Ron Croonenberg

Hi Ryan,

Good to hear (this sounds bad doesn't it ?) that it's common or at least
someone else has similar experiences. Also what might have made the
problem a bit worse is that when I got the T18, I put in a new reverse
gear and a new first gear (i was basically a bench rebuild). As you know
those are exactly the ones that are not synchronized. When I drive it,
it almost seems that shifting gears (especially back from 3rd to 2nd is
getting worst when it "heated up ?" meaning after I drove it for 15-30
minutes. What helps best to shift into 1st and reverse is to come to a
full stop in gear and then shift "real fast", at leat for me. But when I
do it seems like the car "wants to move" as if engaged while on the
parking/emergency break. (I still think shifting the tranny is too rough)

I still wonder what it is that makes it do this.

Also, I don't know if you remember but advanced adapters send out the
conversion kits with the wrong pilot bushing at first, I had one of
those. The pilot bushing wasn't big enough and could "fall out" (however
when you think of it when the tranny is in there, how could that happen.
The pilot bushing went in very "loose". I replaced it with the new one
but that seemed to make the problem worse. So I took it apart for the
3rd time (or was it 4 or 5 ?) and put the original "wrong" too loose
bushing in.

If the pilot bushing is the problem (I considered this) then I might
take it apart and see if I can polish the end of the input shaft and the
spot the bushing goes in real good to see if that helps. But then
again.... I think I drove it enough to think that it polished itself by
now. The guy at the shop that did the conversion of the T18 for me (put
in the conversion shaft and new gears) told me later "yeah that's what
those T18 tranny's do (because the gears are not helical (spelled right
?) cut according to him).

If anyone knows more about this, please let me/us know.

Ron


Ryan wrote:
> Ron:
>
> My Ford T-18 conversion does the same, though not bad enough to grind
> the gears. Disengaging the clutch, even in neutral, will still spin
> the wheels while up on jackstands. With the wheels on the ground, it
> doesn't seem to drag, try to move the Jeep, or load the engine. Best I
> can guess is that the input shaft gets enough torque from the pilot
> bushing to spin a bit (explains the spin even with clutch depressed),
> and must ride on one of the internal gears enough to transfer some
> torque. I've put about 1000 miles on it this way, and no problems yet.
> I've decided "that's the way it is", and not worried about it.
>
> Any T-18 guru's out there know more?
>
> Ryan
> ryansweany@earthlink.net
> (O|||||||O)
>
> Ron Croonenberg <ronc@depauw.edu> wrote in message news:<bv8f74$k3f$1@terra.csc.depauw.edu>...
>
>>actually what I did too was take the linkage off and have the arm where
>>the adjustable part attaches too extended. that way the arm/clutch
>>linkage has more "throw" (and it is way harder to disengage the cluth
>>that way btw. Also because that throw/travel of the clutchfork is longer
>>I tried to play with it a bit, so that I can "see/feel" when I push the
>>clutchpedal if it is adjustable.
>>
>>What I am looking for now is other possible causes. Even though the
>>clutch (disk and pressure plate) are new. Maybe the pressure plate
>>doesn't release the pressure all the way ? Could it be that the disk I
>>have is too thick and it drags inbetween the pressure plate and flywheel
>>? On thing that is typical is that when I drive it for a bit the problem
>>seem to get worse. when I let it sit for 15-30 mins then it seems to be
>>a bit better again. So it almost seems that something heats up (the
>>pressure plate ?) extends and the clutch disk drags even more ?
>>
>>or is it a tranny problem ? of course the tranny heats up too when I
>>drive the CJ. (although I can imagine that when that was the case,
>>something would have worn out or broken)
>>
>>
>>any other ideas are welcome.
>>
>>
>>Ron
>>
>>
>>fletcher wrote:
>>
>>>The washer to space out the tranny / bellhousing was a good idea. I think
>>>that would be a great test and you can eliminate the idea #1. Can you try
>>>to over-adjust your clutch pedal so that you are sure you are moving the
>>>clutch plate fully off the flywheel. Maybe do that in conjunction with
>>>having the rear axle on jackstands so you can see if the rear wheels try to
>>>spin even without road resistance.
>>>Have you replaced or checked all of your clutch linkage pieces to verify
>>>that all of your pedal travel is getting to the clutch and not just bending
>>>of flexing linkage pieces? All just ideas, I don't have a real answer for
>>>you.
>>>
>>>
>>>"Ron Croonenberg" <ronc@depauw.edu> wrote in message
>>>news:bv6k0e$7pm$1@terra.csc.depauw.edu...
>>>
>>>
>>>>Hello,
>>>>
>>>>I have a '79 CJ5 258, used to have a T150 and a dana20, swapped those
>>>>for a T18 out of a ford and a Dana300.
>>>>
>>>>The problem I have is that it seems that even when the clutch
>>>>disengages, the inputshaft still seems to be turned just slightly. I
>>>>know because when I try to shift (especially to first and reverse (cause
>>>>those are not synchronized), it shifts real rough even grinds (even when
>>>>the car is not moving).
>>>>
>>>>So I am looking for any pointer why it could be doing that.
>>>>
>>>>The ones I came up with
>>>>[1] The tranny inputshaft is "riding up" against the crank and that
>>>> makes the inputshaft turn.
>>>>[2] The clutch doesn't really disengage and drags on the flywheel or
>>>> something
>>>>[3] ???
>>>>
>>>>what I did is use a few washer to temporarily back the tranny off from
>>>>the bellhousing. That way I know that the inputshaft isn't touching the
>>>>crank. but that didn't seem to make the problem go away.
>>>>
>>>>Also the problem seems to get worse when I drive the Jeep for a bit ,
>>>>few miles or so) shifting seems to be really rough then.
>>>>
>>>>Any tips in figuring out what exactly could be the problem ?
>>>>
>>>>thanks,
>>>>
>>>>Ron
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>

