Mike,

I will try plugging the manifold vac from the canister but do not want to
hook up the PCV system. The engine has 185,000 miles on it and the blow by
forces oil through the pcv into the carb and clogs everything up. I will
try the other fixes, buy a timing light and hopefuly go for another test
today. will let you know what happens.

"Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:43776F1C.118BBF24@sympatico.ca...
> The reason the crankcase 'intake' line from the air filter to the engine
> is puking out oil is because the PCV isn't working. The PCV sucks air
> out of the valve cover into the intake manifold. This air comes from
> the air filter to the back of the valve cover and circulates through the
> PCV.
>
> The reason the PCV isn't working is because there isn't enough manifold
> vacuum due to a blown charcoal canister purge valve or a dead solenoid
> switch or line (see below for explanation).
>
> The reason the ported vacuum and EGR isn't working right is because of
> low manifold vacuum.
>
> Your timing advance also isn't working right which will blow your
> emissions readings.
>
> Lets start with some basics and see if you can get it purring again.
>
> You can 'temporarily' disconnect the canister, but it 'is' the gas tank
> and carb float bowl vent so if you block the wrong things, the Jeep will
> act like it wants to run out of gas. A vacuum will build up on the gas
> tank.
>
> This also will happen as the charcoal gets saturated with fumes because
> of no purge and as the air filter on the bottom of the canister gets
> plugged. The air filter is only a couple bucks but is a real SOB to get
> the first one out of the canister. Ya gotta dig it out.
>
> The PCV valve should rattle when shaken. If not, it is cheap and needs
> to be replaced.
>
> Then follow the PCV line along the valve cover making sure the 90 degree
> elbow is still good. I replaced that part with a copper tube bent to a
> 90 on mine.
>
> Then the PCV line comes to a solenoid thing at the back of the carb.
> This solenoid never worked properly and the factory fix is to toss it
> away and replace it with a normal T fitting.
>
> Off this T fitting, one line goes to the base of the carb and the other
> line goes to the canister top. This is the vacuum purge line from the
> canister to the PCV system. This large line to the top of the canister
> needs to be blocked at the carb end. It is letting out the manifold
> vacuum.
>
> For 'temporary' use this line to the canister can be unplugged at the
> carb end and the PCV line just put directly onto the carb base nipple.
> That gives the PCV direct manifold vacuum and shuts off the canister.
>
> You then need to unplug one of the other large lines going to the top of
> the canister. I usually unplug the one leading to the carb float bowl.
> The other goes to the gas tank.
>
> This will relieve pressure on the canister so you don't act like you run
> out of gas but will allow gas fumes to escape when it sits. No real
> getting around the gas fumes, that is what the canister is for anyway.
>
> The 'best' fix is to replace the canister.... Anything up to a 91 will
> work.
>
> As to the timing, the computer controls it according to how much vacuum
> it sees. The vacuum switches sit on top of the valve cover or on the
> center firewall. There are two of them side by side. If these are
> electrically unplugged for any reason, the timing will jump about 8
> degrees or back to 0 like you see and the idle will drop. This also
> happens when you unplug the computer.
>
> Mike
>
> steve wrote:
>>
>> Mike,
>>
>> The canister is blown. I have blocked the vacum signal to it from the
>> CTO
>> but the manifold vacum is not blocked (should I). Also, the hose to the
>> PCV
>> is blocked - otherwise it would be sucking in blowby and clog the carb.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Steve
>> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
>> news:4377537D.E8E60140@sympatico.ca...
>> > Now we are getting closer I think....
>> >
>> > You have to address the blowby first. That is the main symptom of a
>> > blown out charcoal canister. This will kill your ported vacuum (EGR)
>> > and make your manifold vacuum too low. It also will mess up the timing
>> > advance big time. This was already mentioned by someone as a possible
>> > cause.
>> >
>> > What have you done with the canister and the small vacuum line to it
>> > that comes from the EGR circuit or from the CTO valve?
>> >
>> > What have you done with the large vacuum line that comes from the PCV
>> > line at the solenoid at the rear of the carb and goes to the canister?
>> >
>> > Does your PCV valve still rattle when you shake it?
>> >
>> > The PCV line runs along the valve cover and makes a right angle turn at
>> > the back of the carb. Is that rubber right angle fitting still in one
>> > piece or has it gone soft and collapsed?
>> >
>> > The trick to adjust the timing depends on you having manifold vacuum.
>> > You don't have proper manifold vacuum if the canister is blown. But
>> > basically you adjust the timing with a vacuum gauge on manifold vacuum
>> > and adjust until you hit the maximum vacuum, then back it off 1" of
>> > vacuum and tighten it up. This will have it close.
>> >
>> > Can you address the above questions, then I can come back with maybe
>> > some more answers or fixes.
>> >
>> > Mike
>> > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
>> > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>> > Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
>> > Aug./05 http://www.imagestation.com/album/in...?id=2120343242
>> > (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
>> >
>> > steve wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Here are some more answers/clues: The idle is very good and smooth
>> >> even
>> >> down to 600rmp. I do have manifold vacuum. I did have oil puking
>> >> into
>> >> the
>> >> air cleaner but I took care of that a long time ago by venting the
>> >> crankcase
>> >> out the back of the Jeep via a long hose...and yes, a lot of blow by
>> >> does
>> >> come out. I also went for the smog test today and failed. The
>> >> hydrocarbons
>> >> were good, CO was 0 at both 15 and 25 mph but the NO was 1100 at 15mph
>> >> (max
>> >> is 750) and was 690 at 25mph. I also failed because the timing was 0
>> >> btdc.
>> >> The guy told me that the timing might be causing the high NO but I am
>> >> woried
>> >> that it is the EGR not getting any ported vac. I know the egr is not
>> >> strong
>> >> at 15 but I am sure a bit of egr would help. It seems to work at
>> >> higher
>> >> speed. Any thoughts? Also, anybody have the link to that trick to
>> >> adjust
>> >> timing without a timing light?
>> >>
>> >> Thanks again for all the help...glad you guts are sticking with me
>> >> here!
>> >>
>> >> "steve" <None@nothing.com> wrote in message
>> >> news:41i9f.6192$D13.468@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com ...
>> >> > Hi All,
>> >> >
>> >> > I am not getting any ported vacuum going to my EGR valve. I checked
>> >> > the
>> >> > vac at the connection that is on the top of the Carter BBD - the one
>> >> > on
>> >> > the engine side of the carb and there is no vacuum at any RPM.
>> >> > Anyone
>> >> > have any ideas why?
>> >> >
>> >> > Thanks in advance,
>> >> > Steve
>> >> >
>> >> >

 

Mike,

I will try plugging the manifold vac from the canister but do not want to
hook up the PCV system. The engine has 185,000 miles on it and the blow by
forces oil through the pcv into the carb and clogs everything up. I will
try the other fixes, buy a timing light and hopefuly go for another test
today. will let you know what happens.

"Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:43776F1C.118BBF24@sympatico.ca...
> The reason the crankcase 'intake' line from the air filter to the engine
> is puking out oil is because the PCV isn't working. The PCV sucks air
> out of the valve cover into the intake manifold. This air comes from
> the air filter to the back of the valve cover and circulates through the
> PCV.
>
> The reason the PCV isn't working is because there isn't enough manifold
> vacuum due to a blown charcoal canister purge valve or a dead solenoid
> switch or line (see below for explanation).
>
> The reason the ported vacuum and EGR isn't working right is because of
> low manifold vacuum.
>
> Your timing advance also isn't working right which will blow your
> emissions readings.
>
> Lets start with some basics and see if you can get it purring again.
>
> You can 'temporarily' disconnect the canister, but it 'is' the gas tank
> and carb float bowl vent so if you block the wrong things, the Jeep will
> act like it wants to run out of gas. A vacuum will build up on the gas
> tank.
>
> This also will happen as the charcoal gets saturated with fumes because
> of no purge and as the air filter on the bottom of the canister gets
> plugged. The air filter is only a couple bucks but is a real SOB to get
> the first one out of the canister. Ya gotta dig it out.
>
> The PCV valve should rattle when shaken. If not, it is cheap and needs
> to be replaced.
>
> Then follow the PCV line along the valve cover making sure the 90 degree
> elbow is still good. I replaced that part with a copper tube bent to a
> 90 on mine.
>
> Then the PCV line comes to a solenoid thing at the back of the carb.
> This solenoid never worked properly and the factory fix is to toss it
> away and replace it with a normal T fitting.
>
> Off this T fitting, one line goes to the base of the carb and the other
> line goes to the canister top. This is the vacuum purge line from the
> canister to the PCV system. This large line to the top of the canister
> needs to be blocked at the carb end. It is letting out the manifold
> vacuum.
>
> For 'temporary' use this line to the canister can be unplugged at the
> carb end and the PCV line just put directly onto the carb base nipple.
> That gives the PCV direct manifold vacuum and shuts off the canister.
>
> You then need to unplug one of the other large lines going to the top of
> the canister. I usually unplug the one leading to the carb float bowl.
> The other goes to the gas tank.
>
> This will relieve pressure on the canister so you don't act like you run
> out of gas but will allow gas fumes to escape when it sits. No real
> getting around the gas fumes, that is what the canister is for anyway.
>
> The 'best' fix is to replace the canister.... Anything up to a 91 will
> work.
>
> As to the timing, the computer controls it according to how much vacuum
> it sees. The vacuum switches sit on top of the valve cover or on the
> center firewall. There are two of them side by side. If these are
> electrically unplugged for any reason, the timing will jump about 8
> degrees or back to 0 like you see and the idle will drop. This also
> happens when you unplug the computer.
>
> Mike
>
> steve wrote:
>>
>> Mike,
>>
>> The canister is blown. I have blocked the vacum signal to it from the
>> CTO
>> but the manifold vacum is not blocked (should I). Also, the hose to the
>> PCV
>> is blocked - otherwise it would be sucking in blowby and clog the carb.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Steve
>> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
>> news:4377537D.E8E60140@sympatico.ca...
>> > Now we are getting closer I think....
>> >
>> > You have to address the blowby first. That is the main symptom of a
>> > blown out charcoal canister. This will kill your ported vacuum (EGR)
>> > and make your manifold vacuum too low. It also will mess up the timing
>> > advance big time. This was already mentioned by someone as a possible
>> > cause.
>> >
>> > What have you done with the canister and the small vacuum line to it
>> > that comes from the EGR circuit or from the CTO valve?
>> >
>> > What have you done with the large vacuum line that comes from the PCV
>> > line at the solenoid at the rear of the carb and goes to the canister?
>> >
>> > Does your PCV valve still rattle when you shake it?
>> >
>> > The PCV line runs along the valve cover and makes a right angle turn at
>> > the back of the carb. Is that rubber right angle fitting still in one
>> > piece or has it gone soft and collapsed?
>> >
>> > The trick to adjust the timing depends on you having manifold vacuum.
>> > You don't have proper manifold vacuum if the canister is blown. But
>> > basically you adjust the timing with a vacuum gauge on manifold vacuum
>> > and adjust until you hit the maximum vacuum, then back it off 1" of
>> > vacuum and tighten it up. This will have it close.
>> >
>> > Can you address the above questions, then I can come back with maybe
>> > some more answers or fixes.
>> >
>> > Mike
>> > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
>> > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>> > Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
>> > Aug./05 http://www.imagestation.com/album/in...?id=2120343242
>> > (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
>> >
>> > steve wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Here are some more answers/clues: The idle is very good and smooth
>> >> even
>> >> down to 600rmp. I do have manifold vacuum. I did have oil puking
>> >> into
>> >> the
>> >> air cleaner but I took care of that a long time ago by venting the
>> >> crankcase
>> >> out the back of the Jeep via a long hose...and yes, a lot of blow by
>> >> does
>> >> come out. I also went for the smog test today and failed. The
>> >> hydrocarbons
>> >> were good, CO was 0 at both 15 and 25 mph but the NO was 1100 at 15mph
>> >> (max
>> >> is 750) and was 690 at 25mph. I also failed because the timing was 0
>> >> btdc.
>> >> The guy told me that the timing might be causing the high NO but I am
>> >> woried
>> >> that it is the EGR not getting any ported vac. I know the egr is not
>> >> strong
>> >> at 15 but I am sure a bit of egr would help. It seems to work at
>> >> higher
>> >> speed. Any thoughts? Also, anybody have the link to that trick to
>> >> adjust
>> >> timing without a timing light?
>> >>
>> >> Thanks again for all the help...glad you guts are sticking with me
>> >> here!
>> >>
>> >> "steve" <None@nothing.com> wrote in message
>> >> news:41i9f.6192$D13.468@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com ...
>> >> > Hi All,
>> >> >
>> >> > I am not getting any ported vacuum going to my EGR valve. I checked
>> >> > the
>> >> > vac at the connection that is on the top of the Carter BBD - the one
>> >> > on
>> >> > the engine side of the carb and there is no vacuum at any RPM.
>> >> > Anyone
>> >> > have any ideas why?
>> >> >
>> >> > Thanks in advance,
>> >> > Steve
>> >> >
>> >> >

 

Mike,

I will try plugging the manifold vac from the canister but do not want to
hook up the PCV system. The engine has 185,000 miles on it and the blow by
forces oil through the pcv into the carb and clogs everything up. I will
try the other fixes, buy a timing light and hopefuly go for another test
today. will let you know what happens.

"Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:43776F1C.118BBF24@sympatico.ca...
> The reason the crankcase 'intake' line from the air filter to the engine
> is puking out oil is because the PCV isn't working. The PCV sucks air
> out of the valve cover into the intake manifold. This air comes from
> the air filter to the back of the valve cover and circulates through the
> PCV.
>
> The reason the PCV isn't working is because there isn't enough manifold
> vacuum due to a blown charcoal canister purge valve or a dead solenoid
> switch or line (see below for explanation).
>
> The reason the ported vacuum and EGR isn't working right is because of
> low manifold vacuum.
>
> Your timing advance also isn't working right which will blow your
> emissions readings.
>
> Lets start with some basics and see if you can get it purring again.
>
> You can 'temporarily' disconnect the canister, but it 'is' the gas tank
> and carb float bowl vent so if you block the wrong things, the Jeep will
> act like it wants to run out of gas. A vacuum will build up on the gas
> tank.
>
> This also will happen as the charcoal gets saturated with fumes because
> of no purge and as the air filter on the bottom of the canister gets
> plugged. The air filter is only a couple bucks but is a real SOB to get
> the first one out of the canister. Ya gotta dig it out.
>
> The PCV valve should rattle when shaken. If not, it is cheap and needs
> to be replaced.
>
> Then follow the PCV line along the valve cover making sure the 90 degree
> elbow is still good. I replaced that part with a copper tube bent to a
> 90 on mine.
>
> Then the PCV line comes to a solenoid thing at the back of the carb.
> This solenoid never worked properly and the factory fix is to toss it
> away and replace it with a normal T fitting.
>
> Off this T fitting, one line goes to the base of the carb and the other
> line goes to the canister top. This is the vacuum purge line from the
> canister to the PCV system. This large line to the top of the canister
> needs to be blocked at the carb end. It is letting out the manifold
> vacuum.
>
> For 'temporary' use this line to the canister can be unplugged at the
> carb end and the PCV line just put directly onto the carb base nipple.
> That gives the PCV direct manifold vacuum and shuts off the canister.
>
> You then need to unplug one of the other large lines going to the top of
> the canister. I usually unplug the one leading to the carb float bowl.
> The other goes to the gas tank.
>
> This will relieve pressure on the canister so you don't act like you run
> out of gas but will allow gas fumes to escape when it sits. No real
> getting around the gas fumes, that is what the canister is for anyway.
>
> The 'best' fix is to replace the canister.... Anything up to a 91 will
> work.
>
> As to the timing, the computer controls it according to how much vacuum
> it sees. The vacuum switches sit on top of the valve cover or on the
> center firewall. There are two of them side by side. If these are
> electrically unplugged for any reason, the timing will jump about 8
> degrees or back to 0 like you see and the idle will drop. This also
> happens when you unplug the computer.
>
> Mike
>
> steve wrote:
>>
>> Mike,
>>
>> The canister is blown. I have blocked the vacum signal to it from the
>> CTO
>> but the manifold vacum is not blocked (should I). Also, the hose to the
>> PCV
>> is blocked - otherwise it would be sucking in blowby and clog the carb.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Steve
>> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
>> news:4377537D.E8E60140@sympatico.ca...
>> > Now we are getting closer I think....
>> >
>> > You have to address the blowby first. That is the main symptom of a
>> > blown out charcoal canister. This will kill your ported vacuum (EGR)
>> > and make your manifold vacuum too low. It also will mess up the timing
>> > advance big time. This was already mentioned by someone as a possible
>> > cause.
>> >
>> > What have you done with the canister and the small vacuum line to it
>> > that comes from the EGR circuit or from the CTO valve?
>> >
>> > What have you done with the large vacuum line that comes from the PCV
>> > line at the solenoid at the rear of the carb and goes to the canister?
>> >
>> > Does your PCV valve still rattle when you shake it?
>> >
>> > The PCV line runs along the valve cover and makes a right angle turn at
>> > the back of the carb. Is that rubber right angle fitting still in one
>> > piece or has it gone soft and collapsed?
>> >
>> > The trick to adjust the timing depends on you having manifold vacuum.
>> > You don't have proper manifold vacuum if the canister is blown. But
>> > basically you adjust the timing with a vacuum gauge on manifold vacuum
>> > and adjust until you hit the maximum vacuum, then back it off 1" of
>> > vacuum and tighten it up. This will have it close.
>> >
>> > Can you address the above questions, then I can come back with maybe
>> > some more answers or fixes.
>> >
>> > Mike
>> > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
>> > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>> > Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
>> > Aug./05 http://www.imagestation.com/album/in...?id=2120343242
>> > (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
>> >
>> > steve wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Here are some more answers/clues: The idle is very good and smooth
>> >> even
>> >> down to 600rmp. I do have manifold vacuum. I did have oil puking
>> >> into
>> >> the
>> >> air cleaner but I took care of that a long time ago by venting the
>> >> crankcase
>> >> out the back of the Jeep via a long hose...and yes, a lot of blow by
>> >> does
>> >> come out. I also went for the smog test today and failed. The
>> >> hydrocarbons
>> >> were good, CO was 0 at both 15 and 25 mph but the NO was 1100 at 15mph
>> >> (max
>> >> is 750) and was 690 at 25mph. I also failed because the timing was 0
>> >> btdc.
>> >> The guy told me that the timing might be causing the high NO but I am
>> >> woried
>> >> that it is the EGR not getting any ported vac. I know the egr is not
>> >> strong
>> >> at 15 but I am sure a bit of egr would help. It seems to work at
>> >> higher
>> >> speed. Any thoughts? Also, anybody have the link to that trick to
>> >> adjust
>> >> timing without a timing light?
>> >>
>> >> Thanks again for all the help...glad you guts are sticking with me
>> >> here!
>> >>
>> >> "steve" <None@nothing.com> wrote in message
>> >> news:41i9f.6192$D13.468@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com ...
>> >> > Hi All,
>> >> >
>> >> > I am not getting any ported vacuum going to my EGR valve. I checked
>> >> > the
>> >> > vac at the connection that is on the top of the Carter BBD - the one
>> >> > on
>> >> > the engine side of the carb and there is no vacuum at any RPM.
>> >> > Anyone
>> >> > have any ideas why?
>> >> >
>> >> > Thanks in advance,
>> >> > Steve
>> >> >
>> >> >

