'79 304 Edelbrock carb problems vs Holley carbs?
09-06-2006, 08:17 PM
#31
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: '79 304 Edelbrock carb problems vs Holley carbs?
The rule of thumb was during the muscle car era, was any carburetor
that came form the factory needed to be jetted by about ten percent, of
course that was too rich for the street and fouled plugs, but it was
that little edge I had on everyone.
God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
c wrote:
>
> Dave,
>
> When the companies that make carb give them their initial settings from the
> factory, they take all kinds of compromised in to consideration. They don't
> know if the carb will be used on a large or small displacement engine, or if
> it will be used in hot or cold climate, high altitude, etc. They also don't
> know what other mods have been done to these engines. The baseline settings
> they give these carbs will allow them to run on most of the applications
> they will see, but they almost always require tuning to get them to be
> optimal. My guess would be that this carb would still be a little rich, but
> it is just a guess. I'm not saying it won't run, it will, and it will
> probably be pretty damn close to right.
>
> The metering rod system that Carter/Edelbrock uses will "adjust" the mixture
> based on engine vacuum. The rods are controlled by a piston and spring,
> similar to many other carbs. When the engine vacuum is low, the metering rod
> spring will start to overtake the vacuum pulling the piston down. The rods
> are tapered, and when they move up in the bore they are in, a smaller
> diameter of the rod will still be inside the main jet, effectively
> increasing the total main jet area that fuel can pass thru. If the engine
> runs too rich at high vacuum conditions, but is ok at low vacuum or wide
> open throttle, then you simply change the metering rod to on the has a
> larger diameter on the part of the rod that is in the jet at high vacuum
> conditions. It really is a simple process, and normally will only require 1
> or 2 sets of rods to get the carb where you need it to be.
>
> Chris
that came form the factory needed to be jetted by about ten percent, of
course that was too rich for the street and fouled plugs, but it was
that little edge I had on everyone.
God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
c wrote:
>
> Dave,
>
> When the companies that make carb give them their initial settings from the
> factory, they take all kinds of compromised in to consideration. They don't
> know if the carb will be used on a large or small displacement engine, or if
> it will be used in hot or cold climate, high altitude, etc. They also don't
> know what other mods have been done to these engines. The baseline settings
> they give these carbs will allow them to run on most of the applications
> they will see, but they almost always require tuning to get them to be
> optimal. My guess would be that this carb would still be a little rich, but
> it is just a guess. I'm not saying it won't run, it will, and it will
> probably be pretty damn close to right.
>
> The metering rod system that Carter/Edelbrock uses will "adjust" the mixture
> based on engine vacuum. The rods are controlled by a piston and spring,
> similar to many other carbs. When the engine vacuum is low, the metering rod
> spring will start to overtake the vacuum pulling the piston down. The rods
> are tapered, and when they move up in the bore they are in, a smaller
> diameter of the rod will still be inside the main jet, effectively
> increasing the total main jet area that fuel can pass thru. If the engine
> runs too rich at high vacuum conditions, but is ok at low vacuum or wide
> open throttle, then you simply change the metering rod to on the has a
> larger diameter on the part of the rod that is in the jet at high vacuum
> conditions. It really is a simple process, and normally will only require 1
> or 2 sets of rods to get the carb where you need it to be.
>
> Chris
09-07-2006, 02:51 AM
#32
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: '79 304 Edelbrock carb problems vs Holley carbs?
Dave, you shouldn't have a problem tuning the Carter/Edelbrock carb, and
yes, they are basically the same carb inside. I believe the jets and rods
interchange, but I'm not positive on that. I do know that the Edelbrock carb
is heavily based on the Carter design. If you understand basic carb
functioning, and what the rods and jets do for the mixture, it will be a
simple process to get it dialed in. If you ruin in to problems, I'm sure we
can get you going in the right direction. Also, there is a book available
called Carter Carb Tuning. Most of it will apply to the Edelbrock as well. I
had the book at one time, but loaned it out and never got it back. I do know
that the book is very thorough.
Chris
"Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
news:FiGLg.14805$r61.8273@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
> Thanks. Looks like perhaps I should have ordered the calibration kit in
> retrospect. Anyhow, after a 2 week wait, it has arrived so I'll fit at the
> weekend.
>
> Quite looking forward to it - my carb experience has been mainly with
> multiple SU's (single barrel downdraft) and the odd side draft Weber -
> never done anything on a 4 barrel like Holley or Edelbrock before.
>
> Dave Milne, Scotland
> '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
> "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
> news:1lDLg.1336$d72.134@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>> Dave,
>>
>> When the companies that make carb give them their initial settings from
> the
>> factory, they take all kinds of compromised in to consideration. They
> don't
>> know if the carb will be used on a large or small displacement engine, or
> if
>> it will be used in hot or cold climate, high altitude, etc. They also
> don't
>> know what other mods have been done to these engines. The baseline
> settings
>> they give these carbs will allow them to run on most of the applications
>> they will see, but they almost always require tuning to get them to be
>> optimal. My guess would be that this carb would still be a little rich,
> but
>> it is just a guess. I'm not saying it won't run, it will, and it will
>> probably be pretty damn close to right.
>>
>> The metering rod system that Carter/Edelbrock uses will "adjust" the
> mixture
>> based on engine vacuum. The rods are controlled by a piston and spring,
>> similar to many other carbs. When the engine vacuum is low, the metering
> rod
>> spring will start to overtake the vacuum pulling the piston down. The
>> rods
>> are tapered, and when they move up in the bore they are in, a smaller
>> diameter of the rod will still be inside the main jet, effectively
>> increasing the total main jet area that fuel can pass thru. If the engine
>> runs too rich at high vacuum conditions, but is ok at low vacuum or wide
>> open throttle, then you simply change the metering rod to on the has a
>> larger diameter on the part of the rod that is in the jet at high vacuum
>> conditions. It really is a simple process, and normally will only require
> 1
>> or 2 sets of rods to get the carb where you need it to be.
>>
>> Chris
>>
>>
>> "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
>> news:OeuLg.14311$r61.1621@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
>> > Any idea if the Edelbrock 600cfm 1405 Performer + Edelbrock 2131
> manifold
>> > will require a metering or jet change on a stock 360 '91 Grand Wagoneer
> ?
>> >
>> >
>> > Dave Milne, Scotland
>> > '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
>> > "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
>> > news:cliLg.1294$d72.56@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>> >> Without knowing what size carb, choke or no choke, and which manifold,
> it
>> > is
>> >> hard to tell you what the problem could be. What I can tell you is
>> >> that
>> >> Edelbrock and Holley carbs are both set up from the factory with a
>> >> general
>> >> tune. This mean the carb may or may not need to be set up properly for
>> > your
>> >> particular engine. In general, the Edelbrock carbs run too rich with
> the
>> >> factory set up. Normally they will require a metering rod change, and
>> > maybe
>> >> a jet change as well. You also don't specify the cam specs.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
>
yes, they are basically the same carb inside. I believe the jets and rods
interchange, but I'm not positive on that. I do know that the Edelbrock carb
is heavily based on the Carter design. If you understand basic carb
functioning, and what the rods and jets do for the mixture, it will be a
simple process to get it dialed in. If you ruin in to problems, I'm sure we
can get you going in the right direction. Also, there is a book available
called Carter Carb Tuning. Most of it will apply to the Edelbrock as well. I
had the book at one time, but loaned it out and never got it back. I do know
that the book is very thorough.
