JEEPR wrote:
>

> But I recall the solenoid engaging with the heater in off selection I'm
> pretty sure.


You really should make sure one way or the other.

Do you already have a rotted ground strap from the rear of the engine
head to the firewall? If this ground is bad, you also will get a dead
battery. Seeing as you post from sympatico, you are in the rust belt
and that strap does rot out. There is another computer harness ground
on a bolt at the rear passenger side of the engine with a mess of small
wires on it.

If the computer is seeking a ground for it's 'holding' power, it could
maybe be stealing it through that relay which keeps the thing activated.

Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

 

Sorry bill didn't have a diagram at the time and like I said I was use to
aviation terms
in the light diagram you mention it is only a two contact relay
the 85 terminal we cal X1 indicated vdc applied to the coil, terminal 85 we
would call that X2 indicated the grounded side of the coil, terminals 30
and 87 would be the contacts.

In the air conditioning schematic look at C100, a multicontact relay
B8 = X1, B10 = X2, B6 would be the common contact, B9 would be the normally
closed contact and B7 would be the normally open contact.
That's how we would describe it, just so when you refer to relays in
discussion it is a standard and leads to no confusion. just a little trivia
or info, funny the differences between the three industries,
household,automotive and aviation

--

Matt
0|||||||0
Tact is the ability to describe others as they see themselves
"L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
news:42815582.78D7E4F9@***.net...
> OK, but we use terms like ground or power to identify the wires
> like in this basic KC relay wiring:
> http://www.kchilites.com/instruction...layHarness.pdf Like nothing
> says "common" in these diagrams: http://www.----------.com/ACWire.pdf
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:--------------------
>
> JEEPR wrote:
> >
> > take a look at Doug's schematic at
> > http://www.revbeergoggles.com/temp/relay-diagram.jpg
> > 30 being the common terminal, 87a being normally closed and 87 being
> > normally open, that how we phrase it in the aviation industry
> >
> > --
> >
> > Matt
> > 0|||||||0
> > Tact is the ability to describe others as they see themselves
> > "L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
> > news:42813B52.8D1FE10@***.net...
> > > Your use of the word common confuses me, as it is the term we use
> > > for the white wire in out homes which is grounded, just like the bare
> > > copper wire is.
> > > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> > > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> > >
> > > JEEPR wrote:
> > > >
> > > > OK done some reverse engineering
> > > > the coil of the relay has a switched controlled ground and a 12v
power
> > > > supply controlled through ignition sw I guessing as the 12v is not
> > constant
> > > > the common contact on the relay has a constant 12v.
> > > > for the clutch solenoid to energize with ignition off, a ground
would
> > have
> > > > to be supplied to the relay and also a power source to energize the
> > relay.
> > > > So theoretically if the ignition switch was not shutting off all the
way
> > > > when key is extracted and the control was left on defrost this would
> > cause
> > > > the problem as I had described. Not sure were the low pressure sw.
> > plays in
> > > > this theory though, is it ignition controlled?
> > > > But I recall the solenoid engaging with the heater in off selection
I'm
> > > > pretty sure.
> > > > If the PCM was having a melt down you think I would notice more
symptoms
> > on
> > > > other systems.
> > > > Ok I think I just talked myself out of understanding what the hell
is
> > going
> > > > on.
> > > >
> > > > x1=12v sw
> > > > x2= gnd sw
> > > > C= common 12v constant
> > > > nc= normally closed to common
> > > > no= normally open or closed to common when relay is energized
> > > > | or __ = contacts
> > > >
> > > > -- | x2 | nc | x1
> > > >
> > > > __no
> > > >
> > > > __C

 

Sorry bill didn't have a diagram at the time and like I said I was use to
aviation terms
in the light diagram you mention it is only a two contact relay
the 85 terminal we cal X1 indicated vdc applied to the coil, terminal 85 we
would call that X2 indicated the grounded side of the coil, terminals 30
and 87 would be the contacts.

