A.H. MacIntosh aka USERNAME

Utterly terrifying concept, is it not?

"Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
news:Ofh6b.1970$BA1.19161296@news-text.cableinet.net...
> 8 tons of biological and chemical agent would fit in a standard shipping
> container desert.. Not sure they will be found.
>
> Dave Milne, Scotland
> '99 TJ 4.0 Sahara
>
> "Richard Harris" <SHARRIS11@san.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:zye6b.27044$uZ6.1546804@twister.socal.rr.com. ..
> : I'll say this once and only once.... Then when I'm proven right you can
> : comment .....
> : WMD is there and it will be found....en mass. Iraq is a large country
with
> : MANY places to hide things. We've already found a number of Iraqi
fighter
> : aircraft buried under the sand so no one will find them....
> : Trust me oh yea of little faith, and those who STILL believe Algore won
> the
> : election...
> : Sorry for the OT comment.
> : Rich
> :
> : "A.H. MacIntosh aka USERNAME" <chesshire_cat@nospam.net> wrote in
message
> : news:5Pc6b.6455$cQ1.1778268@kent.svc.tds.net...
> : > 135K (your statistic of 300K is over double the highest estimates)
> Germans
> : > are more innocent than 6,000,000 Jews?
> : >
> : > Germany was the aggressor, and earned every bomb that fell on them.
> : > Were not those bombs to destroy a dictator's war making ability?
> : > just how else would you have proposed it be done? Ask him to leave?
> : >
> : > WW2 was a war against opposing nations civil infrastructure as much as
> it
> : > was a war against military targets, partially because the technology
did
> : not
> : > exist to fight it any other way.
> : >
> : >
> : > "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
> : > news:At76b.1742$Sn5.16906365@news-text.cableinet.net...
> : > > Jeez - you advocate killing 300,000 innocent people so you can
appear
> : > tough
> : > > ?
> : > > My next door neighbour was in Dresden - her feet burnt and the
wheels
> of
> : > the
> : > > pram she was pushing caught fire from the incendiaries ; its very
> nasty
> : > and
> : > > was a low point of the war.
> : > >
> : > > I'm sorry but your attitude is a disgrace to the soldiers in Iraq
from
> : > both
> : > > our countries who are fighting extremism and being courteous in
> victory.
> : A
> : > > large part of this operation was to get rid of a dictator who had so
> : > little
> : > > regard for human life (both his own people and the Kurds) that he
> didn't
> : > > stop at killing 300,000 innocent people. In short soldiers are
risking
> : > their
> : > > lives to save the world from ******** like you.
> : > >
> : > >
> : > > Dave Milne, Scotland
> : > > '99 TJ 4.0 Sahara
> : > >
> : > > "Joshua Nelson" <spam_box@ev1.net> wrote in message
> : > > news:b102b6e4.0309051331.686d0d2b@posting.google.c om...
> : > > : > " He said that 90% of the Iraqi people are glad the Americans
are
> : > > there."
> : > > : >
> : > > : > I would have to question this guys credibility. 90%? I must be
> : > reading
> : > > the
> : > > : > wrong media (around the world). Maybe he ment 10% and 90% would
> : like
> : > us
> : > > to
> : > > : > leave so they can keep thier oil.
> : > > : >
> : > > :
> : > > : This is totally off topic, but I didn't start it and it's an
> : > > : interesting topic so I will gladly respond.
> : > > :
> : > > : I for one really do not understand why we are being so soft with
the
> : > > : Iraqis. I keep seeing comparisons in the media with how badly the
> : > > : Iraqi occupation is going compared to the German occupation after
> : > > : World War II. Well, the reason is, we showed the Germans we meant
> : > > : business. One particular example is that at the war's close we
> : > > : firebombed Dresden, an undefended city of no meaningful military
> : > > : value. The bombing was so extensive it killed nearly 300,000
> people.
> : > > : To put that in perspective, that's more than double the amount of
> : > > : people killed in the atomic bomb attacks on Nagasaki and Hiroshima
> : > > : combined.
> : > > :
> : > > : Speaking of the Germans, they were also pretty good at quashing
> : > > : dissent in occupied territories, (and I'm not talking about the SS
> : > > : operations and concentration camps.) Any time a German soldier
was
> : > > : killed by an underground partisan, the Germans lined up ten local
> : > > : civilians at random and executed them on the spot.
> : > > :
> : > > : This may sound inhumane, but which is worse, lancing the boil or
> : > > : letting it fester? If we don't start getting serious we are going
to
> : > > : come home from Iraq in defeat, which will only reinforce the
mindset
> : > > : of the terrorists and make it open season on American civilians
> : > > : everywhere. Personally, I prefer 10 dead Iraqis over 1 dead
> American
> : > > : any day.
> : > > :
> : > > : You have to break a few eggs to make the omlette. The terrorists
> and
> : > > : underground fighters in Iraq should be glad I'm not in charge.
I'd
> : > > : start by giving everyone in Tikrit 30 minutes notice to get out,
> then
> : > > : I'd firebomb the place off the map. Then massively
disproportional
> : > > : civilian reprisals for every future scratch suffered by US forces.
> : > > : I'd bet $100 to $1 that would calm the place down real darn quick.
> : > > :
> : > > : The downside is that this would make the "Arab Street" angry with
> us,
> : > > : the Europeans would no longer be our faithful allies, and liberals
> : > > : would start calling Bush a war criminal. (Which is, of course,
> : > > : totally unlike the situation that exists at the current moment.)
> : > > :
> : > > : I also don't understand why we don't seize the Iraqi oil fields
and
> : > > : sell the oil wherever we please to pay for the billion dollar per
> : > > : month occupation cost. But that's another subject and I do
believe
> I
> : > > : have gotten my 2 cents worth for today.
> : > >
> : > >
> : >
> : >
> :
> :
>
>

