Re: General Jeep Questions
 

In my area, no soccer moms, they get suburbans. The 4cyl Jeeps are
commonly bought as high school 'go to school' cars or as HS graduation
presents. They are usually soft top, 4cyl verisions, driven in the
summer, tend to sit all winter as the kids are away at school.
Eventually the kid graduates from college, has no need for a 5 year old
soft top while living in New York or wherever. And they certainly are
not cross country road trip vehicles to visit the parents on a long
weekend.

Also, take a look at the original price on the plain 4cyl version. A few
years back they were advertising them for under $15k

griffin wrote:
> "Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message news:_KidnQyd6d-
>
>>>>>3. I bought one 4cyl 2.5L and everyone told me afterwards that it's a
>>>>>mistake to buy any 4cyl Jeeps. I've noticed anything with a 4 is
>
> pretty
>
>>>>>cheap compared to a 6 or 8.
>>
>>The 4cyl is cheap because they aren't in such demand as the 6.
>
>
> I think this is actually what is bugging me. Why is this the case? I just
> remember everyone telling me that my "little 4-banger" doesn't have the
> juice and I should sell it and invest in a 6. Is there a reason the 4's are
> so low on the resale market? I notice that most of the 4cyl are completely
> stock and often have the hardtop on in the summer so perhaps they are
> purchased by and stereotyped as "family Jeeps" for vacationing and just
> basically fun "soccer mom" vehicles.
>
>

Re: General Jeep Questions
 

In my area, no soccer moms, they get suburbans. The 4cyl Jeeps are
commonly bought as high school 'go to school' cars or as HS graduation
presents. They are usually soft top, 4cyl verisions, driven in the
summer, tend to sit all winter as the kids are away at school.
Eventually the kid graduates from college, has no need for a 5 year old
soft top while living in New York or wherever. And they certainly are
not cross country road trip vehicles to visit the parents on a long
weekend.

Also, take a look at the original price on the plain 4cyl version. A few
years back they were advertising them for under $15k

griffin wrote:
> "Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message news:_KidnQyd6d-
>
>>>>>3. I bought one 4cyl 2.5L and everyone told me afterwards that it's a
>>>>>mistake to buy any 4cyl Jeeps. I've noticed anything with a 4 is
>
> pretty
>
>>>>>cheap compared to a 6 or 8.
>>
>>The 4cyl is cheap because they aren't in such demand as the 6.
>
>
> I think this is actually what is bugging me. Why is this the case? I just
> remember everyone telling me that my "little 4-banger" doesn't have the
> juice and I should sell it and invest in a 6. Is there a reason the 4's are
> so low on the resale market? I notice that most of the 4cyl are completely
> stock and often have the hardtop on in the summer so perhaps they are
> purchased by and stereotyped as "family Jeeps" for vacationing and just
> basically fun "soccer mom" vehicles.
>
>

Re: General Jeep Questions
 

In my area, no soccer moms, they get suburbans. The 4cyl Jeeps are
commonly bought as high school 'go to school' cars or as HS graduation
presents. They are usually soft top, 4cyl verisions, driven in the
summer, tend to sit all winter as the kids are away at school.
Eventually the kid graduates from college, has no need for a 5 year old
soft top while living in New York or wherever. And they certainly are
not cross country road trip vehicles to visit the parents on a long
weekend.

Also, take a look at the original price on the plain 4cyl version. A few
years back they were advertising them for under $15k

griffin wrote:
> "Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message news:_KidnQyd6d-
>
>>>>>3. I bought one 4cyl 2.5L and everyone told me afterwards that it's a
>>>>>mistake to buy any 4cyl Jeeps. I've noticed anything with a 4 is
>
> pretty
>
>>>>>cheap compared to a 6 or 8.
>>
>>The 4cyl is cheap because they aren't in such demand as the 6.
>
>
> I think this is actually what is bugging me. Why is this the case? I just
> remember everyone telling me that my "little 4-banger" doesn't have the
> juice and I should sell it and invest in a 6. Is there a reason the 4's are
> so low on the resale market? I notice that most of the 4cyl are completely
> stock and often have the hardtop on in the summer so perhaps they are
> purchased by and stereotyped as "family Jeeps" for vacationing and just
> basically fun "soccer mom" vehicles.
>
>

Re: Re: General Jeep Questions
 

On Fri, 15 Jun 2007 15:38:03 -0400, Mike Romain <romainm@sympatico.ca>
wrote:

>I don't mind forgetting I have a 5th gear so I don't lug my engine with
>my 33's and 3.31 gears, but then I have a 'glass body and the 258 so it
>goes nice. I can still use 5th, but it costs gas, about 5 mpg better
>without it.

