Re: What kind of gas?
 

ah........but do they - or should they care, as long as it gets in the right
hole?

--
Carlo F. Serusa, Jr. RPh
carlo.jr@comcast.net
'98 Sahara TJ - '89 YJ - '79 Scout II
O|||||||O
'92 Explorer '65 Mustang


"David Harmon" <source@netcom.com> wrote in message
news:3f66e824.6106378@news.west.earthlink.net...
> On Mon, 08 Sep 2003 05:07:18 GMT in rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys,
> "Carlo Jr." <carlo.jr@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> >I say that pulling up to 80,000lbs of anything through crowded
residential
> >areas, over freeways, over mountain roads, & roads like those of the
Feather
> >River Canyon (all in one day - & sharing these roads with really
> >unintelligent drivers) does require skills that many average or even
above
> >average individuals do not posses.
>
> In addition I am sure they know how to pour the right color of gas
> down the right hole at the station. That doesn't mean they know how
> it is blended or what else goes on back at the refinery.
>

Re: What kind of gas?
 

David Harmon wrote:
>
> On Sat, 06 Sep 2003 21:56:18 GMT in rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys,
> Lon Stowell <lon.stowell@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > I've had two engineers from major oil companies swear up and down
> > that *except* where an octane enhancer just also happens to be
> > useful as an engine detergent, the different grades have no
> > substantive differences in "cleaning additives".
>
> Well you got me beat then, I only heard one oil company guy say the
> same thing. (That was at the lab at Mobil in Torrance Calif.)

Several of them made the newspaper not too long ago up here in Canada
saying the same thing. 'Regular' gas has the same cleaners as 'high
test', they just don't promote the fact at the pumps. The pumps imply
high test has these 'cleaning' additives and leave you guessing about
the other grades.

Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

Re: What kind of gas?
 

David Harmon wrote:
>
> On Sat, 06 Sep 2003 21:56:18 GMT in rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys,
> Lon Stowell <lon.stowell@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > I've had two engineers from major oil companies swear up and down
> > that *except* where an octane enhancer just also happens to be
> > useful as an engine detergent, the different grades have no
> > substantive differences in "cleaning additives".
>
> Well you got me beat then, I only heard one oil company guy say the
> same thing. (That was at the lab at Mobil in Torrance Calif.)

Several of them made the newspaper not too long ago up here in Canada
saying the same thing. 'Regular' gas has the same cleaners as 'high
test', they just don't promote the fact at the pumps. The pumps imply
high test has these 'cleaning' additives and leave you guessing about
the other grades.

Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

Re: What kind of gas?
 

Approximately 9/10/03 21:28, L.W.(ßill) ------ III uttered for posterity:

> ARCO uses an alcohol mix for Kalifornia.

I thought more or less everybody was starting to use alky
as the MTBE is being phased out. Or have they found something
even more toxic and foul tasting than MTBE to replace it with?

Re: What kind of gas?
 

Approximately 9/10/03 21:28, L.W.(ßill) ------ III uttered for posterity:

> ARCO uses an alcohol mix for Kalifornia.

I thought more or less everybody was starting to use alky
as the MTBE is being phased out. Or have they found something
even more toxic and foul tasting than MTBE to replace it with?

Re: What kind of gas?
 

On Thu, 11 Sep 2003 10:19:41 -0700 in rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys,
"Jeff Strickland" <beerman@yahoo.com> is alleged to have written:

>In general, there is no benefit whatsoever to using high test where regular
>is called for by the manufacturer. I suppose if you were taking a long road
>trip, you might want to run a tank or two of high test for some reason, but

I confess that I bought a couple of tanks of high octane this summer
while I was struggling to pass the Smog Check dyno test, but I have
no real idea whether or not it made any difference. I would like to
run the test with both high and low grade gas, but that would cost
money so it's not gonna happen. Anybody try it?

Replacing a nonfunctioning EGR valve definitely made a difference.

Re: What kind of gas?
 

On Thu, 11 Sep 2003 10:19:41 -0700 in rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys,
"Jeff Strickland" <beerman@yahoo.com> is alleged to have written:

>In general, there is no benefit whatsoever to using high test where regular
>is called for by the manufacturer. I suppose if you were taking a long road
>trip, you might want to run a tank or two of high test for some reason, but

I confess that I bought a couple of tanks of high octane this summer
while I was struggling to pass the Smog Check dyno test, but I have
no real idea whether or not it made any difference. I would like to
run the test with both high and low grade gas, but that would cost
money so it's not gonna happen. Anybody try it?

