Working on Brakes (especially Rear Drums) - TJ
06-29-2004, 07:54 AM
#41
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Working on Brakes (especially Rear Drums) - TJ
Yep. On most cars, the front brakes do about 70% (+) of the braking. On the
TJ, because of the extra short wheelbase, the fronts
do MUCH more of the braking. The rears do very little of the actual braking.
Try this test. Raise the rear wheels off the ground with a floor jack or
jack stands. With the engine at IDLE and with the transfer case in 2-wheel
drive, put the transmission in drive or 1st gear, then try to stop the rear
wheels from moving with only the foot brake. On my 6-cyl TJ with 3.73 rear
axel ratio, it is almost impossible to stop the rears, even while mashing
the foot brake with all my might. Applying the parking brake will stop the
rears easily.
Tom
"SB" <chicbearsmook@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:O94Ec.322$T6i.195@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.r ogers.com...
> Wow...do the front actually do that much?
>
> Sure feels like it the way the front dives down....
> actually shared an **** clenching experience with a dog today! Nosed down
> and skidded....but all's ok!
>
>
> "mabar" <mabar@NoSpamgrbonline.com> wrote in message
> news:W-OdnQ9Kgs_ZK33dRVn-sA@gbronline.com...
> > Exactly. A combination valve is also called a proportioning valve. It
> > distributes the braking power heavily to the front brakes and
> > much less so to the rears. On a TJ, the front brakes do the lion's share
> of
> > the braking, probably 80 to 90%.
> >
> > Tom
TJ, because of the extra short wheelbase, the fronts
do MUCH more of the braking. The rears do very little of the actual braking.
Try this test. Raise the rear wheels off the ground with a floor jack or
jack stands. With the engine at IDLE and with the transfer case in 2-wheel
drive, put the transmission in drive or 1st gear, then try to stop the rear
wheels from moving with only the foot brake. On my 6-cyl TJ with 3.73 rear
axel ratio, it is almost impossible to stop the rears, even while mashing
the foot brake with all my might. Applying the parking brake will stop the
rears easily.
Tom
"SB" <chicbearsmook@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:O94Ec.322$T6i.195@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.r ogers.com...
> Wow...do the front actually do that much?
>
> Sure feels like it the way the front dives down....
> actually shared an **** clenching experience with a dog today! Nosed down
> and skidded....but all's ok!
>
>
> "mabar" <mabar@NoSpamgrbonline.com> wrote in message
> news:W-OdnQ9Kgs_ZK33dRVn-sA@gbronline.com...
> > Exactly. A combination valve is also called a proportioning valve. It
> > distributes the braking power heavily to the front brakes and
> > much less so to the rears. On a TJ, the front brakes do the lion's share
> of
> > the braking, probably 80 to 90%.
> >
> > Tom
06-29-2004, 09:42 AM
#42
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Working on Brakes (especially Rear Drums) - TJ
I'm pretty sure it's not just that.
I've been getting a seat-of-the-pants feeling that my braking power
has diminished of late; on the highway when traffic has stopped
suddenly, I've found myself having to smash down on the brakes harder
than before to get the jeep to stop in the same amount of time. While
I can still lock the front up, it just doesn't seem to be as
effective.
This last weekend on the trail was my final straw: I was on a slight
incline, and tried to go up a couple of rocks (I was in 2wd), and spun
tires. So, I put the clutch in and hit the brake simultaneously, in
order to put it in 4-low to get through the little bit of rocks. As
soon as the clutch was in, the vehicle proceeded to roll back about
10+ feet, with me standing on the brake pedal (in retrospect, perhaps
I should have pumped it). Either way, it was a bit freaky. The others
in my group said my front wheels were locked up, but my rears were
rolling, as I just rolled backward. It was like my rear brakes were
doing nothing, and just the locking-up and subsequent dragging of my
front wheels was all that stopped me.
The braking improved a bit as the day progressed, but I decided maybe
I'd better check and see if the brakes were (a) in good shape still
and (b) not out of adjustment.
Mike Romain <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:<40E08500.A9E6738F@sympatico.ca>...
> Are you sure you aren't just seeing the effects of a properly working
> combination valve?
>
> It acts like an anti lock brake for the rear wheels so they don't lock
> up easy if at all. Normally you don't want the rears locking, you can
> do 360's faster than you can blink if the rears lock up at speed.
>
> The combination valve stops them from locking until you are almost
> stopped even if you really mash the pedal down.
>
> Mike
> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>
> Bob wrote:
> >
> > Hey...I am about to pull my brakes apart due to some persistent brake
> > fade issues (dry or wet) I've been having with my rear brakes; I want
> > to make sure everything is ok/fix whatever's wrong with them.
> >
> > Anyway, I'm going to start scouring the 'Net tonight to look for info
> > how to work on brakes, diagrams, instructions, etc., especially for
> > the rear drums (the front discs are more straight-forward from what I
> > understand, and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to figure out what's
> > going on with them a little easier).
> >
> > So, if anyone out there can provide me with any links to instructions
> > they've found particularly useful in the past, that would be awesome.
> > Pictures and diagrams are great, too. Bill, if you feel inclined to
> > put up a link to the appropriate section from the FSM or something,
> > that'd be awesome too. Also, any tips or suggestions what all I should
> > do when servicing and checking my brakes (beyond the obvious
> > inspection and replacement if necessary of the pads...) would be
> > great!
> >
> > Thanks everyone.
> >
> > /Bob
> >
> > Applicable specs:
> > 1997 TJ
> > Dana 44 Rear (drum brakes)
> > Dana 30 Front (disc brakes)
> > Stock brakes front and rear.
> > Last brake service performed 15 months ago.
I've been getting a seat-of-the-pants feeling that my braking power
has diminished of late; on the highway when traffic has stopped
suddenly, I've found myself having to smash down on the brakes harder
than before to get the jeep to stop in the same amount of time. While
I can still lock the front up, it just doesn't seem to be as
effective.
This last weekend on the trail was my final straw: I was on a slight
incline, and tried to go up a couple of rocks (I was in 2wd), and spun
tires. So, I put the clutch in and hit the brake simultaneously, in
order to put it in 4-low to get through the little bit of rocks. As
soon as the clutch was in, the vehicle proceeded to roll back about
10+ feet, with me standing on the brake pedal (in retrospect, perhaps
I should have pumped it). Either way, it was a bit freaky. The others
in my group said my front wheels were locked up, but my rears were
rolling, as I just rolled backward. It was like my rear brakes were
doing nothing, and just the locking-up and subsequent dragging of my
front wheels was all that stopped me.