This guy is so full of it. He thinks 3.31 gear with a 33's is a GREAT
combo and he does not even know how to change a diff cover gasket let
along a gear set or what it can do. DO NOT take his advise and ham
string your on and off road performance. People like Mike are why some
complain about needing bigger motors because they fail to understand
the importance of gear ratio. I will not even get into the effect the
tall gears have on wheel traction due to torque inpout into a tall
ratio with bi tires because this completely escapes Mike because he
beilieve ina magic force that keep both wheel planted the same
regardless of drive shaft input torque. He does not even like know
what Newton Law is let alone how it applies here


>Off road we have low range so never have issues.

Another stupid answer, 33's without regear reducing power about 15 to
20% in a ALL gears and ranges if you do not regear.

>
>As mentioned, 'I' had a big truck spring shop do my lift. They do not
>sell gold plated springs like the 4x4 shops do or use platinum tools
>like the specialty shops also use. :-)


Yep you talk big but farm everything out.

YOue may call this a attack but when some one is looking for advise
starting out they do not need your "foorget 5th gear and use low
range" as the right way to do things. You give Jeep owners a bad name.
-----------------
TheSnoMan.com

Re: Re: General Jeep Questions
 

On Fri, 15 Jun 2007 15:38:03 -0400, Mike Romain <romainm@sympatico.ca>
wrote:

>I don't mind forgetting I have a 5th gear so I don't lug my engine with
>my 33's and 3.31 gears, but then I have a 'glass body and the 258 so it
>goes nice. I can still use 5th, but it costs gas, about 5 mpg better
>without it.

This guy is so full of it. He thinks 3.31 gear with a 33's is a GREAT
combo and he does not even know how to change a diff cover gasket let
along a gear set or what it can do. DO NOT take his advise and ham
string your on and off road performance. People like Mike are why some
complain about needing bigger motors because they fail to understand
the importance of gear ratio. I will not even get into the effect the
tall gears have on wheel traction due to torque inpout into a tall
ratio with bi tires because this completely escapes Mike because he
beilieve ina magic force that keep both wheel planted the same
regardless of drive shaft input torque. He does not even like know
what Newton Law is let alone how it applies here


>Off road we have low range so never have issues.

Another stupid answer, 33's without regear reducing power about 15 to
20% in a ALL gears and ranges if you do not regear.

>
>As mentioned, 'I' had a big truck spring shop do my lift. They do not
>sell gold plated springs like the 4x4 shops do or use platinum tools
>like the specialty shops also use. :-)


Yep you talk big but farm everything out.

YOue may call this a attack but when some one is looking for advise
starting out they do not need your "foorget 5th gear and use low
range" as the right way to do things. You give Jeep owners a bad name.
-----------------
TheSnoMan.com

Re: Re: General Jeep Questions
 

On Fri, 15 Jun 2007 15:38:03 -0400, Mike Romain <romainm@sympatico.ca>
wrote:

>I don't mind forgetting I have a 5th gear so I don't lug my engine with
>my 33's and 3.31 gears, but then I have a 'glass body and the 258 so it
>goes nice. I can still use 5th, but it costs gas, about 5 mpg better
>without it.

This guy is so full of it. He thinks 3.31 gear with a 33's is a GREAT
combo and he does not even know how to change a diff cover gasket let
along a gear set or what it can do. DO NOT take his advise and ham
string your on and off road performance. People like Mike are why some
complain about needing bigger motors because they fail to understand
the importance of gear ratio. I will not even get into the effect the
tall gears have on wheel traction due to torque inpout into a tall
ratio with bi tires because this completely escapes Mike because he
beilieve ina magic force that keep both wheel planted the same
regardless of drive shaft input torque. He does not even like know
what Newton Law is let alone how it applies here


>Off road we have low range so never have issues.

Another stupid answer, 33's without regear reducing power about 15 to
20% in a ALL gears and ranges if you do not regear.