 

The PCV is the one emissions control, that is actually good for your engine.
If you like a sump full of goo, water, and acid, then by all means leave it
unhooked. Like Mike says, you have to fix whatever it is, that is
preventing the PCV from working properly. Otherwise you probably will never
pass emissions either.

Earle

"steve" <None@nothing.com> wrote in message
news:A5Mdf.26229$6e1.16903@newssvr14.news.prodigy. com...
> Mike,
>
> I will try plugging the manifold vac from the canister but do not want to
> hook up the PCV system. The engine has 185,000 miles on it and the blow
by
> forces oil through the pcv into the carb and clogs everything up. I will
> try the other fixes, buy a timing light and hopefuly go for another test
> today. will let you know what happens.
>
> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:43776F1C.118BBF24@sympatico.ca...
> > The reason the crankcase 'intake' line from the air filter to the engine
> > is puking out oil is because the PCV isn't working. The PCV sucks air
> > out of the valve cover into the intake manifold. This air comes from
> > the air filter to the back of the valve cover and circulates through the
> > PCV.
> >
> > The reason the PCV isn't working is because there isn't enough manifold
> > vacuum due to a blown charcoal canister purge valve or a dead solenoid
> > switch or line (see below for explanation).
> >
> > The reason the ported vacuum and EGR isn't working right is because of
> > low manifold vacuum.
> >
> > Your timing advance also isn't working right which will blow your
> > emissions readings.
> >
> > Lets start with some basics and see if you can get it purring again.
> >
> > You can 'temporarily' disconnect the canister, but it 'is' the gas tank
> > and carb float bowl vent so if you block the wrong things, the Jeep will
> > act like it wants to run out of gas. A vacuum will build up on the gas
> > tank.
> >
> > This also will happen as the charcoal gets saturated with fumes because

> > of no purge and as the air filter on the bottom of the canister gets
> > plugged. The air filter is only a couple bucks but is a real SOB to get
> > the first one out of the canister. Ya gotta dig it out.
> >
> > The PCV valve should rattle when shaken. If not, it is cheap and needs
> > to be replaced.
> >
> > Then follow the PCV line along the valve cover making sure the 90 degree
> > elbow is still good. I replaced that part with a copper tube bent to a
> > 90 on mine.
> >
> > Then the PCV line comes to a solenoid thing at the back of the carb.
> > This solenoid never worked properly and the factory fix is to toss it
> > away and replace it with a normal T fitting.
> >
> > Off this T fitting, one line goes to the base of the carb and the other
> > line goes to the canister top. This is the vacuum purge line from the
> > canister to the PCV system. This large line to the top of the canister
> > needs to be blocked at the carb end. It is letting out the manifold
> > vacuum.
> >
> > For 'temporary' use this line to the canister can be unplugged at the
> > carb end and the PCV line just put directly onto the carb base nipple.
> > That gives the PCV direct manifold vacuum and shuts off the canister.
> >
> > You then need to unplug one of the other large lines going to the top of
> > the canister. I usually unplug the one leading to the carb float bowl.
> > The other goes to the gas tank.
> >
> > This will relieve pressure on the canister so you don't act like you run
> > out of gas but will allow gas fumes to escape when it sits. No real
> > getting around the gas fumes, that is what the canister is for anyway.
> >
> > The 'best' fix is to replace the canister.... Anything up to a 91 will
> > work.
> >
> > As to the timing, the computer controls it according to how much vacuum
> > it sees. The vacuum switches sit on top of the valve cover or on the
> > center firewall. There are two of them side by side. If these are
> > electrically unplugged for any reason, the timing will jump about 8
> > degrees or back to 0 like you see and the idle will drop. This also
> > happens when you unplug the computer.
> >
> > Mike
> >
> > steve wrote:
> >>
> >> Mike,
> >>
> >> The canister is blown. I have blocked the vacum signal to it from the
> >> CTO
> >> but the manifold vacum is not blocked (should I). Also, the hose to
the
> >> PCV
> >> is blocked - otherwise it would be sucking in blowby and clog the carb.
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >> Steve
> >> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> >> news:4377537D.E8E60140@sympatico.ca...
> >> > Now we are getting closer I think....
> >> >
> >> > You have to address the blowby first. That is the main symptom of a
> >> > blown out charcoal canister. This will kill your ported vacuum
(EGR)
> >> > and make your manifold vacuum too low. It also will mess up the
timing
> >> > advance big time. This was already mentioned by someone as a
possible
> >> > cause.
> >> >
> >> > What have you done with the canister and the small vacuum line to it
> >> > that comes from the EGR circuit or from the CTO valve?
> >> >
> >> > What have you done with the large vacuum line that comes from the PCV
> >> > line at the solenoid at the rear of the carb and goes to the
canister?
> >> >
> >> > Does your PCV valve still rattle when you shake it?
> >> >
> >> > The PCV line runs along the valve cover and makes a right angle turn
at
> >> > the back of the carb. Is that rubber right angle fitting still in
one
> >> > piece or has it gone soft and collapsed?
> >> >
> >> > The trick to adjust the timing depends on you having manifold vacuum.
> >> > You don't have proper manifold vacuum if the canister is blown. But
> >> > basically you adjust the timing with a vacuum gauge on manifold
vacuum
> >> > and adjust until you hit the maximum vacuum, then back it off 1" of
> >> > vacuum and tighten it up. This will have it close.
> >> >
> >> > Can you address the above questions, then I can come back with maybe
> >> > some more answers or fixes.
> >> >
> >> > Mike
> >> > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> >> > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> >> > Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> >> > Aug./05 http://www.imagestation.com/album/in...?id=2120343242
> >> > (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
> >> >
> >> > steve wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> Here are some more answers/clues: The idle is very good and smooth
> >> >> even
> >> >> down to 600rmp. I do have manifold vacuum. I did have oil puking
> >> >> into
> >> >> the
> >> >> air cleaner but I took care of that a long time ago by venting the
> >> >> crankcase
> >> >> out the back of the Jeep via a long hose...and yes, a lot of blow by
> >> >> does
> >> >> come out. I also went for the smog test today and failed. The
> >> >> hydrocarbons
> >> >> were good, CO was 0 at both 15 and 25 mph but the NO was 1100 at
15mph
> >> >> (max
> >> >> is 750) and was 690 at 25mph. I also failed because the timing was
0
> >> >> btdc.
> >> >> The guy told me that the timing might be causing the high NO but I
am
> >> >> woried
> >> >> that it is the EGR not getting any ported vac. I know the egr is
not
> >> >> strong
> >> >> at 15 but I am sure a bit of egr would help. It seems to work at
> >> >> higher
> >> >> speed. Any thoughts? Also, anybody have the link to that trick to
> >> >> adjust
> >> >> timing without a timing light?
> >> >>
> >> >> Thanks again for all the help...glad you guts are sticking with me
> >> >> here!
> >> >>
> >> >> "steve" <None@nothing.com> wrote in message
> >> >> news:41i9f.6192$D13.468@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com ...
> >> >> > Hi All,
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I am not getting any ported vacuum going to my EGR valve. I
checked
> >> >> > the
> >> >> > vac at the connection that is on the top of the Carter BBD - the
one
> >> >> > on
> >> >> > the engine side of the carb and there is no vacuum at any RPM.
> >> >> > Anyone
> >> >> > have any ideas why?
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Thanks in advance,
> >> >> > Steve
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
>
>

