L.W.(=?iso-8859-1?Q?=DFill?=) Hughes III

Low mileage, would dictate changing oil every three months,
regardless of mileage.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/

Joe wrote:
>
> Yep, tried it before last oil change. It didnt seem to help.
>
> One of my problems being retired and living here on Maui is that I don't
> drive that many miles. Actually I really can't call that a problem
> though! I suspect the cleaners don't get a chance to really work well.
> Aloha and thanks to all for advice.
> Joe in Maui

Joe

Aloha Bill
Yes that is pretty much what I do. I maybe change it somwhere between 3
and 4 mo. As i said in original post though, I don't think the original
owner did that. Usually 3 months is less than 1000 miles driving for me
though.
Aloha and thanks for input
Joe

L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> Low mileage, would dictate changing oil every three months,
> regardless of mileage.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Joe wrote:
>
>>Yep, tried it before last oil change. It didnt seem to help.
>>
>>One of my problems being retired and living here on Maui is that I don't
>>drive that many miles. Actually I really can't call that a problem
>>though! I suspect the cleaners don't get a chance to really work well.
>>Aloha and thanks to all for advice.
>>Joe in Maui
>

Joe

Aloha Bill
Yes that is pretty much what I do. I maybe change it somwhere between 3
and 4 mo. As i said in original post though, I don't think the original
owner did that. Usually 3 months is less than 1000 miles driving for me
though.
Aloha and thanks for input
Joe

L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> Low mileage, would dictate changing oil every three months,
> regardless of mileage.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Joe wrote:
>
>>Yep, tried it before last oil change. It didnt seem to help.
>>
>>One of my problems being retired and living here on Maui is that I don't
>>drive that many miles. Actually I really can't call that a problem
>>though! I suspect the cleaners don't get a chance to really work well.
>>Aloha and thanks to all for advice.
>>Joe in Maui
>

Joe

Aloha Bill
Yes that is pretty much what I do. I maybe change it somwhere between 3
and 4 mo. As i said in original post though, I don't think the original
owner did that. Usually 3 months is less than 1000 miles driving for me
though.
Aloha and thanks for input
Joe

L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> Low mileage, would dictate changing oil every three months,
> regardless of mileage.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Joe wrote:
>
>>Yep, tried it before last oil change. It didnt seem to help.
>>
>>One of my problems being retired and living here on Maui is that I don't
>>drive that many miles. Actually I really can't call that a problem
>>though! I suspect the cleaners don't get a chance to really work well.
>>Aloha and thanks to all for advice.
>>Joe in Maui
>

Joe

Aloha Bill
Yes that is pretty much what I do. I maybe change it somwhere between 3
and 4 mo. As i said in original post though, I don't think the original
owner did that. Usually 3 months is less than 1000 miles driving for me
though.
Aloha and thanks for input
Joe

L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> Low mileage, would dictate changing oil every three months,
> regardless of mileage.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Joe wrote:
>
>>Yep, tried it before last oil change. It didnt seem to help.
>>
>>One of my problems being retired and living here on Maui is that I don't
>>drive that many miles. Actually I really can't call that a problem
>>though! I suspect the cleaners don't get a chance to really work well.
>>Aloha and thanks to all for advice.
>>Joe in Maui
>

CRWLR

That is a large expense for a little noise. I understand it can be annoying,
but normally that is all the noise is - annoying.

You say you have tried everything, but you have only gone 12,000 miles since
you bought it. If you bought it two or three years ago, you simply haven't
driven it enough for all of the stuff you have tried to even work. If you
bought it 3 years ago, and tried each of the available chemicals, you
haven't put more than a few hundred miles on any of them, and this is just
not enough to given them a chance to work.

Normally, you put this stuff in and see results in a thousand miles, or
maybe two thousand. But, those miles all come in a month, you don't put them
on in a year so whatever is gunked up is still gunked up.