The braking improved a bit as the day progressed, but I decided maybe
I'd better check and see if the brakes were (a) in good shape still
and (b) not out of adjustment.
Mike Romain <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:<40E08500.A9E6738F@sympatico.ca>...
> Are you sure you aren't just seeing the effects of a properly working
> combination valve?
>
> It acts like an anti lock brake for the rear wheels so they don't lock
> up easy if at all. Normally you don't want the rears locking, you can
> do 360's faster than you can blink if the rears lock up at speed.
>
> The combination valve stops them from locking until you are almost
> stopped even if you really mash the pedal down.
>
> Mike
> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>
> Bob wrote:
> >
> > Hey...I am about to pull my brakes apart due to some persistent brake
> > fade issues (dry or wet) I've been having with my rear brakes; I want
> > to make sure everything is ok/fix whatever's wrong with them.
> >
> > Anyway, I'm going to start scouring the 'Net tonight to look for info
> > how to work on brakes, diagrams, instructions, etc., especially for
> > the rear drums (the front discs are more straight-forward from what I
> > understand, and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to figure out what's
> > going on with them a little easier).
> >
> > So, if anyone out there can provide me with any links to instructions
> > they've found particularly useful in the past, that would be awesome.
> > Pictures and diagrams are great, too. Bill, if you feel inclined to
> > put up a link to the appropriate section from the FSM or something,
> > that'd be awesome too. Also, any tips or suggestions what all I should
> > do when servicing and checking my brakes (beyond the obvious
> > inspection and replacement if necessary of the pads...) would be
> > great!
> >
> > Thanks everyone.
> >
> > /Bob
> >
> > Applicable specs:
> > 1997 TJ
> > Dana 44 Rear (drum brakes)
> > Dana 30 Front (disc brakes)
> > Stock brakes front and rear.
> > Last brake service performed 15 months ago.
06-29-2004, 09:42 AM
#43
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Working on Brakes (especially Rear Drums) - TJ
I'm pretty sure it's not just that.
I've been getting a seat-of-the-pants feeling that my braking power
has diminished of late; on the highway when traffic has stopped
suddenly, I've found myself having to smash down on the brakes harder
than before to get the jeep to stop in the same amount of time. While
I can still lock the front up, it just doesn't seem to be as
effective.
This last weekend on the trail was my final straw: I was on a slight
incline, and tried to go up a couple of rocks (I was in 2wd), and spun
tires. So, I put the clutch in and hit the brake simultaneously, in
order to put it in 4-low to get through the little bit of rocks. As
soon as the clutch was in, the vehicle proceeded to roll back about
10+ feet, with me standing on the brake pedal (in retrospect, perhaps
I should have pumped it). Either way, it was a bit freaky. The others
in my group said my front wheels were locked up, but my rears were
rolling, as I just rolled backward. It was like my rear brakes were
doing nothing, and just the locking-up and subsequent dragging of my
front wheels was all that stopped me.
The braking improved a bit as the day progressed, but I decided maybe
I'd better check and see if the brakes were (a) in good shape still
and (b) not out of adjustment.
Mike Romain <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:<40E08500.A9E6738F@sympatico.ca>...
> Are you sure you aren't just seeing the effects of a properly working
> combination valve?
>
> It acts like an anti lock brake for the rear wheels so they don't lock
> up easy if at all. Normally you don't want the rears locking, you can
> do 360's faster than you can blink if the rears lock up at speed.
>
> The combination valve stops them from locking until you are almost
> stopped even if you really mash the pedal down.
>
> Mike
> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>
> Bob wrote:
> >
> > Hey...I am about to pull my brakes apart due to some persistent brake
> > fade issues (dry or wet) I've been having with my rear brakes; I want
> > to make sure everything is ok/fix whatever's wrong with them.
> >
> > Anyway, I'm going to start scouring the 'Net tonight to look for info
> > how to work on brakes, diagrams, instructions, etc., especially for
> > the rear drums (the front discs are more straight-forward from what I
> > understand, and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to figure out what's
> > going on with them a little easier).
> >
> > So, if anyone out there can provide me with any links to instructions
> > they've found particularly useful in the past, that would be awesome.
> > Pictures and diagrams are great, too. Bill, if you feel inclined to
> > put up a link to the appropriate section from the FSM or something,
> > that'd be awesome too. Also, any tips or suggestions what all I should
> > do when servicing and checking my brakes (beyond the obvious
> > inspection and replacement if necessary of the pads...) would be
> > great!
> >
> > Thanks everyone.
> >
> > /Bob
> >
> > Applicable specs:
> > 1997 TJ
> > Dana 44 Rear (drum brakes)
> > Dana 30 Front (disc brakes)
> > Stock brakes front and rear.
> > Last brake service performed 15 months ago.
I've been getting a seat-of-the-pants feeling that my braking power
has diminished of late; on the highway when traffic has stopped
suddenly, I've found myself having to smash down on the brakes harder
than before to get the jeep to stop in the same amount of time. While
I can still lock the front up, it just doesn't seem to be as
effective.
This last weekend on the trail was my final straw: I was on a slight
incline, and tried to go up a couple of rocks (I was in 2wd), and spun
tires. So, I put the clutch in and hit the brake simultaneously, in
order to put it in 4-low to get through the little bit of rocks. As
soon as the clutch was in, the vehicle proceeded to roll back about
10+ feet, with me standing on the brake pedal (in retrospect, perhaps
I should have pumped it). Either way, it was a bit freaky. The others
in my group said my front wheels were locked up, but my rears were
rolling, as I just rolled backward. It was like my rear brakes were
doing nothing, and just the locking-up and subsequent dragging of my
front wheels was all that stopped me.
The braking improved a bit as the day progressed, but I decided maybe
I'd better check and see if the brakes were (a) in good shape still
and (b) not out of adjustment.
Mike Romain <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:<40E08500.A9E6738F@sympatico.ca>...
> Are you sure you aren't just seeing the effects of a properly working
> combination valve?
>
> It acts like an anti lock brake for the rear wheels so they don't lock
> up easy if at all. Normally you don't want the rears locking, you can
> do 360's faster than you can blink if the rears lock up at speed.
>
> The combination valve stops them from locking until you are almost
> stopped even if you really mash the pedal down.
>
> Mike
> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>
> Bob wrote:
> >
> > Hey...I am about to pull my brakes apart due to some persistent brake
> > fade issues (dry or wet) I've been having with my rear brakes; I want
> > to make sure everything is ok/fix whatever's wrong with them.
> >
> > Anyway, I'm going to start scouring the 'Net tonight to look for info
> > how to work on brakes, diagrams, instructions, etc., especially for
> > the rear drums (the front discs are more straight-forward from what I
> > understand, and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to figure out what's
> > going on with them a little easier).