 

The PCV is the one emissions control, that is actually good for your engine.
If you like a sump full of goo, water, and acid, then by all means leave it
unhooked. Like Mike says, you have to fix whatever it is, that is
preventing the PCV from working properly. Otherwise you probably will never
pass emissions either.

Earle

"steve" <None@nothing.com> wrote in message
news:A5Mdf.26229$6e1.16903@newssvr14.news.prodigy. com...
> Mike,
>
> I will try plugging the manifold vac from the canister but do not want to
> hook up the PCV system. The engine has 185,000 miles on it and the blow
by
> forces oil through the pcv into the carb and clogs everything up. I will
> try the other fixes, buy a timing light and hopefuly go for another test
> today. will let you know what happens.
>
> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:43776F1C.118BBF24@sympatico.ca...
> > The reason the crankcase 'intake' line from the air filter to the engine
> > is puking out oil is because the PCV isn't working. The PCV sucks air
> > out of the valve cover into the intake manifold. This air comes from
> > the air filter to the back of the valve cover and circulates through the
> > PCV.
> >
> > The reason the PCV isn't working is because there isn't enough manifold
> > vacuum due to a blown charcoal canister purge valve or a dead solenoid
> > switch or line (see below for explanation).
> >
> > The reason the ported vacuum and EGR isn't working right is because of
> > low manifold vacuum.
> >
> > Your timing advance also isn't working right which will blow your
> > emissions readings.
> >
> > Lets start with some basics and see if you can get it purring again.
> >
> > You can 'temporarily' disconnect the canister, but it 'is' the gas tank
> > and carb float bowl vent so if you block the wrong things, the Jeep will
> > act like it wants to run out of gas. A vacuum will build up on the gas
> > tank.
> >
> > This also will happen as the charcoal gets saturated with fumes because

> > of no purge and as the air filter on the bottom of the canister gets
> > plugged. The air filter is only a couple bucks but is a real SOB to get
> > the first one out of the canister. Ya gotta dig it out.
> >
> > The PCV valve should rattle when shaken. If not, it is cheap and needs
> > to be replaced.
> >
> > Then follow the PCV line along the valve cover making sure the 90 degree
> > elbow is still good. I replaced that part with a copper tube bent to a
> > 90 on mine.
> >
> > Then the PCV line comes to a solenoid thing at the back of the carb.
> > This solenoid never worked properly and the factory fix is to toss it
> > away and replace it with a normal T fitting.
> >
> > Off this T fitting, one line goes to the base of the carb and the other
> > line goes to the canister top. This is the vacuum purge line from the
> > canister to the PCV system. This large line to the top of the canister
> > needs to be blocked at the carb end. It is letting out the manifold
> > vacuum.
> >
> > For 'temporary' use this line to the canister can be unplugged at the
> > carb end and the PCV line just put directly onto the carb base nipple.
> > That gives the PCV direct manifold vacuum and shuts off the canister.
> >
> > You then need to unplug one of the other large lines going to the top of
> > the canister. I usually unplug the one leading to the carb float bowl.
> > The other goes to the gas tank.
> >
> > This will relieve pressure on the canister so you don't act like you run
> > out of gas but will allow gas fumes to escape when it sits. No real
> > getting around the gas fumes, that is what the canister is for anyway.
> >
> > The 'best' fix is to replace the canister.... Anything up to a 91 will
> > work.
> >
> > As to the timing, the computer controls it according to how much vacuum
> > it sees. The vacuum switches sit on top of the valve cover or on the
> > center firewall. There are two of them side by side. If these are
> > electrically unplugged for any reason, the timing will jump about 8
> > degrees or back to 0 like you see and the idle will drop. This also
> > happens when you unplug the computer.
> >
> > Mike
> >
> > steve wrote:
> >>
> >> Mike,
> >>
> >> The canister is blown. I have blocked the vacum signal to it from the
> >> CTO
> >> but the manifold vacum is not blocked (should I). Also, the hose to
the
> >> PCV
> >> is blocked - otherwise it would be sucking in blowby and clog the carb.
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >> Steve
> >> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> >> news:4377537D.E8E60140@sympatico.ca...
> >> > Now we are getting closer I think....
> >> >
> >> > You have to address the blowby first. That is the main symptom of a
> >> > blown out charcoal canister. This will kill your ported vacuum
(EGR)
> >> > and make your manifold vacuum too low. It also will mess up the
timing
> >> > advance big time. This was already mentioned by someone as a
possible
> >> > cause.
> >> >
> >> > What have you done with the canister and the small vacuum line to it
> >> > that comes from the EGR circuit or from the CTO valve?
> >> >
> >> > What have you done with the large vacuum line that comes from the PCV
> >> > line at the solenoid at the rear of the carb and goes to the
canister?
> >> >
> >> > Does your PCV valve still rattle when you shake it?
> >> >
> >> > The PCV line runs along the valve cover and makes a right angle turn
at
> >> > the back of the carb. Is that rubber right angle fitting still in
one
> >> > piece or has it gone soft and collapsed?
> >> >
> >> > The trick to adjust the timing depends on you having manifold vacuum.
> >> > You don't have proper manifold vacuum if the canister is blown. But
> >> > basically you adjust the timing with a vacuum gauge on manifold
vacuum
> >> > and adjust until you hit the maximum vacuum, then back it off 1" of
> >> > vacuum and tighten it up. This will have it close.
> >> >
> >> > Can you address the above questions, then I can come back with maybe
> >> > some more answers or fixes.
> >> >
> >> > Mike
> >> > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> >> > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> >> > Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> >> > Aug./05 http://www.imagestation.com/album/in...?id=2120343242
> >> > (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
> >> >
> >> > steve wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> Here are some more answers/clues: The idle is very good and smooth
> >> >> even
> >> >> down to 600rmp. I do have manifold vacuum. I did have oil puking
> >> >> into
> >> >> the
> >> >> air cleaner but I took care of that a long time ago by venting the
> >> >> crankcase
> >> >> out the back of the Jeep via a long hose...and yes, a lot of blow by
> >> >> does
> >> >> come out. I also went for the smog test today and failed. The
> >> >> hydrocarbons
> >> >> were good, CO was 0 at both 15 and 25 mph but the NO was 1100 at
15mph
> >> >> (max
> >> >> is 750) and was 690 at 25mph. I also failed because the timing was
0
> >> >> btdc.
> >> >> The guy told me that the timing might be causing the high NO but I
am
> >> >> woried
> >> >> that it is the EGR not getting any ported vac. I know the egr is
not
> >> >> strong
> >> >> at 15 but I am sure a bit of egr would help. It seems to work at
> >> >> higher
> >> >> speed. Any thoughts? Also, anybody have the link to that trick to
> >> >> adjust
> >> >> timing without a timing light?
> >> >>
> >> >> Thanks again for all the help...glad you guts are sticking with me
> >> >> here!
> >> >>
> >> >> "steve" <None@nothing.com> wrote in message
> >> >> news:41i9f.6192$D13.468@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com ...
> >> >> > Hi All,
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I am not getting any ported vacuum going to my EGR valve. I
checked
> >> >> > the
> >> >> > vac at the connection that is on the top of the Carter BBD - the
one
> >> >> > on
> >> >> > the engine side of the carb and there is no vacuum at any RPM.
> >> >> > Anyone
> >> >> > have any ideas why?
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Thanks in advance,
> >> >> > Steve
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
>
>

 

The PCV is the one emissions control, that is actually good for your engine.
If you like a sump full of goo, water, and acid, then by all means leave it
unhooked. Like Mike says, you have to fix whatever it is, that is
preventing the PCV from working properly. Otherwise you probably will never
pass emissions either.

