Interior-Exterior Thermometer
#71
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Interior-Exterior Thermometer
On Wed, 11 Jan 2006 15:53:09 GMT, "Tomes" <askme@here.net> wrote:
>Thanks Billy Ray. 2 things - one is that I don't think the wire is long
>enough and two is that I agree that this is a real good spot since it sees
>the temperature unfettered by the vehicle. So this gets me thinking - can I
>extend this wire by cutting it and splicing in an extension? Does that muck
>up the calibration? I suppose I would at least need to use the same gauge
>wire. Talk to me on this if you please as I am dim on this type of stuff.
>Thanks,
>Tomes
I have one of these http://tinyurl.com/bmf2y
which I mounted in a 97 Cherokee. I actually cut out a notch just
above the stereo head and put the readout there (looks pretty nice
actually).
The sensor.. well I had a heck of a time with that.
First I tried over one of the doors and discovered that engine heat
gets channeled up the door frames.
Next I ran it all the way out and put it just behind the grille. Great
when moving but sitting still or parked and the engine heat threw it
WAY off.
Finally I got some insulating foam to keep the sensor from directly
contacting the bumper and mounted the sensor on the bottom of the
plastic bumper guards as far out in front as I can.
Direct sunlight (on hot days) still heats the bumper and gives you a
false high temperature reading but the rest of the time I get about as
accurate a reading as you can reasonably expect.
Drifter
"I've been here, I've been there..."
>Thanks Billy Ray. 2 things - one is that I don't think the wire is long
>enough and two is that I agree that this is a real good spot since it sees
>the temperature unfettered by the vehicle. So this gets me thinking - can I
>extend this wire by cutting it and splicing in an extension? Does that muck
>up the calibration? I suppose I would at least need to use the same gauge
>wire. Talk to me on this if you please as I am dim on this type of stuff.
>Thanks,
>Tomes
I have one of these http://tinyurl.com/bmf2y
which I mounted in a 97 Cherokee. I actually cut out a notch just
above the stereo head and put the readout there (looks pretty nice
actually).
The sensor.. well I had a heck of a time with that.
First I tried over one of the doors and discovered that engine heat
gets channeled up the door frames.
Next I ran it all the way out and put it just behind the grille. Great
when moving but sitting still or parked and the engine heat threw it
WAY off.
Finally I got some insulating foam to keep the sensor from directly
contacting the bumper and mounted the sensor on the bottom of the
plastic bumper guards as far out in front as I can.
Direct sunlight (on hot days) still heats the bumper and gives you a
false high temperature reading but the rest of the time I get about as
accurate a reading as you can reasonably expect.
Drifter
"I've been here, I've been there..."
#72
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Interior-Exterior Thermometer
On Wed, 11 Jan 2006 15:53:09 GMT, "Tomes" <askme@here.net> wrote:
>Thanks Billy Ray. 2 things - one is that I don't think the wire is long
>enough and two is that I agree that this is a real good spot since it sees
>the temperature unfettered by the vehicle. So this gets me thinking - can I
>extend this wire by cutting it and splicing in an extension? Does that muck
>up the calibration? I suppose I would at least need to use the same gauge
>wire. Talk to me on this if you please as I am dim on this type of stuff.
>Thanks,
>Tomes
I have one of these http://tinyurl.com/bmf2y
which I mounted in a 97 Cherokee. I actually cut out a notch just
above the stereo head and put the readout there (looks pretty nice
actually).
The sensor.. well I had a heck of a time with that.
First I tried over one of the doors and discovered that engine heat
gets channeled up the door frames.
Next I ran it all the way out and put it just behind the grille. Great
when moving but sitting still or parked and the engine heat threw it
WAY off.
Finally I got some insulating foam to keep the sensor from directly
contacting the bumper and mounted the sensor on the bottom of the
plastic bumper guards as far out in front as I can.
Direct sunlight (on hot days) still heats the bumper and gives you a
false high temperature reading but the rest of the time I get about as
accurate a reading as you can reasonably expect.
Drifter
"I've been here, I've been there..."
>Thanks Billy Ray. 2 things - one is that I don't think the wire is long
>enough and two is that I agree that this is a real good spot since it sees
>the temperature unfettered by the vehicle. So this gets me thinking - can I
>extend this wire by cutting it and splicing in an extension? Does that muck
>up the calibration? I suppose I would at least need to use the same gauge
>wire. Talk to me on this if you please as I am dim on this type of stuff.
>Thanks,
>Tomes
I have one of these http://tinyurl.com/bmf2y
which I mounted in a 97 Cherokee. I actually cut out a notch just
above the stereo head and put the readout there (looks pretty nice
actually).
The sensor.. well I had a heck of a time with that.
First I tried over one of the doors and discovered that engine heat
gets channeled up the door frames.
Next I ran it all the way out and put it just behind the grille. Great
when moving but sitting still or parked and the engine heat threw it
WAY off.
Finally I got some insulating foam to keep the sensor from directly
contacting the bumper and mounted the sensor on the bottom of the
plastic bumper guards as far out in front as I can.
Direct sunlight (on hot days) still heats the bumper and gives you a
false high temperature reading but the rest of the time I get about as
accurate a reading as you can reasonably expect.
Drifter
"I've been here, I've been there..."
#73
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Interior-Exterior Thermometer
On Wed, 11 Jan 2006 15:53:09 GMT, "Tomes" <askme@here.net> wrote:
>Thanks Billy Ray. 2 things - one is that I don't think the wire is long
>enough and two is that I agree that this is a real good spot since it sees
>the temperature unfettered by the vehicle. So this gets me thinking - can I
>extend this wire by cutting it and splicing in an extension? Does that muck
>up the calibration? I suppose I would at least need to use the same gauge
>wire. Talk to me on this if you please as I am dim on this type of stuff.
>Thanks,
>Tomes
I have one of these http://tinyurl.com/bmf2y
which I mounted in a 97 Cherokee. I actually cut out a notch just
above the stereo head and put the readout there (looks pretty nice
actually).
The sensor.. well I had a heck of a time with that.
First I tried over one of the doors and discovered that engine heat
gets channeled up the door frames.
Next I ran it all the way out and put it just behind the grille. Great
when moving but sitting still or parked and the engine heat threw it
WAY off.
Finally I got some insulating foam to keep the sensor from directly
contacting the bumper and mounted the sensor on the bottom of the
plastic bumper guards as far out in front as I can.
Direct sunlight (on hot days) still heats the bumper and gives you a
false high temperature reading but the rest of the time I get about as
accurate a reading as you can reasonably expect.
Drifter
"I've been here, I've been there..."
>Thanks Billy Ray. 2 things - one is that I don't think the wire is long
>enough and two is that I agree that this is a real good spot since it sees
>the temperature unfettered by the vehicle. So this gets me thinking - can I
>extend this wire by cutting it and splicing in an extension? Does that muck
>up the calibration? I suppose I would at least need to use the same gauge
>wire. Talk to me on this if you please as I am dim on this type of stuff.
>Thanks,
>Tomes
I have one of these http://tinyurl.com/bmf2y
which I mounted in a 97 Cherokee. I actually cut out a notch just
above the stereo head and put the readout there (looks pretty nice
actually).
The sensor.. well I had a heck of a time with that.
First I tried over one of the doors and discovered that engine heat
gets channeled up the door frames.
Next I ran it all the way out and put it just behind the grille. Great
when moving but sitting still or parked and the engine heat threw it
WAY off.
Finally I got some insulating foam to keep the sensor from directly
contacting the bumper and mounted the sensor on the bottom of the
plastic bumper guards as far out in front as I can.
Direct sunlight (on hot days) still heats the bumper and gives you a
false high temperature reading but the rest of the time I get about as
accurate a reading as you can reasonably expect.
Drifter
"I've been here, I've been there..."
#74
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Interior-Exterior Thermometer
I guess I should have better stated my thoughts.
On the Norwood Lateral (Ohio 562) there is, within a mile of the ramp to
I-75, an outdoor time/temperature sign at the rear property line of a local
business.
When I worked evenings I would drive past that sign on the way home (after
midnight in most cases) and the temperature shown was almost always within a
degree or two of the temperature shown on the dash on 3 of my last 4
vehicles (the only ones with "outside" temperature displays)
On days when I worked mornings and got off work at 5 PM I would go past that
sign and the temperature shown on my dash would always be higher.
The greatest difference I have noted was 30 degrees higher on my dash than
on the sign. (please recall I worked evenings 80+% of the time)
If there was heavy traffic or an accident so traffic was crawling you could
watch the dramatic drop when you would edge underneath the overpass and you
and the pavement were shaded from sunlight.
I could continue this but Bobbie's "Welcome back to the world" shindig
starts in 35 minutes and I have to get back to getting the food ready.
needless to say his mother has been a wreck since last December....
"Lon" <lon.stowell@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:Epydnbh_gYGvElfeRVn-vA@comcast.com...
> billy ray proclaimed:
>
>> I think what it comes down to is there is really no good place if you
>> want a true air temperature.
>
> "True air temperature" is tricky to get with any sensor. Sufficiently so
> that the weather bureau has guidelines for constructing an enclosure that
> protects the sensor from any direct radiation yet allows free air flow but
> goes on to note that you need to then force a small air flow past a dry
> sensor before taking a reading. The enclosure is to be mounted at a
> standard height above the surface which cannot be rock, asphalt, etc. And
> then you are expected to calibrate your equipment periodically against
> precision thermometers and even then although the temps are reported to a
> tenth of a degree they are really accurate to only a degree or two. Once
> you realize all that, plus the general cheapness, lack of inherent
> accuracy, and lack of calibration capability at multiple points across the
> temperature curve of the typical home and/or automobile sensor, the
> location becomes pretty much more self delusion than worthwile effort.
> In the air stream but blocked from direct high speed air flow and moisture
> is about as good as you are gonna get. Calibration is possible on some
> units but is generally done only at one point--which if it were my sensor
> would be 32 degrees F. Then realize that if the temp is 40 or lower, it is
> a good idea to be prepared for icing on all but the most unusual real
> roads.
