Jeff Strickland

"Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message
news:QfWdnUMyd5nfRbXfRVn-sQ@comcast.com...
> Measure from wheel rim to wheel rim, top and bottom. The measurements
> should be the same.
>

Matt is right, but let me suggest an alternate method that should be easier
and perhaps even more accurate.

The tires have a mold mark that runs around the center of the tire. The mold
mark is going to be uniform on all tires and gives a place to measure from.
The trouble is finding a place to measure from. Pick a spot on a tire other
side of the vehicle and also has a clear line at a point as near as possible
to 180° to the first spot. If you could measure at the 6:00 position to the
other wheel, then you would aslo want to measure as near as possible to the
12:00 position. Obviously, the 12:00 position is going to present issues, so
you have to go towards 11:00 or 1:00, deviate at the bottom of the tire the
appropriate amount to measure two points 180° apart.

Odds are that the axles are bent on a verticle line, making the desired
measuring points to be the top and bottom of the tire. I don't have a clue
as to how far it is from the mold mark on one tire to the mold mark on the
other tire, but whatever your measurement is, you want the same measurement
when you shift 180°. If it is 48 and 7/32nds at 12:00, then it should be 48
and 7/32nds at 6:00. I suggest the variance should be less than 3/64ths,
which is 1.5 32nds. 4 32nds is 1/8th. So, the deviation is well under an
8th. Measuring from the rim will give the same result, but measuring to the
rim is difficult and the added difficulty can affect an accurate
measurement. The mold marks on the tires give a flat place to measure that
is unobstructed at the point where the tape is held and read. Your partner
needs to understand that the tolerance is very small and the error
probability is very high, so the tape must be held at the same point.
Instead of measuring from the end of the tape, I sugggest using the 1" or 2"
mark as the starting point because the lines are smaller and getting the
starting point at the same place for all measurements is critical here.

Having said all of that, the alignment shop should be able to set a fixture
that will give an accurate measurement for you. They won't be able to adjust
very much, but they will be able to tell you if the axles are bent.








> "Rusted" <noEmail@please.com> wrote in message
> news:Kt4Wd.8536$CU.2850@fe45.usenetserver.com...
>> Can a home user measure camber with any kind of accuracy? Makes me want
>> to double check mine.
>>
>> "Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message
>> news:6qWdnanh7aCaT7XfRVn-qQ@comcast.com...
>>> Did the alignment shop actually check the rear camber? True there is no
>>> adjustment but if the axle is bent, tire wear is the least of your
>>> problems...
>>>
>>> "Troy" <@ .> wrote in message
>>> news:hZ3Wd.1238$603.870@newsread2.news.atl.earthli nk.net...
>>>>I got a used dana44 rear installed into my tj and when I look at it from
>>>>a distance I notice that the tires have negative camber I think it's
>>>>called... looks like this: /-\
>>>>
>>>> It looks like its gonna wear my tires unevenly, and I took it to an
>>>> alignment shop and the guy said that there's no adjustment for the rear
>>>> and to just rotate my tires frequently.
>>>>
>>>> Since there is no adjustment, I'm guessing the tubes are crooked in the
>>>> housing? Can they be bent back into shape?
>>>>
>>>> The shop who did the swap was supposed to put in a detroit locker, but
>>>> for some reason put in the detroit truetrac. They're gonna fix it
>>>> Monday, would they have to take the rear off again to bend it back?
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>

Jeff Strickland

There is no caster on the rear for a CJ. Well, that is not entirely true.
the Pinion Angle is the critical measurement on the CJ, not the Caster
Angle. I suppose one might look at these as interchangable terms, but they
are not.

Caster is the imaginary line through the upper and lower ball joints that
includes the centerline of the spindle. The rear axle has no ball joints,
therefore no caster. The critical measurement is the angle of the pinion
relative to the driveshaft and transmission/transfer case.




