Ethanol in Grand Cherokee
#101
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Ethanol in Grand Cherokee
Getting a little off topic but remember when the "gas crisis" hit in
73. I was paying 18cents a gallon retail until then. Most pumps
wouldn't go above 50 cents so they would set it at something like 30
cents and then charge you double what was on the pump.
At the time I was a major school bus contractor, trying to buy my own
tanker so I could move fuel between terminals. I couldn't find a used
truck to buy in the whole country. And when I talked to the terminal
people in Miami they said there were 23 super tankers holding off the
port because there was no room to empty anymore crude. SHORTAGE is a
government term indicating a balance of payments crisis between us and
someone else.
About that time I participated in some research on Chevron stations in
CA. Turns out their favorite trick was to raise the price of gas a
penny every week, then at the end of the month have a big ad campaign
about a nickel a gallon price decrease. It worked for them.
Tate
On Mon, 13 Feb 2006 00:17:33 -0800, L.W.(=?iso-8859-1?Q?=DFill?=)
------ III <----------@***.net> wrote:
> Your state's more than that, now. California's fifty two cents a
>gallon, not including local taxes:
>http://www.californiagasprices.com/tax_info.aspx I used to retail
>gasoline for twenty six cents a gallon up the last gas war I was in, in
>'72 where then Chevron reimburse me six tenths of a cent for every cent
>drop to maintain competitive prices.
> God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
>mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
>Chad Fraker wrote:
>>
>> Part of the huge problem is that WI gas taxes are WAY too high. For the
>> longest time, the gas tax would AUTOMATICALLY increase every April 1st.
>> (What a cruel joke our state government plays on us) The gas tax rose by
>> 81% - from 16.5 cents to 29.9 cents per gallon - over the last 20 years,
>> giving Wisconsin one of the highest gas taxes in the nation. Maybe rather
>> than having such high gas taxes, the vehicle registrations should go up? Or
>> at lease slap a few toll booths so all the "FIBs" and "FISHTABs" pay a
>> little to drive thru the state to make it to their "weekend homes" up nort
>> or in da UP.
>>
>> Just my unenlightend opinion
73. I was paying 18cents a gallon retail until then. Most pumps
wouldn't go above 50 cents so they would set it at something like 30
cents and then charge you double what was on the pump.
At the time I was a major school bus contractor, trying to buy my own
tanker so I could move fuel between terminals. I couldn't find a used
truck to buy in the whole country. And when I talked to the terminal
people in Miami they said there were 23 super tankers holding off the
port because there was no room to empty anymore crude. SHORTAGE is a
government term indicating a balance of payments crisis between us and
someone else.
About that time I participated in some research on Chevron stations in
CA. Turns out their favorite trick was to raise the price of gas a
penny every week, then at the end of the month have a big ad campaign
about a nickel a gallon price decrease. It worked for them.
Tate
On Mon, 13 Feb 2006 00:17:33 -0800, L.W.(=?iso-8859-1?Q?=DFill?=)
------ III <----------@***.net> wrote:
> Your state's more than that, now. California's fifty two cents a
>gallon, not including local taxes:
>http://www.californiagasprices.com/tax_info.aspx I used to retail
>gasoline for twenty six cents a gallon up the last gas war I was in, in
>'72 where then Chevron reimburse me six tenths of a cent for every cent
>drop to maintain competitive prices.
> God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
>mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
>Chad Fraker wrote:
>>
>> Part of the huge problem is that WI gas taxes are WAY too high. For the
>> longest time, the gas tax would AUTOMATICALLY increase every April 1st.
>> (What a cruel joke our state government plays on us) The gas tax rose by
>> 81% - from 16.5 cents to 29.9 cents per gallon - over the last 20 years,
>> giving Wisconsin one of the highest gas taxes in the nation. Maybe rather
>> than having such high gas taxes, the vehicle registrations should go up? Or
>> at lease slap a few toll booths so all the "FIBs" and "FISHTABs" pay a
>> little to drive thru the state to make it to their "weekend homes" up nort
>> or in da UP.
>>
>> Just my unenlightend opinion
#102
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Ethanol in Grand Cherokee
Yeh I like that idea. Everyone from Chicago has to pay an entry fee
to get into the state each time. I remember when we used to have a
bumper sticker that said GO BACK TO ILLINOIS. Being a native
Chicagoan it makes me sad how my fellow citizens have raped and
pillaged the countryside, especially anywhere within 200 miles of
Chicago.