Earle

"steve" <None@nothing.com> wrote in message
news:A5Mdf.26229$6e1.16903@newssvr14.news.prodigy. com...
> Mike,
>
> I will try plugging the manifold vac from the canister but do not want to
> hook up the PCV system. The engine has 185,000 miles on it and the blow
by
> forces oil through the pcv into the carb and clogs everything up. I will
> try the other fixes, buy a timing light and hopefuly go for another test
> today. will let you know what happens.
>
> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:43776F1C.118BBF24@sympatico.ca...
> > The reason the crankcase 'intake' line from the air filter to the engine
> > is puking out oil is because the PCV isn't working. The PCV sucks air
> > out of the valve cover into the intake manifold. This air comes from
> > the air filter to the back of the valve cover and circulates through the
> > PCV.
> >
> > The reason the PCV isn't working is because there isn't enough manifold
> > vacuum due to a blown charcoal canister purge valve or a dead solenoid
> > switch or line (see below for explanation).
> >
> > The reason the ported vacuum and EGR isn't working right is because of
> > low manifold vacuum.
> >
> > Your timing advance also isn't working right which will blow your
> > emissions readings.
> >
> > Lets start with some basics and see if you can get it purring again.
> >
> > You can 'temporarily' disconnect the canister, but it 'is' the gas tank
> > and carb float bowl vent so if you block the wrong things, the Jeep will
> > act like it wants to run out of gas. A vacuum will build up on the gas
> > tank.
> >
> > This also will happen as the charcoal gets saturated with fumes because

> > of no purge and as the air filter on the bottom of the canister gets
> > plugged. The air filter is only a couple bucks but is a real SOB to get
> > the first one out of the canister. Ya gotta dig it out.
> >
> > The PCV valve should rattle when shaken. If not, it is cheap and needs
> > to be replaced.
> >
> > Then follow the PCV line along the valve cover making sure the 90 degree
> > elbow is still good. I replaced that part with a copper tube bent to a
> > 90 on mine.
> >
> > Then the PCV line comes to a solenoid thing at the back of the carb.
> > This solenoid never worked properly and the factory fix is to toss it
> > away and replace it with a normal T fitting.
> >
> > Off this T fitting, one line goes to the base of the carb and the other
> > line goes to the canister top. This is the vacuum purge line from the
> > canister to the PCV system. This large line to the top of the canister
> > needs to be blocked at the carb end. It is letting out the manifold
> > vacuum.
> >
> > For 'temporary' use this line to the canister can be unplugged at the
> > carb end and the PCV line just put directly onto the carb base nipple.
> > That gives the PCV direct manifold vacuum and shuts off the canister.
> >
> > You then need to unplug one of the other large lines going to the top of
> > the canister. I usually unplug the one leading to the carb float bowl.
> > The other goes to the gas tank.
> >
> > This will relieve pressure on the canister so you don't act like you run
> > out of gas but will allow gas fumes to escape when it sits. No real
> > getting around the gas fumes, that is what the canister is for anyway.
> >
> > The 'best' fix is to replace the canister.... Anything up to a 91 will
> > work.
> >
> > As to the timing, the computer controls it according to how much vacuum
> > it sees. The vacuum switches sit on top of the valve cover or on the
> > center firewall. There are two of them side by side. If these are
> > electrically unplugged for any reason, the timing will jump about 8
> > degrees or back to 0 like you see and the idle will drop. This also
> > happens when you unplug the computer.
> >
> > Mike
> >
> > steve wrote:
> >>
> >> Mike,
> >>
> >> The canister is blown. I have blocked the vacum signal to it from the
> >> CTO
> >> but the manifold vacum is not blocked (should I). Also, the hose to
the
> >> PCV
> >> is blocked - otherwise it would be sucking in blowby and clog the carb.
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >> Steve
> >> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> >> news:4377537D.E8E60140@sympatico.ca...
> >> > Now we are getting closer I think....
> >> >
> >> > You have to address the blowby first. That is the main symptom of a
> >> > blown out charcoal canister. This will kill your ported vacuum
(EGR)
> >> > and make your manifold vacuum too low. It also will mess up the
timing
> >> > advance big time. This was already mentioned by someone as a
possible
> >> > cause.
> >> >
> >> > What have you done with the canister and the small vacuum line to it
> >> > that comes from the EGR circuit or from the CTO valve?
> >> >
> >> > What have you done with the large vacuum line that comes from the PCV
> >> > line at the solenoid at the rear of the carb and goes to the
canister?
> >> >
> >> > Does your PCV valve still rattle when you shake it?
> >> >
> >> > The PCV line runs along the valve cover and makes a right angle turn
at
> >> > the back of the carb. Is that rubber right angle fitting still in
one
> >> > piece or has it gone soft and collapsed?
> >> >
> >> > The trick to adjust the timing depends on you having manifold vacuum.
> >> > You don't have proper manifold vacuum if the canister is blown. But
> >> > basically you adjust the timing with a vacuum gauge on manifold
vacuum
> >> > and adjust until you hit the maximum vacuum, then back it off 1" of
> >> > vacuum and tighten it up. This will have it close.
> >> >
> >> > Can you address the above questions, then I can come back with maybe
> >> > some more answers or fixes.
> >> >
> >> > Mike
> >> > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> >> > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> >> > Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> >> > Aug./05 http://www.imagestation.com/album/in...?id=2120343242
> >> > (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
> >> >
> >> > steve wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> Here are some more answers/clues: The idle is very good and smooth
> >> >> even
> >> >> down to 600rmp. I do have manifold vacuum. I did have oil puking
> >> >> into
> >> >> the
> >> >> air cleaner but I took care of that a long time ago by venting the
> >> >> crankcase
> >> >> out the back of the Jeep via a long hose...and yes, a lot of blow by
> >> >> does
> >> >> come out. I also went for the smog test today and failed. The
> >> >> hydrocarbons
> >> >> were good, CO was 0 at both 15 and 25 mph but the NO was 1100 at
15mph
> >> >> (max
> >> >> is 750) and was 690 at 25mph. I also failed because the timing was
0
> >> >> btdc.
> >> >> The guy told me that the timing might be causing the high NO but I
am
> >> >> woried
> >> >> that it is the EGR not getting any ported vac. I know the egr is
not
> >> >> strong
> >> >> at 15 but I am sure a bit of egr would help. It seems to work at
> >> >> higher
> >> >> speed. Any thoughts? Also, anybody have the link to that trick to
> >> >> adjust
> >> >> timing without a timing light?
> >> >>
> >> >> Thanks again for all the help...glad you guts are sticking with me
> >> >> here!
> >> >>
> >> >> "steve" <None@nothing.com> wrote in message
> >> >> news:41i9f.6192$D13.468@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com ...
> >> >> > Hi All,
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I am not getting any ported vacuum going to my EGR valve. I
checked
> >> >> > the
> >> >> > vac at the connection that is on the top of the Carter BBD - the
one
> >> >> > on
> >> >> > the engine side of the carb and there is no vacuum at any RPM.
> >> >> > Anyone
> >> >> > have any ideas why?
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Thanks in advance,
> >> >> > Steve
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
>
>

 

It's also time to get pragmatic. Hook up the PCV if it will get you
past the smog *****, then worry about the carb gunk later. If its
blowing enough to gum up the carb on one trip to the inspection
station you've got some far more significant problems than just
blowby.

