Mike Romain

I have no idea on the specs of the snake oil you put in there, but it
calls for a low sulfur gear oil, a GL3 I believe someone said, but GL4
is called for.

Same deal for the friction base. If the snake oil is made for
differentials, it usually will have the limited slip additive and say
something like it's safe for traction devices. This will 'not' work.

When I got the correct fluid in mine, it took a little while for the
shifting to come back.

Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

none wrote:
>
> Ok, guys.....I changed the tranny fluid to Amsoil 2000. No noticeable
> change. The shifting still is hard whether the engine is hot or cold.
> Checked the clutch fluid, and it's filled 3/4 full. The friction point
> is near mid stroke. So I'm assuming the clutch is fine. Jacked the
> rear and selected first gear...disengaged the clutch and the wheels
> rotated slightly which stopped after quick engine rev. After playing
> with it for a while I determined that the dragging clutch seems to be
> intermittent. This weekend I think I'll bleed the hydo line. Although
> I feel that air in the line should not be intermittent.
>
> If the master or slave cylinder were bad and was introducing air into
> the system, wouldn't there be fluid leaking??
>
> Again thanks so much for all the advice
>
> Zak
>
> none wrote:
> > I have 80,000 on my AX-5 tranny and shifting into first gear is very
> > difficult. If I rev the engine a little the gear will eventually
> > engage. Would this be a sign that the clutch is not fully disengaging?
> > I have no grinding so I'm thinking the syncros are fine. Should I
> > start with a fluid bleed?
> >
> > Thanks for your help
> > Zak

Mike Romain

I have no idea on the specs of the snake oil you put in there, but it
calls for a low sulfur gear oil, a GL3 I believe someone said, but GL4
is called for.

Same deal for the friction base. If the snake oil is made for
differentials, it usually will have the limited slip additive and say
something like it's safe for traction devices. This will 'not' work.

When I got the correct fluid in mine, it took a little while for the
shifting to come back.

Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

none wrote:
>
> Ok, guys.....I changed the tranny fluid to Amsoil 2000. No noticeable
> change. The shifting still is hard whether the engine is hot or cold.
> Checked the clutch fluid, and it's filled 3/4 full. The friction point
> is near mid stroke. So I'm assuming the clutch is fine. Jacked the
> rear and selected first gear...disengaged the clutch and the wheels
> rotated slightly which stopped after quick engine rev. After playing
> with it for a while I determined that the dragging clutch seems to be
> intermittent. This weekend I think I'll bleed the hydo line. Although
> I feel that air in the line should not be intermittent.
>
> If the master or slave cylinder were bad and was introducing air into
> the system, wouldn't there be fluid leaking??
>
> Again thanks so much for all the advice
>
> Zak
>
> none wrote:
> > I have 80,000 on my AX-5 tranny and shifting into first gear is very
> > difficult. If I rev the engine a little the gear will eventually
> > engage. Would this be a sign that the clutch is not fully disengaging?
> > I have no grinding so I'm thinking the syncros are fine. Should I
> > start with a fluid bleed?
> >
> > Thanks for your help
> > Zak

Clax

I'm not familiar with the Amsoil 2000 product you've mentioned. Is it the
recommended grade? (check the SAE weight markings, usually in the form of
75W90 or something like that - note that I'm not recommending a 75W90 oil,
just an example of what the markings will look like). The synchro linings
are typically porous (paper or carbon) and therefore it can take a few
hundred miles of operation before the "old" oil is diluted with the new and
the box shifts as it should. However there should be an improvement noticed
within a few dozen miles of hot operation (esp. if shifted a lot).

Sometimes clutch discs can start to de-laminate (break-down) or can warp
slightly (potato crisp) - (especially if driven in an, ahem "spirited"
manner...) This takes up the clearance when the clutch plate lifts and
doesn't allow the clutch disc to fully disengage. It will still give
"normal" feeling operation (bite point, torque capacity, etc) but the clutch
can still drag despite the bite/engagement point feeling at a good height
and the clutch bleed being OK, etc. How far did you need to lift the pedal
before the wheels started to turn? Note that it would be normal for the
wheels to kick a few inches around when the gear is selected (due to the
inertia of the spinning disc). BTW it's best to assess this hot (after a 30
min drive or so) as this way there's less driveline drag. Note that the
wheels should not rotate at all until the pedal has been lifted by an inch
or more. On that point, do you have floor mats fitted? Do they go under
the clutch where it meets the floor - something to check as you'll lose
about a half inch there.