We need a Republican governor who will repeal the stupud tax laws and
give us a concealed carry permit. But all the liberal out of towners
in Madison bias what most of us want.
Tate
On Mon, 13 Feb 2006 04:38:35 GMT, "Chad Fraker" <sylvanis@wi.rr.com>
wrote:
>Part of the huge problem is that WI gas taxes are WAY too high. For the
>longest time, the gas tax would AUTOMATICALLY increase every April 1st.
>(What a cruel joke our state government plays on us) The gas tax rose by
>81% - from 16.5 cents to 29.9 cents per gallon - over the last 20 years,
>giving Wisconsin one of the highest gas taxes in the nation. Maybe rather
>than having such high gas taxes, the vehicle registrations should go up? Or
>at lease slap a few toll booths so all the "FIBs" and "FISHTABs" pay a
>little to drive thru the state to make it to their "weekend homes" up nort
>or in da UP.
>
>Just my unenlightend opinion
>
>
>"Chris Lamb" <clamb1@new.rr.com> wrote in message
>news:43ed6a97.456917@news-server.new.rr.com...
>> Have 2000 GC V-8 and wondering if anyone is running ethanol in theirs.
>> Price here in WI is 45 cents a gallon cheaper than 87 Octane.
>
>
to get into the state each time. I remember when we used to have a
bumper sticker that said GO BACK TO ILLINOIS. Being a native
Chicagoan it makes me sad how my fellow citizens have raped and
pillaged the countryside, especially anywhere within 200 miles of
Chicago.
We need a Republican governor who will repeal the stupud tax laws and
give us a concealed carry permit. But all the liberal out of towners
in Madison bias what most of us want.
Tate
On Mon, 13 Feb 2006 04:38:35 GMT, "Chad Fraker" <sylvanis@wi.rr.com>
wrote:
>Part of the huge problem is that WI gas taxes are WAY too high. For the
>longest time, the gas tax would AUTOMATICALLY increase every April 1st.
>(What a cruel joke our state government plays on us) The gas tax rose by
>81% - from 16.5 cents to 29.9 cents per gallon - over the last 20 years,
>giving Wisconsin one of the highest gas taxes in the nation. Maybe rather
>than having such high gas taxes, the vehicle registrations should go up? Or
>at lease slap a few toll booths so all the "FIBs" and "FISHTABs" pay a
>little to drive thru the state to make it to their "weekend homes" up nort
>or in da UP.
>
>Just my unenlightend opinion
>
>
>"Chris Lamb" <clamb1@new.rr.com> wrote in message
>news:43ed6a97.456917@news-server.new.rr.com...
>> Have 2000 GC V-8 and wondering if anyone is running ethanol in theirs.
>> Price here in WI is 45 cents a gallon cheaper than 87 Octane.
>
>
#103
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Ethanol in Grand Cherokee
Yeh I like that idea. Everyone from Chicago has to pay an entry fee
to get into the state each time. I remember when we used to have a
bumper sticker that said GO BACK TO ILLINOIS. Being a native
Chicagoan it makes me sad how my fellow citizens have raped and
pillaged the countryside, especially anywhere within 200 miles of
Chicago.
We need a Republican governor who will repeal the stupud tax laws and
give us a concealed carry permit. But all the liberal out of towners
in Madison bias what most of us want.
Tate
On Mon, 13 Feb 2006 04:38:35 GMT, "Chad Fraker" <sylvanis@wi.rr.com>
wrote:
>Part of the huge problem is that WI gas taxes are WAY too high. For the
>longest time, the gas tax would AUTOMATICALLY increase every April 1st.
>(What a cruel joke our state government plays on us) The gas tax rose by
>81% - from 16.5 cents to 29.9 cents per gallon - over the last 20 years,
>giving Wisconsin one of the highest gas taxes in the nation. Maybe rather
>than having such high gas taxes, the vehicle registrations should go up? Or
>at lease slap a few toll booths so all the "FIBs" and "FISHTABs" pay a
>little to drive thru the state to make it to their "weekend homes" up nort
>or in da UP.
>
>Just my unenlightend opinion
>
>
>"Chris Lamb" <clamb1@new.rr.com> wrote in message
>news:43ed6a97.456917@news-server.new.rr.com...
>> Have 2000 GC V-8 and wondering if anyone is running ethanol in theirs.
>> Price here in WI is 45 cents a gallon cheaper than 87 Octane.
