We leased a brand-new Honda Odessey a few years back. Imagine our suprise
when we found a ten-inch-wide puddle of oil under the engine when we pulled
out of the garage on the second day. It was in the shop a total of 4 weeks
in our first two months of ownership. Eventually they had to buy it back
under Michigan's lemon law because the dealership could never fix it.

And the DVD player screen was all screwed up, too.

Better engineered, maybe, maybe not. The arrogance of "This never happens
with Hondas" we encountered at every turn has put me off the brand for good.

"abomb69" <abuse@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:LglHh.2880$tv6.2736@newssvr19.news.prodigy.ne t...
> yeah or toyota
>
> "Earle Horton" <apodo@gracioso.usa> wrote in message
> news:PpednVwBcYxwQ3DYnZ2dnUVZ_rqhnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
>> If you are willing to talk price/quality optimization, I submit that
>> Hondas
>> are the best engineered car in the world.
>>
>> Saludos,
>>
>> Earle
>>
>> "Bret Ludwig" <bretldwig@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> news:1173216259.971728.61600@v33g2000cwv.googlegro ups.com...
>>> The word now is that DCX may split Chrysler (and certainly Jeep will
>>> go with it) off from its corporate structure.
>>>
>>> DCX has been a failure not because of Chrysler, but because of German
>>> management who refuse to make good on the idea under which the merger
>>> was founded...that the two would benefit from American manufacturing
>>> (cheaper than German and with good quality given good management, as
>>> the Japanese US plants and Saturn have proved) and branding and German
>>> engineering.
>>>
>>> Mechanically, the Mercedes Benz is mostly still the best engineered
>>> car in the world. Most of its issues have been electrical. But DCX has
>>> refused to take advantage of US design at all in its products (they
>>> should have bought Delphi when it was in trouble) and also refused to
>>> put the better pieces of Mercedes engineering in the US product,
>>> claiming it would dilute the exclusivity of Mercedes products.
>>>
>>
>>
>
>

 

We leased a brand-new Honda Odessey a few years back. Imagine our suprise
when we found a ten-inch-wide puddle of oil under the engine when we pulled
out of the garage on the second day. It was in the shop a total of 4 weeks
in our first two months of ownership. Eventually they had to buy it back
under Michigan's lemon law because the dealership could never fix it.

And the DVD player screen was all screwed up, too.

Better engineered, maybe, maybe not. The arrogance of "This never happens
with Hondas" we encountered at every turn has put me off the brand for good.

"abomb69" <abuse@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:LglHh.2880$tv6.2736@newssvr19.news.prodigy.ne t...
> yeah or toyota
>
> "Earle Horton" <apodo@gracioso.usa> wrote in message
> news:PpednVwBcYxwQ3DYnZ2dnUVZ_rqhnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
>> If you are willing to talk price/quality optimization, I submit that
>> Hondas
>> are the best engineered car in the world.
>>
>> Saludos,
>>
>> Earle
>>
>> "Bret Ludwig" <bretldwig@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> news:1173216259.971728.61600@v33g2000cwv.googlegro ups.com...
>>> The word now is that DCX may split Chrysler (and certainly Jeep will
>>> go with it) off from its corporate structure.
>>>
>>> DCX has been a failure not because of Chrysler, but because of German
>>> management who refuse to make good on the idea under which the merger
>>> was founded...that the two would benefit from American manufacturing
>>> (cheaper than German and with good quality given good management, as
>>> the Japanese US plants and Saturn have proved) and branding and German
>>> engineering.
>>>
>>> Mechanically, the Mercedes Benz is mostly still the best engineered
>>> car in the world. Most of its issues have been electrical. But DCX has
>>> refused to take advantage of US design at all in its products (they
>>> should have bought Delphi when it was in trouble) and also refused to
>>> put the better pieces of Mercedes engineering in the US product,
>>> claiming it would dilute the exclusivity of Mercedes products.
>>>
>>
>>
>
>

 

Word locally is this is DCX's way of positioning itself for the upcoming UAW
contract talks.....

"Bret Ludwig" <bretldwig@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1173222938.128149.116230@64g2000cwx.googlegro ups.com...
> On Mar 6, 4:43 pm, Mike Romain <roma...@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>> It would appear you just crawled out from under a rock or something...
>>
>> That is pretty old news there Bret...
>>
>> Full moon or something?
>>
>> Oh eclipse, right....
>>
>
> What's more news is the concrete fact that DCX management is sitting
> down with private capital firms to actually do a deal.
>
>

 

Word locally is this is DCX's way of positioning itself for the upcoming UAW
contract talks.....