Ron Croonenberg

Hi Ryan,

Good to hear (this sounds bad doesn't it ?) that it's common or at least
someone else has similar experiences. Also what might have made the
problem a bit worse is that when I got the T18, I put in a new reverse
gear and a new first gear (i was basically a bench rebuild). As you know
those are exactly the ones that are not synchronized. When I drive it,
it almost seems that shifting gears (especially back from 3rd to 2nd is
getting worst when it "heated up ?" meaning after I drove it for 15-30
minutes. What helps best to shift into 1st and reverse is to come to a
full stop in gear and then shift "real fast", at leat for me. But when I
do it seems like the car "wants to move" as if engaged while on the
parking/emergency break. (I still think shifting the tranny is too rough)

I still wonder what it is that makes it do this.

Also, I don't know if you remember but advanced adapters send out the
conversion kits with the wrong pilot bushing at first, I had one of
those. The pilot bushing wasn't big enough and could "fall out" (however
when you think of it when the tranny is in there, how could that happen.
The pilot bushing went in very "loose". I replaced it with the new one
but that seemed to make the problem worse. So I took it apart for the
3rd time (or was it 4 or 5 ?) and put the original "wrong" too loose
bushing in.

If the pilot bushing is the problem (I considered this) then I might
take it apart and see if I can polish the end of the input shaft and the
spot the bushing goes in real good to see if that helps. But then
again.... I think I drove it enough to think that it polished itself by
now. The guy at the shop that did the conversion of the T18 for me (put
in the conversion shaft and new gears) told me later "yeah that's what
those T18 tranny's do (because the gears are not helical (spelled right
?) cut according to him).

If anyone knows more about this, please let me/us know.

