mabar

Hi Brian:

When you remove the radiator cap to see how long it takes the engine to warm
up, the engine block is filled with coolant. The original question was about
an engine with NO coolant (radiator was removed.) An engine with no coolant
will overheat VERY QUICKLY.

I don't know how long exactly, but I'm pretty sure running it for a "few
minutes" with no coolant might destroy the engine. For my vehicle, I would
run it for no more than 30 seconds or so.

Tom

"Cherokee-LTD" <spammenot@home.com> wrote in message
news:QWMLb.76696$1g41.9250@twister01.bloor.is.net. cable.rogers.com...
> Not everybody dies from running with scissors. Unless all your vehicles
are
> supercharged nitro-burning funny cars you're pretty safe running them
longer
> than 30 seconds. When your engine is cold, remove the rad cap and see how
> long it takes for your thermostat to open. That will give you an
indication
> of how long it takes for your engine to detect warmth.
>
> By the way, the "removal of this tag is punishable by law" thing on sofa
> cushions and mattresses can be removed after you purchase them.
>
> -Brian
>
> "mabar" <mabar@NOSPAMgbronline.com> wrote in message
> news:8dudnaGeccHHy2KiRVn-tw@gbronline.com...
> : NO WAY should you drive it for a few minutes. The cylinder walls will
turn
> : red hot and the engine will seize and be destroyed.
> :
> : 30 seconds MAXIMUM without coolant for my vehicles.
> :
> : Tom
> :
> : "Cherokee-LTD" <spammenot@home.com> wrote in message
> : news:9EGLb.52125$AAe1.35813@news01.bloor.is.net.ca ble.rogers.com...
> : > If the engine is cold to begin with you can drive it for a few minutes
> : > without trouble.
> : > -Brian
> : >
> : > "aGraham" <aarongraham@mac.com.removeme> wrote in message
> : > news:aarongraham-140E34.16253909012004@corp-radius.supernews.com...
> : > : I am going to be pulling my radiator tomorrow to take it to get
fixed.
> : > : The problem is i then have to move the Jeep out of the shop until I
> get
> : > : the radiator back. I have to move the jeep about 30 yds, would it
be
> ok
> : > : to drive the Jeep this far with out any coolant and the radiator
> : > : removed?
> : > :
> : > : --
> : > : o_o_o_o
> : > : /| ,[_____],
> : > : |ŻŻŻL --O|||||||O-
> : > : ()_)Ż()_) ŻŻŻŻŻ )_)
> : >
> : >
> :
> :
>
>

mabar

Hi Brian:

When you remove the radiator cap to see how long it takes the engine to warm
up, the engine block is filled with coolant. The original question was about
an engine with NO coolant (radiator was removed.) An engine with no coolant
will overheat VERY QUICKLY.

I don't know how long exactly, but I'm pretty sure running it for a "few
minutes" with no coolant might destroy the engine. For my vehicle, I would
run it for no more than 30 seconds or so.

Tom

"Cherokee-LTD" <spammenot@home.com> wrote in message
news:QWMLb.76696$1g41.9250@twister01.bloor.is.net. cable.rogers.com...
> Not everybody dies from running with scissors. Unless all your vehicles
are
> supercharged nitro-burning funny cars you're pretty safe running them
longer
> than 30 seconds. When your engine is cold, remove the rad cap and see how
> long it takes for your thermostat to open. That will give you an
indication
> of how long it takes for your engine to detect warmth.
>
> By the way, the "removal of this tag is punishable by law" thing on sofa
> cushions and mattresses can be removed after you purchase them.
>
> -Brian
>
> "mabar" <mabar@NOSPAMgbronline.com> wrote in message
> news:8dudnaGeccHHy2KiRVn-tw@gbronline.com...
> : NO WAY should you drive it for a few minutes. The cylinder walls will
turn
> : red hot and the engine will seize and be destroyed.
> :
> : 30 seconds MAXIMUM without coolant for my vehicles.
> :
> : Tom
> :
> : "Cherokee-LTD" <spammenot@home.com> wrote in message
> : news:9EGLb.52125$AAe1.35813@news01.bloor.is.net.ca ble.rogers.com...
> : > If the engine is cold to begin with you can drive it for a few minutes
> : > without trouble.
> : > -Brian
> : >
> : > "aGraham" <aarongraham@mac.com.removeme> wrote in message
> : > news:aarongraham-140E34.16253909012004@corp-radius.supernews.com...
> : > : I am going to be pulling my radiator tomorrow to take it to get
fixed.
> : > : The problem is i then have to move the Jeep out of the shop until I
> get
> : > : the radiator back. I have to move the jeep about 30 yds, would it
be
> ok
> : > : to drive the Jeep this far with out any coolant and the radiator
> : > : removed?
> : > :
> : > : --
> : > : o_o_o_o
> : > : /| ,[_____],
> : > : |ŻŻŻL --O|||||||O-
> : > : ()_)Ż()_) ŻŻŻŻŻ )_)
> : >
> : >
> :
> :
>
>