> >
> > So, if anyone out there can provide me with any links to instructions
> > they've found particularly useful in the past, that would be awesome.
> > Pictures and diagrams are great, too. Bill, if you feel inclined to
> > put up a link to the appropriate section from the FSM or something,
> > that'd be awesome too. Also, any tips or suggestions what all I should
> > do when servicing and checking my brakes (beyond the obvious
> > inspection and replacement if necessary of the pads...) would be
> > great!
> >
> > Thanks everyone.
> >
> > /Bob
> >
> > Applicable specs:
> > 1997 TJ
> > Dana 44 Rear (drum brakes)
> > Dana 30 Front (disc brakes)
> > Stock brakes front and rear.
> > Last brake service performed 15 months ago.
06-29-2004, 09:42 AM
#44
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Working on Brakes (especially Rear Drums) - TJ
I'm pretty sure it's not just that.
I've been getting a seat-of-the-pants feeling that my braking power
has diminished of late; on the highway when traffic has stopped
suddenly, I've found myself having to smash down on the brakes harder
than before to get the jeep to stop in the same amount of time. While
I can still lock the front up, it just doesn't seem to be as
effective.
This last weekend on the trail was my final straw: I was on a slight
incline, and tried to go up a couple of rocks (I was in 2wd), and spun
tires. So, I put the clutch in and hit the brake simultaneously, in
order to put it in 4-low to get through the little bit of rocks. As
soon as the clutch was in, the vehicle proceeded to roll back about
10+ feet, with me standing on the brake pedal (in retrospect, perhaps
I should have pumped it). Either way, it was a bit freaky. The others
in my group said my front wheels were locked up, but my rears were
rolling, as I just rolled backward. It was like my rear brakes were
doing nothing, and just the locking-up and subsequent dragging of my
front wheels was all that stopped me.
The braking improved a bit as the day progressed, but I decided maybe
I'd better check and see if the brakes were (a) in good shape still
and (b) not out of adjustment.
Mike Romain <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:<40E08500.A9E6738F@sympatico.ca>...
> Are you sure you aren't just seeing the effects of a properly working
> combination valve?
>
> It acts like an anti lock brake for the rear wheels so they don't lock
> up easy if at all. Normally you don't want the rears locking, you can
> do 360's faster than you can blink if the rears lock up at speed.
>
> The combination valve stops them from locking until you are almost
> stopped even if you really mash the pedal down.
>
> Mike
> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>
> Bob wrote:
> >
> > Hey...I am about to pull my brakes apart due to some persistent brake
> > fade issues (dry or wet) I've been having with my rear brakes; I want
> > to make sure everything is ok/fix whatever's wrong with them.
> >
> > Anyway, I'm going to start scouring the 'Net tonight to look for info
> > how to work on brakes, diagrams, instructions, etc., especially for
> > the rear drums (the front discs are more straight-forward from what I
> > understand, and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to figure out what's
> > going on with them a little easier).
> >
> > So, if anyone out there can provide me with any links to instructions
> > they've found particularly useful in the past, that would be awesome.
> > Pictures and diagrams are great, too. Bill, if you feel inclined to
> > put up a link to the appropriate section from the FSM or something,
> > that'd be awesome too. Also, any tips or suggestions what all I should
> > do when servicing and checking my brakes (beyond the obvious
> > inspection and replacement if necessary of the pads...) would be
> > great!
> >
> > Thanks everyone.
> >
> > /Bob
> >
> > Applicable specs:
> > 1997 TJ
> > Dana 44 Rear (drum brakes)
> > Dana 30 Front (disc brakes)
> > Stock brakes front and rear.
> > Last brake service performed 15 months ago.
I've been getting a seat-of-the-pants feeling that my braking power
has diminished of late; on the highway when traffic has stopped
suddenly, I've found myself having to smash down on the brakes harder
than before to get the jeep to stop in the same amount of time. While
I can still lock the front up, it just doesn't seem to be as
effective.
This last weekend on the trail was my final straw: I was on a slight
incline, and tried to go up a couple of rocks (I was in 2wd), and spun
tires. So, I put the clutch in and hit the brake simultaneously, in
order to put it in 4-low to get through the little bit of rocks. As
soon as the clutch was in, the vehicle proceeded to roll back about
10+ feet, with me standing on the brake pedal (in retrospect, perhaps
I should have pumped it). Either way, it was a bit freaky. The others
in my group said my front wheels were locked up, but my rears were
rolling, as I just rolled backward. It was like my rear brakes were
doing nothing, and just the locking-up and subsequent dragging of my
front wheels was all that stopped me.
The braking improved a bit as the day progressed, but I decided maybe
I'd better check and see if the brakes were (a) in good shape still
and (b) not out of adjustment.
Mike Romain <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:<40E08500.A9E6738F@sympatico.ca>...
> Are you sure you aren't just seeing the effects of a properly working
> combination valve?
>
> It acts like an anti lock brake for the rear wheels so they don't lock
> up easy if at all. Normally you don't want the rears locking, you can
> do 360's faster than you can blink if the rears lock up at speed.
>
> The combination valve stops them from locking until you are almost
> stopped even if you really mash the pedal down.
>
> Mike
> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>
> Bob wrote:
> >
> > Hey...I am about to pull my brakes apart due to some persistent brake
> > fade issues (dry or wet) I've been having with my rear brakes; I want
> > to make sure everything is ok/fix whatever's wrong with them.
> >
> > Anyway, I'm going to start scouring the 'Net tonight to look for info
> > how to work on brakes, diagrams, instructions, etc., especially for
> > the rear drums (the front discs are more straight-forward from what I
> > understand, and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to figure out what's
> > going on with them a little easier).
> >
> > So, if anyone out there can provide me with any links to instructions
> > they've found particularly useful in the past, that would be awesome.
> > Pictures and diagrams are great, too. Bill, if you feel inclined to
> > put up a link to the appropriate section from the FSM or something,
> > that'd be awesome too. Also, any tips or suggestions what all I should
> > do when servicing and checking my brakes (beyond the obvious
> > inspection and replacement if necessary of the pads...) would be
> > great!
> >
> > Thanks everyone.
> >
> > /Bob
> >
> > Applicable specs:
> > 1997 TJ
> > Dana 44 Rear (drum brakes)
> > Dana 30 Front (disc brakes)
> > Stock brakes front and rear.
> > Last brake service performed 15 months ago.
06-29-2004, 09:42 AM
#45
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Working on Brakes (especially Rear Drums) - TJ
I'm pretty sure it's not just that.
