Detroit, Japan, and Car Quality
 

Both Japan and Detroit can make a good car if they really want to. I
personally would rather buy American if the quality and price are
comparable for the most part but it is not the first thing I look for.
Buying a domestic product that is inferior just makes you a large
banana republic.

As I said elsewhere, Toyota in my opinion makes the best fork lift in
the world. I personally don't buy fork lifts, few individuals do, but
the North American competition is not as good at least in the size
class of lift truck I have experience with. US lift trucks have US
industrial engines made from patterns and core boxes made in the '50s
and they no longer cut the muster.

I don't feel Japanese cars are necessarily better any more. But GM
can't blame its problems on anyone else, it has failed to produce a
first rate product on a cost effective basis for a long time. Yes, the
Corvette is a great value for a car in its class-in fact probably too
good, you don't buy an expensive sports car for cost-effectiveness!
Yes, the Duramax is great. Yes, the Northstar is first class tech. But
overall their lines are stodgy, middle-of-the-road, and have no
compelling reason to buy.

DCX has done good things with Jeep and will probably do more, but I
don't think they really have a strong idea where they want to go in a
way the American Jeep buyer will really go for.

Re: Detroit, Japan, and Car Quality
 

<calcerise@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1117329892.179041.193580@g49g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...

....

> As I said elsewhere, Toyota in my opinion makes the best fork lift in
> the world. I personally don't buy fork lifts, few individuals do, but
> the North American competition is not as good at least in the size
> class of lift truck I have experience with. US lift trucks have US
> industrial engines made from patterns and core boxes made in the '50s
> and they no longer cut the muster.

Er, or is that 'pass mustard'... mexed mitiphors!

> I don't feel Japanese cars are necessarily better any more. But GM
> can't blame its problems on anyone else, it has failed to produce a
> first rate product on a cost effective basis for a long time. Yes, the
> Corvette is a great value for a car in its class-in fact probably too
> good, you don't buy an expensive sports car for cost-effectiveness!
> Yes, the Duramax is great. Yes, the Northstar is first class tech. But
> overall their lines are stodgy, middle-of-the-road, and have no
> compelling reason to buy.
>
> DCX has done good things with Jeep and will probably do more, but I
> don't think they really have a strong idea where they want to go in a
> way the American Jeep buyer will really go for.

They *really* pissed me off when they obsoleted the (real) Cherokee...
anyone notice how the new hemi Grand harks back to the real thing?
First one I saw, I had to double-take...
__
Steve
..

Re: Detroit, Japan, and Car Quality
 

<calcerise@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1117329892.179041.193580@g49g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...

....

> As I said elsewhere, Toyota in my opinion makes the best fork lift in
> the world. I personally don't buy fork lifts, few individuals do, but
> the North American competition is not as good at least in the size
> class of lift truck I have experience with. US lift trucks have US
> industrial engines made from patterns and core boxes made in the '50s
> and they no longer cut the muster.

Er, or is that 'pass mustard'... mexed mitiphors!

> I don't feel Japanese cars are necessarily better any more. But GM
> can't blame its problems on anyone else, it has failed to produce a
> first rate product on a cost effective basis for a long time. Yes, the
> Corvette is a great value for a car in its class-in fact probably too
> good, you don't buy an expensive sports car for cost-effectiveness!
> Yes, the Duramax is great. Yes, the Northstar is first class tech. But
> overall their lines are stodgy, middle-of-the-road, and have no
> compelling reason to buy.
>
> DCX has done good things with Jeep and will probably do more, but I
> don't think they really have a strong idea where they want to go in a
> way the American Jeep buyer will really go for.

They *really* pissed me off when they obsoleted the (real) Cherokee...
anyone notice how the new hemi Grand harks back to the real thing?
First one I saw, I had to double-take...
__
Steve
..

Re: Detroit, Japan, and Car Quality
 

<calcerise@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1117329892.179041.193580@g49g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...

....

> As I said elsewhere, Toyota in my opinion makes the best fork lift in
> the world. I personally don't buy fork lifts, few individuals do, but
> the North American competition is not as good at least in the size
> class of lift truck I have experience with. US lift trucks have US
> industrial engines made from patterns and core boxes made in the '50s
> and they no longer cut the muster.

Er, or is that 'pass mustard'... mexed mitiphors!

> I don't feel Japanese cars are necessarily better any more. But GM
> can't blame its problems on anyone else, it has failed to produce a
> first rate product on a cost effective basis for a long time. Yes, the
> Corvette is a great value for a car in its class-in fact probably too
> good, you don't buy an expensive sports car for cost-effectiveness!
> Yes, the Duramax is great. Yes, the Northstar is first class tech. But
> overall their lines are stodgy, middle-of-the-road, and have no
> compelling reason to buy.
>
> DCX has done good things with Jeep and will probably do more, but I
> don't think they really have a strong idea where they want to go in a
> way the American Jeep buyer will really go for.

