Bill,

I think your reasoning is relative to your location.

When I lived in San Diego for a year the first rainfall (there was 3
rainstorms in that year) I saw the freeways slowdown to a crawl. Folks
were driving like folks do in the northeast and canada in the most
blinding blizzards (White outs, No visibility).
I was silly enough to assume I could drive faster then everyone else,
after all, it was only rain. I found myself sliding sideways at 60 MPH
in a vega wagon!
The freeways evidently don't get the mother nature car wash enough to
keep the oil and grime off the roads. They truly are slippery when wet!

That said when it snows up here in New England it's very common to see
folks doing 50-60 mph. Some are stupid SUV's thinking their invincible
with no clue or care of how fast they cannot stop and what the other guy
can and cannot do.
I will drive those speeds if there's no traffic around with my AWD
vehicles but not my Wrangler. With it's short wheelbase (not wheel base)
it too easily comes around when one side encounters more resistance
(snow or slush) than the other. Some folks counter well but I've seen
many brave wranglers in snow banks or worse, guard rails, because of the
simple laws of physics.

Speed and lack of traction (both driving and braking) deserve respect
anywhere. Add to that, lack of visibility, stupid 4x4 soccer moms (and
Dads) and it's directly proportional to the danger.

I do believe there are many times when 60 MPH in 4 wheel drive is
totally feasible and necessary in some areas of the country with all due
respect to the factors I mentioned above.

Cheers!

Perry

87YJ 36X12.5 MT Baja's


L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> If I need four wheel drive, I won't be driving sixty miles an hour!
> Of course, I've never had an accident, on road.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Mike Romain wrote:
>
>>Wet pavement is iffy for 4x4. Some of it is slick, some is sticky.
>>
>>If it is really pissing down and you are on greasy city streets, then...
>>
>>Otherwise, yes, 4 high is for normal speeds on slick roads and I have no
>>issues driving over 60 mph in 4 high on both of my Jeeps.
>>
>>Mike
>>86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
>>88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>

 

Bill,

I think your reasoning is relative to your location.

When I lived in San Diego for a year the first rainfall (there was 3
rainstorms in that year) I saw the freeways slowdown to a crawl. Folks
were driving like folks do in the northeast and canada in the most
blinding blizzards (White outs, No visibility).
I was silly enough to assume I could drive faster then everyone else,
after all, it was only rain. I found myself sliding sideways at 60 MPH
in a vega wagon!
The freeways evidently don't get the mother nature car wash enough to
keep the oil and grime off the roads. They truly are slippery when wet!

That said when it snows up here in New England it's very common to see
folks doing 50-60 mph. Some are stupid SUV's thinking their invincible
with no clue or care of how fast they cannot stop and what the other guy
can and cannot do.
I will drive those speeds if there's no traffic around with my AWD
vehicles but not my Wrangler. With it's short wheelbase (not wheel base)
it too easily comes around when one side encounters more resistance
(snow or slush) than the other. Some folks counter well but I've seen
many brave wranglers in snow banks or worse, guard rails, because of the
simple laws of physics.

Speed and lack of traction (both driving and braking) deserve respect
anywhere. Add to that, lack of visibility, stupid 4x4 soccer moms (and
Dads) and it's directly proportional to the danger.

I do believe there are many times when 60 MPH in 4 wheel drive is
totally feasible and necessary in some areas of the country with all due
respect to the factors I mentioned above.

Cheers!

Perry

87YJ 36X12.5 MT Baja's


L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> If I need four wheel drive, I won't be driving sixty miles an hour!
> Of course, I've never had an accident, on road.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Mike Romain wrote:
>
>>Wet pavement is iffy for 4x4. Some of it is slick, some is sticky.
>>
>>If it is really pissing down and you are on greasy city streets, then...
>>
>>Otherwise, yes, 4 high is for normal speeds on slick roads and I have no
>>issues driving over 60 mph in 4 high on both of my Jeeps.
>>
>>Mike
>>86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
>>88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>

 

I've heard good things about the Pir. Scorpion ATs too. I'll prob. get
some for my Nissan 4WD when the time comes. It is mostly a hwy vehicle
but finds it's way offroad very occasionally. I think they'd be a
perfect tire for it. No experience with the Michelin ATs at all.

