Re: Multiple fuel pump failures
 

Mike Romain wrote:
> Retiredff wrote:
>
>>
>> It failed again.
>
> Your Gas filter is in upside down would be my guess.
>
> The filter has two outlets. The center one goes to the carb and the
> 'top' one goes to the return line. If the return line outlet isn't up
> top, gas siphons back to the tank when it sits air locking the pump.
>
> If this is it, two or three primes down the carb with gas will
> normally get it going again.
>
> A pinhole leak in the gas line also causes this. It is a suction
> line, so a small leak only makes a stain, it doesn't drip but will
> let air in when it sits. You didn't find a stain though, so...
>
> Mike

Nope. Filter is correct. I found out many years ago that even if it is off
by just a small amount, I have problems. Besides, I think even you would
amazed at how many times you have offered up that very important piece of
info that gets overlooked. I find them them to be very benificial in that it
continually reminds me to get it correct!

Any kind of leak won't explain this, Mike. At least, not in a manner that
makes sense to me.

Today, I talked to a friend who owns his own garage, and he convinced me to
forget the NAPA and Advance Auto Parts pumps, and get a Jeep one. Provided,
of course, the pump lobe is good. I'll check that tonight.

Any guesses on how rare those are?

Chrysler doesn't make/stock/provide them anymore. There are two dealers in
the eastern U.S. that have them.

Re: Multiple fuel pump failures
 

Mike Romain wrote:
> Retiredff wrote:
>
>>
>> It failed again.
>
> Your Gas filter is in upside down would be my guess.
>
> The filter has two outlets. The center one goes to the carb and the
> 'top' one goes to the return line. If the return line outlet isn't up
> top, gas siphons back to the tank when it sits air locking the pump.
>
> If this is it, two or three primes down the carb with gas will
> normally get it going again.
>
> A pinhole leak in the gas line also causes this. It is a suction
> line, so a small leak only makes a stain, it doesn't drip but will
> let air in when it sits. You didn't find a stain though, so...
>
> Mike

Nope. Filter is correct. I found out many years ago that even if it is off
by just a small amount, I have problems. Besides, I think even you would
amazed at how many times you have offered up that very important piece of
info that gets overlooked. I find them them to be very benificial in that it
continually reminds me to get it correct!

Any kind of leak won't explain this, Mike. At least, not in a manner that
makes sense to me.

Today, I talked to a friend who owns his own garage, and he convinced me to
forget the NAPA and Advance Auto Parts pumps, and get a Jeep one. Provided,
of course, the pump lobe is good. I'll check that tonight.

Any guesses on how rare those are?

Chrysler doesn't make/stock/provide them anymore. There are two dealers in
the eastern U.S. that have them.

Re: Multiple fuel pump failures
 

Mike Romain wrote:
> Retiredff wrote:
>
>>
>> It failed again.
>
> Your Gas filter is in upside down would be my guess.
>
> The filter has two outlets. The center one goes to the carb and the
> 'top' one goes to the return line. If the return line outlet isn't up
> top, gas siphons back to the tank when it sits air locking the pump.
>
> If this is it, two or three primes down the carb with gas will
> normally get it going again.
>
> A pinhole leak in the gas line also causes this. It is a suction
> line, so a small leak only makes a stain, it doesn't drip but will
> let air in when it sits. You didn't find a stain though, so...
>
> Mike

Nope. Filter is correct. I found out many years ago that even if it is off
by just a small amount, I have problems. Besides, I think even you would
amazed at how many times you have offered up that very important piece of
info that gets overlooked. I find them them to be very benificial in that it
continually reminds me to get it correct!

Any kind of leak won't explain this, Mike. At least, not in a manner that
makes sense to me.

Today, I talked to a friend who owns his own garage, and he convinced me to
forget the NAPA and Advance Auto Parts pumps, and get a Jeep one. Provided,
of course, the pump lobe is good. I'll check that tonight.

Any guesses on how rare those are?

Chrysler doesn't make/stock/provide them anymore. There are two dealers in
the eastern U.S. that have them.