>>
>> Anywhere on/underneath the vehicle will be influenced by heat radiation
>> from the roadway. Fresh blacktop in the summer sun will be much hotter
>> and even in the winter the sun will make the roadway warmer than the air
>> just a bit off the road.
>
> The temp over a dark roadway will be hotter, although the vehicle is
> moving and there may or may not be enough other vehicles to stir the air
> enough to eliminate the differences except on very wide spans of asphalt
> like the old runways at Camp Roberts. Anyone who relies on an auto temp
> sensor for the degree of accuracy to really predict icing is kidding
> themselves anyway. Anything below 40 or so is dangerous.
>
>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "Lee Ayrton" <layrton@panix.com> wrote in message
>> news:dqdqhj$n1$1@reader2.panix.com...
>>
>>>I'd guess that the "car wash" warning had more to do with it not getting
>>>broomed off by the RoboWash brushes.
>>>
>>>There can be a fair bit of difference in temperature with just a few feet
>>>of elevation change, and the air can be a good deal warmer than the
>>>surface you're driving on and it can make a difference -- 33F vs. 31F. If
>>>I were using it as an icing indicator I'd want it down by the pavement
>>>surface.
>>>
>>>Tomes wrote:
>>>
>>>>It's just that on the packaging it noted to keep the sensor out of the
>>>>'way
>>>>of the car wash' or somesuch; it looks sealed enough though. Maybe the
>>>>peril is that it falls off under water pressure spray, not that it will
>>>>leak. Would the temperature be much different at these two elevations
>>>>you
>>>>think? This one audibly alarms at 32 degrees too for the black ice
>>>>alert.
>>>>Tomes
>>>>
>>>>"Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
>>>>news:43C98DDC.5F17AE2@sympatico.ca...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>The one in our old Volvo was below the front bumper to pick up the road
>>>>>temperature. It went red at 32 to let you know to watch for black ice.
>>>>>
>>>>>Mike
>>>>>86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
>>>>>88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>>>>>Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
>>>>>Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
>>>>>(More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
>>>>>
>>>>>Tomes wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Thanks Jeff. Right now I am running it under the carpet, out the back
>>>>
>>>>door
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>and mounting it on the bottom of the 3rd brake light. We will see how
>>>>
>>>>that
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>works out. It is in the elements and somewhat protected.
>>>>>>Tomes
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>news:vdidndNoI_1l9VTenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@ez2.ne t...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On my BMW, the probe is mounted in one of the aor ducts that direct
>>>>
>>>>cold
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>air
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>onto the brake rotors.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>All you need to do is put it where it won't be affected by the hot
>>>>
>>>>exhaust
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>system. Surely the probe is adequately sealed to deal with water
>>>>
>>>>splashing
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>on it. I'd pick a spot where the rocks won't get it, if there is such
>>>>
>>>>a
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>spot
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>"Tomes" <askme@here.net> wrote in message
>>>>>>>news:2C0xf.5343$ZA2.3845@newsread1.news.atl .earthlink.net...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Hi folks,
>>>>>>>>One of the things I got for Christmas in a clock/temperature monitor
>>>>>>
>>>>>>that
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>tells you what the temperature inside the Jeep is and also what
>>>>>>>>temperature
>>>>>>>>is outside the jeep. It sticks with sticky velcro anywhere you want
>>>>
>>>>to
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>stick it - I put mine over the glove box so my daughter has
>>>>
>>>>something to
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>do
>>>>>>>><grin>. My question for the folks is this:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>It comes with a lead on a long wire for the outside temp sensor and
>>>>
>>>>I am
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>having an indecisive time coming up with a spot to stick it. The
>>>>>>>>literature
>>>>>>>>(the deep thought stuff on the packaging) suggests in the door
>>>>
>>>>frame,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>but
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>on
>>>>>>>>this Jeep the doors are off most of the summer as much as I can get
>>>>
>>>>away
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>with. The idea here is it beeps when freezing to warn for black ice
>>>>>>>>possibility. It needs to stay relatively dry and not be affected by
>>>>>>
>>>>>>motor
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>heat. It has maybe 8 feet of wire. Suggestions?
>>>>>>>>Thanks folks,
>>>>>>>>Tomes
>>>>>>>>02 TJ
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>
On the Norwood Lateral (Ohio 562) there is, within a mile of the ramp to
I-75, an outdoor time/temperature sign at the rear property line of a local
business.
When I worked evenings I would drive past that sign on the way home (after
midnight in most cases) and the temperature shown was almost always within a
degree or two of the temperature shown on the dash on 3 of my last 4
vehicles (the only ones with "outside" temperature displays)
On days when I worked mornings and got off work at 5 PM I would go past that
sign and the temperature shown on my dash would always be higher.
The greatest difference I have noted was 30 degrees higher on my dash than
on the sign. (please recall I worked evenings 80+% of the time)
If there was heavy traffic or an accident so traffic was crawling you could
watch the dramatic drop when you would edge underneath the overpass and you
and the pavement were shaded from sunlight.
I could continue this but Bobbie's "Welcome back to the world" shindig
starts in 35 minutes and I have to get back to getting the food ready.
needless to say his mother has been a wreck since last December....
"Lon" <lon.stowell@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:Epydnbh_gYGvElfeRVn-vA@comcast.com...
> billy ray proclaimed:
>
>> I think what it comes down to is there is really no good place if you
>> want a true air temperature.
>
> "True air temperature" is tricky to get with any sensor. Sufficiently so
> that the weather bureau has guidelines for constructing an enclosure that
> protects the sensor from any direct radiation yet allows free air flow but
> goes on to note that you need to then force a small air flow past a dry
> sensor before taking a reading. The enclosure is to be mounted at a
> standard height above the surface which cannot be rock, asphalt, etc. And
> then you are expected to calibrate your equipment periodically against
> precision thermometers and even then although the temps are reported to a
> tenth of a degree they are really accurate to only a degree or two. Once
> you realize all that, plus the general cheapness, lack of inherent
> accuracy, and lack of calibration capability at multiple points across the
> temperature curve of the typical home and/or automobile sensor, the
> location becomes pretty much more self delusion than worthwile effort.
> In the air stream but blocked from direct high speed air flow and moisture
> is about as good as you are gonna get. Calibration is possible on some
> units but is generally done only at one point--which if it were my sensor
> would be 32 degrees F. Then realize that if the temp is 40 or lower, it is
> a good idea to be prepared for icing on all but the most unusual real
> roads.
>>
>> Anywhere on/underneath the vehicle will be influenced by heat radiation
>> from the roadway. Fresh blacktop in the summer sun will be much hotter
>> and even in the winter the sun will make the roadway warmer than the air
>> just a bit off the road.
>
> The temp over a dark roadway will be hotter, although the vehicle is
> moving and there may or may not be enough other vehicles to stir the air
> enough to eliminate the differences except on very wide spans of asphalt
> like the old runways at Camp Roberts. Anyone who relies on an auto temp
> sensor for the degree of accuracy to really predict icing is kidding
> themselves anyway. Anything below 40 or so is dangerous.
>
>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "Lee Ayrton" <layrton@panix.com> wrote in message
>> news:dqdqhj$n1$1@reader2.panix.com...
>>
>>>I'd guess that the "car wash" warning had more to do with it not getting
>>>broomed off by the RoboWash brushes.
>>>
>>>There can be a fair bit of difference in temperature with just a few feet
>>>of elevation change, and the air can be a good deal warmer than the
>>>surface you're driving on and it can make a difference -- 33F vs. 31F. If
>>>I were using it as an icing indicator I'd want it down by the pavement
>>>surface.
>>>
>>>Tomes wrote:
>>>
>>>>It's just that on the packaging it noted to keep the sensor out of the
>>>>'way
>>>>of the car wash' or somesuch; it looks sealed enough though. Maybe the
>>>>peril is that it falls off under water pressure spray, not that it will
>>>>leak. Would the temperature be much different at these two elevations
>>>>you
>>>>think? This one audibly alarms at 32 degrees too for the black ice
>>>>alert.
>>>>Tomes
>>>>
>>>>"Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
>>>>news:43C98DDC.5F17AE2@sympatico.ca...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>The one in our old Volvo was below the front bumper to pick up the road
>>>>>temperature. It went red at 32 to let you know to watch for black ice.
>>>>>
>>>>>Mike
>>>>>86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
>>>>>88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>>>>>Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
>>>>>Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
>>>>>(More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
>>>>>
>>>>>Tomes wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Thanks Jeff. Right now I am running it under the carpet, out the back
>>>>
>>>>door
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>and mounting it on the bottom of the 3rd brake light. We will see how
>>>>
>>>>that
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>works out. It is in the elements and somewhat protected.
>>>>>>Tomes
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>news:vdidndNoI_1l9VTenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@ez2.ne t...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On my BMW, the probe is mounted in one of the aor ducts that direct
>>>>
>>>>cold
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>air
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>onto the brake rotors.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>All you need to do is put it where it won't be affected by the hot
>>>>
>>>>exhaust
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>system. Surely the probe is adequately sealed to deal with water
>>>>
>>>>splashing
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>on it. I'd pick a spot where the rocks won't get it, if there is such
>>>>
>>>>a
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>spot
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>"Tomes" <askme@here.net> wrote in message
>>>>>>>news:2C0xf.5343$ZA2.3845@newsread1.news.atl .earthlink.net...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Hi folks,
>>>>>>>>One of the things I got for Christmas in a clock/temperature monitor
>>>>>>
>>>>>>that
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>tells you what the temperature inside the Jeep is and also what
>>>>>>>>temperature
>>>>>>>>is outside the jeep. It sticks with sticky velcro anywhere you want
>>>>
>>>>to
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>stick it - I put mine over the glove box so my daughter has
>>>>
>>>>something to
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>do
>>>>>>>><grin>. My question for the folks is this:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>It comes with a lead on a long wire for the outside temp sensor and
>>>>
>>>>I am
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>having an indecisive time coming up with a spot to stick it. The
>>>>>>>>literature
>>>>>>>>(the deep thought stuff on the packaging) suggests in the door
>>>>
>>>>frame,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>but
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>on
>>>>>>>>this Jeep the doors are off most of the summer as much as I can get
>>>>
>>>>away
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>with. The idea here is it beeps when freezing to warn for black ice
>>>>>>>>possibility. It needs to stay relatively dry and not be affected by
>>>>>>
>>>>>>motor
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>heat. It has maybe 8 feet of wire. Suggestions?