Good luck, Clax.


"none" <zakwhitak@*n0_spam*hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:cgna7t$rsa$1@uni00nw.unity.ncsu.edu...
> Ok, guys.....I changed the tranny fluid to Amsoil 2000. No noticeable
> change. The shifting still is hard whether the engine is hot or cold.
> Checked the clutch fluid, and it's filled 3/4 full. The friction point
> is near mid stroke. So I'm assuming the clutch is fine. Jacked the
> rear and selected first gear...disengaged the clutch and the wheels
> rotated slightly which stopped after quick engine rev. After playing
> with it for a while I determined that the dragging clutch seems to be
> intermittent. This weekend I think I'll bleed the hydo line. Although
> I feel that air in the line should not be intermittent.
>
> If the master or slave cylinder were bad and was introducing air into
> the system, wouldn't there be fluid leaking??
>
> Again thanks so much for all the advice
>
> Zak
>
> none wrote:
> > I have 80,000 on my AX-5 tranny and shifting into first gear is very
> > difficult. If I rev the engine a little the gear will eventually
> > engage. Would this be a sign that the clutch is not fully disengaging?
> > I have no grinding so I'm thinking the syncros are fine. Should I
> > start with a fluid bleed?
> >
> > Thanks for your help
> > Zak

Clax

I'm not familiar with the Amsoil 2000 product you've mentioned. Is it the
recommended grade? (check the SAE weight markings, usually in the form of
75W90 or something like that - note that I'm not recommending a 75W90 oil,
just an example of what the markings will look like). The synchro linings
are typically porous (paper or carbon) and therefore it can take a few
hundred miles of operation before the "old" oil is diluted with the new and
the box shifts as it should. However there should be an improvement noticed
within a few dozen miles of hot operation (esp. if shifted a lot).

Sometimes clutch discs can start to de-laminate (break-down) or can warp
slightly (potato crisp) - (especially if driven in an, ahem "spirited"
manner...) This takes up the clearance when the clutch plate lifts and
doesn't allow the clutch disc to fully disengage. It will still give
"normal" feeling operation (bite point, torque capacity, etc) but the clutch
can still drag despite the bite/engagement point feeling at a good height
and the clutch bleed being OK, etc. How far did you need to lift the pedal
before the wheels started to turn? Note that it would be normal for the
wheels to kick a few inches around when the gear is selected (due to the
inertia of the spinning disc). BTW it's best to assess this hot (after a 30
min drive or so) as this way there's less driveline drag. Note that the
wheels should not rotate at all until the pedal has been lifted by an inch
or more. On that point, do you have floor mats fitted? Do they go under
the clutch where it meets the floor - something to check as you'll lose
about a half inch there.

Good luck, Clax.


"none" <zakwhitak@*n0_spam*hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:cgna7t$rsa$1@uni00nw.unity.ncsu.edu...
> Ok, guys.....I changed the tranny fluid to Amsoil 2000. No noticeable
> change. The shifting still is hard whether the engine is hot or cold.
> Checked the clutch fluid, and it's filled 3/4 full. The friction point
> is near mid stroke. So I'm assuming the clutch is fine. Jacked the
> rear and selected first gear...disengaged the clutch and the wheels
> rotated slightly which stopped after quick engine rev. After playing
> with it for a while I determined that the dragging clutch seems to be
> intermittent. This weekend I think I'll bleed the hydo line. Although
> I feel that air in the line should not be intermittent.
>
> If the master or slave cylinder were bad and was introducing air into
> the system, wouldn't there be fluid leaking??
>
> Again thanks so much for all the advice
>
> Zak
>
> none wrote:
> > I have 80,000 on my AX-5 tranny and shifting into first gear is very
> > difficult. If I rev the engine a little the gear will eventually
> > engage. Would this be a sign that the clutch is not fully disengaging?
> > I have no grinding so I'm thinking the syncros are fine. Should I
> > start with a fluid bleed?
> >
> > Thanks for your help
> > Zak

