Pink Kate
09-08-2006, 09:09 PM
#1401
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: the reported bear attack
The tree thing reminds me of when I was in Kodiak, Alaska. the joke was if
you climb a tree and a bear chases you up the tree its a black bear, if he
knocks it down, he's a Kodiak. (of course there are no black bears on
Kodiak, but its an attention getter.)
"Lon" <lon.stowell@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:RI-dnR2QBMwxxNnZnZ2dnUVZ_tSdnZ2d@comcast.com...
> Clay proclaimed:
>
>> Kate wrote:
>>
>>> If you carry the right ammunition, most calibers will mushroom.
>>
>>
>>
>> You don't want bullets that mushroom when shooting big,tough skinned
>> dangerous game.
>
> Yes you do. The skin of even a moose is trivially penetrated by a .22, so
> is that of a wood chuck which is even tougher than that of a moose
> although not nearly as thick.
>
>> You want penetration... all you can get. Ideally, a round that will go
>> clean through the beast.
>
> No you don't. You want a round that will penetrate bone if necessary and
> then expand. Ideally tearing out lungs, heart, or brain completely. The
> round needs to penetrate and then deposit all of its energy in the target.
> Ideally the round should stop completely just over midway in the
> target...some will argue that a round which fragments heavily is even more
> effective--but that is almost a religious argument amongst hunters of
> really big game. Any energy that passes out the far side is wasted
> powder.
>
>> You're better off with FMJ in handgun calibers. A stoked up .44 mag would
>> do it *if* you were competent (read: calm) enough to place your shot.
>> Spray and pray ain't going to get it done.
>
> Get the bears attention while it is charging. Stay pretty still until it
> gets close and then duck sideways if possible. Then get its attention by
> making as much noise as you can possibly make and hope you can get it to
> rear up, at which point you can usually get the heart and lungs. A gut
> shot works, but by then you may be badly injured. Best tactic is to keep
> an eye out for trees at least a 18 inches or so in diameter and climb
> fast--taking your weapon with you. Adult grizzlies cannot climb.
>
>> .454 Causull would be a better choice if you could handle it.
>> http://www.pistolwhipvideo.com/images/wallpaper.jpg
>> http://www.shootingtimes.com/handgun_reviews/rgrRH/
>> As JD said, it might buy you time to unsling your long gun.
>
> I've killed grizzly with a .357 magnum. I grew up with folks who killed
> them with a .22LR. Very difficult to avoid them if you spend much time
> in the woods up around Kalispell.
>
you climb a tree and a bear chases you up the tree its a black bear, if he
knocks it down, he's a Kodiak. (of course there are no black bears on
Kodiak, but its an attention getter.)
"Lon" <lon.stowell@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:RI-dnR2QBMwxxNnZnZ2dnUVZ_tSdnZ2d@comcast.com...
> Clay proclaimed:
>
>> Kate wrote:
>>
>>> If you carry the right ammunition, most calibers will mushroom.
>>
>>
>>
>> You don't want bullets that mushroom when shooting big,tough skinned
>> dangerous game.
>
> Yes you do. The skin of even a moose is trivially penetrated by a .22, so
> is that of a wood chuck which is even tougher than that of a moose
> although not nearly as thick.
>
>> You want penetration... all you can get. Ideally, a round that will go
>> clean through the beast.
>
> No you don't. You want a round that will penetrate bone if necessary and
> then expand. Ideally tearing out lungs, heart, or brain completely. The
> round needs to penetrate and then deposit all of its energy in the target.
> Ideally the round should stop completely just over midway in the
> target...some will argue that a round which fragments heavily is even more
> effective--but that is almost a religious argument amongst hunters of
> really big game. Any energy that passes out the far side is wasted
> powder.
>
>> You're better off with FMJ in handgun calibers. A stoked up .44 mag would
>> do it *if* you were competent (read: calm) enough to place your shot.
>> Spray and pray ain't going to get it done.
>
> Get the bears attention while it is charging. Stay pretty still until it
> gets close and then duck sideways if possible. Then get its attention by
> making as much noise as you can possibly make and hope you can get it to
> rear up, at which point you can usually get the heart and lungs. A gut
> shot works, but by then you may be badly injured. Best tactic is to keep
> an eye out for trees at least a 18 inches or so in diameter and climb
> fast--taking your weapon with you. Adult grizzlies cannot climb.
