Re: 07 vs. 06 Wrangler torque curves?
 

When I lived in Western Washington, many families put up signs, "This family
supported by timber dollars". They were distinctive yellow, all the same
size and design. I think they were trying to make some kind of
anti-regulatory, anti-tree-hugger point. I wanted to put one up that said
"This family supported by Microsoft dollars", but I never got up the nerve.

The world does not owe anyone a living. If, like Bill, I prefer to buy from
companies that trade their stock on American stock exchanges, well then that
is my business. If I want to hang out at WalMart and subsidize the Chinese,
well then that is my business too.

Earle

"twaldron" <thomasOBVIOUS@rubicons.com> wrote in message
news:1_qdnamU8p7vRaTZnZ2dnUVZ_tWdnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
> Many American families depend on Americans buying the Titan.
>
> tw
> __________________________________________________ ___________________
> 2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco
>
> "There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness'."
>
> Pronunciation: 'jEp Function: noun Date: 1940
>
> Etymology: from g. p. (G= 'Government' P= '80 inch wheelbase')
> A small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80" wheelbase, 1/4-ton
> capacity and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II.
> __________________________________________________ ___________________
>
>
> L.W.(Bill) ------ III wrote:
> > Where all the moneys go to our enemy, unless you thing the man
> > hours equal ten, twenty thousand from the start of the assemble line to
> > where it drives off.
> > God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
> > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> >
> > twaldron wrote:
> >
> >>Mfg'd in good ole USA, employing thousands of Americans.
> >>
> >>tw
> >>________________________________________________ _____________________
> >>2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco

Re: 07 vs. 06 Wrangler torque curves?
 

Three...the Stevensons, the Johnsons and Sallie Mae Girdleunder....but
they don't count 'cause they cheat on their taxes...and besides, they
all drive KIAs.

tw
__________________________________________________ ___________________
2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco

"There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness'."

Pronunciation: 'jEp Function: noun Date: 1940

Etymology: from g. p. (G= 'Government' P= '80 inch wheelbase')
A small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80" wheelbase, 1/4-ton
capacity and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II.
__________________________________________________ ___________________

L.W.(Bill) ------ III wrote:
> And how more American families are staring to death, because we
> don't support America?
> God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> twaldron wrote:
>
>>Many American families depend on Americans buying the Titan.
>>
>>tw
>>________________________________________________ _____________________
>>2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco
>>
>>"There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness'."
>>
>>Pronunciation: 'jEp Function: noun Date: 1940
>>
>>Etymology: from g. p. (G= 'Government' P= '80 inch wheelbase')
>>A small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80" wheelbase, 1/4-ton
>>capacity and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II.

Re: 07 vs. 06 Wrangler torque curves?
 

Three...the Stevensons, the Johnsons and Sallie Mae Girdleunder....but
they don't count 'cause they cheat on their taxes...and besides, they
all drive KIAs.

tw
__________________________________________________ ___________________
2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco

"There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness'."

Pronunciation: 'jEp Function: noun Date: 1940

Etymology: from g. p. (G= 'Government' P= '80 inch wheelbase')
A small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80" wheelbase, 1/4-ton
capacity and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II.
__________________________________________________ ___________________

L.W.(Bill) ------ III wrote:
> And how more American families are staring to death, because we
> don't support America?
> God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> twaldron wrote:
>
>>Many American families depend on Americans buying the Titan.
>>
>>tw
>>________________________________________________ _____________________
>>2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco
>>
>>"There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness'."
>>
>>Pronunciation: 'jEp Function: noun Date: 1940
>>
>>Etymology: from g. p. (G= 'Government' P= '80 inch wheelbase')
>>A small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80" wheelbase, 1/4-ton
>>capacity and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II.

Re: 07 vs. 06 Wrangler torque curves?
 

Three...the Stevensons, the Johnsons and Sallie Mae Girdleunder....but
they don't count 'cause they cheat on their taxes...and besides, they
all drive KIAs.

tw
__________________________________________________ ___________________
2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco

"There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness'."