Chris
"Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
news:FiGLg.14805$r61.8273@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
> Thanks. Looks like perhaps I should have ordered the calibration kit in
> retrospect. Anyhow, after a 2 week wait, it has arrived so I'll fit at the
> weekend.
>
> Quite looking forward to it - my carb experience has been mainly with
> multiple SU's (single barrel downdraft) and the odd side draft Weber -
> never done anything on a 4 barrel like Holley or Edelbrock before.
>
> Dave Milne, Scotland
> '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
> "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
> news:1lDLg.1336$d72.134@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>> Dave,
>>
>> When the companies that make carb give them their initial settings from
> the
>> factory, they take all kinds of compromised in to consideration. They
> don't
>> know if the carb will be used on a large or small displacement engine, or
> if
>> it will be used in hot or cold climate, high altitude, etc. They also
> don't
>> know what other mods have been done to these engines. The baseline
> settings
>> they give these carbs will allow them to run on most of the applications
>> they will see, but they almost always require tuning to get them to be
>> optimal. My guess would be that this carb would still be a little rich,
> but
>> it is just a guess. I'm not saying it won't run, it will, and it will
>> probably be pretty damn close to right.
>>
>> The metering rod system that Carter/Edelbrock uses will "adjust" the
> mixture
>> based on engine vacuum. The rods are controlled by a piston and spring,
>> similar to many other carbs. When the engine vacuum is low, the metering
> rod
>> spring will start to overtake the vacuum pulling the piston down. The
>> rods
>> are tapered, and when they move up in the bore they are in, a smaller
>> diameter of the rod will still be inside the main jet, effectively
>> increasing the total main jet area that fuel can pass thru. If the engine
>> runs too rich at high vacuum conditions, but is ok at low vacuum or wide
>> open throttle, then you simply change the metering rod to on the has a
>> larger diameter on the part of the rod that is in the jet at high vacuum
>> conditions. It really is a simple process, and normally will only require
> 1
>> or 2 sets of rods to get the carb where you need it to be.
>>
>> Chris
>>
>>
>> "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
>> news:OeuLg.14311$r61.1621@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
>> > Any idea if the Edelbrock 600cfm 1405 Performer + Edelbrock 2131
> manifold
>> > will require a metering or jet change on a stock 360 '91 Grand Wagoneer
> ?
>> >
>> >
>> > Dave Milne, Scotland
>> > '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
>> > "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
>> > news:cliLg.1294$d72.56@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>> >> Without knowing what size carb, choke or no choke, and which manifold,
> it
>> > is
>> >> hard to tell you what the problem could be. What I can tell you is
>> >> that
>> >> Edelbrock and Holley carbs are both set up from the factory with a
>> >> general
>> >> tune. This mean the carb may or may not need to be set up properly for
>> > your
>> >> particular engine. In general, the Edelbrock carbs run too rich with
> the
>> >> factory set up. Normally they will require a metering rod change, and
>> > maybe
>> >> a jet change as well. You also don't specify the cam specs.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
>
09-07-2006, 02:51 AM
#33
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: '79 304 Edelbrock carb problems vs Holley carbs?
Dave, you shouldn't have a problem tuning the Carter/Edelbrock carb, and
yes, they are basically the same carb inside. I believe the jets and rods
interchange, but I'm not positive on that. I do know that the Edelbrock carb
is heavily based on the Carter design. If you understand basic carb
functioning, and what the rods and jets do for the mixture, it will be a
simple process to get it dialed in. If you ruin in to problems, I'm sure we
can get you going in the right direction. Also, there is a book available
called Carter Carb Tuning. Most of it will apply to the Edelbrock as well. I
had the book at one time, but loaned it out and never got it back. I do know
that the book is very thorough.
Chris
"Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
news:FiGLg.14805$r61.8273@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
> Thanks. Looks like perhaps I should have ordered the calibration kit in
> retrospect. Anyhow, after a 2 week wait, it has arrived so I'll fit at the
> weekend.
>
> Quite looking forward to it - my carb experience has been mainly with
> multiple SU's (single barrel downdraft) and the odd side draft Weber -
> never done anything on a 4 barrel like Holley or Edelbrock before.
>
> Dave Milne, Scotland
> '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
> "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
> news:1lDLg.1336$d72.134@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>> Dave,
>>
>> When the companies that make carb give them their initial settings from
> the
>> factory, they take all kinds of compromised in to consideration. They
> don't
>> know if the carb will be used on a large or small displacement engine, or
> if
>> it will be used in hot or cold climate, high altitude, etc. They also
> don't
>> know what other mods have been done to these engines. The baseline
> settings
>> they give these carbs will allow them to run on most of the applications
>> they will see, but they almost always require tuning to get them to be
>> optimal. My guess would be that this carb would still be a little rich,
> but
>> it is just a guess. I'm not saying it won't run, it will, and it will
>> probably be pretty damn close to right.
>>
>> The metering rod system that Carter/Edelbrock uses will "adjust" the
> mixture
>> based on engine vacuum. The rods are controlled by a piston and spring,
>> similar to many other carbs. When the engine vacuum is low, the metering
> rod
>> spring will start to overtake the vacuum pulling the piston down. The
>> rods
>> are tapered, and when they move up in the bore they are in, a smaller
>> diameter of the rod will still be inside the main jet, effectively
>> increasing the total main jet area that fuel can pass thru. If the engine
>> runs too rich at high vacuum conditions, but is ok at low vacuum or wide
>> open throttle, then you simply change the metering rod to on the has a
>> larger diameter on the part of the rod that is in the jet at high vacuum
>> conditions. It really is a simple process, and normally will only require
> 1
>> or 2 sets of rods to get the carb where you need it to be.
>>
>> Chris
>>
>>
>> "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
>> news:OeuLg.14311$r61.1621@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
>> > Any idea if the Edelbrock 600cfm 1405 Performer + Edelbrock 2131
> manifold
>> > will require a metering or jet change on a stock 360 '91 Grand Wagoneer
> ?