>
>> .454 Causull would be a better choice if you could handle it.
>> http://www.pistolwhipvideo.com/images/wallpaper.jpg
>> http://www.shootingtimes.com/handgun_reviews/rgrRH/
>> As JD said, it might buy you time to unsling your long gun.
>
> I've killed grizzly with a .357 magnum. I grew up with folks who killed
> them with a .22LR. Very difficult to avoid them if you spend much time
> in the woods up around Kalispell.
>
09-08-2006, 09:09 PM
#1402
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: the reported bear attack
The tree thing reminds me of when I was in Kodiak, Alaska. the joke was if
you climb a tree and a bear chases you up the tree its a black bear, if he
knocks it down, he's a Kodiak. (of course there are no black bears on
Kodiak, but its an attention getter.)
"Lon" <lon.stowell@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:RI-dnR2QBMwxxNnZnZ2dnUVZ_tSdnZ2d@comcast.com...
> Clay proclaimed:
>
>> Kate wrote:
>>
>>> If you carry the right ammunition, most calibers will mushroom.
>>
>>
>>
>> You don't want bullets that mushroom when shooting big,tough skinned
>> dangerous game.
>
> Yes you do. The skin of even a moose is trivially penetrated by a .22, so
> is that of a wood chuck which is even tougher than that of a moose
> although not nearly as thick.
>
>> You want penetration... all you can get. Ideally, a round that will go
>> clean through the beast.
>
> No you don't. You want a round that will penetrate bone if necessary and
> then expand. Ideally tearing out lungs, heart, or brain completely. The
> round needs to penetrate and then deposit all of its energy in the target.
> Ideally the round should stop completely just over midway in the
> target...some will argue that a round which fragments heavily is even more
> effective--but that is almost a religious argument amongst hunters of
> really big game. Any energy that passes out the far side is wasted
> powder.
>
>> You're better off with FMJ in handgun calibers. A stoked up .44 mag would
>> do it *if* you were competent (read: calm) enough to place your shot.
>> Spray and pray ain't going to get it done.
>
> Get the bears attention while it is charging. Stay pretty still until it
> gets close and then duck sideways if possible. Then get its attention by
> making as much noise as you can possibly make and hope you can get it to
> rear up, at which point you can usually get the heart and lungs. A gut
> shot works, but by then you may be badly injured. Best tactic is to keep
> an eye out for trees at least a 18 inches or so in diameter and climb
> fast--taking your weapon with you. Adult grizzlies cannot climb.
>
>> .454 Causull would be a better choice if you could handle it.
>> http://www.pistolwhipvideo.com/images/wallpaper.jpg
>> http://www.shootingtimes.com/handgun_reviews/rgrRH/
>> As JD said, it might buy you time to unsling your long gun.
>
> I've killed grizzly with a .357 magnum. I grew up with folks who killed
> them with a .22LR. Very difficult to avoid them if you spend much time
> in the woods up around Kalispell.
>
you climb a tree and a bear chases you up the tree its a black bear, if he
knocks it down, he's a Kodiak. (of course there are no black bears on
Kodiak, but its an attention getter.)
"Lon" <lon.stowell@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:RI-dnR2QBMwxxNnZnZ2dnUVZ_tSdnZ2d@comcast.com...
> Clay proclaimed:
>
>> Kate wrote:
>>
>>> If you carry the right ammunition, most calibers will mushroom.
>>
>>
>>
>> You don't want bullets that mushroom when shooting big,tough skinned
>> dangerous game.
>
> Yes you do. The skin of even a moose is trivially penetrated by a .22, so
> is that of a wood chuck which is even tougher than that of a moose
> although not nearly as thick.
>
>> You want penetration... all you can get. Ideally, a round that will go
>> clean through the beast.
>
> No you don't. You want a round that will penetrate bone if necessary and
> then expand. Ideally tearing out lungs, heart, or brain completely. The
> round needs to penetrate and then deposit all of its energy in the target.