Pronunciation: 'jEp Function: noun Date: 1940

Etymology: from g. p. (G= 'Government' P= '80 inch wheelbase')
A small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80" wheelbase, 1/4-ton
capacity and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II.
__________________________________________________ ___________________

L.W.(Bill) ------ III wrote:
> And how more American families are staring to death, because we
> don't support America?
> God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
> mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
>
> twaldron wrote:
>
>>Many American families depend on Americans buying the Titan.
>>
>>tw
>>________________________________________________ _____________________
>>2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco
>>
>>"There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness'."
>>
>>Pronunciation: 'jEp Function: noun Date: 1940
>>
>>Etymology: from g. p. (G= 'Government' P= '80 inch wheelbase')
>>A small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80" wheelbase, 1/4-ton
>>capacity and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II.

Re: 07 vs. 06 Wrangler torque curves?
 

With the profits going to Japan.

"twaldron" <thomasOBVIOUS@rubicons.com> wrote in message
news:-ZmdnYqHyd-LsqTZnZ2dnUVZ_tOdnZ2d@comcast.com...
> Mfg'd in good ole USA, employing thousands of Americans.
>
> tw
> __________________________________________________ ___________________
> 2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco
>
> "There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness'."
>
> Pronunciation: 'jEp Function: noun Date: 1940
>
> Etymology: from g. p. (G= 'Government' P= '80 inch wheelbase')
> A small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80" wheelbase, 1/4-ton
> capacity and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II.
> __________________________________________________ ___________________
>
>
> Earle Horton wrote:
>> Jerry,
>>
>> A channel frame isn't any better or worse than a boxed frame of the same
>> same stiffness. You might consider the fact that over the road trucks,
>> like
>> the one that will haul your Titan to the dealership, use channel frames.
>> Boxed frames have the weaknesses that they can rust from the inside,
>> there
>> is no way to rust proof or even clean the rust out of them, and that big
>> rust flakes can even block the drain holes. This can never happen with a
>> channel frame.
>>
>> What are you thinking anyway, a truck of foreign manufacture?
>>
>> Earle
>>
>> "Jerry Bransford" <jerrypb@cox.net> wrote in message
>> news:vB9_f.168$bm6.46@fed1read04...
>>
>>>Just FYI, the Titan's tow rating is up to 9,500 lbs. It has a really
>>>strong boxed frame (the Toyota's frame is c-channel) and its 5.6L engine
>>>has more torque than any other truck in its class. When I buy a truck,
>>>it's going to be a Titan. :)
>>>
>>>Jerry
>>>
>>>twaldron wrote:
>>>
>>>>I think you're on the right track for your next TJ. The I6 in the 97-06
>>>>seems to suit your needs better. You just can't fault it for offroad
>>
>> fun.
>>
>>>>As far as the Titan/Tundra thing...yes, I was refering to
>>>>bigger/stronger as to being "better", that depends on how you use the
>>>>truck, of course. My needs/thoughts were different than yours, so I
>>>>leaned toward the Titan (towing 6000#+, carrying gear & passengers).
>>>>Current model performance aside, Toyota is my first choice (miss my
>>>>4Runner) and they are truly competing with the Nissan Titan next year.
>>>>
>>>>I definitely see why you chose the 7/8ths Tundra for your needs. The new
>>>>Tacoma would probably work for you too, weaving around trees (a bit
>>>>larger than the tiny previous Taco...I was too tall to sit in the old
>>>>one). Styling goes to Toyota, I agree, but I think Nissan had to make a
>>>>splash with the first viable real workhorse Japanese pickup to gain
>>>>respect. To compete with the Dodge, Ford and Chevy in selling to the
>>>>"puffed up" US workman, they had to lose that under powered, too small,
>>>>'tin can' image. I believe they did that and Toyota seems to be
>>>>following suit. This is a good thing.
>>>>
>>>>I was just curious, thanks.
>>>>
>>>>tw
>>>>______________________________________
>>>>2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco
>>>>
>>>>"There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness'."
>>>>
>>>>Pronunciation: 'jEp Function: noun Date: 1940
>>>>
>>>>Etymology: from g. p. (G= 'Government' P= '80 inch wheelbase')
>>>>A small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80" wheelbase, 1/4-ton
>>>>capacity and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II.
>>>>______________________________________________ _______________________
>>>>
>>>>Jeff Olsen wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>in article 2KednevIf5yN_avZRVn-ug@comcast.com, twaldron at
>>>>>thomasOBVIOUS@rubicons.com wrote on 4/7/06 5:50 AM:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Jeff Olsen wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>in article CrfZf.12672$tN3.5182@newssvr27.news.prodigy.net, Jarod
>>>>>>>Sprauer at
>>>>>>>jsprauer2000@yahoo.com wrote on 4/6/06 2:08 PM:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>'06 190 hp @ 4600 rpm
>>>>>>>>'07 205 hp @ 5200 rpm
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>So who ever runs their 4.0L I6 at 4600 rpm? Things sound like the
>>>>>>>world is
>>>>>>>about to blow up revving that high. ROAR!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Where torque matters to me, in a jeep, is at or near idle. I had my