>> >
>> >
>> > Dave Milne, Scotland
>> > '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
>> > "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
>> > news:cliLg.1294$d72.56@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>> >> Without knowing what size carb, choke or no choke, and which manifold,
> it
>> > is
>> >> hard to tell you what the problem could be. What I can tell you is
>> >> that
>> >> Edelbrock and Holley carbs are both set up from the factory with a
>> >> general
>> >> tune. This mean the carb may or may not need to be set up properly for
>> > your
>> >> particular engine. In general, the Edelbrock carbs run too rich with
> the
>> >> factory set up. Normally they will require a metering rod change, and
>> > maybe
>> >> a jet change as well. You also don't specify the cam specs.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
>
yes, they are basically the same carb inside. I believe the jets and rods
interchange, but I'm not positive on that. I do know that the Edelbrock carb
is heavily based on the Carter design. If you understand basic carb
functioning, and what the rods and jets do for the mixture, it will be a
simple process to get it dialed in. If you ruin in to problems, I'm sure we
can get you going in the right direction. Also, there is a book available
called Carter Carb Tuning. Most of it will apply to the Edelbrock as well. I
had the book at one time, but loaned it out and never got it back. I do know
that the book is very thorough.
Chris
"Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
news:FiGLg.14805$r61.8273@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
> Thanks. Looks like perhaps I should have ordered the calibration kit in
> retrospect. Anyhow, after a 2 week wait, it has arrived so I'll fit at the
> weekend.
>
> Quite looking forward to it - my carb experience has been mainly with
> multiple SU's (single barrel downdraft) and the odd side draft Weber -
> never done anything on a 4 barrel like Holley or Edelbrock before.
>
> Dave Milne, Scotland
> '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
> "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
> news:1lDLg.1336$d72.134@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>> Dave,
>>
>> When the companies that make carb give them their initial settings from
> the
>> factory, they take all kinds of compromised in to consideration. They
> don't
>> know if the carb will be used on a large or small displacement engine, or
> if
>> it will be used in hot or cold climate, high altitude, etc. They also
> don't
>> know what other mods have been done to these engines. The baseline
> settings
>> they give these carbs will allow them to run on most of the applications
>> they will see, but they almost always require tuning to get them to be
>> optimal. My guess would be that this carb would still be a little rich,
> but
>> it is just a guess. I'm not saying it won't run, it will, and it will
>> probably be pretty damn close to right.
>>
>> The metering rod system that Carter/Edelbrock uses will "adjust" the
> mixture
>> based on engine vacuum. The rods are controlled by a piston and spring,
>> similar to many other carbs. When the engine vacuum is low, the metering
> rod
>> spring will start to overtake the vacuum pulling the piston down. The
>> rods
>> are tapered, and when they move up in the bore they are in, a smaller
>> diameter of the rod will still be inside the main jet, effectively
>> increasing the total main jet area that fuel can pass thru. If the engine
>> runs too rich at high vacuum conditions, but is ok at low vacuum or wide
>> open throttle, then you simply change the metering rod to on the has a
>> larger diameter on the part of the rod that is in the jet at high vacuum
>> conditions. It really is a simple process, and normally will only require
> 1
>> or 2 sets of rods to get the carb where you need it to be.
>>
>> Chris
>>
>>
>> "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
>> news:OeuLg.14311$r61.1621@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
>> > Any idea if the Edelbrock 600cfm 1405 Performer + Edelbrock 2131
> manifold
>> > will require a metering or jet change on a stock 360 '91 Grand Wagoneer
> ?
>> >
>> >
>> > Dave Milne, Scotland
>> > '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
>> > "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
>> > news:cliLg.1294$d72.56@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>> >> Without knowing what size carb, choke or no choke, and which manifold,
> it
>> > is
>> >> hard to tell you what the problem could be. What I can tell you is
>> >> that
>> >> Edelbrock and Holley carbs are both set up from the factory with a
>> >> general
>> >> tune. This mean the carb may or may not need to be set up properly for
>> > your
>> >> particular engine. In general, the Edelbrock carbs run too rich with
> the
>> >> factory set up. Normally they will require a metering rod change, and
>> > maybe
>> >> a jet change as well. You also don't specify the cam specs.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
>
09-07-2006, 02:51 AM
#34
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: '79 304 Edelbrock carb problems vs Holley carbs?
Dave, you shouldn't have a problem tuning the Carter/Edelbrock carb, and
yes, they are basically the same carb inside. I believe the jets and rods
interchange, but I'm not positive on that. I do know that the Edelbrock carb
is heavily based on the Carter design. If you understand basic carb
functioning, and what the rods and jets do for the mixture, it will be a
simple process to get it dialed in. If you ruin in to problems, I'm sure we
can get you going in the right direction. Also, there is a book available
called Carter Carb Tuning. Most of it will apply to the Edelbrock as well. I
had the book at one time, but loaned it out and never got it back. I do know
that the book is very thorough.
Chris
"Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
news:FiGLg.14805$r61.8273@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
> Thanks. Looks like perhaps I should have ordered the calibration kit in
> retrospect. Anyhow, after a 2 week wait, it has arrived so I'll fit at the
> weekend.
>
> Quite looking forward to it - my carb experience has been mainly with
> multiple SU's (single barrel downdraft) and the odd side draft Weber -
> never done anything on a 4 barrel like Holley or Edelbrock before.
>
> Dave Milne, Scotland
> '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
> "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
> news:1lDLg.1336$d72.134@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>> Dave,
>>
>> When the companies that make carb give them their initial settings from
> the
>> factory, they take all kinds of compromised in to consideration. They
> don't
>> know if the carb will be used on a large or small displacement engine, or
> if
>> it will be used in hot or cold climate, high altitude, etc. They also
> don't
>> know what other mods have been done to these engines. The baseline
> settings
>> they give these carbs will allow them to run on most of the applications
>> they will see, but they almost always require tuning to get them to be
>> optimal. My guess would be that this carb would still be a little rich,
> but
>> it is just a guess. I'm not saying it won't run, it will, and it will
>> probably be pretty damn close to right.
>>
>> The metering rod system that Carter/Edelbrock uses will "adjust" the
> mixture
>> based on engine vacuum. The rods are controlled by a piston and spring,
>> similar to many other carbs. When the engine vacuum is low, the metering
> rod
>> spring will start to overtake the vacuum pulling the piston down. The
>> rods
>> are tapered, and when they move up in the bore they are in, a smaller
>> diameter of the rod will still be inside the main jet, effectively
>> increasing the total main jet area that fuel can pass thru. If the engine
>> runs too rich at high vacuum conditions, but is ok at low vacuum or wide
>> open throttle, then you simply change the metering rod to on the has a
>> larger diameter on the part of the rod that is in the jet at high vacuum
>> conditions. It really is a simple process, and normally will only require
> 1
>> or 2 sets of rods to get the carb where you need it to be.
>>
>> Chris
>>
>>
>> "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
>> news:OeuLg.14311$r61.1621@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
>> > Any idea if the Edelbrock 600cfm 1405 Performer + Edelbrock 2131
> manifold
>> > will require a metering or jet change on a stock 360 '91 Grand Wagoneer
> ?
