twaldron

Meaning that the compression side, by bottoming out on the bumpstop,
limits the travel of the other side's expansion as you go over terrain.
They are dependent on each other by design. Your shocks need to expand
longer than your extended suspension or you WILL destroy the shock.

tw

Bill Spiliotopoulos wrote:
> Sorry, I can't understand what you mean.
>
> ? "twaldron" <dude@hairsproutingbunions.com> ?????? ??? ??????
> news:qZABi.12317$Yg.5171@trnddc02...
>
>>The compression side bottoms out before the expanded side reaches the
>>limits on the shock. POP!
>>
>>tw
>>
>>
>>Bill Spiliotopoulos wrote:
>>
>>>In TJ as in almost every other vehicle without leaf springs, the
>>>suspension is limited on compression by the bump stops, but when expaded,
>>>the suspension is limited by the shocks. That is because the force needed
>>>to limit the suspension when fully compressed is much larger (weight of
>>>the vehicle plus the downwards momentum of the vehicle) than that needed
>>>to limit suspension travel when fully expanded (just the axle weight plus
>>>downwards momemtum of the axle).
>>>
>>>In TJs, the shocks are what keep the axles from dropping for several more
>>>inches before they are limited again by the track bar and arms.
>>>
>>>Bill Spiliotopoulos,
>>>'96 XJ,
>>>'06 TJ.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>? "twaldron" <dude@hairsproutingbunions.com> ?????? ??? ??????
>>>news:wNzBi.12313$Yg.7068@trnddc02...
>>>
>>>
>>>>Bill Spiliotopoulos wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>The stock rear springs are shorter and stiffer. So since you raise the
>>>>>rear 2", you need a 2" bump stop extension to prevent the rear springs
>>>>
>>>>>from being over-compressed and get deformed. This way the articulation
>>>>
>>>>>in the rear stays the same as before the lift.
>>>>>
>>>>>In the front, the stock springs are longer and softer, and so you can
>>>>>use a shorter bump stop extension and achieve 0.5" more articulation
>>>>>when the wheel is pushed up. The front springs won't be strained much if
>>>>>compressed 0.5" more than stock.
>>>>>
>>>>>You also need the bump stop extensions to ensure that the larger tires
>>>>>won't rub on the fenders.
>>>>>
>>>>>When a wheel is in the air and hangs down, the suspension travel is
>>>>>limited by the shock's travel. You need either longer shocks or shock
>>>>>extensions (bar pin eliminators) to restore suspension travel
>>>>>(articulation) to stock or a bit more. However, bar pin eliminators
>>>>>(BPE) I have seen on the market, usually compress the shocks only about
>>>>>3/4" which is not enough. If you can find BPE which relocate the shock
>>>>>1.5" or 2", then ok. Otherwise you have to construct your own, or easier
>>>>>get longer shocks.
>>>>>
>>>>>The Terraflex kit (advertised as 1.5" spacers) is actually 2" spacers
>>>>>and has the correct bump stop kit extenders.
>>>>>
>>>>>Bill Spiliotopoulos,
>>>>>'96 XJ,
>>>>>'06 TJ.
>>>>
>>>>A suspension should NEVER be limited by the shock's travel. A shock that
>>>>limits travel would be an ex-shock soon enough. Your suspension's travel
>>>>should be limited by spring compression and ultimately the bumpstop.
>>>>
>>>>tw
>>>
>>>
>

twaldron

Meaning that the compression side, by bottoming out on the bumpstop,
limits the travel of the other side's expansion as you go over terrain.
They are dependent on each other by design. Your shocks need to expand
longer than your extended suspension or you WILL destroy the shock.