>>>>>>>>Thanks folks,
>>>>>>>>Tomes
>>>>>>>>02 TJ
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>
#75
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Interior-Exterior Thermometer
I guess I should have better stated my thoughts.
On the Norwood Lateral (Ohio 562) there is, within a mile of the ramp to
I-75, an outdoor time/temperature sign at the rear property line of a local
business.
When I worked evenings I would drive past that sign on the way home (after
midnight in most cases) and the temperature shown was almost always within a
degree or two of the temperature shown on the dash on 3 of my last 4
vehicles (the only ones with "outside" temperature displays)
On days when I worked mornings and got off work at 5 PM I would go past that
sign and the temperature shown on my dash would always be higher.
The greatest difference I have noted was 30 degrees higher on my dash than
on the sign. (please recall I worked evenings 80+% of the time)
If there was heavy traffic or an accident so traffic was crawling you could
watch the dramatic drop when you would edge underneath the overpass and you
and the pavement were shaded from sunlight.
I could continue this but Bobbie's "Welcome back to the world" shindig
starts in 35 minutes and I have to get back to getting the food ready.
needless to say his mother has been a wreck since last December....
"Lon" <lon.stowell@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:Epydnbh_gYGvElfeRVn-vA@comcast.com...
> billy ray proclaimed:
>
>> I think what it comes down to is there is really no good place if you
>> want a true air temperature.
>
> "True air temperature" is tricky to get with any sensor. Sufficiently so
> that the weather bureau has guidelines for constructing an enclosure that
> protects the sensor from any direct radiation yet allows free air flow but
> goes on to note that you need to then force a small air flow past a dry
> sensor before taking a reading. The enclosure is to be mounted at a
> standard height above the surface which cannot be rock, asphalt, etc. And
> then you are expected to calibrate your equipment periodically against
> precision thermometers and even then although the temps are reported to a
> tenth of a degree they are really accurate to only a degree or two. Once
> you realize all that, plus the general cheapness, lack of inherent
> accuracy, and lack of calibration capability at multiple points across the
> temperature curve of the typical home and/or automobile sensor, the
> location becomes pretty much more self delusion than worthwile effort.
> In the air stream but blocked from direct high speed air flow and moisture
> is about as good as you are gonna get. Calibration is possible on some
> units but is generally done only at one point--which if it were my sensor
> would be 32 degrees F. Then realize that if the temp is 40 or lower, it is
> a good idea to be prepared for icing on all but the most unusual real
> roads.
>>
>> Anywhere on/underneath the vehicle will be influenced by heat radiation
>> from the roadway. Fresh blacktop in the summer sun will be much hotter
>> and even in the winter the sun will make the roadway warmer than the air
>> just a bit off the road.
>
> The temp over a dark roadway will be hotter, although the vehicle is
> moving and there may or may not be enough other vehicles to stir the air
> enough to eliminate the differences except on very wide spans of asphalt
> like the old runways at Camp Roberts. Anyone who relies on an auto temp
> sensor for the degree of accuracy to really predict icing is kidding
> themselves anyway. Anything below 40 or so is dangerous.
>
>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "Lee Ayrton" <layrton@panix.com> wrote in message
>> news:dqdqhj$n1$1@reader2.panix.com...
>>
>>>I'd guess that the "car wash" warning had more to do with it not getting
>>>broomed off by the RoboWash brushes.
>>>
>>>There can be a fair bit of difference in temperature with just a few feet
>>>of elevation change, and the air can be a good deal warmer than the
>>>surface you're driving on and it can make a difference -- 33F vs. 31F. If
>>>I were using it as an icing indicator I'd want it down by the pavement
>>>surface.
>>>
>>>Tomes wrote:
>>>
>>>>It's just that on the packaging it noted to keep the sensor out of the
>>>>'way
>>>>of the car wash' or somesuch; it looks sealed enough though. Maybe the
>>>>peril is that it falls off under water pressure spray, not that it will
>>>>leak. Would the temperature be much different at these two elevations
>>>>you
>>>>think? This one audibly alarms at 32 degrees too for the black ice
>>>>alert.
>>>>Tomes
>>>>
>>>>"Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
>>>>news:43C98DDC.5F17AE2@sympatico.ca...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>The one in our old Volvo was below the front bumper to pick up the road
>>>>>temperature. It went red at 32 to let you know to watch for black ice.
>>>>>
>>>>>Mike
>>>>>86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
>>>>>88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>>>>>Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
>>>>>Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
>>>>>(More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
>>>>>
>>>>>Tomes wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Thanks Jeff. Right now I am running it under the carpet, out the back
>>>>
>>>>door
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>and mounting it on the bottom of the 3rd brake light. We will see how
>>>>
>>>>that
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>works out. It is in the elements and somewhat protected.
>>>>>>Tomes
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>news:vdidndNoI_1l9VTenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@ez2.ne t...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On my BMW, the probe is mounted in one of the aor ducts that direct
>>>>
>>>>cold
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>air
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>onto the brake rotors.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>All you need to do is put it where it won't be affected by the hot
>>>>
>>>>exhaust
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>system. Surely the probe is adequately sealed to deal with water
>>>>
>>>>splashing
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>on it. I'd pick a spot where the rocks won't get it, if there is such
>>>>
>>>>a
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>spot
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>"Tomes" <askme@here.net> wrote in message
>>>>>>>news:2C0xf.5343$ZA2.3845@newsread1.news.atl .earthlink.net...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Hi folks,
>>>>>>>>One of the things I got for Christmas in a clock/temperature monitor
>>>>>>
>>>>>>that
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>tells you what the temperature inside the Jeep is and also what
>>>>>>>>temperature
>>>>>>>>is outside the jeep. It sticks with sticky velcro anywhere you want
>>>>
>>>>to
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>stick it - I put mine over the glove box so my daughter has
>>>>
>>>>something to
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>do
>>>>>>>><grin>. My question for the folks is this:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>It comes with a lead on a long wire for the outside temp sensor and
>>>>
>>>>I am
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>having an indecisive time coming up with a spot to stick it. The
>>>>>>>>literature
>>>>>>>>(the deep thought stuff on the packaging) suggests in the door
>>>>
>>>>frame,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>but
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>on
>>>>>>>>this Jeep the doors are off most of the summer as much as I can get
>>>>
>>>>away
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>with. The idea here is it beeps when freezing to warn for black ice
>>>>>>>>possibility. It needs to stay relatively dry and not be affected by
>>>>>>
>>>>>>motor
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>heat. It has maybe 8 feet of wire. Suggestions?
>>>>>>>>Thanks folks,
>>>>>>>>Tomes
>>>>>>>>02 TJ
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>
On the Norwood Lateral (Ohio 562) there is, within a mile of the ramp to
I-75, an outdoor time/temperature sign at the rear property line of a local
business.
When I worked evenings I would drive past that sign on the way home (after
midnight in most cases) and the temperature shown was almost always within a
degree or two of the temperature shown on the dash on 3 of my last 4
vehicles (the only ones with "outside" temperature displays)
On days when I worked mornings and got off work at 5 PM I would go past that
sign and the temperature shown on my dash would always be higher.
The greatest difference I have noted was 30 degrees higher on my dash than
on the sign. (please recall I worked evenings 80+% of the time)
If there was heavy traffic or an accident so traffic was crawling you could
watch the dramatic drop when you would edge underneath the overpass and you
and the pavement were shaded from sunlight.
I could continue this but Bobbie's "Welcome back to the world" shindig
starts in 35 minutes and I have to get back to getting the food ready.
needless to say his mother has been a wreck since last December....
"Lon" <lon.stowell@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:Epydnbh_gYGvElfeRVn-vA@comcast.com...
> billy ray proclaimed:
>
>> I think what it comes down to is there is really no good place if you
>> want a true air temperature.
>
> "True air temperature" is tricky to get with any sensor. Sufficiently so
> that the weather bureau has guidelines for constructing an enclosure that
> protects the sensor from any direct radiation yet allows free air flow but
> goes on to note that you need to then force a small air flow past a dry
> sensor before taking a reading. The enclosure is to be mounted at a
> standard height above the surface which cannot be rock, asphalt, etc. And
> then you are expected to calibrate your equipment periodically against
> precision thermometers and even then although the temps are reported to a
> tenth of a degree they are really accurate to only a degree or two. Once
> you realize all that, plus the general cheapness, lack of inherent
> accuracy, and lack of calibration capability at multiple points across the
> temperature curve of the typical home and/or automobile sensor, the
> location becomes pretty much more self delusion than worthwile effort.
> In the air stream but blocked from direct high speed air flow and moisture
> is about as good as you are gonna get. Calibration is possible on some
> units but is generally done only at one point--which if it were my sensor
> would be 32 degrees F. Then realize that if the temp is 40 or lower, it is
> a good idea to be prepared for icing on all but the most unusual real
> roads.
>>
>> Anywhere on/underneath the vehicle will be influenced by heat radiation
>> from the roadway. Fresh blacktop in the summer sun will be much hotter
>> and even in the winter the sun will make the roadway warmer than the air
>> just a bit off the road.
>
> The temp over a dark roadway will be hotter, although the vehicle is
> moving and there may or may not be enough other vehicles to stir the air
> enough to eliminate the differences except on very wide spans of asphalt
> like the old runways at Camp Roberts. Anyone who relies on an auto temp
> sensor for the degree of accuracy to really predict icing is kidding
> themselves anyway. Anything below 40 or so is dangerous.
>
>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "Lee Ayrton" <layrton@panix.com> wrote in message
>> news:dqdqhj$n1$1@reader2.panix.com...
>>
>>>I'd guess that the "car wash" warning had more to do with it not getting
>>>broomed off by the RoboWash brushes.