Ron


Ryan wrote:
> Ron:
>
> My Ford T-18 conversion does the same, though not bad enough to grind
> the gears. Disengaging the clutch, even in neutral, will still spin
> the wheels while up on jackstands. With the wheels on the ground, it
> doesn't seem to drag, try to move the Jeep, or load the engine. Best I
> can guess is that the input shaft gets enough torque from the pilot
> bushing to spin a bit (explains the spin even with clutch depressed),
> and must ride on one of the internal gears enough to transfer some
> torque. I've put about 1000 miles on it this way, and no problems yet.
> I've decided "that's the way it is", and not worried about it.
>
> Any T-18 guru's out there know more?
>
> Ryan
> ryansweany@earthlink.net
> (O|||||||O)
>
> Ron Croonenberg <ronc@depauw.edu> wrote in message news:<bv8f74$k3f$1@terra.csc.depauw.edu>...
>
>>actually what I did too was take the linkage off and have the arm where
>>the adjustable part attaches too extended. that way the arm/clutch
>>linkage has more "throw" (and it is way harder to disengage the cluth
>>that way btw. Also because that throw/travel of the clutchfork is longer
>>I tried to play with it a bit, so that I can "see/feel" when I push the
>>clutchpedal if it is adjustable.
>>
>>What I am looking for now is other possible causes. Even though the
>>clutch (disk and pressure plate) are new. Maybe the pressure plate
>>doesn't release the pressure all the way ? Could it be that the disk I
>>have is too thick and it drags inbetween the pressure plate and flywheel
>>? On thing that is typical is that when I drive it for a bit the problem
>>seem to get worse. when I let it sit for 15-30 mins then it seems to be
>>a bit better again. So it almost seems that something heats up (the
>>pressure plate ?) extends and the clutch disk drags even more ?
>>
>>or is it a tranny problem ? of course the tranny heats up too when I
>>drive the CJ. (although I can imagine that when that was the case,
>>something would have worn out or broken)
>>
>>
>>any other ideas are welcome.
>>
>>
>>Ron
>>
>>
>>fletcher wrote:
>>
>>>The washer to space out the tranny / bellhousing was a good idea. I think
>>>that would be a great test and you can eliminate the idea #1. Can you try
>>>to over-adjust your clutch pedal so that you are sure you are moving the
>>>clutch plate fully off the flywheel. Maybe do that in conjunction with
>>>having the rear axle on jackstands so you can see if the rear wheels try to
>>>spin even without road resistance.
>>>Have you replaced or checked all of your clutch linkage pieces to verify
>>>that all of your pedal travel is getting to the clutch and not just bending
>>>of flexing linkage pieces? All just ideas, I don't have a real answer for
>>>you.
>>>
>>>
>>>"Ron Croonenberg" <ronc@depauw.edu> wrote in message
>>>news:bv6k0e$7pm$1@terra.csc.depauw.edu...
>>>
>>>
>>>>Hello,
>>>>
>>>>I have a '79 CJ5 258, used to have a T150 and a dana20, swapped those
>>>>for a T18 out of a ford and a Dana300.
>>>>
>>>>The problem I have is that it seems that even when the clutch
>>>>disengages, the inputshaft still seems to be turned just slightly. I
>>>>know because when I try to shift (especially to first and reverse (cause
>>>>those are not synchronized), it shifts real rough even grinds (even when
>>>>the car is not moving).
>>>>
>>>>So I am looking for any pointer why it could be doing that.
>>>>
>>>>The ones I came up with
>>>>[1] The tranny inputshaft is "riding up" against the crank and that
>>>> makes the inputshaft turn.
>>>>[2] The clutch doesn't really disengage and drags on the flywheel or
>>>> something
>>>>[3] ???
>>>>
>>>>what I did is use a few washer to temporarily back the tranny off from
>>>>the bellhousing. That way I know that the inputshaft isn't touching the
>>>>crank. but that didn't seem to make the problem go away.
>>>>
>>>>Also the problem seems to get worse when I drive the Jeep for a bit ,
>>>>few miles or so) shifting seems to be really rough then.
>>>>
>>>>Any tips in figuring out what exactly could be the problem ?
>>>>
>>>>thanks,
>>>>
>>>>Ron
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>

Ron Croonenberg

Hi Ryan,

Good to hear (this sounds bad doesn't it ?) that it's common or at least
someone else has similar experiences. Also what might have made the
problem a bit worse is that when I got the T18, I put in a new reverse
gear and a new first gear (i was basically a bench rebuild). As you know
those are exactly the ones that are not synchronized. When I drive it,
it almost seems that shifting gears (especially back from 3rd to 2nd is
getting worst when it "heated up ?" meaning after I drove it for 15-30
minutes. What helps best to shift into 1st and reverse is to come to a
full stop in gear and then shift "real fast", at leat for me. But when I
do it seems like the car "wants to move" as if engaged while on the
parking/emergency break. (I still think shifting the tranny is too rough)

I still wonder what it is that makes it do this.

Also, I don't know if you remember but advanced adapters send out the
conversion kits with the wrong pilot bushing at first, I had one of
those. The pilot bushing wasn't big enough and could "fall out" (however
when you think of it when the tranny is in there, how could that happen.
The pilot bushing went in very "loose". I replaced it with the new one
but that seemed to make the problem worse. So I took it apart for the
3rd time (or was it 4 or 5 ?) and put the original "wrong" too loose
bushing in.