Re: Multiple fuel pump failures
 

Retiredff wrote:

> Doug-
>
> Any idea what to look for in a lobe? Something I can see by looking
> at it from the outside the block? I would sure hate if that was the
> problem, since this re-man only has about 11,000 miles on it. Out of
> warrenty, though, because of the time frame involved.

Depends. Some use a fuel pump pushrod and some just ride the cam lobe.
The Chevy 305 1982ish had a real problem with the pump arm being harder
than the lobe and wearing it down. The end result was no fuel pressure
even if you put in a new pump. Been too long since I messed with a
mechanical pump.

> I thought about the electric pump last year, but failed very little
> on-line that would help me with the process. This is a carbureted
> motor. Would it work?

Sure. Just goes ==== pump ===> regulator ===> carb
'-----return----'

Best location for an electric pump is actually back by
the gas tank and low on the frame rail. (out of rocks way)

All depends on the type of electric pump.

--
DougW

Re: Multiple fuel pump failures
 

Retiredff wrote:

> Doug-
>
> Any idea what to look for in a lobe? Something I can see by looking
> at it from the outside the block? I would sure hate if that was the
> problem, since this re-man only has about 11,000 miles on it. Out of
> warrenty, though, because of the time frame involved.

Depends. Some use a fuel pump pushrod and some just ride the cam lobe.
The Chevy 305 1982ish had a real problem with the pump arm being harder
than the lobe and wearing it down. The end result was no fuel pressure
even if you put in a new pump. Been too long since I messed with a
mechanical pump.

> I thought about the electric pump last year, but failed very little
> on-line that would help me with the process. This is a carbureted
> motor. Would it work?

Sure. Just goes ==== pump ===> regulator ===> carb
'-----return----'

Best location for an electric pump is actually back by
the gas tank and low on the frame rail. (out of rocks way)

All depends on the type of electric pump.

--
DougW

Re: Multiple fuel pump failures
 

Retiredff wrote:

> Doug-
>
> Any idea what to look for in a lobe? Something I can see by looking
> at it from the outside the block? I would sure hate if that was the
> problem, since this re-man only has about 11,000 miles on it. Out of
> warrenty, though, because of the time frame involved.

Depends. Some use a fuel pump pushrod and some just ride the cam lobe.
The Chevy 305 1982ish had a real problem with the pump arm being harder
than the lobe and wearing it down. The end result was no fuel pressure
even if you put in a new pump. Been too long since I messed with a
mechanical pump.

> I thought about the electric pump last year, but failed very little
> on-line that would help me with the process. This is a carbureted
> motor. Would it work?

Sure. Just goes ==== pump ===> regulator ===> carb
'-----return----'

Best location for an electric pump is actually back by
the gas tank and low on the frame rail. (out of rocks way)

All depends on the type of electric pump.

--
DougW

Re: Multiple fuel pump failures
 

"DougW" <I.only.read.usenet@invalid.address> wrote in message
news:smMYi.4376$4k.1371@newsfe11.phx...
> Retiredff wrote:
>
>> Doug-
>>
>> Any idea what to look for in a lobe? Something I can see by looking
>> at it from the outside the block? I would sure hate if that was the
>> problem, since this re-man only has about 11,000 miles on it. Out of
>> warrenty, though, because of the time frame involved.
>
> Depends. Some use a fuel pump pushrod and some just ride the cam lobe.
> The Chevy 305 1982ish had a real problem with the pump arm being harder
> than the lobe and wearing it down. The end result was no fuel pressure
> even if you put in a new pump. Been too long since I messed with a
> mechanical pump.
>
>> I thought about the electric pump last year, but failed very little
>> on-line that would help me with the process. This is a carbureted
>> motor. Would it work?
>
> Sure. Just goes ==== pump ===> regulator ===> carb
> '-----return----'
>
> Best location for an electric pump is actually back by
> the gas tank and low on the frame rail. (out of rocks way)
>
> All depends on the type of electric pump.
>
For an electric pump a safety circuit is a good idea. Make sure it only
gets power when the starter circuit is energized or the engine is actually
running, not ignition is on. The documentation with the fuel pump should
give some useful ideas. Some people energize them with a relay fed from the
starter circuit and the oil pressure signal. You don't want to be pumping
fuel if the vehicle is upside down or if the vehicle is on fire, etc.

