Water Wetter
 

The recent thread on aluminum radiators inspired me to go back and
look at some older discussions on radiators. One thing I saw
mentioned frequently is that in warm climates, if cooling is an issue,
you're better off running 100% water and maybe a bottle of water
wetter, rather than the more common car mixture of 50/50 water and
antifreeze. This is due to the better cooling properties of pure
water.

So far so good. BUT... in addition to preventing your coolant water
from turning to ice, isn't there another very important function of
antifreeze? Namely, it keeps the innards of your radiator from
rusting. I would think that running mostly or 100% water all the time
would turn your cooling system guts to sludge... wouldn't it?

Re: Water Wetter
 

That stuff is for racing engines.

I don't like their 'snake oil' like claims.

I read their site carefully.

If you have an overheating problem, something mechanical is broke or not
working right or not built right, like my 2 core rad with the winch and
lights blocking it, I need a 4 core for 'my' application in hot weather.

I bitched about my 2 core rad running too cold for heat inside in the
winter before I got the winch and lights.

You can chase symptoms forever, when fixing the cause is sooo much
easier....

Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

Joshua Nelson wrote:
>
> The recent thread on aluminum radiators inspired me to go back and
> look at some older discussions on radiators. One thing I saw
> mentioned frequently is that in warm climates, if cooling is an issue,
> you're better off running 100% water and maybe a bottle of water
> wetter, rather than the more common car mixture of 50/50 water and
> antifreeze. This is due to the better cooling properties of pure
> water.
>
> So far so good. BUT... in addition to preventing your coolant water
> from turning to ice, isn't there another very important function of
> antifreeze? Namely, it keeps the innards of your radiator from
> rusting. I would think that running mostly or 100% water all the time
> would turn your cooling system guts to sludge... wouldn't it?

Re: Water Wetter
 

That stuff is for racing engines.

I don't like their 'snake oil' like claims.

I read their site carefully.

If you have an overheating problem, something mechanical is broke or not
working right or not built right, like my 2 core rad with the winch and
lights blocking it, I need a 4 core for 'my' application in hot weather.

I bitched about my 2 core rad running too cold for heat inside in the
winter before I got the winch and lights.

You can chase symptoms forever, when fixing the cause is sooo much
easier....

Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

Joshua Nelson wrote:
>
> The recent thread on aluminum radiators inspired me to go back and
> look at some older discussions on radiators. One thing I saw
> mentioned frequently is that in warm climates, if cooling is an issue,
> you're better off running 100% water and maybe a bottle of water
> wetter, rather than the more common car mixture of 50/50 water and
> antifreeze. This is due to the better cooling properties of pure
> water.
>
> So far so good. BUT... in addition to preventing your coolant water
> from turning to ice, isn't there another very important function of
> antifreeze? Namely, it keeps the innards of your radiator from
> rusting. I would think that running mostly or 100% water all the time
> would turn your cooling system guts to sludge... wouldn't it?

Re: Water Wetter
 

Snake oil & "splitting hairs" advice.

What make a radiator degrade in performance is the 'salts' drop out of
the (tap) water and foul the radiator surfaces. Either 1. use at least
demineralized water or 2. Periodically desalt/descale the
engine/radiator with boiler descaler products such as Marsolve® or
Rydlyme® (not muriatic or other inorganic acid).

What 'antifreeze' does is raise the temperature at which the coolant
boils and lowers the temperature at which it freezes. The raising of
boiling temperature is quite beneficial. The slight lessening of
thermodynamic efficiency is minimal. But but but.... anti freeze
contains rust corrosion inhibiters !!!!!! An engine run on pure water
will start to corrode internally MUST faster and to a greater degree
than one with such inhibiters.


Joshua Nelson wrote:
> The recent thread on aluminum radiators inspired me to go back and
> look at some older discussions on radiators. One thing I saw
> mentioned frequently is that in warm climates, if cooling is an issue,
> you're better off running 100% water and maybe a bottle of water
> wetter, rather than the more common car mixture of 50/50 water and
> antifreeze. This is due to the better cooling properties of pure
> water.
>
> So far so good. BUT... in addition to preventing your coolant water
> from turning to ice, isn't there another very important function of
> antifreeze? Namely, it keeps the innards of your radiator from
> rusting. I would think that running mostly or 100% water all the time
> would turn your cooling system guts to sludge... wouldn't it?