Matt Macchiarolo

In article <3F58FE20.BF0DF892@***.net>, L.W.(=?iso-8859-1?Q?=DFill?=) ------
III <----------@***.net> writes:

>Whom can't stand the fact that our President is making all the right
>decisions.

Sorry, can't agree there...
* * *
Matt Macchiarolo
www.townpeddler.com
www.wolverine4wd.org
http://wolverine4wd.org/rigs/macchiarolo_ml.html

Matt Macchiarolo

In article <3F58FE20.BF0DF892@***.net>, L.W.(=?iso-8859-1?Q?=DFill?=) ------
III <----------@***.net> writes:

>Whom can't stand the fact that our President is making all the right
>decisions.

Sorry, can't agree there...
* * *
Matt Macchiarolo
www.townpeddler.com
www.wolverine4wd.org
http://wolverine4wd.org/rigs/macchiarolo_ml.html

Matt Macchiarolo

In article <5Pc6b.6455$cQ1.1778268@kent.svc.tds.net>, "A.H. MacIntosh aka
USERNAME" <chesshire_cat@nospam.net> writes:

>Were not those bombs to destroy a dictator's war making ability?

The firebombing of civilians transcended the war-making ability of the Germany,
it was terrorism in an attempt to break the spirit of the civilian population,
not unlike the German V2's and buzzbombs, but much more effective. It was a low
point in the war, but it was also in response to Germany's increasingly
desperate campaigns.

>WW2 was a war against opposing nations civil infrastructure as much as it
>was a war against military targets,

more so in the later years...

partially because the technology did not
>exist to fight it any other way.

Agreed.
* * *
Matt Macchiarolo
www.townpeddler.com
www.wolverine4wd.org
http://wolverine4wd.org/rigs/macchiarolo_ml.html

Matt Macchiarolo

In article <5Pc6b.6455$cQ1.1778268@kent.svc.tds.net>, "A.H. MacIntosh aka
USERNAME" <chesshire_cat@nospam.net> writes:

>Were not those bombs to destroy a dictator's war making ability?

The firebombing of civilians transcended the war-making ability of the Germany,
it was terrorism in an attempt to break the spirit of the civilian population,
not unlike the German V2's and buzzbombs, but much more effective. It was a low
point in the war, but it was also in response to Germany's increasingly
desperate campaigns.

>WW2 was a war against opposing nations civil infrastructure as much as it
>was a war against military targets,

more so in the later years...

partially because the technology did not
>exist to fight it any other way.

