Re: [OT] another fugly car
07-10-2003, 11:55 PM
#1
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: [OT] another fugly car
DougW wrote:
> http://members.***.net/wilsond/temp/lexus.jpg
All Lexus cars are overpriced Toyotas, and therefore hideous by nature.
> http://members.***.net/wilsond/temp/lexus.jpg
All Lexus cars are overpriced Toyotas, and therefore hideous by nature.
07-11-2003, 12:18 AM
#2
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: [OT] another fugly car
"Big Daddy" <DontBother@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:3f0e34f9$0$79643$a0465688@nnrp.fuse.net...
> DougW wrote:
>
> > http://members.***.net/wilsond/temp/lexus.jpg
>
> All Lexus cars are overpriced Toyotas, and therefore hideous by nature.
There have only been three cars I owned that I truly loved... my '67 Triumph
TR-6, my current '97 Jeep Wrangler TJ, and my sadly departed '92 Lexus
LS-400... and the LS-400 was literally the only car I've ever owned in 39
years of owning cars that was flawless in every respect... it never had a
single, solitary problem in the 131,000 miles I owned it before selling it.
I drove it off the dealer's lot and never had to go back for any repairs.
I'd buy another Lexus, just like I'd buy another Jeep. My Best Man at my
wedding still has his '89 LS-400... as solid as the day he bought it in '88.
The Lexus LS-400 has very little in common with a Toyota other than Toyota
being the parent company, that is for sure. :)
Jerry
--
Jerry Bransford
KC6TAY, PP-ASEL
The Zen Hotdog, make me one with everything!
See the Geezer Jeep at
http://members.***.net/jerrypb/
news:3f0e34f9$0$79643$a0465688@nnrp.fuse.net...
> DougW wrote:
>
> > http://members.***.net/wilsond/temp/lexus.jpg
>
> All Lexus cars are overpriced Toyotas, and therefore hideous by nature.
There have only been three cars I owned that I truly loved... my '67 Triumph
TR-6, my current '97 Jeep Wrangler TJ, and my sadly departed '92 Lexus
LS-400... and the LS-400 was literally the only car I've ever owned in 39
years of owning cars that was flawless in every respect... it never had a
single, solitary problem in the 131,000 miles I owned it before selling it.
I drove it off the dealer's lot and never had to go back for any repairs.
I'd buy another Lexus, just like I'd buy another Jeep. My Best Man at my
wedding still has his '89 LS-400... as solid as the day he bought it in '88.
The Lexus LS-400 has very little in common with a Toyota other than Toyota
being the parent company, that is for sure. :)
Jerry
--
Jerry Bransford
KC6TAY, PP-ASEL
The Zen Hotdog, make me one with everything!
See the Geezer Jeep at
http://members.***.net/jerrypb/
07-11-2003, 09:48 AM
#3
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: [OT] another fugly car
Jerry Bransford wrote:
>> All Lexus cars are overpriced Toyotas, and therefore hideous by nature.
>
> There have only been three cars I owned that I truly loved... my '67
> Triumph TR-6, my current '97 Jeep Wrangler TJ, and my sadly departed '92
> Lexus LS-400... and the LS-400 was literally the only car I've ever owned
> in 39 years of owning cars that was flawless in every respect... it never
> had a single, solitary problem in the 131,000 miles I owned it before
> selling it. I drove it off the dealer's lot and never had to go back for
> any repairs.
> I'd buy another Lexus, just like I'd buy another Jeep. My Best Man at my
> wedding still has his '89 LS-400... as solid as the day he bought it in
> '88. The Lexus LS-400 has very little in common with a Toyota other than
> Toyota being the parent company, that is for sure. :)
Actually, you're wrong. The engine and transmission are lifted right from
the Land Cruiser. Most mechanical parts on the car are either directly
lifted off of a Toyota from somewhere in the world in one of the many
markets they have, or a slightly revised Toyota part. You must remember
that Toyota makes many rear drive cars in other markets. In order to get
that level of reliability, those parts need to have been redesigned over
and over again to get rid of any defects. Most Lexus models are rebadged
Toyotas from another market, just as the Acuras are rebadged Hondas from
another market. The use of a premium name in the US market is done only for
perception to compete against other premium brands. True, they probably are
a bit more loaded than their Toyota counterparts...
Designing from scrap ensures defects, and thus is the reason Honda and
Toyota never totally redesign their cars. Their philosophy is "if it isn't
broke, don't fix it." On the flip side, the US companies have traditionally
redesigned their cars from top to bottom. The (then) new for 1992 Jeep
Grand Cherokee was a total redesign and was touted by Bob Lutz that the
only parts from the old Grand Cherokee used could fit in a small bag.