If the pilot bushing is the problem (I considered this) then I might
take it apart and see if I can polish the end of the input shaft and the
spot the bushing goes in real good to see if that helps. But then
again.... I think I drove it enough to think that it polished itself by
now. The guy at the shop that did the conversion of the T18 for me (put
in the conversion shaft and new gears) told me later "yeah that's what
those T18 tranny's do (because the gears are not helical (spelled right
?) cut according to him).

If anyone knows more about this, please let me/us know.

Ron


Ryan wrote:
> Ron:
>
> My Ford T-18 conversion does the same, though not bad enough to grind
> the gears. Disengaging the clutch, even in neutral, will still spin
> the wheels while up on jackstands. With the wheels on the ground, it
> doesn't seem to drag, try to move the Jeep, or load the engine. Best I
> can guess is that the input shaft gets enough torque from the pilot
> bushing to spin a bit (explains the spin even with clutch depressed),
> and must ride on one of the internal gears enough to transfer some
> torque. I've put about 1000 miles on it this way, and no problems yet.
> I've decided "that's the way it is", and not worried about it.
>
> Any T-18 guru's out there know more?
>
> Ryan
> ryansweany@earthlink.net
> (O|||||||O)
>
> Ron Croonenberg <ronc@depauw.edu> wrote in message news:<bv8f74$k3f$1@terra.csc.depauw.edu>...
>
>>actually what I did too was take the linkage off and have the arm where
>>the adjustable part attaches too extended. that way the arm/clutch
>>linkage has more "throw" (and it is way harder to disengage the cluth
>>that way btw. Also because that throw/travel of the clutchfork is longer
>>I tried to play with it a bit, so that I can "see/feel" when I push the
>>clutchpedal if it is adjustable.
>>
>>What I am looking for now is other possible causes. Even though the
>>clutch (disk and pressure plate) are new. Maybe the pressure plate
>>doesn't release the pressure all the way ? Could it be that the disk I
>>have is too thick and it drags inbetween the pressure plate and flywheel
>>? On thing that is typical is that when I drive it for a bit the problem
>>seem to get worse. when I let it sit for 15-30 mins then it seems to be
>>a bit better again. So it almost seems that something heats up (the
>>pressure plate ?) extends and the clutch disk drags even more ?
>>
>>or is it a tranny problem ? of course the tranny heats up too when I
>>drive the CJ. (although I can imagine that when that was the case,
>>something would have worn out or broken)
>>
>>
>>any other ideas are welcome.
>>
>>
>>Ron
>>
>>
>>fletcher wrote:
>>
>>>The washer to space out the tranny / bellhousing was a good idea. I think
>>>that would be a great test and you can eliminate the idea #1. Can you try
>>>to over-adjust your clutch pedal so that you are sure you are moving the
>>>clutch plate fully off the flywheel. Maybe do that in conjunction with
>>>having the rear axle on jackstands so you can see if the rear wheels try to
>>>spin even without road resistance.
>>>Have you replaced or checked all of your clutch linkage pieces to verify
>>>that all of your pedal travel is getting to the clutch and not just bending
>>>of flexing linkage pieces? All just ideas, I don't have a real answer for
>>>you.
>>>
>>>
>>>"Ron Croonenberg" <ronc@depauw.edu> wrote in message
>>>news:bv6k0e$7pm$1@terra.csc.depauw.edu...
>>>
>>>
>>>>Hello,
>>>>
>>>>I have a '79 CJ5 258, used to have a T150 and a dana20, swapped those
>>>>for a T18 out of a ford and a Dana300.
>>>>
>>>>The problem I have is that it seems that even when the clutch
>>>>disengages, the inputshaft still seems to be turned just slightly. I
>>>>know because when I try to shift (especially to first and reverse (cause
>>>>those are not synchronized), it shifts real rough even grinds (even when
>>>>the car is not moving).
>>>>
>>>>So I am looking for any pointer why it could be doing that.
>>>>
>>>>The ones I came up with
>>>>[1] The tranny inputshaft is "riding up" against the crank and that
>>>> makes the inputshaft turn.
>>>>[2] The clutch doesn't really disengage and drags on the flywheel or
>>>> something
>>>>[3] ???
>>>>
>>>>what I did is use a few washer to temporarily back the tranny off from
>>>>the bellhousing. That way I know that the inputshaft isn't touching the
>>>>crank. but that didn't seem to make the problem go away.
>>>>
>>>>Also the problem seems to get worse when I drive the Jeep for a bit ,
>>>>few miles or so) shifting seems to be really rough then.
>>>>
>>>>Any tips in figuring out what exactly could be the problem ?
>>>>
>>>>thanks,
>>>>
>>>>Ron
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>

