Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

Hey Guys, long time no post. Good to see that a lot of the regulars
are still here. My son needs a car, his first, and I've thinking
about buying him a Grand Cherokee. While I can quote you chapter and
verse from the book of TJ, I don't know much about the Grands.

I do know that I'm looking at the 93 - 98 models. The Jeep will
mostly be used for getting to school and various errands. He and I
will be putting on a mild lift and doing some of the easier Moab
trails.

Questions
Which years should I look for/avoid?
Gas mileage, how bad is it?
Is the gas mileage for the 6 better than the V8?
Transfer cases options and any to avoid?
How does the Grand do in accidents?

TIA
Dean

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

On Jul 10, 8:39 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hey Guys, long time no post. Good to see that a lot of the regulars
> are still here. My son needs a car, his first, and I've thinking
> about buying him a Grand Cherokee. While I can quote you chapter and
> verse from the book of TJ, I don't know much about the Grands.
>
> I do know that I'm looking at the 93 - 98 models. The Jeep will
> mostly be used for getting to school and various errands. He and I
> will be putting on a mild lift and doing some of the easier Moab
> trails.
>
> Questions
> Which years should I look for/avoid?
> Gas mileage, how bad is it?
> Is the gas mileage for the 6 better than the V8?
> Transfer cases options and any to avoid?
> How does the Grand do in accidents?
>
> TIA
> Dean

Ok, I'll bite on a few areas:

Well, you know the Chrysler-derived Wrangler automatic -- the GC unit
is from the same family of transmissions. I don't see the same
failure rates with Wranglers as with heavier OD vehicles, but I'm not
a fan of the transmission -- the fact is that Dodge didn't have the
time or money or motivation to develop a new OD transmission back in
the day, so they took the 727 3-spd, slapped on what amounts to an
auxiliary OD unit, and milked the idea. Transmissions aren't rocket
science, so that should be fine...right? Well, the bottom line is
that it didn't mature into a very reliable package -- 100K is a
blessing on a factory unit. Having said that much, when they work,
they work well. Up to '96 is a mechanically governed setup, rebuilds
are a couple hundred cheaper than an electronically governed setup
(96+). Not 100% on the date, someone can verify.

Same logic goes for the V-8: a tried and true soldier with a new set
of boots. The bad news is that the Magnum-engine head castings are
prone to cracking at the valve seats, it's worth having the coolant
tested for the presence of combustion gases. Aftermarket replacement
heads are popular and not too pricey, go to www.------engines.com to
see their solutions for heads as well as intake leaks.

I understand that every vehicle has its own share of problems, but the
prospect of spending -- oh, say, $2500 if you do it yourself -- out of
pocket just to keep it driving....on something that is sure to have
100k on it already....well, that seems like a deal-buster to me.

[YES lesser quality Asian heads are available at half the price, and
YES if you are a great shopper you can get this tranny rebuilt and
installed for $1100, so that's only a $1600 gamble......but that is
definitely a bottom-bin parts affair]

Jon

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

On Jul 10, 8:39 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hey Guys, long time no post. Good to see that a lot of the regulars
> are still here. My son needs a car, his first, and I've thinking
> about buying him a Grand Cherokee. While I can quote you chapter and
> verse from the book of TJ, I don't know much about the Grands.
>
> I do know that I'm looking at the 93 - 98 models. The Jeep will
> mostly be used for getting to school and various errands. He and I
> will be putting on a mild lift and doing some of the easier Moab
> trails.
>
> Questions
> Which years should I look for/avoid?
> Gas mileage, how bad is it?
> Is the gas mileage for the 6 better than the V8?
> Transfer cases options and any to avoid?
> How does the Grand do in accidents?
>
> TIA
> Dean

Ok, I'll bite on a few areas:

Well, you know the Chrysler-derived Wrangler automatic -- the GC unit
is from the same family of transmissions. I don't see the same
failure rates with Wranglers as with heavier OD vehicles, but I'm not
a fan of the transmission -- the fact is that Dodge didn't have the
time or money or motivation to develop a new OD transmission back in
the day, so they took the 727 3-spd, slapped on what amounts to an
auxiliary OD unit, and milked the idea. Transmissions aren't rocket
science, so that should be fine...right? Well, the bottom line is
that it didn't mature into a very reliable package -- 100K is a
blessing on a factory unit. Having said that much, when they work,
they work well. Up to '96 is a mechanically governed setup, rebuilds
are a couple hundred cheaper than an electronically governed setup
(96+). Not 100% on the date, someone can verify.

Same logic goes for the V-8: a tried and true soldier with a new set
of boots. The bad news is that the Magnum-engine head castings are
prone to cracking at the valve seats, it's worth having the coolant
tested for the presence of combustion gases. Aftermarket replacement
heads are popular and not too pricey, go to www.------engines.com to
see their solutions for heads as well as intake leaks.

I understand that every vehicle has its own share of problems, but the
prospect of spending -- oh, say, $2500 if you do it yourself -- out of
pocket just to keep it driving....on something that is sure to have
100k on it already....well, that seems like a deal-buster to me.