mabar

Hi Brian:

When you remove the radiator cap to see how long it takes the engine to warm
up, the engine block is filled with coolant. The original question was about
an engine with NO coolant (radiator was removed.) An engine with no coolant
will overheat VERY QUICKLY.

I don't know how long exactly, but I'm pretty sure running it for a "few
minutes" with no coolant might destroy the engine. For my vehicle, I would
run it for no more than 30 seconds or so.

Tom

"Cherokee-LTD" <spammenot@home.com> wrote in message
news:QWMLb.76696$1g41.9250@twister01.bloor.is.net. cable.rogers.com...
> Not everybody dies from running with scissors. Unless all your vehicles
are
> supercharged nitro-burning funny cars you're pretty safe running them
longer
> than 30 seconds. When your engine is cold, remove the rad cap and see how
> long it takes for your thermostat to open. That will give you an
indication
> of how long it takes for your engine to detect warmth.
>
> By the way, the "removal of this tag is punishable by law" thing on sofa
> cushions and mattresses can be removed after you purchase them.
>
> -Brian
>
> "mabar" <mabar@NOSPAMgbronline.com> wrote in message
> news:8dudnaGeccHHy2KiRVn-tw@gbronline.com...
> : NO WAY should you drive it for a few minutes. The cylinder walls will
turn
> : red hot and the engine will seize and be destroyed.
> :
> : 30 seconds MAXIMUM without coolant for my vehicles.
> :
> : Tom
> :
> : "Cherokee-LTD" <spammenot@home.com> wrote in message
> : news:9EGLb.52125$AAe1.35813@news01.bloor.is.net.ca ble.rogers.com...
> : > If the engine is cold to begin with you can drive it for a few minutes
> : > without trouble.
> : > -Brian
> : >
> : > "aGraham" <aarongraham@mac.com.removeme> wrote in message
> : > news:aarongraham-140E34.16253909012004@corp-radius.supernews.com...
> : > : I am going to be pulling my radiator tomorrow to take it to get
fixed.
> : > : The problem is i then have to move the Jeep out of the shop until I
> get
> : > : the radiator back. I have to move the jeep about 30 yds, would it
be
> ok
> : > : to drive the Jeep this far with out any coolant and the radiator
> : > : removed?
> : > :
> : > : --
> : > : o_o_o_o
> : > : /| ,[_____],
> : > : |ŻŻŻL --O|||||||O-
> : > : ()_)Ż()_) ŻŻŻŻŻ )_)
> : >
> : >
> :
> :
>
>

Steve G

As I pointed out in an earlier post, draining the rad does not drain the
block. The level of coolant in the block is at least up near the top of the
cyl walls. But even a dry engine will not overheat, or even come close to
reaching operating temp in 30 seconds, a minute, 2 minutes. Take an oxy
acetalene torch and hold it against a piece of cast iron and see how long it
takes to get red not. Put your hand on the exhaust manifold and run it for
30 seconds. The manifold is not cooled and is the hotest spot in the
engine. You can still hold your hand on it after a minute or more. The
fresh air charge coming into the cyls is cooling it. The oil in the
crankcase is carrying away heat. If there's an engine oil cooler you can
even go longer. Think about air cooled engines. 30 seconds won't even get
the heat to the fins.
But nevermind the theoretical explanations, I've done it a thousand
times as a professional mechanic since the early 70's can assure you that
there is no risk of damage. You can safely run it until the temp gauge or
indicater light indicates a problem, probably a good 10 minutes or more. In
fact here in the frozen north if the engine is idling it will run
indefinately and not hit operating temp and open the thermostat when the
system is full of coolant. You have to have a load on the engine to get it
to warm to op temp. Without coolant the temp sender won't be as accurate,
but close enough and remember, it's designed to warn well before damage
occurs.

