Paul Brogren

Hi All,
If you've read any previous posts, you know where I'm with certain
adjustments. This is a good one. During a normal timing job I have always
disconnected the vacuum line from the distributor to adjust and set my curb
idle advance. This is what my manuals state.

Ok, Since I've now switched to manifold vacuum, which always supplies some
suction, do I need to adjust the timing using a connected vacuum tube or
just keep doing it as the books suggests?

--
Thanks Always !!!
Paul '75 CJ5 258
Vail, CO.

L.W.(=?iso-8859-1?Q?=DFill?=) Hughes III

Hi Paul,
The vacuum hose disconnected and plugged just like the timing
instructions say. Have the engine idling as slow as possible so the
centrifugal weights won't add any advance to your initial timing.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/

Paul Brogren wrote:
>
> Hi All,
> If you've read any previous posts, you know where I'm with certain
> adjustments. This is a good one. During a normal timing job I have always
> disconnected the vacuum line from the distributor to adjust and set my curb
> idle advance. This is what my manuals state.
>
> Ok, Since I've now switched to manifold vacuum, which always supplies some
> suction, do I need to adjust the timing using a connected vacuum tube or
> just keep doing it as the books suggests?
>
> --
> Thanks Always !!!
> Paul '75 CJ5 258
> Vail, CO.

L.W.(=?iso-8859-1?Q?=DFill?=) Hughes III

Hi Paul,
The vacuum hose disconnected and plugged just like the timing
instructions say. Have the engine idling as slow as possible so the
centrifugal weights won't add any advance to your initial timing.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/

Paul Brogren wrote:
>
> Hi All,
> If you've read any previous posts, you know where I'm with certain
> adjustments. This is a good one. During a normal timing job I have always
> disconnected the vacuum line from the distributor to adjust and set my curb
> idle advance. This is what my manuals state.
>
> Ok, Since I've now switched to manifold vacuum, which always supplies some
> suction, do I need to adjust the timing using a connected vacuum tube or
> just keep doing it as the books suggests?
>
> --
> Thanks Always !!!
> Paul '75 CJ5 258
> Vail, CO.

L.W.(=?iso-8859-1?Q?=DFill?=) Hughes III

Hi Paul,
The vacuum hose disconnected and plugged just like the timing
instructions say. Have the engine idling as slow as possible so the
centrifugal weights won't add any advance to your initial timing.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/

Paul Brogren wrote:
>
> Hi All,
> If you've read any previous posts, you know where I'm with certain
> adjustments. This is a good one. During a normal timing job I have always
> disconnected the vacuum line from the distributor to adjust and set my curb
> idle advance. This is what my manuals state.
>
> Ok, Since I've now switched to manifold vacuum, which always supplies some
> suction, do I need to adjust the timing using a connected vacuum tube or
> just keep doing it as the books suggests?
>
> --
> Thanks Always !!!
> Paul '75 CJ5 258
> Vail, CO.

Paul Brogren

That's what I did. I'm running 9 deg advance disconnected. And about 15
deg. approx, with the vacuum line to manifold. Send your Views.

--
Thanks Always !!!
Paul '75 CJ5 258
Vail, CO.
"L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
news:403AB723.17289EA@***.net...
> Hi Paul,
> The vacuum hose disconnected and plugged just like the timing
> instructions say. Have the engine idling as slow as possible so the
> centrifugal weights won't add any advance to your initial timing.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Paul Brogren wrote:
> >
> > Hi All,
> > If you've read any previous posts, you know where I'm with certain
> > adjustments. This is a good one. During a normal timing job I have
always
> > disconnected the vacuum line from the distributor to adjust and set my
curb
> > idle advance. This is what my manuals state.
> >
> > Ok, Since I've now switched to manifold vacuum, which always supplies
some
> > suction, do I need to adjust the timing using a connected vacuum tube or
> > just keep doing it as the books suggests?
> >
> > --
> > Thanks Always !!!
> > Paul '75 CJ5 258
> > Vail, CO.

Paul Brogren

That's what I did. I'm running 9 deg advance disconnected. And about 15
deg. approx, with the vacuum line to manifold. Send your Views.

--
Thanks Always !!!
Paul '75 CJ5 258
Vail, CO.
"L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
news:403AB723.17289EA@***.net...
> Hi Paul,
> The vacuum hose disconnected and plugged just like the timing
> instructions say. Have the engine idling as slow as possible so the
> centrifugal weights won't add any advance to your initial timing.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Paul Brogren wrote:
> >
> > Hi All,
> > If you've read any previous posts, you know where I'm with certain
> > adjustments. This is a good one. During a normal timing job I have
always
> > disconnected the vacuum line from the distributor to adjust and set my
curb
> > idle advance. This is what my manuals state.
> >
> > Ok, Since I've now switched to manifold vacuum, which always supplies
some
> > suction, do I need to adjust the timing using a connected vacuum tube or
> > just keep doing it as the books suggests?
> >
> > --
> > Thanks Always !!!
> > Paul '75 CJ5 258
> > Vail, CO.