On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 19:45:43 UTC "Earle Horton"
<nurse-nospam-busters@msn.com> wrote:

> The PCV is the one emissions control, that is actually good for your engine.
> If you like a sump full of goo, water, and acid, then by all means leave it
> unhooked. Like Mike says, you have to fix whatever it is, that is
> preventing the PCV from working properly. Otherwise you probably will never
> pass emissions either.
>
> Earle
>
> "steve" <None@nothing.com> wrote in message
> news:A5Mdf.26229$6e1.16903@newssvr14.news.prodigy. com...
> > Mike,
> >
> > I will try plugging the manifold vac from the canister but do not want to
> > hook up the PCV system. The engine has 185,000 miles on it and the blow
> by
> > forces oil through the pcv into the carb and clogs everything up. I will
> > try the other fixes, buy a timing light and hopefuly go for another test
> > today. will let you know what happens.
> >
> > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > news:43776F1C.118BBF24@sympatico.ca...
> > > The reason the crankcase 'intake' line from the air filter to the engine
> > > is puking out oil is because the PCV isn't working. The PCV sucks air
> > > out of the valve cover into the intake manifold. This air comes from
> > > the air filter to the back of the valve cover and circulates through the
> > > PCV.
> > >
> > > The reason the PCV isn't working is because there isn't enough manifold
> > > vacuum due to a blown charcoal canister purge valve or a dead solenoid
> > > switch or line (see below for explanation).
> > >
> > > The reason the ported vacuum and EGR isn't working right is because of
> > > low manifold vacuum.
> > >
> > > Your timing advance also isn't working right which will blow your
> > > emissions readings.
> > >
> > > Lets start with some basics and see if you can get it purring again.
> > >
> > > You can 'temporarily' disconnect the canister, but it 'is' the gas tank
> > > and carb float bowl vent so if you block the wrong things, the Jeep will
> > > act like it wants to run out of gas. A vacuum will build up on the gas
> > > tank.
> > >
> > > This also will happen as the charcoal gets saturated with fumes because
>
> > > of no purge and as the air filter on the bottom of the canister gets
> > > plugged. The air filter is only a couple bucks but is a real SOB to get
> > > the first one out of the canister. Ya gotta dig it out.
> > >
> > > The PCV valve should rattle when shaken. If not, it is cheap and needs
> > > to be replaced.
> > >
> > > Then follow the PCV line along the valve cover making sure the 90 degree
> > > elbow is still good. I replaced that part with a copper tube bent to a
> > > 90 on mine.
> > >
> > > Then the PCV line comes to a solenoid thing at the back of the carb.
> > > This solenoid never worked properly and the factory fix is to toss it
> > > away and replace it with a normal T fitting.
> > >
> > > Off this T fitting, one line goes to the base of the carb and the other
> > > line goes to the canister top. This is the vacuum purge line from the
> > > canister to the PCV system. This large line to the top of the canister
> > > needs to be blocked at the carb end. It is letting out the manifold
> > > vacuum.
> > >
> > > For 'temporary' use this line to the canister can be unplugged at the
> > > carb end and the PCV line just put directly onto the carb base nipple.
> > > That gives the PCV direct manifold vacuum and shuts off the canister.
> > >
> > > You then need to unplug one of the other large lines going to the top of
> > > the canister. I usually unplug the one leading to the carb float bowl.
> > > The other goes to the gas tank.
> > >
> > > This will relieve pressure on the canister so you don't act like you run
> > > out of gas but will allow gas fumes to escape when it sits. No real
> > > getting around the gas fumes, that is what the canister is for anyway.
> > >
> > > The 'best' fix is to replace the canister.... Anything up to a 91 will
> > > work.
> > >
> > > As to the timing, the computer controls it according to how much vacuum
> > > it sees. The vacuum switches sit on top of the valve cover or on the
> > > center firewall. There are two of them side by side. If these are
> > > electrically unplugged for any reason, the timing will jump about 8
> > > degrees or back to 0 like you see and the idle will drop. This also
> > > happens when you unplug the computer.
> > >
> > > Mike
> > >
> > > steve wrote:
> > >>
> > >> Mike,
> > >>
> > >> The canister is blown. I have blocked the vacum signal to it from the
> > >> CTO
> > >> but the manifold vacum is not blocked (should I). Also, the hose to
> the
> > >> PCV
> > >> is blocked - otherwise it would be sucking in blowby and clog the carb.
> > >>
> > >> Thanks,
> > >> Steve
> > >> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > >> news:4377537D.E8E60140@sympatico.ca...
> > >> > Now we are getting closer I think....
> > >> >
> > >> > You have to address the blowby first. That is the main symptom of a
> > >> > blown out charcoal canister. This will kill your ported vacuum
> (EGR)
> > >> > and make your manifold vacuum too low. It also will mess up the
> timing
> > >> > advance big time. This was already mentioned by someone as a
> possible
> > >> > cause.
> > >> >
> > >> > What have you done with the canister and the small vacuum line to it
> > >> > that comes from the EGR circuit or from the CTO valve?
> > >> >
> > >> > What have you done with the large vacuum line that comes from the PCV
> > >> > line at the solenoid at the rear of the carb and goes to the
> canister?
> > >> >
> > >> > Does your PCV valve still rattle when you shake it?
> > >> >
> > >> > The PCV line runs along the valve cover and makes a right angle turn
> at
> > >> > the back of the carb. Is that rubber right angle fitting still in
> one
> > >> > piece or has it gone soft and collapsed?
> > >> >
> > >> > The trick to adjust the timing depends on you having manifold vacuum.
> > >> > You don't have proper manifold vacuum if the canister is blown. But
> > >> > basically you adjust the timing with a vacuum gauge on manifold
> vacuum
> > >> > and adjust until you hit the maximum vacuum, then back it off 1" of
> > >> > vacuum and tighten it up. This will have it close.
> > >> >
> > >> > Can you address the above questions, then I can come back with maybe
> > >> > some more answers or fixes.
> > >> >
> > >> > Mike
> > >> > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> > >> > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> > >> > Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> > >> > Aug./05 http://www.imagestation.com/album/in...?id=2120343242
> > >> > (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
> > >> >
> > >> > steve wrote:
> > >> >>
> > >> >> Here are some more answers/clues: The idle is very good and smooth
> > >> >> even
> > >> >> down to 600rmp. I do have manifold vacuum. I did have oil puking
> > >> >> into
> > >> >> the
> > >> >> air cleaner but I took care of that a long time ago by venting the
> > >> >> crankcase
> > >> >> out the back of the Jeep via a long hose...and yes, a lot of blow by
> > >> >> does
> > >> >> come out. I also went for the smog test today and failed. The
> > >> >> hydrocarbons
> > >> >> were good, CO was 0 at both 15 and 25 mph but the NO was 1100 at
> 15mph
> > >> >> (max
> > >> >> is 750) and was 690 at 25mph. I also failed because the timing was
> 0
> > >> >> btdc.
> > >> >> The guy told me that the timing might be causing the high NO but I
> am
> > >> >> woried
> > >> >> that it is the EGR not getting any ported vac. I know the egr is
> not
> > >> >> strong
> > >> >> at 15 but I am sure a bit of egr would help. It seems to work at
> > >> >> higher
> > >> >> speed. Any thoughts? Also, anybody have the link to that trick to
> > >> >> adjust
> > >> >> timing without a timing light?
> > >> >>
> > >> >> Thanks again for all the help...glad you guts are sticking with me
> > >> >> here!
> > >> >>
> > >> >> "steve" <None@nothing.com> wrote in message
> > >> >> news:41i9f.6192$D13.468@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com ...
> > >> >> > Hi All,
> > >> >> >
> > >> >> > I am not getting any ported vacuum going to my EGR valve. I
> checked
> > >> >> > the
> > >> >> > vac at the connection that is on the top of the Carter BBD - the
> one
> > >> >> > on
> > >> >> > the engine side of the carb and there is no vacuum at any RPM.
> > >> >> > Anyone
> > >> >> > have any ideas why?
> > >> >> >
> > >> >> > Thanks in advance,
> > >> >> > Steve
> > >> >> >
> > >> >> >
> >
> >
>
>


--
Will Honea

 

It's also time to get pragmatic. Hook up the PCV if it will get you
past the smog *****, then worry about the carb gunk later. If its
blowing enough to gum up the carb on one trip to the inspection
station you've got some far more significant problems than just
blowby.