"Bret Ludwig" <bretldwig@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1173222938.128149.116230@64g2000cwx.googlegro ups.com...
> On Mar 6, 4:43 pm, Mike Romain <roma...@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>> It would appear you just crawled out from under a rock or something...
>>
>> That is pretty old news there Bret...
>>
>> Full moon or something?
>>
>> Oh eclipse, right....
>>
>
> What's more news is the concrete fact that DCX management is sitting
> down with private capital firms to actually do a deal.
>
>

 

Word locally is this is DCX's way of positioning itself for the upcoming UAW
contract talks.....

"Bret Ludwig" <bretldwig@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1173222938.128149.116230@64g2000cwx.googlegro ups.com...
> On Mar 6, 4:43 pm, Mike Romain <roma...@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>> It would appear you just crawled out from under a rock or something...
>>
>> That is pretty old news there Bret...
>>
>> Full moon or something?
>>
>> Oh eclipse, right....
>>
>
> What's more news is the concrete fact that DCX management is sitting
> down with private capital firms to actually do a deal.
>
>

 

I hear you, Sure gets old hearing that you can't do any wrong with a Toyota
or Honda. Tell that guy in the Toyota camary I was following last week on
the highway when his hood decided to open up. Picture driving down the
highway I96 in Detroit doing 55 and not seeing anything. The hood was shaped
like a "C" folded on the roof. Dam! Yimes like that I wish I had a camera.
Better yet picturing the guy dancing on the hood trying to close it after
that. LOL


"Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message
news:XNadnRD8qva_lnPYnZ2dnUVZ_oGlnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
> We leased a brand-new Honda Odessey a few years back. Imagine our suprise
> when we found a ten-inch-wide puddle of oil under the engine when we
> pulled out of the garage on the second day. It was in the shop a total of
> 4 weeks in our first two months of ownership. Eventually they had to buy
> it back under Michigan's lemon law because the dealership could never fix
> it.
>
> And the DVD player screen was all screwed up, too.
>
> Better engineered, maybe, maybe not. The arrogance of "This never happens
> with Hondas" we encountered at every turn has put me off the brand for
> good.
>
> "abomb69" <abuse@verizon.net> wrote in message
> news:LglHh.2880$tv6.2736@newssvr19.news.prodigy.ne t...
>> yeah or toyota
>>
>> "Earle Horton" <apodo@gracioso.usa> wrote in message
>> news:PpednVwBcYxwQ3DYnZ2dnUVZ_rqhnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
>>> If you are willing to talk price/quality optimization, I submit that
>>> Hondas
>>> are the best engineered car in the world.
>>>
>>> Saludos,
>>>
>>> Earle
>>>
>>> "Bret Ludwig" <bretldwig@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>> news:1173216259.971728.61600@v33g2000cwv.googlegro ups.com...
>>>> The word now is that DCX may split Chrysler (and certainly Jeep will
>>>> go with it) off from its corporate structure.
>>>>
>>>> DCX has been a failure not because of Chrysler, but because of German
>>>> management who refuse to make good on the idea under which the merger
>>>> was founded...that the two would benefit from American manufacturing
>>>> (cheaper than German and with good quality given good management, as
>>>> the Japanese US plants and Saturn have proved) and branding and German
>>>> engineering.
>>>>
>>>> Mechanically, the Mercedes Benz is mostly still the best engineered
>>>> car in the world. Most of its issues have been electrical. But DCX has
>>>> refused to take advantage of US design at all in its products (they
>>>> should have bought Delphi when it was in trouble) and also refused to
>>>> put the better pieces of Mercedes engineering in the US product,
>>>> claiming it would dilute the exclusivity of Mercedes products.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>

 

I hear you, Sure gets old hearing that you can't do any wrong with a Toyota
or Honda. Tell that guy in the Toyota camary I was following last week on
the highway when his hood decided to open up. Picture driving down the
highway I96 in Detroit doing 55 and not seeing anything. The hood was shaped
like a "C" folded on the roof. Dam! Yimes like that I wish I had a camera.
Better yet picturing the guy dancing on the hood trying to close it after
that. LOL


"Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message
news:XNadnRD8qva_lnPYnZ2dnUVZ_oGlnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
> We leased a brand-new Honda Odessey a few years back. Imagine our suprise
> when we found a ten-inch-wide puddle of oil under the engine when we
> pulled out of the garage on the second day. It was in the shop a total of
> 4 weeks in our first two months of ownership. Eventually they had to buy
> it back under Michigan's lemon law because the dealership could never fix
> it.
>
> And the DVD player screen was all screwed up, too.
>
> Better engineered, maybe, maybe not. The arrogance of "This never happens
> with Hondas" we encountered at every turn has put me off the brand for
> good.
>
> "abomb69" <abuse@verizon.net> wrote in message
> news:LglHh.2880$tv6.2736@newssvr19.news.prodigy.ne t...
>> yeah or toyota
>>
>> "Earle Horton" <apodo@gracioso.usa> wrote in message
>> news:PpednVwBcYxwQ3DYnZ2dnUVZ_rqhnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
>>> If you are willing to talk price/quality optimization, I submit that
>>> Hondas
>>> are the best engineered car in the world.
>>>
>>> Saludos,
>>>
>>> Earle
>>>
>>> "Bret Ludwig" <bretldwig@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>> news:1173216259.971728.61600@v33g2000cwv.googlegro ups.com...
>>>> The word now is that DCX may split Chrysler (and certainly Jeep will
>>>> go with it) off from its corporate structure.
>>>>
>>>> DCX has been a failure not because of Chrysler, but because of German
>>>> management who refuse to make good on the idea under which the merger
>>>> was founded...that the two would benefit from American manufacturing
>>>> (cheaper than German and with good quality given good management, as
>>>> the Japanese US plants and Saturn have proved) and branding and German
>>>> engineering.
>>>>
>>>> Mechanically, the Mercedes Benz is mostly still the best engineered
>>>> car in the world. Most of its issues have been electrical. But DCX has
>>>> refused to take advantage of US design at all in its products (they
>>>> should have bought Delphi when it was in trouble) and also refused to
>>>> put the better pieces of Mercedes engineering in the US product,
>>>> claiming it would dilute the exclusivity of Mercedes products.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>

 

I hear you, Sure gets old hearing that you can't do any wrong with a Toyota
or Honda. Tell that guy in the Toyota camary I was following last week on
the highway when his hood decided to open up. Picture driving down the
highway I96 in Detroit doing 55 and not seeing anything. The hood was shaped
like a "C" folded on the roof. Dam! Yimes like that I wish I had a camera.
Better yet picturing the guy dancing on the hood trying to close it after
that. LOL


"Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message
news:XNadnRD8qva_lnPYnZ2dnUVZ_oGlnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
> We leased a brand-new Honda Odessey a few years back. Imagine our suprise
> when we found a ten-inch-wide puddle of oil under the engine when we
> pulled out of the garage on the second day. It was in the shop a total of
> 4 weeks in our first two months of ownership. Eventually they had to buy
> it back under Michigan's lemon law because the dealership could never fix
> it.
>
> And the DVD player screen was all screwed up, too.
>
> Better engineered, maybe, maybe not. The arrogance of "This never happens
> with Hondas" we encountered at every turn has put me off the brand for
> good.
>
> "abomb69" <abuse@verizon.net> wrote in message
> news:LglHh.2880$tv6.2736@newssvr19.news.prodigy.ne t...
>> yeah or toyota
>>
>> "Earle Horton" <apodo@gracioso.usa> wrote in message
>> news:PpednVwBcYxwQ3DYnZ2dnUVZ_rqhnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
>>> If you are willing to talk price/quality optimization, I submit that
>>> Hondas
>>> are the best engineered car in the world.
>>>
>>> Saludos,
>>>
>>> Earle
>>>
>>> "Bret Ludwig" <bretldwig@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>> news:1173216259.971728.61600@v33g2000cwv.googlegro ups.com...
>>>> The word now is that DCX may split Chrysler (and certainly Jeep will
>>>> go with it) off from its corporate structure.
>>>>
>>>> DCX has been a failure not because of Chrysler, but because of German
>>>> management who refuse to make good on the idea under which the merger
>>>> was founded...that the two would benefit from American manufacturing
>>>> (cheaper than German and with good quality given good management, as
>>>> the Japanese US plants and Saturn have proved) and branding and German
>>>> engineering.
>>>>
>>>> Mechanically, the Mercedes Benz is mostly still the best engineered
>>>> car in the world. Most of its issues have been electrical. But DCX has
>>>> refused to take advantage of US design at all in its products (they
>>>> should have bought Delphi when it was in trouble) and also refused to
>>>> put the better pieces of Mercedes engineering in the US product,
>>>> claiming it would dilute the exclusivity of Mercedes products.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>

 

That experience is unusual, but it does happen with any make, even Mercedes.
Odyssey is a minivan, isn't it? I've got like 90,000 on my Civic, and I
never did anything except for maintenance items and tires for it. I believe
I have the original tires on the back. I still haven't figured out where
the transmission level check is at.

