Re: 91 Jeep Cherokee 4.0 engine transplant.
 

Simon Juncal wrote:
>
> Mike Romain wrote:
> > So in other words, you can junk the fuel injection on a 4.0, drop in a
> > cam and go with a carb and maybe a nice 4.2 performance intake to
> > 'really' get some power out of it. :-)
>
> I'll tell you if you really want some power out of a Jeep 6, do a 4.0
> stroker, the 4.6 (or more) with a 4.2 crank and rods is a real eye
> opener if you're used to the 4.2 or 4.0... It's not hard at all to put
> down more RWHP than a stock Mustang 5.0 with a mildly messaged stroker.
>
> The 4.0 w/ FI is definitely a better bet for power than ANY combintation
> of upgrades with a 4.2, (short of forced induction). I know you're fond
> of that old turd of an engine Mike but lets face it that thing was rated
> at just over a hundred hp and torque in it's day... And that might have
> been optimistic or even flywheel numbers... The 4.0 whips the pants off
> it in just about every regard. I own and wheel all three engines and
> I'll never build on a 4.2 again... waste of time.
>
> --
> Simon
> "I may be wrong, but I'm not uncertain." -- Robert A. Heinlein

Well, I have an extra 4.2 sitting in the garage with a freshly remanned
crank and bearings and a tired 4.0 I am removing from my 'new' 87
Cherokee to play with. Have a 'new' engine out of my 88 Cherokee for
the 87. Hmmm.....

I don't know what I have done to my 4.2, but it goes like a scalded cat
as it is. It will top 4400 rpm and hit over 50 mph in 2nd, a fast 75 mph
in 3rd, bury the speedo in 4th and who knows in 5th.

The best part is I still get well over 20 mpg on the highway.

I plan on playing with the two spare engines and build myself a stroker
for when mine wears out.

Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
(More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)

Re: 91 Jeep Cherokee 4.0 engine transplant.
 

Simon Juncal wrote:
>
> Mike Romain wrote:
> > So in other words, you can junk the fuel injection on a 4.0, drop in a
> > cam and go with a carb and maybe a nice 4.2 performance intake to
> > 'really' get some power out of it. :-)
>
> I'll tell you if you really want some power out of a Jeep 6, do a 4.0
> stroker, the 4.6 (or more) with a 4.2 crank and rods is a real eye
> opener if you're used to the 4.2 or 4.0... It's not hard at all to put
> down more RWHP than a stock Mustang 5.0 with a mildly messaged stroker.
>
> The 4.0 w/ FI is definitely a better bet for power than ANY combintation
> of upgrades with a 4.2, (short of forced induction). I know you're fond
> of that old turd of an engine Mike but lets face it that thing was rated
> at just over a hundred hp and torque in it's day... And that might have
> been optimistic or even flywheel numbers... The 4.0 whips the pants off
> it in just about every regard. I own and wheel all three engines and
> I'll never build on a 4.2 again... waste of time.
>
> --
> Simon
> "I may be wrong, but I'm not uncertain." -- Robert A. Heinlein

Well, I have an extra 4.2 sitting in the garage with a freshly remanned
crank and bearings and a tired 4.0 I am removing from my 'new' 87
Cherokee to play with. Have a 'new' engine out of my 88 Cherokee for
the 87. Hmmm.....

I don't know what I have done to my 4.2, but it goes like a scalded cat
as it is. It will top 4400 rpm and hit over 50 mph in 2nd, a fast 75 mph
in 3rd, bury the speedo in 4th and who knows in 5th.

The best part is I still get well over 20 mpg on the highway.

I plan on playing with the two spare engines and build myself a stroker
for when mine wears out.

Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
(More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)

Re: 91 Jeep Cherokee 4.0 engine transplant.
 

Bill, offroad.com shows it works just fine plus lots of folks use the
4.0 head in their 258's and keep the carb.

It's just the exhaust that doesn't fit, you have to use the 4.0 header.