>>>
>>>There can be a fair bit of difference in temperature with just a few feet
>>>of elevation change, and the air can be a good deal warmer than the
>>>surface you're driving on and it can make a difference -- 33F vs. 31F. If
>>>I were using it as an icing indicator I'd want it down by the pavement
>>>surface.
>>>
>>>Tomes wrote:
>>>
>>>>It's just that on the packaging it noted to keep the sensor out of the
>>>>'way
>>>>of the car wash' or somesuch; it looks sealed enough though. Maybe the
>>>>peril is that it falls off under water pressure spray, not that it will
>>>>leak. Would the temperature be much different at these two elevations
>>>>you
>>>>think? This one audibly alarms at 32 degrees too for the black ice
>>>>alert.
>>>>Tomes
>>>>
>>>>"Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
>>>>news:43C98DDC.5F17AE2@sympatico.ca...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>The one in our old Volvo was below the front bumper to pick up the road
>>>>>temperature. It went red at 32 to let you know to watch for black ice.
>>>>>
>>>>>Mike
>>>>>86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
>>>>>88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>>>>>Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
>>>>>Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
>>>>>(More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
>>>>>
>>>>>Tomes wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Thanks Jeff. Right now I am running it under the carpet, out the back
>>>>
>>>>door
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>and mounting it on the bottom of the 3rd brake light. We will see how
>>>>
>>>>that
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>works out. It is in the elements and somewhat protected.
>>>>>>Tomes
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>news:vdidndNoI_1l9VTenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@ez2.ne t...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On my BMW, the probe is mounted in one of the aor ducts that direct
>>>>
>>>>cold
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>air
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>onto the brake rotors.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>All you need to do is put it where it won't be affected by the hot
>>>>
>>>>exhaust
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>system. Surely the probe is adequately sealed to deal with water
>>>>
>>>>splashing
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>on it. I'd pick a spot where the rocks won't get it, if there is such
>>>>
>>>>a
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>spot
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>"Tomes" <askme@here.net> wrote in message
>>>>>>>news:2C0xf.5343$ZA2.3845@newsread1.news.atl .earthlink.net...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Hi folks,
>>>>>>>>One of the things I got for Christmas in a clock/temperature monitor
>>>>>>
>>>>>>that
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>tells you what the temperature inside the Jeep is and also what
>>>>>>>>temperature
>>>>>>>>is outside the jeep. It sticks with sticky velcro anywhere you want
>>>>
>>>>to
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>stick it - I put mine over the glove box so my daughter has
>>>>
>>>>something to
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>do
>>>>>>>><grin>. My question for the folks is this:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>It comes with a lead on a long wire for the outside temp sensor and
>>>>
>>>>I am
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>having an indecisive time coming up with a spot to stick it. The
>>>>>>>>literature
>>>>>>>>(the deep thought stuff on the packaging) suggests in the door
>>>>
>>>>frame,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>but
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>on
>>>>>>>>this Jeep the doors are off most of the summer as much as I can get
>>>>
>>>>away
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>with. The idea here is it beeps when freezing to warn for black ice
>>>>>>>>possibility. It needs to stay relatively dry and not be affected by
>>>>>>
>>>>>>motor
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>heat. It has maybe 8 feet of wire. Suggestions?
>>>>>>>>Thanks folks,
>>>>>>>>Tomes
>>>>>>>>02 TJ
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>
#76
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Interior-Exterior Thermometer
I guess I should have better stated my thoughts.
On the Norwood Lateral (Ohio 562) there is, within a mile of the ramp to
I-75, an outdoor time/temperature sign at the rear property line of a local
business.
When I worked evenings I would drive past that sign on the way home (after
midnight in most cases) and the temperature shown was almost always within a
degree or two of the temperature shown on the dash on 3 of my last 4
vehicles (the only ones with "outside" temperature displays)
On days when I worked mornings and got off work at 5 PM I would go past that
sign and the temperature shown on my dash would always be higher.
The greatest difference I have noted was 30 degrees higher on my dash than
on the sign. (please recall I worked evenings 80+% of the time)
If there was heavy traffic or an accident so traffic was crawling you could
watch the dramatic drop when you would edge underneath the overpass and you
and the pavement were shaded from sunlight.
I could continue this but Bobbie's "Welcome back to the world" shindig
starts in 35 minutes and I have to get back to getting the food ready.
needless to say his mother has been a wreck since last December....
"Lon" <lon.stowell@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:Epydnbh_gYGvElfeRVn-vA@comcast.com...
> billy ray proclaimed:
>
>> I think what it comes down to is there is really no good place if you
>> want a true air temperature.
>
> "True air temperature" is tricky to get with any sensor. Sufficiently so
> that the weather bureau has guidelines for constructing an enclosure that
> protects the sensor from any direct radiation yet allows free air flow but
> goes on to note that you need to then force a small air flow past a dry
> sensor before taking a reading. The enclosure is to be mounted at a
> standard height above the surface which cannot be rock, asphalt, etc. And
> then you are expected to calibrate your equipment periodically against
> precision thermometers and even then although the temps are reported to a
> tenth of a degree they are really accurate to only a degree or two. Once
> you realize all that, plus the general cheapness, lack of inherent
> accuracy, and lack of calibration capability at multiple points across the
> temperature curve of the typical home and/or automobile sensor, the
> location becomes pretty much more self delusion than worthwile effort.
> In the air stream but blocked from direct high speed air flow and moisture
> is about as good as you are gonna get. Calibration is possible on some
> units but is generally done only at one point--which if it were my sensor
> would be 32 degrees F. Then realize that if the temp is 40 or lower, it is
> a good idea to be prepared for icing on all but the most unusual real
> roads.
>>
>> Anywhere on/underneath the vehicle will be influenced by heat radiation
>> from the roadway. Fresh blacktop in the summer sun will be much hotter
>> and even in the winter the sun will make the roadway warmer than the air
>> just a bit off the road.
>
> The temp over a dark roadway will be hotter, although the vehicle is
> moving and there may or may not be enough other vehicles to stir the air
> enough to eliminate the differences except on very wide spans of asphalt
> like the old runways at Camp Roberts. Anyone who relies on an auto temp
> sensor for the degree of accuracy to really predict icing is kidding
> themselves anyway. Anything below 40 or so is dangerous.
>
>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "Lee Ayrton" <layrton@panix.com> wrote in message
>> news:dqdqhj$n1$1@reader2.panix.com...
>>
>>>I'd guess that the "car wash" warning had more to do with it not getting
>>>broomed off by the RoboWash brushes.
>>>
>>>There can be a fair bit of difference in temperature with just a few feet
>>>of elevation change, and the air can be a good deal warmer than the
>>>surface you're driving on and it can make a difference -- 33F vs. 31F. If
>>>I were using it as an icing indicator I'd want it down by the pavement
>>>surface.
>>>
>>>Tomes wrote:
>>>
>>>>It's just that on the packaging it noted to keep the sensor out of the
>>>>'way
>>>>of the car wash' or somesuch; it looks sealed enough though. Maybe the
>>>>peril is that it falls off under water pressure spray, not that it will
>>>>leak. Would the temperature be much different at these two elevations
>>>>you
>>>>think? This one audibly alarms at 32 degrees too for the black ice
>>>>alert.
>>>>Tomes
>>>>
>>>>"Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
>>>>news:43C98DDC.5F17AE2@sympatico.ca...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>The one in our old Volvo was below the front bumper to pick up the road
>>>>>temperature. It went red at 32 to let you know to watch for black ice.
>>>>>
>>>>>Mike
>>>>>86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
>>>>>88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>>>>>Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
>>>>>Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
>>>>>(More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
>>>>>
>>>>>Tomes wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Thanks Jeff. Right now I am running it under the carpet, out the back
>>>>
>>>>door
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>and mounting it on the bottom of the 3rd brake light. We will see how
>>>>
>>>>that
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>works out. It is in the elements and somewhat protected.
>>>>>>Tomes
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>news:vdidndNoI_1l9VTenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@ez2.ne t...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On my BMW, the probe is mounted in one of the aor ducts that direct
>>>>
>>>>cold
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>air
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>onto the brake rotors.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>All you need to do is put it where it won't be affected by the hot
>>>>
>>>>exhaust
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>system. Surely the probe is adequately sealed to deal with water
>>>>
>>>>splashing
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>on it. I'd pick a spot where the rocks won't get it, if there is such
>>>>
>>>>a
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>spot
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>"Tomes" <askme@here.net> wrote in message
>>>>>>>news:2C0xf.5343$ZA2.3845@newsread1.news.atl .earthlink.net...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Hi folks,
>>>>>>>>One of the things I got for Christmas in a clock/temperature monitor
>>>>>>
>>>>>>that
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>tells you what the temperature inside the Jeep is and also what
>>>>>>>>temperature
>>>>>>>>is outside the jeep. It sticks with sticky velcro anywhere you want
>>>>
>>>>to
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>stick it - I put mine over the glove box so my daughter has
>>>>
>>>>something to
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>do
>>>>>>>><grin>. My question for the folks is this:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>It comes with a lead on a long wire for the outside temp sensor and
>>>>
>>>>I am
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>having an indecisive time coming up with a spot to stick it. The
>>>>>>>>literature
>>>>>>>>(the deep thought stuff on the packaging) suggests in the door
>>>>
>>>>frame,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>but
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>on
>>>>>>>>this Jeep the doors are off most of the summer as much as I can get
>>>>
>>>>away
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>with. The idea here is it beeps when freezing to warn for black ice
>>>>>>>>possibility. It needs to stay relatively dry and not be affected by
>>>>>>
>>>>>>motor
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>heat. It has maybe 8 feet of wire. Suggestions?
>>>>>>>>Thanks folks,
>>>>>>>>Tomes
>>>>>>>>02 TJ
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>
On the Norwood Lateral (Ohio 562) there is, within a mile of the ramp to
I-75, an outdoor time/temperature sign at the rear property line of a local
business.