Ron Croonenberg

Ryan, btw...

I have been wondering about the pilot bushin, maybe it is too much drag
on that one that causes the problem. Would be nice if there's a bearing
that could be used instead of a bushing. In a T18 conversion the bearing
used is plenty big, must be possible to find a bearing that can be used.
(that is if that would help getting rid of the drag.)

Is there anyone who knows the dimensions of the pilot bushing used for
that conversion ? The bushing is really big, because it isn't going in
the the pilot bushing hole .. but in the cavity just in front of it

Ron


Ryan wrote:

> Ron:
>
> My Ford T-18 conversion does the same, though not bad enough to grind
> the gears. Disengaging the clutch, even in neutral, will still spin
> the wheels while up on jackstands. With the wheels on the ground, it
> doesn't seem to drag, try to move the Jeep, or load the engine. Best I
> can guess is that the input shaft gets enough torque from the pilot
> bushing to spin a bit (explains the spin even with clutch depressed),
> and must ride on one of the internal gears enough to transfer some
> torque. I've put about 1000 miles on it this way, and no problems yet.
> I've decided "that's the way it is", and not worried about it.
>
> Any T-18 guru's out there know more?
>
> Ryan
> ryansweany@earthlink.net
> (O|||||||O)
>
> Ron Croonenberg <ronc@depauw.edu> wrote in message news:<bv8f74$k3f$1@terra.csc.depauw.edu>...
>
>>actually what I did too was take the linkage off and have the arm where
>>the adjustable part attaches too extended. that way the arm/clutch
>>linkage has more "throw" (and it is way harder to disengage the cluth
>>that way btw. Also because that throw/travel of the clutchfork is longer
>>I tried to play with it a bit, so that I can "see/feel" when I push the
>>clutchpedal if it is adjustable.
>>
>>What I am looking for now is other possible causes. Even though the
>>clutch (disk and pressure plate) are new. Maybe the pressure plate
>>doesn't release the pressure all the way ? Could it be that the disk I
>>have is too thick and it drags inbetween the pressure plate and flywheel
>>? On thing that is typical is that when I drive it for a bit the problem
>>seem to get worse. when I let it sit for 15-30 mins then it seems to be
>>a bit better again. So it almost seems that something heats up (the
>>pressure plate ?) extends and the clutch disk drags even more ?
>>
>>or is it a tranny problem ? of course the tranny heats up too when I
>>drive the CJ. (although I can imagine that when that was the case,
>>something would have worn out or broken)
>>
>>
>>any other ideas are welcome.
>>
>>
>>Ron
>>
>>
>>fletcher wrote:
>>
>>>The washer to space out the tranny / bellhousing was a good idea. I think
>>>that would be a great test and you can eliminate the idea #1. Can you try
>>>to over-adjust your clutch pedal so that you are sure you are moving the
>>>clutch plate fully off the flywheel. Maybe do that in conjunction with
>>>having the rear axle on jackstands so you can see if the rear wheels try to
>>>spin even without road resistance.
>>>Have you replaced or checked all of your clutch linkage pieces to verify
>>>that all of your pedal travel is getting to the clutch and not just bending
>>>of flexing linkage pieces? All just ideas, I don't have a real answer for
>>>you.
>>>
>>>
>>>"Ron Croonenberg" <ronc@depauw.edu> wrote in message
>>>news:bv6k0e$7pm$1@terra.csc.depauw.edu...
>>>
>>>
>>>>Hello,
>>>>
>>>>I have a '79 CJ5 258, used to have a T150 and a dana20, swapped those
>>>>for a T18 out of a ford and a Dana300.
>>>>
>>>>The problem I have is that it seems that even when the clutch
>>>>disengages, the inputshaft still seems to be turned just slightly. I
>>>>know because when I try to shift (especially to first and reverse (cause
>>>>those are not synchronized), it shifts real rough even grinds (even when
>>>>the car is not moving).
>>>>
>>>>So I am looking for any pointer why it could be doing that.
>>>>
>>>>The ones I came up with
>>>>[1] The tranny inputshaft is "riding up" against the crank and that
>>>> makes the inputshaft turn.
>>>>[2] The clutch doesn't really disengage and drags on the flywheel or
>>>> something
>>>>[3] ???
>>>>
>>>>what I did is use a few washer to temporarily back the tranny off from
>>>>the bellhousing. That way I know that the inputshaft isn't touching the
>>>>crank. but that didn't seem to make the problem go away.
>>>>
>>>>Also the problem seems to get worse when I drive the Jeep for a bit ,
>>>>few miles or so) shifting seems to be really rough then.
>>>>
>>>>Any tips in figuring out what exactly could be the problem ?
>>>>
>>>>thanks,
>>>>
>>>>Ron
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>