Lon Stowell wrote:

> Ahhh, the light dawns. *Real* offroad tires don't have speed
> ratings. Oddly enough, I have heard good things about the
> Michelin AT and the Pirelli AT, both of which are available
> as S rated LT versions. Somehow the comprehension is more
> apprehension at this point.
>
>
> Approximately 10/4/03 16:32, L.W.(ßill) ------ III uttered for posterity:
>
>
>> Re read my post this time with comprehension. I didn't say the S
>>rating was bogus, I indicated the tire you chose had a street tread
>>design, look at it again, and see if you can say it's an off road tire
>>with a straight face, it's a wimp tire:
>>http://www.1010tires.com/tire.asp?ti...l=LTX%AE+M%2FS
>> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
>>mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>>
>>"L.W.(ßill) ------ III" wrote:
>>
>>> That's french in lower case.
>>> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
>>>mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>>>
>>>Lon Stowell wrote:
>>>
>>>> Aha, so not only is the S rating bogus, obviously the
>>>> LTX is as well.... how dare those French!!
>
>

--
__________________________________________________ _________
tw
03 TJ Rubicon
01 XJ Sport

There is a very fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness."
-- Dave Barry

http://www.7slotgrille.com/jeepers/t...ron/index.html
(Please remove the OBVIOUS to reply by email)
__________________________________________________ _________

 

I've heard good things about the Pir. Scorpion ATs too. I'll prob. get
some for my Nissan 4WD when the time comes. It is mostly a hwy vehicle
but finds it's way offroad very occasionally. I think they'd be a
perfect tire for it. No experience with the Michelin ATs at all.

Lon Stowell wrote:

> Ahhh, the light dawns. *Real* offroad tires don't have speed
> ratings. Oddly enough, I have heard good things about the
> Michelin AT and the Pirelli AT, both of which are available
> as S rated LT versions. Somehow the comprehension is more
> apprehension at this point.
>
>
> Approximately 10/4/03 16:32, L.W.(ßill) ------ III uttered for posterity:
>
>
>> Re read my post this time with comprehension. I didn't say the S
>>rating was bogus, I indicated the tire you chose had a street tread
>>design, look at it again, and see if you can say it's an off road tire
>>with a straight face, it's a wimp tire:
>>http://www.1010tires.com/tire.asp?ti...l=LTX%AE+M%2FS
>> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
>>mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>>
>>"L.W.(ßill) ------ III" wrote:
>>
>>> That's french in lower case.
>>> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
>>>mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>>>
>>>Lon Stowell wrote:
>>>
>>>> Aha, so not only is the S rating bogus, obviously the
>>>> LTX is as well.... how dare those French!!
>
>

--
__________________________________________________ _________
tw
03 TJ Rubicon
01 XJ Sport

There is a very fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness."
-- Dave Barry

http://www.7slotgrille.com/jeepers/t...ron/index.html
(Please remove the OBVIOUS to reply by email)
__________________________________________________ _________

 

I've heard good things about the Pir. Scorpion ATs too. I'll prob. get
some for my Nissan 4WD when the time comes. It is mostly a hwy vehicle
but finds it's way offroad very occasionally. I think they'd be a
perfect tire for it. No experience with the Michelin ATs at all.

Lon Stowell wrote:

> Ahhh, the light dawns. *Real* offroad tires don't have speed
> ratings. Oddly enough, I have heard good things about the
> Michelin AT and the Pirelli AT, both of which are available
> as S rated LT versions. Somehow the comprehension is more
> apprehension at this point.
>
>
> Approximately 10/4/03 16:32, L.W.(ßill) ------ III uttered for posterity:
>
>
>> Re read my post this time with comprehension. I didn't say the S
>>rating was bogus, I indicated the tire you chose had a street tread
>>design, look at it again, and see if you can say it's an off road tire
>>with a straight face, it's a wimp tire:
>>http://www.1010tires.com/tire.asp?ti...l=LTX%AE+M%2FS
>> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
>>mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>>
>>"L.W.(ßill) ------ III" wrote:
>>
>>> That's french in lower case.
>>> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
>>>mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>>>
>>>Lon Stowell wrote:
>>>
>>>> Aha, so not only is the S rating bogus, obviously the
>>>> LTX is as well.... how dare those French!!
>
>

--
__________________________________________________ _________
tw
03 TJ Rubicon
01 XJ Sport

There is a very fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness."
-- Dave Barry

http://www.7slotgrille.com/jeepers/t...ron/index.html
(Please remove the OBVIOUS to reply by email)
__________________________________________________ _________

 

Hi Perry,
In addition to the oil lifting on the few rains we get, often the
engineers have designed an inadequate drainage for an area, leading to
many first time drivers hydroplaning while trying to make a turn at
normal speed.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/