Of course you'll do as you like with your vehicle, but everyone should know
that if you drop a frost plug and loose all of your coolant in the middle of
the road somewhere and have to make an assessment of how much of a hazard
you are on the road in the spot you're sitting versus your risk of damage to
your vehicle that you have plenty of time to drive to a better spot. I'm
constantly amazed and annoyed by where people will leave there vehicles
under those conditions, even if they're not endangering traffic they're
causing traffic to backup for miles because they believe they'll ruin their
engine if they drive the 5 minutes to get it off the road.


"mabar" <mabar@NOSPAMgbronline.com> wrote in message
news:XIOdnVY0i5PjnZ3dRVn-tA@gbronline.com...
> Hi Brian:
>
> When you remove the radiator cap to see how long it takes the engine to
warm
> up, the engine block is filled with coolant. The original question was
about
> an engine with NO coolant (radiator was removed.) An engine with no
coolant
> will overheat VERY QUICKLY.
>
> I don't know how long exactly, but I'm pretty sure running it for a "few
> minutes" with no coolant might destroy the engine. For my vehicle, I would
> run it for no more than 30 seconds or so.
>
> Tom
>
> "Cherokee-LTD" <spammenot@home.com> wrote in message
> news:QWMLb.76696$1g41.9250@twister01.bloor.is.net. cable.rogers.com...
> > Not everybody dies from running with scissors. Unless all your vehicles
> are
> > supercharged nitro-burning funny cars you're pretty safe running them
> longer
> > than 30 seconds. When your engine is cold, remove the rad cap and see
how
> > long it takes for your thermostat to open. That will give you an
> indication
> > of how long it takes for your engine to detect warmth.
> >
> > By the way, the "removal of this tag is punishable by law" thing on sofa
> > cushions and mattresses can be removed after you purchase them.
> >
> > -Brian
> >
> > "mabar" <mabar@NOSPAMgbronline.com> wrote in message
> > news:8dudnaGeccHHy2KiRVn-tw@gbronline.com...
> > : NO WAY should you drive it for a few minutes. The cylinder walls will
> turn
> > : red hot and the engine will seize and be destroyed.
> > :
> > : 30 seconds MAXIMUM without coolant for my vehicles.
> > :
> > : Tom
> > :
> > : "Cherokee-LTD" <spammenot@home.com> wrote in message
> > : news:9EGLb.52125$AAe1.35813@news01.bloor.is.net.ca ble.rogers.com...
> > : > If the engine is cold to begin with you can drive it for a few
minutes
> > : > without trouble.
> > : > -Brian
> > : >
> > : > "aGraham" <aarongraham@mac.com.removeme> wrote in message
> > : > news:aarongraham-140E34.16253909012004@corp-radius.supernews.com...
> > : > : I am going to be pulling my radiator tomorrow to take it to get
> fixed.
> > : > : The problem is i then have to move the Jeep out of the shop until
I
> > get
> > : > : the radiator back. I have to move the jeep about 30 yds, would it
> be
> > ok
> > : > : to drive the Jeep this far with out any coolant and the radiator
> > : > : removed?
> > : > :
> > : > : --
> > : > : o_o_o_o
> > : > : /| ,[_____],
> > : > : |ŻŻŻL --O|||||||O-
> > : > : ()_)Ż()_) ŻŻŻŻŻ )_)
> > : >
> > : >
> > :
> > :
> >
> >
>
>

