Last tire question, I promise
04-19-2004, 03:00 PM
#71
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Open Diff Traction Technique: Was: Last tire question, I promise
That trick has saved me from being on the receiving end of a strap a few
times.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Drink wrote:
>
> Just as a small point of order, we shouldn't think in absolutes. With a
> stock, open differential, the power goes to the tire that's moving faster.
> When one tire turns faster (as in a turn) the spider gears are effectively
> multiplying the torque to that tire. This is perfect in a tight turn with
> no tires spinning because the total torque from the driveshaft is
> distributed between the tires and relieves the stress that would be placed
> on the spider gears. The problem with this setup comes when one tire loses
> traction.
> When one tire loses traction, it turns more (spins) and the torque is
> multiplied to that tire and divided from the other. Now, the downward
> spiral begins as the spinning tire gets more power to spin faster. The
> faster that tire spins, the less traction it has and the firmly planted tire
> gets even less power even though it has more traction.
> In a world of absolutes, the tire with more traction would have zero
> power. But, it actually does receive some power but only as much as the
> spinning tire (which is very little). So, here's the bottom line.
> If you're in a bad situation like one tire spins on oily, glassy ice and
> the other is planted on hot, dry pavement, don't expect to move with gas
> pedal alone. But, if both tires are in slick mud, one tire might spin more
> but you may have enough to the other tire to help if you don't romp on the
> throttle and spin it out of control. You might be disheartened at this
> point but we can try to trick the differential with an old technique.
> If you apply a little brake pressure, the spinning tire will have drag on
> it. That will trick that stock, open differential into thinking the
> offending tire has traction and distribute more power to the other tire.
> You might think that, "It's braking the stationary tire too" but that tire's
> not moving much anyway and now it'll have more power.
> I know a lot of the guys here know this technique but I wanted to make
> sure some of the newcomers got this corporate knowledge.
> o_o_o_o
> Best Regards, /| ,[_____],
> Jim, WP3JQ |ŻŻŻL --O|||||||O-
> ()_)Ż()_) ŻŻŻŻŻ )_)
> EM60qk 30.447439N 086.628959W
> "viriiman" <addresschanged@NOSPAM.hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:GKSdne99orFbd_DdRVn-ig@comcast.com...
> > > If you just have a locker or limited slip in the rear, then you need to
> > > use the smaller spare on the front only which means 2 tire changes if a
> > > rear goes flat. One front one to the back, the spare to the front.
> >
> > With a limited slip the tire with the least amount of grip spins and the
> one
> > with the best grip doesn't get any power, correct?
times.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Drink wrote:
>
> Just as a small point of order, we shouldn't think in absolutes. With a
> stock, open differential, the power goes to the tire that's moving faster.
> When one tire turns faster (as in a turn) the spider gears are effectively
> multiplying the torque to that tire. This is perfect in a tight turn with
> no tires spinning because the total torque from the driveshaft is
> distributed between the tires and relieves the stress that would be placed
> on the spider gears. The problem with this setup comes when one tire loses
> traction.
> When one tire loses traction, it turns more (spins) and the torque is
> multiplied to that tire and divided from the other. Now, the downward
> spiral begins as the spinning tire gets more power to spin faster. The
> faster that tire spins, the less traction it has and the firmly planted tire
> gets even less power even though it has more traction.
> In a world of absolutes, the tire with more traction would have zero
> power. But, it actually does receive some power but only as much as the
> spinning tire (which is very little). So, here's the bottom line.
> If you're in a bad situation like one tire spins on oily, glassy ice and
> the other is planted on hot, dry pavement, don't expect to move with gas
> pedal alone. But, if both tires are in slick mud, one tire might spin more
> but you may have enough to the other tire to help if you don't romp on the
> throttle and spin it out of control. You might be disheartened at this
> point but we can try to trick the differential with an old technique.
> If you apply a little brake pressure, the spinning tire will have drag on
> it. That will trick that stock, open differential into thinking the
> offending tire has traction and distribute more power to the other tire.
> You might think that, "It's braking the stationary tire too" but that tire's
> not moving much anyway and now it'll have more power.
> I know a lot of the guys here know this technique but I wanted to make
> sure some of the newcomers got this corporate knowledge.
> o_o_o_o
> Best Regards, /| ,[_____],
> Jim, WP3JQ |ŻŻŻL --O|||||||O-
> ()_)Ż()_) ŻŻŻŻŻ )_)
> EM60qk 30.447439N 086.628959W
> "viriiman" <addresschanged@NOSPAM.hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:GKSdne99orFbd_DdRVn-ig@comcast.com...
> > > If you just have a locker or limited slip in the rear, then you need to
> > > use the smaller spare on the front only which means 2 tire changes if a
> > > rear goes flat. One front one to the back, the spare to the front.
> >
> > With a limited slip the tire with the least amount of grip spins and the
> one
> > with the best grip doesn't get any power, correct?
