Hootowl

On Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:27:39 -0600, "Earle Horton"
<nurse--NOSPAM--busters@msn.com> wrote:

>It's a good thing for you, it's not a Chrysler product of the same vintage.
>If you lost the ground to the dash on one of those, you would fry your fuel
>gauge. Ouch!
>
>Before you do anything, try fixing the instrument panel ground. I have a
>policy with vehicles, of addressing the easiest to fix problem first. It is
>amazing how often this works.

I know. I do the same thing. One person thought it might be the
ammeter starting to ground out, since the readings change when the
motor is running (but they change if it sits in the hot sun all day,
too).
>
>If it turns out to be the regulator, and there is no replacement available,
>one is easily made with parts available from your local Radio Shack. Radio
>Shack has the books you will need, too. Before you get that far, perform a
>proper diagnosis using a voltmeter. It is essential to have the proper
>manual for your vehicle. Many public libraries have old Motors Manuals
>still on the shelves. These are the best, next to the factory service
>manual. Chilton's is not too bad. Haynes is economical.

I have the original AMC manual.

Dan
>
>Earle
>
>"Hootowl" <ELN/zooo@earthlink.net> wrote in message
>news:4oglg1t8ifm7jov40t1s4in470t0mp7n19@4ax.com.. .
>> On Tue, 23 Aug 2005 01:13:53 GMT, "Stephen Cowell"
>> <scowell@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >"Hootowl" <ELN/zooo@earthlink.net> wrote in message
>> >news:qtpfg1h75a61c4pef9ep06nhkiesmd9kjm@4ax.com.. .
>> >> I am getting some strange readings from my fuel, oil pressure, and
>> >> temperature gauges on my 1977 Cherokee Chief as follows;
>> >>
>> >> When I simply turn on the ignition but don'g start the engine, all
>> >> three read accurately and stay at those readings. The ammeter, of
>> >> course, operates independently of these three, and functions normally
>> >> under all conditions.
>> >>
>> >> When I start the engine, they all read accurately at first, then
>> >> slowly drop to the lower readings. For example, the fuel gauge drops
>> >> almost a quarter of a tank, and the other two drop likewise. At some
>> >> point, they may return to normal for a while, especially in cooler
>> >> parts of the day (or when cooled by the AC). It makes no difference
>> >> if accessories such as the AC are operating.
>> >>
>> >> If I kill the engine, then turn the ignition right back on (or wait a
>> >> while- it doesn't matter), they all three return to normal readings
>> >> and stay there, regardless of temperature.
>> >>
>> >> Any ideas, anyone? This is something I haven't seen before! Thanks!
>> >
>> >The regulator is stuck open... believe it or not, there's
>> >a bimetallic strip that opens/closes faster or slower,
>> >depending on the ambient temperature... the voltage
>> >looks like it's going crazy, but it's average is regulated
>> >over time. Either the contact is dirty, or something
>> >else is preventing it from shorting itself and cooling
>> >down, hence your lowered reference voltage to your
>> >instruments when the temp is high.
>>
>> Steve,
>>
>> Are you talking about the cluster voltage regulator (CVR) that fits
>> down on two posts beside the temperature gauge? Doesn't it provide a
>> constant 3.2 volts to the cluster gauges? If so, it is no longer
>> available. The dealer (whom I know personally) can't get it anymore.
>> NAPA no longer handles them for any make. Another local parts house
>> does, but not for Jeep. The two or three they do carry looked like
>> they might fit, if all gauges use the same voltage. A Jeep mechanic I
>> know said I've lost the ground to the dash. Someone in another Jeep
>> news group also thinks it's a ground problem. Anyway, my friend is
>> going to be checking out a rear joint for me later this morning (I
>> have no safe place to raise two wheels), and he can look at the gauge
>> problem, too, if it doesn't get too hot for him. He has heart
>> problems and a previous stroke.
>>
>> That CVR would be a salvage yard item now, and I figure they would
>> want to sell me the entire circuit board and cluster.
>>
>> Dan
>> >__
>> >Steve
>> >.
>> >
>>
>

Hootowl

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 14:04:27 GMT, "Stephen Cowell"
<scowell@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

>
>"Hootowl" <ELN/zooo@earthlink.net> wrote in message
>news:4oglg1t8ifm7jov40t1s4in470t0mp7n19@4ax.com.. .
>> On Tue, 23 Aug 2005 01:13:53 GMT, "Stephen Cowell"
>> <scowell@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>...
>
>> Are you talking about the cluster voltage regulator (CVR) that fits
>> down on two posts beside the temperature gauge? Doesn't it provide a
>> constant 3.2 volts to the cluster gauges?
>
>That's the one... and no, it's not constant, at least on
>the one's I've messed with... all the gauges it supplies
>are also based on the thermo-electric bimetallic, so
>they all are temperature-sensitive and should be supplied
>with a temperature-sensitive regulator.
>
>> If so, it is no longer
>> available.
>
>Indeed a bummer... perhaps another could
>be made to fit, or you could repair the one
>you have by cleaning or replacing the contacts.
>The bimetallic strip shouldn't have failed, and
>the heater wire around the strip is probably OK
>too. If these parts are good, then try burnishing
>the contacts with a good tool... never use a
>matchbook striker for electrical contacts, it's emery
>and bad for them... likewise with an emery board.
>Look at GC-9337 and GC-9338 here:
>
>http://www.gcwaldom.com/catalog.html
>
>That's the right tool for the job.