Re: Water Wetter
 

Snake oil & "splitting hairs" advice.

What make a radiator degrade in performance is the 'salts' drop out of
the (tap) water and foul the radiator surfaces. Either 1. use at least
demineralized water or 2. Periodically desalt/descale the
engine/radiator with boiler descaler products such as Marsolve® or
Rydlyme® (not muriatic or other inorganic acid).

What 'antifreeze' does is raise the temperature at which the coolant
boils and lowers the temperature at which it freezes. The raising of
boiling temperature is quite beneficial. The slight lessening of
thermodynamic efficiency is minimal. But but but.... anti freeze
contains rust corrosion inhibiters !!!!!! An engine run on pure water
will start to corrode internally MUST faster and to a greater degree
than one with such inhibiters.


Joshua Nelson wrote:
> The recent thread on aluminum radiators inspired me to go back and
> look at some older discussions on radiators. One thing I saw
> mentioned frequently is that in warm climates, if cooling is an issue,
> you're better off running 100% water and maybe a bottle of water
> wetter, rather than the more common car mixture of 50/50 water and
> antifreeze. This is due to the better cooling properties of pure
> water.
>
> So far so good. BUT... in addition to preventing your coolant water
> from turning to ice, isn't there another very important function of
> antifreeze? Namely, it keeps the innards of your radiator from
> rusting. I would think that running mostly or 100% water all the time
> would turn your cooling system guts to sludge... wouldn't it?

Re: Water Wetter
 

Back in the days when the wheel was first invented, we only used water in
radiators, and we made lots of money every year flushing systems for people,
and replacing stuff like freeze plugs that either rotted out or got pushed
out from frozen water in the block.

With the advent of Aluminum, it was discovered that the water actually
rotted the aluminum and constantly ate away at it. Soon they discovered that
anti freeze not only would keep from freezing, it also did not eat stuff
like freeze plugs and aluminum. And, it didn't rust either. Sheesh, all this
benefit and virtually no downside, except for the environmental issues that
is.

So, in the desert southwest where there is virtually no chance of freezing,
it is true that you do not need anti freeze because you are worried about
pushing the freeze plugs out. But, you might want anti freeze if you were
worried that you were going to corrode the insides of the engine block or
heads.

Even back in the olden days, it wasn't the radiator that rusted so much as
it was the rest of the engine that rusted and the rust got stuck in the
radiator. Yes, sometimes the radiator would rust out, and that still happens
today. But, the fact is that most rust in the radiator is merely stuck
there, it came from somewhere else.




"Joshua Nelson" <spam_box@ev1.net> wrote in message
news:b102b6e4.0309111216.5cea91c9@posting.google.c om...
> The recent thread on aluminum radiators inspired me to go back and
> look at some older discussions on radiators. One thing I saw
> mentioned frequently is that in warm climates, if cooling is an issue,
> you're better off running 100% water and maybe a bottle of water
> wetter, rather than the more common car mixture of 50/50 water and
> antifreeze. This is due to the better cooling properties of pure
> water.
>
> So far so good. BUT... in addition to preventing your coolant water
> from turning to ice, isn't there another very important function of
> antifreeze? Namely, it keeps the innards of your radiator from
> rusting. I would think that running mostly or 100% water all the time
> would turn your cooling system guts to sludge... wouldn't it?

Re: Water Wetter
 

Back in the days when the wheel was first invented, we only used water in
radiators, and we made lots of money every year flushing systems for people,
and replacing stuff like freeze plugs that either rotted out or got pushed
out from frozen water in the block.

With the advent of Aluminum, it was discovered that the water actually
rotted the aluminum and constantly ate away at it. Soon they discovered that
anti freeze not only would keep from freezing, it also did not eat stuff
like freeze plugs and aluminum. And, it didn't rust either. Sheesh, all this
benefit and virtually no downside, except for the environmental issues that
is.