Hence, it was horrible in reliability and did a lot of damage to the Jeep
reputation because of all the yuppies that bought them expecting more
reliability like the Hondas and Toyotas they used to buy.
>> All Lexus cars are overpriced Toyotas, and therefore hideous by nature.
>
> There have only been three cars I owned that I truly loved... my '67
> Triumph TR-6, my current '97 Jeep Wrangler TJ, and my sadly departed '92
> Lexus LS-400... and the LS-400 was literally the only car I've ever owned
> in 39 years of owning cars that was flawless in every respect... it never
> had a single, solitary problem in the 131,000 miles I owned it before
> selling it. I drove it off the dealer's lot and never had to go back for
> any repairs.
> I'd buy another Lexus, just like I'd buy another Jeep. My Best Man at my
> wedding still has his '89 LS-400... as solid as the day he bought it in
> '88. The Lexus LS-400 has very little in common with a Toyota other than
> Toyota being the parent company, that is for sure. :)
Actually, you're wrong. The engine and transmission are lifted right from
the Land Cruiser. Most mechanical parts on the car are either directly
lifted off of a Toyota from somewhere in the world in one of the many
markets they have, or a slightly revised Toyota part. You must remember
that Toyota makes many rear drive cars in other markets. In order to get
that level of reliability, those parts need to have been redesigned over
and over again to get rid of any defects. Most Lexus models are rebadged
Toyotas from another market, just as the Acuras are rebadged Hondas from
another market. The use of a premium name in the US market is done only for
perception to compete against other premium brands. True, they probably are
a bit more loaded than their Toyota counterparts...
Designing from scrap ensures defects, and thus is the reason Honda and
Toyota never totally redesign their cars. Their philosophy is "if it isn't
broke, don't fix it." On the flip side, the US companies have traditionally
redesigned their cars from top to bottom. The (then) new for 1992 Jeep
Grand Cherokee was a total redesign and was touted by Bob Lutz that the
only parts from the old Grand Cherokee used could fit in a small bag.
Hence, it was horrible in reliability and did a lot of damage to the Jeep
reputation because of all the yuppies that bought them expecting more
reliability like the Hondas and Toyotas they used to buy.
07-11-2003, 09:13 PM
#4
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: [OT] another fugly car
Jerry Bransford wrote:
>> Actually, you're wrong. The engine and transmission are lifted right from
>> the Land Cruiser.
>
> And actually you're totally wrong... the 4.0L engine used in the Lexus was
> developed by Lexus engineers and then LATER used in the Land Cruiser. Not
> a
> rumor, fact. I remember when the Land Cruiser got the 4.0L Lexus engine,
> it was discussed at length in many publications.
I do believe that it was a redesigned V8 that already existed, not a ground
up engine for Lexus. The Land Cruiser got its V8 (4.2 Liter) in 1975, long
before Lexus even existed. The redesigned engine may have made a debut in
the Lexus first, but it was still based on the old Toyota engine.
Never-the-less, the LS400 shares most of its mechanical components with
other Toyotas sold in many parts of the world. It is, in fact, a Toyota at
heart and not something revolutionary, as you so try to indicate.
At the same time, it was and is a very bland car, just as all other Toyotas
are.
>> Actually, you're wrong. The engine and transmission are lifted right from
>> the Land Cruiser.
>
> And actually you're totally wrong... the 4.0L engine used in the Lexus was
> developed by Lexus engineers and then LATER used in the Land Cruiser. Not
> a
> rumor, fact. I remember when the Land Cruiser got the 4.0L Lexus engine,
> it was discussed at length in many publications.
I do believe that it was a redesigned V8 that already existed, not a ground
up engine for Lexus. The Land Cruiser got its V8 (4.2 Liter) in 1975, long
before Lexus even existed. The redesigned engine may have made a debut in
the Lexus first, but it was still based on the old Toyota engine.
Never-the-less, the LS400 shares most of its mechanical components with
other Toyotas sold in many parts of the world. It is, in fact, a Toyota at
heart and not something revolutionary, as you so try to indicate.
At the same time, it was and is a very bland car, just as all other Toyotas
are.
07-12-2003, 03:59 PM
#5
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: [OT] another fugly car
Hi Dave,
Going back to W.W.II, after the war, American set Japan up in the
business of making the 1947 Chevy pickup trucks, from which the Land
Crusher got it's six lug pattern, axles, transmission, and six cylinder,
straight from the '47 Chevrolet. I will give Japan credit for doing away
with the floor tunnel so an American can fit in their upholstered
roller-skate by marketing Cord's front wheel drive for mass production.
But when Japan's customers needed horse power and a way to get to the
ground, they went back to what works, the rear axle. I suppose you think
your country should take credit for that design? But I see basically the
'63 Stingray Corvette independent design, a little refined to work like
my '89 Thunderbird's, but not your broken axle design use in your
Jaguar.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Dave Milne wrote:
>
> ??