Perry Gagnon wrote:
>
> Bill,
>
> I think your reasoning is relative to your location.
>
> When I lived in San Diego for a year the first rainfall (there was 3
> rainstorms in that year) I saw the freeways slowdown to a crawl. Folks
> were driving like folks do in the northeast and canada in the most
> blinding blizzards (White outs, No visibility).
> I was silly enough to assume I could drive faster then everyone else,
> after all, it was only rain. I found myself sliding sideways at 60 MPH
> in a vega wagon!
> The freeways evidently don't get the mother nature car wash enough to
> keep the oil and grime off the roads. They truly are slippery when wet!
>
> That said when it snows up here in New England it's very common to see
> folks doing 50-60 mph. Some are stupid SUV's thinking their invincible
> with no clue or care of how fast they cannot stop and what the other guy
> can and cannot do.
> I will drive those speeds if there's no traffic around with my AWD
> vehicles but not my Wrangler. With it's short wheelbase (not wheel base)
> it too easily comes around when one side encounters more resistance
> (snow or slush) than the other. Some folks counter well but I've seen
> many brave wranglers in snow banks or worse, guard rails, because of the
> simple laws of physics.
>
> Speed and lack of traction (both driving and braking) deserve respect
> anywhere. Add to that, lack of visibility, stupid 4x4 soccer moms (and
> Dads) and it's directly proportional to the danger.
>
> I do believe there are many times when 60 MPH in 4 wheel drive is
> totally feasible and necessary in some areas of the country with all due
> respect to the factors I mentioned above.
>
> Cheers!
>
> Perry
>
> 87YJ 36X12.5 MT Baja's

 

Hi Perry,
In addition to the oil lifting on the few rains we get, often the
engineers have designed an inadequate drainage for an area, leading to
many first time drivers hydroplaning while trying to make a turn at
normal speed.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/

Perry Gagnon wrote:
>
> Bill,
>
> I think your reasoning is relative to your location.
>
> When I lived in San Diego for a year the first rainfall (there was 3
> rainstorms in that year) I saw the freeways slowdown to a crawl. Folks
> were driving like folks do in the northeast and canada in the most
> blinding blizzards (White outs, No visibility).
> I was silly enough to assume I could drive faster then everyone else,
> after all, it was only rain. I found myself sliding sideways at 60 MPH
> in a vega wagon!
> The freeways evidently don't get the mother nature car wash enough to
> keep the oil and grime off the roads. They truly are slippery when wet!
>
> That said when it snows up here in New England it's very common to see
> folks doing 50-60 mph. Some are stupid SUV's thinking their invincible
> with no clue or care of how fast they cannot stop and what the other guy
> can and cannot do.
> I will drive those speeds if there's no traffic around with my AWD
> vehicles but not my Wrangler. With it's short wheelbase (not wheel base)
> it too easily comes around when one side encounters more resistance
> (snow or slush) than the other. Some folks counter well but I've seen
> many brave wranglers in snow banks or worse, guard rails, because of the
> simple laws of physics.
>
> Speed and lack of traction (both driving and braking) deserve respect
> anywhere. Add to that, lack of visibility, stupid 4x4 soccer moms (and
> Dads) and it's directly proportional to the danger.
>
> I do believe there are many times when 60 MPH in 4 wheel drive is
> totally feasible and necessary in some areas of the country with all due
> respect to the factors I mentioned above.
>
> Cheers!
>
> Perry
>
> 87YJ 36X12.5 MT Baja's

 

Hi Perry,
In addition to the oil lifting on the few rains we get, often the
engineers have designed an inadequate drainage for an area, leading to
many first time drivers hydroplaning while trying to make a turn at
normal speed.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/

Perry Gagnon wrote:
>
> Bill,
>
> I think your reasoning is relative to your location.
>
> When I lived in San Diego for a year the first rainfall (there was 3
> rainstorms in that year) I saw the freeways slowdown to a crawl. Folks
> were driving like folks do in the northeast and canada in the most
> blinding blizzards (White outs, No visibility).
> I was silly enough to assume I could drive faster then everyone else,
> after all, it was only rain. I found myself sliding sideways at 60 MPH
> in a vega wagon!
> The freeways evidently don't get the mother nature car wash enough to
> keep the oil and grime off the roads. They truly are slippery when wet!
>
> That said when it snows up here in New England it's very common to see
> folks doing 50-60 mph. Some are stupid SUV's thinking their invincible
> with no clue or care of how fast they cannot stop and what the other guy
> can and cannot do.
> I will drive those speeds if there's no traffic around with my AWD
> vehicles but not my Wrangler. With it's short wheelbase (not wheel base)
> it too easily comes around when one side encounters more resistance
> (snow or slush) than the other. Some folks counter well but I've seen
> many brave wranglers in snow banks or worse, guard rails, because of the
> simple laws of physics.
>
> Speed and lack of traction (both driving and braking) deserve respect
> anywhere. Add to that, lack of visibility, stupid 4x4 soccer moms (and
> Dads) and it's directly proportional to the danger.
>
> I do believe there are many times when 60 MPH in 4 wheel drive is
> totally feasible and necessary in some areas of the country with all due
> respect to the factors I mentioned above.
>
> Cheers!
>
> Perry
>
> 87YJ 36X12.5 MT Baja's

 

Bill,

I noticed that too. There were areas of freeway flooded with a pool of
water for lack of adequate drainage. That did not bother me so much
since that Vega I bought locally for $150 to get me to Mexico on
weekends and the Olympic Games in LA was also really fun swamping in the
surf off PC highway. I figured splashing through a fresh water pool on
the freeway was removing some salt! ;-)

Cheers!