tw

Bill Spiliotopoulos wrote:
> Sorry, I can't understand what you mean.
>
> ? "twaldron" <dude@hairsproutingbunions.com> ?????? ??? ??????
> news:qZABi.12317$Yg.5171@trnddc02...
>
>>The compression side bottoms out before the expanded side reaches the
>>limits on the shock. POP!
>>
>>tw
>>
>>
>>Bill Spiliotopoulos wrote:
>>
>>>In TJ as in almost every other vehicle without leaf springs, the
>>>suspension is limited on compression by the bump stops, but when expaded,
>>>the suspension is limited by the shocks. That is because the force needed
>>>to limit the suspension when fully compressed is much larger (weight of
>>>the vehicle plus the downwards momentum of the vehicle) than that needed
>>>to limit suspension travel when fully expanded (just the axle weight plus
>>>downwards momemtum of the axle).
>>>
>>>In TJs, the shocks are what keep the axles from dropping for several more
>>>inches before they are limited again by the track bar and arms.
>>>
>>>Bill Spiliotopoulos,
>>>'96 XJ,
>>>'06 TJ.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>? "twaldron" <dude@hairsproutingbunions.com> ?????? ??? ??????
>>>news:wNzBi.12313$Yg.7068@trnddc02...
>>>
>>>
>>>>Bill Spiliotopoulos wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>The stock rear springs are shorter and stiffer. So since you raise the
>>>>>rear 2", you need a 2" bump stop extension to prevent the rear springs
>>>>
>>>>>from being over-compressed and get deformed. This way the articulation
>>>>
>>>>>in the rear stays the same as before the lift.
>>>>>
>>>>>In the front, the stock springs are longer and softer, and so you can
>>>>>use a shorter bump stop extension and achieve 0.5" more articulation
>>>>>when the wheel is pushed up. The front springs won't be strained much if
>>>>>compressed 0.5" more than stock.
>>>>>
>>>>>You also need the bump stop extensions to ensure that the larger tires
>>>>>won't rub on the fenders.
>>>>>
>>>>>When a wheel is in the air and hangs down, the suspension travel is
>>>>>limited by the shock's travel. You need either longer shocks or shock
>>>>>extensions (bar pin eliminators) to restore suspension travel
>>>>>(articulation) to stock or a bit more. However, bar pin eliminators
>>>>>(BPE) I have seen on the market, usually compress the shocks only about
>>>>>3/4" which is not enough. If you can find BPE which relocate the shock
>>>>>1.5" or 2", then ok. Otherwise you have to construct your own, or easier
>>>>>get longer shocks.
>>>>>
>>>>>The Terraflex kit (advertised as 1.5" spacers) is actually 2" spacers
>>>>>and has the correct bump stop kit extenders.
>>>>>
>>>>>Bill Spiliotopoulos,
>>>>>'96 XJ,
>>>>>'06 TJ.
>>>>
>>>>A suspension should NEVER be limited by the shock's travel. A shock that
>>>>limits travel would be an ex-shock soon enough. Your suspension's travel
>>>>should be limited by spring compression and ultimately the bumpstop.
>>>>
>>>>tw
>>>
>>>
>

twaldron

Meaning that the compression side, by bottoming out on the bumpstop,
limits the travel of the other side's expansion as you go over terrain.
They are dependent on each other by design. Your shocks need to expand
longer than your extended suspension or you WILL destroy the shock.