>>
>> TJ
>>
>>>>>>>(sniff) geared 4.10 with 31's and it felt like an electric motor or
>>>>>>>something at idle. With great engine braking.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>The 4.7L V8 in my new Tundra, OTOH, likes to REV! It this
>>>>>>>fancypants '07
>>>>>>>engine a V6 or V8? Or did they rework the 4.0L?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>-jeff
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Ah, don't listen to him. He's a used car salesman. They don't know the
>>>>>>difference between HP and Torque.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Hah! Gotcha.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>You must've been hiding under a rock to miss all the discussion on the
>>>>>>'new' to the Wrangler line, V6! :) One thing it did is cure my
>>>>>>Upgrade-itis as far as any SWB Jeeps go.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Nah... I traded my TJ a few months ago and have been very busy in the
>>>>>meantime. Not paying attention to Jeeps. I've been skiing my ass
>>>>>off on
>>>>>my days off! (thought of the day: big thigh muscles are like big
>>
>> tires;
>>
>>>>>they make the tough stuff soooo much easier!)
>>>>>
>>>>>One thing this V6 thing DOES do for me, is set a time limit on buying
>>
>> my
>>
>>>>>next TJ. I learned from the first one that I don't want one as a rig
>>>>>that
>>>>>sees much street time, or at least commuting or long trips, I don't
>>>>>want to
>>>>>tow a trailer with it unnecessarily, and I don't want to haul my kids
>>>>>around
>>>>>in it. In other words, I want it to be my toy. So... for what I
>>>>>want, a
>>>>>used one is fine and one with about 70k miles would be perfectly
>>>>>serviceable, and half price. So... that means I've got about six
>>>>>years to
>>>>>buy a nice clean '06 with records and low miles AND THE I6 ENGINE!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> One question on the Tundra,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>they are coming out with a new one to actually compete with the Titan
>>>>>>next year, why didn't you wait for THAT one? The reason I ask is that
>>
>> I
>>
>>>>>>passed on the Toyota in favor of the Titan in '04. With the '07
>>>>>>improvements on the Toyota, I'd have gone with it instead.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Aren't they just making it bigger? That's not better as far as I'm
>>>>>concerned. For me, it was between the Taco and Tundra. The Tundra
>>>>>was on
>>>>>the large side of what I needed. And I was not after the ultimate
>>>>>heavy-duty truck to pull a large boat over mountain passes at 80 mph or
>>>>>anything. I do use it as a truck; at 3000 miles it has several dents
>>>>>in the
>>>>>bed and I was down to bare metal in a couple bad scrapes (but I got a
>>>>>bedliner sprayed on yesterday)... got it stuck for the first and second
>>>>>times last week hauling firewood out of my woods... etc. The hardest
>>>>>this
>>>>>truck will work is big loads of firewood (4 cords so far this year) and
>>>>>gravel, and hauling a bunch of stuff and a small trailer full of oak
>>>>>firewood to elk camp every year. My Wrangler did OK with that the
>>>>>last few
>>>>>years and I hope the Tundra will do better. Other than that I wanted
>>
>> a
>>
>>>>>pleasant commute 3-4 days a week into town a half hour each way. The
>>>>>Tundra
>>>>>and XM radio fit the bill!! Smooth, crazy quiet, fun to drive, great
>>>>>power
>>>>>when I get an excuse to pass somebody on the country roads...
>>>>>
>>>>>But to directly answer your question, the styling on the Nissan ruled
>>>>>it out
>>>>>for me. I'm not a chest-pounding kind of guy. I don't even know why
>>
>> the
>>
>>>>>Nissan is supposed to be better? More power? The Tundra hauls ASS
>>>>>and that
>>>>>4.7L engine is a marvel. More payload? Tundra is the biggest truck
>>
>> I've
>>
>>>>>ever had (my third) and hauls more than I care to load/unload.
>>>>>Looks? See
>>>>>above. Towing? Anything my Tundra won't tow I don't want any part
>>
>> of.
>>
>>>>>I think also the whole... I dunno.. the whole "Toyota" thing bears on
>>
>> the
>>
>>>>>decision too. We have a '95 Land Cruiser that is just an amazing
>>>>>vehicle.
>>>>>Talk about a capable, dependable, confindence-inspiring vehicle.
>>>>>Everyone i
>>>>>know with Toyota's loves them. My last truck was an '86 Nissan that I
>>>>>bought with 45k miles on it and it died at 177k miles (and still has
>>>>>more in
>>>>>it if anyone wants to put an engine in it) and I used it HARD. I have
>>
>> no
>>
>>>>>beef with Nissan; if the Titan wasn't trying to look so tough-guy
>>>>>puffed-up
>>>>>I would've considered one. But it's hard to argue against a Toyota.
>>>>>
>>>>>-jeff
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>tw
>>>>>>____________________________________________ _________________________
>>>>>>2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness'."
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Pronunciation: 'jEp Function: noun Date: 1940
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Etymology: from g. p. (G= 'Government' P= '80 inch wheelbase')
>>>>>>A small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80" wheelbase, 1/4-ton
>>>>>>capacity and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II.
>>>>>>____________________________________________ _________________________
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>--
>>>Jerry Bransford
>>>PP-ASEL N6TAY
>>>See the Geezer Jeep at
>>>http://members.cox.net/jerrypb/
>>
>>