Ron Croonenberg

Ryan, btw...

I have been wondering about the pilot bushin, maybe it is too much drag
on that one that causes the problem. Would be nice if there's a bearing
that could be used instead of a bushing. In a T18 conversion the bearing
used is plenty big, must be possible to find a bearing that can be used.
(that is if that would help getting rid of the drag.)

Is there anyone who knows the dimensions of the pilot bushing used for
that conversion ? The bushing is really big, because it isn't going in
the the pilot bushing hole .. but in the cavity just in front of it

Ron


Ryan wrote:

> Ron:
>
> My Ford T-18 conversion does the same, though not bad enough to grind
> the gears. Disengaging the clutch, even in neutral, will still spin
> the wheels while up on jackstands. With the wheels on the ground, it
> doesn't seem to drag, try to move the Jeep, or load the engine. Best I
> can guess is that the input shaft gets enough torque from the pilot
> bushing to spin a bit (explains the spin even with clutch depressed),
> and must ride on one of the internal gears enough to transfer some
> torque. I've put about 1000 miles on it this way, and no problems yet.
> I've decided "that's the way it is", and not worried about it.
>
> Any T-18 guru's out there know more?
>
> Ryan
> ryansweany@earthlink.net
> (O|||||||O)
>
> Ron Croonenberg <ronc@depauw.edu> wrote in message news:<bv8f74$k3f$1@terra.csc.depauw.edu>...
>
>>actually what I did too was take the linkage off and have the arm where
>>the adjustable part attaches too extended. that way the arm/clutch
>>linkage has more "throw" (and it is way harder to disengage the cluth
>>that way btw. Also because that throw/travel of the clutchfork is longer
>>I tried to play with it a bit, so that I can "see/feel" when I push the
>>clutchpedal if it is adjustable.
>>
>>What I am looking for now is other possible causes. Even though the
>>clutch (disk and pressure plate) are new. Maybe the pressure plate
>>doesn't release the pressure all the way ? Could it be that the disk I
>>have is too thick and it drags inbetween the pressure plate and flywheel
>>? On thing that is typical is that when I drive it for a bit the problem
>>seem to get worse. when I let it sit for 15-30 mins then it seems to be
>>a bit better again. So it almost seems that something heats up (the
>>pressure plate ?) extends and the clutch disk drags even more ?
>>
>>or is it a tranny problem ? of course the tranny heats up too when I
>>drive the CJ. (although I can imagine that when that was the case,
>>something would have worn out or broken)
>>
>>
>>any other ideas are welcome.
>>
>>
>>Ron
>>
>>
>>fletcher wrote:
>>
>>>The washer to space out the tranny / bellhousing was a good idea. I think
>>>that would be a great test and you can eliminate the idea #1. Can you try
>>>to over-adjust your clutch pedal so that you are sure you are moving the
>>>clutch plate fully off the flywheel. Maybe do that in conjunction with
>>>having the rear axle on jackstands so you can see if the rear wheels try to
>>>spin even without road resistance.
>>>Have you replaced or checked all of your clutch linkage pieces to verify
>>>that all of your pedal travel is getting to the clutch and not just bending
>>>of flexing linkage pieces? All just ideas, I don't have a real answer for
>>>you.
>>>
>>>
>>>"Ron Croonenberg" <ronc@depauw.edu> wrote in message
>>>news:bv6k0e$7pm$1@terra.csc.depauw.edu...
>>>
>>>
>>>>Hello,
>>>>
>>>>I have a '79 CJ5 258, used to have a T150 and a dana20, swapped those
>>>>for a T18 out of a ford and a Dana300.
>>>>
>>>>The problem I have is that it seems that even when the clutch
>>>>disengages, the inputshaft still seems to be turned just slightly. I
>>>>know because when I try to shift (especially to first and reverse (cause
>>>>those are not synchronized), it shifts real rough even grinds (even when
>>>>the car is not moving).
>>>>
>>>>So I am looking for any pointer why it could be doing that.
>>>>
>>>>The ones I came up with
>>>>[1] The tranny inputshaft is "riding up" against the crank and that
>>>> makes the inputshaft turn.
>>>>[2] The clutch doesn't really disengage and drags on the flywheel or
>>>> something
>>>>[3] ???
>>>>
>>>>what I did is use a few washer to temporarily back the tranny off from
>>>>the bellhousing. That way I know that the inputshaft isn't touching the
>>>>crank. but that didn't seem to make the problem go away.
>>>>
>>>>Also the problem seems to get worse when I drive the Jeep for a bit ,
>>>>few miles or so) shifting seems to be really rough then.
>>>>
>>>>Any tips in figuring out what exactly could be the problem ?
>>>>
>>>>thanks,
>>>>
>>>>Ron
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>