Mike

"L.W.(Bill) ------ III" wrote:
>
> I was correcting Simon assumption: You may bolt an older exhaust on
> to the 4.0 liter "head", but the 258 CID carburetor manifold will not
> match the ports: http://www.----------.com/temp/258vs4LPorts.jpg Mike,
> you did notice the difference in your head and an fuel injection
> head?????
> God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Mike Romain wrote:
> >
> > Sorry Bill, but you are mistaken. Folks swap the 4.0 head onto the 4.2
> > engine all the time. 'I' don't like the idea of relying on epoxy to
> > hold the coolant passages, but hey that's me.
> >
> > You only have to change the exhaust for the 4.0 header, the intake
> > matches up just fine so the carb can go back on the 4.0 head.
> >
> > http://www.off-road.com/jeep/new/40conv.html
> >
> > So in other words, you can junk the fuel injection on a 4.0, drop in a
> > cam and go with a carb and maybe a nice 4.2 performance intake to
> > 'really' get some power out of it. :-)
> >
> > Mike
> > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> > Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> > Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
> > (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
> >
> > "L.W.(Bill) ------ III" wrote:
> > >
> > > You may bolt an older exhaust on to the 4.0 liter, but the 258 CID
> > > carburetor manifold will not match the ports:
> > > http://www.----------.com/temp/258vs4LPorts.jpg
> > > God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
> > > mailto:--------------------
> > >
> > > Simon Juncal wrote:
> > > >
> > > > I'm not sure which manifold you're talking about... the exhuast manifold
> > > > changed but the port pattern is the same so it's just a matter of
> > > > swaping manifolds, or fab'ing or buying a new collector pipe, and
> > > > modifiying brackets for clearance. The intake manifold also has the same
> > > > port pattern and is 100% interchangable from Renix to non-HO mopar MPI,
> > > > to HO, to even the newest intake (99 and up rounded runners). In fact
> > > > you can even use an old 4.2L carbureted 2bbl intake manifold on a 7120
> > > > or 0630 head. Those are both HO "high port" heads without the 0331
> > > > head's penchant for cracking.
> > > >
> > > > Again this might require some minor drilling, grinding, maybe even some
> > > > welding to get workable brackets and power steering but if you're doing
> > > > an engine swap and the thought of drilling, grinding and welding scares
> > > > you then you probably ought re-think doing it. :)
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Simon
> > > > "I may be wrong, but I'm not uncertain." -- Robert A. Heinlein

Re: 91 Jeep Cherokee 4.0 engine transplant.
 

Bill, offroad.com shows it works just fine plus lots of folks use the
4.0 head in their 258's and keep the carb.

It's just the exhaust that doesn't fit, you have to use the 4.0 header.

Mike

"L.W.(Bill) ------ III" wrote:
>
> I was correcting Simon assumption: You may bolt an older exhaust on
> to the 4.0 liter "head", but the 258 CID carburetor manifold will not
> match the ports: http://www.----------.com/temp/258vs4LPorts.jpg Mike,
> you did notice the difference in your head and an fuel injection
> head?????
> God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Mike Romain wrote:
> >
> > Sorry Bill, but you are mistaken. Folks swap the 4.0 head onto the 4.2
> > engine all the time. 'I' don't like the idea of relying on epoxy to
> > hold the coolant passages, but hey that's me.
> >
> > You only have to change the exhaust for the 4.0 header, the intake
> > matches up just fine so the carb can go back on the 4.0 head.
> >
> > http://www.off-road.com/jeep/new/40conv.html
> >
> > So in other words, you can junk the fuel injection on a 4.0, drop in a
> > cam and go with a carb and maybe a nice 4.2 performance intake to
> > 'really' get some power out of it. :-)
> >
> > Mike
> > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> > Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> > Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
> > (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
> >
> > "L.W.(Bill) ------ III" wrote:
> > >
> > > You may bolt an older exhaust on to the 4.0 liter, but the 258 CID
> > > carburetor manifold will not match the ports:
> > > http://www.----------.com/temp/258vs4LPorts.jpg
> > > God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
> > > mailto:--------------------
> > >
> > > Simon Juncal wrote:
> > > >
> > > > I'm not sure which manifold you're talking about... the exhuast manifold
> > > > changed but the port pattern is the same so it's just a matter of
> > > > swaping manifolds, or fab'ing or buying a new collector pipe, and
> > > > modifiying brackets for clearance. The intake manifold also has the same
> > > > port pattern and is 100% interchangable from Renix to non-HO mopar MPI,
> > > > to HO, to even the newest intake (99 and up rounded runners). In fact
> > > > you can even use an old 4.2L carbureted 2bbl intake manifold on a 7120
> > > > or 0630 head. Those are both HO "high port" heads without the 0331
> > > > head's penchant for cracking.
> > > >
> > > > Again this might require some minor drilling, grinding, maybe even some
> > > > welding to get workable brackets and power steering but if you're doing
> > > > an engine swap and the thought of drilling, grinding and welding scares
> > > > you then you probably ought re-think doing it. :)
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Simon
> > > > "I may be wrong, but I'm not uncertain." -- Robert A. Heinlein