>
>
to get into the state each time. I remember when we used to have a
bumper sticker that said GO BACK TO ILLINOIS. Being a native
Chicagoan it makes me sad how my fellow citizens have raped and
pillaged the countryside, especially anywhere within 200 miles of
Chicago.
We need a Republican governor who will repeal the stupud tax laws and
give us a concealed carry permit. But all the liberal out of towners
in Madison bias what most of us want.
Tate
On Mon, 13 Feb 2006 04:38:35 GMT, "Chad Fraker" <sylvanis@wi.rr.com>
wrote:
>Part of the huge problem is that WI gas taxes are WAY too high. For the
>longest time, the gas tax would AUTOMATICALLY increase every April 1st.
>(What a cruel joke our state government plays on us) The gas tax rose by
>81% - from 16.5 cents to 29.9 cents per gallon - over the last 20 years,
>giving Wisconsin one of the highest gas taxes in the nation. Maybe rather
>than having such high gas taxes, the vehicle registrations should go up? Or
>at lease slap a few toll booths so all the "FIBs" and "FISHTABs" pay a
>little to drive thru the state to make it to their "weekend homes" up nort
>or in da UP.
>
>Just my unenlightend opinion
>
>
>"Chris Lamb" <clamb1@new.rr.com> wrote in message
>news:43ed6a97.456917@news-server.new.rr.com...
>> Have 2000 GC V-8 and wondering if anyone is running ethanol in theirs.
>> Price here in WI is 45 cents a gallon cheaper than 87 Octane.
>
>
#104
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Ethanol in Grand Cherokee
Yeh I like that idea. Everyone from Chicago has to pay an entry fee
to get into the state each time. I remember when we used to have a
bumper sticker that said GO BACK TO ILLINOIS. Being a native
Chicagoan it makes me sad how my fellow citizens have raped and
pillaged the countryside, especially anywhere within 200 miles of
Chicago.
We need a Republican governor who will repeal the stupud tax laws and
give us a concealed carry permit. But all the liberal out of towners
in Madison bias what most of us want.
Tate
On Mon, 13 Feb 2006 04:38:35 GMT, "Chad Fraker" <sylvanis@wi.rr.com>
wrote:
>Part of the huge problem is that WI gas taxes are WAY too high. For the
>longest time, the gas tax would AUTOMATICALLY increase every April 1st.
>(What a cruel joke our state government plays on us) The gas tax rose by
>81% - from 16.5 cents to 29.9 cents per gallon - over the last 20 years,
>giving Wisconsin one of the highest gas taxes in the nation. Maybe rather
>than having such high gas taxes, the vehicle registrations should go up? Or
>at lease slap a few toll booths so all the "FIBs" and "FISHTABs" pay a
>little to drive thru the state to make it to their "weekend homes" up nort
>or in da UP.
>
>Just my unenlightend opinion
>
>
>"Chris Lamb" <clamb1@new.rr.com> wrote in message
>news:43ed6a97.456917@news-server.new.rr.com...
>> Have 2000 GC V-8 and wondering if anyone is running ethanol in theirs.
>> Price here in WI is 45 cents a gallon cheaper than 87 Octane.
>
>
to get into the state each time. I remember when we used to have a
bumper sticker that said GO BACK TO ILLINOIS. Being a native
Chicagoan it makes me sad how my fellow citizens have raped and
pillaged the countryside, especially anywhere within 200 miles of
Chicago.
We need a Republican governor who will repeal the stupud tax laws and
give us a concealed carry permit. But all the liberal out of towners
in Madison bias what most of us want.
Tate
On Mon, 13 Feb 2006 04:38:35 GMT, "Chad Fraker" <sylvanis@wi.rr.com>
wrote:
>Part of the huge problem is that WI gas taxes are WAY too high. For the
>longest time, the gas tax would AUTOMATICALLY increase every April 1st.
>(What a cruel joke our state government plays on us) The gas tax rose by
>81% - from 16.5 cents to 29.9 cents per gallon - over the last 20 years,
>giving Wisconsin one of the highest gas taxes in the nation. Maybe rather
>than having such high gas taxes, the vehicle registrations should go up? Or
>at lease slap a few toll booths so all the "FIBs" and "FISHTABs" pay a
>little to drive thru the state to make it to their "weekend homes" up nort
>or in da UP.
>
>Just my unenlightend opinion
>
>
>"Chris Lamb" <clamb1@new.rr.com> wrote in message
>news:43ed6a97.456917@news-server.new.rr.com...