>> >
>> >
>> > Dave Milne, Scotland
>> > '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
>> > "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
>> > news:cliLg.1294$d72.56@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>> >> Without knowing what size carb, choke or no choke, and which manifold,
> it
>> > is
>> >> hard to tell you what the problem could be. What I can tell you is
>> >> that
>> >> Edelbrock and Holley carbs are both set up from the factory with a
>> >> general
>> >> tune. This mean the carb may or may not need to be set up properly for
>> > your
>> >> particular engine. In general, the Edelbrock carbs run too rich with
> the
>> >> factory set up. Normally they will require a metering rod change, and
>> > maybe
>> >> a jet change as well. You also don't specify the cam specs.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
>
yes, they are basically the same carb inside. I believe the jets and rods
interchange, but I'm not positive on that. I do know that the Edelbrock carb
is heavily based on the Carter design. If you understand basic carb
functioning, and what the rods and jets do for the mixture, it will be a
simple process to get it dialed in. If you ruin in to problems, I'm sure we
can get you going in the right direction. Also, there is a book available
called Carter Carb Tuning. Most of it will apply to the Edelbrock as well. I
had the book at one time, but loaned it out and never got it back. I do know
that the book is very thorough.
Chris
"Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
news:FiGLg.14805$r61.8273@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
> Thanks. Looks like perhaps I should have ordered the calibration kit in
> retrospect. Anyhow, after a 2 week wait, it has arrived so I'll fit at the
> weekend.
>
> Quite looking forward to it - my carb experience has been mainly with
> multiple SU's (single barrel downdraft) and the odd side draft Weber -
> never done anything on a 4 barrel like Holley or Edelbrock before.
>
> Dave Milne, Scotland
> '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
> "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
> news:1lDLg.1336$d72.134@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>> Dave,
>>
>> When the companies that make carb give them their initial settings from
> the
>> factory, they take all kinds of compromised in to consideration. They
> don't
>> know if the carb will be used on a large or small displacement engine, or
> if
>> it will be used in hot or cold climate, high altitude, etc. They also
> don't
>> know what other mods have been done to these engines. The baseline
> settings
>> they give these carbs will allow them to run on most of the applications
>> they will see, but they almost always require tuning to get them to be
>> optimal. My guess would be that this carb would still be a little rich,
> but
>> it is just a guess. I'm not saying it won't run, it will, and it will
>> probably be pretty damn close to right.
>>
>> The metering rod system that Carter/Edelbrock uses will "adjust" the
> mixture
>> based on engine vacuum. The rods are controlled by a piston and spring,
>> similar to many other carbs. When the engine vacuum is low, the metering
> rod
>> spring will start to overtake the vacuum pulling the piston down. The
>> rods
>> are tapered, and when they move up in the bore they are in, a smaller
>> diameter of the rod will still be inside the main jet, effectively
>> increasing the total main jet area that fuel can pass thru. If the engine
>> runs too rich at high vacuum conditions, but is ok at low vacuum or wide
>> open throttle, then you simply change the metering rod to on the has a
>> larger diameter on the part of the rod that is in the jet at high vacuum
>> conditions. It really is a simple process, and normally will only require
> 1
>> or 2 sets of rods to get the carb where you need it to be.
>>
>> Chris
>>
>>
>> "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
>> news:OeuLg.14311$r61.1621@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
>> > Any idea if the Edelbrock 600cfm 1405 Performer + Edelbrock 2131
> manifold
>> > will require a metering or jet change on a stock 360 '91 Grand Wagoneer
> ?
>> >
>> >
>> > Dave Milne, Scotland
>> > '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
>> > "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
>> > news:cliLg.1294$d72.56@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>> >> Without knowing what size carb, choke or no choke, and which manifold,
> it
>> > is
>> >> hard to tell you what the problem could be. What I can tell you is
>> >> that
>> >> Edelbrock and Holley carbs are both set up from the factory with a
>> >> general
>> >> tune. This mean the carb may or may not need to be set up properly for
>> > your
>> >> particular engine. In general, the Edelbrock carbs run too rich with
> the
>> >> factory set up. Normally they will require a metering rod change, and
>> > maybe
>> >> a jet change as well. You also don't specify the cam specs.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
>
09-07-2006, 03:52 AM
#35
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: '79 304 Edelbrock carb problems vs Holley carbs?
This one?
Super Tuning and Modifying Carter Carburetors for Performance,
Street and Off-Road Applications, Dave Emanuel
http://www.amazon.com/o/ASIN/0931472113/
"c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
news:RjPLg.1352$d72.768@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> Dave, you shouldn't have a problem tuning the Carter/Edelbrock
> carb, and yes, they are basically the same carb inside. I
> believe the jets and rods interchange, but I'm not positive on
> that. I do know that the Edelbrock carb is heavily based on the
> Carter design. If you understand basic carb functioning, and
> what the rods and jets do for the mixture, it will be a simple
> process to get it dialed in. If you ruin in to problems, I'm
> sure we can get you going in the right direction. Also, there
> is a book available called Carter Carb Tuning. Most of it will
> apply to the Edelbrock as well. I had the book at one time, but
> loaned it out and never got it back. I do know that the book is
> very thorough.
>
> Chris
>
>
> "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
> news:FiGLg.14805$r61.8273@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
>> Thanks. Looks like perhaps I should have ordered the
>> calibration kit in
>> retrospect. Anyhow, after a 2 week wait, it has arrived so
>> I'll fit at the
>> weekend.
>>
>> Quite looking forward to it - my carb experience has been
>> mainly with
>> multiple SU's (single barrel downdraft) and the odd side
>> draft Weber -
>> never done anything on a 4 barrel like Holley or Edelbrock
>> before.
>>
>> Dave Milne, Scotland
>> '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
>> "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
>> news:1lDLg.1336$d72.134@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>>> Dave,
>>>
>>> When the companies that make carb give them their initial
>>> settings from
>> the
>>> factory, they take all kinds of compromised in to
>>> consideration. They
>> don't
>>> know if the carb will be used on a large or small
>>> displacement engine, or
>> if
>>> it will be used in hot or cold climate, high altitude, etc.
>>> They also
>> don't
>>> know what other mods have been done to these engines. The
>>> baseline
>> settings
>>> they give these carbs will allow them to run on most of the
>>> applications
>>> they will see, but they almost always require tuning to get
>>> them to be
>>> optimal. My guess would be that this carb would still be a
>>> little rich,
>> but
>>> it is just a guess. I'm not saying it won't run, it will, and
>>> it will
>>> probably be pretty damn close to right.
>>>
>>> The metering rod system that Carter/Edelbrock uses will
>>> "adjust" the
>> mixture
>>> based on engine vacuum. The rods are controlled by a piston
>>> and spring,
>>> similar to many other carbs. When the engine vacuum is low,
>>> the metering
>> rod
>>> spring will start to overtake the vacuum pulling the piston
>>> down. The rods
>>> are tapered, and when they move up in the bore they are in, a
>>> smaller
>>> diameter of the rod will still be inside the main jet,
>>> effectively
>>> increasing the total main jet area that fuel can pass thru.
>>> If the engine
>>> runs too rich at high vacuum conditions, but is ok at low
>>> vacuum or wide
>>> open throttle, then you simply change the metering rod to on
>>> the has a
>>> larger diameter on the part of the rod that is in the jet at
>>> high vacuum
>>> conditions. It really is a simple process, and normally will
>>> only require
>> 1
>>> or 2 sets of rods to get the carb where you need it to be.