Clax

I'm not familiar with the Amsoil 2000 product you've mentioned. Is it the
recommended grade? (check the SAE weight markings, usually in the form of
75W90 or something like that - note that I'm not recommending a 75W90 oil,
just an example of what the markings will look like). The synchro linings
are typically porous (paper or carbon) and therefore it can take a few
hundred miles of operation before the "old" oil is diluted with the new and
the box shifts as it should. However there should be an improvement noticed
within a few dozen miles of hot operation (esp. if shifted a lot).

Sometimes clutch discs can start to de-laminate (break-down) or can warp
slightly (potato crisp) - (especially if driven in an, ahem "spirited"
manner...) This takes up the clearance when the clutch plate lifts and
doesn't allow the clutch disc to fully disengage. It will still give
"normal" feeling operation (bite point, torque capacity, etc) but the clutch
can still drag despite the bite/engagement point feeling at a good height
and the clutch bleed being OK, etc. How far did you need to lift the pedal
before the wheels started to turn? Note that it would be normal for the
wheels to kick a few inches around when the gear is selected (due to the
inertia of the spinning disc). BTW it's best to assess this hot (after a 30
min drive or so) as this way there's less driveline drag. Note that the
wheels should not rotate at all until the pedal has been lifted by an inch
or more. On that point, do you have floor mats fitted? Do they go under
the clutch where it meets the floor - something to check as you'll lose
about a half inch there.

Good luck, Clax.


"none" <zakwhitak@*n0_spam*hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:cgna7t$rsa$1@uni00nw.unity.ncsu.edu...
> Ok, guys.....I changed the tranny fluid to Amsoil 2000. No noticeable
> change. The shifting still is hard whether the engine is hot or cold.
> Checked the clutch fluid, and it's filled 3/4 full. The friction point
> is near mid stroke. So I'm assuming the clutch is fine. Jacked the
> rear and selected first gear...disengaged the clutch and the wheels
> rotated slightly which stopped after quick engine rev. After playing
> with it for a while I determined that the dragging clutch seems to be
> intermittent. This weekend I think I'll bleed the hydo line. Although
> I feel that air in the line should not be intermittent.
>
> If the master or slave cylinder were bad and was introducing air into
> the system, wouldn't there be fluid leaking??
>
> Again thanks so much for all the advice
>
> Zak
>
> none wrote:
> > I have 80,000 on my AX-5 tranny and shifting into first gear is very
> > difficult. If I rev the engine a little the gear will eventually
> > engage. Would this be a sign that the clutch is not fully disengaging?
> > I have no grinding so I'm thinking the syncros are fine. Should I
> > start with a fluid bleed?
> >
> > Thanks for your help
> > Zak

Jerry Bransford

Great information Clax, nice posting of info I don't think I've ever read
before. Thanks!

