L.W.(=?iso-8859-1?Q?=DFill?=) Hughes III

Hi Tim,
I think you'll find the "curb" weight to be a figment of the
manufacturer's imagination. something they establish shipping costs by,
in the old days cars were shipped without even oil in the crankcase to
save a buck. I think you'll find yourself on the other side of two tons:
http://groups.google.com/groups?q=Je...***.net&rnum=1
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/

Tim Carver wrote:
>
> Not sure where you're getting that number.
>
> Base curb weigfht of a 2003 TJ is 3231 for a manual, 3268 for an
> auto, according to jeep.com. GVWR is 4450.
>
> Tim Carver
> news2@twocarvers.com

Matt Macchiarolo

Would that jeep.com rating be for a 2003 TJ Rubicon with a hard top, or is it
for the bare-bones SE, with the 4-cyl engine, pizza cutter wheels, soft top,
and no rear seat?

In article <3F3514F6.BB9A65F8@***.net>, L.W.(=?iso-8859-1?Q?=DFill?=) ------
III <----------@***.net> writes:

>Hi Tim,
> I think you'll find the "curb" weight to be a figment of the
>manufacturer's imagination. something they establish shipping costs by,
>in the old days cars were shipped without even oil in the crankcase to
>save a buck. I think you'll find yourself on the other side of two tons:
>
>http://groups.google.com/groups?q=Je...group:rec.auto
s.makers.jeep%2Bwillys&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=3D13BB2A.DB3B498A%40cox.net
&rnum=1
>
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
>mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
>Tim Carver wrote:
>>
>> Not sure where you're getting that number.
>>
>> Base curb weigfht of a 2003 TJ is 3231 for a manual, 3268 for an
>> auto, according to jeep.com. GVWR is 4450.
>>
>> Tim Carver
>> news2@twocarvers.com
>


* * *
Matt Macchiarolo
www.townpeddler.com
www.wolverine4wd.org
http://wolverine4wd.org/rigs/macchiarolo_ml.html

Tim Carver

On Sat, 09 Aug 2003 15:38:39 GMT, L.W.(ßill) ------ III
<----------@***.net> wrote:

>Hi Tim,
> I think you'll find the "curb" weight to be a figment of the
>manufacturer's imagination. something they establish shipping costs by,
>in the old days cars were shipped without even oil in the crankcase to
>save a buck. I think you'll find yourself on the other side of two tons:
>http://groups.google.com/groups?q=Je...***.net&rnum=1
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
>mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/

Hi Bill -

Curb weight is a standard term. It is the weight of an empty vehicle
(without passengers or payload), but including oil, gas, coolant, and
standard equipment.

I suppose that DC could be misstating the curb weight of TJs by 750
lbs, but I don't see the motivation for this, it's not like they make
a big deal out of how light a Jeep is.

If it really makes a difference to somebody (e.g., a trrucking
company, or perhaps the EPA) DC would be guilty of fraud if they
deliberately misstated an easily ascertainable fact to this extent.

>
>Tim Carver wrote:
>>
>> Not sure where you're getting that number.
>>
>> Base curb weigfht of a 2003 TJ is 3231 for a manual, 3268 for an
>> auto, according to jeep.com. GVWR is 4450.
>>
>> Tim Carver
>> news2@twocarvers.com

Tim Carver
news2@twocarvers.com

L.W.(=?iso-8859-1?Q?=DFill?=) Hughes III

I remember part of the dealer prep, back in the fifties was to fill
the crankcase, transmission, and differential. And it's not miss leading
any one, it's shipped short.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/

Tim Carver wrote:
>
> Hi Bill -
>
> Curb weight is a standard term. It is the weight of an empty vehicle
> (without passengers or payload), but including oil, gas, coolant, and
> standard equipment.
>
> I suppose that DC could be misstating the curb weight of TJs by 750
> lbs, but I don't see the motivation for this, it's not like they make
> a big deal out of how light a Jeep is.
>
> If it really makes a difference to somebody (e.g., a trrucking
> company, or perhaps the EPA) DC would be guilty of fraud if they
> deliberately misstated an easily ascertainable fact to this extent.

bllsht

750 lbs is a lot of oil.

In message <3F35978D.9A387945@***.net>, "L.W." wrote:

> I remember part of the dealer prep, back in the fifties was to fill
>the crankcase, transmission, and differential. And it's not miss leading
>any one, it's shipped short.
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
>mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
>Tim Carver wrote:
>>
>> Hi Bill -
>>
>> Curb weight is a standard term. It is the weight of an empty vehicle
>> (without passengers or payload), but including oil, gas, coolant, and
>> standard equipment.
>>
>> I suppose that DC could be misstating the curb weight of TJs by 750
>> lbs, but I don't see the motivation for this, it's not like they make
>> a big deal out of how light a Jeep is.
>>
>> If it really makes a difference to somebody (e.g., a trrucking
>> company, or perhaps the EPA) DC would be guilty of fraud if they
>> deliberately misstated an easily ascertainable fact to this extent.