>> Have 2000 GC V-8 and wondering if anyone is running ethanol in theirs.
>> Price here in WI is 45 cents a gallon cheaper than 87 Octane.
>
>
#105
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Ethanol in Grand Cherokee
Yeh I like that idea. Everyone from Chicago has to pay an entry fee
to get into the state each time. I remember when we used to have a
bumper sticker that said GO BACK TO ILLINOIS. Being a native
Chicagoan it makes me sad how my fellow citizens have raped and
pillaged the countryside, especially anywhere within 200 miles of
Chicago.
We need a Republican governor who will repeal the stupud tax laws and
give us a concealed carry permit. But all the liberal out of towners
in Madison bias what most of us want.
Tate
On Mon, 13 Feb 2006 04:38:35 GMT, "Chad Fraker" <sylvanis@wi.rr.com>
wrote:
>Part of the huge problem is that WI gas taxes are WAY too high. For the
>longest time, the gas tax would AUTOMATICALLY increase every April 1st.
>(What a cruel joke our state government plays on us) The gas tax rose by
>81% - from 16.5 cents to 29.9 cents per gallon - over the last 20 years,
>giving Wisconsin one of the highest gas taxes in the nation. Maybe rather
>than having such high gas taxes, the vehicle registrations should go up? Or
>at lease slap a few toll booths so all the "FIBs" and "FISHTABs" pay a
>little to drive thru the state to make it to their "weekend homes" up nort
>or in da UP.
>
>Just my unenlightend opinion
>
>
>"Chris Lamb" <clamb1@new.rr.com> wrote in message
>news:43ed6a97.456917@news-server.new.rr.com...
>> Have 2000 GC V-8 and wondering if anyone is running ethanol in theirs.
>> Price here in WI is 45 cents a gallon cheaper than 87 Octane.
>
>
to get into the state each time. I remember when we used to have a
bumper sticker that said GO BACK TO ILLINOIS. Being a native
Chicagoan it makes me sad how my fellow citizens have raped and
pillaged the countryside, especially anywhere within 200 miles of
Chicago.
We need a Republican governor who will repeal the stupud tax laws and
give us a concealed carry permit. But all the liberal out of towners
in Madison bias what most of us want.
Tate
On Mon, 13 Feb 2006 04:38:35 GMT, "Chad Fraker" <sylvanis@wi.rr.com>
wrote:
>Part of the huge problem is that WI gas taxes are WAY too high. For the
>longest time, the gas tax would AUTOMATICALLY increase every April 1st.
>(What a cruel joke our state government plays on us) The gas tax rose by
>81% - from 16.5 cents to 29.9 cents per gallon - over the last 20 years,
>giving Wisconsin one of the highest gas taxes in the nation. Maybe rather
>than having such high gas taxes, the vehicle registrations should go up? Or
>at lease slap a few toll booths so all the "FIBs" and "FISHTABs" pay a
>little to drive thru the state to make it to their "weekend homes" up nort
>or in da UP.
>
>Just my unenlightend opinion
>
>
>"Chris Lamb" <clamb1@new.rr.com> wrote in message
>news:43ed6a97.456917@news-server.new.rr.com...
>> Have 2000 GC V-8 and wondering if anyone is running ethanol in theirs.
>> Price here in WI is 45 cents a gallon cheaper than 87 Octane.
>
>
#106
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Ethanol in Grand Cherokee
Again, we're paddling rapidly away from Jeeps but...
Wisconsin, while right up there at 31.1 cents/gal, is still behind
Hawaii at 35.1 cents/gal, Nevada at 33.3, and sunny California at 32.0
cents. But you're not too far ahead of my home state of Connecticut at
29.7, Florida at 29.6, Illinois at 30.0, New York at 30.3 and little
Rhode Island at 31.0 cents/gal. Alaska is the only state with gas taxes
under 10 cents. These are combined state taxes (Connecticut for one
charges an excise tax at the wholesale level plus a gas tax at the pump)
for 2002 and can be found at:
<URL:http://api-ep.api.org/filelibrary/Historical%20Trends%20in%20Motor%20Gasoline%20Taxe s%201918-2002.pdf>
More details at <URL:http://www.gaspricewatch.com/usgastaxes.asp>
Lowering at-the-pump taxes has a couple of unpleasant side effects:
1) You've got to make up the revenue someplace (roads have to repaired,
snow plowed, buildings heated, police paid, National Guard benefits,
etc.), meaning a higher tax on something else.