When I worked evenings I would drive past that sign on the way home (after
midnight in most cases) and the temperature shown was almost always within a
degree or two of the temperature shown on the dash on 3 of my last 4
vehicles (the only ones with "outside" temperature displays)
On days when I worked mornings and got off work at 5 PM I would go past that
sign and the temperature shown on my dash would always be higher.
The greatest difference I have noted was 30 degrees higher on my dash than
on the sign. (please recall I worked evenings 80+% of the time)
If there was heavy traffic or an accident so traffic was crawling you could
watch the dramatic drop when you would edge underneath the overpass and you
and the pavement were shaded from sunlight.
I could continue this but Bobbie's "Welcome back to the world" shindig
starts in 35 minutes and I have to get back to getting the food ready.
needless to say his mother has been a wreck since last December....
"Lon" <lon.stowell@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:Epydnbh_gYGvElfeRVn-vA@comcast.com...
> billy ray proclaimed:
>
>> I think what it comes down to is there is really no good place if you
>> want a true air temperature.
>
> "True air temperature" is tricky to get with any sensor. Sufficiently so
> that the weather bureau has guidelines for constructing an enclosure that
> protects the sensor from any direct radiation yet allows free air flow but
> goes on to note that you need to then force a small air flow past a dry
> sensor before taking a reading. The enclosure is to be mounted at a
> standard height above the surface which cannot be rock, asphalt, etc. And
> then you are expected to calibrate your equipment periodically against
> precision thermometers and even then although the temps are reported to a
> tenth of a degree they are really accurate to only a degree or two. Once
> you realize all that, plus the general cheapness, lack of inherent
> accuracy, and lack of calibration capability at multiple points across the
> temperature curve of the typical home and/or automobile sensor, the
> location becomes pretty much more self delusion than worthwile effort.
> In the air stream but blocked from direct high speed air flow and moisture
> is about as good as you are gonna get. Calibration is possible on some
> units but is generally done only at one point--which if it were my sensor
> would be 32 degrees F. Then realize that if the temp is 40 or lower, it is
> a good idea to be prepared for icing on all but the most unusual real
> roads.
>>
>> Anywhere on/underneath the vehicle will be influenced by heat radiation
>> from the roadway. Fresh blacktop in the summer sun will be much hotter
>> and even in the winter the sun will make the roadway warmer than the air
>> just a bit off the road.
>
> The temp over a dark roadway will be hotter, although the vehicle is
> moving and there may or may not be enough other vehicles to stir the air
> enough to eliminate the differences except on very wide spans of asphalt
> like the old runways at Camp Roberts. Anyone who relies on an auto temp
> sensor for the degree of accuracy to really predict icing is kidding
> themselves anyway. Anything below 40 or so is dangerous.
>
>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "Lee Ayrton" <layrton@panix.com> wrote in message
>> news:dqdqhj$n1$1@reader2.panix.com...
>>
>>>I'd guess that the "car wash" warning had more to do with it not getting
>>>broomed off by the RoboWash brushes.
>>>
>>>There can be a fair bit of difference in temperature with just a few feet
>>>of elevation change, and the air can be a good deal warmer than the
>>>surface you're driving on and it can make a difference -- 33F vs. 31F. If
>>>I were using it as an icing indicator I'd want it down by the pavement
>>>surface.
>>>
>>>Tomes wrote:
>>>
>>>>It's just that on the packaging it noted to keep the sensor out of the
>>>>'way
>>>>of the car wash' or somesuch; it looks sealed enough though. Maybe the
>>>>peril is that it falls off under water pressure spray, not that it will
>>>>leak. Would the temperature be much different at these two elevations
>>>>you
>>>>think? This one audibly alarms at 32 degrees too for the black ice
>>>>alert.
>>>>Tomes
>>>>
>>>>"Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
>>>>news:43C98DDC.5F17AE2@sympatico.ca...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>The one in our old Volvo was below the front bumper to pick up the road
>>>>>temperature. It went red at 32 to let you know to watch for black ice.
>>>>>
>>>>>Mike
>>>>>86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
>>>>>88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>>>>>Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
>>>>>Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
>>>>>(More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
>>>>>
>>>>>Tomes wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Thanks Jeff. Right now I am running it under the carpet, out the back
>>>>
>>>>door
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>and mounting it on the bottom of the 3rd brake light. We will see how
>>>>
>>>>that
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>works out. It is in the elements and somewhat protected.
>>>>>>Tomes
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>news:vdidndNoI_1l9VTenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@ez2.ne t...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On my BMW, the probe is mounted in one of the aor ducts that direct
>>>>
>>>>cold
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>air
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>onto the brake rotors.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>All you need to do is put it where it won't be affected by the hot
>>>>
>>>>exhaust
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>system. Surely the probe is adequately sealed to deal with water
>>>>
>>>>splashing
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>on it. I'd pick a spot where the rocks won't get it, if there is such
>>>>
>>>>a
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>spot
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>"Tomes" <askme@here.net> wrote in message
>>>>>>>news:2C0xf.5343$ZA2.3845@newsread1.news.atl .earthlink.net...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Hi folks,
>>>>>>>>One of the things I got for Christmas in a clock/temperature monitor
>>>>>>
>>>>>>that
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>tells you what the temperature inside the Jeep is and also what
>>>>>>>>temperature
>>>>>>>>is outside the jeep. It sticks with sticky velcro anywhere you want
>>>>
>>>>to
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>stick it - I put mine over the glove box so my daughter has
>>>>
>>>>something to
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>do
>>>>>>>><grin>. My question for the folks is this:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>It comes with a lead on a long wire for the outside temp sensor and
>>>>
>>>>I am
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>having an indecisive time coming up with a spot to stick it. The
>>>>>>>>literature
>>>>>>>>(the deep thought stuff on the packaging) suggests in the door
>>>>
>>>>frame,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>but
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>on
>>>>>>>>this Jeep the doors are off most of the summer as much as I can get
>>>>
>>>>away
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>with. The idea here is it beeps when freezing to warn for black ice
>>>>>>>>possibility. It needs to stay relatively dry and not be affected by
>>>>>>
>>>>>>motor
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>heat. It has maybe 8 feet of wire. Suggestions?
>>>>>>>>Thanks folks,
>>>>>>>>Tomes
>>>>>>>>02 TJ
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>
#77
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Interior-Exterior Thermometer
On Sun, 15 Jan 2006 17:27:33 UTC Lon <lon.stowell@comcast.net> wrote:
> Lee Ayrton proclaimed:
>
> > I'd guess that the "car wash" warning had more to do with it not getting
> > broomed off by the RoboWash brushes.
> >
> > There can be a fair bit of difference in temperature with just a few
> > feet of elevation change, and the air can be a good deal warmer than the
> > surface you're driving on and it can make a difference -- 33F vs. 31F.
> > If I were using it as an icing indicator I'd want it down by the
> > pavement surface.
>
> With very few exceptions, the air is always colder than the surface,
> even beginning as close as a few centimeters above and or below the
> surface. Over solid ground, in all my years measuring these trivia,
> even when you think you might, if there was any insolation at all, the
> surface would be warmer than air just a few CM above it. Frozen ground
> on occasion would be colder, but generally lightly colored with no
> insolation. Over areas with canyons and other places where air from
> well beneath the roadway can get near the roadway, you are more likely
> to run into colder surfaces. If the minor degree difference in mounting
> location is taken by the driver as anything significant, that driver is
> a sliding accident just waiting to happen. There is more temp
> difference along a single mile of typical roadway than any trivia
> vertically.
That's why a/c iciing indicators basically ignore the temperature and
use air flow through a calibrated port to detect it. Your 40 F number
is about right - carb or intake ice detection starts about there and
it only takes once to get your undevided attention.
> >
> > Tomes wrote:
> >
> >> It's just that on the packaging it noted to keep the sensor out of the
> >> 'way
> >> of the car wash' or somesuch; it looks sealed enough though. Maybe the
> >> peril is that it falls off under water pressure spray, not that it will
> >> leak. Would the temperature be much different at these two elevations
> >> you
> >> think? This one audibly alarms at 32 degrees too for the black ice
> >> alert.
> >> Tomes
> >>
> >> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> >> news:43C98DDC.5F17AE2@sympatico.ca...
> >>
> >>> The one in our old Volvo was below the front bumper to pick up the road
> >>> temperature. It went red at 32 to let you know to watch for black ice.
> >>>
> >>> Mike
> >>> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> >>> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> >>> Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> >>> Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
> >>> (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
> >>>
> >>> Tomes wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Thanks Jeff. Right now I am running it under the carpet, out the back
> >>
> >>
> >> door
> >>
> >>>> and mounting it on the bottom of the 3rd brake light. We will see how
> >>
> >>
> >> that
> >>
> >>>> works out. It is in the elements and somewhat protected.
> >>>> Tomes
> >>>>
> >>>> "Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >>>> news:vdidndNoI_1l9VTenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@ez2.net...
> >>>>
> >>>>> On my BMW, the probe is mounted in one of the aor ducts that direct
> >>
> >>
> >> cold
> >>
> >>>> air
> >>>>
> >>>>> onto the brake rotors.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> All you need to do is put it where it won't be affected by the hot
> >>
> >>
> >> exhaust
> >>
> >>>>> system. Surely the probe is adequately sealed to deal with water
> >>
> >>
> >> splashing
> >>
> >>>>> on it. I'd pick a spot where the rocks won't get it, if there is such
> >>
> >>
> >> a
> >>
> >>>> spot
> >>>>
> >>>>> ...
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> "Tomes" <askme@here.net> wrote in message
> >>>>> news:2C0xf.5343$ZA2.3845@newsread1.news.atl.earthl ink.net...