tw

Bill Spiliotopoulos wrote:
> Sorry, I can't understand what you mean.
>
> ? "twaldron" <dude@hairsproutingbunions.com> ?????? ??? ??????
> news:qZABi.12317$Yg.5171@trnddc02...
>
>>The compression side bottoms out before the expanded side reaches the
>>limits on the shock. POP!
>>
>>tw
>>
>>
>>Bill Spiliotopoulos wrote:
>>
>>>In TJ as in almost every other vehicle without leaf springs, the
>>>suspension is limited on compression by the bump stops, but when expaded,
>>>the suspension is limited by the shocks. That is because the force needed
>>>to limit the suspension when fully compressed is much larger (weight of
>>>the vehicle plus the downwards momentum of the vehicle) than that needed
>>>to limit suspension travel when fully expanded (just the axle weight plus
>>>downwards momemtum of the axle).
>>>
>>>In TJs, the shocks are what keep the axles from dropping for several more
>>>inches before they are limited again by the track bar and arms.
>>>
>>>Bill Spiliotopoulos,
>>>'96 XJ,
>>>'06 TJ.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>? "twaldron" <dude@hairsproutingbunions.com> ?????? ??? ??????
>>>news:wNzBi.12313$Yg.7068@trnddc02...
>>>
>>>
>>>>Bill Spiliotopoulos wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>The stock rear springs are shorter and stiffer. So since you raise the
>>>>>rear 2", you need a 2" bump stop extension to prevent the rear springs
>>>>
>>>>>from being over-compressed and get deformed. This way the articulation
>>>>
>>>>>in the rear stays the same as before the lift.
>>>>>
>>>>>In the front, the stock springs are longer and softer, and so you can
>>>>>use a shorter bump stop extension and achieve 0.5" more articulation
>>>>>when the wheel is pushed up. The front springs won't be strained much if
>>>>>compressed 0.5" more than stock.
>>>>>
>>>>>You also need the bump stop extensions to ensure that the larger tires
>>>>>won't rub on the fenders.
>>>>>
>>>>>When a wheel is in the air and hangs down, the suspension travel is
>>>>>limited by the shock's travel. You need either longer shocks or shock
>>>>>extensions (bar pin eliminators) to restore suspension travel
>>>>>(articulation) to stock or a bit more. However, bar pin eliminators
>>>>>(BPE) I have seen on the market, usually compress the shocks only about
>>>>>3/4" which is not enough. If you can find BPE which relocate the shock
>>>>>1.5" or 2", then ok. Otherwise you have to construct your own, or easier
>>>>>get longer shocks.
>>>>>
>>>>>The Terraflex kit (advertised as 1.5" spacers) is actually 2" spacers
>>>>>and has the correct bump stop kit extenders.
>>>>>
>>>>>Bill Spiliotopoulos,
>>>>>'96 XJ,
>>>>>'06 TJ.
>>>>
>>>>A suspension should NEVER be limited by the shock's travel. A shock that
>>>>limits travel would be an ex-shock soon enough. Your suspension's travel
>>>>should be limited by spring compression and ultimately the bumpstop.
>>>>
>>>>tw
>>>
>>>
>

Bill Spiliotopoulos

My TJ came new without the rear anti-sway bar installed.
As they come from the factory, the shocks are what prevents the springs from
getting un-seated. If you remove the shocks, the axles drop much more and
the springs almost fall out. The only other thing that limits the axle from
dropping all the way down, is the track-bar in combination with the
upper/lower arms.

This is the wheeling I do, not very extreme but not too light either, with
2" spacer lift, disconnected swaybars and the stock shocks with home made
shock extensions so that the shocks are not limiting the suspension travel
when the suspension is fuly compressed. I am very pleased from this setup
and it only cost me $100 for the spacers.
http://alma-tech.com/tmp/2/

Bill Spiliotopoulos,
'96 XJ,
'06 TJ.