[YES lesser quality Asian heads are available at half the price, and
YES if you are a great shopper you can get this tranny rebuilt and
installed for $1100, so that's only a $1600 gamble......but that is
definitely a bottom-bin parts affair]

Jon

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

On Jul 10, 8:39 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hey Guys, long time no post. Good to see that a lot of the regulars
> are still here. My son needs a car, his first, and I've thinking
> about buying him a Grand Cherokee. While I can quote you chapter and
> verse from the book of TJ, I don't know much about the Grands.
>
> I do know that I'm looking at the 93 - 98 models. The Jeep will
> mostly be used for getting to school and various errands. He and I
> will be putting on a mild lift and doing some of the easier Moab
> trails.
>
> Questions
> Which years should I look for/avoid?
> Gas mileage, how bad is it?
> Is the gas mileage for the 6 better than the V8?
> Transfer cases options and any to avoid?
> How does the Grand do in accidents?
>
> TIA
> Dean

Ok, I'll bite on a few areas:

Well, you know the Chrysler-derived Wrangler automatic -- the GC unit
is from the same family of transmissions. I don't see the same
failure rates with Wranglers as with heavier OD vehicles, but I'm not
a fan of the transmission -- the fact is that Dodge didn't have the
time or money or motivation to develop a new OD transmission back in
the day, so they took the 727 3-spd, slapped on what amounts to an
auxiliary OD unit, and milked the idea. Transmissions aren't rocket
science, so that should be fine...right? Well, the bottom line is
that it didn't mature into a very reliable package -- 100K is a
blessing on a factory unit. Having said that much, when they work,
they work well. Up to '96 is a mechanically governed setup, rebuilds
are a couple hundred cheaper than an electronically governed setup
(96+). Not 100% on the date, someone can verify.

Same logic goes for the V-8: a tried and true soldier with a new set
of boots. The bad news is that the Magnum-engine head castings are
prone to cracking at the valve seats, it's worth having the coolant
tested for the presence of combustion gases. Aftermarket replacement
heads are popular and not too pricey, go to www.------engines.com to
see their solutions for heads as well as intake leaks.

I understand that every vehicle has its own share of problems, but the
prospect of spending -- oh, say, $2500 if you do it yourself -- out of
pocket just to keep it driving....on something that is sure to have
100k on it already....well, that seems like a deal-buster to me.

[YES lesser quality Asian heads are available at half the price, and
YES if you are a great shopper you can get this tranny rebuilt and
installed for $1100, so that's only a $1600 gamble......but that is
definitely a bottom-bin parts affair]

Jon

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

On Jul 10, 8:39 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hey Guys, long time no post. Good to see that a lot of the regulars
> are still here. My son needs a car, his first, and I've thinking
> about buying him a Grand Cherokee. While I can quote you chapter and
> verse from the book of TJ, I don't know much about the Grands.
>
> I do know that I'm looking at the 93 - 98 models. The Jeep will
> mostly be used for getting to school and various errands. He and I
> will be putting on a mild lift and doing some of the easier Moab
> trails.
>
> Questions
> Which years should I look for/avoid?
> Gas mileage, how bad is it?
> Is the gas mileage for the 6 better than the V8?
> Transfer cases options and any to avoid?
> How does the Grand do in accidents?
>
> TIA
> Dean

Ok, I'll bite on a few areas:

Well, you know the Chrysler-derived Wrangler automatic -- the GC unit
is from the same family of transmissions. I don't see the same
failure rates with Wranglers as with heavier OD vehicles, but I'm not
a fan of the transmission -- the fact is that Dodge didn't have the
time or money or motivation to develop a new OD transmission back in
the day, so they took the 727 3-spd, slapped on what amounts to an
auxiliary OD unit, and milked the idea. Transmissions aren't rocket
science, so that should be fine...right? Well, the bottom line is
that it didn't mature into a very reliable package -- 100K is a
blessing on a factory unit. Having said that much, when they work,
they work well. Up to '96 is a mechanically governed setup, rebuilds
are a couple hundred cheaper than an electronically governed setup
(96+). Not 100% on the date, someone can verify.

Same logic goes for the V-8: a tried and true soldier with a new set
of boots. The bad news is that the Magnum-engine head castings are
prone to cracking at the valve seats, it's worth having the coolant
tested for the presence of combustion gases. Aftermarket replacement
heads are popular and not too pricey, go to www.------engines.com to
see their solutions for heads as well as intake leaks.

I understand that every vehicle has its own share of problems, but the
prospect of spending -- oh, say, $2500 if you do it yourself -- out of
pocket just to keep it driving....on something that is sure to have
100k on it already....well, that seems like a deal-buster to me.