In the air conditioning schematic look at C100, a multicontact relay
B8 = X1, B10 = X2, B6 would be the common contact, B9 would be the normally
closed contact and B7 would be the normally open contact.
That's how we would describe it, just so when you refer to relays in
discussion it is a standard and leads to no confusion. just a little trivia
or info, funny the differences between the three industries,
household,automotive and aviation

--

Matt
0|||||||0
Tact is the ability to describe others as they see themselves
"L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
news:42815582.78D7E4F9@***.net...
> OK, but we use terms like ground or power to identify the wires
> like in this basic KC relay wiring:
> http://www.kchilites.com/instruction...layHarness.pdf Like nothing
> says "common" in these diagrams: http://www.----------.com/ACWire.pdf
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:--------------------
>
> JEEPR wrote:
> >
> > take a look at Doug's schematic at
> > http://www.revbeergoggles.com/temp/relay-diagram.jpg
> > 30 being the common terminal, 87a being normally closed and 87 being
> > normally open, that how we phrase it in the aviation industry
> >
> > --
> >
> > Matt
> > 0|||||||0
> > Tact is the ability to describe others as they see themselves
> > "L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
> > news:42813B52.8D1FE10@***.net...
> > > Your use of the word common confuses me, as it is the term we use
> > > for the white wire in out homes which is grounded, just like the bare
> > > copper wire is.
> > > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> > > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> > >
> > > JEEPR wrote:
> > > >
> > > > OK done some reverse engineering
> > > > the coil of the relay has a switched controlled ground and a 12v
power
> > > > supply controlled through ignition sw I guessing as the 12v is not
> > constant
> > > > the common contact on the relay has a constant 12v.
> > > > for the clutch solenoid to energize with ignition off, a ground
would
> > have
> > > > to be supplied to the relay and also a power source to energize the
> > relay.
> > > > So theoretically if the ignition switch was not shutting off all the
way
> > > > when key is extracted and the control was left on defrost this would
> > cause
> > > > the problem as I had described. Not sure were the low pressure sw.
> > plays in
> > > > this theory though, is it ignition controlled?
> > > > But I recall the solenoid engaging with the heater in off selection
I'm
> > > > pretty sure.
> > > > If the PCM was having a melt down you think I would notice more
symptoms
> > on
> > > > other systems.
> > > > Ok I think I just talked myself out of understanding what the hell
is
> > going
> > > > on.
> > > >
> > > > x1=12v sw
> > > > x2= gnd sw
> > > > C= common 12v constant
> > > > nc= normally closed to common
> > > > no= normally open or closed to common when relay is energized
> > > > | or __ = contacts
> > > >
> > > > -- | x2 | nc | x1
> > > >
> > > > __no
> > > >
> > > > __C

 

Sorry bill didn't have a diagram at the time and like I said I was use to
aviation terms
in the light diagram you mention it is only a two contact relay
the 85 terminal we cal X1 indicated vdc applied to the coil, terminal 85 we
would call that X2 indicated the grounded side of the coil, terminals 30
and 87 would be the contacts.

In the air conditioning schematic look at C100, a multicontact relay
B8 = X1, B10 = X2, B6 would be the common contact, B9 would be the normally
closed contact and B7 would be the normally open contact.
That's how we would describe it, just so when you refer to relays in
discussion it is a standard and leads to no confusion. just a little trivia
or info, funny the differences between the three industries,
household,automotive and aviation

--

Matt
0|||||||0
Tact is the ability to describe others as they see themselves
"L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
news:42815582.78D7E4F9@***.net...
> OK, but we use terms like ground or power to identify the wires
> like in this basic KC relay wiring:
> http://www.kchilites.com/instruction...layHarness.pdf Like nothing
> says "common" in these diagrams: http://www.----------.com/ACWire.pdf
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:--------------------
>
> JEEPR wrote:
> >
> > take a look at Doug's schematic at
> > http://www.revbeergoggles.com/temp/relay-diagram.jpg
> > 30 being the common terminal, 87a being normally closed and 87 being
> > normally open, that how we phrase it in the aviation industry
> >
> > --
> >
> > Matt
> > 0|||||||0
> > Tact is the ability to describe others as they see themselves
> > "L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
> > news:42813B52.8D1FE10@***.net...
> > > Your use of the word common confuses me, as it is the term we use
> > > for the white wire in out homes which is grounded, just like the bare
> > > copper wire is.
> > > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> > > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> > >
> > > JEEPR wrote:
> > > >
> > > > OK done some reverse engineering
> > > > the coil of the relay has a switched controlled ground and a 12v
power
> > > > supply controlled through ignition sw I guessing as the 12v is not
> > constant
> > > > the common contact on the relay has a constant 12v.
> > > > for the clutch solenoid to energize with ignition off, a ground
would
> > have
> > > > to be supplied to the relay and also a power source to energize the
> > relay.
> > > > So theoretically if the ignition switch was not shutting off all the
way
> > > > when key is extracted and the control was left on defrost this would
> > cause
> > > > the problem as I had described. Not sure were the low pressure sw.
> > plays in
> > > > this theory though, is it ignition controlled?
> > > > But I recall the solenoid engaging with the heater in off selection
I'm
> > > > pretty sure.
> > > > If the PCM was having a melt down you think I would notice more
symptoms
> > on
> > > > other systems.
> > > > Ok I think I just talked myself out of understanding what the hell
is
> > going
> > > > on.
> > > >
> > > > x1=12v sw
> > > > x2= gnd sw
> > > > C= common 12v constant
> > > > nc= normally closed to common
> > > > no= normally open or closed to common when relay is energized
> > > > | or __ = contacts
> > > >
> > > > -- | x2 | nc | x1
> > > >
> > > > __no
> > > >
> > > > __C