I've been getting a seat-of-the-pants feeling that my braking power
has diminished of late; on the highway when traffic has stopped
suddenly, I've found myself having to smash down on the brakes harder
than before to get the jeep to stop in the same amount of time. While
I can still lock the front up, it just doesn't seem to be as
effective.
This last weekend on the trail was my final straw: I was on a slight
incline, and tried to go up a couple of rocks (I was in 2wd), and spun
tires. So, I put the clutch in and hit the brake simultaneously, in
order to put it in 4-low to get through the little bit of rocks. As
soon as the clutch was in, the vehicle proceeded to roll back about
10+ feet, with me standing on the brake pedal (in retrospect, perhaps
I should have pumped it). Either way, it was a bit freaky. The others
in my group said my front wheels were locked up, but my rears were
rolling, as I just rolled backward. It was like my rear brakes were
doing nothing, and just the locking-up and subsequent dragging of my
front wheels was all that stopped me.
The braking improved a bit as the day progressed, but I decided maybe
I'd better check and see if the brakes were (a) in good shape still
and (b) not out of adjustment.
Mike Romain <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:<40E08500.A9E6738F@sympatico.ca>...
> Are you sure you aren't just seeing the effects of a properly working
> combination valve?
>
> It acts like an anti lock brake for the rear wheels so they don't lock
> up easy if at all. Normally you don't want the rears locking, you can
> do 360's faster than you can blink if the rears lock up at speed.
>
> The combination valve stops them from locking until you are almost
> stopped even if you really mash the pedal down.
>
> Mike
> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>
> Bob wrote:
> >
> > Hey...I am about to pull my brakes apart due to some persistent brake
> > fade issues (dry or wet) I've been having with my rear brakes; I want
> > to make sure everything is ok/fix whatever's wrong with them.
> >
> > Anyway, I'm going to start scouring the 'Net tonight to look for info
> > how to work on brakes, diagrams, instructions, etc., especially for
> > the rear drums (the front discs are more straight-forward from what I
> > understand, and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to figure out what's
> > going on with them a little easier).
> >
> > So, if anyone out there can provide me with any links to instructions
> > they've found particularly useful in the past, that would be awesome.
> > Pictures and diagrams are great, too. Bill, if you feel inclined to
> > put up a link to the appropriate section from the FSM or something,
> > that'd be awesome too. Also, any tips or suggestions what all I should
> > do when servicing and checking my brakes (beyond the obvious
> > inspection and replacement if necessary of the pads...) would be
> > great!
> >
> > Thanks everyone.
> >
> > /Bob
> >
> > Applicable specs:
> > 1997 TJ
> > Dana 44 Rear (drum brakes)
> > Dana 30 Front (disc brakes)
> > Stock brakes front and rear.
> > Last brake service performed 15 months ago.
I've been getting a seat-of-the-pants feeling that my braking power
has diminished of late; on the highway when traffic has stopped
suddenly, I've found myself having to smash down on the brakes harder
than before to get the jeep to stop in the same amount of time. While
I can still lock the front up, it just doesn't seem to be as
effective.
This last weekend on the trail was my final straw: I was on a slight
incline, and tried to go up a couple of rocks (I was in 2wd), and spun
tires. So, I put the clutch in and hit the brake simultaneously, in
order to put it in 4-low to get through the little bit of rocks. As
soon as the clutch was in, the vehicle proceeded to roll back about
10+ feet, with me standing on the brake pedal (in retrospect, perhaps
I should have pumped it). Either way, it was a bit freaky. The others
in my group said my front wheels were locked up, but my rears were
rolling, as I just rolled backward. It was like my rear brakes were
doing nothing, and just the locking-up and subsequent dragging of my
front wheels was all that stopped me.
The braking improved a bit as the day progressed, but I decided maybe
I'd better check and see if the brakes were (a) in good shape still
and (b) not out of adjustment.
Mike Romain <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:<40E08500.A9E6738F@sympatico.ca>...
> Are you sure you aren't just seeing the effects of a properly working
> combination valve?
>
> It acts like an anti lock brake for the rear wheels so they don't lock
> up easy if at all. Normally you don't want the rears locking, you can
> do 360's faster than you can blink if the rears lock up at speed.
>
> The combination valve stops them from locking until you are almost
> stopped even if you really mash the pedal down.
>
> Mike
> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>
> Bob wrote:
> >
> > Hey...I am about to pull my brakes apart due to some persistent brake
> > fade issues (dry or wet) I've been having with my rear brakes; I want
> > to make sure everything is ok/fix whatever's wrong with them.
> >
> > Anyway, I'm going to start scouring the 'Net tonight to look for info
> > how to work on brakes, diagrams, instructions, etc., especially for
> > the rear drums (the front discs are more straight-forward from what I
> > understand, and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to figure out what's
> > going on with them a little easier).
> >
> > So, if anyone out there can provide me with any links to instructions
> > they've found particularly useful in the past, that would be awesome.
> > Pictures and diagrams are great, too. Bill, if you feel inclined to
> > put up a link to the appropriate section from the FSM or something,
> > that'd be awesome too. Also, any tips or suggestions what all I should
> > do when servicing and checking my brakes (beyond the obvious
> > inspection and replacement if necessary of the pads...) would be
> > great!
> >
> > Thanks everyone.
> >
> > /Bob
> >
> > Applicable specs:
> > 1997 TJ
> > Dana 44 Rear (drum brakes)
> > Dana 30 Front (disc brakes)
> > Stock brakes front and rear.
> > Last brake service performed 15 months ago.
06-29-2004, 09:43 AM
#46
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Working on Brakes (especially Rear Drums) - TJ
Thanks, Bill.
Mabar, thanks for the link.
/Bob
L.W.(ßill) ------ III <----------@***.net> wrote in message news:<40E088DD.DE1C548A@***.net>...
> Hi Bob,
> Start out by using a good product Bendix or Raybestos:
> http://www.raybestos.com/usa/brakepads.htm
> A couple of pictures:
> http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/axl...2/DSCN0915.jpg and
> http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/axl...2/DSCN0913.jpg
> The tricks I use with drum brakes, is to remove the wheels and
> slide them under the frame for a little extra protection in case I jar
> it off it's blocks. Usually the drums stick a little to the hub, I
> squirt the lugs and center with with WD-40 and hit it with a hammer at
> the drum's edge like you were going push it back on and make it ring
> like a bell, usually it pop lose, back at you. Rather than the twenty
> years I did blowing the asbestos off with air, I've found that a blast
> with the garden hose does a much better job of containing the dust and
> cleaning the parts you'll use again, then disassemble. As you
> disassemble place the parts on the tire rim you have lying beside you so
> as they are in the same position as they look on the backing plate, will
> help immensely with the different color coded springs on reassemble. If
> you heard a metal to metal sound before you started work on the brakes,
> then you may have to poke a small screwdriver through the backing plate
> to push the ratchet lever back and release the star, and another to back
> it off before the drum will come off.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Bob wrote:
> >
> > Hey...I am about to pull my brakes apart due to some persistent brake
> > fade issues (dry or wet) I've been having with my rear brakes; I want
> > to make sure everything is ok/fix whatever's wrong with them.