[YES lesser quality Asian heads are available at half the price, and
YES if you are a great shopper you can get this tranny rebuilt and
installed for $1100, so that's only a $1600 gamble......but that is
definitely a bottom-bin parts affair]

Jon

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

"Jon" <jongoddard@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1184180864.627591.94160@g4g2000hsf.googlegrou ps.com...
> On Jul 10, 8:39 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Well, you know the Chrysler-derived Wrangler automatic -- the GC unit
> is from the same family of transmissions. I don't see the same
> failure rates with Wranglers as with heavier OD vehicles, but I'm not
> a fan of the transmission --

I don't know much about the Grands, even though I had a '93, but is this
accurate? The XJ's AX4 automatic is known to be a pretty reliable
transmission, and it seems to me it would have made more sense since they
already had an OD unit in the lineup they would have used it instead of
reengineering a Wrangler 3-speed.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

"Jon" <jongoddard@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1184180864.627591.94160@g4g2000hsf.googlegrou ps.com...
> On Jul 10, 8:39 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Well, you know the Chrysler-derived Wrangler automatic -- the GC unit
> is from the same family of transmissions. I don't see the same
> failure rates with Wranglers as with heavier OD vehicles, but I'm not
> a fan of the transmission --

I don't know much about the Grands, even though I had a '93, but is this
accurate? The XJ's AX4 automatic is known to be a pretty reliable
transmission, and it seems to me it would have made more sense since they
already had an OD unit in the lineup they would have used it instead of
reengineering a Wrangler 3-speed.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

"Jon" <jongoddard@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1184180864.627591.94160@g4g2000hsf.googlegrou ps.com...
> On Jul 10, 8:39 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Well, you know the Chrysler-derived Wrangler automatic -- the GC unit
> is from the same family of transmissions. I don't see the same
> failure rates with Wranglers as with heavier OD vehicles, but I'm not
> a fan of the transmission --

I don't know much about the Grands, even though I had a '93, but is this
accurate? The XJ's AX4 automatic is known to be a pretty reliable
transmission, and it seems to me it would have made more sense since they
already had an OD unit in the lineup they would have used it instead of
reengineering a Wrangler 3-speed.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

"Jon" <jongoddard@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1184180864.627591.94160@g4g2000hsf.googlegrou ps.com...
> On Jul 10, 8:39 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Well, you know the Chrysler-derived Wrangler automatic -- the GC unit
> is from the same family of transmissions. I don't see the same
> failure rates with Wranglers as with heavier OD vehicles, but I'm not
> a fan of the transmission --

I don't know much about the Grands, even though I had a '93, but is this
accurate? The XJ's AX4 automatic is known to be a pretty reliable
transmission, and it seems to me it would have made more sense since they
already had an OD unit in the lineup they would have used it instead of
reengineering a Wrangler 3-speed.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

On Jul 11, 1:53 pm, "Matt Macchiarolo" <m...@nospamplease.com> wrote:
> "Jon" <jongodd...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:1184180864.627591.94160@g4g2000hsf.googlegrou ps.com...
>
> > On Jul 10, 8:39 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Well, you know the Chrysler-derived Wrangler automatic -- the GC unit
> > is from the same family of transmissions. I don't see the same
> > failure rates with Wranglers as with heavier OD vehicles, but I'm not
> > a fan of the transmission --
>
> I don't know much about the Grands, even though I had a '93, but is this
> accurate? The XJ's AX4 automatic is known to be a pretty reliable
> transmission, and it seems to me it would have made more sense since they
> already had an OD unit in the lineup they would have used it instead of
> reengineering a Wrangler 3-speed.


Hi Matt,

I was picking up the conversation from his TJ perspective -- so,
before that point: Chrysler steps in, and puts their transmission
into Jeeps -- why pay someone else? Jeeps get the 3 speed version
because the aformentioned OD "add-on" makes for a ridiculously long
transmission.

Don't quote all the digits, but this is my understanding: A-727 > 727
w/lockup > A-518 (4sp) > 4xRH > 4xRE .....A-518 might be the old name
for 4xRH

But don't take my word for it: http://www.jeeptech.com/trans/

And [oops] I do see that early 1993 4.0 GCs have the Aisin unit.

Jon

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

On Jul 11, 1:53 pm, "Matt Macchiarolo" <m...@nospamplease.com> wrote:
> "Jon" <jongodd...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:1184180864.627591.94160@g4g2000hsf.googlegrou ps.com...
>
> > On Jul 10, 8:39 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Well, you know the Chrysler-derived Wrangler automatic -- the GC unit
> > is from the same family of transmissions. I don't see the same
> > failure rates with Wranglers as with heavier OD vehicles, but I'm not
> > a fan of the transmission --
>
> I don't know much about the Grands, even though I had a '93, but is this
> accurate? The XJ's AX4 automatic is known to be a pretty reliable
> transmission, and it seems to me it would have made more sense since they
> already had an OD unit in the lineup they would have used it instead of
> reengineering a Wrangler 3-speed.


Hi Matt,

I was picking up the conversation from his TJ perspective -- so,
before that point: Chrysler steps in, and puts their transmission
into Jeeps -- why pay someone else? Jeeps get the 3 speed version
because the aformentioned OD "add-on" makes for a ridiculously long
transmission.

Don't quote all the digits, but this is my understanding: A-727 > 727
w/lockup > A-518 (4sp) > 4xRH > 4xRE .....A-518 might be the old name
for 4xRH

But don't take my word for it: http://www.jeeptech.com/trans/

And [oops] I do see that early 1993 4.0 GCs have the Aisin unit.