>>>
>>> Chris
>>>
>>>
>>> "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
>>> news:OeuLg.14311$r61.1621@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
>>> > Any idea if the Edelbrock 600cfm 1405 Performer + Edelbrock
>>> > 2131
>> manifold
>>> > will require a metering or jet change on a stock 360 '91
>>> > Grand Wagoneer
>> ?
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Dave Milne, Scotland
>>> > '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
>>> > "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
>>> > news:cliLg.1294$d72.56@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>>> >> Without knowing what size carb, choke or no choke, and
>>> >> which manifold,
>> it
>>> > is
>>> >> hard to tell you what the problem could be. What I can
>>> >> tell you is that
>>> >> Edelbrock and Holley carbs are both set up from the
>>> >> factory with a
>>> >> general
>>> >> tune. This mean the carb may or may not need to be set up
>>> >> properly for
>>> > your
>>> >> particular engine. In general, the Edelbrock carbs run too
>>> >> rich with
>> the
>>> >> factory set up. Normally they will require a metering rod
>>> >> change, and
>>> > maybe
>>> >> a jet change as well. You also don't specify the cam
>>> >> specs.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
Super Tuning and Modifying Carter Carburetors for Performance,
Street and Off-Road Applications, Dave Emanuel
http://www.amazon.com/o/ASIN/0931472113/
"c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
news:RjPLg.1352$d72.768@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> Dave, you shouldn't have a problem tuning the Carter/Edelbrock
> carb, and yes, they are basically the same carb inside. I
> believe the jets and rods interchange, but I'm not positive on
> that. I do know that the Edelbrock carb is heavily based on the
> Carter design. If you understand basic carb functioning, and
> what the rods and jets do for the mixture, it will be a simple
> process to get it dialed in. If you ruin in to problems, I'm
> sure we can get you going in the right direction. Also, there
> is a book available called Carter Carb Tuning. Most of it will
> apply to the Edelbrock as well. I had the book at one time, but
> loaned it out and never got it back. I do know that the book is
> very thorough.
>
> Chris
>
>
> "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
> news:FiGLg.14805$r61.8273@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
>> Thanks. Looks like perhaps I should have ordered the
>> calibration kit in
>> retrospect. Anyhow, after a 2 week wait, it has arrived so
>> I'll fit at the
>> weekend.
>>
>> Quite looking forward to it - my carb experience has been
>> mainly with
>> multiple SU's (single barrel downdraft) and the odd side
>> draft Weber -
>> never done anything on a 4 barrel like Holley or Edelbrock
>> before.
>>
>> Dave Milne, Scotland
>> '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
>> "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
>> news:1lDLg.1336$d72.134@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>>> Dave,
>>>
>>> When the companies that make carb give them their initial
>>> settings from
>> the
>>> factory, they take all kinds of compromised in to
>>> consideration. They
>> don't
>>> know if the carb will be used on a large or small
>>> displacement engine, or
>> if
>>> it will be used in hot or cold climate, high altitude, etc.
>>> They also
>> don't
>>> know what other mods have been done to these engines. The
>>> baseline
>> settings
>>> they give these carbs will allow them to run on most of the
>>> applications
>>> they will see, but they almost always require tuning to get
>>> them to be
>>> optimal. My guess would be that this carb would still be a
>>> little rich,
>> but
>>> it is just a guess. I'm not saying it won't run, it will, and
>>> it will
>>> probably be pretty damn close to right.
>>>
>>> The metering rod system that Carter/Edelbrock uses will
>>> "adjust" the
>> mixture
>>> based on engine vacuum. The rods are controlled by a piston
>>> and spring,
>>> similar to many other carbs. When the engine vacuum is low,
>>> the metering
>> rod
>>> spring will start to overtake the vacuum pulling the piston
>>> down. The rods
>>> are tapered, and when they move up in the bore they are in, a
>>> smaller
>>> diameter of the rod will still be inside the main jet,
>>> effectively
>>> increasing the total main jet area that fuel can pass thru.
>>> If the engine
>>> runs too rich at high vacuum conditions, but is ok at low
>>> vacuum or wide
>>> open throttle, then you simply change the metering rod to on
>>> the has a
>>> larger diameter on the part of the rod that is in the jet at
>>> high vacuum
>>> conditions. It really is a simple process, and normally will
>>> only require
>> 1
>>> or 2 sets of rods to get the carb where you need it to be.
>>>
>>> Chris
>>>
>>>
>>> "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
>>> news:OeuLg.14311$r61.1621@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
>>> > Any idea if the Edelbrock 600cfm 1405 Performer + Edelbrock
>>> > 2131
>> manifold
>>> > will require a metering or jet change on a stock 360 '91
>>> > Grand Wagoneer
>> ?
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Dave Milne, Scotland
>>> > '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
>>> > "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
>>> > news:cliLg.1294$d72.56@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>>> >> Without knowing what size carb, choke or no choke, and
>>> >> which manifold,
>> it
>>> > is
>>> >> hard to tell you what the problem could be. What I can
>>> >> tell you is that
>>> >> Edelbrock and Holley carbs are both set up from the
>>> >> factory with a
>>> >> general
>>> >> tune. This mean the carb may or may not need to be set up
>>> >> properly for
>>> > your
>>> >> particular engine. In general, the Edelbrock carbs run too
>>> >> rich with
>> the
>>> >> factory set up. Normally they will require a metering rod
>>> >> change, and
>>> > maybe
>>> >> a jet change as well. You also don't specify the cam
>>> >> specs.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
09-07-2006, 03:52 AM
#36
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: '79 304 Edelbrock carb problems vs Holley carbs?
This one?
Super Tuning and Modifying Carter Carburetors for Performance,
Street and Off-Road Applications, Dave Emanuel
http://www.amazon.com/o/ASIN/0931472113/
"c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
news:RjPLg.1352$d72.768@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> Dave, you shouldn't have a problem tuning the Carter/Edelbrock
> carb, and yes, they are basically the same carb inside. I
> believe the jets and rods interchange, but I'm not positive on
> that. I do know that the Edelbrock carb is heavily based on the
> Carter design. If you understand basic carb functioning, and
> what the rods and jets do for the mixture, it will be a simple
> process to get it dialed in. If you ruin in to problems, I'm
> sure we can get you going in the right direction. Also, there
> is a book available called Carter Carb Tuning. Most of it will
> apply to the Edelbrock as well. I had the book at one time, but
> loaned it out and never got it back. I do know that the book is
> very thorough.
>
> Chris
>
>
> "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
> news:FiGLg.14805$r61.8273@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
>> Thanks. Looks like perhaps I should have ordered the
>> calibration kit in
>> retrospect. Anyhow, after a 2 week wait, it has arrived so
>> I'll fit at the
>> weekend.
>>
>> Quite looking forward to it - my carb experience has been
>> mainly with
>> multiple SU's (single barrel downdraft) and the odd side
>> draft Weber -
>> never done anything on a 4 barrel like Holley or Edelbrock
>> before.