We don't know how old you are, but hydraulic lifters are new in my lifetime,
and I am 50. There were cars being built that had solid lifters in them, and
the only way to make them quiet was to adjust them tight enough that the
rocker arm never left contact with the top of the valve, but very often in
the attempt to quiet the lifters, a poor mechanic would set the valves so
they didn't close completely, and this caused burnt valves. A little
clacking is not a big problem. Certainly not a problem that warrants pulling
the head. Now, if you needed to pull the head for other reasons, then by all
means get some new lifters, but otherwise get out and drive some more.

Try some ATF in the crankcase, somewhere between a pint and a quart should
do the trick. But you gotta get out and drive or the detergent can not clean
anything out. I would normally suggest to put the ATF in about a 1000 miles
before an oil change, but I think you should probably change the oil and use
a quart of ATF instead of one of the quarts of motor oil. Get the oil as
clean as you can. Then run it - don't park it, run it - for a few weeks or a
month, and then change the oil again and use a full load of oil with no ATF.
ATF is highly detergent, and it should clean the gunk from the inside of the
lifters. Gunk inside the lifters is the most likely problem, mostly due to
the age and low miles. You could have a lifter, or two or three, that are
sticky from the affects of condensation that result from low engine temps
and long periods of being parked. If the motor does not get hot enough for
long enough to blow the steam out, then stuff inside the engine is going to
corrode. If the lifters are corroded, then you will have a difficult time
with them, but a sitcky lifter is much better than one that is adjusted too
tightly.

Which, by the way, we have not even touched on yet. Are the lifters even
adjusted properly? If they are not set propelry, they will make noise no
matter how much ATF you run through them. I forget the spec, but I think you
want to adjust them while the motor is at idle (this can be a bitch) so they
are quiet, then add one-half turn. It has been a very long time since I
attempted to adjust lifters, bit I seem to recall backing them off until
they made noise, then tightening them down so they were silent, then adding
one-half more turn to the adjuster nut. You can use a stethoscope to find
the offender, but I would do them all. Maybe do the offender(s) first, then
go back and do the others, even hit the offenders a second time just to
confirm.

There is a procedure to adjust the valves that calls for feeler guages and
cranking the motor around by hand. But to adjust the rocker arms on a moving
motor, you will need to loosen all of the lock nuts first, then use a socket
to carefully work on a moving motor. Obvioulsy, oil will be flowing so you
will want to plan accordingly. The moving parts are a particular hazard, so
you want to plan around that as well. Or, you could buy some feeler guages
and a book that tells you how to do it on a static motor.





"Joe" <mauijoe@maui.net> wrote in message news:40B541D1.702@maui.net...
> I give up! I am going to replace the lifters in my 1990 YJ 258. I am
> replacing due to a clacking noise on start up which is lasting longer
> before it goes away and now sometimes reappears (although much quieter).
> I have tried all the cleaners and some seem to help a bit for a while,
> but then it gets worse again. YJ has 60k miles. I got it with 48k miles,
> but I suspect that previous owner had not been to religious about
> changing oil.
>
> Any preference for lifter brand? JC whitney has Elgin brand. Good or bad
> experiences with these or other brand names? Also is it possible or
> even worth trying to change the lifters without pulling the head on a 258?
> Aloha
> Joe in Maui
>

CRWLR

That is a large expense for a little noise. I understand it can be annoying,
but normally that is all the noise is - annoying.

You say you have tried everything, but you have only gone 12,000 miles since
you bought it. If you bought it two or three years ago, you simply haven't
driven it enough for all of the stuff you have tried to even work. If you
bought it 3 years ago, and tried each of the available chemicals, you
haven't put more than a few hundred miles on any of them, and this is just
not enough to given them a chance to work.

Normally, you put this stuff in and see results in a thousand miles, or
maybe two thousand. But, those miles all come in a month, you don't put them
on in a year so whatever is gunked up is still gunked up.