They *really* pissed me off when they obsoleted the (real) Cherokee...
anyone notice how the new hemi Grand harks back to the real thing?
First one I saw, I had to double-take...
__
Steve
..

Re: Detroit, Japan, and Car Quality
 

<calcerise@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1117329892.179041.193580@g49g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...

....

> As I said elsewhere, Toyota in my opinion makes the best fork lift in
> the world. I personally don't buy fork lifts, few individuals do, but
> the North American competition is not as good at least in the size
> class of lift truck I have experience with. US lift trucks have US
> industrial engines made from patterns and core boxes made in the '50s
> and they no longer cut the muster.

Er, or is that 'pass mustard'... mexed mitiphors!

> I don't feel Japanese cars are necessarily better any more. But GM
> can't blame its problems on anyone else, it has failed to produce a
> first rate product on a cost effective basis for a long time. Yes, the
> Corvette is a great value for a car in its class-in fact probably too
> good, you don't buy an expensive sports car for cost-effectiveness!
> Yes, the Duramax is great. Yes, the Northstar is first class tech. But
> overall their lines are stodgy, middle-of-the-road, and have no
> compelling reason to buy.
>
> DCX has done good things with Jeep and will probably do more, but I
> don't think they really have a strong idea where they want to go in a
> way the American Jeep buyer will really go for.

They *really* pissed me off when they obsoleted the (real) Cherokee...
anyone notice how the new hemi Grand harks back to the real thing?
First one I saw, I had to double-take...
__
Steve
..

Re: Detroit, Japan, and Car Quality
 

calcerise@hotmail.com wrote:

> DCX has done good things with Jeep and will probably do more, but I
> don't think they really have a strong idea where they want to go in a
> way the American Jeep buyer will really go for.

Since Chrysler got taken over by Daimler, it's been downhill for the Jeep
brand. The Grand Cherokee once ruled soccer mom driveways, but now it's
nowhere near the success it once was. The capable Cherokee was replaced by
the sissy-fied Liberty, the beloved 4.0 liter I6 is being fazed out by the
less powerful 3.7 liter V6, and rumors are the next Wrangler will have IFS
just like the Liberty. This is progress?


--

Registered Linux user #378193

Re: Detroit, Japan, and Car Quality
 

calcerise@hotmail.com wrote:

> DCX has done good things with Jeep and will probably do more, but I
> don't think they really have a strong idea where they want to go in a
> way the American Jeep buyer will really go for.

Since Chrysler got taken over by Daimler, it's been downhill for the Jeep
brand. The Grand Cherokee once ruled soccer mom driveways, but now it's
nowhere near the success it once was. The capable Cherokee was replaced by
the sissy-fied Liberty, the beloved 4.0 liter I6 is being fazed out by the
less powerful 3.7 liter V6, and rumors are the next Wrangler will have IFS
just like the Liberty. This is progress?


--

Registered Linux user #378193

Re: Detroit, Japan, and Car Quality
 

calcerise@hotmail.com wrote:

> DCX has done good things with Jeep and will probably do more, but I
> don't think they really have a strong idea where they want to go in a
> way the American Jeep buyer will really go for.

Since Chrysler got taken over by Daimler, it's been downhill for the Jeep
brand. The Grand Cherokee once ruled soccer mom driveways, but now it's
nowhere near the success it once was. The capable Cherokee was replaced by
the sissy-fied Liberty, the beloved 4.0 liter I6 is being fazed out by the
less powerful 3.7 liter V6, and rumors are the next Wrangler will have IFS
just like the Liberty. This is progress?


--

Registered Linux user #378193

Re: Detroit, Japan, and Car Quality
 

calcerise@hotmail.com wrote:

> DCX has done good things with Jeep and will probably do more, but I
> don't think they really have a strong idea where they want to go in a
> way the American Jeep buyer will really go for.

Since Chrysler got taken over by Daimler, it's been downhill for the Jeep
brand. The Grand Cherokee once ruled soccer mom driveways, but now it's
nowhere near the success it once was. The capable Cherokee was replaced by
the sissy-fied Liberty, the beloved 4.0 liter I6 is being fazed out by the
less powerful 3.7 liter V6, and rumors are the next Wrangler will have IFS
just like the Liberty. This is progress?


--

Registered Linux user #378193

Re: Detroit, Japan, and Car Quality
 

No, I think they understand the off road crowd wants a straight axle,
right or wrong. And I think they're wrong to get rid of the inline
6-but MBZ does have some first rate engines to pick from, gas and
diesel.

As far as the Liberty-it's a girlie-car and it does that well. Females
love it. For men, there are Wranglers.

MBZ has had some QC problems-but they have acknowledged them and they
are making progress. And they are the leaders in CAN electronics, which
is as close as we are going to get in cars to ARINC 429, and it's the
right way to go-the price will get right when the rest of the industry
follows suit. Since it haas heavy use in capital manufacturing and
materials handling equipment, real test tools, supplied by real vendors
like Agilent, are available-far better than Mickey Mouse Snap-on
automotive stuff.