"Rusted" <noEmail@please.com> wrote in message
news:6U4Wd.7011$cs3.5732@fe42.usenetserver.com...
> is 0 degree caster correct for a rear axle on a CJ? and 4 degree in the
> front??
>
>
> "Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message
> news:QfWdnUMyd5nfRbXfRVn-sQ@comcast.com...
>> Measure from wheel rim to wheel rim, top and bottom. The measurements
>> should be the same.
>>
>> "Rusted" <noEmail@please.com> wrote in message
>> news:Kt4Wd.8536$CU.2850@fe45.usenetserver.com...
>>> Can a home user measure camber with any kind of accuracy? Makes me want
>>> to double check mine.
>>>
>>> "Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message
>>> news:6qWdnanh7aCaT7XfRVn-qQ@comcast.com...
>>>> Did the alignment shop actually check the rear camber? True there is no
>>>> adjustment but if the axle is bent, tire wear is the least of your
>>>> problems...
>>>>
>>>> "Troy" <@ .> wrote in message
>>>> news:hZ3Wd.1238$603.870@newsread2.news.atl.earthli nk.net...
>>>>>I got a used dana44 rear installed into my tj and when I look at it
>>>>>from a distance I notice that the tires have negative camber I think
>>>>>it's called... looks like this: /-\
>>>>>
>>>>> It looks like its gonna wear my tires unevenly, and I took it to an
>>>>> alignment shop and the guy said that there's no adjustment for the
>>>>> rear and to just rotate my tires frequently.
>>>>>
>>>>> Since there is no adjustment, I'm guessing the tubes are crooked in
>>>>> the housing? Can they be bent back into shape?
>>>>>
>>>>> The shop who did the swap was supposed to put in a detroit locker, but
>>>>> for some reason put in the detroit truetrac. They're gonna fix it
>>>>> Monday, would they have to take the rear off again to bend it back?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
>

Jeff Strickland

There is no caster on the rear for a CJ. Well, that is not entirely true.
the Pinion Angle is the critical measurement on the CJ, not the Caster
Angle. I suppose one might look at these as interchangable terms, but they
are not.

Caster is the imaginary line through the upper and lower ball joints that
includes the centerline of the spindle. The rear axle has no ball joints,
therefore no caster. The critical measurement is the angle of the pinion
relative to the driveshaft and transmission/transfer case.




"Rusted" <noEmail@please.com> wrote in message
news:6U4Wd.7011$cs3.5732@fe42.usenetserver.com...
> is 0 degree caster correct for a rear axle on a CJ? and 4 degree in the
> front??
>
>
> "Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message
> news:QfWdnUMyd5nfRbXfRVn-sQ@comcast.com...
>> Measure from wheel rim to wheel rim, top and bottom. The measurements
>> should be the same.
>>
>> "Rusted" <noEmail@please.com> wrote in message
>> news:Kt4Wd.8536$CU.2850@fe45.usenetserver.com...
>>> Can a home user measure camber with any kind of accuracy? Makes me want
>>> to double check mine.
>>>
>>> "Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message
>>> news:6qWdnanh7aCaT7XfRVn-qQ@comcast.com...
>>>> Did the alignment shop actually check the rear camber? True there is no
>>>> adjustment but if the axle is bent, tire wear is the least of your
>>>> problems...
>>>>
>>>> "Troy" <@ .> wrote in message
>>>> news:hZ3Wd.1238$603.870@newsread2.news.atl.earthli nk.net...
>>>>>I got a used dana44 rear installed into my tj and when I look at it
>>>>>from a distance I notice that the tires have negative camber I think
>>>>>it's called... looks like this: /-\
>>>>>
>>>>> It looks like its gonna wear my tires unevenly, and I took it to an
>>>>> alignment shop and the guy said that there's no adjustment for the
>>>>> rear and to just rotate my tires frequently.
>>>>>
>>>>> Since there is no adjustment, I'm guessing the tubes are crooked in
>>>>> the housing? Can they be bent back into shape?
>>>>>
>>>>> The shop who did the swap was supposed to put in a detroit locker, but
>>>>> for some reason put in the detroit truetrac. They're gonna fix it
>>>>> Monday, would they have to take the rear off again to bend it back?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
>

Jeff Strickland

There is no caster on the rear for a CJ. Well, that is not entirely true.
the Pinion Angle is the critical measurement on the CJ, not the Caster
Angle. I suppose one might look at these as interchangable terms, but they
are not.

Caster is the imaginary line through the upper and lower ball joints that
includes the centerline of the spindle. The rear axle has no ball joints,
therefore no caster. The critical measurement is the angle of the pinion
relative to the driveshaft and transmission/transfer case.