> >
> > Anyway, I'm going to start scouring the 'Net tonight to look for info
> > how to work on brakes, diagrams, instructions, etc., especially for
> > the rear drums (the front discs are more straight-forward from what I
> > understand, and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to figure out what's
> > going on with them a little easier).
> >
> > So, if anyone out there can provide me with any links to instructions
> > they've found particularly useful in the past, that would be awesome.
> > Pictures and diagrams are great, too. Bill, if you feel inclined to
> > put up a link to the appropriate section from the FSM or something,
> > that'd be awesome too. Also, any tips or suggestions what all I should
> > do when servicing and checking my brakes (beyond the obvious
> > inspection and replacement if necessary of the pads...) would be
> > great!
> >
> > Thanks everyone.
> >
> > /Bob
> >
> > Applicable specs:
> > 1997 TJ
> > Dana 44 Rear (drum brakes)
> > Dana 30 Front (disc brakes)
> > Stock brakes front and rear.
> > Last brake service performed 15 months ago.
Mabar, thanks for the link.
/Bob
L.W.(ßill) ------ III <----------@***.net> wrote in message news:<40E088DD.DE1C548A@***.net>...
> Hi Bob,
> Start out by using a good product Bendix or Raybestos:
> http://www.raybestos.com/usa/brakepads.htm
> A couple of pictures:
> http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/axl...2/DSCN0915.jpg and
> http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/axl...2/DSCN0913.jpg
> The tricks I use with drum brakes, is to remove the wheels and
> slide them under the frame for a little extra protection in case I jar
> it off it's blocks. Usually the drums stick a little to the hub, I
> squirt the lugs and center with with WD-40 and hit it with a hammer at
> the drum's edge like you were going push it back on and make it ring
> like a bell, usually it pop lose, back at you. Rather than the twenty
> years I did blowing the asbestos off with air, I've found that a blast
> with the garden hose does a much better job of containing the dust and
> cleaning the parts you'll use again, then disassemble. As you
> disassemble place the parts on the tire rim you have lying beside you so
> as they are in the same position as they look on the backing plate, will
> help immensely with the different color coded springs on reassemble. If
> you heard a metal to metal sound before you started work on the brakes,
> then you may have to poke a small screwdriver through the backing plate
> to push the ratchet lever back and release the star, and another to back
> it off before the drum will come off.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Bob wrote:
> >
> > Hey...I am about to pull my brakes apart due to some persistent brake
> > fade issues (dry or wet) I've been having with my rear brakes; I want
> > to make sure everything is ok/fix whatever's wrong with them.
> >
> > Anyway, I'm going to start scouring the 'Net tonight to look for info
> > how to work on brakes, diagrams, instructions, etc., especially for
> > the rear drums (the front discs are more straight-forward from what I
> > understand, and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to figure out what's
> > going on with them a little easier).
> >
> > So, if anyone out there can provide me with any links to instructions
> > they've found particularly useful in the past, that would be awesome.
> > Pictures and diagrams are great, too. Bill, if you feel inclined to
> > put up a link to the appropriate section from the FSM or something,
> > that'd be awesome too. Also, any tips or suggestions what all I should
> > do when servicing and checking my brakes (beyond the obvious
> > inspection and replacement if necessary of the pads...) would be
> > great!
> >
> > Thanks everyone.
> >
> > /Bob
> >
> > Applicable specs:
> > 1997 TJ
> > Dana 44 Rear (drum brakes)
> > Dana 30 Front (disc brakes)
> > Stock brakes front and rear.
> > Last brake service performed 15 months ago.
06-29-2004, 09:43 AM
#47
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Working on Brakes (especially Rear Drums) - TJ
Thanks, Bill.
Mabar, thanks for the link.
/Bob
L.W.(ßill) ------ III <----------@***.net> wrote in message news:<40E088DD.DE1C548A@***.net>...
> Hi Bob,
> Start out by using a good product Bendix or Raybestos:
> http://www.raybestos.com/usa/brakepads.htm
> A couple of pictures:
> http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/axl...2/DSCN0915.jpg and
> http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/axl...2/DSCN0913.jpg
> The tricks I use with drum brakes, is to remove the wheels and
> slide them under the frame for a little extra protection in case I jar
> it off it's blocks. Usually the drums stick a little to the hub, I
> squirt the lugs and center with with WD-40 and hit it with a hammer at
> the drum's edge like you were going push it back on and make it ring
> like a bell, usually it pop lose, back at you. Rather than the twenty
> years I did blowing the asbestos off with air, I've found that a blast
> with the garden hose does a much better job of containing the dust and
> cleaning the parts you'll use again, then disassemble. As you
> disassemble place the parts on the tire rim you have lying beside you so
> as they are in the same position as they look on the backing plate, will
> help immensely with the different color coded springs on reassemble. If
> you heard a metal to metal sound before you started work on the brakes,
> then you may have to poke a small screwdriver through the backing plate
> to push the ratchet lever back and release the star, and another to back
> it off before the drum will come off.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Bob wrote:
> >
> > Hey...I am about to pull my brakes apart due to some persistent brake
> > fade issues (dry or wet) I've been having with my rear brakes; I want
> > to make sure everything is ok/fix whatever's wrong with them.
> >
> > Anyway, I'm going to start scouring the 'Net tonight to look for info
> > how to work on brakes, diagrams, instructions, etc., especially for
> > the rear drums (the front discs are more straight-forward from what I
> > understand, and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to figure out what's
> > going on with them a little easier).
> >
> > So, if anyone out there can provide me with any links to instructions
> > they've found particularly useful in the past, that would be awesome.
> > Pictures and diagrams are great, too. Bill, if you feel inclined to
> > put up a link to the appropriate section from the FSM or something,
> > that'd be awesome too. Also, any tips or suggestions what all I should
> > do when servicing and checking my brakes (beyond the obvious
> > inspection and replacement if necessary of the pads...) would be
> > great!
> >
> > Thanks everyone.
> >
> > /Bob
> >
> > Applicable specs:
> > 1997 TJ
> > Dana 44 Rear (drum brakes)
> > Dana 30 Front (disc brakes)
> > Stock brakes front and rear.