We don't know how old you are, but hydraulic lifters are new in my lifetime,
and I am 50. There were cars being built that had solid lifters in them, and
the only way to make them quiet was to adjust them tight enough that the
rocker arm never left contact with the top of the valve, but very often in
the attempt to quiet the lifters, a poor mechanic would set the valves so
they didn't close completely, and this caused burnt valves. A little
clacking is not a big problem. Certainly not a problem that warrants pulling
the head. Now, if you needed to pull the head for other reasons, then by all
means get some new lifters, but otherwise get out and drive some more.

Try some ATF in the crankcase, somewhere between a pint and a quart should
do the trick. But you gotta get out and drive or the detergent can not clean
anything out. I would normally suggest to put the ATF in about a 1000 miles
before an oil change, but I think you should probably change the oil and use
a quart of ATF instead of one of the quarts of motor oil. Get the oil as
clean as you can. Then run it - don't park it, run it - for a few weeks or a
month, and then change the oil again and use a full load of oil with no ATF.
ATF is highly detergent, and it should clean the gunk from the inside of the
lifters. Gunk inside the lifters is the most likely problem, mostly due to
the age and low miles. You could have a lifter, or two or three, that are
sticky from the affects of condensation that result from low engine temps
and long periods of being parked. If the motor does not get hot enough for
long enough to blow the steam out, then stuff inside the engine is going to
corrode. If the lifters are corroded, then you will have a difficult time
with them, but a sitcky lifter is much better than one that is adjusted too
tightly.

Which, by the way, we have not even touched on yet. Are the lifters even
adjusted properly? If they are not set propelry, they will make noise no
matter how much ATF you run through them. I forget the spec, but I think you
want to adjust them while the motor is at idle (this can be a bitch) so they
are quiet, then add one-half turn. It has been a very long time since I
attempted to adjust lifters, bit I seem to recall backing them off until
they made noise, then tightening them down so they were silent, then adding
one-half more turn to the adjuster nut. You can use a stethoscope to find
the offender, but I would do them all. Maybe do the offender(s) first, then
go back and do the others, even hit the offenders a second time just to
confirm.

There is a procedure to adjust the valves that calls for feeler guages and
cranking the motor around by hand. But to adjust the rocker arms on a moving
motor, you will need to loosen all of the lock nuts first, then use a socket
to carefully work on a moving motor. Obvioulsy, oil will be flowing so you
will want to plan accordingly. The moving parts are a particular hazard, so
you want to plan around that as well. Or, you could buy some feeler guages
and a book that tells you how to do it on a static motor.





"Joe" <mauijoe@maui.net> wrote in message news:40B541D1.702@maui.net...
> I give up! I am going to replace the lifters in my 1990 YJ 258. I am
> replacing due to a clacking noise on start up which is lasting longer
> before it goes away and now sometimes reappears (although much quieter).
> I have tried all the cleaners and some seem to help a bit for a while,
> but then it gets worse again. YJ has 60k miles. I got it with 48k miles,
> but I suspect that previous owner had not been to religious about
> changing oil.
>
> Any preference for lifter brand? JC whitney has Elgin brand. Good or bad
> experiences with these or other brand names? Also is it possible or
> even worth trying to change the lifters without pulling the head on a 258?
> Aloha
> Joe in Maui
>

CRWLR

That is a large expense for a little noise. I understand it can be annoying,
but normally that is all the noise is - annoying.

You say you have tried everything, but you have only gone 12,000 miles since
you bought it. If you bought it two or three years ago, you simply haven't
driven it enough for all of the stuff you have tried to even work. If you
bought it 3 years ago, and tried each of the available chemicals, you
haven't put more than a few hundred miles on any of them, and this is just
not enough to given them a chance to work.

Normally, you put this stuff in and see results in a thousand miles, or
maybe two thousand. But, those miles all come in a month, you don't put them
on in a year so whatever is gunked up is still gunked up.