Jon

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

On Jul 11, 1:53 pm, "Matt Macchiarolo" <m...@nospamplease.com> wrote:
> "Jon" <jongodd...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:1184180864.627591.94160@g4g2000hsf.googlegrou ps.com...
>
> > On Jul 10, 8:39 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Well, you know the Chrysler-derived Wrangler automatic -- the GC unit
> > is from the same family of transmissions. I don't see the same
> > failure rates with Wranglers as with heavier OD vehicles, but I'm not
> > a fan of the transmission --
>
> I don't know much about the Grands, even though I had a '93, but is this
> accurate? The XJ's AX4 automatic is known to be a pretty reliable
> transmission, and it seems to me it would have made more sense since they
> already had an OD unit in the lineup they would have used it instead of
> reengineering a Wrangler 3-speed.


Hi Matt,

I was picking up the conversation from his TJ perspective -- so,
before that point: Chrysler steps in, and puts their transmission
into Jeeps -- why pay someone else? Jeeps get the 3 speed version
because the aformentioned OD "add-on" makes for a ridiculously long
transmission.

Don't quote all the digits, but this is my understanding: A-727 > 727
w/lockup > A-518 (4sp) > 4xRH > 4xRE .....A-518 might be the old name
for 4xRH

But don't take my word for it: http://www.jeeptech.com/trans/

And [oops] I do see that early 1993 4.0 GCs have the Aisin unit.

Jon

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

On Jul 11, 1:53 pm, "Matt Macchiarolo" <m...@nospamplease.com> wrote:
> "Jon" <jongodd...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:1184180864.627591.94160@g4g2000hsf.googlegrou ps.com...
>
> > On Jul 10, 8:39 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Well, you know the Chrysler-derived Wrangler automatic -- the GC unit
> > is from the same family of transmissions. I don't see the same
> > failure rates with Wranglers as with heavier OD vehicles, but I'm not
> > a fan of the transmission --
>
> I don't know much about the Grands, even though I had a '93, but is this
> accurate? The XJ's AX4 automatic is known to be a pretty reliable
> transmission, and it seems to me it would have made more sense since they
> already had an OD unit in the lineup they would have used it instead of
> reengineering a Wrangler 3-speed.


Hi Matt,

I was picking up the conversation from his TJ perspective -- so,
before that point: Chrysler steps in, and puts their transmission
into Jeeps -- why pay someone else? Jeeps get the 3 speed version
because the aformentioned OD "add-on" makes for a ridiculously long
transmission.

Don't quote all the digits, but this is my understanding: A-727 > 727
w/lockup > A-518 (4sp) > 4xRH > 4xRE .....A-518 might be the old name
for 4xRH

But don't take my word for it: http://www.jeeptech.com/trans/

And [oops] I do see that early 1993 4.0 GCs have the Aisin unit.

Jon

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

On Jul 11, 2:16 pm, Jon <jongodd...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 11, 1:53 pm, "Matt Macchiarolo" <m...@nospamplease.com> wrote:
>
> > "Jon" <jongodd...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:1184180864.627591.94160@g4g2000hsf.googlegro ups.com...
>
> > > On Jul 10, 8:39 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Well, you know the Chrysler-derived Wrangler automatic -- the GC unit
> > > is from the same family of transmissions. I don't see the same
> > > failure rates with Wranglers as with heavier OD vehicles, but I'm not
> > > a fan of the transmission --
>
> > I don't know much about the Grands, even though I had a '93, but is this
> > accurate? The XJ's AX4 automatic is known to be a pretty reliable
> > transmission, and it seems to me it would have made more sense since they
> > already had an OD unit in the lineup they would have used it instead of
> > reengineering a Wrangler 3-speed.
>
> Hi Matt,
>
> I was picking up the conversation from his TJ perspective -- so,
> before that point: Chrysler steps in, and puts their transmission
> into Jeeps -- why pay someone else? Jeeps get the 3 speed version
> because the aformentioned OD "add-on" makes for a ridiculously long
> transmission.
>
> Don't quote all the digits, but this is my understanding: A-727 > 727
> w/lockup > A-518 (4sp) > 4xRH > 4xRE .....A-518 might be the old name
> for 4xRH
>
> But don't take my word for it: http://www.jeeptech.com/trans/
>
> And [oops] I do see that early 1993 4.0 GCs have the Aisin unit.
>
> Jon

ARR....replace "Jeeps" in previous post with "Wranglers". Old habits
die hard.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