2) If your registration were that someplace else, it would have to go up
about $230/year to make up the revenue lost if you eliminated the state
gas tax. (Assuming 15K miles/year at 20 MPG.) That's one painful lump
every time you renew instead of an invisible $4 and change at every fill-up.
3) Shifting from a fuel tax to higher registration fees shifts the tax
burden from a use tax to a property tax, meaning that someone who drives
a little is paying the same as someone who drives a lot, and if your
Jeep is a second-car toy that sees occasional use you'll be paying
twice. There's a loose correlation between fuel consumption and weight,
and weight is a major factor in road wear. Worse, by moving away from a
use tax you reduce the amount of money those out-of-state vehicles on
their way to the their million-dollar log "cabins" pay into your state
and move it onto in-state taxpayers. You'll be subsidizing the stinkin'
touristas.
4) You reduce whatever incentive there is for some drivers to drive
vehicles that don't guzzle fuel. It's a weak effect that really only
affects those with the means to buy another vehicle, but it's there.
5) Generally speaking, you cannot add toll stations to existing
federally-funded highways without losing federal money. So, again
you'll be digging deeper into your pocket just to keep up. The federal
money you lose will go to another state, so your federal taxes won't
decrease either.
6) Tolls waste time and fuel for drivers, they cause accidents
(Connecticut removed theirs from I-95 after a tractor-trailer drove into
a queue of cars and killed 6). Yes, there are transponder technologies
but you still need toll stations, a contractor to support the technology
and staff to collect tolls from vehicles without transponders, so you
are spending a lot more taxpayer money than you would by having fuel
stations send in a check for taxes once a month.
Chad Fraker wrote:
> Part of the huge problem is that WI gas taxes are WAY too high. For the
> longest time, the gas tax would AUTOMATICALLY increase every April 1st.
> (What a cruel joke our state government plays on us) The gas tax rose by
> 81% - from 16.5 cents to 29.9 cents per gallon - over the last 20 years,
> giving Wisconsin one of the highest gas taxes in the nation. Maybe rather
> than having such high gas taxes, the vehicle registrations should go up? Or
> at lease slap a few toll booths so all the "FIBs" and "FISHTABs" pay a
> little to drive thru the state to make it to their "weekend homes" up nort
> or in da UP.
>
> Just my unenlightend opinion
>
>
> "Chris Lamb" <clamb1@new.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:43ed6a97.456917@news-server.new.rr.com...
>
>>Have 2000 GC V-8 and wondering if anyone is running ethanol in theirs.
>>Price here in WI is 45 cents a gallon cheaper than 87 Octane.
#107
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Ethanol in Grand Cherokee
Again, we're paddling rapidly away from Jeeps but...
Wisconsin, while right up there at 31.1 cents/gal, is still behind
Hawaii at 35.1 cents/gal, Nevada at 33.3, and sunny California at 32.0
cents. But you're not too far ahead of my home state of Connecticut at
29.7, Florida at 29.6, Illinois at 30.0, New York at 30.3 and little
Rhode Island at 31.0 cents/gal. Alaska is the only state with gas taxes
under 10 cents. These are combined state taxes (Connecticut for one
charges an excise tax at the wholesale level plus a gas tax at the pump)
for 2002 and can be found at:
<URL:http://api-ep.api.org/filelibrary/Historical%20Trends%20in%20Motor%20Gasoline%20Taxe s%201918-2002.pdf>
More details at <URL:http://www.gaspricewatch.com/usgastaxes.asp>
Lowering at-the-pump taxes has a couple of unpleasant side effects:
1) You've got to make up the revenue someplace (roads have to repaired,
snow plowed, buildings heated, police paid, National Guard benefits,
etc.), meaning a higher tax on something else.
2) If your registration were that someplace else, it would have to go up
about $230/year to make up the revenue lost if you eliminated the state
gas tax. (Assuming 15K miles/year at 20 MPG.) That's one painful lump
every time you renew instead of an invisible $4 and change at every fill-up.
3) Shifting from a fuel tax to higher registration fees shifts the tax
burden from a use tax to a property tax, meaning that someone who drives
a little is paying the same as someone who drives a lot, and if your
Jeep is a second-car toy that sees occasional use you'll be paying
twice. There's a loose correlation between fuel consumption and weight,
and weight is a major factor in road wear. Worse, by moving away from a
use tax you reduce the amount of money those out-of-state vehicles on
their way to the their million-dollar log "cabins" pay into your state
and move it onto in-state taxpayers. You'll be subsidizing the stinkin'
touristas.