We don't know how old you are, but hydraulic lifters are new in my lifetime,
and I am 50. There were cars being built that had solid lifters in them, and
the only way to make them quiet was to adjust them tight enough that the
rocker arm never left contact with the top of the valve, but very often in
the attempt to quiet the lifters, a poor mechanic would set the valves so
they didn't close completely, and this caused burnt valves. A little
clacking is not a big problem. Certainly not a problem that warrants pulling
the head. Now, if you needed to pull the head for other reasons, then by all
means get some new lifters, but otherwise get out and drive some more.

Try some ATF in the crankcase, somewhere between a pint and a quart should
do the trick. But you gotta get out and drive or the detergent can not clean
anything out. I would normally suggest to put the ATF in about a 1000 miles
before an oil change, but I think you should probably change the oil and use
a quart of ATF instead of one of the quarts of motor oil. Get the oil as
clean as you can. Then run it - don't park it, run it - for a few weeks or a
month, and then change the oil again and use a full load of oil with no ATF.
ATF is highly detergent, and it should clean the gunk from the inside of the
lifters. Gunk inside the lifters is the most likely problem, mostly due to
the age and low miles. You could have a lifter, or two or three, that are
sticky from the affects of condensation that result from low engine temps
and long periods of being parked. If the motor does not get hot enough for
long enough to blow the steam out, then stuff inside the engine is going to
corrode. If the lifters are corroded, then you will have a difficult time
with them, but a sitcky lifter is much better than one that is adjusted too
tightly.

Which, by the way, we have not even touched on yet. Are the lifters even
adjusted properly? If they are not set propelry, they will make noise no
matter how much ATF you run through them. I forget the spec, but I think you
want to adjust them while the motor is at idle (this can be a bitch) so they
are quiet, then add one-half turn. It has been a very long time since I
attempted to adjust lifters, bit I seem to recall backing them off until
they made noise, then tightening them down so they were silent, then adding
one-half more turn to the adjuster nut. You can use a stethoscope to find
the offender, but I would do them all. Maybe do the offender(s) first, then
go back and do the others, even hit the offenders a second time just to
confirm.

There is a procedure to adjust the valves that calls for feeler guages and
cranking the motor around by hand. But to adjust the rocker arms on a moving
motor, you will need to loosen all of the lock nuts first, then use a socket
to carefully work on a moving motor. Obvioulsy, oil will be flowing so you
will want to plan accordingly. The moving parts are a particular hazard, so
you want to plan around that as well. Or, you could buy some feeler guages
and a book that tells you how to do it on a static motor.





"Joe" <mauijoe@maui.net> wrote in message news:40B541D1.702@maui.net...
> I give up! I am going to replace the lifters in my 1990 YJ 258. I am
> replacing due to a clacking noise on start up which is lasting longer
> before it goes away and now sometimes reappears (although much quieter).
> I have tried all the cleaners and some seem to help a bit for a while,
> but then it gets worse again. YJ has 60k miles. I got it with 48k miles,
> but I suspect that previous owner had not been to religious about
> changing oil.
>
> Any preference for lifter brand? JC whitney has Elgin brand. Good or bad
> experiences with these or other brand names? Also is it possible or
> even worth trying to change the lifters without pulling the head on a 258?
> Aloha
> Joe in Maui
>

CRWLR

That is a large expense for a little noise. I understand it can be annoying,
but normally that is all the noise is - annoying.

You say you have tried everything, but you have only gone 12,000 miles since
you bought it. If you bought it two or three years ago, you simply haven't
driven it enough for all of the stuff you have tried to even work. If you
bought it 3 years ago, and tried each of the available chemicals, you
haven't put more than a few hundred miles on any of them, and this is just
not enough to given them a chance to work.

Normally, you put this stuff in and see results in a thousand miles, or
maybe two thousand. But, those miles all come in a month, you don't put them
on in a year so whatever is gunked up is still gunked up.