? "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> ?????? ??? ??????
news:46d6e341$0$5519$9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshostin g.com...
> You 'certainly' would 'not' be able to run any of the trails I run set
> up like that, you would drop the wheel into a hole and snap the shock off
> faster than you can say oops....
>
> Been there, done that with my 'leaf sprung' CJ7 even.
>
> The downward motion 'must' be limited by something other than the shock
> or you will break things like the frame or 'just' the bar pins if you
> are lucky.
>
> That is why the TJ has a rear antisway bar in it, it limits the range of
> motion. Take that off and the rear springs can literally fall out.
>
> I am not sure what stops the front springs from falling out on a TJ.
>
> Mike
> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's - Gone to the rust pile...
> Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
> (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
>
> Bill Spiliotopoulos wrote:
>> In TJ as in almost every other vehicle without leaf springs, the
>> suspension is limited on compression by the bump stops, but when expaded,
>> the suspension is limited by the shocks. That is because the force needed
>> to limit the suspension when fully compressed is much larger (weight of
>> the vehicle plus the downwards momentum of the vehicle) than that needed
>> to limit suspension travel when fully expanded (just the axle weight plus
>> downwards momemtum of the axle).
>>
>> In TJs, the shocks are what keep the axles from dropping for several more
>> inches before they are limited again by the track bar and arms.
>>
>> Bill Spiliotopoulos,
>> '96 XJ,
>> '06 TJ.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ? "twaldron" <dude@hairsproutingbunions.com> ?????? ??? ??????
>> news:wNzBi.12313$Yg.7068@trnddc02...
>>> Bill Spiliotopoulos wrote:
>>>> The stock rear springs are shorter and stiffer. So since you raise the
>>>> rear 2", you need a 2" bump stop extension to prevent the rear springs
>>>> from being over-compressed and get deformed. This way the articulation
>>>> in the rear stays the same as before the lift.
>>>>
>>>> In the front, the stock springs are longer and softer, and so you can
>>>> use a shorter bump stop extension and achieve 0.5" more articulation
>>>> when the wheel is pushed up. The front springs won't be strained much
>>>> if compressed 0.5" more than stock.
>>>>
>>>> You also need the bump stop extensions to ensure that the larger tires
>>>> won't rub on the fenders.
>>>>
>>>> When a wheel is in the air and hangs down, the suspension travel is
>>>> limited by the shock's travel. You need either longer shocks or shock
>>>> extensions (bar pin eliminators) to restore suspension travel
>>>> (articulation) to stock or a bit more. However, bar pin eliminators
>>>> (BPE) I have seen on the market, usually compress the shocks only about
>>>> 3/4" which is not enough. If you can find BPE which relocate the shock
>>>> 1.5" or 2", then ok. Otherwise you have to construct your own, or
>>>> easier get longer shocks.
>>>>
>>>> The Terraflex kit (advertised as 1.5" spacers) is actually 2" spacers
>>>> and has the correct bump stop kit extenders.
>>>>
>>>> Bill Spiliotopoulos,
>>>> '96 XJ,
>>>> '06 TJ.
>>> A suspension should NEVER be limited by the shock's travel. A shock that
>>> limits travel would be an ex-shock soon enough. Your suspension's travel
>>> should be limited by spring compression and ultimately the bumpstop.
>>>
>>> tw
>>
>>
>

Bill Spiliotopoulos

My TJ came new without the rear anti-sway bar installed.
As they come from the factory, the shocks are what prevents the springs from
getting un-seated. If you remove the shocks, the axles drop much more and
the springs almost fall out. The only other thing that limits the axle from
dropping all the way down, is the track-bar in combination with the
upper/lower arms.

This is the wheeling I do, not very extreme but not too light either, with
2" spacer lift, disconnected swaybars and the stock shocks with home made
shock extensions so that the shocks are not limiting the suspension travel
when the suspension is fuly compressed. I am very pleased from this setup
and it only cost me $100 for the spacers.
http://alma-tech.com/tmp/2/

Bill Spiliotopoulos,
'96 XJ,
'06 TJ.