On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 19:45:43 UTC "Earle Horton"
<nurse-nospam-busters@msn.com> wrote:

> The PCV is the one emissions control, that is actually good for your engine.
> If you like a sump full of goo, water, and acid, then by all means leave it
> unhooked. Like Mike says, you have to fix whatever it is, that is
> preventing the PCV from working properly. Otherwise you probably will never
> pass emissions either.
>
> Earle
>
> "steve" <None@nothing.com> wrote in message
> news:A5Mdf.26229$6e1.16903@newssvr14.news.prodigy. com...
> > Mike,
> >
> > I will try plugging the manifold vac from the canister but do not want to
> > hook up the PCV system. The engine has 185,000 miles on it and the blow
> by
> > forces oil through the pcv into the carb and clogs everything up. I will
> > try the other fixes, buy a timing light and hopefuly go for another test
> > today. will let you know what happens.
> >
> > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > news:43776F1C.118BBF24@sympatico.ca...
> > > The reason the crankcase 'intake' line from the air filter to the engine
> > > is puking out oil is because the PCV isn't working. The PCV sucks air
> > > out of the valve cover into the intake manifold. This air comes from
> > > the air filter to the back of the valve cover and circulates through the
> > > PCV.
> > >
> > > The reason the PCV isn't working is because there isn't enough manifold
> > > vacuum due to a blown charcoal canister purge valve or a dead solenoid
> > > switch or line (see below for explanation).
> > >
> > > The reason the ported vacuum and EGR isn't working right is because of
> > > low manifold vacuum.
> > >
> > > Your timing advance also isn't working right which will blow your
> > > emissions readings.
> > >
> > > Lets start with some basics and see if you can get it purring again.
> > >
> > > You can 'temporarily' disconnect the canister, but it 'is' the gas tank
> > > and carb float bowl vent so if you block the wrong things, the Jeep will
> > > act like it wants to run out of gas. A vacuum will build up on the gas
> > > tank.
> > >
> > > This also will happen as the charcoal gets saturated with fumes because
>
> > > of no purge and as the air filter on the bottom of the canister gets
> > > plugged. The air filter is only a couple bucks but is a real SOB to get
> > > the first one out of the canister. Ya gotta dig it out.
> > >
> > > The PCV valve should rattle when shaken. If not, it is cheap and needs
> > > to be replaced.
> > >
> > > Then follow the PCV line along the valve cover making sure the 90 degree
> > > elbow is still good. I replaced that part with a copper tube bent to a
> > > 90 on mine.
> > >
> > > Then the PCV line comes to a solenoid thing at the back of the carb.
> > > This solenoid never worked properly and the factory fix is to toss it
> > > away and replace it with a normal T fitting.
> > >
> > > Off this T fitting, one line goes to the base of the carb and the other
> > > line goes to the canister top. This is the vacuum purge line from the
> > > canister to the PCV system. This large line to the top of the canister
> > > needs to be blocked at the carb end. It is letting out the manifold
> > > vacuum.
> > >
> > > For 'temporary' use this line to the canister can be unplugged at the
> > > carb end and the PCV line just put directly onto the carb base nipple.
> > > That gives the PCV direct manifold vacuum and shuts off the canister.
> > >
> > > You then need to unplug one of the other large lines going to the top of
> > > the canister. I usually unplug the one leading to the carb float bowl.
> > > The other goes to the gas tank.
> > >
> > > This will relieve pressure on the canister so you don't act like you run
> > > out of gas but will allow gas fumes to escape when it sits. No real
> > > getting around the gas fumes, that is what the canister is for anyway.
> > >
> > > The 'best' fix is to replace the canister.... Anything up to a 91 will
> > > work.
> > >
> > > As to the timing, the computer controls it according to how much vacuum
> > > it sees. The vacuum switches sit on top of the valve cover or on the
> > > center firewall. There are two of them side by side. If these are
> > > electrically unplugged for any reason, the timing will jump about 8
> > > degrees or back to 0 like you see and the idle will drop. This also
> > > happens when you unplug the computer.
> > >
> > > Mike
> > >
> > > steve wrote:
> > >>
> > >> Mike,
> > >>
> > >> The canister is blown. I have blocked the vacum signal to it from the
> > >> CTO
> > >> but the manifold vacum is not blocked (should I). Also, the hose to
> the
> > >> PCV
> > >> is blocked - otherwise it would be sucking in blowby and clog the carb.
> > >>
> > >> Thanks,
> > >> Steve
> > >> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > >> news:4377537D.E8E60140@sympatico.ca...
> > >> > Now we are getting closer I think....
> > >> >
> > >> > You have to address the blowby first. That is the main symptom of a
> > >> > blown out charcoal canister. This will kill your ported vacuum
> (EGR)
> > >> > and make your manifold vacuum too low. It also will mess up the
> timing
> > >> > advance big time. This was already mentioned by someone as a
> possible
> > >> > cause.
> > >> >
> > >> > What have you done with the canister and the small vacuum line to it
> > >> > that comes from the EGR circuit or from the CTO valve?
> > >> >
> > >> > What have you done with the large vacuum line that comes from the PCV
> > >> > line at the solenoid at the rear of the carb and goes to the
> canister?
> > >> >
> > >> > Does your PCV valve still rattle when you shake it?
> > >> >
> > >> > The PCV line runs along the valve cover and makes a right angle turn
> at
> > >> > the back of the carb. Is that rubber right angle fitting still in
> one
> > >> > piece or has it gone soft and collapsed?
> > >> >
> > >> > The trick to adjust the timing depends on you having manifold vacuum.
> > >> > You don't have proper manifold vacuum if the canister is blown. But
> > >> > basically you adjust the timing with a vacuum gauge on manifold
> vacuum
> > >> > and adjust until you hit the maximum vacuum, then back it off 1" of
> > >> > vacuum and tighten it up. This will have it close.
> > >> >
> > >> > Can you address the above questions, then I can come back with maybe
> > >> > some more answers or fixes.
> > >> >
> > >> > Mike
> > >> > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> > >> > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> > >> > Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> > >> > Aug./05 http://www.imagestation.com/album/in...?id=2120343242
> > >> > (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
> > >> >
> > >> > steve wrote:
> > >> >>
> > >> >> Here are some more answers/clues: The idle is very good and smooth
> > >> >> even
> > >> >> down to 600rmp. I do have manifold vacuum. I did have oil puking
> > >> >> into
> > >> >> the
> > >> >> air cleaner but I took care of that a long time ago by venting the
> > >> >> crankcase
> > >> >> out the back of the Jeep via a long hose...and yes, a lot of blow by
> > >> >> does
> > >> >> come out. I also went for the smog test today and failed. The
> > >> >> hydrocarbons
> > >> >> were good, CO was 0 at both 15 and 25 mph but the NO was 1100 at
> 15mph
> > >> >> (max
> > >> >> is 750) and was 690 at 25mph. I also failed because the timing was
> 0
> > >> >> btdc.
> > >> >> The guy told me that the timing might be causing the high NO but I
> am
> > >> >> woried
> > >> >> that it is the EGR not getting any ported vac. I know the egr is
> not
> > >> >> strong
> > >> >> at 15 but I am sure a bit of egr would help. It seems to work at
> > >> >> higher
> > >> >> speed. Any thoughts? Also, anybody have the link to that trick to
> > >> >> adjust
> > >> >> timing without a timing light?
> > >> >>
> > >> >> Thanks again for all the help...glad you guts are sticking with me
> > >> >> here!
> > >> >>
> > >> >> "steve" <None@nothing.com> wrote in message
> > >> >> news:41i9f.6192$D13.468@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com ...
> > >> >> > Hi All,
> > >> >> >
> > >> >> > I am not getting any ported vacuum going to my EGR valve. I
> checked
> > >> >> > the
> > >> >> > vac at the connection that is on the top of the Carter BBD - the
> one
> > >> >> > on
> > >> >> > the engine side of the carb and there is no vacuum at any RPM.
> > >> >> > Anyone
> > >> >> > have any ideas why?
> > >> >> >
> > >> >> > Thanks in advance,
> > >> >> > Steve
> > >> >> >
> > >> >> >
> >
> >
>
>


--
Will Honea

 

It's also time to get pragmatic. Hook up the PCV if it will get you
past the smog *****, then worry about the carb gunk later. If its
blowing enough to gum up the carb on one trip to the inspection
station you've got some far more significant problems than just
blowby.