> Ideally the round should stop completely just over midway in the
> target...some will argue that a round which fragments heavily is even more
> effective--but that is almost a religious argument amongst hunters of
> really big game. Any energy that passes out the far side is wasted
> powder.
>
>> You're better off with FMJ in handgun calibers. A stoked up .44 mag would
>> do it *if* you were competent (read: calm) enough to place your shot.
>> Spray and pray ain't going to get it done.
>
> Get the bears attention while it is charging. Stay pretty still until it
> gets close and then duck sideways if possible. Then get its attention by
> making as much noise as you can possibly make and hope you can get it to
> rear up, at which point you can usually get the heart and lungs. A gut
> shot works, but by then you may be badly injured. Best tactic is to keep
> an eye out for trees at least a 18 inches or so in diameter and climb
> fast--taking your weapon with you. Adult grizzlies cannot climb.
>
>> .454 Causull would be a better choice if you could handle it.
>> http://www.pistolwhipvideo.com/images/wallpaper.jpg
>> http://www.shootingtimes.com/handgun_reviews/rgrRH/
>> As JD said, it might buy you time to unsling your long gun.
>
> I've killed grizzly with a .357 magnum. I grew up with folks who killed
> them with a .22LR. Very difficult to avoid them if you spend much time
> in the woods up around Kalispell.
>
09-08-2006, 09:09 PM
#1403
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: the reported bear attack
The tree thing reminds me of when I was in Kodiak, Alaska. the joke was if
you climb a tree and a bear chases you up the tree its a black bear, if he
knocks it down, he's a Kodiak. (of course there are no black bears on
Kodiak, but its an attention getter.)
"Lon" <lon.stowell@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:RI-dnR2QBMwxxNnZnZ2dnUVZ_tSdnZ2d@comcast.com...
> Clay proclaimed:
>
>> Kate wrote:
>>
>>> If you carry the right ammunition, most calibers will mushroom.
>>
>>
>>
>> You don't want bullets that mushroom when shooting big,tough skinned
>> dangerous game.
>
> Yes you do. The skin of even a moose is trivially penetrated by a .22, so
> is that of a wood chuck which is even tougher than that of a moose
> although not nearly as thick.
>
>> You want penetration... all you can get. Ideally, a round that will go
>> clean through the beast.
>
> No you don't. You want a round that will penetrate bone if necessary and
> then expand. Ideally tearing out lungs, heart, or brain completely. The
> round needs to penetrate and then deposit all of its energy in the target.
> Ideally the round should stop completely just over midway in the
> target...some will argue that a round which fragments heavily is even more
> effective--but that is almost a religious argument amongst hunters of
> really big game. Any energy that passes out the far side is wasted
> powder.
>
>> You're better off with FMJ in handgun calibers. A stoked up .44 mag would
>> do it *if* you were competent (read: calm) enough to place your shot.
>> Spray and pray ain't going to get it done.
>
> Get the bears attention while it is charging. Stay pretty still until it
> gets close and then duck sideways if possible. Then get its attention by
> making as much noise as you can possibly make and hope you can get it to
> rear up, at which point you can usually get the heart and lungs. A gut
> shot works, but by then you may be badly injured. Best tactic is to keep
> an eye out for trees at least a 18 inches or so in diameter and climb
> fast--taking your weapon with you. Adult grizzlies cannot climb.
>
>> .454 Causull would be a better choice if you could handle it.
>> http://www.pistolwhipvideo.com/images/wallpaper.jpg
>> http://www.shootingtimes.com/handgun_reviews/rgrRH/
>> As JD said, it might buy you time to unsling your long gun.
>
> I've killed grizzly with a .357 magnum. I grew up with folks who killed
> them with a .22LR. Very difficult to avoid them if you spend much time
> in the woods up around Kalispell.
>
you climb a tree and a bear chases you up the tree its a black bear, if he
knocks it down, he's a Kodiak. (of course there are no black bears on
Kodiak, but its an attention getter.)
"Lon" <lon.stowell@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:RI-dnR2QBMwxxNnZnZ2dnUVZ_tSdnZ2d@comcast.com...
> Clay proclaimed:
>
>> Kate wrote:
>>
>>> If you carry the right ammunition, most calibers will mushroom.