On Jul 11, 2:16 pm, Jon <jongodd...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 11, 1:53 pm, "Matt Macchiarolo" <m...@nospamplease.com> wrote:
>
> > "Jon" <jongodd...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:1184180864.627591.94160@g4g2000hsf.googlegro ups.com...
>
> > > On Jul 10, 8:39 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Well, you know the Chrysler-derived Wrangler automatic -- the GC unit
> > > is from the same family of transmissions. I don't see the same
> > > failure rates with Wranglers as with heavier OD vehicles, but I'm not
> > > a fan of the transmission --
>
> > I don't know much about the Grands, even though I had a '93, but is this
> > accurate? The XJ's AX4 automatic is known to be a pretty reliable
> > transmission, and it seems to me it would have made more sense since they
> > already had an OD unit in the lineup they would have used it instead of
> > reengineering a Wrangler 3-speed.
>
> Hi Matt,
>
> I was picking up the conversation from his TJ perspective -- so,
> before that point: Chrysler steps in, and puts their transmission
> into Jeeps -- why pay someone else? Jeeps get the 3 speed version
> because the aformentioned OD "add-on" makes for a ridiculously long
> transmission.
>
> Don't quote all the digits, but this is my understanding: A-727 > 727
> w/lockup > A-518 (4sp) > 4xRH > 4xRE .....A-518 might be the old name
> for 4xRH
>
> But don't take my word for it: http://www.jeeptech.com/trans/
>
> And [oops] I do see that early 1993 4.0 GCs have the Aisin unit.
>
> Jon

ARR....replace "Jeeps" in previous post with "Wranglers". Old habits
die hard.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

On Jul 11, 2:16 pm, Jon <jongodd...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 11, 1:53 pm, "Matt Macchiarolo" <m...@nospamplease.com> wrote:
>
> > "Jon" <jongodd...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:1184180864.627591.94160@g4g2000hsf.googlegro ups.com...
>
> > > On Jul 10, 8:39 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Well, you know the Chrysler-derived Wrangler automatic -- the GC unit
> > > is from the same family of transmissions. I don't see the same
> > > failure rates with Wranglers as with heavier OD vehicles, but I'm not
> > > a fan of the transmission --
>
> > I don't know much about the Grands, even though I had a '93, but is this
> > accurate? The XJ's AX4 automatic is known to be a pretty reliable
> > transmission, and it seems to me it would have made more sense since they
> > already had an OD unit in the lineup they would have used it instead of
> > reengineering a Wrangler 3-speed.
>
> Hi Matt,
>
> I was picking up the conversation from his TJ perspective -- so,
> before that point: Chrysler steps in, and puts their transmission
> into Jeeps -- why pay someone else? Jeeps get the 3 speed version
> because the aformentioned OD "add-on" makes for a ridiculously long
> transmission.
>
> Don't quote all the digits, but this is my understanding: A-727 > 727
> w/lockup > A-518 (4sp) > 4xRH > 4xRE .....A-518 might be the old name
> for 4xRH
>
> But don't take my word for it: http://www.jeeptech.com/trans/
>
> And [oops] I do see that early 1993 4.0 GCs have the Aisin unit.
>
> Jon

ARR....replace "Jeeps" in previous post with "Wranglers". Old habits
die hard.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

On Jul 11, 2:16 pm, Jon <jongodd...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 11, 1:53 pm, "Matt Macchiarolo" <m...@nospamplease.com> wrote:
>
> > "Jon" <jongodd...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:1184180864.627591.94160@g4g2000hsf.googlegro ups.com...
>
> > > On Jul 10, 8:39 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Well, you know the Chrysler-derived Wrangler automatic -- the GC unit
> > > is from the same family of transmissions. I don't see the same
> > > failure rates with Wranglers as with heavier OD vehicles, but I'm not
> > > a fan of the transmission --
>
> > I don't know much about the Grands, even though I had a '93, but is this
> > accurate? The XJ's AX4 automatic is known to be a pretty reliable
> > transmission, and it seems to me it would have made more sense since they
> > already had an OD unit in the lineup they would have used it instead of
> > reengineering a Wrangler 3-speed.
>
> Hi Matt,
>
> I was picking up the conversation from his TJ perspective -- so,
> before that point: Chrysler steps in, and puts their transmission
> into Jeeps -- why pay someone else? Jeeps get the 3 speed version
> because the aformentioned OD "add-on" makes for a ridiculously long
> transmission.
>
> Don't quote all the digits, but this is my understanding: A-727 > 727
> w/lockup > A-518 (4sp) > 4xRH > 4xRE .....A-518 might be the old name
> for 4xRH
>
> But don't take my word for it: http://www.jeeptech.com/trans/
>
> And [oops] I do see that early 1993 4.0 GCs have the Aisin unit.
>
> Jon

ARR....replace "Jeeps" in previous post with "Wranglers". Old habits
die hard.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

"Jon" <jongoddard@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1184188607.613487.83170@d55g2000hsg.googlegro ups.com...

>
> Hi Matt,
>
> I was picking up the conversation from his TJ perspective -- so,
> before that point: Chrysler steps in, and puts their transmission
> into Jeeps -- why pay someone else? Jeeps get the 3 speed version
> because the aformentioned OD "add-on" makes for a ridiculously long
> transmission.

>
> Don't quote all the digits, but this is my understanding: A-727 > 727
> w/lockup > A-518 (4sp) > 4xRH > 4xRE .....A-518 might be the old name
> for 4xRH
>
> But don't take my word for it: http://www.jeeptech.com/trans/

Got it. FYI, TJ's started getting a OD transmission in the last few years,
2002 IIRC.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

"Jon" <jongoddard@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1184188607.613487.83170@d55g2000hsg.googlegro ups.com...