>>
>> Dave Milne, Scotland
>> '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
>> "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
>> news:1lDLg.1336$d72.134@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>>> Dave,
>>>
>>> When the companies that make carb give them their initial
>>> settings from
>> the
>>> factory, they take all kinds of compromised in to
>>> consideration. They
>> don't
>>> know if the carb will be used on a large or small
>>> displacement engine, or
>> if
>>> it will be used in hot or cold climate, high altitude, etc.
>>> They also
>> don't
>>> know what other mods have been done to these engines. The
>>> baseline
>> settings
>>> they give these carbs will allow them to run on most of the
>>> applications
>>> they will see, but they almost always require tuning to get
>>> them to be
>>> optimal. My guess would be that this carb would still be a
>>> little rich,
>> but
>>> it is just a guess. I'm not saying it won't run, it will, and
>>> it will
>>> probably be pretty damn close to right.
>>>
>>> The metering rod system that Carter/Edelbrock uses will
>>> "adjust" the
>> mixture
>>> based on engine vacuum. The rods are controlled by a piston
>>> and spring,
>>> similar to many other carbs. When the engine vacuum is low,
>>> the metering
>> rod
>>> spring will start to overtake the vacuum pulling the piston
>>> down. The rods
>>> are tapered, and when they move up in the bore they are in, a
>>> smaller
>>> diameter of the rod will still be inside the main jet,
>>> effectively
>>> increasing the total main jet area that fuel can pass thru.
>>> If the engine
>>> runs too rich at high vacuum conditions, but is ok at low
>>> vacuum or wide
>>> open throttle, then you simply change the metering rod to on
>>> the has a
>>> larger diameter on the part of the rod that is in the jet at
>>> high vacuum
>>> conditions. It really is a simple process, and normally will
>>> only require
>> 1
>>> or 2 sets of rods to get the carb where you need it to be.
>>>
>>> Chris
>>>
>>>
>>> "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
>>> news:OeuLg.14311$r61.1621@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
>>> > Any idea if the Edelbrock 600cfm 1405 Performer + Edelbrock
>>> > 2131
>> manifold
>>> > will require a metering or jet change on a stock 360 '91
>>> > Grand Wagoneer
>> ?
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Dave Milne, Scotland
>>> > '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
>>> > "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
>>> > news:cliLg.1294$d72.56@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>>> >> Without knowing what size carb, choke or no choke, and
>>> >> which manifold,
>> it
>>> > is
>>> >> hard to tell you what the problem could be. What I can
>>> >> tell you is that
>>> >> Edelbrock and Holley carbs are both set up from the
>>> >> factory with a
>>> >> general
>>> >> tune. This mean the carb may or may not need to be set up
>>> >> properly for
>>> > your
>>> >> particular engine. In general, the Edelbrock carbs run too
>>> >> rich with
>> the
>>> >> factory set up. Normally they will require a metering rod
>>> >> change, and
>>> > maybe
>>> >> a jet change as well. You also don't specify the cam
>>> >> specs.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
Super Tuning and Modifying Carter Carburetors for Performance,
Street and Off-Road Applications, Dave Emanuel
http://www.amazon.com/o/ASIN/0931472113/
"c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
news:RjPLg.1352$d72.768@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> Dave, you shouldn't have a problem tuning the Carter/Edelbrock
> carb, and yes, they are basically the same carb inside. I
> believe the jets and rods interchange, but I'm not positive on
> that. I do know that the Edelbrock carb is heavily based on the
> Carter design. If you understand basic carb functioning, and
> what the rods and jets do for the mixture, it will be a simple
> process to get it dialed in. If you ruin in to problems, I'm
> sure we can get you going in the right direction. Also, there
> is a book available called Carter Carb Tuning. Most of it will
> apply to the Edelbrock as well. I had the book at one time, but
> loaned it out and never got it back. I do know that the book is
> very thorough.
>
> Chris
>
>
> "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
> news:FiGLg.14805$r61.8273@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
>> Thanks. Looks like perhaps I should have ordered the
>> calibration kit in
>> retrospect. Anyhow, after a 2 week wait, it has arrived so
>> I'll fit at the
>> weekend.
>>
>> Quite looking forward to it - my carb experience has been
>> mainly with
>> multiple SU's (single barrel downdraft) and the odd side
>> draft Weber -
>> never done anything on a 4 barrel like Holley or Edelbrock
>> before.
>>
>> Dave Milne, Scotland
>> '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
>> "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
>> news:1lDLg.1336$d72.134@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>>> Dave,
>>>
>>> When the companies that make carb give them their initial
>>> settings from
>> the
>>> factory, they take all kinds of compromised in to
>>> consideration. They
>> don't
>>> know if the carb will be used on a large or small
>>> displacement engine, or
>> if
>>> it will be used in hot or cold climate, high altitude, etc.
>>> They also
>> don't
>>> know what other mods have been done to these engines. The
>>> baseline
>> settings
>>> they give these carbs will allow them to run on most of the
>>> applications
>>> they will see, but they almost always require tuning to get
>>> them to be
>>> optimal. My guess would be that this carb would still be a
>>> little rich,
>> but
>>> it is just a guess. I'm not saying it won't run, it will, and
>>> it will
>>> probably be pretty damn close to right.
>>>
>>> The metering rod system that Carter/Edelbrock uses will
>>> "adjust" the
>> mixture
>>> based on engine vacuum. The rods are controlled by a piston
>>> and spring,
>>> similar to many other carbs. When the engine vacuum is low,
>>> the metering
>> rod
>>> spring will start to overtake the vacuum pulling the piston
>>> down. The rods
>>> are tapered, and when they move up in the bore they are in, a
>>> smaller
>>> diameter of the rod will still be inside the main jet,
>>> effectively
>>> increasing the total main jet area that fuel can pass thru.
>>> If the engine
>>> runs too rich at high vacuum conditions, but is ok at low
>>> vacuum or wide
>>> open throttle, then you simply change the metering rod to on
>>> the has a
>>> larger diameter on the part of the rod that is in the jet at
>>> high vacuum
>>> conditions. It really is a simple process, and normally will
>>> only require
>> 1
>>> or 2 sets of rods to get the carb where you need it to be.
>>>
>>> Chris
>>>
>>>
>>> "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
>>> news:OeuLg.14311$r61.1621@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
>>> > Any idea if the Edelbrock 600cfm 1405 Performer + Edelbrock
>>> > 2131
>> manifold
>>> > will require a metering or jet change on a stock 360 '91
>>> > Grand Wagoneer
>> ?
