Jerry

I bought this 89' Jeep 6 months ago. The papers in the glove box show
the 6 cyl engine was rebuilt 3 years ago. Everything looks new.
Radiator, water pump, a/c compressor, head, you name it, it's new.
There is no radiator cap, just a plastic bottle up by the fire wall.
It overheats all the time. While idle it may take 30 minutes, on the
road it may take two hours depending on outside temp. I've replaced
the t'stat & did a flush. Water flows into the top of the plastic
bottle quite forcefully, so I guss that means the pump is doing it's
job. But, then again I really don't know if the hoses are hooked up
right because I've never worked on an engine that has no radiator cap.
One hose goes from the t'stat to the top of the bottle & tee's to the
bottom of the heater core. The other hose comes from the top of the
heater core, tee's to the bottom of the bottle & then to the pump. The
radiator also has no drain. The coolant looks good, not like it's
being contaminated by combustion or oil. The oil looks good. The
engine runs strong. When it overheats all the coolant comes out the
cap on the plastic bottle. There is no cowling around the mechinecal
fan (does it need one? I have no idea). The fan clutch is fine and the
electric fan is fine. My brain is tapped out. I need help, what's up?

Snow

Sounds like a similar set up as my 88 Jetta had, the "overflow" bottle
was/is part of the active cooling system, a certain amount of fluid is
diverted and sent back to the bottle, likewise there is also a continuous
flow of fluid from the bottle into the system. I believe this is what they
call a closed system (?). try looking here for some ideas.
http://www.off-road.com/jeep/cheroke.../cooling1.html ,
http://www.olypen.com/craigh/cooling.htm .

Snow...


"Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:3F1064C3.548E8CB7@sympatico.ca...
> Interesting....
>
> I have 'never' seen fluid flow into the bottle on mine....
>
> As the engine heats up, the level in the bottle just slowly rises.
>
> I have flushed mine and changed the rad when the core vanes all fell out
> because someone gave me a 'new' rad and during this, I have watched the
> fluid flow carefully to make sure all the air got out. I have never
> seen a 'flow' into the expansion tank like you describe.
>
> I would be wondering on the plumbing on yours and I would be wondering
> on the water pump.
>
> They make 2 different water pumps for that engine. A 'normal' rotation
> pump for a V-belt and a 'reverse' rotation pump for a serpentine belt.
>
> It seems to be a very common thing to see the wrong pump in the box from
> the parts store.
>
> If you can get a bead on the water pump, it should say 'REV' on it if
> you have the serpentine belt or if you look close, you should notice
> where the bottom rad hose 'feeds'.
>
> What I mean is on a normal rotation pump, the rad hose and the pump
> shape will be directing the fluid to the bottom side of the impeller.
> For a reverse rotation, the hose and pump body should be directing the
> fluid to the top side of the impeller.
>
> Mike
> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>
> Jerry wrote:
> >
> > I bought this 89' Jeep 6 months ago. The papers in the glove box show
> > the 6 cyl engine was rebuilt 3 years ago. Everything looks new.
> > Radiator, water pump, a/c compressor, head, you name it, it's new.
> > There is no radiator cap, just a plastic bottle up by the fire wall.
> > It overheats all the time. While idle it may take 30 minutes, on the
> > road it may take two hours depending on outside temp. I've replaced
> > the t'stat & did a flush. Water flows into the top of the plastic
> > bottle quite forcefully, so I guss that means the pump is doing it's
> > job. But, then again I really don't know if the hoses are hooked up
> > right because I've never worked on an engine that has no radiator cap.
> > One hose goes from the t'stat to the top of the bottle & tee's to the
> > bottom of the heater core. The other hose comes from the top of the
> > heater core, tee's to the bottom of the bottle & then to the pump. The
> > radiator also has no drain. The coolant looks good, not like it's
> > being contaminated by combustion or oil. The oil looks good. The
> > engine runs strong. When it overheats all the coolant comes out the
> > cap on the plastic bottle. There is no cowling around the mechinecal
> > fan (does it need one? I have no idea). The fan clutch is fine and the
> > electric fan is fine. My brain is tapped out. I need help, what's up?