>
> What's American about either rear wheel drive, or the Lexus (originally
> built in Tahara in Japan) ?
>
> Dave Milne, Scotland
> '99 TJ 4.0 Sahara
>
> "L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
> news:3F0F8D7D.7AF5E722@***.net...
> : Straight American rear wheel drive technology.
> : God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> : mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> :
> : Big Daddy wrote:
> : >
> : > I do believe that it was a redesigned V8 that already existed, not a
> ground
> : > up engine for Lexus. The Land Cruiser got its V8 (4.2 Liter) in 1975,
> long
> : > before Lexus even existed. The redesigned engine may have made a debut
> in
> : > the Lexus first, but it was still based on the old Toyota engine.
> : > Never-the-less, the LS400 shares most of its mechanical components with
> : > other Toyotas sold in many parts of the world. It is, in fact, a Toyota
> at
> : > heart and not something revolutionary, as you so try to indicate.
> : >
> : > At the same time, it was and is a very bland car, just as all other
> Toyotas
> : > are.
Going back to W.W.II, after the war, American set Japan up in the
business of making the 1947 Chevy pickup trucks, from which the Land
Crusher got it's six lug pattern, axles, transmission, and six cylinder,
straight from the '47 Chevrolet. I will give Japan credit for doing away
with the floor tunnel so an American can fit in their upholstered
roller-skate by marketing Cord's front wheel drive for mass production.
But when Japan's customers needed horse power and a way to get to the
ground, they went back to what works, the rear axle. I suppose you think
your country should take credit for that design? But I see basically the
'63 Stingray Corvette independent design, a little refined to work like
my '89 Thunderbird's, but not your broken axle design use in your
Jaguar.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Dave Milne wrote:
>
> ??
>
> What's American about either rear wheel drive, or the Lexus (originally
> built in Tahara in Japan) ?
>
> Dave Milne, Scotland
> '99 TJ 4.0 Sahara
>
> "L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
> news:3F0F8D7D.7AF5E722@***.net...
> : Straight American rear wheel drive technology.
> : God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> : mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> :
> : Big Daddy wrote:
> : >
> : > I do believe that it was a redesigned V8 that already existed, not a
> ground
> : > up engine for Lexus. The Land Cruiser got its V8 (4.2 Liter) in 1975,
> long
> : > before Lexus even existed. The redesigned engine may have made a debut
> in
> : > the Lexus first, but it was still based on the old Toyota engine.
> : > Never-the-less, the LS400 shares most of its mechanical components with
> : > other Toyotas sold in many parts of the world. It is, in fact, a Toyota
> at
> : > heart and not something revolutionary, as you so try to indicate.
> : >
> : > At the same time, it was and is a very bland car, just as all other
> Toyotas
> : > are.
07-12-2003, 05:12 PM
#6
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: [OT] another fugly car
L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> Hi Dave,
> Going back to W.W.II, after the war, American set Japan up in the
> business of making the 1947 Chevy pickup trucks, from which the Land
> Crusher got it's six lug pattern, axles, transmission, and six cylinder,
> straight from the '47 Chevrolet. I will give Japan credit for doing away
> with the floor tunnel so an American can fit in their upholstered
> roller-skate by marketing Cord's front wheel drive for mass production.
I thought Toyota used to make vehicles under license from both
Jaguar and Rover. From whence came a better DOHC engine than
Jaguar ever produced?
> Hi Dave,
> Going back to W.W.II, after the war, American set Japan up in the
> business of making the 1947 Chevy pickup trucks, from which the Land
> Crusher got it's six lug pattern, axles, transmission, and six cylinder,
> straight from the '47 Chevrolet. I will give Japan credit for doing away
> with the floor tunnel so an American can fit in their upholstered
> roller-skate by marketing Cord's front wheel drive for mass production.
I thought Toyota used to make vehicles under license from both
Jaguar and Rover. From whence came a better DOHC engine than
Jaguar ever produced?
07-12-2003, 07:45 PM
#7
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: [OT] another fugly car
ok, JEEP group. :)
--
Bruce
99 White WJ 4x4 Select Trac
89 YJ
03 Liberty Ltd L.O.S.T #000256
90 XJ6 Sovereign
"Big Daddy" <DontBother@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:3f0f607b$0$88075$a0465688@nnrp.fuse.net...
> Jerry Bransford wrote:
>
> >> Actually, you're wrong. The engine and transmission are lifted right
from
> >> the Land Cruiser.
> >
> > And actually you're totally wrong... the 4.0L engine used in the Lexus
was
> > developed by Lexus engineers and then LATER used in the Land Cruiser.