>
> Hi Matt,
>
> I was picking up the conversation from his TJ perspective -- so,
> before that point: Chrysler steps in, and puts their transmission
> into Jeeps -- why pay someone else? Jeeps get the 3 speed version
> because the aformentioned OD "add-on" makes for a ridiculously long
> transmission.

>
> Don't quote all the digits, but this is my understanding: A-727 > 727
> w/lockup > A-518 (4sp) > 4xRH > 4xRE .....A-518 might be the old name
> for 4xRH
>
> But don't take my word for it: http://www.jeeptech.com/trans/

Got it. FYI, TJ's started getting a OD transmission in the last few years,
2002 IIRC.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

"Jon" <jongoddard@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1184188607.613487.83170@d55g2000hsg.googlegro ups.com...

>
> Hi Matt,
>
> I was picking up the conversation from his TJ perspective -- so,
> before that point: Chrysler steps in, and puts their transmission
> into Jeeps -- why pay someone else? Jeeps get the 3 speed version
> because the aformentioned OD "add-on" makes for a ridiculously long
> transmission.

>
> Don't quote all the digits, but this is my understanding: A-727 > 727
> w/lockup > A-518 (4sp) > 4xRH > 4xRE .....A-518 might be the old name
> for 4xRH
>
> But don't take my word for it: http://www.jeeptech.com/trans/

Got it. FYI, TJ's started getting a OD transmission in the last few years,
2002 IIRC.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

"Jon" <jongoddard@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1184188607.613487.83170@d55g2000hsg.googlegro ups.com...

>
> Hi Matt,
>
> I was picking up the conversation from his TJ perspective -- so,
> before that point: Chrysler steps in, and puts their transmission
> into Jeeps -- why pay someone else? Jeeps get the 3 speed version
> because the aformentioned OD "add-on" makes for a ridiculously long
> transmission.

>
> Don't quote all the digits, but this is my understanding: A-727 > 727
> w/lockup > A-518 (4sp) > 4xRH > 4xRE .....A-518 might be the old name
> for 4xRH
>
> But don't take my word for it: http://www.jeeptech.com/trans/

Got it. FYI, TJ's started getting a OD transmission in the last few years,
2002 IIRC.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

Ok so the ZJ has a dog's breath transmission. Which probably explains
why so many of the used one's I'm looking at proudly advertise their
newly replaced transmissions. Is the design basically flawed or have
the issues been fixed so that a replacement transmission can be
counted on to last for a good while?

Dean
Check out my web site 6bargrill . com. The url is a complete rip-off
of Nate's 7slotgrill, but I couldn't come up with something I liked
better.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

Ok so the ZJ has a dog's breath transmission. Which probably explains
why so many of the used one's I'm looking at proudly advertise their
newly replaced transmissions. Is the design basically flawed or have
the issues been fixed so that a replacement transmission can be
counted on to last for a good while?

Dean
Check out my web site 6bargrill . com. The url is a complete rip-off
of Nate's 7slotgrill, but I couldn't come up with something I liked
better.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

Ok so the ZJ has a dog's breath transmission. Which probably explains
why so many of the used one's I'm looking at proudly advertise their
newly replaced transmissions. Is the design basically flawed or have
the issues been fixed so that a replacement transmission can be
counted on to last for a good while?

Dean
Check out my web site 6bargrill . com. The url is a complete rip-off
of Nate's 7slotgrill, but I couldn't come up with something I liked
better.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

Ok so the ZJ has a dog's breath transmission. Which probably explains
why so many of the used one's I'm looking at proudly advertise their
newly replaced transmissions. Is the design basically flawed or have
the issues been fixed so that a replacement transmission can be
counted on to last for a good while?

Dean
Check out my web site 6bargrill . com. The url is a complete rip-off
of Nate's 7slotgrill, but I couldn't come up with something I liked
better.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

I've got another question related to the variations on the full time
transfer cases. Can the transfer case be locked into an off-road only
mode? How reliable are they? Is one flavor better than any other?
(better is defined reliable, and can be locked for off-road use)

tia
Dean

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

I've got another question related to the variations on the full time
transfer cases. Can the transfer case be locked into an off-road only
mode? How reliable are they? Is one flavor better than any other?
(better is defined reliable, and can be locked for off-road use)

tia
Dean

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

I've got another question related to the variations on the full time
transfer cases. Can the transfer case be locked into an off-road only
mode? How reliable are they? Is one flavor better than any other?
(better is defined reliable, and can be locked for off-road use)

tia
Dean

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

I've got another question related to the variations on the full time
transfer cases. Can the transfer case be locked into an off-road only
mode? How reliable are they? Is one flavor better than any other?
(better is defined reliable, and can be locked for off-road use)

tia
Dean

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

In article <1184207277.959021.311660@n60g2000hse.googlegroups .com>,
Dean <JuanSigned@gmail.com> wrote:
#I've got another question related to the variations on the full time
#transfer cases. Can the transfer case be locked into an off-road only
#mode? How reliable are they? Is one flavor better than any other?
#(better is defined reliable, and can be locked for off-road use)
#
#tia
#Dean
#