4) You reduce whatever incentive there is for some drivers to drive
vehicles that don't guzzle fuel. It's a weak effect that really only
affects those with the means to buy another vehicle, but it's there.
5) Generally speaking, you cannot add toll stations to existing
federally-funded highways without losing federal money. So, again
you'll be digging deeper into your pocket just to keep up. The federal
money you lose will go to another state, so your federal taxes won't
decrease either.
6) Tolls waste time and fuel for drivers, they cause accidents
(Connecticut removed theirs from I-95 after a tractor-trailer drove into
a queue of cars and killed 6). Yes, there are transponder technologies
but you still need toll stations, a contractor to support the technology
and staff to collect tolls from vehicles without transponders, so you
are spending a lot more taxpayer money than you would by having fuel
stations send in a check for taxes once a month.
Chad Fraker wrote:
> Part of the huge problem is that WI gas taxes are WAY too high. For the
> longest time, the gas tax would AUTOMATICALLY increase every April 1st.
> (What a cruel joke our state government plays on us) The gas tax rose by
> 81% - from 16.5 cents to 29.9 cents per gallon - over the last 20 years,
> giving Wisconsin one of the highest gas taxes in the nation. Maybe rather
> than having such high gas taxes, the vehicle registrations should go up? Or
> at lease slap a few toll booths so all the "FIBs" and "FISHTABs" pay a
> little to drive thru the state to make it to their "weekend homes" up nort
> or in da UP.
>
> Just my unenlightend opinion
>
>
> "Chris Lamb" <clamb1@new.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:43ed6a97.456917@news-server.new.rr.com...
>
>>Have 2000 GC V-8 and wondering if anyone is running ethanol in theirs.
>>Price here in WI is 45 cents a gallon cheaper than 87 Octane.
#108
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Ethanol in Grand Cherokee
Again, we're paddling rapidly away from Jeeps but...
Wisconsin, while right up there at 31.1 cents/gal, is still behind
Hawaii at 35.1 cents/gal, Nevada at 33.3, and sunny California at 32.0
cents. But you're not too far ahead of my home state of Connecticut at
29.7, Florida at 29.6, Illinois at 30.0, New York at 30.3 and little
Rhode Island at 31.0 cents/gal. Alaska is the only state with gas taxes
under 10 cents. These are combined state taxes (Connecticut for one
charges an excise tax at the wholesale level plus a gas tax at the pump)
for 2002 and can be found at:
<URL:http://api-ep.api.org/filelibrary/Historical%20Trends%20in%20Motor%20Gasoline%20Taxe s%201918-2002.pdf>
More details at <URL:http://www.gaspricewatch.com/usgastaxes.asp>
Lowering at-the-pump taxes has a couple of unpleasant side effects:
1) You've got to make up the revenue someplace (roads have to repaired,
snow plowed, buildings heated, police paid, National Guard benefits,
etc.), meaning a higher tax on something else.
2) If your registration were that someplace else, it would have to go up
about $230/year to make up the revenue lost if you eliminated the state
gas tax. (Assuming 15K miles/year at 20 MPG.) That's one painful lump
every time you renew instead of an invisible $4 and change at every fill-up.
3) Shifting from a fuel tax to higher registration fees shifts the tax
burden from a use tax to a property tax, meaning that someone who drives
a little is paying the same as someone who drives a lot, and if your
Jeep is a second-car toy that sees occasional use you'll be paying
twice. There's a loose correlation between fuel consumption and weight,
and weight is a major factor in road wear. Worse, by moving away from a
use tax you reduce the amount of money those out-of-state vehicles on
their way to the their million-dollar log "cabins" pay into your state
and move it onto in-state taxpayers. You'll be subsidizing the stinkin'
touristas.
4) You reduce whatever incentive there is for some drivers to drive
vehicles that don't guzzle fuel. It's a weak effect that really only
affects those with the means to buy another vehicle, but it's there.
5) Generally speaking, you cannot add toll stations to existing
federally-funded highways without losing federal money. So, again
you'll be digging deeper into your pocket just to keep up. The federal
money you lose will go to another state, so your federal taxes won't
decrease either.