>
>As mentioned, 'I' had a big truck spring shop do my lift. They do not
>sell gold plated springs like the 4x4 shops do or use platinum tools
>like the specialty shops also use. :-)


Yep you talk big but farm everything out.

YOue may call this a attack but when some one is looking for advise
starting out they do not need your "foorget 5th gear and use low
range" as the right way to do things. You give Jeep owners a bad name.
-----------------
TheSnoMan.com

Re: Re: General Jeep Questions
 

On Fri, 15 Jun 2007 15:38:03 -0400, Mike Romain <romainm@sympatico.ca>
wrote:

>I don't mind forgetting I have a 5th gear so I don't lug my engine with
>my 33's and 3.31 gears, but then I have a 'glass body and the 258 so it
>goes nice. I can still use 5th, but it costs gas, about 5 mpg better
>without it.

This guy is so full of it. He thinks 3.31 gear with a 33's is a GREAT
combo and he does not even know how to change a diff cover gasket let
along a gear set or what it can do. DO NOT take his advise and ham
string your on and off road performance. People like Mike are why some
complain about needing bigger motors because they fail to understand
the importance of gear ratio. I will not even get into the effect the
tall gears have on wheel traction due to torque inpout into a tall
ratio with bi tires because this completely escapes Mike because he
beilieve ina magic force that keep both wheel planted the same
regardless of drive shaft input torque. He does not even like know
what Newton Law is let alone how it applies here


>Off road we have low range so never have issues.

Another stupid answer, 33's without regear reducing power about 15 to
20% in a ALL gears and ranges if you do not regear.

>
>As mentioned, 'I' had a big truck spring shop do my lift. They do not
>sell gold plated springs like the 4x4 shops do or use platinum tools
>like the specialty shops also use. :-)


Yep you talk big but farm everything out.

YOue may call this a attack but when some one is looking for advise
starting out they do not need your "foorget 5th gear and use low
range" as the right way to do things. You give Jeep owners a bad name.
-----------------
TheSnoMan.com

Re: Re: General Jeep Questions
 

On Fri, 15 Jun 2007 23:24:42 GMT, "griffin" <gryffy@WEEEEshaw.ca>
wrote:

>I think this is actually what is bugging me. Why is this the case? I just
>remember everyone telling me that my "little 4-banger" doesn't have the
>juice and I should sell it and invest in a 6. Is there a reason the 4's are
>so low on the resale market? I notice that most of the 4cyl are completely
>stock and often have the hardtop on in the summer so perhaps they are
>purchased by and stereotyped as "family Jeeps" for vacationing and just
>basically fun "soccer mom" vehicles.


Again the reason for this is that there is a LOT of guys out there
like Mike Romain that act like "experts" and know it all and tell you
to install lifts and big tires and keep stock gears and so what if you
loose 5th and need low range all the time. (hello, this is telling you
that you have a gear ratio problem) It is mentallity like this that
causes this hype about it being a bad motor because many think the
solution is a tune, bigger carb or custom exhaust and if that fails, a
bigger engine rather than realize that deeper gears will help a LOT
more overall. (not just a opinion but rather the physics of it all
too) I knew a guy that had a old YJ with a 4 banger and 35's and 5.13
gears in it and he beat the heck out of it off road and it held up and
surprized many as to what it would do and where it would go. He
finially killed the motor when he hydrolocked it and busted it when he
sunk it unexpectadly. BTW, it had over 150K on it too.

One day I may buy one more Jeep (I have owned over a dozen 4x4's in
over 35 years and four of them Jeeps) I what to find a old clean YJ
one of the last years built with a 4 banger that has not been lifted
and do a mild lift and runs maybe some 33's andwith some 4.88's or so
in it and just play around with it. It will not be a daily driver.
BTW, I have a old and now rare J20 Jeep truck that I have owned for
almost 22 years now that is still 100% stock and it is a beast. With
its 4.10 gears and 360 V8 with stock sized bias plied nasty traction
grip 10 ply tires, you rarely need low range for anything. This is the
way I like my 4x4 geared so low range is used when you need a slower
speed, not because you are so over geared that you cannot do much
without it off road.
-----------------
TheSnoMan.com

Re: Re: General Jeep Questions
 

On Fri, 15 Jun 2007 23:24:42 GMT, "griffin" <gryffy@WEEEEshaw.ca>
wrote:

>I think this is actually what is bugging me. Why is this the case? I just
>remember everyone telling me that my "little 4-banger" doesn't have the
>juice and I should sell it and invest in a 6. Is there a reason the 4's are
>so low on the resale market? I notice that most of the 4cyl are completely
>stock and often have the hardtop on in the summer so perhaps they are
>purchased by and stereotyped as "family Jeeps" for vacationing and just
>basically fun "soccer mom" vehicles.