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeep_Grand_Cherokee

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeep_fo..._drive_systems

/herb

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

In article <1184207277.959021.311660@n60g2000hse.googlegroups .com>,
Dean <JuanSigned@gmail.com> wrote:
#I've got another question related to the variations on the full time
#transfer cases. Can the transfer case be locked into an off-road only
#mode? How reliable are they? Is one flavor better than any other?
#(better is defined reliable, and can be locked for off-road use)
#
#tia
#Dean
#

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeep_Grand_Cherokee

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeep_fo..._drive_systems

/herb

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

In article <1184207277.959021.311660@n60g2000hse.googlegroups .com>,
Dean <JuanSigned@gmail.com> wrote:
#I've got another question related to the variations on the full time
#transfer cases. Can the transfer case be locked into an off-road only
#mode? How reliable are they? Is one flavor better than any other?
#(better is defined reliable, and can be locked for off-road use)
#
#tia
#Dean
#

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeep_Grand_Cherokee

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeep_fo..._drive_systems

/herb

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

In article <1184207277.959021.311660@n60g2000hse.googlegroups .com>,
Dean <JuanSigned@gmail.com> wrote:
#I've got another question related to the variations on the full time
#transfer cases. Can the transfer case be locked into an off-road only
#mode? How reliable are they? Is one flavor better than any other?
#(better is defined reliable, and can be locked for off-road use)
#
#tia
#Dean
#

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeep_Grand_Cherokee

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeep_fo..._drive_systems

/herb

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

On Jul 11, 7:19 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Ok so the ZJ has a dog's breath transmission. Which probably explains
> why so many of the used one's I'm looking at proudly advertise their
> newly replaced transmissions. Is the design basically flawed or have
> the issues been fixed so that a replacement transmission can be
> counted on to last for a good while?
>
> Dean
> Check out my web site 6bargrill . com. The url is a complete rip-off
> of Nate's 7slotgrill, but I couldn't come up with something I liked
> better.

Well, with the standard "opinion" disclaimers, the design isn't flawed
to the degree that you see catastrophic failures .... just premature
ones. A few sources cite insufficient lubrication to some bearing or
clutch...but if someone popped for a transferable warranty, you're in
like Flynn. What I do understand follows:

-- sensitive to proper transmission fluid
-- prone to governor pressure solenoid/sensor failures
-- [some models] prone to torque converter [clutch] failures, fouling
coolers with debris
-- the so-called "anti-drainback valve" catches torque converter
debris and clogs/sticks, blocking fluid flow to the transmission
"operating system"
-- people fuss about a lag after starting, then shifting from park
into gear, as this model doesn't circulate fluid through the torque
converter in park....generally caused by some worn [not to a fatal
degree] component that I didn't bother to catalog in my head.
-- rebuild components aren't crazy expensive, but the O/D unit, which
does fail, comes in around 3 bills:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/New-4...spagenameZWD1V


Now that I've done my share of raining on the machine, I'd like to
hear from others how they think a GC fares off-road.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

On Jul 11, 7:19 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Ok so the ZJ has a dog's breath transmission. Which probably explains
> why so many of the used one's I'm looking at proudly advertise their
> newly replaced transmissions. Is the design basically flawed or have
> the issues been fixed so that a replacement transmission can be
> counted on to last for a good while?
>
> Dean
> Check out my web site 6bargrill . com. The url is a complete rip-off
> of Nate's 7slotgrill, but I couldn't come up with something I liked
> better.

Well, with the standard "opinion" disclaimers, the design isn't flawed
to the degree that you see catastrophic failures .... just premature
ones. A few sources cite insufficient lubrication to some bearing or
clutch...but if someone popped for a transferable warranty, you're in
like Flynn. What I do understand follows:

-- sensitive to proper transmission fluid
-- prone to governor pressure solenoid/sensor failures
-- [some models] prone to torque converter [clutch] failures, fouling
coolers with debris
-- the so-called "anti-drainback valve" catches torque converter
debris and clogs/sticks, blocking fluid flow to the transmission
"operating system"
-- people fuss about a lag after starting, then shifting from park
into gear, as this model doesn't circulate fluid through the torque
converter in park....generally caused by some worn [not to a fatal
degree] component that I didn't bother to catalog in my head.
-- rebuild components aren't crazy expensive, but the O/D unit, which
does fail, comes in around 3 bills:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/New-4...spagenameZWD1V


Now that I've done my share of raining on the machine, I'd like to
hear from others how they think a GC fares off-road.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

On Jul 11, 7:19 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Ok so the ZJ has a dog's breath transmission. Which probably explains
> why so many of the used one's I'm looking at proudly advertise their
> newly replaced transmissions. Is the design basically flawed or have
> the issues been fixed so that a replacement transmission can be
> counted on to last for a good while?
>
> Dean
> Check out my web site 6bargrill . com. The url is a complete rip-off
> of Nate's 7slotgrill, but I couldn't come up with something I liked
> better.

