98 GRAND CHEROKEE BATTERY BEING DRAINED
05-08-2005, 08:19 PM
#61
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 98 GRAND CHEROKEE BATTERY BEING DRAINED Part 2
On Sun, 8 May 2005 19:48:04 -0400, "JEEPR" <YJJPS@nospam@yahoo.ca>
wrote:
>
>a battery never looses voltage, it will loose its capacitance to delivery
>current that why the flashlight goes dim, measure the voltage on a deed
>flashlight battery and it will read 1.5v, but the potential (voltage) will
>remain
>
>
> Matt
That is absolutely not true. You apparently haven't measured the
voltage on a dead or dying battery. I have measured hundreds, if not
thousands of batteries in my lifetime, and I assure you the voltage
across the terminals will decrease as the cell(s) go dead.
Just for drill I measured the voltage on two AA cells I took out of a
wireless mouse because the mouse no longer worked. The batteries
measured 1.022 volts DC with no load on a $350 Fluke DVM calibrated by
Fluke. That's a long way from 1.5 volts. The same is true of any
battery.
As I said before, let the garage charge your battery. There is
probably nothing wrong with it, except that it needs charging.
wrote:
>
>a battery never looses voltage, it will loose its capacitance to delivery
>current that why the flashlight goes dim, measure the voltage on a deed
>flashlight battery and it will read 1.5v, but the potential (voltage) will
>remain
>
>
> Matt
That is absolutely not true. You apparently haven't measured the
voltage on a dead or dying battery. I have measured hundreds, if not
thousands of batteries in my lifetime, and I assure you the voltage
across the terminals will decrease as the cell(s) go dead.
Just for drill I measured the voltage on two AA cells I took out of a
wireless mouse because the mouse no longer worked. The batteries
measured 1.022 volts DC with no load on a $350 Fluke DVM calibrated by
Fluke. That's a long way from 1.5 volts. The same is true of any
battery.
As I said before, let the garage charge your battery. There is
probably nothing wrong with it, except that it needs charging.
05-08-2005, 08:21 PM
#62
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 98 GRAND CHEROKEE BATTERY BEING DRAINED Part 2
Wrong. The load tester, tests for how much a battery will recover
after a simulated fifteen second starter run in volts:
http://www.repairfaq.org/ELE/F_Car_B...CARBATTERY_010
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
JEEPR wrote:
>
> Well I have diagnosed it down to the air conditioning clutch solenoid being
> engaged all the time. not to sure what would cause it, I pulled the relay in
> the power distribution box and re installed it, now fault has disappeared
> for now.
> As a side bar my new battery dropped to 9 volts and was boiling over in the
> jeep. The out put from alternator is 14 v. Now the garage wants to recharge
> it, I say it was defective because a battery should never loose its voltage,
> but they would not listen to me.
after a simulated fifteen second starter run in volts:
http://www.repairfaq.org/ELE/F_Car_B...CARBATTERY_010
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
JEEPR wrote:
>
> Well I have diagnosed it down to the air conditioning clutch solenoid being
> engaged all the time. not to sure what would cause it, I pulled the relay in
> the power distribution box and re installed it, now fault has disappeared
> for now.
> As a side bar my new battery dropped to 9 volts and was boiling over in the
> jeep. The out put from alternator is 14 v. Now the garage wants to recharge
> it, I say it was defective because a battery should never loose its voltage,
> but they would not listen to me.
05-08-2005, 08:21 PM
#63
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 98 GRAND CHEROKEE BATTERY BEING DRAINED Part 2
Wrong. The load tester, tests for how much a battery will recover
after a simulated fifteen second starter run in volts:
http://www.repairfaq.org/ELE/F_Car_B...CARBATTERY_010
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
JEEPR wrote:
>
> Well I have diagnosed it down to the air conditioning clutch solenoid being
> engaged all the time. not to sure what would cause it, I pulled the relay in
> the power distribution box and re installed it, now fault has disappeared
> for now.
> As a side bar my new battery dropped to 9 volts and was boiling over in the
> jeep. The out put from alternator is 14 v. Now the garage wants to recharge
> it, I say it was defective because a battery should never loose its voltage,
> but they would not listen to me.
after a simulated fifteen second starter run in volts:
http://www.repairfaq.org/ELE/F_Car_B...CARBATTERY_010
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
JEEPR wrote:
>
> Well I have diagnosed it down to the air conditioning clutch solenoid being
> engaged all the time. not to sure what would cause it, I pulled the relay in
> the power distribution box and re installed it, now fault has disappeared
> for now.