I'll check that page out. I've also been told I can get all the parts
to make one at Radio Shack. I had already thought about that, but will
have to check my service manual to determine the correct voltage
output.

Dan
>__
>Steve
>.
>

Hootowl

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 14:04:27 GMT, "Stephen Cowell"
<scowell@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

>
>"Hootowl" <ELN/zooo@earthlink.net> wrote in message
>news:4oglg1t8ifm7jov40t1s4in470t0mp7n19@4ax.com.. .
>> On Tue, 23 Aug 2005 01:13:53 GMT, "Stephen Cowell"
>> <scowell@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>...
>
>> Are you talking about the cluster voltage regulator (CVR) that fits
>> down on two posts beside the temperature gauge? Doesn't it provide a
>> constant 3.2 volts to the cluster gauges?
>
>That's the one... and no, it's not constant, at least on
>the one's I've messed with... all the gauges it supplies
>are also based on the thermo-electric bimetallic, so
>they all are temperature-sensitive and should be supplied
>with a temperature-sensitive regulator.
>
>> If so, it is no longer
>> available.
>
>Indeed a bummer... perhaps another could
>be made to fit, or you could repair the one
>you have by cleaning or replacing the contacts.
>The bimetallic strip shouldn't have failed, and
>the heater wire around the strip is probably OK
>too. If these parts are good, then try burnishing
>the contacts with a good tool... never use a
>matchbook striker for electrical contacts, it's emery
>and bad for them... likewise with an emery board.
>Look at GC-9337 and GC-9338 here:
>
>http://www.gcwaldom.com/catalog.html
>
>That's the right tool for the job.

I'll check that page out. I've also been told I can get all the parts
to make one at Radio Shack. I had already thought about that, but will
have to check my service manual to determine the correct voltage
output.

Dan
>__
>Steve
>.
>

Hootowl

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 14:04:27 GMT, "Stephen Cowell"
<scowell@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

>
>"Hootowl" <ELN/zooo@earthlink.net> wrote in message
>news:4oglg1t8ifm7jov40t1s4in470t0mp7n19@4ax.com.. .
>> On Tue, 23 Aug 2005 01:13:53 GMT, "Stephen Cowell"
>> <scowell@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>...
>
>> Are you talking about the cluster voltage regulator (CVR) that fits
>> down on two posts beside the temperature gauge? Doesn't it provide a
>> constant 3.2 volts to the cluster gauges?
>
>That's the one... and no, it's not constant, at least on
>the one's I've messed with... all the gauges it supplies
>are also based on the thermo-electric bimetallic, so
>they all are temperature-sensitive and should be supplied
>with a temperature-sensitive regulator.
>
>> If so, it is no longer
>> available.
>
>Indeed a bummer... perhaps another could
>be made to fit, or you could repair the one
>you have by cleaning or replacing the contacts.
>The bimetallic strip shouldn't have failed, and
>the heater wire around the strip is probably OK
>too. If these parts are good, then try burnishing
>the contacts with a good tool... never use a
>matchbook striker for electrical contacts, it's emery
>and bad for them... likewise with an emery board.
>Look at GC-9337 and GC-9338 here:
>
>http://www.gcwaldom.com/catalog.html
>
>That's the right tool for the job.

I'll check that page out. I've also been told I can get all the parts
to make one at Radio Shack. I had already thought about that, but will
have to check my service manual to determine the correct voltage
output.

Dan
>__
>Steve
>.
>

Hootowl

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 14:04:27 GMT, "Stephen Cowell"
<scowell@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

>
>"Hootowl" <ELN/zooo@earthlink.net> wrote in message
>news:4oglg1t8ifm7jov40t1s4in470t0mp7n19@4ax.com.. .
>> On Tue, 23 Aug 2005 01:13:53 GMT, "Stephen Cowell"
>> <scowell@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>...
>
>> Are you talking about the cluster voltage regulator (CVR) that fits
>> down on two posts beside the temperature gauge? Doesn't it provide a
>> constant 3.2 volts to the cluster gauges?
>
>That's the one... and no, it's not constant, at least on
>the one's I've messed with... all the gauges it supplies
>are also based on the thermo-electric bimetallic, so
>they all are temperature-sensitive and should be supplied
>with a temperature-sensitive regulator.
>
>> If so, it is no longer
>> available.
>
>Indeed a bummer... perhaps another could
>be made to fit, or you could repair the one
>you have by cleaning or replacing the contacts.
>The bimetallic strip shouldn't have failed, and
>the heater wire around the strip is probably OK
>too. If these parts are good, then try burnishing
>the contacts with a good tool... never use a
>matchbook striker for electrical contacts, it's emery
>and bad for them... likewise with an emery board.
>Look at GC-9337 and GC-9338 here:
>
>http://www.gcwaldom.com/catalog.html
>
>That's the right tool for the job.