04-19-2004, 03:00 PM
#72
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Open Diff Traction Technique: Was: Last tire question, I promise
That trick has saved me from being on the receiving end of a strap a few
times.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Drink wrote:
>
> Just as a small point of order, we shouldn't think in absolutes. With a
> stock, open differential, the power goes to the tire that's moving faster.
> When one tire turns faster (as in a turn) the spider gears are effectively
> multiplying the torque to that tire. This is perfect in a tight turn with
> no tires spinning because the total torque from the driveshaft is
> distributed between the tires and relieves the stress that would be placed
> on the spider gears. The problem with this setup comes when one tire loses
> traction.
> When one tire loses traction, it turns more (spins) and the torque is
> multiplied to that tire and divided from the other. Now, the downward
> spiral begins as the spinning tire gets more power to spin faster. The
> faster that tire spins, the less traction it has and the firmly planted tire
> gets even less power even though it has more traction.
> In a world of absolutes, the tire with more traction would have zero
> power. But, it actually does receive some power but only as much as the
> spinning tire (which is very little). So, here's the bottom line.
> If you're in a bad situation like one tire spins on oily, glassy ice and
> the other is planted on hot, dry pavement, don't expect to move with gas
> pedal alone. But, if both tires are in slick mud, one tire might spin more
> but you may have enough to the other tire to help if you don't romp on the
> throttle and spin it out of control. You might be disheartened at this
> point but we can try to trick the differential with an old technique.
> If you apply a little brake pressure, the spinning tire will have drag on
> it. That will trick that stock, open differential into thinking the
> offending tire has traction and distribute more power to the other tire.
> You might think that, "It's braking the stationary tire too" but that tire's
> not moving much anyway and now it'll have more power.
> I know a lot of the guys here know this technique but I wanted to make
> sure some of the newcomers got this corporate knowledge.
> o_o_o_o
> Best Regards, /| ,[_____],
> Jim, WP3JQ |ŻŻŻL --O|||||||O-
> ()_)Ż()_) ŻŻŻŻŻ )_)
> EM60qk 30.447439N 086.628959W
> "viriiman" <addresschanged@NOSPAM.hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:GKSdne99orFbd_DdRVn-ig@comcast.com...
> > > If you just have a locker or limited slip in the rear, then you need to
> > > use the smaller spare on the front only which means 2 tire changes if a
> > > rear goes flat. One front one to the back, the spare to the front.
> >
> > With a limited slip the tire with the least amount of grip spins and the
> one
> > with the best grip doesn't get any power, correct?
times.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Drink wrote:
>
> Just as a small point of order, we shouldn't think in absolutes. With a
> stock, open differential, the power goes to the tire that's moving faster.
> When one tire turns faster (as in a turn) the spider gears are effectively
> multiplying the torque to that tire. This is perfect in a tight turn with
> no tires spinning because the total torque from the driveshaft is
> distributed between the tires and relieves the stress that would be placed
> on the spider gears. The problem with this setup comes when one tire loses
> traction.
> When one tire loses traction, it turns more (spins) and the torque is
> multiplied to that tire and divided from the other. Now, the downward
> spiral begins as the spinning tire gets more power to spin faster. The
> faster that tire spins, the less traction it has and the firmly planted tire
> gets even less power even though it has more traction.
> In a world of absolutes, the tire with more traction would have zero
> power. But, it actually does receive some power but only as much as the
> spinning tire (which is very little). So, here's the bottom line.
> If you're in a bad situation like one tire spins on oily, glassy ice and
> the other is planted on hot, dry pavement, don't expect to move with gas
> pedal alone. But, if both tires are in slick mud, one tire might spin more
> but you may have enough to the other tire to help if you don't romp on the
> throttle and spin it out of control. You might be disheartened at this
> point but we can try to trick the differential with an old technique.
> If you apply a little brake pressure, the spinning tire will have drag on
> it. That will trick that stock, open differential into thinking the
> offending tire has traction and distribute more power to the other tire.
> You might think that, "It's braking the stationary tire too" but that tire's
> not moving much anyway and now it'll have more power.
> I know a lot of the guys here know this technique but I wanted to make
> sure some of the newcomers got this corporate knowledge.
> o_o_o_o
> Best Regards, /| ,[_____],
> Jim, WP3JQ |ŻŻŻL --O|||||||O-
> ()_)Ż()_) ŻŻŻŻŻ )_)
> EM60qk 30.447439N 086.628959W
> "viriiman" <addresschanged@NOSPAM.hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:GKSdne99orFbd_DdRVn-ig@comcast.com...
> > > If you just have a locker or limited slip in the rear, then you need to
> > > use the smaller spare on the front only which means 2 tire changes if a
> > > rear goes flat. One front one to the back, the spare to the front.
> >
> > With a limited slip the tire with the least amount of grip spins and the
> one
> > with the best grip doesn't get any power, correct?