That arrogant attitude is bad. I've seen it too, in places where you would
never expect it, like Dodge dealerships. ;^)

Earle

"Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message
news:XNadnRD8qva_lnPYnZ2dnUVZ_oGlnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
> We leased a brand-new Honda Odessey a few years back. Imagine our suprise
> when we found a ten-inch-wide puddle of oil under the engine when we
pulled
> out of the garage on the second day. It was in the shop a total of 4 weeks
> in our first two months of ownership. Eventually they had to buy it back
> under Michigan's lemon law because the dealership could never fix it.
>
> And the DVD player screen was all screwed up, too.
>
> Better engineered, maybe, maybe not. The arrogance of "This never happens
> with Hondas" we encountered at every turn has put me off the brand for
good.
>
> "abomb69" <abuse@verizon.net> wrote in message
> news:LglHh.2880$tv6.2736@newssvr19.news.prodigy.ne t...
> > yeah or toyota
> >
> > "Earle Horton" <apodo@gracioso.usa> wrote in message
> > news:PpednVwBcYxwQ3DYnZ2dnUVZ_rqhnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
> >> If you are willing to talk price/quality optimization, I submit that
> >> Hondas
> >> are the best engineered car in the world.
> >>
> >> Saludos,
> >>
> >> Earle
> >>
> >> "Bret Ludwig" <bretldwig@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >> news:1173216259.971728.61600@v33g2000cwv.googlegro ups.com...
> >>> The word now is that DCX may split Chrysler (and certainly Jeep will
> >>> go with it) off from its corporate structure.
> >>>
> >>> DCX has been a failure not because of Chrysler, but because of German
> >>> management who refuse to make good on the idea under which the merger
> >>> was founded...that the two would benefit from American manufacturing
> >>> (cheaper than German and with good quality given good management, as
> >>> the Japanese US plants and Saturn have proved) and branding and German
> >>> engineering.
> >>>
> >>> Mechanically, the Mercedes Benz is mostly still the best engineered
> >>> car in the world. Most of its issues have been electrical. But DCX has
> >>> refused to take advantage of US design at all in its products (they
> >>> should have bought Delphi when it was in trouble) and also refused to
> >>> put the better pieces of Mercedes engineering in the US product,
> >>> claiming it would dilute the exclusivity of Mercedes products.
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>
>

 

That experience is unusual, but it does happen with any make, even Mercedes.
Odyssey is a minivan, isn't it? I've got like 90,000 on my Civic, and I
never did anything except for maintenance items and tires for it. I believe
I have the original tires on the back. I still haven't figured out where
the transmission level check is at.

That arrogant attitude is bad. I've seen it too, in places where you would
never expect it, like Dodge dealerships. ;^)

Earle

"Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message
news:XNadnRD8qva_lnPYnZ2dnUVZ_oGlnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
> We leased a brand-new Honda Odessey a few years back. Imagine our suprise
> when we found a ten-inch-wide puddle of oil under the engine when we
pulled
> out of the garage on the second day. It was in the shop a total of 4 weeks
> in our first two months of ownership. Eventually they had to buy it back
> under Michigan's lemon law because the dealership could never fix it.
>
> And the DVD player screen was all screwed up, too.
>
> Better engineered, maybe, maybe not. The arrogance of "This never happens
> with Hondas" we encountered at every turn has put me off the brand for
good.
>
> "abomb69" <abuse@verizon.net> wrote in message
> news:LglHh.2880$tv6.2736@newssvr19.news.prodigy.ne t...
> > yeah or toyota
> >
> > "Earle Horton" <apodo@gracioso.usa> wrote in message
> > news:PpednVwBcYxwQ3DYnZ2dnUVZ_rqhnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
> >> If you are willing to talk price/quality optimization, I submit that
> >> Hondas
> >> are the best engineered car in the world.
> >>
> >> Saludos,
> >>
> >> Earle
> >>
> >> "Bret Ludwig" <bretldwig@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >> news:1173216259.971728.61600@v33g2000cwv.googlegro ups.com...
> >>> The word now is that DCX may split Chrysler (and certainly Jeep will
> >>> go with it) off from its corporate structure.
> >>>
> >>> DCX has been a failure not because of Chrysler, but because of German
> >>> management who refuse to make good on the idea under which the merger
> >>> was founded...that the two would benefit from American manufacturing
> >>> (cheaper than German and with good quality given good management, as
> >>> the Japanese US plants and Saturn have proved) and branding and German
> >>> engineering.
> >>>
> >>> Mechanically, the Mercedes Benz is mostly still the best engineered
> >>> car in the world. Most of its issues have been electrical. But DCX has
> >>> refused to take advantage of US design at all in its products (they
> >>> should have bought Delphi when it was in trouble) and also refused to
> >>> put the better pieces of Mercedes engineering in the US product,
> >>> claiming it would dilute the exclusivity of Mercedes products.
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>
>