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Dave Milne, Scotland
>>> > '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
>>> > "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
>>> > news:cliLg.1294$d72.56@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>>> >> Without knowing what size carb, choke or no choke, and
>>> >> which manifold,
>> it
>>> > is
>>> >> hard to tell you what the problem could be. What I can
>>> >> tell you is that
>>> >> Edelbrock and Holley carbs are both set up from the
>>> >> factory with a
>>> >> general
>>> >> tune. This mean the carb may or may not need to be set up
>>> >> properly for
>>> > your
>>> >> particular engine. In general, the Edelbrock carbs run too
>>> >> rich with
>> the
>>> >> factory set up. Normally they will require a metering rod
>>> >> change, and
>>> > maybe
>>> >> a jet change as well. You also don't specify the cam
>>> >> specs.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
09-07-2006, 03:52 AM
#37
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: '79 304 Edelbrock carb problems vs Holley carbs?
This one?
Super Tuning and Modifying Carter Carburetors for Performance,
Street and Off-Road Applications, Dave Emanuel
http://www.amazon.com/o/ASIN/0931472113/
"c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
news:RjPLg.1352$d72.768@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> Dave, you shouldn't have a problem tuning the Carter/Edelbrock
> carb, and yes, they are basically the same carb inside. I
> believe the jets and rods interchange, but I'm not positive on
> that. I do know that the Edelbrock carb is heavily based on the
> Carter design. If you understand basic carb functioning, and
> what the rods and jets do for the mixture, it will be a simple
> process to get it dialed in. If you ruin in to problems, I'm
> sure we can get you going in the right direction. Also, there
> is a book available called Carter Carb Tuning. Most of it will
> apply to the Edelbrock as well. I had the book at one time, but
> loaned it out and never got it back. I do know that the book is
> very thorough.
>
> Chris
>
>
> "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
> news:FiGLg.14805$r61.8273@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
>> Thanks. Looks like perhaps I should have ordered the
>> calibration kit in
>> retrospect. Anyhow, after a 2 week wait, it has arrived so
>> I'll fit at the
>> weekend.
>>
>> Quite looking forward to it - my carb experience has been
>> mainly with
>> multiple SU's (single barrel downdraft) and the odd side
>> draft Weber -
>> never done anything on a 4 barrel like Holley or Edelbrock
>> before.
>>
>> Dave Milne, Scotland
>> '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
>> "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
>> news:1lDLg.1336$d72.134@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>>> Dave,
>>>
>>> When the companies that make carb give them their initial
>>> settings from
>> the
>>> factory, they take all kinds of compromised in to
>>> consideration. They
>> don't
>>> know if the carb will be used on a large or small
>>> displacement engine, or
>> if
>>> it will be used in hot or cold climate, high altitude, etc.
>>> They also
>> don't
>>> know what other mods have been done to these engines. The
>>> baseline
>> settings
>>> they give these carbs will allow them to run on most of the
>>> applications
>>> they will see, but they almost always require tuning to get
>>> them to be
>>> optimal. My guess would be that this carb would still be a
>>> little rich,
>> but
>>> it is just a guess. I'm not saying it won't run, it will, and
>>> it will
>>> probably be pretty damn close to right.
>>>
>>> The metering rod system that Carter/Edelbrock uses will
>>> "adjust" the
>> mixture
>>> based on engine vacuum. The rods are controlled by a piston
>>> and spring,
>>> similar to many other carbs. When the engine vacuum is low,
>>> the metering
>> rod
>>> spring will start to overtake the vacuum pulling the piston
>>> down. The rods
>>> are tapered, and when they move up in the bore they are in, a
>>> smaller
>>> diameter of the rod will still be inside the main jet,
>>> effectively
>>> increasing the total main jet area that fuel can pass thru.
>>> If the engine
>>> runs too rich at high vacuum conditions, but is ok at low
>>> vacuum or wide
>>> open throttle, then you simply change the metering rod to on
>>> the has a
>>> larger diameter on the part of the rod that is in the jet at
>>> high vacuum
>>> conditions. It really is a simple process, and normally will
>>> only require
>> 1
>>> or 2 sets of rods to get the carb where you need it to be.
>>>
>>> Chris
>>>
>>>
>>> "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
>>> news:OeuLg.14311$r61.1621@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
>>> > Any idea if the Edelbrock 600cfm 1405 Performer + Edelbrock
>>> > 2131
>> manifold
>>> > will require a metering or jet change on a stock 360 '91
>>> > Grand Wagoneer
>> ?
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Dave Milne, Scotland
>>> > '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
>>> > "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
>>> > news:cliLg.1294$d72.56@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>>> >> Without knowing what size carb, choke or no choke, and
>>> >> which manifold,
>> it
>>> > is
>>> >> hard to tell you what the problem could be. What I can
>>> >> tell you is that
>>> >> Edelbrock and Holley carbs are both set up from the
>>> >> factory with a
>>> >> general
>>> >> tune. This mean the carb may or may not need to be set up
>>> >> properly for
>>> > your
>>> >> particular engine. In general, the Edelbrock carbs run too
>>> >> rich with
>> the
>>> >> factory set up. Normally they will require a metering rod
>>> >> change, and
>>> > maybe
>>> >> a jet change as well. You also don't specify the cam
>>> >> specs.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
Super Tuning and Modifying Carter Carburetors for Performance,
Street and Off-Road Applications, Dave Emanuel
http://www.amazon.com/o/ASIN/0931472113/
"c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
news:RjPLg.1352$d72.768@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> Dave, you shouldn't have a problem tuning the Carter/Edelbrock
> carb, and yes, they are basically the same carb inside. I
> believe the jets and rods interchange, but I'm not positive on
> that. I do know that the Edelbrock carb is heavily based on the
> Carter design. If you understand basic carb functioning, and
> what the rods and jets do for the mixture, it will be a simple
> process to get it dialed in. If you ruin in to problems, I'm
> sure we can get you going in the right direction. Also, there
> is a book available called Carter Carb Tuning. Most of it will
> apply to the Edelbrock as well. I had the book at one time, but
> loaned it out and never got it back. I do know that the book is
> very thorough.
>
> Chris
>
>
> "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
> news:FiGLg.14805$r61.8273@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
>> Thanks. Looks like perhaps I should have ordered the
>> calibration kit in
>> retrospect. Anyhow, after a 2 week wait, it has arrived so
>> I'll fit at the
>> weekend.
>>
>> Quite looking forward to it - my carb experience has been
>> mainly with
>> multiple SU's (single barrel downdraft) and the odd side
>> draft Weber -
>> never done anything on a 4 barrel like Holley or Edelbrock
>> before.
>>
>> Dave Milne, Scotland
>> '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
>> "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
>> news:1lDLg.1336$d72.134@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>>> Dave,
>>>
>>> When the companies that make carb give them their initial
>>> settings from
>> the
>>> factory, they take all kinds of compromised in to
>>> consideration. They
>> don't
>>> know if the carb will be used on a large or small
>>> displacement engine, or
>> if
>>> it will be used in hot or cold climate, high altitude, etc.
>>> They also
>> don't
>>> know what other mods have been done to these engines. The
>>> baseline
>> settings
>>> they give these carbs will allow them to run on most of the
>>> applications
>>> they will see, but they almost always require tuning to get
>>> them to be
>>> optimal. My guess would be that this carb would still be a
>>> little rich,
>> but
>>> it is just a guess. I'm not saying it won't run, it will, and
>>> it will
>>> probably be pretty damn close to right.