Steve G

As I pointed out in an earlier post, draining the rad does not drain the
block. The level of coolant in the block is at least up near the top of the
cyl walls. But even a dry engine will not overheat, or even come close to
reaching operating temp in 30 seconds, a minute, 2 minutes. Take an oxy
acetalene torch and hold it against a piece of cast iron and see how long it
takes to get red not. Put your hand on the exhaust manifold and run it for
30 seconds. The manifold is not cooled and is the hotest spot in the
engine. You can still hold your hand on it after a minute or more. The
fresh air charge coming into the cyls is cooling it. The oil in the
crankcase is carrying away heat. If there's an engine oil cooler you can
even go longer. Think about air cooled engines. 30 seconds won't even get
the heat to the fins.
But nevermind the theoretical explanations, I've done it a thousand
times as a professional mechanic since the early 70's can assure you that
there is no risk of damage. You can safely run it until the temp gauge or
indicater light indicates a problem, probably a good 10 minutes or more. In
fact here in the frozen north if the engine is idling it will run
indefinately and not hit operating temp and open the thermostat when the
system is full of coolant. You have to have a load on the engine to get it
to warm to op temp. Without coolant the temp sender won't be as accurate,
but close enough and remember, it's designed to warn well before damage
occurs.

Of course you'll do as you like with your vehicle, but everyone should know
that if you drop a frost plug and loose all of your coolant in the middle of
the road somewhere and have to make an assessment of how much of a hazard
you are on the road in the spot you're sitting versus your risk of damage to
your vehicle that you have plenty of time to drive to a better spot. I'm
constantly amazed and annoyed by where people will leave there vehicles
under those conditions, even if they're not endangering traffic they're
causing traffic to backup for miles because they believe they'll ruin their
engine if they drive the 5 minutes to get it off the road.


"mabar" <mabar@NOSPAMgbronline.com> wrote in message
news:XIOdnVY0i5PjnZ3dRVn-tA@gbronline.com...
> Hi Brian:
>
> When you remove the radiator cap to see how long it takes the engine to
warm
> up, the engine block is filled with coolant. The original question was
about
> an engine with NO coolant (radiator was removed.) An engine with no
coolant
> will overheat VERY QUICKLY.
>
> I don't know how long exactly, but I'm pretty sure running it for a "few
> minutes" with no coolant might destroy the engine. For my vehicle, I would
> run it for no more than 30 seconds or so.
>
> Tom
>
> "Cherokee-LTD" <spammenot@home.com> wrote in message
> news:QWMLb.76696$1g41.9250@twister01.bloor.is.net. cable.rogers.com...
> > Not everybody dies from running with scissors. Unless all your vehicles
> are
> > supercharged nitro-burning funny cars you're pretty safe running them
> longer
> > than 30 seconds. When your engine is cold, remove the rad cap and see
how
> > long it takes for your thermostat to open. That will give you an
> indication
> > of how long it takes for your engine to detect warmth.
> >
> > By the way, the "removal of this tag is punishable by law" thing on sofa
> > cushions and mattresses can be removed after you purchase them.
> >
> > -Brian
> >
> > "mabar" <mabar@NOSPAMgbronline.com> wrote in message
> > news:8dudnaGeccHHy2KiRVn-tw@gbronline.com...
> > : NO WAY should you drive it for a few minutes. The cylinder walls will
> turn
> > : red hot and the engine will seize and be destroyed.
> > :
> > : 30 seconds MAXIMUM without coolant for my vehicles.
> > :
> > : Tom
> > :
> > : "Cherokee-LTD" <spammenot@home.com> wrote in message
> > : news:9EGLb.52125$AAe1.35813@news01.bloor.is.net.ca ble.rogers.com...
> > : > If the engine is cold to begin with you can drive it for a few
minutes
> > : > without trouble.
> > : > -Brian
> > : >
> > : > "aGraham" <aarongraham@mac.com.removeme> wrote in message
> > : > news:aarongraham-140E34.16253909012004@corp-radius.supernews.com...
> > : > : I am going to be pulling my radiator tomorrow to take it to get
> fixed.
> > : > : The problem is i then have to move the Jeep out of the shop until
I
> > get
> > : > : the radiator back. I have to move the jeep about 30 yds, would it
> be
> > ok
> > : > : to drive the Jeep this far with out any coolant and the radiator
> > : > : removed?
> > : > :
> > : > : --
> > : > : o_o_o_o
> > : > : /| ,[_____],
> > : > : |ŻŻŻL --O|||||||O-
> > : > : ()_)Ż()_) ŻŻŻŻŻ )_)
> > : >
> > : >
> > :
> > :
> >
> >
>
>