6) Tolls waste time and fuel for drivers, they cause accidents
(Connecticut removed theirs from I-95 after a tractor-trailer drove into
a queue of cars and killed 6). Yes, there are transponder technologies
but you still need toll stations, a contractor to support the technology
and staff to collect tolls from vehicles without transponders, so you
are spending a lot more taxpayer money than you would by having fuel
stations send in a check for taxes once a month.
Chad Fraker wrote:
> Part of the huge problem is that WI gas taxes are WAY too high. For the
> longest time, the gas tax would AUTOMATICALLY increase every April 1st.
> (What a cruel joke our state government plays on us) The gas tax rose by
> 81% - from 16.5 cents to 29.9 cents per gallon - over the last 20 years,
> giving Wisconsin one of the highest gas taxes in the nation. Maybe rather
> than having such high gas taxes, the vehicle registrations should go up? Or
> at lease slap a few toll booths so all the "FIBs" and "FISHTABs" pay a
> little to drive thru the state to make it to their "weekend homes" up nort
> or in da UP.
>
> Just my unenlightend opinion
>
>
> "Chris Lamb" <clamb1@new.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:43ed6a97.456917@news-server.new.rr.com...
>
>>Have 2000 GC V-8 and wondering if anyone is running ethanol in theirs.
>>Price here in WI is 45 cents a gallon cheaper than 87 Octane.
#109
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Ethanol in Grand Cherokee
Again, we're paddling rapidly away from Jeeps but...
Wisconsin, while right up there at 31.1 cents/gal, is still behind
Hawaii at 35.1 cents/gal, Nevada at 33.3, and sunny California at 32.0
cents. But you're not too far ahead of my home state of Connecticut at
29.7, Florida at 29.6, Illinois at 30.0, New York at 30.3 and little
Rhode Island at 31.0 cents/gal. Alaska is the only state with gas taxes
under 10 cents. These are combined state taxes (Connecticut for one
charges an excise tax at the wholesale level plus a gas tax at the pump)
for 2002 and can be found at:
<URL:http://api-ep.api.org/filelibrary/Historical%20Trends%20in%20Motor%20Gasoline%20Taxe s%201918-2002.pdf>
More details at <URL:http://www.gaspricewatch.com/usgastaxes.asp>
Lowering at-the-pump taxes has a couple of unpleasant side effects:
1) You've got to make up the revenue someplace (roads have to repaired,
snow plowed, buildings heated, police paid, National Guard benefits,
etc.), meaning a higher tax on something else.
2) If your registration were that someplace else, it would have to go up
about $230/year to make up the revenue lost if you eliminated the state
gas tax. (Assuming 15K miles/year at 20 MPG.) That's one painful lump
every time you renew instead of an invisible $4 and change at every fill-up.
3) Shifting from a fuel tax to higher registration fees shifts the tax
burden from a use tax to a property tax, meaning that someone who drives
a little is paying the same as someone who drives a lot, and if your
Jeep is a second-car toy that sees occasional use you'll be paying
twice. There's a loose correlation between fuel consumption and weight,
and weight is a major factor in road wear. Worse, by moving away from a
use tax you reduce the amount of money those out-of-state vehicles on
their way to the their million-dollar log "cabins" pay into your state
and move it onto in-state taxpayers. You'll be subsidizing the stinkin'
touristas.
4) You reduce whatever incentive there is for some drivers to drive
vehicles that don't guzzle fuel. It's a weak effect that really only
affects those with the means to buy another vehicle, but it's there.
5) Generally speaking, you cannot add toll stations to existing
federally-funded highways without losing federal money. So, again
you'll be digging deeper into your pocket just to keep up. The federal
money you lose will go to another state, so your federal taxes won't
decrease either.
6) Tolls waste time and fuel for drivers, they cause accidents
(Connecticut removed theirs from I-95 after a tractor-trailer drove into
a queue of cars and killed 6). Yes, there are transponder technologies
but you still need toll stations, a contractor to support the technology
and staff to collect tolls from vehicles without transponders, so you
are spending a lot more taxpayer money than you would by having fuel
stations send in a check for taxes once a month.
Chad Fraker wrote:
> Part of the huge problem is that WI gas taxes are WAY too high. For the
> longest time, the gas tax would AUTOMATICALLY increase every April 1st.