I'll check that page out. I've also been told I can get all the parts
to make one at Radio Shack. I had already thought about that, but will
have to check my service manual to determine the correct voltage
output.

Dan
>__
>Steve
>.
>

Earle Horton

Dan,

The AMC manual should tell you the voltage at the terminals of the
regulator, or the current draw, or both. It should, in fact, have a
troubleshooting procedure. Then you take a multimeter to the terminals with
the engine running, and see what's up. If the regulator is bad, you can try
one of those aftermarket or other OEM regulators that was mentioned, and see
if it is a better fit, electrically speaking.

As a last resort, you could buy or make a power supply to deliver the proper
voltage and current. This seems like a lot of work, but with the original
parts no longer available, it is better than non-working gauges, or a custom
panel full of round aftermarket ones.

Earle

"Hootowl" <ELN/zooo@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:6etsg1hqcg0g5lhvg16vpbbvd27iu9fvfp@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:27:39 -0600, "Earle Horton"
> <nurse--NOSPAM--busters@msn.com> wrote:
>
....
>
> I have the original AMC manual.
>

Earle Horton

Dan,

The AMC manual should tell you the voltage at the terminals of the
regulator, or the current draw, or both. It should, in fact, have a
troubleshooting procedure. Then you take a multimeter to the terminals with
the engine running, and see what's up. If the regulator is bad, you can try
one of those aftermarket or other OEM regulators that was mentioned, and see
if it is a better fit, electrically speaking.

As a last resort, you could buy or make a power supply to deliver the proper
voltage and current. This seems like a lot of work, but with the original
parts no longer available, it is better than non-working gauges, or a custom
panel full of round aftermarket ones.

Earle

"Hootowl" <ELN/zooo@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:6etsg1hqcg0g5lhvg16vpbbvd27iu9fvfp@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:27:39 -0600, "Earle Horton"
> <nurse--NOSPAM--busters@msn.com> wrote:
>
....
>
> I have the original AMC manual.
>

Earle Horton

Dan,

The AMC manual should tell you the voltage at the terminals of the
regulator, or the current draw, or both. It should, in fact, have a
troubleshooting procedure. Then you take a multimeter to the terminals with
the engine running, and see what's up. If the regulator is bad, you can try
one of those aftermarket or other OEM regulators that was mentioned, and see
if it is a better fit, electrically speaking.

As a last resort, you could buy or make a power supply to deliver the proper
voltage and current. This seems like a lot of work, but with the original
parts no longer available, it is better than non-working gauges, or a custom
panel full of round aftermarket ones.

Earle

"Hootowl" <ELN/zooo@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:6etsg1hqcg0g5lhvg16vpbbvd27iu9fvfp@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:27:39 -0600, "Earle Horton"
> <nurse--NOSPAM--busters@msn.com> wrote:
>
....
>
> I have the original AMC manual.
>

Earle Horton

Dan,

The AMC manual should tell you the voltage at the terminals of the
regulator, or the current draw, or both. It should, in fact, have a
troubleshooting procedure. Then you take a multimeter to the terminals with
the engine running, and see what's up. If the regulator is bad, you can try
one of those aftermarket or other OEM regulators that was mentioned, and see
if it is a better fit, electrically speaking.

As a last resort, you could buy or make a power supply to deliver the proper
voltage and current. This seems like a lot of work, but with the original
parts no longer available, it is better than non-working gauges, or a custom
panel full of round aftermarket ones.

Earle

"Hootowl" <ELN/zooo@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:6etsg1hqcg0g5lhvg16vpbbvd27iu9fvfp@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:27:39 -0600, "Earle Horton"
> <nurse--NOSPAM--busters@msn.com> wrote:
>
....
>
> I have the original AMC manual.
>

Hootowl

Twice in the last three days, when I started my Jeep to leave work,
the oil pressure gauge stayed on zero (not new-I have a bad connection
on the 4-prong flat plug's orange wire that plugs into the circuit
board <Radio Shack no longer carries such hobbiest parts>). However,
both times the fuel and temperature gauges read accurately until the
oil pressure gauge started working. Then, both of them dropped. Any
possibility that the oil pressure gauge is loose, or something like
that? I'm going to be working on this stuff tomorrow morning, and
would like any other suggestions to check out. Of course, if it isn't
something like that, I'm also going to check out the ammeter, too.
Thanks.

Dan