Agreed.
* * *
Matt Macchiarolo
www.townpeddler.com
www.wolverine4wd.org
http://wolverine4wd.org/rigs/macchiarolo_ml.html

A.H. MacIntosh aka USERNAME

Dresden was a communication and cultural centre. It's destruction served to
break the moral of the German people... effectively the German war
production. I believe that it was an attempt to force the German
surrender... but madmen don't surrender.

Just as the V1, and V2 were used on London to demoralise the populace (in
actuality, had an opposite effect) if they had been available in sufficient
#, and a greater number of them functioned properly London would have been
in the same shape as Dresden Some may consider that to constitute urban
renewal

"Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
news:Zih6b.1980$SI1.19281025@news-text.cableinet.net...
> I'm not sure that knocking down 28,000 houses counts as massive civil
> infrastructure ...
>
> Dave Milne, Scotland
> '99 TJ 4.0 Sahara
>
> "A.H. MacIntosh aka USERNAME" <chesshire_cat@nospam.net> wrote in message
> news:5Pc6b.6455$cQ1.1778268@kent.svc.tds.net...
> : 135K (your statistic of 300K is over double the highest estimates)
Germans
> : are more innocent than 6,000,000 Jews?
> :
> : Germany was the aggressor, and earned every bomb that fell on them.
> : Were not those bombs to destroy a dictator's war making ability?
> : just how else would you have proposed it be done? Ask him to leave?
> :
> : WW2 was a war against opposing nations civil infrastructure as much as
it
> : was a war against military targets, partially because the technology did
> not
> : exist to fight it any other way.
> :
> :
> : "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
> : news:At76b.1742$Sn5.16906365@news-text.cableinet.net...
> : > Jeez - you advocate killing 300,000 innocent people so you can appear
> : tough
> : > ?
> : > My next door neighbour was in Dresden - her feet burnt and the wheels
of
> : the
> : > pram she was pushing caught fire from the incendiaries ; its very
nasty
> : and
> : > was a low point of the war.
> : >
> : > I'm sorry but your attitude is a disgrace to the soldiers in Iraq from
> : both
> : > our countries who are fighting extremism and being courteous in
victory.
> A
> : > large part of this operation was to get rid of a dictator who had so
> : little
> : > regard for human life (both his own people and the Kurds) that he
didn't
> : > stop at killing 300,000 innocent people. In short soldiers are risking
> : their
> : > lives to save the world from ******** like you.
> : >
> : >
> : > Dave Milne, Scotland
> : > '99 TJ 4.0 Sahara
> : >
> : > "Joshua Nelson" <spam_box@ev1.net> wrote in message
> : > news:b102b6e4.0309051331.686d0d2b@posting.google.c om...
> : > : > " He said that 90% of the Iraqi people are glad the Americans are
> : > there."
> : > : >
> : > : > I would have to question this guys credibility. 90%? I must be
> : reading
> : > the
> : > : > wrong media (around the world). Maybe he ment 10% and 90% would
> like
> : us
> : > to
> : > : > leave so they can keep thier oil.
> : > : >
> : > :
> : > : This is totally off topic, but I didn't start it and it's an
> : > : interesting topic so I will gladly respond.
> : > :
> : > : I for one really do not understand why we are being so soft with the
> : > : Iraqis. I keep seeing comparisons in the media with how badly the
> : > : Iraqi occupation is going compared to the German occupation after
> : > : World War II. Well, the reason is, we showed the Germans we meant
> : > : business. One particular example is that at the war's close we
> : > : firebombed Dresden, an undefended city of no meaningful military
> : > : value. The bombing was so extensive it killed nearly 300,000
people.
> : > : To put that in perspective, that's more than double the amount of
> : > : people killed in the atomic bomb attacks on Nagasaki and Hiroshima
> : > : combined.
> : > :
> : > : Speaking of the Germans, they were also pretty good at quashing
> : > : dissent in occupied territories, (and I'm not talking about the SS
> : > : operations and concentration camps.) Any time a German soldier was
> : > : killed by an underground partisan, the Germans lined up ten local
> : > : civilians at random and executed them on the spot.
> : > :
> : > : This may sound inhumane, but which is worse, lancing the boil or
> : > : letting it fester? If we don't start getting serious we are going to
> : > : come home from Iraq in defeat, which will only reinforce the mindset
> : > : of the terrorists and make it open season on American civilians
> : > : everywhere. Personally, I prefer 10 dead Iraqis over 1 dead
American
> : > : any day.
> : > :
> : > : You have to break a few eggs to make the omlette. The terrorists
and
> : > : underground fighters in Iraq should be glad I'm not in charge. I'd
> : > : start by giving everyone in Tikrit 30 minutes notice to get out,
then
> : > : I'd firebomb the place off the map. Then massively disproportional
> : > : civilian reprisals for every future scratch suffered by US forces.
> : > : I'd bet $100 to $1 that would calm the place down real darn quick.
> : > :
> : > : The downside is that this would make the "Arab Street" angry with
us,
> : > : the Europeans would no longer be our faithful allies, and liberals
> : > : would start calling Bush a war criminal. (Which is, of course,
> : > : totally unlike the situation that exists at the current moment.)
> : > :
> : > : I also don't understand why we don't seize the Iraqi oil fields and
> : > : sell the oil wherever we please to pay for the billion dollar per
> : > : month occupation cost. But that's another subject and I do believe
I
> : > : have gotten my 2 cents worth for today.
> : >
> : >
> :
> :
>
>