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Hi folks,
> >>>>>> One of the things I got for Christmas in a clock/temperature monitor
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> that
> >>>>
> >>>>>> tells you what the temperature inside the Jeep is and also what
> >>>>>> temperature
> >>>>>> is outside the jeep. It sticks with sticky velcro anywhere you want
> >>
> >>
> >> to
> >>
> >>>>>> stick it - I put mine over the glove box so my daughter has
> >>
> >>
> >> something to
> >>
> >>>>>> do
> >>>>>> <grin>. My question for the folks is this:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> It comes with a lead on a long wire for the outside temp sensor and
> >>
> >>
> >> I am
> >>
> >>>>>> having an indecisive time coming up with a spot to stick it. The
> >>>>>> literature
> >>>>>> (the deep thought stuff on the packaging) suggests in the door
> >>
> >>
> >> frame,
> >>
> >>>> but
> >>>>
> >>>>>> on
> >>>>>> this Jeep the doors are off most of the summer as much as I can get
> >>
> >>
> >> away
> >>
> >>>>>> with. The idea here is it beeps when freezing to warn for black ice
> >>>>>> possibility. It needs to stay relatively dry and not be affected by
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> motor
> >>>>
> >>>>>> heat. It has maybe 8 feet of wire. Suggestions?
> >>>>>> Thanks folks,
> >>>>>> Tomes
> >>>>>> 02 TJ
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>
> >>
--
Will Honea
> Lee Ayrton proclaimed:
>
> > I'd guess that the "car wash" warning had more to do with it not getting
> > broomed off by the RoboWash brushes.
> >
> > There can be a fair bit of difference in temperature with just a few
> > feet of elevation change, and the air can be a good deal warmer than the
> > surface you're driving on and it can make a difference -- 33F vs. 31F.
> > If I were using it as an icing indicator I'd want it down by the
> > pavement surface.
>
> With very few exceptions, the air is always colder than the surface,
> even beginning as close as a few centimeters above and or below the
> surface. Over solid ground, in all my years measuring these trivia,
> even when you think you might, if there was any insolation at all, the
> surface would be warmer than air just a few CM above it. Frozen ground
> on occasion would be colder, but generally lightly colored with no
> insolation. Over areas with canyons and other places where air from
> well beneath the roadway can get near the roadway, you are more likely
> to run into colder surfaces. If the minor degree difference in mounting
> location is taken by the driver as anything significant, that driver is
> a sliding accident just waiting to happen. There is more temp
> difference along a single mile of typical roadway than any trivia
> vertically.
That's why a/c iciing indicators basically ignore the temperature and
use air flow through a calibrated port to detect it. Your 40 F number
is about right - carb or intake ice detection starts about there and
it only takes once to get your undevided attention.
> >
> > Tomes wrote:
> >
> >> It's just that on the packaging it noted to keep the sensor out of the
> >> 'way
> >> of the car wash' or somesuch; it looks sealed enough though. Maybe the
> >> peril is that it falls off under water pressure spray, not that it will
> >> leak. Would the temperature be much different at these two elevations
> >> you
> >> think? This one audibly alarms at 32 degrees too for the black ice
> >> alert.
> >> Tomes
> >>
> >> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> >> news:43C98DDC.5F17AE2@sympatico.ca...
> >>
> >>> The one in our old Volvo was below the front bumper to pick up the road
> >>> temperature. It went red at 32 to let you know to watch for black ice.
> >>>
> >>> Mike
> >>> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> >>> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> >>> Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> >>> Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
> >>> (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
> >>>
> >>> Tomes wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Thanks Jeff. Right now I am running it under the carpet, out the back
> >>
> >>
> >> door
> >>
> >>>> and mounting it on the bottom of the 3rd brake light. We will see how
> >>
> >>
> >> that
> >>
> >>>> works out. It is in the elements and somewhat protected.
> >>>> Tomes
> >>>>
> >>>> "Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >>>> news:vdidndNoI_1l9VTenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@ez2.net...
> >>>>
> >>>>> On my BMW, the probe is mounted in one of the aor ducts that direct
> >>
> >>
> >> cold
> >>
> >>>> air
> >>>>
> >>>>> onto the brake rotors.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> All you need to do is put it where it won't be affected by the hot
> >>
> >>
> >> exhaust
> >>
> >>>>> system. Surely the probe is adequately sealed to deal with water
> >>
> >>
> >> splashing
> >>
> >>>>> on it. I'd pick a spot where the rocks won't get it, if there is such
> >>
> >>
> >> a
> >>
> >>>> spot
> >>>>
> >>>>> ...
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> "Tomes" <askme@here.net> wrote in message
> >>>>> news:2C0xf.5343$ZA2.3845@newsread1.news.atl.earthl ink.net...
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Hi folks,
> >>>>>> One of the things I got for Christmas in a clock/temperature monitor
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> that
> >>>>
> >>>>>> tells you what the temperature inside the Jeep is and also what
> >>>>>> temperature
> >>>>>> is outside the jeep. It sticks with sticky velcro anywhere you want
> >>
> >>
> >> to
> >>
> >>>>>> stick it - I put mine over the glove box so my daughter has
> >>
> >>
> >> something to
> >>
> >>>>>> do
> >>>>>> <grin>. My question for the folks is this:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> It comes with a lead on a long wire for the outside temp sensor and
> >>
> >>
> >> I am
> >>
> >>>>>> having an indecisive time coming up with a spot to stick it. The
> >>>>>> literature
> >>>>>> (the deep thought stuff on the packaging) suggests in the door
> >>
> >>
> >> frame,
> >>
> >>>> but
> >>>>
> >>>>>> on
> >>>>>> this Jeep the doors are off most of the summer as much as I can get
> >>
> >>
> >> away
> >>
> >>>>>> with. The idea here is it beeps when freezing to warn for black ice
> >>>>>> possibility. It needs to stay relatively dry and not be affected by
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> motor
> >>>>
> >>>>>> heat. It has maybe 8 feet of wire. Suggestions?
> >>>>>> Thanks folks,
> >>>>>> Tomes
> >>>>>> 02 TJ
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>
> >>
--
Will Honea
#78
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Interior-Exterior Thermometer
On Sun, 15 Jan 2006 17:27:33 UTC Lon <lon.stowell@comcast.net> wrote:
> Lee Ayrton proclaimed:
>
> > I'd guess that the "car wash" warning had more to do with it not getting
> > broomed off by the RoboWash brushes.
> >
> > There can be a fair bit of difference in temperature with just a few
> > feet of elevation change, and the air can be a good deal warmer than the
> > surface you're driving on and it can make a difference -- 33F vs. 31F.
> > If I were using it as an icing indicator I'd want it down by the
> > pavement surface.
>
> With very few exceptions, the air is always colder than the surface,
> even beginning as close as a few centimeters above and or below the
> surface. Over solid ground, in all my years measuring these trivia,
> even when you think you might, if there was any insolation at all, the
> surface would be warmer than air just a few CM above it. Frozen ground
> on occasion would be colder, but generally lightly colored with no
> insolation. Over areas with canyons and other places where air from
> well beneath the roadway can get near the roadway, you are more likely
> to run into colder surfaces. If the minor degree difference in mounting
> location is taken by the driver as anything significant, that driver is
> a sliding accident just waiting to happen. There is more temp
> difference along a single mile of typical roadway than any trivia
> vertically.
That's why a/c iciing indicators basically ignore the temperature and
use air flow through a calibrated port to detect it. Your 40 F number
is about right - carb or intake ice detection starts about there and
it only takes once to get your undevided attention.
> >
> > Tomes wrote:
> >
> >> It's just that on the packaging it noted to keep the sensor out of the
> >> 'way
> >> of the car wash' or somesuch; it looks sealed enough though. Maybe the
> >> peril is that it falls off under water pressure spray, not that it will
> >> leak. Would the temperature be much different at these two elevations
> >> you
> >> think? This one audibly alarms at 32 degrees too for the black ice
> >> alert.
> >> Tomes
> >>
> >> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> >> news:43C98DDC.5F17AE2@sympatico.ca...
> >>
> >>> The one in our old Volvo was below the front bumper to pick up the road
> >>> temperature. It went red at 32 to let you know to watch for black ice.
> >>>
> >>> Mike
> >>> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> >>> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> >>> Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> >>> Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
> >>> (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
> >>>
> >>> Tomes wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Thanks Jeff. Right now I am running it under the carpet, out the back
> >>
> >>
> >> door
> >>
> >>>> and mounting it on the bottom of the 3rd brake light. We will see how
> >>
> >>
> >> that
> >>
> >>>> works out. It is in the elements and somewhat protected.
> >>>> Tomes
> >>>>
> >>>> "Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >>>> news:vdidndNoI_1l9VTenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@ez2.net...
> >>>>
> >>>>> On my BMW, the probe is mounted in one of the aor ducts that direct
> >>
> >>
> >> cold
> >>
> >>>> air
> >>>>
> >>>>> onto the brake rotors.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> All you need to do is put it where it won't be affected by the hot
> >>
> >>
> >> exhaust
> >>
> >>>>> system. Surely the probe is adequately sealed to deal with water
> >>
> >>
> >> splashing
> >>
> >>>>> on it. I'd pick a spot where the rocks won't get it, if there is such
> >>
> >>
> >> a
> >>
> >>>> spot
> >>>>
> >>>>> ...
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> "Tomes" <askme@here.net> wrote in message
> >>>>> news:2C0xf.5343$ZA2.3845@newsread1.news.atl.earthl ink.net...
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Hi folks,
> >>>>>> One of the things I got for Christmas in a clock/temperature monitor
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> that
> >>>>
> >>>>>> tells you what the temperature inside the Jeep is and also what
> >>>>>> temperature
> >>>>>> is outside the jeep. It sticks with sticky velcro anywhere you want
> >>
> >>
> >> to
> >>
> >>>>>> stick it - I put mine over the glove box so my daughter has
> >>
> >>
> >> something to
> >>
> >>>>>> do
> >>>>>> <grin>. My question for the folks is this:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> It comes with a lead on a long wire for the outside temp sensor and
> >>
> >>
> >> I am
> >>
> >>>>>> having an indecisive time coming up with a spot to stick it. The
> >>>>>> literature
> >>>>>> (the deep thought stuff on the packaging) suggests in the door
> >>
> >>
> >> frame,
> >>
> >>>> but
> >>>>
> >>>>>> on
> >>>>>> this Jeep the doors are off most of the summer as much as I can get
> >>
> >>
> >> away
> >>
> >>>>>> with. The idea here is it beeps when freezing to warn for black ice
> >>>>>> possibility. It needs to stay relatively dry and not be affected by
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> motor
> >>>>
> >>>>>> heat. It has maybe 8 feet of wire. Suggestions?