Paul Brogren

That's what I did. I'm running 9 deg advance disconnected. And about 15
deg. approx, with the vacuum line to manifold. Send your Views.

--
Thanks Always !!!
Paul '75 CJ5 258
Vail, CO.
"L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
news:403AB723.17289EA@***.net...
> Hi Paul,
> The vacuum hose disconnected and plugged just like the timing
> instructions say. Have the engine idling as slow as possible so the
> centrifugal weights won't add any advance to your initial timing.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Paul Brogren wrote:
> >
> > Hi All,
> > If you've read any previous posts, you know where I'm with certain
> > adjustments. This is a good one. During a normal timing job I have
always
> > disconnected the vacuum line from the distributor to adjust and set my
curb
> > idle advance. This is what my manuals state.
> >
> > Ok, Since I've now switched to manifold vacuum, which always supplies
some
> > suction, do I need to adjust the timing using a connected vacuum tube or
> > just keep doing it as the books suggests?
> >
> > --
> > Thanks Always !!!
> > Paul '75 CJ5 258
> > Vail, CO.

Steve G

In as much as your change to the vacuum advance routing deviates from the
intended method of operation, why are you worrying about what is "correct"?
There is no correct procedure with present arrangement. The initial timing
adjustment is calculated taking into account the rate of advance of the
mechanical advance and the original vacuum advance rate at specific throttle
opening.
Personally, I'm not sure Iagree with this change of the vacuum system. This
situation of no vacuum to the advance at an idle is not a post emmissions
thing brought about to save the environment and take away our fun. Back in
the 50's and 60's,(that's as far back as I go) there were vehicles
configured both ways. They were designed to operate one way or the other.
One isn't better than the other, they're just different from one another.
When you consider that for one engine, say a 350 chev, there are probably
hundred's of different part numbers for vacuum advances with different
internal spring tensions and travel distances, how can something so
arbitrary as switching the vacuum source be expected to produce the correct
response.
Also, remember that when you have manifold vacuum at an idle to the
vacuum advance, the moment you start to accelerate the vacuum starts to drop
quickly and the timing starts to retard, not what you want to have happening
as you accelerate.
I think it gives the impression of a more efficient engine because the
engine speeds up as soon as you apply vacuum to the advance pot. Gotta be
good, right? Not necessarily. Your engine has to operate through it's
complete rpm range, not just idle.
If I was looking to do timing tricks, which I've done for over 30 years,
the first thing I would do is return the vacuum hoses back they way they
were. I would then purchase and install an advance curve kit in the
distributer, it simply replaces the springs and weights with lighter springs
and heavier weights, to get your mechanical advance to come all in sooner.
Then I'd put my timing light back in the box and throw my distributer wrench
on the seat and go for a ride. I would advance the timing until I could
hear it just start to ping under the heaviest loads I was likely to be
placing on it and lock the distributer down. Run it until it's good and
hot. Shut it off and let it sit a couple of minutes. If it starts okay,
just leave it. If it starts hard, firing against itself ( you can tell
this by short crank burst almost stopping in between when on the starter)
back the timing off until you just hit the point it is no longer firing
against itself. Now you have maximum efficiencey.
Steve
"Paul Brogren" <pibrogren@msn.com> wrote in message
news:c1e907$1fkd0a$1@ID-190695.news.uni-berlin.de...
> Hi All,
> If you've read any previous posts, you know where I'm with certain
> adjustments. This is a good one. During a normal timing job I have
always
> disconnected the vacuum line from the distributor to adjust and set my
curb
> idle advance. This is what my manuals state.
>
> Ok, Since I've now switched to manifold vacuum, which always supplies
some
> suction, do I need to adjust the timing using a connected vacuum tube or
> just keep doing it as the books suggests?
>
> --
> Thanks Always !!!
> Paul '75 CJ5 258
> Vail, CO.
>
>