A.H. MacIntosh aka USERNAME

Dresden was a communication and cultural centre. It's destruction served to
break the moral of the German people... effectively the German war
production. I believe that it was an attempt to force the German
surrender... but madmen don't surrender.

Just as the V1, and V2 were used on London to demoralise the populace (in
actuality, had an opposite effect) if they had been available in sufficient
#, and a greater number of them functioned properly London would have been
in the same shape as Dresden Some may consider that to constitute urban
renewal

"Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
news:Zih6b.1980$SI1.19281025@news-text.cableinet.net...
> I'm not sure that knocking down 28,000 houses counts as massive civil
> infrastructure ...
>
> Dave Milne, Scotland
> '99 TJ 4.0 Sahara
>
> "A.H. MacIntosh aka USERNAME" <chesshire_cat@nospam.net> wrote in message
> news:5Pc6b.6455$cQ1.1778268@kent.svc.tds.net...
> : 135K (your statistic of 300K is over double the highest estimates)
Germans
> : are more innocent than 6,000,000 Jews?
> :
> : Germany was the aggressor, and earned every bomb that fell on them.
> : Were not those bombs to destroy a dictator's war making ability?
> : just how else would you have proposed it be done? Ask him to leave?
> :
> : WW2 was a war against opposing nations civil infrastructure as much as
it
> : was a war against military targets, partially because the technology did
> not
> : exist to fight it any other way.
> :
> :
> : "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
> : news:At76b.1742$Sn5.16906365@news-text.cableinet.net...
> : > Jeez - you advocate killing 300,000 innocent people so you can appear
> : tough
> : > ?
> : > My next door neighbour was in Dresden - her feet burnt and the wheels
of
> : the
> : > pram she was pushing caught fire from the incendiaries ; its very
nasty
> : and
> : > was a low point of the war.
> : >
> : > I'm sorry but your attitude is a disgrace to the soldiers in Iraq from
> : both
> : > our countries who are fighting extremism and being courteous in
victory.
> A
> : > large part of this operation was to get rid of a dictator who had so
> : little
> : > regard for human life (both his own people and the Kurds) that he
didn't
> : > stop at killing 300,000 innocent people. In short soldiers are risking
> : their
> : > lives to save the world from ******** like you.
> : >
> : >
> : > Dave Milne, Scotland
> : > '99 TJ 4.0 Sahara
> : >
> : > "Joshua Nelson" <spam_box@ev1.net> wrote in message
> : > news:b102b6e4.0309051331.686d0d2b@posting.google.c om...
> : > : > " He said that 90% of the Iraqi people are glad the Americans are
> : > there."
> : > : >
> : > : > I would have to question this guys credibility. 90%? I must be
> : reading
> : > the
> : > : > wrong media (around the world). Maybe he ment 10% and 90% would
> like
> : us
> : > to
> : > : > leave so they can keep thier oil.
> : > : >
> : > :
> : > : This is totally off topic, but I didn't start it and it's an
> : > : interesting topic so I will gladly respond.
> : > :
> : > : I for one really do not understand why we are being so soft with the
> : > : Iraqis. I keep seeing comparisons in the media with how badly the
> : > : Iraqi occupation is going compared to the German occupation after
> : > : World War II. Well, the reason is, we showed the Germans we meant
> : > : business. One particular example is that at the war's close we
> : > : firebombed Dresden, an undefended city of no meaningful military
> : > : value. The bombing was so extensive it killed nearly 300,000
people.