? "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> ?????? ??? ??????
news:46d6e341$0$5519$9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshostin g.com...
> You 'certainly' would 'not' be able to run any of the trails I run set
> up like that, you would drop the wheel into a hole and snap the shock off
> faster than you can say oops....
>
> Been there, done that with my 'leaf sprung' CJ7 even.
>
> The downward motion 'must' be limited by something other than the shock
> or you will break things like the frame or 'just' the bar pins if you
> are lucky.
>
> That is why the TJ has a rear antisway bar in it, it limits the range of
> motion. Take that off and the rear springs can literally fall out.
>
> I am not sure what stops the front springs from falling out on a TJ.
>
> Mike
> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's - Gone to the rust pile...
> Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
> (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
>
> Bill Spiliotopoulos wrote:
>> In TJ as in almost every other vehicle without leaf springs, the
>> suspension is limited on compression by the bump stops, but when expaded,
>> the suspension is limited by the shocks. That is because the force needed
>> to limit the suspension when fully compressed is much larger (weight of
>> the vehicle plus the downwards momentum of the vehicle) than that needed
>> to limit suspension travel when fully expanded (just the axle weight plus
>> downwards momemtum of the axle).
>>
>> In TJs, the shocks are what keep the axles from dropping for several more
>> inches before they are limited again by the track bar and arms.
>>
>> Bill Spiliotopoulos,
>> '96 XJ,
>> '06 TJ.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ? "twaldron" <dude@hairsproutingbunions.com> ?????? ??? ??????
>> news:wNzBi.12313$Yg.7068@trnddc02...
>>> Bill Spiliotopoulos wrote:
>>>> The stock rear springs are shorter and stiffer. So since you raise the
>>>> rear 2", you need a 2" bump stop extension to prevent the rear springs
>>>> from being over-compressed and get deformed. This way the articulation
>>>> in the rear stays the same as before the lift.
>>>>
>>>> In the front, the stock springs are longer and softer, and so you can
>>>> use a shorter bump stop extension and achieve 0.5" more articulation
>>>> when the wheel is pushed up. The front springs won't be strained much
>>>> if compressed 0.5" more than stock.
>>>>
>>>> You also need the bump stop extensions to ensure that the larger tires
>>>> won't rub on the fenders.
>>>>
>>>> When a wheel is in the air and hangs down, the suspension travel is
>>>> limited by the shock's travel. You need either longer shocks or shock
>>>> extensions (bar pin eliminators) to restore suspension travel
>>>> (articulation) to stock or a bit more. However, bar pin eliminators
>>>> (BPE) I have seen on the market, usually compress the shocks only about
>>>> 3/4" which is not enough. If you can find BPE which relocate the shock
>>>> 1.5" or 2", then ok. Otherwise you have to construct your own, or
>>>> easier get longer shocks.
>>>>
>>>> The Terraflex kit (advertised as 1.5" spacers) is actually 2" spacers
>>>> and has the correct bump stop kit extenders.
>>>>
>>>> Bill Spiliotopoulos,
>>>> '96 XJ,
>>>> '06 TJ.
>>> A suspension should NEVER be limited by the shock's travel. A shock that
>>> limits travel would be an ex-shock soon enough. Your suspension's travel
>>> should be limited by spring compression and ultimately the bumpstop.
>>>
>>> tw
>>
>>
>

Bill Spiliotopoulos

My TJ came new without the rear anti-sway bar installed.
As they come from the factory, the shocks are what prevents the springs from
getting un-seated. If you remove the shocks, the axles drop much more and
the springs almost fall out. The only other thing that limits the axle from
dropping all the way down, is the track-bar in combination with the
upper/lower arms.

This is the wheeling I do, not very extreme but not too light either, with
2" spacer lift, disconnected swaybars and the stock shocks with home made
shock extensions so that the shocks are not limiting the suspension travel
when the suspension is fuly compressed. I am very pleased from this setup
and it only cost me $100 for the spacers.
http://alma-tech.com/tmp/2/

Bill Spiliotopoulos,
'96 XJ,
'06 TJ.