Ron Croonenberg

Ryan, btw...

I have been wondering about the pilot bushin, maybe it is too much drag
on that one that causes the problem. Would be nice if there's a bearing
that could be used instead of a bushing. In a T18 conversion the bearing
used is plenty big, must be possible to find a bearing that can be used.
(that is if that would help getting rid of the drag.)

Is there anyone who knows the dimensions of the pilot bushing used for
that conversion ? The bushing is really big, because it isn't going in
the the pilot bushing hole .. but in the cavity just in front of it

Ron


Ryan wrote:

> Ron:
>
> My Ford T-18 conversion does the same, though not bad enough to grind
> the gears. Disengaging the clutch, even in neutral, will still spin
> the wheels while up on jackstands. With the wheels on the ground, it
> doesn't seem to drag, try to move the Jeep, or load the engine. Best I
> can guess is that the input shaft gets enough torque from the pilot
> bushing to spin a bit (explains the spin even with clutch depressed),
> and must ride on one of the internal gears enough to transfer some
> torque. I've put about 1000 miles on it this way, and no problems yet.
> I've decided "that's the way it is", and not worried about it.
>
> Any T-18 guru's out there know more?
>
> Ryan
> ryansweany@earthlink.net
> (O|||||||O)
>
> Ron Croonenberg <ronc@depauw.edu> wrote in message news:<bv8f74$k3f$1@terra.csc.depauw.edu>...
>
>>actually what I did too was take the linkage off and have the arm where
>>the adjustable part attaches too extended. that way the arm/clutch
>>linkage has more "throw" (and it is way harder to disengage the cluth
>>that way btw. Also because that throw/travel of the clutchfork is longer
>>I tried to play with it a bit, so that I can "see/feel" when I push the
>>clutchpedal if it is adjustable.
>>
>>What I am looking for now is other possible causes. Even though the
>>clutch (disk and pressure plate) are new. Maybe the pressure plate
>>doesn't release the pressure all the way ? Could it be that the disk I
>>have is too thick and it drags inbetween the pressure plate and flywheel
>>? On thing that is typical is that when I drive it for a bit the problem
>>seem to get worse. when I let it sit for 15-30 mins then it seems to be
>>a bit better again. So it almost seems that something heats up (the
>>pressure plate ?) extends and the clutch disk drags even more ?
>>
>>or is it a tranny problem ? of course the tranny heats up too when I
>>drive the CJ. (although I can imagine that when that was the case,
>>something would have worn out or broken)
>>
>>
>>any other ideas are welcome.
>>
>>
>>Ron
>>
>>
>>fletcher wrote:
>>
>>>The washer to space out the tranny / bellhousing was a good idea. I think
>>>that would be a great test and you can eliminate the idea #1. Can you try
>>>to over-adjust your clutch pedal so that you are sure you are moving the
>>>clutch plate fully off the flywheel. Maybe do that in conjunction with
>>>having the rear axle on jackstands so you can see if the rear wheels try to
>>>spin even without road resistance.
>>>Have you replaced or checked all of your clutch linkage pieces to verify
>>>that all of your pedal travel is getting to the clutch and not just bending
>>>of flexing linkage pieces? All just ideas, I don't have a real answer for
>>>you.
>>>
>>>
>>>"Ron Croonenberg" <ronc@depauw.edu> wrote in message
>>>news:bv6k0e$7pm$1@terra.csc.depauw.edu...
>>>
>>>
>>>>Hello,
>>>>
>>>>I have a '79 CJ5 258, used to have a T150 and a dana20, swapped those
>>>>for a T18 out of a ford and a Dana300.
>>>>
>>>>The problem I have is that it seems that even when the clutch
>>>>disengages, the inputshaft still seems to be turned just slightly. I
>>>>know because when I try to shift (especially to first and reverse (cause
>>>>those are not synchronized), it shifts real rough even grinds (even when
>>>>the car is not moving).
>>>>
>>>>So I am looking for any pointer why it could be doing that.
>>>>
>>>>The ones I came up with
>>>>[1] The tranny inputshaft is "riding up" against the crank and that
>>>> makes the inputshaft turn.
>>>>[2] The clutch doesn't really disengage and drags on the flywheel or
>>>> something
>>>>[3] ???
>>>>
>>>>what I did is use a few washer to temporarily back the tranny off from
>>>>the bellhousing. That way I know that the inputshaft isn't touching the
>>>>crank. but that didn't seem to make the problem go away.
>>>>
>>>>Also the problem seems to get worse when I drive the Jeep for a bit ,
>>>>few miles or so) shifting seems to be really rough then.
>>>>
>>>>Any tips in figuring out what exactly could be the problem ?
>>>>
>>>>thanks,
>>>>
>>>>Ron
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>