Carlo Jr.

what kind of Jeep?

--
Carlo F. Serusa, Jr. RPh
carlo.jr@comcast.net
'98 Sahara TJ - '89 YJ - '79 Scout II
O|||||||O
'92 Explorer '65 Mustang


"Snow" <snowbalspam@spamrogersspam.com> wrote in message
news:OH1Qa.19623$1aB1.653@news02.bloor.is.net.cabl e.rogers.com...
> Sounds like a similar set up as my 88 Jetta had, the "overflow" bottle
> was/is part of the active cooling system, a certain amount of fluid is
> diverted and sent back to the bottle, likewise there is also a continuous
> flow of fluid from the bottle into the system. I believe this is what
they
> call a closed system (?). try looking here for some ideas.
> http://www.off-road.com/jeep/cheroke.../cooling1.html ,
> http://www.olypen.com/craigh/cooling.htm .
>
> Snow...
>
>
> "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:3F1064C3.548E8CB7@sympatico.ca...
> > Interesting....
> >
> > I have 'never' seen fluid flow into the bottle on mine....
> >
> > As the engine heats up, the level in the bottle just slowly rises.
> >
> > I have flushed mine and changed the rad when the core vanes all fell out
> > because someone gave me a 'new' rad and during this, I have watched the
> > fluid flow carefully to make sure all the air got out. I have never
> > seen a 'flow' into the expansion tank like you describe.
> >
> > I would be wondering on the plumbing on yours and I would be wondering
> > on the water pump.
> >
> > They make 2 different water pumps for that engine. A 'normal' rotation
> > pump for a V-belt and a 'reverse' rotation pump for a serpentine belt.
> >
> > It seems to be a very common thing to see the wrong pump in the box from
> > the parts store.
> >
> > If you can get a bead on the water pump, it should say 'REV' on it if
> > you have the serpentine belt or if you look close, you should notice
> > where the bottom rad hose 'feeds'.
> >
> > What I mean is on a normal rotation pump, the rad hose and the pump
> > shape will be directing the fluid to the bottom side of the impeller.
> > For a reverse rotation, the hose and pump body should be directing the
> > fluid to the top side of the impeller.
> >
> > Mike
> > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> >
> > Jerry wrote:
> > >
> > > I bought this 89' Jeep 6 months ago. The papers in the glove box show
> > > the 6 cyl engine was rebuilt 3 years ago. Everything looks new.
> > > Radiator, water pump, a/c compressor, head, you name it, it's new.
> > > There is no radiator cap, just a plastic bottle up by the fire wall.
> > > It overheats all the time. While idle it may take 30 minutes, on the
> > > road it may take two hours depending on outside temp. I've replaced
> > > the t'stat & did a flush. Water flows into the top of the plastic
> > > bottle quite forcefully, so I guss that means the pump is doing it's
> > > job. But, then again I really don't know if the hoses are hooked up
> > > right because I've never worked on an engine that has no radiator cap.
> > > One hose goes from the t'stat to the top of the bottle & tee's to the
> > > bottom of the heater core. The other hose comes from the top of the
> > > heater core, tee's to the bottom of the bottle & then to the pump. The
> > > radiator also has no drain. The coolant looks good, not like it's
> > > being contaminated by combustion or oil. The oil looks good. The
> > > engine runs strong. When it overheats all the coolant comes out the
> > > cap on the plastic bottle. There is no cowling around the mechinecal
> > > fan (does it need one? I have no idea). The fan clutch is fine and the
> > > electric fan is fine. My brain is tapped out. I need help, what's up?
>
>

Will Honea

On Sat, 12 Jul 2003 19:26:58 UTC gsvrcek@cfl.rr.com (Jerry) wrote:

> I bought this 89' Jeep 6 months ago. The papers in the glove box show
> the 6 cyl engine was rebuilt 3 years ago. Everything looks new.
> Radiator, water pump, a/c compressor, head, you name it, it's new.
> There is no radiator cap, just a plastic bottle up by the fire wall.
> It overheats all the time. While idle it may take 30 minutes, on the
> road it may take two hours depending on outside temp. I've replaced
> the t'stat & did a flush. Water flows into the top of the plastic
> bottle quite forcefully, so I guss that means the pump is doing it's
> job. But, then again I really don't know if the hoses are hooked up
> right because I've never worked on an engine that has no radiator cap.
> One hose goes from the t'stat to the top of the bottle & tee's to the
> bottom of the heater core. The other hose comes from the top of the
> heater core, tee's to the bottom of the bottle & then to the pump. The
> radiator also has no drain. The coolant looks good, not like it's
> being contaminated by combustion or oil. The oil looks good. The
> engine runs strong. When it overheats all the coolant comes out the
> cap on the plastic bottle. There is no cowling around the mechinecal
> fan (does it need one? I have no idea). The fan clutch is fine and the
> electric fan is fine. My brain is tapped out. I need help, what's up?

The proper term for this cooling system is a 'closed system', better
known a a PITA! What you describe sounds like a Cherokee (XJ) or
Commanche (MJ) with the 4.0L engine.

Two issues I've had that both led to overheating: The cap on the
bottle is the pressure cap for the system and it's a royal pain to get
the air out of the system when you refill it. About the only answers
to the first issue is to either buy a new resevoir to get a new cap or
replace the radiator and convert the cooling system to a sensible open
system. I've never found the cap separately but don't dispair -
you'll need the new bottle soon enough anyway.

As for the fill, you can usually get the air out by filling as far as
it will go, starting the engine and run it until you see the water
rise in the tank then shut it down and let it cool. Repeat until it
stabilizes and no longer spits bubbles out of the top tube into the
tank. Another way is to pull the temp sensor at the rear of the head
and fill to overflow. I usually do best by parking on a good slope,
nose up, and filling it there so that the air rises to the front of
the engine. As long as it's spitting bubbles into the top tube, you
have air in the system and it's going to run hot.

You can find the drain for the radiator (assuming I'm right about the
XJ/MJ) on the lower passenger side corner of the radiator. You have
to pull the grill insert to get at it (8 screws) and it's going to
make a mess. I replaced the plug with a draincock that had enough of
an extension that I could get a short piece of hose on so that I could
direct the flow into a bucket.

--
Will Honea <whonea@codenet.net>

johnny

I must warn you that those closed plastic holders often break off at one of
the connections and all is lost.
Assuming that your system is not plugged and the thermostat opens correctly,
it is often the case that an air pocket is formed in the top of the engine
and there is not a full load of coolant. they say you can pressure fill it
with a
hose somehow, or just keep filling the coolant holder while running the
eng. and try to get the air out.
I spent 185 dollars and put a later model radiator with a cap and eliminated
the platic closed system . also the later radiator is a three row and the
old one is two. no problems except you may change the water inlet and the
temperature sensor to fit the new setup. never a cooling problem for me NOW!
john
"Jerry" <gsvrcek@cfl.rr.com> wrote in message
news:dbc388f7.0307121126.15acb161@posting.google.c om...
> I bought this 89' Jeep 6 months ago. The papers in the glove box show
> the 6 cyl engine was rebuilt 3 years ago. Everything looks new.
> Radiator, water pump, a/c compressor, head, you name it, it's new.
> There is no radiator cap, just a plastic bottle up by the fire wall.
> It overheats all the time. While idle it may take 30 minutes, on the
> road it may take two hours depending on outside temp. I've replaced
> the t'stat & did a flush. Water flows into the top of the plastic
> bottle quite forcefully, so I guss that means the pump is doing it's
> job. But, then again I really don't know if the hoses are hooked up
> right because I've never worked on an engine that has no radiator cap.
> One hose goes from the t'stat to the top of the bottle & tee's to the
> bottom of the heater core. The other hose comes from the top of the
> heater core, tee's to the bottom of the bottle & then to the pump. The
> radiator also has no drain. The coolant looks good, not like it's
> being contaminated by combustion or oil. The oil looks good. The
> engine runs strong. When it overheats all the coolant comes out the
> cap on the plastic bottle. There is no cowling around the mechinecal
> fan (does it need one? I have no idea). The fan clutch is fine and the
> electric fan is fine. My brain is tapped out. I need help, what's up?