> > Last brake service performed 15 months ago.
Mabar, thanks for the link.
/Bob
L.W.(ßill) ------ III <----------@***.net> wrote in message news:<40E088DD.DE1C548A@***.net>...
> Hi Bob,
> Start out by using a good product Bendix or Raybestos:
> http://www.raybestos.com/usa/brakepads.htm
> A couple of pictures:
> http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/axl...2/DSCN0915.jpg and
> http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/axl...2/DSCN0913.jpg
> The tricks I use with drum brakes, is to remove the wheels and
> slide them under the frame for a little extra protection in case I jar
> it off it's blocks. Usually the drums stick a little to the hub, I
> squirt the lugs and center with with WD-40 and hit it with a hammer at
> the drum's edge like you were going push it back on and make it ring
> like a bell, usually it pop lose, back at you. Rather than the twenty
> years I did blowing the asbestos off with air, I've found that a blast
> with the garden hose does a much better job of containing the dust and
> cleaning the parts you'll use again, then disassemble. As you
> disassemble place the parts on the tire rim you have lying beside you so
> as they are in the same position as they look on the backing plate, will
> help immensely with the different color coded springs on reassemble. If
> you heard a metal to metal sound before you started work on the brakes,
> then you may have to poke a small screwdriver through the backing plate
> to push the ratchet lever back and release the star, and another to back
> it off before the drum will come off.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Bob wrote:
> >
> > Hey...I am about to pull my brakes apart due to some persistent brake
> > fade issues (dry or wet) I've been having with my rear brakes; I want
> > to make sure everything is ok/fix whatever's wrong with them.
> >
> > Anyway, I'm going to start scouring the 'Net tonight to look for info
> > how to work on brakes, diagrams, instructions, etc., especially for
> > the rear drums (the front discs are more straight-forward from what I
> > understand, and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to figure out what's
> > going on with them a little easier).
> >
> > So, if anyone out there can provide me with any links to instructions
> > they've found particularly useful in the past, that would be awesome.
> > Pictures and diagrams are great, too. Bill, if you feel inclined to
> > put up a link to the appropriate section from the FSM or something,
> > that'd be awesome too. Also, any tips or suggestions what all I should
> > do when servicing and checking my brakes (beyond the obvious
> > inspection and replacement if necessary of the pads...) would be
> > great!
> >
> > Thanks everyone.
> >
> > /Bob
> >
> > Applicable specs:
> > 1997 TJ
> > Dana 44 Rear (drum brakes)
> > Dana 30 Front (disc brakes)
> > Stock brakes front and rear.
> > Last brake service performed 15 months ago.
06-29-2004, 09:43 AM
#48
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Working on Brakes (especially Rear Drums) - TJ
Thanks, Bill.
Mabar, thanks for the link.
/Bob
L.W.(ßill) ------ III <----------@***.net> wrote in message news:<40E088DD.DE1C548A@***.net>...
> Hi Bob,
> Start out by using a good product Bendix or Raybestos:
> http://www.raybestos.com/usa/brakepads.htm
> A couple of pictures:
> http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/axl...2/DSCN0915.jpg and
> http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/axl...2/DSCN0913.jpg
> The tricks I use with drum brakes, is to remove the wheels and
> slide them under the frame for a little extra protection in case I jar
> it off it's blocks. Usually the drums stick a little to the hub, I
> squirt the lugs and center with with WD-40 and hit it with a hammer at
> the drum's edge like you were going push it back on and make it ring
> like a bell, usually it pop lose, back at you. Rather than the twenty
> years I did blowing the asbestos off with air, I've found that a blast
> with the garden hose does a much better job of containing the dust and
> cleaning the parts you'll use again, then disassemble. As you
> disassemble place the parts on the tire rim you have lying beside you so
> as they are in the same position as they look on the backing plate, will
> help immensely with the different color coded springs on reassemble. If
> you heard a metal to metal sound before you started work on the brakes,
> then you may have to poke a small screwdriver through the backing plate
> to push the ratchet lever back and release the star, and another to back
> it off before the drum will come off.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Bob wrote:
> >
> > Hey...I am about to pull my brakes apart due to some persistent brake
> > fade issues (dry or wet) I've been having with my rear brakes; I want
> > to make sure everything is ok/fix whatever's wrong with them.
> >
> > Anyway, I'm going to start scouring the 'Net tonight to look for info
> > how to work on brakes, diagrams, instructions, etc., especially for
> > the rear drums (the front discs are more straight-forward from what I
> > understand, and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to figure out what's
> > going on with them a little easier).
> >
> > So, if anyone out there can provide me with any links to instructions
> > they've found particularly useful in the past, that would be awesome.
> > Pictures and diagrams are great, too. Bill, if you feel inclined to
> > put up a link to the appropriate section from the FSM or something,
> > that'd be awesome too. Also, any tips or suggestions what all I should
> > do when servicing and checking my brakes (beyond the obvious
> > inspection and replacement if necessary of the pads...) would be
> > great!
> >
> > Thanks everyone.
> >
> > /Bob
> >
> > Applicable specs:
> > 1997 TJ
> > Dana 44 Rear (drum brakes)
> > Dana 30 Front (disc brakes)
> > Stock brakes front and rear.
> > Last brake service performed 15 months ago.
Mabar, thanks for the link.
/Bob
L.W.(ßill) ------ III <----------@***.net> wrote in message news:<40E088DD.DE1C548A@***.net>...
> Hi Bob,
> Start out by using a good product Bendix or Raybestos:
> http://www.raybestos.com/usa/brakepads.htm
> A couple of pictures:
> http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/axl...2/DSCN0915.jpg and
> http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/axl...2/DSCN0913.jpg
> The tricks I use with drum brakes, is to remove the wheels and
> slide them under the frame for a little extra protection in case I jar
> it off it's blocks. Usually the drums stick a little to the hub, I
> squirt the lugs and center with with WD-40 and hit it with a hammer at
> the drum's edge like you were going push it back on and make it ring
> like a bell, usually it pop lose, back at you. Rather than the twenty
> years I did blowing the asbestos off with air, I've found that a blast
> with the garden hose does a much better job of containing the dust and
> cleaning the parts you'll use again, then disassemble. As you
> disassemble place the parts on the tire rim you have lying beside you so
> as they are in the same position as they look on the backing plate, will
> help immensely with the different color coded springs on reassemble. If
> you heard a metal to metal sound before you started work on the brakes,
> then you may have to poke a small screwdriver through the backing plate
> to push the ratchet lever back and release the star, and another to back
> it off before the drum will come off.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Bob wrote:
> >
> > Hey...I am about to pull my brakes apart due to some persistent brake
> > fade issues (dry or wet) I've been having with my rear brakes; I want
> > to make sure everything is ok/fix whatever's wrong with them.