Steve G

As I pointed out in an earlier post, draining the rad does not drain the
block. The level of coolant in the block is at least up near the top of the
cyl walls. But even a dry engine will not overheat, or even come close to
reaching operating temp in 30 seconds, a minute, 2 minutes. Take an oxy
acetalene torch and hold it against a piece of cast iron and see how long it
takes to get red not. Put your hand on the exhaust manifold and run it for
30 seconds. The manifold is not cooled and is the hotest spot in the
engine. You can still hold your hand on it after a minute or more. The
fresh air charge coming into the cyls is cooling it. The oil in the
crankcase is carrying away heat. If there's an engine oil cooler you can
even go longer. Think about air cooled engines. 30 seconds won't even get
the heat to the fins.
But nevermind the theoretical explanations, I've done it a thousand
times as a professional mechanic since the early 70's can assure you that
there is no risk of damage. You can safely run it until the temp gauge or
indicater light indicates a problem, probably a good 10 minutes or more. In
fact here in the frozen north if the engine is idling it will run
indefinately and not hit operating temp and open the thermostat when the
system is full of coolant. You have to have a load on the engine to get it
to warm to op temp. Without coolant the temp sender won't be as accurate,
but close enough and remember, it's designed to warn well before damage
occurs.

Of course you'll do as you like with your vehicle, but everyone should know
that if you drop a frost plug and loose all of your coolant in the middle of
the road somewhere and have to make an assessment of how much of a hazard
you are on the road in the spot you're sitting versus your risk of damage to
your vehicle that you have plenty of time to drive to a better spot. I'm
constantly amazed and annoyed by where people will leave there vehicles
under those conditions, even if they're not endangering traffic they're
causing traffic to backup for miles because they believe they'll ruin their
engine if they drive the 5 minutes to get it off the road.


"mabar" <mabar@NOSPAMgbronline.com> wrote in message
news:XIOdnVY0i5PjnZ3dRVn-tA@gbronline.com...
> Hi Brian:
>
> When you remove the radiator cap to see how long it takes the engine to
warm
> up, the engine block is filled with coolant. The original question was
about
> an engine with NO coolant (radiator was removed.) An engine with no
coolant
> will overheat VERY QUICKLY.
>
> I don't know how long exactly, but I'm pretty sure running it for a "few
> minutes" with no coolant might destroy the engine. For my vehicle, I would
> run it for no more than 30 seconds or so.
>
> Tom
>
> "Cherokee-LTD" <spammenot@home.com> wrote in message
> news:QWMLb.76696$1g41.9250@twister01.bloor.is.net. cable.rogers.com...
> > Not everybody dies from running with scissors. Unless all your vehicles
> are
> > supercharged nitro-burning funny cars you're pretty safe running them
> longer
> > than 30 seconds. When your engine is cold, remove the rad cap and see
how
> > long it takes for your thermostat to open. That will give you an
> indication
> > of how long it takes for your engine to detect warmth.
> >
> > By the way, the "removal of this tag is punishable by law" thing on sofa
> > cushions and mattresses can be removed after you purchase them.
> >
> > -Brian
> >
> > "mabar" <mabar@NOSPAMgbronline.com> wrote in message
> > news:8dudnaGeccHHy2KiRVn-tw@gbronline.com...
> > : NO WAY should you drive it for a few minutes. The cylinder walls will
> turn
> > : red hot and the engine will seize and be destroyed.
> > :
> > : 30 seconds MAXIMUM without coolant for my vehicles.
> > :
> > : Tom
> > :
> > : "Cherokee-LTD" <spammenot@home.com> wrote in message
> > : news:9EGLb.52125$AAe1.35813@news01.bloor.is.net.ca ble.rogers.com...
> > : > If the engine is cold to begin with you can drive it for a few
minutes
> > : > without trouble.
> > : > -Brian
> > : >
> > : > "aGraham" <aarongraham@mac.com.removeme> wrote in message
> > : > news:aarongraham-140E34.16253909012004@corp-radius.supernews.com...
> > : > : I am going to be pulling my radiator tomorrow to take it to get
> fixed.
> > : > : The problem is i then have to move the Jeep out of the shop until
I
> > get
> > : > : the radiator back. I have to move the jeep about 30 yds, would it
> be
> > ok
> > : > : to drive the Jeep this far with out any coolant and the radiator
> > : > : removed?
> > : > :
> > : > : --
> > : > : o_o_o_o
> > : > : /| ,[_____],
> > : > : |ŻŻŻL --O|||||||O-
> > : > : ()_)Ż()_) ŻŻŻŻŻ )_)
> > : >
> > : >
> > :
> > :
> >
> >
>
>