Again the reason for this is that there is a LOT of guys out there
like Mike Romain that act like "experts" and know it all and tell you
to install lifts and big tires and keep stock gears and so what if you
loose 5th and need low range all the time. (hello, this is telling you
that you have a gear ratio problem) It is mentallity like this that
causes this hype about it being a bad motor because many think the
solution is a tune, bigger carb or custom exhaust and if that fails, a
bigger engine rather than realize that deeper gears will help a LOT
more overall. (not just a opinion but rather the physics of it all
too) I knew a guy that had a old YJ with a 4 banger and 35's and 5.13
gears in it and he beat the heck out of it off road and it held up and
surprized many as to what it would do and where it would go. He
finially killed the motor when he hydrolocked it and busted it when he
sunk it unexpectadly. BTW, it had over 150K on it too.

One day I may buy one more Jeep (I have owned over a dozen 4x4's in
over 35 years and four of them Jeeps) I what to find a old clean YJ
one of the last years built with a 4 banger that has not been lifted
and do a mild lift and runs maybe some 33's andwith some 4.88's or so
in it and just play around with it. It will not be a daily driver.
BTW, I have a old and now rare J20 Jeep truck that I have owned for
almost 22 years now that is still 100% stock and it is a beast. With
its 4.10 gears and 360 V8 with stock sized bias plied nasty traction
grip 10 ply tires, you rarely need low range for anything. This is the
way I like my 4x4 geared so low range is used when you need a slower
speed, not because you are so over geared that you cannot do much
without it off road.
-----------------
TheSnoMan.com

Re: Re: General Jeep Questions
 

On Fri, 15 Jun 2007 23:24:42 GMT, "griffin" <gryffy@WEEEEshaw.ca>
wrote:

>I think this is actually what is bugging me. Why is this the case? I just
>remember everyone telling me that my "little 4-banger" doesn't have the
>juice and I should sell it and invest in a 6. Is there a reason the 4's are
>so low on the resale market? I notice that most of the 4cyl are completely
>stock and often have the hardtop on in the summer so perhaps they are
>purchased by and stereotyped as "family Jeeps" for vacationing and just
>basically fun "soccer mom" vehicles.


Again the reason for this is that there is a LOT of guys out there
like Mike Romain that act like "experts" and know it all and tell you
to install lifts and big tires and keep stock gears and so what if you
loose 5th and need low range all the time. (hello, this is telling you
that you have a gear ratio problem) It is mentallity like this that
causes this hype about it being a bad motor because many think the
solution is a tune, bigger carb or custom exhaust and if that fails, a
bigger engine rather than realize that deeper gears will help a LOT
more overall. (not just a opinion but rather the physics of it all
too) I knew a guy that had a old YJ with a 4 banger and 35's and 5.13
gears in it and he beat the heck out of it off road and it held up and
surprized many as to what it would do and where it would go. He
finially killed the motor when he hydrolocked it and busted it when he
sunk it unexpectadly. BTW, it had over 150K on it too.

One day I may buy one more Jeep (I have owned over a dozen 4x4's in
over 35 years and four of them Jeeps) I what to find a old clean YJ
one of the last years built with a 4 banger that has not been lifted
and do a mild lift and runs maybe some 33's andwith some 4.88's or so
in it and just play around with it. It will not be a daily driver.
BTW, I have a old and now rare J20 Jeep truck that I have owned for
almost 22 years now that is still 100% stock and it is a beast. With
its 4.10 gears and 360 V8 with stock sized bias plied nasty traction
grip 10 ply tires, you rarely need low range for anything. This is the
way I like my 4x4 geared so low range is used when you need a slower
speed, not because you are so over geared that you cannot do much
without it off road.
-----------------
TheSnoMan.com