> (What a cruel joke our state government plays on us) The gas tax rose by
> 81% - from 16.5 cents to 29.9 cents per gallon - over the last 20 years,
> giving Wisconsin one of the highest gas taxes in the nation. Maybe rather
> than having such high gas taxes, the vehicle registrations should go up? Or
> at lease slap a few toll booths so all the "FIBs" and "FISHTABs" pay a
> little to drive thru the state to make it to their "weekend homes" up nort
> or in da UP.
>
> Just my unenlightend opinion
>
>
> "Chris Lamb" <clamb1@new.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:43ed6a97.456917@news-server.new.rr.com...
>
>>Have 2000 GC V-8 and wondering if anyone is running ethanol in theirs.
>>Price here in WI is 45 cents a gallon cheaper than 87 Octane.
#110
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Ethanol in Grand Cherokee
Matt:
My e-mail address is valid if you'd like to discuss this further. It is
interesting to me, but I don't want to clutter up the newsgroup with it.
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> Then the project should be federalized. (flame suit on)
>
> "Lee Ayrton" <layrton@panix.com> wrote in message
> news:dsnpf7$a9k$1@reader2.panix.com...
>
>>We're drifting rapidly off-topic, but...
>>
>>If the Navy's motivation was from stock owners demanding increased profits
>>then submersible boat plants wouldn't enjoy the safety record that they
>>do.
>>
>>
>>Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>>
>>>Would be a good use for all the military bases that are slated to
>>>close...put up nuclear power plants. GWB mentioned that a while back, but
>>>I haven't heard much about it since. Yes, Bill, I agree with something W
>>>said. Even a stopped clock is right twice a day.
>>>
>>>And we should assign the management of the plants to the Navy, since they
>>>have so much experience with nuclear power.
>>>
>>>"L.W. ("ßill") ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
>>>news:43EE7F78.44C01486@***.net...
>>>
>>>
>>>> We must use nuclear energy. Even a wind mill cost a million dollars
>>>>worth of energy to make. Maybe asking the our Indians to use their
>>>>sovereign nations, to build around these liberal wackos, will solve our
>>>>problem. All we have to do is drop our use of petroleum by about ten
>>>>percent and gasoline will become a useless by-product again.
>>>> God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
>>>>mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>>>>
>>>>Lee Ayrton wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Or that it is pure government pork. It takes the energy of 2/3s of a
>>>>>gallon of gasoline to produce a gallon of pump-ready ethanol. A gallon
>>>>>of ethanol holds 2/3s the energy of gasoline, so BTU-wise it is a wash.
>>>>> I'm all for workable alternative energy sources, but in this case we
>>>>>might just as well burn gasoline and pay farmers not to plant surplus
>>>>>corn.
>>>
>>>
>
My e-mail address is valid if you'd like to discuss this further. It is
interesting to me, but I don't want to clutter up the newsgroup with it.
Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> Then the project should be federalized. (flame suit on)
>
> "Lee Ayrton" <layrton@panix.com> wrote in message
> news:dsnpf7$a9k$1@reader2.panix.com...
>
>>We're drifting rapidly off-topic, but...
>>
>>If the Navy's motivation was from stock owners demanding increased profits
>>then submersible boat plants wouldn't enjoy the safety record that they
>>do.
>>
>>
>>Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
>>
>>>Would be a good use for all the military bases that are slated to
>>>close...put up nuclear power plants. GWB mentioned that a while back, but
>>>I haven't heard much about it since. Yes, Bill, I agree with something W
>>>said. Even a stopped clock is right twice a day.
>>>
>>>And we should assign the management of the plants to the Navy, since they
>>>have so much experience with nuclear power.
>>>
>>>"L.W. ("ßill") ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
>>>news:43EE7F78.44C01486@***.net...
>>>
>>>
>>>> We must use nuclear energy. Even a wind mill cost a million dollars
>>>>worth of energy to make. Maybe asking the our Indians to use their
>>>>sovereign nations, to build around these liberal wackos, will solve our
>>>>problem. All we have to do is drop our use of petroleum by about ten
>>>>percent and gasoline will become a useless by-product again.
>>>> God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
>>>>mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>>>>
>>>>Lee Ayrton wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Or that it is pure government pork. It takes the energy of 2/3s of a
>>>>>gallon of gasoline to produce a gallon of pump-ready ethanol. A gallon
>>>>>of ethanol holds 2/3s the energy of gasoline, so BTU-wise it is a wash.
>>>>> I'm all for workable alternative energy sources, but in this case we
>>>>>might just as well burn gasoline and pay farmers not to plant surplus
>>>>>corn.
>>>
>>>
>