Re: 91 Jeep Cherokee 4.0 engine transplant.
 

Bill, offroad.com shows it works just fine plus lots of folks use the
4.0 head in their 258's and keep the carb.

It's just the exhaust that doesn't fit, you have to use the 4.0 header.

Mike

"L.W.(Bill) ------ III" wrote:
>
> I was correcting Simon assumption: You may bolt an older exhaust on
> to the 4.0 liter "head", but the 258 CID carburetor manifold will not
> match the ports: http://www.----------.com/temp/258vs4LPorts.jpg Mike,
> you did notice the difference in your head and an fuel injection
> head?????
> God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> Mike Romain wrote:
> >
> > Sorry Bill, but you are mistaken. Folks swap the 4.0 head onto the 4.2
> > engine all the time. 'I' don't like the idea of relying on epoxy to
> > hold the coolant passages, but hey that's me.
> >
> > You only have to change the exhaust for the 4.0 header, the intake
> > matches up just fine so the carb can go back on the 4.0 head.
> >
> > http://www.off-road.com/jeep/new/40conv.html
> >
> > So in other words, you can junk the fuel injection on a 4.0, drop in a
> > cam and go with a carb and maybe a nice 4.2 performance intake to
> > 'really' get some power out of it. :-)
> >
> > Mike
> > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> > Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
> > Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
> > (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
> >
> > "L.W.(Bill) ------ III" wrote:
> > >
> > > You may bolt an older exhaust on to the 4.0 liter, but the 258 CID
> > > carburetor manifold will not match the ports:
> > > http://www.----------.com/temp/258vs4LPorts.jpg
> > > God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
> > > mailto:--------------------
> > >
> > > Simon Juncal wrote:
> > > >
> > > > I'm not sure which manifold you're talking about... the exhuast manifold
> > > > changed but the port pattern is the same so it's just a matter of
> > > > swaping manifolds, or fab'ing or buying a new collector pipe, and
> > > > modifiying brackets for clearance. The intake manifold also has the same
> > > > port pattern and is 100% interchangable from Renix to non-HO mopar MPI,
> > > > to HO, to even the newest intake (99 and up rounded runners). In fact
> > > > you can even use an old 4.2L carbureted 2bbl intake manifold on a 7120
> > > > or 0630 head. Those are both HO "high port" heads without the 0331
> > > > head's penchant for cracking.
> > > >
> > > > Again this might require some minor drilling, grinding, maybe even some
> > > > welding to get workable brackets and power steering but if you're doing
> > > > an engine swap and the thought of drilling, grinding and welding scares
> > > > you then you probably ought re-think doing it. :)
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Simon
> > > > "I may be wrong, but I'm not uncertain." -- Robert A. Heinlein

Re: 91 Jeep Cherokee 4.0 engine transplant.
 

L.W.(Bill) ------ III wrote:
> You may have done the head swap, but you couldn't have used the
> carburetor manifold, the ports don't match! LOOK:

I've sent you an email prepare to eat crow.