> As a side bar my new battery dropped to 9 volts and was boiling over in the
> jeep. The out put from alternator is 14 v. Now the garage wants to recharge
> it, I say it was defective because a battery should never loose its voltage,
> but they would not listen to me.
05-08-2005, 08:21 PM
#64
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 98 GRAND CHEROKEE BATTERY BEING DRAINED Part 2
Wrong. The load tester, tests for how much a battery will recover
after a simulated fifteen second starter run in volts:
http://www.repairfaq.org/ELE/F_Car_B...CARBATTERY_010
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
JEEPR wrote:
>
> Well I have diagnosed it down to the air conditioning clutch solenoid being
> engaged all the time. not to sure what would cause it, I pulled the relay in
> the power distribution box and re installed it, now fault has disappeared
> for now.
> As a side bar my new battery dropped to 9 volts and was boiling over in the
> jeep. The out put from alternator is 14 v. Now the garage wants to recharge
> it, I say it was defective because a battery should never loose its voltage,
> but they would not listen to me.
after a simulated fifteen second starter run in volts:
http://www.repairfaq.org/ELE/F_Car_B...CARBATTERY_010
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
JEEPR wrote:
>
> Well I have diagnosed it down to the air conditioning clutch solenoid being
> engaged all the time. not to sure what would cause it, I pulled the relay in
> the power distribution box and re installed it, now fault has disappeared
> for now.
> As a side bar my new battery dropped to 9 volts and was boiling over in the
> jeep. The out put from alternator is 14 v. Now the garage wants to recharge
> it, I say it was defective because a battery should never loose its voltage,
> but they would not listen to me.
05-08-2005, 08:21 PM
#65
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 98 GRAND CHEROKEE BATTERY BEING DRAINED Part 2
Wrong. The load tester, tests for how much a battery will recover
after a simulated fifteen second starter run in volts:
http://www.repairfaq.org/ELE/F_Car_B...CARBATTERY_010
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
JEEPR wrote:
>
> Well I have diagnosed it down to the air conditioning clutch solenoid being
> engaged all the time. not to sure what would cause it, I pulled the relay in
> the power distribution box and re installed it, now fault has disappeared
> for now.
> As a side bar my new battery dropped to 9 volts and was boiling over in the
> jeep. The out put from alternator is 14 v. Now the garage wants to recharge
> it, I say it was defective because a battery should never loose its voltage,
> but they would not listen to me.
after a simulated fifteen second starter run in volts:
http://www.repairfaq.org/ELE/F_Car_B...CARBATTERY_010
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
JEEPR wrote:
>
> Well I have diagnosed it down to the air conditioning clutch solenoid being
> engaged all the time. not to sure what would cause it, I pulled the relay in
> the power distribution box and re installed it, now fault has disappeared
> for now.
> As a side bar my new battery dropped to 9 volts and was boiling over in the
> jeep. The out put from alternator is 14 v. Now the garage wants to recharge
> it, I say it was defective because a battery should never loose its voltage,
> but they would not listen to me.
05-08-2005, 09:35 PM
#66
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 98 GRAND CHEROKEE BATTERY BEING DRAINED
L.W. ("ßill") ------ III did pass the time by typing:
> My twenty year old Radio Shack analog is pretty sensitive:
They work for most tests but some of the newer fiddly bits like the
crankshaft position sensor, can be blown if you do an ohm test on em
with an analog meter. The analog meters use too much current to measure
the resistance load.
> DougW wrote:
>>
>> Make that a digital volt meter, the analog ones arn't safe for using
>> on some sensors.
> My twenty year old Radio Shack analog is pretty sensitive:
They work for most tests but some of the newer fiddly bits like the
crankshaft position sensor, can be blown if you do an ohm test on em
with an analog meter. The analog meters use too much current to measure
the resistance load.
> DougW wrote:
>>
>> Make that a digital volt meter, the analog ones arn't safe for using
>> on some sensors.
05-08-2005, 09:35 PM
#67
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 98 GRAND CHEROKEE BATTERY BEING DRAINED
L.W. ("ßill") ------ III did pass the time by typing:
> My twenty year old Radio Shack analog is pretty sensitive:
They work for most tests but some of the newer fiddly bits like the
crankshaft position sensor, can be blown if you do an ohm test on em
with an analog meter. The analog meters use too much current to measure
the resistance load.
> DougW wrote:
>>
>> Make that a digital volt meter, the analog ones arn't safe for using
>> on some sensors.
> My twenty year old Radio Shack analog is pretty sensitive:
They work for most tests but some of the newer fiddly bits like the
crankshaft position sensor, can be blown if you do an ohm test on em
with an analog meter. The analog meters use too much current to measure
the resistance load.