04-19-2004, 03:00 PM
#73
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Open Diff Traction Technique: Was: Last tire question, I promise
That trick has saved me from being on the receiving end of a strap a few
times.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Drink wrote:
>
> Just as a small point of order, we shouldn't think in absolutes. With a
> stock, open differential, the power goes to the tire that's moving faster.
> When one tire turns faster (as in a turn) the spider gears are effectively
> multiplying the torque to that tire. This is perfect in a tight turn with
> no tires spinning because the total torque from the driveshaft is
> distributed between the tires and relieves the stress that would be placed
> on the spider gears. The problem with this setup comes when one tire loses
> traction.
> When one tire loses traction, it turns more (spins) and the torque is
> multiplied to that tire and divided from the other. Now, the downward
> spiral begins as the spinning tire gets more power to spin faster. The
> faster that tire spins, the less traction it has and the firmly planted tire
> gets even less power even though it has more traction.
> In a world of absolutes, the tire with more traction would have zero
> power. But, it actually does receive some power but only as much as the
> spinning tire (which is very little). So, here's the bottom line.
> If you're in a bad situation like one tire spins on oily, glassy ice and
> the other is planted on hot, dry pavement, don't expect to move with gas
> pedal alone. But, if both tires are in slick mud, one tire might spin more
> but you may have enough to the other tire to help if you don't romp on the
> throttle and spin it out of control. You might be disheartened at this
> point but we can try to trick the differential with an old technique.
> If you apply a little brake pressure, the spinning tire will have drag on
> it. That will trick that stock, open differential into thinking the
> offending tire has traction and distribute more power to the other tire.
> You might think that, "It's braking the stationary tire too" but that tire's
> not moving much anyway and now it'll have more power.
> I know a lot of the guys here know this technique but I wanted to make
> sure some of the newcomers got this corporate knowledge.
> o_o_o_o
> Best Regards, /| ,[_____],
> Jim, WP3JQ |ŻŻŻL --O|||||||O-
> ()_)Ż()_) ŻŻŻŻŻ )_)
> EM60qk 30.447439N 086.628959W
> "viriiman" <addresschanged@NOSPAM.hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:GKSdne99orFbd_DdRVn-ig@comcast.com...
> > > If you just have a locker or limited slip in the rear, then you need to
> > > use the smaller spare on the front only which means 2 tire changes if a
> > > rear goes flat. One front one to the back, the spare to the front.
> >
> > With a limited slip the tire with the least amount of grip spins and the
> one
> > with the best grip doesn't get any power, correct?
times.
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Drink wrote:
>
> Just as a small point of order, we shouldn't think in absolutes. With a
> stock, open differential, the power goes to the tire that's moving faster.
> When one tire turns faster (as in a turn) the spider gears are effectively
> multiplying the torque to that tire. This is perfect in a tight turn with
> no tires spinning because the total torque from the driveshaft is
> distributed between the tires and relieves the stress that would be placed
> on the spider gears. The problem with this setup comes when one tire loses
> traction.
> When one tire loses traction, it turns more (spins) and the torque is
> multiplied to that tire and divided from the other. Now, the downward
> spiral begins as the spinning tire gets more power to spin faster. The
> faster that tire spins, the less traction it has and the firmly planted tire
> gets even less power even though it has more traction.
> In a world of absolutes, the tire with more traction would have zero
> power. But, it actually does receive some power but only as much as the
> spinning tire (which is very little). So, here's the bottom line.
> If you're in a bad situation like one tire spins on oily, glassy ice and
> the other is planted on hot, dry pavement, don't expect to move with gas
> pedal alone. But, if both tires are in slick mud, one tire might spin more
> but you may have enough to the other tire to help if you don't romp on the
> throttle and spin it out of control. You might be disheartened at this
> point but we can try to trick the differential with an old technique.
> If you apply a little brake pressure, the spinning tire will have drag on
> it. That will trick that stock, open differential into thinking the
> offending tire has traction and distribute more power to the other tire.
> You might think that, "It's braking the stationary tire too" but that tire's
> not moving much anyway and now it'll have more power.
> I know a lot of the guys here know this technique but I wanted to make
> sure some of the newcomers got this corporate knowledge.
> o_o_o_o
> Best Regards, /| ,[_____],
> Jim, WP3JQ |ŻŻŻL --O|||||||O-
> ()_)Ż()_) ŻŻŻŻŻ )_)
> EM60qk 30.447439N 086.628959W
> "viriiman" <addresschanged@NOSPAM.hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:GKSdne99orFbd_DdRVn-ig@comcast.com...
> > > If you just have a locker or limited slip in the rear, then you need to
> > > use the smaller spare on the front only which means 2 tire changes if a
> > > rear goes flat. One front one to the back, the spare to the front.
> >
> > With a limited slip the tire with the least amount of grip spins and the
> one
> > with the best grip doesn't get any power, correct?
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