Jerry
--
Jerry Bransford
PP-ASEL N6TAY
See the Geezer Jeep at
http://members.***.net/jerrypb/
"Clax" <hente@bigpond.com> wrote in message
news:VnRXc.10371$D7.5973@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> I'm not familiar with the Amsoil 2000 product you've mentioned. Is it the
> recommended grade? (check the SAE weight markings, usually in the form of
> 75W90 or something like that - note that I'm not recommending a 75W90 oil,
> just an example of what the markings will look like). The synchro linings
> are typically porous (paper or carbon) and therefore it can take a few
> hundred miles of operation before the "old" oil is diluted with the new
> and
> the box shifts as it should. However there should be an improvement
> noticed
> within a few dozen miles of hot operation (esp. if shifted a lot).
>
> Sometimes clutch discs can start to de-laminate (break-down) or can warp
> slightly (potato crisp) - (especially if driven in an, ahem "spirited"
> manner...) This takes up the clearance when the clutch plate lifts and
> doesn't allow the clutch disc to fully disengage. It will still give
> "normal" feeling operation (bite point, torque capacity, etc) but the
> clutch
> can still drag despite the bite/engagement point feeling at a good height
> and the clutch bleed being OK, etc. How far did you need to lift the
> pedal
> before the wheels started to turn? Note that it would be normal for the
> wheels to kick a few inches around when the gear is selected (due to the
> inertia of the spinning disc). BTW it's best to assess this hot (after a
> 30
> min drive or so) as this way there's less driveline drag. Note that the
> wheels should not rotate at all until the pedal has been lifted by an inch
> or more. On that point, do you have floor mats fitted? Do they go under
> the clutch where it meets the floor - something to check as you'll lose
> about a half inch there.
>
> Good luck, Clax.
>
>
> "none" <zakwhitak@*n0_spam*hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:cgna7t$rsa$1@uni00nw.unity.ncsu.edu...
>> Ok, guys.....I changed the tranny fluid to Amsoil 2000. No noticeable
>> change. The shifting still is hard whether the engine is hot or cold.
>> Checked the clutch fluid, and it's filled 3/4 full. The friction point
>> is near mid stroke. So I'm assuming the clutch is fine. Jacked the
>> rear and selected first gear...disengaged the clutch and the wheels
>> rotated slightly which stopped after quick engine rev. After playing
>> with it for a while I determined that the dragging clutch seems to be
>> intermittent. This weekend I think I'll bleed the hydo line. Although
>> I feel that air in the line should not be intermittent.
>>
>> If the master or slave cylinder were bad and was introducing air into
>> the system, wouldn't there be fluid leaking??
>>
>> Again thanks so much for all the advice
>>
>> Zak
>>
>> none wrote:
>> > I have 80,000 on my AX-5 tranny and shifting into first gear is very
>> > difficult. If I rev the engine a little the gear will eventually
>> > engage. Would this be a sign that the clutch is not fully disengaging?
>> > I have no grinding so I'm thinking the syncros are fine. Should I
>> > start with a fluid bleed?
>> >
>> > Thanks for your help
>> > Zak
>
>

Jerry Bransford

Great information Clax, nice posting of info I don't think I've ever read
before. Thanks!

Jerry
--
Jerry Bransford
PP-ASEL N6TAY
See the Geezer Jeep at
http://members.***.net/jerrypb/
"Clax" <hente@bigpond.com> wrote in message
news:VnRXc.10371$D7.5973@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> I'm not familiar with the Amsoil 2000 product you've mentioned. Is it the
> recommended grade? (check the SAE weight markings, usually in the form of
> 75W90 or something like that - note that I'm not recommending a 75W90 oil,
> just an example of what the markings will look like). The synchro linings
> are typically porous (paper or carbon) and therefore it can take a few
> hundred miles of operation before the "old" oil is diluted with the new
> and
> the box shifts as it should. However there should be an improvement
> noticed
> within a few dozen miles of hot operation (esp. if shifted a lot).
>
> Sometimes clutch discs can start to de-laminate (break-down) or can warp
> slightly (potato crisp) - (especially if driven in an, ahem "spirited"
> manner...) This takes up the clearance when the clutch plate lifts and
> doesn't allow the clutch disc to fully disengage. It will still give
> "normal" feeling operation (bite point, torque capacity, etc) but the
> clutch
> can still drag despite the bite/engagement point feeling at a good height
> and the clutch bleed being OK, etc. How far did you need to lift the
> pedal
> before the wheels started to turn? Note that it would be normal for the
> wheels to kick a few inches around when the gear is selected (due to the
> inertia of the spinning disc). BTW it's best to assess this hot (after a
> 30
> min drive or so) as this way there's less driveline drag. Note that the
> wheels should not rotate at all until the pedal has been lifted by an inch
> or more. On that point, do you have floor mats fitted? Do they go under
> the clutch where it meets the floor - something to check as you'll lose
> about a half inch there.
>
> Good luck, Clax.
>
>
> "none" <zakwhitak@*n0_spam*hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:cgna7t$rsa$1@uni00nw.unity.ncsu.edu...
>> Ok, guys.....I changed the tranny fluid to Amsoil 2000. No noticeable
>> change. The shifting still is hard whether the engine is hot or cold.
>> Checked the clutch fluid, and it's filled 3/4 full. The friction point
>> is near mid stroke. So I'm assuming the clutch is fine. Jacked the
>> rear and selected first gear...disengaged the clutch and the wheels
>> rotated slightly which stopped after quick engine rev. After playing
>> with it for a while I determined that the dragging clutch seems to be
>> intermittent. This weekend I think I'll bleed the hydo line. Although
>> I feel that air in the line should not be intermittent.
>>
>> If the master or slave cylinder were bad and was introducing air into
>> the system, wouldn't there be fluid leaking??
>>
>> Again thanks so much for all the advice
>>
>> Zak
>>
>> none wrote:
>> > I have 80,000 on my AX-5 tranny and shifting into first gear is very
>> > difficult. If I rev the engine a little the gear will eventually
>> > engage. Would this be a sign that the clutch is not fully disengaging?
>> > I have no grinding so I'm thinking the syncros are fine. Should I
>> > start with a fluid bleed?
>> >
>> > Thanks for your help
>> > Zak
>
>