Those pics are terrible, and the port pattern is identical ... maybe
you've confused the exhuast ports which are different with the intakes
which are identical. <shrug>

--
Simon
"I may be wrong, but I'm not uncertain." -- Robert A. Heinlein

Re: 91 Jeep Cherokee 4.0 engine transplant.
 

L.W.(Bill) ------ III wrote:
> You may have done the head swap, but you couldn't have used the
> carburetor manifold, the ports don't match! LOOK:

I've sent you an email prepare to eat crow.

Those pics are terrible, and the port pattern is identical ... maybe
you've confused the exhuast ports which are different with the intakes
which are identical. <shrug>

--
Simon
"I may be wrong, but I'm not uncertain." -- Robert A. Heinlein

Re: 91 Jeep Cherokee 4.0 engine transplant.
 

L.W.(Bill) ------ III wrote:
> You may have done the head swap, but you couldn't have used the
> carburetor manifold, the ports don't match! LOOK:

I've sent you an email prepare to eat crow.

Those pics are terrible, and the port pattern is identical ... maybe
you've confused the exhuast ports which are different with the intakes
which are identical. <shrug>

--
Simon
"I may be wrong, but I'm not uncertain." -- Robert A. Heinlein

Re: 91 Jeep Cherokee 4.0 engine transplant.
 

While Bill keeps his word and posts the pic I sent to him, and his
admission of wrongness, I'll describe the pic:

First off the high intake ports are proof positive that it's a 4.0 head,
the 4.2's ports are dead even with the exhaust. That's a holley TBI in
place of the carter, most of the factory plumbing is gone, only remains
of the factory harness in the background and the holley FI harness. The
coolant return no longer heats the intake which explains the holes.

That's a 4.0 Cherokee thermo housing which is a KILLER swap for your 4.2
thermo housing if you have aftermarket fuel injection that needs a
coolant temp sensor, the stock location was of course... in the intake
which no longer is heated by coolant in my case. The valve cover is a
4.2 which technically shouldn't fit on a 4.0, I milled the alignment
ridge and used a late 4.0 (stamped steel cover) rubber compression
gasket, worked great. I used the 4.2 because I wanted a place to bolt
(the old cleaner housing bolt triangle) the custom cold air intake
tubing (not shown) so I could rout it over to the cooler side of the engine.

Also as with any swap there were bracket issues, my PS bracket is
chopped gusseted down low and no longer bolts to the intake. I ground
clearance for the header, and the intake doesn't seem to need the
support with extra large thick washers keeping it torqued down


--
Simon
"I may be wrong, but I'm not uncertain." -- Robert A. Heinlein

Re: 91 Jeep Cherokee 4.0 engine transplant.
 

While Bill keeps his word and posts the pic I sent to him, and his
admission of wrongness, I'll describe the pic:

First off the high intake ports are proof positive that it's a 4.0 head,
the 4.2's ports are dead even with the exhaust. That's a holley TBI in
place of the carter, most of the factory plumbing is gone, only remains
of the factory harness in the background and the holley FI harness. The
coolant return no longer heats the intake which explains the holes.

That's a 4.0 Cherokee thermo housing which is a KILLER swap for your 4.2
thermo housing if you have aftermarket fuel injection that needs a
coolant temp sensor, the stock location was of course... in the intake
which no longer is heated by coolant in my case. The valve cover is a
4.2 which technically shouldn't fit on a 4.0, I milled the alignment
ridge and used a late 4.0 (stamped steel cover) rubber compression
gasket, worked great. I used the 4.2 because I wanted a place to bolt
(the old cleaner housing bolt triangle) the custom cold air intake
tubing (not shown) so I could rout it over to the cooler side of the engine.

Also as with any swap there were bracket issues, my PS bracket is
chopped gusseted down low and no longer bolts to the intake. I ground
clearance for the header, and the intake doesn't seem to need the
support with extra large thick washers keeping it torqued down


--
Simon
"I may be wrong, but I'm not uncertain." -- Robert A. Heinlein