Steve G

In as much as your change to the vacuum advance routing deviates from the
intended method of operation, why are you worrying about what is "correct"?
There is no correct procedure with present arrangement. The initial timing
adjustment is calculated taking into account the rate of advance of the
mechanical advance and the original vacuum advance rate at specific throttle
opening.
Personally, I'm not sure Iagree with this change of the vacuum system. This
situation of no vacuum to the advance at an idle is not a post emmissions
thing brought about to save the environment and take away our fun. Back in
the 50's and 60's,(that's as far back as I go) there were vehicles
configured both ways. They were designed to operate one way or the other.
One isn't better than the other, they're just different from one another.
When you consider that for one engine, say a 350 chev, there are probably
hundred's of different part numbers for vacuum advances with different
internal spring tensions and travel distances, how can something so
arbitrary as switching the vacuum source be expected to produce the correct
response.
Also, remember that when you have manifold vacuum at an idle to the
vacuum advance, the moment you start to accelerate the vacuum starts to drop
quickly and the timing starts to retard, not what you want to have happening
as you accelerate.
I think it gives the impression of a more efficient engine because the
engine speeds up as soon as you apply vacuum to the advance pot. Gotta be
good, right? Not necessarily. Your engine has to operate through it's
complete rpm range, not just idle.
If I was looking to do timing tricks, which I've done for over 30 years,
the first thing I would do is return the vacuum hoses back they way they
were. I would then purchase and install an advance curve kit in the
distributer, it simply replaces the springs and weights with lighter springs
and heavier weights, to get your mechanical advance to come all in sooner.
Then I'd put my timing light back in the box and throw my distributer wrench
on the seat and go for a ride. I would advance the timing until I could
hear it just start to ping under the heaviest loads I was likely to be
placing on it and lock the distributer down. Run it until it's good and
hot. Shut it off and let it sit a couple of minutes. If it starts okay,
just leave it. If it starts hard, firing against itself ( you can tell
this by short crank burst almost stopping in between when on the starter)
back the timing off until you just hit the point it is no longer firing
against itself. Now you have maximum efficiencey.
Steve
"Paul Brogren" <pibrogren@msn.com> wrote in message
news:c1e907$1fkd0a$1@ID-190695.news.uni-berlin.de...
> Hi All,
> If you've read any previous posts, you know where I'm with certain
> adjustments. This is a good one. During a normal timing job I have
always
> disconnected the vacuum line from the distributor to adjust and set my
curb
> idle advance. This is what my manuals state.
>
> Ok, Since I've now switched to manifold vacuum, which always supplies
some
> suction, do I need to adjust the timing using a connected vacuum tube or
> just keep doing it as the books suggests?
>
> --
> Thanks Always !!!
> Paul '75 CJ5 258
> Vail, CO.
>
>

Steve G

In as much as your change to the vacuum advance routing deviates from the
intended method of operation, why are you worrying about what is "correct"?
There is no correct procedure with present arrangement. The initial timing
adjustment is calculated taking into account the rate of advance of the
mechanical advance and the original vacuum advance rate at specific throttle
opening.
Personally, I'm not sure Iagree with this change of the vacuum system. This
situation of no vacuum to the advance at an idle is not a post emmissions
thing brought about to save the environment and take away our fun. Back in
the 50's and 60's,(that's as far back as I go) there were vehicles
configured both ways. They were designed to operate one way or the other.
One isn't better than the other, they're just different from one another.
When you consider that for one engine, say a 350 chev, there are probably
hundred's of different part numbers for vacuum advances with different
internal spring tensions and travel distances, how can something so
arbitrary as switching the vacuum source be expected to produce the correct
response.
Also, remember that when you have manifold vacuum at an idle to the
vacuum advance, the moment you start to accelerate the vacuum starts to drop
quickly and the timing starts to retard, not what you want to have happening
as you accelerate.
I think it gives the impression of a more efficient engine because the
engine speeds up as soon as you apply vacuum to the advance pot. Gotta be
good, right? Not necessarily. Your engine has to operate through it's
complete rpm range, not just idle.
If I was looking to do timing tricks, which I've done for over 30 years,
the first thing I would do is return the vacuum hoses back they way they
were. I would then purchase and install an advance curve kit in the
distributer, it simply replaces the springs and weights with lighter springs
and heavier weights, to get your mechanical advance to come all in sooner.
Then I'd put my timing light back in the box and throw my distributer wrench
on the seat and go for a ride. I would advance the timing until I could
hear it just start to ping under the heaviest loads I was likely to be
placing on it and lock the distributer down. Run it until it's good and
hot. Shut it off and let it sit a couple of minutes. If it starts okay,
just leave it. If it starts hard, firing against itself ( you can tell
this by short crank burst almost stopping in between when on the starter)
back the timing off until you just hit the point it is no longer firing
against itself. Now you have maximum efficiencey.
Steve
"Paul Brogren" <pibrogren@msn.com> wrote in message
news:c1e907$1fkd0a$1@ID-190695.news.uni-berlin.de...
> Hi All,
> If you've read any previous posts, you know where I'm with certain
> adjustments. This is a good one. During a normal timing job I have
always
> disconnected the vacuum line from the distributor to adjust and set my
curb
> idle advance. This is what my manuals state.
>
> Ok, Since I've now switched to manifold vacuum, which always supplies
some
> suction, do I need to adjust the timing using a connected vacuum tube or
> just keep doing it as the books suggests?
>
> --
> Thanks Always !!!
> Paul '75 CJ5 258
> Vail, CO.
>
>