"Rusted" <noEmail@please.com> wrote in message
news:6U4Wd.7011$cs3.5732@fe42.usenetserver.com...
> is 0 degree caster correct for a rear axle on a CJ? and 4 degree in the
> front??
>
>
> "Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message
> news:QfWdnUMyd5nfRbXfRVn-sQ@comcast.com...
>> Measure from wheel rim to wheel rim, top and bottom. The measurements
>> should be the same.
>>
>> "Rusted" <noEmail@please.com> wrote in message
>> news:Kt4Wd.8536$CU.2850@fe45.usenetserver.com...
>>> Can a home user measure camber with any kind of accuracy? Makes me want
>>> to double check mine.
>>>
>>> "Matt Macchiarolo" <matt@nospamplease.com> wrote in message
>>> news:6qWdnanh7aCaT7XfRVn-qQ@comcast.com...
>>>> Did the alignment shop actually check the rear camber? True there is no
>>>> adjustment but if the axle is bent, tire wear is the least of your
>>>> problems...
>>>>
>>>> "Troy" <@ .> wrote in message
>>>> news:hZ3Wd.1238$603.870@newsread2.news.atl.earthli nk.net...
>>>>>I got a used dana44 rear installed into my tj and when I look at it
>>>>>from a distance I notice that the tires have negative camber I think
>>>>>it's called... looks like this: /-\
>>>>>
>>>>> It looks like its gonna wear my tires unevenly, and I took it to an
>>>>> alignment shop and the guy said that there's no adjustment for the
>>>>> rear and to just rotate my tires frequently.
>>>>>
>>>>> Since there is no adjustment, I'm guessing the tubes are crooked in
>>>>> the housing? Can they be bent back into shape?
>>>>>
>>>>> The shop who did the swap was supposed to put in a detroit locker, but
>>>>> for some reason put in the detroit truetrac. They're gonna fix it
>>>>> Monday, would they have to take the rear off again to bend it back?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
>

Troy

Crap

Hmm, now so if I'm sol then I'm going to have to...

Have them remove the pinion, locker, carrier, axle shafts, all that stuff
and keep them for when I get a new d44 case? Is that what it's going to be
called? what's the name of what I'm looking for then? I'm still learning
as I go.

Troy

Troy

Crap

Hmm, now so if I'm sol then I'm going to have to...

Have them remove the pinion, locker, carrier, axle shafts, all that stuff
and keep them for when I get a new d44 case? Is that what it's going to be
called? what's the name of what I'm looking for then? I'm still learning
as I go.

Troy

Troy

Crap

Hmm, now so if I'm sol then I'm going to have to...

Have them remove the pinion, locker, carrier, axle shafts, all that stuff
and keep them for when I get a new d44 case? Is that what it's going to be
called? what's the name of what I'm looking for then? I'm still learning
as I go.

Troy

L.W.(=?iso-8859-1?Q?=DFill?=) Hughes III

Hi Troy,
The housing may still be good, but more than likely at least one
axle is bent, as will happen with the force necessary to pop the bead of
a fully inflated tire. I make stands out of my bent axles, like this
washing machine motor and grinding wheel:
http://www.----------.com/bentaxle.jpg
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:--------------------

Troy wrote:
>
> Crap
>
> Hmm, now so if I'm sol then I'm going to have to...
>
> Have them remove the pinion, locker, carrier, axle shafts, all that stuff
> and keep them for when I get a new d44 case? Is that what it's going to be
> called? what's the name of what I'm looking for then? I'm still learning
> as I go.
>
> Troy

L.W.(=?iso-8859-1?Q?=DFill?=) Hughes III

Hi Troy,
The housing may still be good, but more than likely at least one
axle is bent, as will happen with the force necessary to pop the bead of
a fully inflated tire. I make stands out of my bent axles, like this
washing machine motor and grinding wheel:
http://www.----------.com/bentaxle.jpg
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:--------------------

Troy wrote:
>
> Crap
>
> Hmm, now so if I'm sol then I'm going to have to...
>
> Have them remove the pinion, locker, carrier, axle shafts, all that stuff
> and keep them for when I get a new d44 case? Is that what it's going to be
> called? what's the name of what I'm looking for then? I'm still learning
> as I go.
>
> Troy

L.W.(=?iso-8859-1?Q?=DFill?=) Hughes III

Hi Troy,
The housing may still be good, but more than likely at least one
axle is bent, as will happen with the force necessary to pop the bead of
a fully inflated tire. I make stands out of my bent axles, like this
washing machine motor and grinding wheel:
http://www.----------.com/bentaxle.jpg
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:--------------------

Troy wrote:
>
> Crap
>
> Hmm, now so if I'm sol then I'm going to have to...
>
> Have them remove the pinion, locker, carrier, axle shafts, all that stuff
> and keep them for when I get a new d44 case? Is that what it's going to be
> called? what's the name of what I'm looking for then? I'm still learning
> as I go.
>
> Troy