On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 19:45:43 UTC "Earle Horton"
<nurse-nospam-busters@msn.com> wrote:

> The PCV is the one emissions control, that is actually good for your engine.
> If you like a sump full of goo, water, and acid, then by all means leave it
> unhooked. Like Mike says, you have to fix whatever it is, that is
> preventing the PCV from working properly. Otherwise you probably will never
> pass emissions either.
>
> Earle
>
> "steve" <None@nothing.com> wrote in message
> news:A5Mdf.26229$6e1.16903@newssvr14.news.prodigy. com...
> > Mike,
> >
> > I will try plugging the manifold vac from the canister but do not want to
> > hook up the PCV system. The engine has 185,000 miles on it and the blow
> by
> > forces oil through the pcv into the carb and clogs everything up. I will
> > try the other fixes, buy a timing light and hopefuly go for another test
> > today. will let you know what happens.
> >
> > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > news:43776F1C.118BBF24@sympatico.ca...
> > > The reason the crankcase 'intake' line from the air filter to the engine
> > > is puking out oil is because the PCV isn't working. The PCV sucks air
> > > out of the valve cover into the intake manifold. This air comes from
> > > the air filter to the back of the valve cover and circulates through the
> > > PCV.
> > >
> > > The reason the PCV isn't working is because there isn't enough manifold
> > > vacuum due to a blown charcoal canister purge valve or a dead solenoid
> > > switch or line (see below for explanation).
> > >
> > > The reason the ported vacuum and EGR isn't working right is because of
> > > low manifold vacuum.
> > >
> > > Your timing advance also isn't working right which will blow your
> > > emissions readings.
> > >
> > > Lets start with some basics and see if you can get it purring again.
> > >
> > > You can 'temporarily' disconnect the canister, but it 'is' the gas tank
> > > and carb float bowl vent so if you block the wrong things, the Jeep will
> > > act like it wants to run out of gas. A vacuum will build up on the gas
> > > tank.
> > >
> > > This also will happen as the charcoal gets saturated with fumes because
>
> > > of no purge and as the air filter on the bottom of the canister gets
> > > plugged. The air filter is only a couple bucks but is a real SOB to get
> > > the first one out of the canister. Ya gotta dig it out.
> > >
> > > The PCV valve should rattle when shaken. If not, it is cheap and needs
> > > to be replaced.
> > >
> > > Then follow the PCV line along the valve cover making sure the 90 degree
> > > elbow is still good. I replaced that part with a copper tube bent to a
> > > 90 on mine.
> > >
> > > Then the PCV line comes to a solenoid thing at the back of the carb.
> > > This solenoid never worked properly and the factory fix is to toss it
> > > away and replace it with a normal T fitting.
> > >
> > > Off this T fitting, one line goes to the base of the carb and the other
> > > line goes to the canister top. This is the vacuum purge line from the
> > > canister to the PCV system. This large line to the top of the canister
> > > needs to be blocked at the carb end. It is letting out the manifold
> > > vacuum.
> > >
> > > For 'temporary' use this line to the canister can be unplugged at the
> > > carb end and the PCV line just put directly onto the carb base nipple.
> > > That gives the PCV direct manifold vacuum and shuts off the canister.
> > >
> > > You then need to unplug one of the other large lines going to the top of
> > > the canister. I usually unplug the one leading to the carb float bowl.
> > > The other goes to the gas tank.
> > >
> > > This will relieve pressure on the canister so you don't act like you run
> > > out of gas but will allow gas fumes to escape when it sits. No real
> > > getting around the gas fumes, that is what the canister is for anyway.
> > >
> > > The 'best' fix is to replace the canister.... Anything up to a 91 will
> > > work.
> > >
> > > As to the timing, the computer controls it according to how much vacuum
> > > it sees. The vacuum switches sit on top of the valve cover or on the
> > > center firewall. There are two of them side by side. If these are
> > > electrically unplugged for any reason, the timing will jump about 8
> > > degrees or back to 0 like you see and the idle will drop. This also
> > > happens when you unplug the computer.
> > >
> > > Mike
> > >
> > > steve wrote:
> > >>
> > >> Mike,
> > >>
> > >> The canister is blown. I have blocked the vacum signal to it from the
> > >> CTO
> > >> but the manifold vacum is not blocked (should I). Also, the hose to
> the
> > >> PCV
> > >> is blocked - otherwise it would be sucking in blowby and clog the carb.
> > >>
> > >> Thanks,
> > >> Steve
> > >> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> > >> news:4377537D.E8E60140@sympatico.ca...
> > >> > Now we are getting closer I think....
> > >> >
> > >> > You have to address the blowby first. That is the main symptom of a
> > >> > blown out charcoal canister. This will kill your ported vacuum
> (EGR)
> > >> > and make your manifold vacuum too low. It also will mess up the
> timing
> > >> > advance big time. This was already mentioned by someone as a
> possible
> > >> > cause.
> > >> >
> > >> > What have you done with the canister and the small vacuum line to it
> > >> > that comes from the EGR circuit or from the CTO valve?
> > >> >
> > >> > What have you done with the large vacuum line that comes from the PCV
> > >> > line at the solenoid at the rear of the carb and goes to the
> canister?
> > >> >
> > >> > Does your PCV valve still rattle when you shake it?
> > >> >
> > >> > The PCV line runs along the valve cover and makes a right angle turn
> at
> > >> > the back of the carb. Is that rubber right angle fitting still in
> one
> > >> > piece or has it gone soft and collapsed?
> > >> >
> > >> > The trick to adjust the timing depends on you having manifold vacuum.
> > >> > You don't have proper manifold vacuum if the canister is blown. But
> > >> > basically you adjust the timing with a vacuum gauge on manifold
> vacuum
> > >> > and adjust until you hit the maximum vacuum, then back it off 1" of
> > >> > vacuum and tighten it up. This will have it close.
> > >> >
> > >> > Can you address the above questions, then I can come back with maybe
> > >> > some more answers or fixes.
> > >> >
> > >> > Mike
> > >> > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> > >> > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> > >> > Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> > >> > Aug./05 http://www.imagestation.com/album/in...?id=2120343242
> > >> > (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
> > >> >
> > >> > steve wrote:
> > >> >>
> > >> >> Here are some more answers/clues: The idle is very good and smooth
> > >> >> even
> > >> >> down to 600rmp. I do have manifold vacuum. I did have oil puking
> > >> >> into
> > >> >> the
> > >> >> air cleaner but I took care of that a long time ago by venting the
> > >> >> crankcase
> > >> >> out the back of the Jeep via a long hose...and yes, a lot of blow by
> > >> >> does
> > >> >> come out. I also went for the smog test today and failed. The
> > >> >> hydrocarbons
> > >> >> were good, CO was 0 at both 15 and 25 mph but the NO was 1100 at
> 15mph
> > >> >> (max
> > >> >> is 750) and was 690 at 25mph. I also failed because the timing was
> 0
> > >> >> btdc.
> > >> >> The guy told me that the timing might be causing the high NO but I
> am
> > >> >> woried
> > >> >> that it is the EGR not getting any ported vac. I know the egr is
> not
> > >> >> strong
> > >> >> at 15 but I am sure a bit of egr would help. It seems to work at
> > >> >> higher
> > >> >> speed. Any thoughts? Also, anybody have the link to that trick to
> > >> >> adjust
> > >> >> timing without a timing light?
> > >> >>
> > >> >> Thanks again for all the help...glad you guts are sticking with me
> > >> >> here!
> > >> >>
> > >> >> "steve" <None@nothing.com> wrote in message
> > >> >> news:41i9f.6192$D13.468@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com ...
> > >> >> > Hi All,
> > >> >> >
> > >> >> > I am not getting any ported vacuum going to my EGR valve. I
> checked
> > >> >> > the
> > >> >> > vac at the connection that is on the top of the Carter BBD - the
> one
> > >> >> > on
> > >> >> > the engine side of the carb and there is no vacuum at any RPM.
> > >> >> > Anyone
> > >> >> > have any ideas why?
> > >> >> >
> > >> >> > Thanks in advance,
> > >> >> > Steve
> > >> >> >
> > >> >> >
> >
> >
>
>


--
Will Honea

 

GOOD NEWS everyone,

I past the smog test! I took mikes suggestions and plugged the manifold
vacum going to the canister and that got the ported vacum back. I adjusted
the timing and went for the test and past easily. Mystery solved. Thanks
everyone for all the help!

-Steve

"steve" <None@nothing.com> wrote in message
news:41i9f.6192$D13.468@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com ...
> Hi All,
>
> I am not getting any ported vacuum going to my EGR valve. I checked the
> vac at the connection that is on the top of the Carter BBD - the one on
> the engine side of the carb and there is no vacuum at any RPM. Anyone
> have any ideas why?
>
> Thanks in advance,
> Steve
>
>