Ron Croonenberg

whoops I meant :



In a T18 conversion the
bushing used is plenty big, must be possible to find a bearing that can
be used.
(that is if that would help getting rid of the drag.)


Ron Croonenberg wrote:

In a T18 conversion the bearing
> used is plenty big, must be possible to find a bearing that can be used.
> (that is if that would help getting rid of the drag.)

Ron Croonenberg

whoops I meant :



In a T18 conversion the
bushing used is plenty big, must be possible to find a bearing that can
be used.
(that is if that would help getting rid of the drag.)


Ron Croonenberg wrote:

In a T18 conversion the bearing
> used is plenty big, must be possible to find a bearing that can be used.
> (that is if that would help getting rid of the drag.)

Ron Croonenberg

whoops I meant :



In a T18 conversion the
bushing used is plenty big, must be possible to find a bearing that can
be used.
(that is if that would help getting rid of the drag.)


Ron Croonenberg wrote:

In a T18 conversion the bearing
> used is plenty big, must be possible to find a bearing that can be used.
> (that is if that would help getting rid of the drag.)

Ryan

Ron:

It sure sounds like you and I are having the same "problem", with a
different severity of symptoms. At worst, I have to double-clutch to
downshift to 2nd. First and reverse are off-limits unless I come to a
complete stop.

Advance Adapters forgot to even ship a pilot bushing the first time. A
quick phone call, and the right one was at may door a few days later.
The AA part number is 716156. According to their parts catalog, that
is a 1.818" OD x .670" ID x .5" deep bushing. A good parts store may
be able to match up a roller- or needle-bearing.

Let me know if you find out anything! I'll continue to ask around as
well.

Ryan

Ron Croonenberg <ronc@depauw.edu> wrote in message news:<bvm4i5$jlh$1@terra.csc.depauw.edu>...
> whoops I meant :
>
>
>
> In a T18 conversion the
> bushing used is plenty big, must be possible to find a bearing that can
> be used.
> (that is if that would help getting rid of the drag.)
>
>
> Ron Croonenberg wrote:
>
> In a T18 conversion the bearing
> > used is plenty big, must be possible to find a bearing that can be used.
> > (that is if that would help getting rid of the drag.)