaked frame.
> MikeG
>
>
> "Nathan Collier" <JeepMail@7SlotGrille.com> wrote in message
> news:htKib.1580$En4.1384@twister.southeast.rr.com. ..
>
>>i wanna sample the market a little bit to help with some designs im
>
> working
>
>>on. im really curious if you as jeepers would be interested in bumpers
>
> that
>
>>weld to the frame instead of bolting? what if such a bumper was stronger
>>than what is currently avialable yet much cheaper? assume the design was
>>such that you couldnt destroy the bumper if you tried. how about sliders
>>that also weld on instead of bolt?
>>thanks,
>>
>>--
>>
>>Nathan W. Collier
>>http://7SlotGrille.com
>>
>>
>
>
>
10-15-2003, 08:07 AM
#65
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: weld-on accessories
"Will Honea" <whonea@codenet.net> wrote in message
news:JxX2tWiP5BNp-pn2-xpwJvxmO2MFm@anon.none.net...
> The old International I drove for a while had notices stamped all over
> the frame that expressly prohibited any welding on the frame rails.
<shrug> who knows what is/is not applicable. i can say with authority thats
how we did it though and as a licensed manufacturer, im sure my employer was
doing it by code.
--
Nathan W. Collier
http://7SlotGrille.com
news:JxX2tWiP5BNp-pn2-xpwJvxmO2MFm@anon.none.net...
> The old International I drove for a while had notices stamped all over
> the frame that expressly prohibited any welding on the frame rails.
<shrug> who knows what is/is not applicable. i can say with authority thats
how we did it though and as a licensed manufacturer, im sure my employer was
doing it by code.
--
Nathan W. Collier
http://7SlotGrille.com
10-15-2003, 08:07 AM
#66
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: weld-on accessories
"Will Honea" <whonea@codenet.net> wrote in message
news:JxX2tWiP5BNp-pn2-xpwJvxmO2MFm@anon.none.net...
> The old International I drove for a while had notices stamped all over
> the frame that expressly prohibited any welding on the frame rails.
<shrug> who knows what is/is not applicable. i can say with authority thats
how we did it though and as a licensed manufacturer, im sure my employer was
doing it by code.
--
Nathan W. Collier
http://7SlotGrille.com
news:JxX2tWiP5BNp-pn2-xpwJvxmO2MFm@anon.none.net...
> The old International I drove for a while had notices stamped all over
> the frame that expressly prohibited any welding on the frame rails.
<shrug> who knows what is/is not applicable. i can say with authority thats
how we did it though and as a licensed manufacturer, im sure my employer was
doing it by code.
--
Nathan W. Collier
http://7SlotGrille.com
10-15-2003, 08:07 AM
#67
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: weld-on accessories
"Will Honea" <whonea@codenet.net> wrote in message
news:JxX2tWiP5BNp-pn2-xpwJvxmO2MFm@anon.none.net...
> The old International I drove for a while had notices stamped all over
> the frame that expressly prohibited any welding on the frame rails.
<shrug> who knows what is/is not applicable. i can say with authority thats
how we did it though and as a licensed manufacturer, im sure my employer was
doing it by code.
--
Nathan W. Collier
http://7SlotGrille.com
news:JxX2tWiP5BNp-pn2-xpwJvxmO2MFm@anon.none.net...
> The old International I drove for a while had notices stamped all over
> the frame that expressly prohibited any welding on the frame rails.
<shrug> who knows what is/is not applicable. i can say with authority thats
how we did it though and as a licensed manufacturer, im sure my employer was
doing it by code.
--
Nathan W. Collier
http://7SlotGrille.com
10-15-2003, 03:49 PM
#68
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: weld-on accessories
My W9000 Ford manual said I wasn't to drill holes in the frame,
that they only could be punched. Well I had to move the axle, to make a
shanty shaker: http://www.----------.com/rextrans.jpg I had to use
probably about ten drill sizes to walk it up to the 3/4" holes and
sharpen each after use, as the frame was case harden.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:--------------------
Will Honea wrote:
>
> The old International I drove for a while had notices stamped all over
> the frame that expressly prohibited any welding on the frame rails.
> --
> Will Honea <whonea@codenet.net>
that they only could be punched. Well I had to move the axle, to make a
shanty shaker: http://www.----------.com/rextrans.jpg I had to use
probably about ten drill sizes to walk it up to the 3/4" holes and
sharpen each after use, as the frame was case harden.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:--------------------
Will Honea wrote:
>
> The old International I drove for a while had notices stamped all over
> the frame that expressly prohibited any welding on the frame rails.
> --
> Will Honea <whonea@codenet.net>
10-15-2003, 03:49 PM
#69
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: weld-on accessories
My W9000 Ford manual said I wasn't to drill holes in the frame,
that they only could be punched. Well I had to move the axle, to make a
shanty shaker: http://www.----------.com/rextrans.jpg I had to use
probably about ten drill sizes to walk it up to the 3/4" holes and
sharpen each after use, as the frame was case harden.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:--------------------
Will Honea wrote:
>
> The old International I drove for a while had notices stamped all over
> the frame that expressly prohibited any welding on the frame rails.
> --
> Will Honea <whonea@codenet.net>
that they only could be punched. Well I had to move the axle, to make a
shanty shaker: http://www.----------.com/rextrans.jpg I had to use
probably about ten drill sizes to walk it up to the 3/4" holes and
sharpen each after use, as the frame was case harden.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:--------------------
Will Honea wrote:
>
> The old International I drove for a while had notices stamped all over
> the frame that expressly prohibited any welding on the frame rails.
> --
> Will Honea <whonea@codenet.net>
10-15-2003, 03:49 PM
#70
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: weld-on accessories
My W9000 Ford manual said I wasn't to drill holes in the frame,
that they only could be punched. Well I had to move the axle, to make a
shanty shaker: http://www.----------.com/rextrans.jpg I had to use
probably about ten drill sizes to walk it up to the 3/4" holes and
sharpen each after use, as the frame was case harden.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:--------------------
Will Honea wrote:
>
> The old International I drove for a while had notices stamped all over
> the frame that expressly prohibited any welding on the frame rails.
> --
> Will Honea <whonea@codenet.net>
that they only could be punched. Well I had to move the axle, to make a
shanty shaker: http://www.----------.com/rextrans.jpg I had to use
probably about ten drill sizes to walk it up to the 3/4" holes and
sharpen each after use, as the frame was case harden.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:--------------------
Will Honea wrote:
>
> The old International I drove for a while had notices stamped all over
> the frame that expressly prohibited any welding on the frame rails.
> --
> Will Honea <whonea@codenet.net>