>>
>>
>>
>> You don't want bullets that mushroom when shooting big,tough skinned
>> dangerous game.
>
> Yes you do. The skin of even a moose is trivially penetrated by a .22, so
> is that of a wood chuck which is even tougher than that of a moose
> although not nearly as thick.
>
>> You want penetration... all you can get. Ideally, a round that will go
>> clean through the beast.
>
> No you don't. You want a round that will penetrate bone if necessary and
> then expand. Ideally tearing out lungs, heart, or brain completely. The
> round needs to penetrate and then deposit all of its energy in the target.
> Ideally the round should stop completely just over midway in the
> target...some will argue that a round which fragments heavily is even more
> effective--but that is almost a religious argument amongst hunters of
> really big game. Any energy that passes out the far side is wasted
> powder.
>
>> You're better off with FMJ in handgun calibers. A stoked up .44 mag would
>> do it *if* you were competent (read: calm) enough to place your shot.
>> Spray and pray ain't going to get it done.
>
> Get the bears attention while it is charging. Stay pretty still until it
> gets close and then duck sideways if possible. Then get its attention by
> making as much noise as you can possibly make and hope you can get it to
> rear up, at which point you can usually get the heart and lungs. A gut
> shot works, but by then you may be badly injured. Best tactic is to keep
> an eye out for trees at least a 18 inches or so in diameter and climb
> fast--taking your weapon with you. Adult grizzlies cannot climb.
>
>> .454 Causull would be a better choice if you could handle it.
>> http://www.pistolwhipvideo.com/images/wallpaper.jpg
>> http://www.shootingtimes.com/handgun_reviews/rgrRH/
>> As JD said, it might buy you time to unsling your long gun.
>
> I've killed grizzly with a .357 magnum. I grew up with folks who killed
> them with a .22LR. Very difficult to avoid them if you spend much time
> in the woods up around Kalispell.
>
09-08-2006, 09:51 PM
#1404
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: the reported bear attack
Hi Rich,
Cool your back again.
The half breath really is the normal full exhaled in that resting
position, not like you were trying to clear your lungs for the full drag
on a cigarette. ;-)
God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Rich wrote:
>
> All the top shooting schools like gunsite and blackwater teach to fire on
> the natural pause of the breathing cycle when fully exhaled, not on the half
> breath.
Cool your back again.
The half breath really is the normal full exhaled in that resting
position, not like you were trying to clear your lungs for the full drag
on a cigarette. ;-)
God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Rich wrote:
>
> All the top shooting schools like gunsite and blackwater teach to fire on
> the natural pause of the breathing cycle when fully exhaled, not on the half
> breath.
09-08-2006, 09:51 PM
#1405
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: the reported bear attack
Hi Rich,
Cool your back again.
The half breath really is the normal full exhaled in that resting
position, not like you were trying to clear your lungs for the full drag
on a cigarette. ;-)
God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Rich wrote:
>
> All the top shooting schools like gunsite and blackwater teach to fire on
> the natural pause of the breathing cycle when fully exhaled, not on the half
> breath.
Cool your back again.
The half breath really is the normal full exhaled in that resting
position, not like you were trying to clear your lungs for the full drag
on a cigarette. ;-)
God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Rich wrote:
>
> All the top shooting schools like gunsite and blackwater teach to fire on
> the natural pause of the breathing cycle when fully exhaled, not on the half
> breath.
09-08-2006, 09:51 PM
#1406
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: the reported bear attack
Hi Rich,
Cool your back again.
The half breath really is the normal full exhaled in that resting
position, not like you were trying to clear your lungs for the full drag
on a cigarette. ;-)
God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Rich wrote:
>
> All the top shooting schools like gunsite and blackwater teach to fire on
> the natural pause of the breathing cycle when fully exhaled, not on the half
> breath.
Cool your back again.
The half breath really is the normal full exhaled in that resting
position, not like you were trying to clear your lungs for the full drag
on a cigarette. ;-)
God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
Rich wrote:
>
> All the top shooting schools like gunsite and blackwater teach to fire on
> the natural pause of the breathing cycle when fully exhaled, not on the half
> breath.
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