Not
> > a
> > rumor, fact. I remember when the Land Cruiser got the 4.0L Lexus
engine,
> > it was discussed at length in many publications.
>
> I do believe that it was a redesigned V8 that already existed, not a
ground
> up engine for Lexus. The Land Cruiser got its V8 (4.2 Liter) in 1975, long
> before Lexus even existed. The redesigned engine may have made a debut in
> the Lexus first, but it was still based on the old Toyota engine.
> Never-the-less, the LS400 shares most of its mechanical components with
> other Toyotas sold in many parts of the world. It is, in fact, a Toyota at
> heart and not something revolutionary, as you so try to indicate.
>
> At the same time, it was and is a very bland car, just as all other
Toyotas
> are.
--
Bruce
99 White WJ 4x4 Select Trac
89 YJ
03 Liberty Ltd L.O.S.T #000256
90 XJ6 Sovereign
"Big Daddy" <DontBother@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:3f0f607b$0$88075$a0465688@nnrp.fuse.net...
> Jerry Bransford wrote:
>
> >> Actually, you're wrong. The engine and transmission are lifted right
from
> >> the Land Cruiser.
> >
> > And actually you're totally wrong... the 4.0L engine used in the Lexus
was
> > developed by Lexus engineers and then LATER used in the Land Cruiser.
Not
> > a
> > rumor, fact. I remember when the Land Cruiser got the 4.0L Lexus
engine,
> > it was discussed at length in many publications.
>
> I do believe that it was a redesigned V8 that already existed, not a
ground
> up engine for Lexus. The Land Cruiser got its V8 (4.2 Liter) in 1975, long
> before Lexus even existed. The redesigned engine may have made a debut in
> the Lexus first, but it was still based on the old Toyota engine.
> Never-the-less, the LS400 shares most of its mechanical components with
> other Toyotas sold in many parts of the world. It is, in fact, a Toyota at
> heart and not something revolutionary, as you so try to indicate.
>
> At the same time, it was and is a very bland car, just as all other
Toyotas
> are.
07-13-2003, 02:41 AM
#8
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: [OT] another fugly car
"Big Daddy" <DontBother@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:3f0f607b$0$88075$a0465688@nnrp.fuse.net...
> Jerry Bransford wrote:
>
> >> Actually, you're wrong. The engine and transmission are lifted right
from
> >> the Land Cruiser.
> >
> > And actually you're totally wrong... the 4.0L engine used in the Lexus
was
> > developed by Lexus engineers and then LATER used in the Land Cruiser.
Not
> > a
> > rumor, fact. I remember when the Land Cruiser got the 4.0L Lexus
engine,
> > it was discussed at length in many publications.
>
> I do believe that it was a redesigned V8 that already existed, not a
ground
> up engine for Lexus.
It was a scratch-built ground-up brand-new design 4.0L engine that the
then-new LS-400 received. It had nothing more in common with the 4.2L
engine other than a V8 design. There were no other major parts or
assemblies shared with Toyota at the time of the LS-400 introduction
either... the Lexus was designed as a cutting-edge entry into the Mercedes
Benz marketplace and was a radical departure for the Parent company.
Eventually, some Lexus designs made it down into Toyota... but few Toyota
parts get used in the LS-400 or LS-450.
Jerry
--
Jerry Bransford
KC6TAY, PP-ASEL
The Zen Hotdog, make me one with everything!
See the Geezer Jeep at
http://members.***.net/jerrypb/
news:3f0f607b$0$88075$a0465688@nnrp.fuse.net...
> Jerry Bransford wrote:
>
> >> Actually, you're wrong. The engine and transmission are lifted right
from
> >> the Land Cruiser.
> >
> > And actually you're totally wrong... the 4.0L engine used in the Lexus
was
> > developed by Lexus engineers and then LATER used in the Land Cruiser.
Not
> > a
> > rumor, fact. I remember when the Land Cruiser got the 4.0L Lexus
engine,
> > it was discussed at length in many publications.
>
> I do believe that it was a redesigned V8 that already existed, not a
ground
> up engine for Lexus.
It was a scratch-built ground-up brand-new design 4.0L engine that the
then-new LS-400 received. It had nothing more in common with the 4.2L
engine other than a V8 design. There were no other major parts or
assemblies shared with Toyota at the time of the LS-400 introduction
either... the Lexus was designed as a cutting-edge entry into the Mercedes
Benz marketplace and was a radical departure for the Parent company.
Eventually, some Lexus designs made it down into Toyota... but few Toyota
parts get used in the LS-400 or LS-450.
Jerry
--
Jerry Bransford
KC6TAY, PP-ASEL
The Zen Hotdog, make me one with everything!
See the Geezer Jeep at
http://members.***.net/jerrypb/
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