 

Sorry bill didn't have a diagram at the time and like I said I was use to
aviation terms
in the light diagram you mention it is only a two contact relay
the 85 terminal we cal X1 indicated vdc applied to the coil, terminal 85 we
would call that X2 indicated the grounded side of the coil, terminals 30
and 87 would be the contacts.

In the air conditioning schematic look at C100, a multicontact relay
B8 = X1, B10 = X2, B6 would be the common contact, B9 would be the normally
closed contact and B7 would be the normally open contact.
That's how we would describe it, just so when you refer to relays in
discussion it is a standard and leads to no confusion. just a little trivia
or info, funny the differences between the three industries,
household,automotive and aviation

--

Matt
0|||||||0
Tact is the ability to describe others as they see themselves
"L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
news:42815582.78D7E4F9@***.net...
> OK, but we use terms like ground or power to identify the wires
> like in this basic KC relay wiring:
> http://www.kchilites.com/instruction...layHarness.pdf Like nothing
> says "common" in these diagrams: http://www.----------.com/ACWire.pdf
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> mailto:--------------------
>
> JEEPR wrote:
> >
> > take a look at Doug's schematic at
> > http://www.revbeergoggles.com/temp/relay-diagram.jpg
> > 30 being the common terminal, 87a being normally closed and 87 being
> > normally open, that how we phrase it in the aviation industry
> >
> > --
> >
> > Matt
> > 0|||||||0
> > Tact is the ability to describe others as they see themselves
> > "L.W. (ßill) ------ III" <----------@***.net> wrote in message
> > news:42813B52.8D1FE10@***.net...
> > > Your use of the word common confuses me, as it is the term we use
> > > for the white wire in out homes which is grounded, just like the bare
> > > copper wire is.
> > > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> > > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> > >
> > > JEEPR wrote:
> > > >
> > > > OK done some reverse engineering
> > > > the coil of the relay has a switched controlled ground and a 12v
power
> > > > supply controlled through ignition sw I guessing as the 12v is not
> > constant
> > > > the common contact on the relay has a constant 12v.
> > > > for the clutch solenoid to energize with ignition off, a ground
would
> > have
> > > > to be supplied to the relay and also a power source to energize the
> > relay.
> > > > So theoretically if the ignition switch was not shutting off all the
way
> > > > when key is extracted and the control was left on defrost this would
> > cause
> > > > the problem as I had described. Not sure were the low pressure sw.
> > plays in
> > > > this theory though, is it ignition controlled?
> > > > But I recall the solenoid engaging with the heater in off selection
I'm
> > > > pretty sure.
> > > > If the PCM was having a melt down you think I would notice more
symptoms
> > on
> > > > other systems.
> > > > Ok I think I just talked myself out of understanding what the hell
is
> > going
> > > > on.
> > > >
> > > > x1=12v sw
> > > > x2= gnd sw
> > > > C= common 12v constant
> > > > nc= normally closed to common
> > > > no= normally open or closed to common when relay is energized
> > > > | or __ = contacts
> > > >
> > > > -- | x2 | nc | x1
> > > >
> > > > __no
> > > >
> > > > __C