? "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> ?????? ??? ??????
news:46d6e341$0$5519$9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshostin g.com...
> You 'certainly' would 'not' be able to run any of the trails I run set
> up like that, you would drop the wheel into a hole and snap the shock off
> faster than you can say oops....
>
> Been there, done that with my 'leaf sprung' CJ7 even.
>
> The downward motion 'must' be limited by something other than the shock
> or you will break things like the frame or 'just' the bar pins if you
> are lucky.
>
> That is why the TJ has a rear antisway bar in it, it limits the range of
> motion. Take that off and the rear springs can literally fall out.
>
> I am not sure what stops the front springs from falling out on a TJ.
>
> Mike
> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's - Gone to the rust pile...
> Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
> (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
>
> Bill Spiliotopoulos wrote:
>> In TJ as in almost every other vehicle without leaf springs, the
>> suspension is limited on compression by the bump stops, but when expaded,
>> the suspension is limited by the shocks. That is because the force needed
>> to limit the suspension when fully compressed is much larger (weight of
>> the vehicle plus the downwards momentum of the vehicle) than that needed
>> to limit suspension travel when fully expanded (just the axle weight plus
>> downwards momemtum of the axle).
>>
>> In TJs, the shocks are what keep the axles from dropping for several more
>> inches before they are limited again by the track bar and arms.
>>
>> Bill Spiliotopoulos,
>> '96 XJ,
>> '06 TJ.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ? "twaldron" <dude@hairsproutingbunions.com> ?????? ??? ??????
>> news:wNzBi.12313$Yg.7068@trnddc02...
>>> Bill Spiliotopoulos wrote:
>>>> The stock rear springs are shorter and stiffer. So since you raise the
>>>> rear 2", you need a 2" bump stop extension to prevent the rear springs
>>>> from being over-compressed and get deformed. This way the articulation
>>>> in the rear stays the same as before the lift.
>>>>
>>>> In the front, the stock springs are longer and softer, and so you can
>>>> use a shorter bump stop extension and achieve 0.5" more articulation
>>>> when the wheel is pushed up. The front springs won't be strained much
>>>> if compressed 0.5" more than stock.
>>>>
>>>> You also need the bump stop extensions to ensure that the larger tires
>>>> won't rub on the fenders.
>>>>
>>>> When a wheel is in the air and hangs down, the suspension travel is
>>>> limited by the shock's travel. You need either longer shocks or shock
>>>> extensions (bar pin eliminators) to restore suspension travel
>>>> (articulation) to stock or a bit more. However, bar pin eliminators
>>>> (BPE) I have seen on the market, usually compress the shocks only about
>>>> 3/4" which is not enough. If you can find BPE which relocate the shock
>>>> 1.5" or 2", then ok. Otherwise you have to construct your own, or
>>>> easier get longer shocks.
>>>>
>>>> The Terraflex kit (advertised as 1.5" spacers) is actually 2" spacers
>>>> and has the correct bump stop kit extenders.
>>>>
>>>> Bill Spiliotopoulos,
>>>> '96 XJ,
>>>> '06 TJ.
>>> A suspension should NEVER be limited by the shock's travel. A shock that
>>> limits travel would be an ex-shock soon enough. Your suspension's travel
>>> should be limited by spring compression and ultimately the bumpstop.
>>>
>>> tw
>>
>>
>

Bill Spiliotopoulos

My TJ came new without the rear anti-sway bar installed.
As they come from the factory, the shocks are what prevents the springs from
getting un-seated. If you remove the shocks, the axles drop much more and
the springs almost fall out. The only other thing that limits the axle from
dropping all the way down, is the track-bar in combination with the
upper/lower arms.

This is the wheeling I do, not very extreme but not too light either, with
2" spacer lift, disconnected swaybars and the stock shocks with home made
shock extensions so that the shocks are not limiting the suspension travel
when the suspension is fuly compressed. I am very pleased from this setup
and it only cost me $100 for the spacers.
http://alma-tech.com/tmp/2/

Bill Spiliotopoulos,
'96 XJ,
'06 TJ.