> >>>>>> Thanks folks,
> >>>>>> Tomes
> >>>>>> 02 TJ
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>
> >>
--
Will Honea
> Lee Ayrton proclaimed:
>
> > I'd guess that the "car wash" warning had more to do with it not getting
> > broomed off by the RoboWash brushes.
> >
> > There can be a fair bit of difference in temperature with just a few
> > feet of elevation change, and the air can be a good deal warmer than the
> > surface you're driving on and it can make a difference -- 33F vs. 31F.
> > If I were using it as an icing indicator I'd want it down by the
> > pavement surface.
>
> With very few exceptions, the air is always colder than the surface,
> even beginning as close as a few centimeters above and or below the
> surface. Over solid ground, in all my years measuring these trivia,
> even when you think you might, if there was any insolation at all, the
> surface would be warmer than air just a few CM above it. Frozen ground
> on occasion would be colder, but generally lightly colored with no
> insolation. Over areas with canyons and other places where air from
> well beneath the roadway can get near the roadway, you are more likely
> to run into colder surfaces. If the minor degree difference in mounting
> location is taken by the driver as anything significant, that driver is
> a sliding accident just waiting to happen. There is more temp
> difference along a single mile of typical roadway than any trivia
> vertically.
That's why a/c iciing indicators basically ignore the temperature and
use air flow through a calibrated port to detect it. Your 40 F number
is about right - carb or intake ice detection starts about there and
it only takes once to get your undevided attention.
> >
> > Tomes wrote:
> >
> >> It's just that on the packaging it noted to keep the sensor out of the
> >> 'way
> >> of the car wash' or somesuch; it looks sealed enough though. Maybe the
> >> peril is that it falls off under water pressure spray, not that it will
> >> leak. Would the temperature be much different at these two elevations
> >> you
> >> think? This one audibly alarms at 32 degrees too for the black ice
> >> alert.
> >> Tomes
> >>
> >> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> >> news:43C98DDC.5F17AE2@sympatico.ca...
> >>
> >>> The one in our old Volvo was below the front bumper to pick up the road
> >>> temperature. It went red at 32 to let you know to watch for black ice.
> >>>
> >>> Mike
> >>> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> >>> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> >>> Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> >>> Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
> >>> (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
> >>>
> >>> Tomes wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Thanks Jeff. Right now I am running it under the carpet, out the back
> >>
> >>
> >> door
> >>
> >>>> and mounting it on the bottom of the 3rd brake light. We will see how
> >>
> >>
> >> that
> >>
> >>>> works out. It is in the elements and somewhat protected.
> >>>> Tomes
> >>>>
> >>>> "Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >>>> news:vdidndNoI_1l9VTenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@ez2.net...
> >>>>
> >>>>> On my BMW, the probe is mounted in one of the aor ducts that direct
> >>
> >>
> >> cold
> >>
> >>>> air
> >>>>
> >>>>> onto the brake rotors.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> All you need to do is put it where it won't be affected by the hot
> >>
> >>
> >> exhaust
> >>
> >>>>> system. Surely the probe is adequately sealed to deal with water
> >>
> >>
> >> splashing
> >>
> >>>>> on it. I'd pick a spot where the rocks won't get it, if there is such
> >>
> >>
> >> a
> >>
> >>>> spot
> >>>>
> >>>>> ...
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> "Tomes" <askme@here.net> wrote in message
> >>>>> news:2C0xf.5343$ZA2.3845@newsread1.news.atl.earthl ink.net...
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Hi folks,
> >>>>>> One of the things I got for Christmas in a clock/temperature monitor
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> that
> >>>>
> >>>>>> tells you what the temperature inside the Jeep is and also what
> >>>>>> temperature
> >>>>>> is outside the jeep. It sticks with sticky velcro anywhere you want
> >>
> >>
> >> to
> >>
> >>>>>> stick it - I put mine over the glove box so my daughter has
> >>
> >>
> >> something to
> >>
> >>>>>> do
> >>>>>> <grin>. My question for the folks is this:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> It comes with a lead on a long wire for the outside temp sensor and
> >>
> >>
> >> I am
> >>
> >>>>>> having an indecisive time coming up with a spot to stick it. The
> >>>>>> literature
> >>>>>> (the deep thought stuff on the packaging) suggests in the door
> >>
> >>
> >> frame,
> >>
> >>>> but
> >>>>
> >>>>>> on
> >>>>>> this Jeep the doors are off most of the summer as much as I can get
> >>
> >>
> >> away
> >>
> >>>>>> with. The idea here is it beeps when freezing to warn for black ice
> >>>>>> possibility. It needs to stay relatively dry and not be affected by
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> motor
> >>>>
> >>>>>> heat. It has maybe 8 feet of wire. Suggestions?
> >>>>>> Thanks folks,
> >>>>>> Tomes
> >>>>>> 02 TJ
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>
> >>
--
Will Honea
#79
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Interior-Exterior Thermometer
On Sun, 15 Jan 2006 17:27:33 UTC Lon <lon.stowell@comcast.net> wrote:
> Lee Ayrton proclaimed:
>
> > I'd guess that the "car wash" warning had more to do with it not getting
> > broomed off by the RoboWash brushes.
> >
> > There can be a fair bit of difference in temperature with just a few
> > feet of elevation change, and the air can be a good deal warmer than the
> > surface you're driving on and it can make a difference -- 33F vs. 31F.
> > If I were using it as an icing indicator I'd want it down by the
> > pavement surface.
>
> With very few exceptions, the air is always colder than the surface,
> even beginning as close as a few centimeters above and or below the
> surface. Over solid ground, in all my years measuring these trivia,
> even when you think you might, if there was any insolation at all, the
> surface would be warmer than air just a few CM above it. Frozen ground
> on occasion would be colder, but generally lightly colored with no
> insolation. Over areas with canyons and other places where air from
> well beneath the roadway can get near the roadway, you are more likely
> to run into colder surfaces. If the minor degree difference in mounting
> location is taken by the driver as anything significant, that driver is
> a sliding accident just waiting to happen. There is more temp
> difference along a single mile of typical roadway than any trivia
> vertically.
That's why a/c iciing indicators basically ignore the temperature and
use air flow through a calibrated port to detect it. Your 40 F number
is about right - carb or intake ice detection starts about there and
it only takes once to get your undevided attention.
> >
> > Tomes wrote:
> >
> >> It's just that on the packaging it noted to keep the sensor out of the
> >> 'way
> >> of the car wash' or somesuch; it looks sealed enough though. Maybe the
> >> peril is that it falls off under water pressure spray, not that it will
> >> leak. Would the temperature be much different at these two elevations
> >> you
> >> think? This one audibly alarms at 32 degrees too for the black ice
> >> alert.
> >> Tomes
> >>
> >> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> >> news:43C98DDC.5F17AE2@sympatico.ca...
> >>
> >>> The one in our old Volvo was below the front bumper to pick up the road
> >>> temperature. It went red at 32 to let you know to watch for black ice.
> >>>
> >>> Mike
> >>> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> >>> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> >>> Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> >>> Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
> >>> (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
> >>>
> >>> Tomes wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Thanks Jeff. Right now I am running it under the carpet, out the back
> >>
> >>
> >> door
> >>
> >>>> and mounting it on the bottom of the 3rd brake light. We will see how
> >>
> >>
> >> that
> >>
> >>>> works out. It is in the elements and somewhat protected.
> >>>> Tomes
> >>>>
> >>>> "Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >>>> news:vdidndNoI_1l9VTenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@ez2.net...
> >>>>
> >>>>> On my BMW, the probe is mounted in one of the aor ducts that direct
> >>
> >>
> >> cold
> >>
> >>>> air
> >>>>
> >>>>> onto the brake rotors.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> All you need to do is put it where it won't be affected by the hot
> >>
> >>
> >> exhaust
> >>
> >>>>> system. Surely the probe is adequately sealed to deal with water
> >>
> >>
> >> splashing
> >>
> >>>>> on it. I'd pick a spot where the rocks won't get it, if there is such
> >>
> >>
> >> a
> >>
> >>>> spot
> >>>>
> >>>>> ...
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> "Tomes" <askme@here.net> wrote in message
> >>>>> news:2C0xf.5343$ZA2.3845@newsread1.news.atl.earthl ink.net...
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Hi folks,
> >>>>>> One of the things I got for Christmas in a clock/temperature monitor
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> that
> >>>>
> >>>>>> tells you what the temperature inside the Jeep is and also what
> >>>>>> temperature
> >>>>>> is outside the jeep. It sticks with sticky velcro anywhere you want
> >>
> >>
> >> to
> >>
> >>>>>> stick it - I put mine over the glove box so my daughter has
> >>
> >>
> >> something to
> >>
> >>>>>> do
> >>>>>> <grin>. My question for the folks is this:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> It comes with a lead on a long wire for the outside temp sensor and
> >>
> >>
> >> I am
> >>
> >>>>>> having an indecisive time coming up with a spot to stick it. The
> >>>>>> literature
> >>>>>> (the deep thought stuff on the packaging) suggests in the door
> >>
> >>
> >> frame,
> >>
> >>>> but
> >>>>
> >>>>>> on
> >>>>>> this Jeep the doors are off most of the summer as much as I can get
> >>
> >>
> >> away
> >>
> >>>>>> with. The idea here is it beeps when freezing to warn for black ice
> >>>>>> possibility. It needs to stay relatively dry and not be affected by
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> motor
> >>>>
> >>>>>> heat. It has maybe 8 feet of wire. Suggestions?
> >>>>>> Thanks folks,
> >>>>>> Tomes
> >>>>>> 02 TJ
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>
> >>
--
Will Honea
> Lee Ayrton proclaimed:
>
> > I'd guess that the "car wash" warning had more to do with it not getting
> > broomed off by the RoboWash brushes.