Perry


L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> Hi Perry,
> In addition to the oil lifting on the few rains we get, often the
> engineers have designed an inadequate drainage for an area, leading to
> many first time drivers hydroplaning while trying to make a turn at
> normal speed.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Perry Gagnon wrote:
>
>>Bill,
>>
>>I think your reasoning is relative to your location.
>>
>>When I lived in San Diego for a year the first rainfall (there was 3
>>rainstorms in that year) I saw the freeways slowdown to a crawl. Folks
>>were driving like folks do in the northeast and canada in the most
>>blinding blizzards (White outs, No visibility).
>>I was silly enough to assume I could drive faster then everyone else,
>>after all, it was only rain. I found myself sliding sideways at 60 MPH
>>in a vega wagon!
>>The freeways evidently don't get the mother nature car wash enough to
>>keep the oil and grime off the roads. They truly are slippery when wet!
>>
>>That said when it snows up here in New England it's very common to see
>>folks doing 50-60 mph. Some are stupid SUV's thinking their invincible
>>with no clue or care of how fast they cannot stop and what the other guy
>>can and cannot do.
>>I will drive those speeds if there's no traffic around with my AWD
>>vehicles but not my Wrangler. With it's short wheelbase (not wheel base)
>>it too easily comes around when one side encounters more resistance
>>(snow or slush) than the other. Some folks counter well but I've seen
>>many brave wranglers in snow banks or worse, guard rails, because of the
>>simple laws of physics.
>>
>>Speed and lack of traction (both driving and braking) deserve respect
>>anywhere. Add to that, lack of visibility, stupid 4x4 soccer moms (and
>>Dads) and it's directly proportional to the danger.
>>
>>I do believe there are many times when 60 MPH in 4 wheel drive is
>>totally feasible and necessary in some areas of the country with all due
>>respect to the factors I mentioned above.
>>
>>Cheers!
>>
>>Perry
>>
>>87YJ 36X12.5 MT Baja's
>

 

Bill,

I noticed that too. There were areas of freeway flooded with a pool of
water for lack of adequate drainage. That did not bother me so much
since that Vega I bought locally for $150 to get me to Mexico on
weekends and the Olympic Games in LA was also really fun swamping in the
surf off PC highway. I figured splashing through a fresh water pool on
the freeway was removing some salt! ;-)

Cheers!

Perry


L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> Hi Perry,
> In addition to the oil lifting on the few rains we get, often the
> engineers have designed an inadequate drainage for an area, leading to
> many first time drivers hydroplaning while trying to make a turn at
> normal speed.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Perry Gagnon wrote:
>
>>Bill,
>>
>>I think your reasoning is relative to your location.
>>
>>When I lived in San Diego for a year the first rainfall (there was 3
>>rainstorms in that year) I saw the freeways slowdown to a crawl. Folks
>>were driving like folks do in the northeast and canada in the most
>>blinding blizzards (White outs, No visibility).
>>I was silly enough to assume I could drive faster then everyone else,
>>after all, it was only rain. I found myself sliding sideways at 60 MPH
>>in a vega wagon!
>>The freeways evidently don't get the mother nature car wash enough to
>>keep the oil and grime off the roads. They truly are slippery when wet!
>>
>>That said when it snows up here in New England it's very common to see
>>folks doing 50-60 mph. Some are stupid SUV's thinking their invincible
>>with no clue or care of how fast they cannot stop and what the other guy
>>can and cannot do.
>>I will drive those speeds if there's no traffic around with my AWD
>>vehicles but not my Wrangler. With it's short wheelbase (not wheel base)
>>it too easily comes around when one side encounters more resistance
>>(snow or slush) than the other. Some folks counter well but I've seen
>>many brave wranglers in snow banks or worse, guard rails, because of the
>>simple laws of physics.
>>
>>Speed and lack of traction (both driving and braking) deserve respect
>>anywhere. Add to that, lack of visibility, stupid 4x4 soccer moms (and
>>Dads) and it's directly proportional to the danger.
>>
>>I do believe there are many times when 60 MPH in 4 wheel drive is
>>totally feasible and necessary in some areas of the country with all due
>>respect to the factors I mentioned above.
>>
>>Cheers!
>>
>>Perry
>>
>>87YJ 36X12.5 MT Baja's
>