>>>
>>> The metering rod system that Carter/Edelbrock uses will
>>> "adjust" the
>> mixture
>>> based on engine vacuum. The rods are controlled by a piston
>>> and spring,
>>> similar to many other carbs. When the engine vacuum is low,
>>> the metering
>> rod
>>> spring will start to overtake the vacuum pulling the piston
>>> down. The rods
>>> are tapered, and when they move up in the bore they are in, a
>>> smaller
>>> diameter of the rod will still be inside the main jet,
>>> effectively
>>> increasing the total main jet area that fuel can pass thru.
>>> If the engine
>>> runs too rich at high vacuum conditions, but is ok at low
>>> vacuum or wide
>>> open throttle, then you simply change the metering rod to on
>>> the has a
>>> larger diameter on the part of the rod that is in the jet at
>>> high vacuum
>>> conditions. It really is a simple process, and normally will
>>> only require
>> 1
>>> or 2 sets of rods to get the carb where you need it to be.
>>>
>>> Chris
>>>
>>>
>>> "Dave Milne" <jeep@_nospam_milne.info> wrote in message
>>> news:OeuLg.14311$r61.1621@text.news.blueyonder.co. uk...
>>> > Any idea if the Edelbrock 600cfm 1405 Performer + Edelbrock
>>> > 2131
>> manifold
>>> > will require a metering or jet change on a stock 360 '91
>>> > Grand Wagoneer
>> ?
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Dave Milne, Scotland
>>> > '91 Grand Wagoneer, '99 TJ
>>> > "c" <c@me.org> wrote in message
>>> > news:cliLg.1294$d72.56@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>>> >> Without knowing what size carb, choke or no choke, and
>>> >> which manifold,
>> it
>>> > is
>>> >> hard to tell you what the problem could be. What I can
>>> >> tell you is that
>>> >> Edelbrock and Holley carbs are both set up from the
>>> >> factory with a
>>> >> general
>>> >> tune. This mean the carb may or may not need to be set up
>>> >> properly for
>>> > your
>>> >> particular engine. In general, the Edelbrock carbs run too
>>> >> rich with
>> the
>>> >> factory set up. Normally they will require a metering rod
>>> >> change, and
>>> > maybe
>>> >> a jet change as well. You also don't specify the cam
>>> >> specs.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
09-07-2006, 04:19 AM
#38
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: '79 304 Edelbrock carb problems vs Holley carbs?
AFB: http://www.carburetorfactory.com/expvw04.html
God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
c wrote:
>
> Dave, you shouldn't have a problem tuning the Carter/Edelbrock carb, and
> yes, they are basically the same carb inside. I believe the jets and rods
> interchange, but I'm not positive on that. I do know that the Edelbrock carb
> is heavily based on the Carter design. If you understand basic carb
> functioning, and what the rods and jets do for the mixture, it will be a
> simple process to get it dialed in. If you ruin in to problems, I'm sure we
> can get you going in the right direction. Also, there is a book available
> called Carter Carb Tuning. Most of it will apply to the Edelbrock as well. I
> had the book at one time, but loaned it out and never got it back. I do know
> that the book is very thorough.
>
> Chris
God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
c wrote:
>
> Dave, you shouldn't have a problem tuning the Carter/Edelbrock carb, and
> yes, they are basically the same carb inside. I believe the jets and rods
> interchange, but I'm not positive on that. I do know that the Edelbrock carb
> is heavily based on the Carter design. If you understand basic carb
> functioning, and what the rods and jets do for the mixture, it will be a
> simple process to get it dialed in. If you ruin in to problems, I'm sure we
> can get you going in the right direction. Also, there is a book available
> called Carter Carb Tuning. Most of it will apply to the Edelbrock as well. I
> had the book at one time, but loaned it out and never got it back. I do know
> that the book is very thorough.
>
> Chris
09-07-2006, 04:19 AM
#39
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: '79 304 Edelbrock carb problems vs Holley carbs?
AFB: http://www.carburetorfactory.com/expvw04.html
God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
c wrote:
>
> Dave, you shouldn't have a problem tuning the Carter/Edelbrock carb, and
> yes, they are basically the same carb inside. I believe the jets and rods
> interchange, but I'm not positive on that. I do know that the Edelbrock carb
> is heavily based on the Carter design. If you understand basic carb
> functioning, and what the rods and jets do for the mixture, it will be a
> simple process to get it dialed in. If you ruin in to problems, I'm sure we
> can get you going in the right direction. Also, there is a book available
> called Carter Carb Tuning. Most of it will apply to the Edelbrock as well. I
> had the book at one time, but loaned it out and never got it back. I do know
> that the book is very thorough.
>
> Chris
God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
c wrote:
>
> Dave, you shouldn't have a problem tuning the Carter/Edelbrock carb, and
> yes, they are basically the same carb inside. I believe the jets and rods
> interchange, but I'm not positive on that. I do know that the Edelbrock carb
> is heavily based on the Carter design. If you understand basic carb
> functioning, and what the rods and jets do for the mixture, it will be a
> simple process to get it dialed in. If you ruin in to problems, I'm sure we
> can get you going in the right direction. Also, there is a book available
> called Carter Carb Tuning. Most of it will apply to the Edelbrock as well. I
> had the book at one time, but loaned it out and never got it back. I do know
> that the book is very thorough.
>
> Chris
09-07-2006, 04:19 AM
#40
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: '79 304 Edelbrock carb problems vs Holley carbs?
AFB: http://www.carburetorfactory.com/expvw04.html
God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
c wrote:
>
> Dave, you shouldn't have a problem tuning the Carter/Edelbrock carb, and
> yes, they are basically the same carb inside. I believe the jets and rods
> interchange, but I'm not positive on that. I do know that the Edelbrock carb
> is heavily based on the Carter design. If you understand basic carb
> functioning, and what the rods and jets do for the mixture, it will be a
> simple process to get it dialed in. If you ruin in to problems, I'm sure we
> can get you going in the right direction. Also, there is a book available
> called Carter Carb Tuning. Most of it will apply to the Edelbrock as well. I
> had the book at one time, but loaned it out and never got it back. I do know
> that the book is very thorough.
>
> Chris
God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
c wrote:
>
> Dave, you shouldn't have a problem tuning the Carter/Edelbrock carb, and
> yes, they are basically the same carb inside. I believe the jets and rods
> interchange, but I'm not positive on that. I do know that the Edelbrock carb
> is heavily based on the Carter design. If you understand basic carb
> functioning, and what the rods and jets do for the mixture, it will be a
> simple process to get it dialed in. If you ruin in to problems, I'm sure we
> can get you going in the right direction. Also, there is a book available
> called Carter Carb Tuning. Most of it will apply to the Edelbrock as well. I
> had the book at one time, but loaned it out and never got it back. I do know
> that the book is very thorough.
>
> Chris