Cheers,

Earle

Re: Multiple fuel pump failures
 

"DougW" <I.only.read.usenet@invalid.address> wrote in message
news:smMYi.4376$4k.1371@newsfe11.phx...
> Retiredff wrote:
>
>> Doug-
>>
>> Any idea what to look for in a lobe? Something I can see by looking
>> at it from the outside the block? I would sure hate if that was the
>> problem, since this re-man only has about 11,000 miles on it. Out of
>> warrenty, though, because of the time frame involved.
>
> Depends. Some use a fuel pump pushrod and some just ride the cam lobe.
> The Chevy 305 1982ish had a real problem with the pump arm being harder
> than the lobe and wearing it down. The end result was no fuel pressure
> even if you put in a new pump. Been too long since I messed with a
> mechanical pump.
>
>> I thought about the electric pump last year, but failed very little
>> on-line that would help me with the process. This is a carbureted
>> motor. Would it work?
>
> Sure. Just goes ==== pump ===> regulator ===> carb
> '-----return----'
>
> Best location for an electric pump is actually back by
> the gas tank and low on the frame rail. (out of rocks way)
>
> All depends on the type of electric pump.
>
For an electric pump a safety circuit is a good idea. Make sure it only
gets power when the starter circuit is energized or the engine is actually
running, not ignition is on. The documentation with the fuel pump should
give some useful ideas. Some people energize them with a relay fed from the
starter circuit and the oil pressure signal. You don't want to be pumping
fuel if the vehicle is upside down or if the vehicle is on fire, etc.

Cheers,

Earle

Re: Multiple fuel pump failures
 

"DougW" <I.only.read.usenet@invalid.address> wrote in message
news:smMYi.4376$4k.1371@newsfe11.phx...
> Retiredff wrote:
>
>> Doug-
>>
>> Any idea what to look for in a lobe? Something I can see by looking
>> at it from the outside the block? I would sure hate if that was the
>> problem, since this re-man only has about 11,000 miles on it. Out of
>> warrenty, though, because of the time frame involved.
>
> Depends. Some use a fuel pump pushrod and some just ride the cam lobe.
> The Chevy 305 1982ish had a real problem with the pump arm being harder
> than the lobe and wearing it down. The end result was no fuel pressure
> even if you put in a new pump. Been too long since I messed with a
> mechanical pump.
>
>> I thought about the electric pump last year, but failed very little
>> on-line that would help me with the process. This is a carbureted
>> motor. Would it work?
>
> Sure. Just goes ==== pump ===> regulator ===> carb
> '-----return----'
>
> Best location for an electric pump is actually back by
> the gas tank and low on the frame rail. (out of rocks way)
>
> All depends on the type of electric pump.
>
For an electric pump a safety circuit is a good idea. Make sure it only
gets power when the starter circuit is energized or the engine is actually
running, not ignition is on. The documentation with the fuel pump should
give some useful ideas. Some people energize them with a relay fed from the
starter circuit and the oil pressure signal. You don't want to be pumping
fuel if the vehicle is upside down or if the vehicle is on fire, etc.

Cheers,

Earle

Re: Multiple fuel pump failures
 

Earle Horton wrote:

> For an electric pump a safety circuit is a good idea. Make sure it
> only gets power when the starter circuit is energized or the engine
> is actually running, not ignition is on. The documentation with the
> fuel pump should give some useful ideas. Some people energize them
> with a relay fed from the starter circuit and the oil pressure
> signal. You don't want to be pumping fuel if the vehicle is upside
> down or if the vehicle is on fire, etc.

The most common used to be an oil pressure interconnect.
http://www.izook.com/tech/samurai/en...p/fuelpump.htm
That way if the engine turns over, the oil pressure will go
to zero, the pump stops, and the engine stops.

Just remember to keep a jumper in case the switch dies on the
trail. :)

--
DougW