Jerry Bransford

Great information Clax, nice posting of info I don't think I've ever read
before. Thanks!

Jerry
--
Jerry Bransford
PP-ASEL N6TAY
See the Geezer Jeep at
http://members.***.net/jerrypb/
"Clax" <hente@bigpond.com> wrote in message
news:VnRXc.10371$D7.5973@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> I'm not familiar with the Amsoil 2000 product you've mentioned. Is it the
> recommended grade? (check the SAE weight markings, usually in the form of
> 75W90 or something like that - note that I'm not recommending a 75W90 oil,
> just an example of what the markings will look like). The synchro linings
> are typically porous (paper or carbon) and therefore it can take a few
> hundred miles of operation before the "old" oil is diluted with the new
> and
> the box shifts as it should. However there should be an improvement
> noticed
> within a few dozen miles of hot operation (esp. if shifted a lot).
>
> Sometimes clutch discs can start to de-laminate (break-down) or can warp
> slightly (potato crisp) - (especially if driven in an, ahem "spirited"
> manner...) This takes up the clearance when the clutch plate lifts and
> doesn't allow the clutch disc to fully disengage. It will still give
> "normal" feeling operation (bite point, torque capacity, etc) but the
> clutch
> can still drag despite the bite/engagement point feeling at a good height
> and the clutch bleed being OK, etc. How far did you need to lift the
> pedal
> before the wheels started to turn? Note that it would be normal for the
> wheels to kick a few inches around when the gear is selected (due to the
> inertia of the spinning disc). BTW it's best to assess this hot (after a
> 30
> min drive or so) as this way there's less driveline drag. Note that the
> wheels should not rotate at all until the pedal has been lifted by an inch
> or more. On that point, do you have floor mats fitted? Do they go under
> the clutch where it meets the floor - something to check as you'll lose
> about a half inch there.
>
> Good luck, Clax.
>
>
> "none" <zakwhitak@*n0_spam*hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:cgna7t$rsa$1@uni00nw.unity.ncsu.edu...
>> Ok, guys.....I changed the tranny fluid to Amsoil 2000. No noticeable
>> change. The shifting still is hard whether the engine is hot or cold.
>> Checked the clutch fluid, and it's filled 3/4 full. The friction point
>> is near mid stroke. So I'm assuming the clutch is fine. Jacked the
>> rear and selected first gear...disengaged the clutch and the wheels
>> rotated slightly which stopped after quick engine rev. After playing
>> with it for a while I determined that the dragging clutch seems to be
>> intermittent. This weekend I think I'll bleed the hydo line. Although
>> I feel that air in the line should not be intermittent.
>>
>> If the master or slave cylinder were bad and was introducing air into
>> the system, wouldn't there be fluid leaking??
>>
>> Again thanks so much for all the advice
>>
>> Zak
>>
>> none wrote:
>> > I have 80,000 on my AX-5 tranny and shifting into first gear is very
>> > difficult. If I rev the engine a little the gear will eventually
>> > engage. Would this be a sign that the clutch is not fully disengaging?
>> > I have no grinding so I'm thinking the syncros are fine. Should I
>> > start with a fluid bleed?
>> >
>> > Thanks for your help
>> > Zak
>
>