We don't know how old you are, but hydraulic lifters are new in my lifetime,
and I am 50. There were cars being built that had solid lifters in them, and
the only way to make them quiet was to adjust them tight enough that the
rocker arm never left contact with the top of the valve, but very often in
the attempt to quiet the lifters, a poor mechanic would set the valves so
they didn't close completely, and this caused burnt valves. A little
clacking is not a big problem. Certainly not a problem that warrants pulling
the head. Now, if you needed to pull the head for other reasons, then by all
means get some new lifters, but otherwise get out and drive some more.

Try some ATF in the crankcase, somewhere between a pint and a quart should
do the trick. But you gotta get out and drive or the detergent can not clean
anything out. I would normally suggest to put the ATF in about a 1000 miles
before an oil change, but I think you should probably change the oil and use
a quart of ATF instead of one of the quarts of motor oil. Get the oil as
clean as you can. Then run it - don't park it, run it - for a few weeks or a
month, and then change the oil again and use a full load of oil with no ATF.
ATF is highly detergent, and it should clean the gunk from the inside of the
lifters. Gunk inside the lifters is the most likely problem, mostly due to
the age and low miles. You could have a lifter, or two or three, that are
sticky from the affects of condensation that result from low engine temps
and long periods of being parked. If the motor does not get hot enough for
long enough to blow the steam out, then stuff inside the engine is going to
corrode. If the lifters are corroded, then you will have a difficult time
with them, but a sitcky lifter is much better than one that is adjusted too
tightly.

Which, by the way, we have not even touched on yet. Are the lifters even
adjusted properly? If they are not set propelry, they will make noise no
matter how much ATF you run through them. I forget the spec, but I think you
want to adjust them while the motor is at idle (this can be a bitch) so they
are quiet, then add one-half turn. It has been a very long time since I
attempted to adjust lifters, bit I seem to recall backing them off until
they made noise, then tightening them down so they were silent, then adding
one-half more turn to the adjuster nut. You can use a stethoscope to find
the offender, but I would do them all. Maybe do the offender(s) first, then
go back and do the others, even hit the offenders a second time just to
confirm.

There is a procedure to adjust the valves that calls for feeler guages and
cranking the motor around by hand. But to adjust the rocker arms on a moving
motor, you will need to loosen all of the lock nuts first, then use a socket
to carefully work on a moving motor. Obvioulsy, oil will be flowing so you
will want to plan accordingly. The moving parts are a particular hazard, so
you want to plan around that as well. Or, you could buy some feeler guages
and a book that tells you how to do it on a static motor.





"Joe" <mauijoe@maui.net> wrote in message news:40B541D1.702@maui.net...
> I give up! I am going to replace the lifters in my 1990 YJ 258. I am
> replacing due to a clacking noise on start up which is lasting longer
> before it goes away and now sometimes reappears (although much quieter).
> I have tried all the cleaners and some seem to help a bit for a while,
> but then it gets worse again. YJ has 60k miles. I got it with 48k miles,
> but I suspect that previous owner had not been to religious about
> changing oil.
>
> Any preference for lifter brand? JC whitney has Elgin brand. Good or bad
> experiences with these or other brand names? Also is it possible or
> even worth trying to change the lifters without pulling the head on a 258?
> Aloha
> Joe in Maui
>

CRWLR

"Joe" <mauijoe@maui.net> wrote in message news:40BA3552.9080301@maui.net...
> Yep, tried it before last oil change. It didnt seem to help.
>
> One of my problems being retired and living here on Maui is that I don't
> drive that many miles. Actually I really can't call that a problem
> though! I suspect the cleaners don't get a chance to really work well.
> Aloha and thanks to all for advice.
> Joe in Maui
>

On the contrary, I think your lack of driving IS your most significant
problem. Maybe you should buy me a plane ticket and have me come over and do
the driving for you. All I'll charge is some food and a place to sleep. I
don't need much money if you are buying the plane tickets, gas, lunch, and
the sea-side palatial estate. I'll tell you now though, I can only stay for
a year or so, then I have to get back to the mainland.