Stephen R. Conrad

Why not remove the coil wire and run it on the starter motor that far? Or
get a couple of budies and push it? 30 yards is not very far.

"aGraham" <aarongraham@mac.com.removeme> wrote in message
news:aarongraham-140E34.16253909012004@corp-radius.supernews.com...
> I am going to be pulling my radiator tomorrow to take it to get fixed.
> The problem is i then have to move the Jeep out of the shop until I get
> the radiator back. I have to move the jeep about 30 yds, would it be ok
> to drive the Jeep this far with out any coolant and the radiator
> removed?
>
> --
> o_o_o_o
> /| ,[_____],
> |ŻŻŻL --O|||||||O-
> ()_)Ż()_) ŻŻŻŻŻ )_)


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
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Stephen R. Conrad

Why not remove the coil wire and run it on the starter motor that far? Or
get a couple of budies and push it? 30 yards is not very far.

"aGraham" <aarongraham@mac.com.removeme> wrote in message
news:aarongraham-140E34.16253909012004@corp-radius.supernews.com...
> I am going to be pulling my radiator tomorrow to take it to get fixed.
> The problem is i then have to move the Jeep out of the shop until I get
> the radiator back. I have to move the jeep about 30 yds, would it be ok
> to drive the Jeep this far with out any coolant and the radiator
> removed?
>
> --
> o_o_o_o
> /| ,[_____],
> |ŻŻŻL --O|||||||O-
> ()_)Ż()_) ŻŻŻŻŻ )_)


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.551 / Virus Database: 343 - Release Date: 12/11/2003

Stephen R. Conrad

Why not remove the coil wire and run it on the starter motor that far? Or
get a couple of budies and push it? 30 yards is not very far.

"aGraham" <aarongraham@mac.com.removeme> wrote in message
news:aarongraham-140E34.16253909012004@corp-radius.supernews.com...
> I am going to be pulling my radiator tomorrow to take it to get fixed.
> The problem is i then have to move the Jeep out of the shop until I get
> the radiator back. I have to move the jeep about 30 yds, would it be ok
> to drive the Jeep this far with out any coolant and the radiator
> removed?
>
> --
> o_o_o_o
> /| ,[_____],
> |ŻŻŻL --O|||||||O-
> ()_)Ż()_) ŻŻŻŻŻ )_)


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.551 / Virus Database: 343 - Release Date: 12/11/2003

Dave Milne

Or even tow the thing on the end of a rope ?

Dave Milne, Scotland

"Stephen R. Conrad" <sconradpt@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:btp9kb$9pb85$1@ID-129890.news.uni-berlin.de...
> Why not remove the coil wire and run it on the starter motor that far? Or
> get a couple of budies and push it? 30 yards is not very far.
>
> "aGraham" <aarongraham@mac.com.removeme> wrote in message
> news:aarongraham-140E34.16253909012004@corp-radius.supernews.com...
> > I am going to be pulling my radiator tomorrow to take it to get fixed.
> > The problem is i then have to move the Jeep out of the shop until I get
> > the radiator back. I have to move the jeep about 30 yds, would it be ok
> > to drive the Jeep this far with out any coolant and the radiator
> > removed?
> >
> > --
> > o_o_o_o
> > /| ,[_____],
> > |ŻŻŻL --O|||||||O-
> > ()_)Ż()_) ŻŻŻŻŻ )_)
>
>
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