> : > : To put that in perspective, that's more than double the amount of
> : > : people killed in the atomic bomb attacks on Nagasaki and Hiroshima
> : > : combined.
> : > :
> : > : Speaking of the Germans, they were also pretty good at quashing
> : > : dissent in occupied territories, (and I'm not talking about the SS
> : > : operations and concentration camps.) Any time a German soldier was
> : > : killed by an underground partisan, the Germans lined up ten local
> : > : civilians at random and executed them on the spot.
> : > :
> : > : This may sound inhumane, but which is worse, lancing the boil or
> : > : letting it fester? If we don't start getting serious we are going to
> : > : come home from Iraq in defeat, which will only reinforce the mindset
> : > : of the terrorists and make it open season on American civilians
> : > : everywhere. Personally, I prefer 10 dead Iraqis over 1 dead
American
> : > : any day.
> : > :
> : > : You have to break a few eggs to make the omlette. The terrorists
and
> : > : underground fighters in Iraq should be glad I'm not in charge. I'd
> : > : start by giving everyone in Tikrit 30 minutes notice to get out,
then
> : > : I'd firebomb the place off the map. Then massively disproportional
> : > : civilian reprisals for every future scratch suffered by US forces.
> : > : I'd bet $100 to $1 that would calm the place down real darn quick.
> : > :
> : > : The downside is that this would make the "Arab Street" angry with
us,
> : > : the Europeans would no longer be our faithful allies, and liberals
> : > : would start calling Bush a war criminal. (Which is, of course,
> : > : totally unlike the situation that exists at the current moment.)
> : > :
> : > : I also don't understand why we don't seize the Iraqi oil fields and
> : > : sell the oil wherever we please to pay for the billion dollar per
> : > : month occupation cost. But that's another subject and I do believe
I
> : > : have gotten my 2 cents worth for today.
> : >
> : >
> :
> :
>
>

Dave Milne

Which brings us neatly back to the Mr Nelson's idea of inflicting it on
the Iraqi people to get the extremists ; won't work (I think we both agree)
and morally wrong (possibly you disagree ?).


Dave Milne, Scotland
'99 TJ 4.0 Sahara

"A.H. MacIntosh aka USERNAME" <chesshire_cat@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:MIn6b.6512$cQ1.1854760@kent.svc.tds.net...
I believe that it was an attempt to force the German
: surrender... but madmen don't surrender.

Dave Milne

Which brings us neatly back to the Mr Nelson's idea of inflicting it on
the Iraqi people to get the extremists ; won't work (I think we both agree)
and morally wrong (possibly you disagree ?).


Dave Milne, Scotland
'99 TJ 4.0 Sahara

"A.H. MacIntosh aka USERNAME" <chesshire_cat@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:MIn6b.6512$cQ1.1854760@kent.svc.tds.net...
I believe that it was an attempt to force the German
: surrender... but madmen don't surrender.

Brian

At some level, it doesn't matter what the government of Iraq is, or who
is running the oil fields. Iraqi oil will be sold on the world market,
where the US is the largest importer.

B

In article <Gf46b.417$w41.411@nwrdny02.gnilink.net>,
"curt" <h_curtis@verizon.net> wrote:

> " He said that 90% of the Iraqi people are glad the Americans are there."
>
> I would have to question this guys credibility. 90%? I must be reading the
> wrong media (around the world). Maybe he ment 10% and 90% would like us to
> leave so they can keep thier oil.
>
> Curt
>
>

--
Brian Heller

It is easier to tame wild beasts
than to conquer the human mind.