L.W.(=?iso-8859-1?Q?=DFill?=) Hughes III

So, what does your Jip weight? Spend a couple of bucks at the truck
scales and find out.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/

bllsht wrote:
>
> 750 lbs is a lot of oil.

Goat Crapp

i weighed my individual components "weigh" back when... and i remember there
was something like a
~25 lb difference per door (half vs full w/ windows)
~near 100lb difference between my friend's stock SE wheels/tires (set of 5) and
my gamblers with 31" m/t tires (probably similar in weight to the mtr... these
tires are heavy people :)
~ backseat (not standard and perhaps nopt counted into curb weight) is what..
30 lbs or so?
~ hard top vs soft top.. theres another 100 or so lbs right there.
~ whatever the difference between i4 and i6 weight are.. (the i6 is a pretty
heavy engine from what i understand)
~ factory subwoofer (i didnt have one, but its probably in the 25 lb range)
~ rubicon's drivetrain... whatever weight the lockers, upgraded axles (the d44
was a good bit heavier than the d35 when i had mine replaced)

i can see how the actual curb weight can differ greatly from the claimed,
assuming its just a non optioned standard jeep they based the number on...

-Steve 98 TJ

Tim Carver

On 10 Aug 2003 17:48:46 GMT, goatcrapp@aol.comnospam (Goat Crapp)
wrote:

>i weighed my individual components "weigh" back when... and i remember there
>was something like a
>~25 lb difference per door (half vs full w/ windows)
>~near 100lb difference between my friend's stock SE wheels/tires (set of 5) and
>my gamblers with 31" m/t tires (probably similar in weight to the mtr... these
>tires are heavy people :)
>~ backseat (not standard and perhaps nopt counted into curb weight) is what..
>30 lbs or so?
>~ hard top vs soft top.. theres another 100 or so lbs right there.
>~ whatever the difference between i4 and i6 weight are.. (the i6 is a pretty
>heavy engine from what i understand)
>~ factory subwoofer (i didnt have one, but its probably in the 25 lb range)
>~ rubicon's drivetrain... whatever weight the lockers, upgraded axles (the d44
>was a good bit heavier than the d35 when i had mine replaced)
>
>i can see how the actual curb weight can differ greatly from the claimed,
>assuming its just a non optioned standard jeep they based the number on...
>
>-Steve 98 TJ

Steve -

These are really good points. I went back and looked at jeep.com
again. The number they quote is for a base SE. The weight of the
different engines, the rear seat, full doors with glass, and the hard
top taken together might well account for a good chunk of the missing
750 lbs or so we are talking about. Having just lugged my rear seat up
to its permanent home in my attic, I think its a lot more than 30 lbs.
OTOH, having just moved my sub to a different console, I think it
doesn't weigh very much at all.

So, I think you guys could be right, it could be near 4000 lbs or so
for a loaded sport/sahara or a rubicon. I would still bet that the
weight quoted by DC is exactly correct (including fuel and oil) for a
base SE.

I'm curious enough now that I'm going to try driving through the
scales at our landfill (they weigh you on the way in and out). I'll
post the number here (sahara soft top plus heavier bumpers,
tuffy console, drawer, and cage, minus rear seat and side steps).




Tim Carver
news2@twocarvers.com

L.W.(=?iso-8859-1?Q?=DFill?=) Hughes III

And I speak form the days when they shipped by rail, and there were
no piggybacks. You might ask an old codger next time you off load your
parking lot, what "dealer prep" entailed. For sure the Ford
differentials in 1960 was shipped drained, I was there to fill them.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/

Dennis wrote:
>
> Bill,
> I am a car hauler, and know for a FACT that they have ALWAYS shipped
> vehicles with oil and water since the beginning of car hauling. How do
> you think they get those cars on those trailers? A forklift? LOL Cya,
> Bill
>
> Dennis '02 Wrangler
> '98 Valkryie

Tim Carver

On Mon, 11 Aug 2003 15:51:15 GMT, Tim Carver <news2@twocarvers.com>
wrote:


>I'm curious enough now that I'm going to try driving through the
>scales at our landfill (they weigh you on the way in and out). I'll
>post the number here (sahara soft top plus heavier bumpers,
>tuffy console, drawer, and cage, minus rear seat and side steps).

So, I did this yesterday. With a full tank of gas, and after
subtracting out my weight, my rig weighs 3711 lbs. This is maybe a
little heavier than a stock soft sahara soft top because of all the
storage stuff, but even so, a sahara or rubicon or other factory
loaded I6 with hard top would have to be a minimum of 3800 or so,
which is pretty close to the 4000+ that I questioned when this
discussion started.



Tim Carver
news2@twocarvers.com