Replacing a nonfunctioning EGR valve definitely made a difference.

Re: What kind of gas?
 

Approximately 9/11/03 13:17, Mike Romain uttered for posterity:

> David Harmon wrote:
>>
>> On Thu, 11 Sep 2003 10:19:41 -0700 in rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys,
>> "Jeff Strickland" <beerman@yahoo.com> is alleged to have written:
>>
>> >In general, there is no benefit whatsoever to using high test where regular
>> >is called for by the manufacturer. I suppose if you were taking a long road
>> >trip, you might want to run a tank or two of high test for some reason, but
>>
>> I confess that I bought a couple of tanks of high octane this summer
>> while I was struggling to pass the Smog Check dyno test, but I have
>> no real idea whether or not it made any difference. I would like to
>> run the test with both high and low grade gas, but that would cost
>> money so it's not gonna happen. Anybody try it?
>>
>> Replacing a nonfunctioning EGR valve definitely made a difference.
>
> High test has more octane which actually slows down the burn of the
> gas. That is what it is for, so in a high compression situation , the
> gas won't explode from compression like diesel, it will wait for the
> spark plug to set it off.

The chemical soups used to get the higher octane may in some
mixes also provide a higher detergency and lower emissions. The
smog checkers locally typically suggest running at least one full
tank of premium brand premium thru an engine then come to the
test station with premium in the tank on engines that might
otherwise be a bit marginal or have failed a "pre-test".

Dunno how well this works with the new Kalifornia smog tests...
but expect to find out in the next month or so.

Re: What kind of gas?
 

Approximately 9/11/03 13:17, Mike Romain uttered for posterity:

> David Harmon wrote:
>>
>> On Thu, 11 Sep 2003 10:19:41 -0700 in rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys,
>> "Jeff Strickland" <beerman@yahoo.com> is alleged to have written:
>>
>> >In general, there is no benefit whatsoever to using high test where regular
>> >is called for by the manufacturer. I suppose if you were taking a long road
>> >trip, you might want to run a tank or two of high test for some reason, but
>>
>> I confess that I bought a couple of tanks of high octane this summer
>> while I was struggling to pass the Smog Check dyno test, but I have
>> no real idea whether or not it made any difference. I would like to
>> run the test with both high and low grade gas, but that would cost
>> money so it's not gonna happen. Anybody try it?
>>
>> Replacing a nonfunctioning EGR valve definitely made a difference.
>
> High test has more octane which actually slows down the burn of the
> gas. That is what it is for, so in a high compression situation , the
> gas won't explode from compression like diesel, it will wait for the
> spark plug to set it off.

The chemical soups used to get the higher octane may in some
mixes also provide a higher detergency and lower emissions. The
smog checkers locally typically suggest running at least one full
tank of premium brand premium thru an engine then come to the
test station with premium in the tank on engines that might
otherwise be a bit marginal or have failed a "pre-test".

Dunno how well this works with the new Kalifornia smog tests...
but expect to find out in the next month or so.

Re: What kind of gas?
 

On Thu, 11 Sep 2003 13:07:41 -0700 in rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys,
"Jeff Strickland" <beerman@yahoo.com> is alleged to have written:

>I think that we have tons of data to show that there is no advantage of
>running high test in a motor that is designed for regular. I can't image
>what possible advantage there might be on a road trip, but if one wanted to
>waste money somewhere, they may as well waste it on a road trip. I assume

I can imagine several possible advantages.

I can imagine that an motor that was designed for regular gas that
has 100K+ miles of wear, with some carbon deposits, etc. might knock
a bit more than it was designed to, giving an increased NoX reading
on the smog check. Even with a new EGR valve I read slightly above
average.

I can imagine that such a motor running regular gas might knock
enough for the computer listening to the knock sensor to retard the
spark enough to reduce milage. I can imagine that the effect of
that might be greater % than the price increment to go to a higher
grade.

I can imagine that the motor was designed to run on regular gas, but
that the crap sold for regular gas with MTBE to poison the Calif
ground water in it, federally subsidized Archer Daniels Midland EtOH
in it, and who knows what else, just isn't good enough. I can
imagine that a company like ARCO might be blatantly lying about what
the octane rating of their product really is.

I don't know what of those to believe, but there is nothing wrong
with my imagination.