> >
> > There can be a fair bit of difference in temperature with just a few
> > feet of elevation change, and the air can be a good deal warmer than the
> > surface you're driving on and it can make a difference -- 33F vs. 31F.
> > If I were using it as an icing indicator I'd want it down by the
> > pavement surface.
>
> With very few exceptions, the air is always colder than the surface,
> even beginning as close as a few centimeters above and or below the
> surface. Over solid ground, in all my years measuring these trivia,
> even when you think you might, if there was any insolation at all, the
> surface would be warmer than air just a few CM above it. Frozen ground
> on occasion would be colder, but generally lightly colored with no
> insolation. Over areas with canyons and other places where air from
> well beneath the roadway can get near the roadway, you are more likely
> to run into colder surfaces. If the minor degree difference in mounting
> location is taken by the driver as anything significant, that driver is
> a sliding accident just waiting to happen. There is more temp
> difference along a single mile of typical roadway than any trivia
> vertically.
That's why a/c iciing indicators basically ignore the temperature and
use air flow through a calibrated port to detect it. Your 40 F number
is about right - carb or intake ice detection starts about there and
it only takes once to get your undevided attention.
> >
> > Tomes wrote:
> >
> >> It's just that on the packaging it noted to keep the sensor out of the
> >> 'way
> >> of the car wash' or somesuch; it looks sealed enough though. Maybe the
> >> peril is that it falls off under water pressure spray, not that it will
> >> leak. Would the temperature be much different at these two elevations
> >> you
> >> think? This one audibly alarms at 32 degrees too for the black ice
> >> alert.
> >> Tomes
> >>
> >> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> >> news:43C98DDC.5F17AE2@sympatico.ca...
> >>
> >>> The one in our old Volvo was below the front bumper to pick up the road
> >>> temperature. It went red at 32 to let you know to watch for black ice.
> >>>
> >>> Mike
> >>> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> >>> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> >>> Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> >>> Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
> >>> (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
> >>>
> >>> Tomes wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Thanks Jeff. Right now I am running it under the carpet, out the back
> >>
> >>
> >> door
> >>
> >>>> and mounting it on the bottom of the 3rd brake light. We will see how
> >>
> >>
> >> that
> >>
> >>>> works out. It is in the elements and somewhat protected.
> >>>> Tomes
> >>>>
> >>>> "Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >>>> news:vdidndNoI_1l9VTenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@ez2.net...
> >>>>
> >>>>> On my BMW, the probe is mounted in one of the aor ducts that direct
> >>
> >>
> >> cold
> >>
> >>>> air
> >>>>
> >>>>> onto the brake rotors.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> All you need to do is put it where it won't be affected by the hot
> >>
> >>
> >> exhaust
> >>
> >>>>> system. Surely the probe is adequately sealed to deal with water
> >>
> >>
> >> splashing
> >>
> >>>>> on it. I'd pick a spot where the rocks won't get it, if there is such
> >>
> >>
> >> a
> >>
> >>>> spot
> >>>>
> >>>>> ...
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> "Tomes" <askme@here.net> wrote in message
> >>>>> news:2C0xf.5343$ZA2.3845@newsread1.news.atl.earthl ink.net...
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Hi folks,
> >>>>>> One of the things I got for Christmas in a clock/temperature monitor
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> that
> >>>>
> >>>>>> tells you what the temperature inside the Jeep is and also what
> >>>>>> temperature
> >>>>>> is outside the jeep. It sticks with sticky velcro anywhere you want
> >>
> >>
> >> to
> >>
> >>>>>> stick it - I put mine over the glove box so my daughter has
> >>
> >>
> >> something to
> >>
> >>>>>> do
> >>>>>> <grin>. My question for the folks is this:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> It comes with a lead on a long wire for the outside temp sensor and
> >>
> >>
> >> I am
> >>
> >>>>>> having an indecisive time coming up with a spot to stick it. The
> >>>>>> literature
> >>>>>> (the deep thought stuff on the packaging) suggests in the door
> >>
> >>
> >> frame,
> >>
> >>>> but
> >>>>
> >>>>>> on
> >>>>>> this Jeep the doors are off most of the summer as much as I can get
> >>
> >>
> >> away
> >>
> >>>>>> with. The idea here is it beeps when freezing to warn for black ice
> >>>>>> possibility. It needs to stay relatively dry and not be affected by
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> motor
> >>>>
> >>>>>> heat. It has maybe 8 feet of wire. Suggestions?
> >>>>>> Thanks folks,
> >>>>>> Tomes
> >>>>>> 02 TJ
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>
> >>
--
Will Honea
#80
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Interior-Exterior Thermometer
I'm with Mike, I think you want it closer to the road so you get an idea of
what life is like where the tires are. The tires can see ice when the temp
is upwards of 37F at the road surface. If the probe is up behind the spare,
then the temp displayed could be upwards of 40F when there can still be ice
on the road.
Ice can form on bridges and in shade if the car thinks it is 37, or below.
Obviously, this gives a margin for error, but the system doesn't respond
quick enough to detect actual conditions for ice, so they set an alarm on my
car that chimes at 37, then comes on and stays on at 32. That is, it lights
a display that then goes out at 37, then lights the display and remains lit
at 32. Both temps sound a chime for a couple of seconds.
"Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:43C98DDC.5F17AE2@sympatico.ca...
> The one in our old Volvo was below the front bumper to pick up the road
> temperature. It went red at 32 to let you know to watch for black ice.
>
> Mike
> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
> (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
>
> Tomes wrote:
>>
>> Thanks Jeff. Right now I am running it under the carpet, out the back
>> door
>> and mounting it on the bottom of the 3rd brake light. We will see how
>> that
>> works out. It is in the elements and somewhat protected.
>> Tomes
>>
>> "Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> news:vdidndNoI_1l9VTenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@ez2.net...
>> > On my BMW, the probe is mounted in one of the aor ducts that direct
>> > cold
>> air
>> > onto the brake rotors.
>> >
>> > All you need to do is put it where it won't be affected by the hot
>> > exhaust
>> > system. Surely the probe is adequately sealed to deal with water
>> > splashing
>> > on it. I'd pick a spot where the rocks won't get it, if there is such a
>> spot
>> > ...
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > "Tomes" <askme@here.net> wrote in message
>> > news:2C0xf.5343$ZA2.3845@newsread1.news.atl.earthl ink.net...
>> > > Hi folks,
>> > > One of the things I got for Christmas in a clock/temperature monitor
>> that
>> > > tells you what the temperature inside the Jeep is and also what
>> > > temperature
>> > > is outside the jeep. It sticks with sticky velcro anywhere you want
>> > > to
>> > > stick it - I put mine over the glove box so my daughter has something
>> > > to
>> > > do
>> > > <grin>. My question for the folks is this:
>> > >
>> > > It comes with a lead on a long wire for the outside temp sensor and I
>> > > am
>> > > having an indecisive time coming up with a spot to stick it. The
>> > > literature
>> > > (the deep thought stuff on the packaging) suggests in the door frame,
>> but
>> > > on
>> > > this Jeep the doors are off most of the summer as much as I can get
>> > > away
>> > > with. The idea here is it beeps when freezing to warn for black ice
>> > > possibility. It needs to stay relatively dry and not be affected by
>> motor
>> > > heat. It has maybe 8 feet of wire. Suggestions?
>> > > Thanks folks,
>> > > Tomes
>> > > 02 TJ
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
what life is like where the tires are. The tires can see ice when the temp
is upwards of 37F at the road surface. If the probe is up behind the spare,
then the temp displayed could be upwards of 40F when there can still be ice
on the road.
Ice can form on bridges and in shade if the car thinks it is 37, or below.
Obviously, this gives a margin for error, but the system doesn't respond
quick enough to detect actual conditions for ice, so they set an alarm on my
car that chimes at 37, then comes on and stays on at 32. That is, it lights
a display that then goes out at 37, then lights the display and remains lit
at 32. Both temps sound a chime for a couple of seconds.
"Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:43C98DDC.5F17AE2@sympatico.ca...
> The one in our old Volvo was below the front bumper to pick up the road
> temperature. It went red at 32 to let you know to watch for black ice.
>
> Mike
> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
> (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
>
> Tomes wrote:
>>
>> Thanks Jeff. Right now I am running it under the carpet, out the back
>> door
>> and mounting it on the bottom of the 3rd brake light. We will see how
>> that
>> works out. It is in the elements and somewhat protected.
>> Tomes
>>
>> "Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> news:vdidndNoI_1l9VTenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@ez2.net...
>> > On my BMW, the probe is mounted in one of the aor ducts that direct
>> > cold
>> air
>> > onto the brake rotors.
>> >
>> > All you need to do is put it where it won't be affected by the hot
>> > exhaust
>> > system. Surely the probe is adequately sealed to deal with water
>> > splashing
>> > on it. I'd pick a spot where the rocks won't get it, if there is such a
>> spot
>> > ...
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > "Tomes" <askme@here.net> wrote in message
>> > news:2C0xf.5343$ZA2.3845@newsread1.news.atl.earthl ink.net...
>> > > Hi folks,
>> > > One of the things I got for Christmas in a clock/temperature monitor
>> that
>> > > tells you what the temperature inside the Jeep is and also what
>> > > temperature
>> > > is outside the jeep. It sticks with sticky velcro anywhere you want
>> > > to
>> > > stick it - I put mine over the glove box so my daughter has something
>> > > to
>> > > do
>> > > <grin>. My question for the folks is this:
>> > >
>> > > It comes with a lead on a long wire for the outside temp sensor and I
>> > > am
>> > > having an indecisive time coming up with a spot to stick it. The
>> > > literature
>> > > (the deep thought stuff on the packaging) suggests in the door frame,
>> but
>> > > on
>> > > this Jeep the doors are off most of the summer as much as I can get
>> > > away
>> > > with. The idea here is it beeps when freezing to warn for black ice
>> > > possibility. It needs to stay relatively dry and not be affected by
>> motor
>> > > heat. It has maybe 8 feet of wire. Suggestions?
>> > > Thanks folks,
>> > > Tomes
>> > > 02 TJ
>> > >
>> > >
>> >