? "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> ?????? ??? ??????
news:46d6e341$0$5519$9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshostin g.com...
> You 'certainly' would 'not' be able to run any of the trails I run set
> up like that, you would drop the wheel into a hole and snap the shock off
> faster than you can say oops....
>
> Been there, done that with my 'leaf sprung' CJ7 even.
>
> The downward motion 'must' be limited by something other than the shock
> or you will break things like the frame or 'just' the bar pins if you
> are lucky.
>
> That is why the TJ has a rear antisway bar in it, it limits the range of
> motion. Take that off and the rear springs can literally fall out.
>
> I am not sure what stops the front springs from falling out on a TJ.
>
> Mike
> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's - Gone to the rust pile...
> Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
> (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
>
> Bill Spiliotopoulos wrote:
>> In TJ as in almost every other vehicle without leaf springs, the
>> suspension is limited on compression by the bump stops, but when expaded,
>> the suspension is limited by the shocks. That is because the force needed
>> to limit the suspension when fully compressed is much larger (weight of
>> the vehicle plus the downwards momentum of the vehicle) than that needed
>> to limit suspension travel when fully expanded (just the axle weight plus
>> downwards momemtum of the axle).
>>
>> In TJs, the shocks are what keep the axles from dropping for several more
>> inches before they are limited again by the track bar and arms.
>>
>> Bill Spiliotopoulos,
>> '96 XJ,
>> '06 TJ.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ? "twaldron" <dude@hairsproutingbunions.com> ?????? ??? ??????
>> news:wNzBi.12313$Yg.7068@trnddc02...
>>> Bill Spiliotopoulos wrote:
>>>> The stock rear springs are shorter and stiffer. So since you raise the
>>>> rear 2", you need a 2" bump stop extension to prevent the rear springs
>>>> from being over-compressed and get deformed. This way the articulation
>>>> in the rear stays the same as before the lift.
>>>>
>>>> In the front, the stock springs are longer and softer, and so you can
>>>> use a shorter bump stop extension and achieve 0.5" more articulation
>>>> when the wheel is pushed up. The front springs won't be strained much
>>>> if compressed 0.5" more than stock.
>>>>
>>>> You also need the bump stop extensions to ensure that the larger tires
>>>> won't rub on the fenders.
>>>>
>>>> When a wheel is in the air and hangs down, the suspension travel is
>>>> limited by the shock's travel. You need either longer shocks or shock
>>>> extensions (bar pin eliminators) to restore suspension travel
>>>> (articulation) to stock or a bit more. However, bar pin eliminators
>>>> (BPE) I have seen on the market, usually compress the shocks only about
>>>> 3/4" which is not enough. If you can find BPE which relocate the shock
>>>> 1.5" or 2", then ok. Otherwise you have to construct your own, or
>>>> easier get longer shocks.
>>>>
>>>> The Terraflex kit (advertised as 1.5" spacers) is actually 2" spacers
>>>> and has the correct bump stop kit extenders.
>>>>
>>>> Bill Spiliotopoulos,
>>>> '96 XJ,
>>>> '06 TJ.
>>> A suspension should NEVER be limited by the shock's travel. A shock that
>>> limits travel would be an ex-shock soon enough. Your suspension's travel
>>> should be limited by spring compression and ultimately the bumpstop.
>>>
>>> tw
>>
>>
>

twaldron

Bill Spiliotopoulos wrote:
> My TJ came new without the rear anti-sway bar installed.
> As they come from the factory, the shocks are what prevents the springs from
> getting un-seated. If you remove the shocks, the axles drop much more and
> the springs almost fall out. The only other thing that limits the axle from
> dropping all the way down, is the track-bar in combination with the
> upper/lower arms.

I think you're exaggerating the effect here. If you remove the shocks,
the springs will not fall out, not a chance. Now if you remove them and
hyper compress one side of the axle you _might_ possibly be able to
remove the opposite spring with some concerted effort. A lot of people
use a spring compressor at that point.

tw

twaldron

Bill Spiliotopoulos wrote:
> My TJ came new without the rear anti-sway bar installed.
> As they come from the factory, the shocks are what prevents the springs from
> getting un-seated. If you remove the shocks, the axles drop much more and
> the springs almost fall out. The only other thing that limits the axle from
> dropping all the way down, is the track-bar in combination with the
> upper/lower arms.

I think you're exaggerating the effect here. If you remove the shocks,
the springs will not fall out, not a chance. Now if you remove them and
hyper compress one side of the axle you _might_ possibly be able to
remove the opposite spring with some concerted effort. A lot of people
use a spring compressor at that point.

tw

twaldron

Bill Spiliotopoulos wrote:
> My TJ came new without the rear anti-sway bar installed.
> As they come from the factory, the shocks are what prevents the springs from
> getting un-seated. If you remove the shocks, the axles drop much more and
> the springs almost fall out. The only other thing that limits the axle from
> dropping all the way down, is the track-bar in combination with the
> upper/lower arms.

I think you're exaggerating the effect here. If you remove the shocks,
the springs will not fall out, not a chance. Now if you remove them and
hyper compress one side of the axle you _might_ possibly be able to
remove the opposite spring with some concerted effort. A lot of people
use a spring compressor at that point.

tw