> DougW wrote:
>>
>> Make that a digital volt meter, the analog ones arn't safe for using
>> on some sensors.
05-08-2005, 09:35 PM
#68
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 98 GRAND CHEROKEE BATTERY BEING DRAINED
L.W. ("ßill") ------ III did pass the time by typing:
> My twenty year old Radio Shack analog is pretty sensitive:
They work for most tests but some of the newer fiddly bits like the
crankshaft position sensor, can be blown if you do an ohm test on em
with an analog meter. The analog meters use too much current to measure
the resistance load.
> DougW wrote:
>>
>> Make that a digital volt meter, the analog ones arn't safe for using
>> on some sensors.
> My twenty year old Radio Shack analog is pretty sensitive:
They work for most tests but some of the newer fiddly bits like the
crankshaft position sensor, can be blown if you do an ohm test on em
with an analog meter. The analog meters use too much current to measure
the resistance load.
> DougW wrote:
>>
>> Make that a digital volt meter, the analog ones arn't safe for using
>> on some sensors.
05-08-2005, 09:35 PM
#69
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 98 GRAND CHEROKEE BATTERY BEING DRAINED
L.W. ("ßill") ------ III did pass the time by typing:
> My twenty year old Radio Shack analog is pretty sensitive:
They work for most tests but some of the newer fiddly bits like the
crankshaft position sensor, can be blown if you do an ohm test on em
with an analog meter. The analog meters use too much current to measure
the resistance load.
> DougW wrote:
>>
>> Make that a digital volt meter, the analog ones arn't safe for using
>> on some sensors.
> My twenty year old Radio Shack analog is pretty sensitive:
They work for most tests but some of the newer fiddly bits like the
crankshaft position sensor, can be blown if you do an ohm test on em
with an analog meter. The analog meters use too much current to measure
the resistance load.
> DougW wrote:
>>
>> Make that a digital volt meter, the analog ones arn't safe for using
>> on some sensors.
05-08-2005, 09:50 PM
#70
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 98 GRAND CHEROKEE BATTERY BEING DRAINED Part 2
Just to claify a few things.
All batteries have a power curve and it varies from
model to model. Here is one for a standard AA battery. (e91)
http://data.energizer.com/PDFs/e91.pdf
Flip to the second page and look at constant power discharge.
(I went through a lot of this figuring out what batteries
would last longer in my GPS unit) The Energizer and e2
profiles are almost identical so the only thing you got
when paying out the noze for an e2 was a warm fuzzy.
Anyhoo, back on line...
Feel like watching a slide show?
http://nms.csail.mit.edu/fun/battery.ppt
Optima self-discharge curve.
http://www.dcbattery.com/optima_self...rge_curve.html
Hope that helps clear things up.
The only sure way to test a car battery is a load
test. Most PepBoys and probably C-Tire (Tyre?) :)
will have a setup. This is a computer that charges
the battery then does a controlled and timed discharge.
FWIW, I've brought dead cell batteries back to life by
using a charger (high amp) and a volt meter to bring the
battery up to the service maximum 5-10 times in a row
and then using a low amp trickle till all cells bubbled
the same. I don't suggest doing this without eye
protection because you will bubble the cells quite a
bit and that's acid that is popping out even if you can't
see the microsopic drops.
--
DougW
And his portable soapbox.
All batteries have a power curve and it varies from
model to model. Here is one for a standard AA battery. (e91)
http://data.energizer.com/PDFs/e91.pdf
Flip to the second page and look at constant power discharge.
(I went through a lot of this figuring out what batteries
would last longer in my GPS unit) The Energizer and e2
profiles are almost identical so the only thing you got
when paying out the noze for an e2 was a warm fuzzy.
Anyhoo, back on line...
Feel like watching a slide show?
http://nms.csail.mit.edu/fun/battery.ppt
Optima self-discharge curve.
http://www.dcbattery.com/optima_self...rge_curve.html
Hope that helps clear things up.
The only sure way to test a car battery is a load
test. Most PepBoys and probably C-Tire (Tyre?) :)
will have a setup. This is a computer that charges
the battery then does a controlled and timed discharge.
FWIW, I've brought dead cell batteries back to life by
using a charger (high amp) and a volt meter to bring the
battery up to the service maximum 5-10 times in a row
and then using a low amp trickle till all cells bubbled
the same. I don't suggest doing this without eye
protection because you will bubble the cells quite a
bit and that's acid that is popping out even if you can't
see the microsopic drops.
--
DougW
And his portable soapbox.