So, in the desert southwest where there is virtually no chance of freezing,
it is true that you do not need anti freeze because you are worried about
pushing the freeze plugs out. But, you might want anti freeze if you were
worried that you were going to corrode the insides of the engine block or
heads.

Even back in the olden days, it wasn't the radiator that rusted so much as
it was the rest of the engine that rusted and the rust got stuck in the
radiator. Yes, sometimes the radiator would rust out, and that still happens
today. But, the fact is that most rust in the radiator is merely stuck
there, it came from somewhere else.




"Joshua Nelson" <spam_box@ev1.net> wrote in message
news:b102b6e4.0309111216.5cea91c9@posting.google.c om...
> The recent thread on aluminum radiators inspired me to go back and
> look at some older discussions on radiators. One thing I saw
> mentioned frequently is that in warm climates, if cooling is an issue,
> you're better off running 100% water and maybe a bottle of water
> wetter, rather than the more common car mixture of 50/50 water and
> antifreeze. This is due to the better cooling properties of pure
> water.
>
> So far so good. BUT... in addition to preventing your coolant water
> from turning to ice, isn't there another very important function of
> antifreeze? Namely, it keeps the innards of your radiator from
> rusting. I would think that running mostly or 100% water all the time
> would turn your cooling system guts to sludge... wouldn't it?

Re: Water Wetter
 

many exotic cars with Aluminium radiators, and steel blocks use a
sacrificial anode plug to stop electrolysis of the system components. I am
unsure about any wetting agents, but the natural tendency for you cooling
system to become a battery and dissolve itself is a worry greatly compounded
by aluminium components.




"Joshua Nelson" <spam_box@ev1.net> wrote in message
news:b102b6e4.0309111216.5cea91c9@posting.google.c om...
> The recent thread on aluminum radiators inspired me to go back and
> look at some older discussions on radiators. One thing I saw
> mentioned frequently is that in warm climates, if cooling is an issue,
> you're better off running 100% water and maybe a bottle of water
> wetter, rather than the more common car mixture of 50/50 water and
> antifreeze. This is due to the better cooling properties of pure
> water.
>
> So far so good. BUT... in addition to preventing your coolant water
> from turning to ice, isn't there another very important function of
> antifreeze? Namely, it keeps the innards of your radiator from
> rusting. I would think that running mostly or 100% water all the time
> would turn your cooling system guts to sludge... wouldn't it?

Re: Water Wetter
 

many exotic cars with Aluminium radiators, and steel blocks use a
sacrificial anode plug to stop electrolysis of the system components. I am
unsure about any wetting agents, but the natural tendency for you cooling
system to become a battery and dissolve itself is a worry greatly compounded
by aluminium components.




"Joshua Nelson" <spam_box@ev1.net> wrote in message
news:b102b6e4.0309111216.5cea91c9@posting.google.c om...
> The recent thread on aluminum radiators inspired me to go back and
> look at some older discussions on radiators. One thing I saw
> mentioned frequently is that in warm climates, if cooling is an issue,
> you're better off running 100% water and maybe a bottle of water
> wetter, rather than the more common car mixture of 50/50 water and
> antifreeze. This is due to the better cooling properties of pure
> water.
>
> So far so good. BUT... in addition to preventing your coolant water
> from turning to ice, isn't there another very important function of
> antifreeze? Namely, it keeps the innards of your radiator from
> rusting. I would think that running mostly or 100% water all the time
> would turn your cooling system guts to sludge... wouldn't it?

Re: Water Wetter
 

Zinc.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/

"A.H. MacIntosh aka USERNAME" wrote:
>
> many exotic cars with Aluminium radiators, and steel blocks use a
> sacrificial anode plug to stop electrolysis of the system components. I am
> unsure about any wetting agents, but the natural tendency for you cooling
> system to become a battery and dissolve itself is a worry greatly compounded
> by aluminium components.