> >
> > Anyway, I'm going to start scouring the 'Net tonight to look for info
> > how to work on brakes, diagrams, instructions, etc., especially for
> > the rear drums (the front discs are more straight-forward from what I
> > understand, and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to figure out what's
> > going on with them a little easier).
> >
> > So, if anyone out there can provide me with any links to instructions
> > they've found particularly useful in the past, that would be awesome.
> > Pictures and diagrams are great, too. Bill, if you feel inclined to
> > put up a link to the appropriate section from the FSM or something,
> > that'd be awesome too. Also, any tips or suggestions what all I should
> > do when servicing and checking my brakes (beyond the obvious
> > inspection and replacement if necessary of the pads...) would be
> > great!
> >
> > Thanks everyone.
> >
> > /Bob
> >
> > Applicable specs:
> > 1997 TJ
> > Dana 44 Rear (drum brakes)
> > Dana 30 Front (disc brakes)
> > Stock brakes front and rear.
> > Last brake service performed 15 months ago.
06-29-2004, 09:43 AM
#49
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Working on Brakes (especially Rear Drums) - TJ
Thanks, Bill.
Mabar, thanks for the link.
/Bob
L.W.(ßill) ------ III <----------@***.net> wrote in message news:<40E088DD.DE1C548A@***.net>...
> Hi Bob,
> Start out by using a good product Bendix or Raybestos:
> http://www.raybestos.com/usa/brakepads.htm
> A couple of pictures:
> http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/axl...2/DSCN0915.jpg and
> http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/axl...2/DSCN0913.jpg
> The tricks I use with drum brakes, is to remove the wheels and
> slide them under the frame for a little extra protection in case I jar
> it off it's blocks. Usually the drums stick a little to the hub, I
> squirt the lugs and center with with WD-40 and hit it with a hammer at
> the drum's edge like you were going push it back on and make it ring
> like a bell, usually it pop lose, back at you. Rather than the twenty
> years I did blowing the asbestos off with air, I've found that a blast
> with the garden hose does a much better job of containing the dust and
> cleaning the parts you'll use again, then disassemble. As you
> disassemble place the parts on the tire rim you have lying beside you so
> as they are in the same position as they look on the backing plate, will
> help immensely with the different color coded springs on reassemble. If
> you heard a metal to metal sound before you started work on the brakes,
> then you may have to poke a small screwdriver through the backing plate
> to push the ratchet lever back and release the star, and another to back
> it off before the drum will come off.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Bob wrote:
> >
> > Hey...I am about to pull my brakes apart due to some persistent brake
> > fade issues (dry or wet) I've been having with my rear brakes; I want
> > to make sure everything is ok/fix whatever's wrong with them.
> >
> > Anyway, I'm going to start scouring the 'Net tonight to look for info
> > how to work on brakes, diagrams, instructions, etc., especially for
> > the rear drums (the front discs are more straight-forward from what I
> > understand, and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to figure out what's
> > going on with them a little easier).
> >
> > So, if anyone out there can provide me with any links to instructions
> > they've found particularly useful in the past, that would be awesome.
> > Pictures and diagrams are great, too. Bill, if you feel inclined to
> > put up a link to the appropriate section from the FSM or something,
> > that'd be awesome too. Also, any tips or suggestions what all I should
> > do when servicing and checking my brakes (beyond the obvious
> > inspection and replacement if necessary of the pads...) would be
> > great!
> >
> > Thanks everyone.
> >
> > /Bob
> >
> > Applicable specs:
> > 1997 TJ
> > Dana 44 Rear (drum brakes)
> > Dana 30 Front (disc brakes)
> > Stock brakes front and rear.
> > Last brake service performed 15 months ago.
Mabar, thanks for the link.
/Bob
L.W.(ßill) ------ III <----------@***.net> wrote in message news:<40E088DD.DE1C548A@***.net>...
> Hi Bob,
> Start out by using a good product Bendix or Raybestos:
> http://www.raybestos.com/usa/brakepads.htm
> A couple of pictures:
> http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/axl...2/DSCN0915.jpg and
> http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/axl...2/DSCN0913.jpg
> The tricks I use with drum brakes, is to remove the wheels and
> slide them under the frame for a little extra protection in case I jar
> it off it's blocks. Usually the drums stick a little to the hub, I
> squirt the lugs and center with with WD-40 and hit it with a hammer at
> the drum's edge like you were going push it back on and make it ring
> like a bell, usually it pop lose, back at you. Rather than the twenty
> years I did blowing the asbestos off with air, I've found that a blast
> with the garden hose does a much better job of containing the dust and
> cleaning the parts you'll use again, then disassemble. As you
> disassemble place the parts on the tire rim you have lying beside you so
> as they are in the same position as they look on the backing plate, will
> help immensely with the different color coded springs on reassemble. If
> you heard a metal to metal sound before you started work on the brakes,
> then you may have to poke a small screwdriver through the backing plate
> to push the ratchet lever back and release the star, and another to back
> it off before the drum will come off.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Bob wrote:
> >
> > Hey...I am about to pull my brakes apart due to some persistent brake
> > fade issues (dry or wet) I've been having with my rear brakes; I want
> > to make sure everything is ok/fix whatever's wrong with them.
> >
> > Anyway, I'm going to start scouring the 'Net tonight to look for info
> > how to work on brakes, diagrams, instructions, etc., especially for
> > the rear drums (the front discs are more straight-forward from what I
> > understand, and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to figure out what's
> > going on with them a little easier).
> >
> > So, if anyone out there can provide me with any links to instructions
> > they've found particularly useful in the past, that would be awesome.
> > Pictures and diagrams are great, too. Bill, if you feel inclined to
> > put up a link to the appropriate section from the FSM or something,
> > that'd be awesome too. Also, any tips or suggestions what all I should
> > do when servicing and checking my brakes (beyond the obvious
> > inspection and replacement if necessary of the pads...) would be
> > great!
> >
> > Thanks everyone.
> >
> > /Bob
> >
> > Applicable specs:
> > 1997 TJ
> > Dana 44 Rear (drum brakes)
> > Dana 30 Front (disc brakes)
> > Stock brakes front and rear.
> > Last brake service performed 15 months ago.
06-29-2004, 09:53 AM
#50
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Working on Brakes (especially Rear Drums) - TJ
On really steep stuff, I have had to use my e-brake on many occasions to
help in those kind of situations. Not just with Jeeps, pickups were way
worse.
Others have posted about not being able to lock the rears at low speeds.