Well, with the standard "opinion" disclaimers, the design isn't flawed
to the degree that you see catastrophic failures .... just premature
ones. A few sources cite insufficient lubrication to some bearing or
clutch...but if someone popped for a transferable warranty, you're in
like Flynn. What I do understand follows:

-- sensitive to proper transmission fluid
-- prone to governor pressure solenoid/sensor failures
-- [some models] prone to torque converter [clutch] failures, fouling
coolers with debris
-- the so-called "anti-drainback valve" catches torque converter
debris and clogs/sticks, blocking fluid flow to the transmission
"operating system"
-- people fuss about a lag after starting, then shifting from park
into gear, as this model doesn't circulate fluid through the torque
converter in park....generally caused by some worn [not to a fatal
degree] component that I didn't bother to catalog in my head.
-- rebuild components aren't crazy expensive, but the O/D unit, which
does fail, comes in around 3 bills:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/New-4...spagenameZWD1V


Now that I've done my share of raining on the machine, I'd like to
hear from others how they think a GC fares off-road.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

On Jul 11, 7:19 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Ok so the ZJ has a dog's breath transmission. Which probably explains
> why so many of the used one's I'm looking at proudly advertise their
> newly replaced transmissions. Is the design basically flawed or have
> the issues been fixed so that a replacement transmission can be
> counted on to last for a good while?
>
> Dean
> Check out my web site 6bargrill . com. The url is a complete rip-off
> of Nate's 7slotgrill, but I couldn't come up with something I liked
> better.

Well, with the standard "opinion" disclaimers, the design isn't flawed
to the degree that you see catastrophic failures .... just premature
ones. A few sources cite insufficient lubrication to some bearing or
clutch...but if someone popped for a transferable warranty, you're in
like Flynn. What I do understand follows:

-- sensitive to proper transmission fluid
-- prone to governor pressure solenoid/sensor failures
-- [some models] prone to torque converter [clutch] failures, fouling
coolers with debris
-- the so-called "anti-drainback valve" catches torque converter
debris and clogs/sticks, blocking fluid flow to the transmission
"operating system"
-- people fuss about a lag after starting, then shifting from park
into gear, as this model doesn't circulate fluid through the torque
converter in park....generally caused by some worn [not to a fatal
degree] component that I didn't bother to catalog in my head.
-- rebuild components aren't crazy expensive, but the O/D unit, which
does fail, comes in around 3 bills:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/New-4...spagenameZWD1V


Now that I've done my share of raining on the machine, I'd like to
hear from others how they think a GC fares off-road.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

On Jul 10, 11:39 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Which years should I look for/avoid?

Interior and grille/bumper were redesigned in '96. Earlier ones are
ugly.

> Gas mileage, how bad is it?

My '96 5.2L would get 20mpg on the highway. That was with the
Goodyear Wrangler AT/S's aired up to about 45 PSI. With a lift and
offroad tires it'll probably be a lot worse.

> Is the gas mileage for the 6 better than the V8?

I've heard that it's so close that it's not worth the loss in power.

> Transfer cases options and any to avoid?

The full time unit is known for problems with the viscous coupler but
I had no problems with mine (130k miles).

> How does the Grand do in accidents?

I saw one that had gone off an overpass backwards and landed ass first
on the the road below. The doors would still open and close. Most
other cars would crush like a beer can. The flip side to lousy gas
mileage is that it's 4000+ pounds of crashworthy steel.

Only downside as a first car is that it holds so many passengers.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

On Jul 10, 11:39 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Which years should I look for/avoid?

Interior and grille/bumper were redesigned in '96. Earlier ones are
ugly.

> Gas mileage, how bad is it?

My '96 5.2L would get 20mpg on the highway. That was with the
Goodyear Wrangler AT/S's aired up to about 45 PSI. With a lift and
offroad tires it'll probably be a lot worse.

> Is the gas mileage for the 6 better than the V8?

I've heard that it's so close that it's not worth the loss in power.

> Transfer cases options and any to avoid?

The full time unit is known for problems with the viscous coupler but
I had no problems with mine (130k miles).

> How does the Grand do in accidents?

I saw one that had gone off an overpass backwards and landed ass first
on the the road below. The doors would still open and close. Most
other cars would crush like a beer can. The flip side to lousy gas
mileage is that it's 4000+ pounds of crashworthy steel.

Only downside as a first car is that it holds so many passengers.

Re: Looking for a Grand Cherokee
 

On Jul 10, 11:39 pm, Dean <JuanSig...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Which years should I look for/avoid?

Interior and grille/bumper were redesigned in '96. Earlier ones are
ugly.

> Gas mileage, how bad is it?

My '96 5.2L would get 20mpg on the highway. That was with the
Goodyear Wrangler AT/S's aired up to about 45 PSI. With a lift and
offroad tires it'll probably be a lot worse.

> Is the gas mileage for the 6 better than the V8?

I've heard that it's so close that it's not worth the loss in power.

> Transfer cases options and any to avoid?

The full time unit is known for problems with the viscous coupler but
I had no problems with mine (130k miles).

> How does the Grand do in accidents?

I saw one that had gone off an overpass backwards and landed ass first
on the the road below. The doors would still open and close. Most
other cars would crush like a beer can. The flip side to lousy gas
mileage is that it's 4000+ pounds of crashworthy steel.

Only downside as a first car is that it holds so many passengers.