One Jeep out with us actually lost his rear brakes and wow what a
difference. He literally could not stop the roll back on a ravine
climb. He nailed a tree 3 times in sliding backward and we had to drive
around to give him a pull from the front just to get him out of there.
It is worth inspecting though.
Mike
Bob wrote:
>
> I'm pretty sure it's not just that.
>
> I've been getting a seat-of-the-pants feeling that my braking power
> has diminished of late; on the highway when traffic has stopped
> suddenly, I've found myself having to smash down on the brakes harder
> than before to get the jeep to stop in the same amount of time. While
> I can still lock the front up, it just doesn't seem to be as
> effective.
>
> This last weekend on the trail was my final straw: I was on a slight
> incline, and tried to go up a couple of rocks (I was in 2wd), and spun
> tires. So, I put the clutch in and hit the brake simultaneously, in
> order to put it in 4-low to get through the little bit of rocks. As
> soon as the clutch was in, the vehicle proceeded to roll back about
> 10+ feet, with me standing on the brake pedal (in retrospect, perhaps
> I should have pumped it). Either way, it was a bit freaky. The others
> in my group said my front wheels were locked up, but my rears were
> rolling, as I just rolled backward. It was like my rear brakes were
> doing nothing, and just the locking-up and subsequent dragging of my
> front wheels was all that stopped me.
>
> The braking improved a bit as the day progressed, but I decided maybe
> I'd better check and see if the brakes were (a) in good shape still
> and (b) not out of adjustment.
>
> Mike Romain <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:<40E08500.A9E6738F@sympatico.ca>...
> > Are you sure you aren't just seeing the effects of a properly working
> > combination valve?
> >
> > It acts like an anti lock brake for the rear wheels so they don't lock
> > up easy if at all. Normally you don't want the rears locking, you can
> > do 360's faster than you can blink if the rears lock up at speed.
> >
> > The combination valve stops them from locking until you are almost
> > stopped even if you really mash the pedal down.
> >
> > Mike
> > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> >
> > Bob wrote:
> > >
> > > Hey...I am about to pull my brakes apart due to some persistent brake
> > > fade issues (dry or wet) I've been having with my rear brakes; I want
> > > to make sure everything is ok/fix whatever's wrong with them.
> > >
> > > Anyway, I'm going to start scouring the 'Net tonight to look for info
> > > how to work on brakes, diagrams, instructions, etc., especially for
> > > the rear drums (the front discs are more straight-forward from what I
> > > understand, and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to figure out what's
> > > going on with them a little easier).
> > >
> > > So, if anyone out there can provide me with any links to instructions
> > > they've found particularly useful in the past, that would be awesome.
> > > Pictures and diagrams are great, too. Bill, if you feel inclined to
> > > put up a link to the appropriate section from the FSM or something,
> > > that'd be awesome too. Also, any tips or suggestions what all I should
> > > do when servicing and checking my brakes (beyond the obvious
> > > inspection and replacement if necessary of the pads...) would be
> > > great!
> > >
> > > Thanks everyone.
> > >
> > > /Bob
> > >
> > > Applicable specs:
> > > 1997 TJ
> > > Dana 44 Rear (drum brakes)
> > > Dana 30 Front (disc brakes)
> > > Stock brakes front and rear.
> > > Last brake service performed 15 months ago.
help in those kind of situations. Not just with Jeeps, pickups were way
worse.
Others have posted about not being able to lock the rears at low speeds.
One Jeep out with us actually lost his rear brakes and wow what a
difference. He literally could not stop the roll back on a ravine
climb. He nailed a tree 3 times in sliding backward and we had to drive
around to give him a pull from the front just to get him out of there.
It is worth inspecting though.
Mike
Bob wrote:
>
> I'm pretty sure it's not just that.
>
> I've been getting a seat-of-the-pants feeling that my braking power
> has diminished of late; on the highway when traffic has stopped
> suddenly, I've found myself having to smash down on the brakes harder
> than before to get the jeep to stop in the same amount of time. While
> I can still lock the front up, it just doesn't seem to be as
> effective.
>
> This last weekend on the trail was my final straw: I was on a slight
> incline, and tried to go up a couple of rocks (I was in 2wd), and spun
> tires. So, I put the clutch in and hit the brake simultaneously, in
> order to put it in 4-low to get through the little bit of rocks. As
> soon as the clutch was in, the vehicle proceeded to roll back about
> 10+ feet, with me standing on the brake pedal (in retrospect, perhaps
> I should have pumped it). Either way, it was a bit freaky. The others
> in my group said my front wheels were locked up, but my rears were
> rolling, as I just rolled backward. It was like my rear brakes were
> doing nothing, and just the locking-up and subsequent dragging of my
> front wheels was all that stopped me.
>
> The braking improved a bit as the day progressed, but I decided maybe
> I'd better check and see if the brakes were (a) in good shape still
> and (b) not out of adjustment.
>
> Mike Romain <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:<40E08500.A9E6738F@sympatico.ca>...
> > Are you sure you aren't just seeing the effects of a properly working
> > combination valve?
> >
> > It acts like an anti lock brake for the rear wheels so they don't lock
> > up easy if at all. Normally you don't want the rears locking, you can
> > do 360's faster than you can blink if the rears lock up at speed.
> >
> > The combination valve stops them from locking until you are almost
> > stopped even if you really mash the pedal down.
> >
> > Mike
> > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> >
> > Bob wrote:
> > >
> > > Hey...I am about to pull my brakes apart due to some persistent brake
> > > fade issues (dry or wet) I've been having with my rear brakes; I want
> > > to make sure everything is ok/fix whatever's wrong with them.
> > >
> > > Anyway, I'm going to start scouring the 'Net tonight to look for info
> > > how to work on brakes, diagrams, instructions, etc., especially for
> > > the rear drums (the front discs are more straight-forward from what I
> > > understand, and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to figure out what's
> > > going on with them a little easier).
> > >
> > > So, if anyone out there can provide me with any links to instructions
> > > they've found particularly useful in the past, that would be awesome.
> > > Pictures and diagrams are great, too. Bill, if you feel inclined to
> > > put up a link to the appropriate section from the FSM or something,
> > > that'd be awesome too. Also, any tips or suggestions what all I should
> > > do when servicing and checking my brakes (beyond the obvious
> > > inspection and replacement if necessary of the pads...) would be
> > > great!
> > >
> > > Thanks everyone.
> > >
> > > /Bob
> > >
> > > Applicable specs:
> > > 1997 TJ
> > > Dana 44 Rear (drum brakes)
> > > Dana 30 Front (disc brakes)
> > > Stock brakes front and rear.
> > > Last brake service performed 15 months ago.