Re: 07 vs. 06 Wrangler torque curves?
 

With the profits going to Japan.

"twaldron" <thomasOBVIOUS@rubicons.com> wrote in message
news:-ZmdnYqHyd-LsqTZnZ2dnUVZ_tOdnZ2d@comcast.com...
> Mfg'd in good ole USA, employing thousands of Americans.
>
> tw
> __________________________________________________ ___________________
> 2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco
>
> "There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness'."
>
> Pronunciation: 'jEp Function: noun Date: 1940
>
> Etymology: from g. p. (G= 'Government' P= '80 inch wheelbase')
> A small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80" wheelbase, 1/4-ton
> capacity and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II.
> __________________________________________________ ___________________
>
>
> Earle Horton wrote:
>> Jerry,
>>
>> A channel frame isn't any better or worse than a boxed frame of the same
>> same stiffness. You might consider the fact that over the road trucks,
>> like
>> the one that will haul your Titan to the dealership, use channel frames.
>> Boxed frames have the weaknesses that they can rust from the inside,
>> there
>> is no way to rust proof or even clean the rust out of them, and that big
>> rust flakes can even block the drain holes. This can never happen with a
>> channel frame.
>>
>> What are you thinking anyway, a truck of foreign manufacture?
>>
>> Earle
>>
>> "Jerry Bransford" <jerrypb@cox.net> wrote in message
>> news:vB9_f.168$bm6.46@fed1read04...
>>
>>>Just FYI, the Titan's tow rating is up to 9,500 lbs. It has a really
>>>strong boxed frame (the Toyota's frame is c-channel) and its 5.6L engine
>>>has more torque than any other truck in its class. When I buy a truck,
>>>it's going to be a Titan. :)
>>>
>>>Jerry
>>>
>>>twaldron wrote:
>>>
>>>>I think you're on the right track for your next TJ. The I6 in the 97-06
>>>>seems to suit your needs better. You just can't fault it for offroad
>>
>> fun.
>>
>>>>As far as the Titan/Tundra thing...yes, I was refering to
>>>>bigger/stronger as to being "better", that depends on how you use the
>>>>truck, of course. My needs/thoughts were different than yours, so I
>>>>leaned toward the Titan (towing 6000#+, carrying gear & passengers).
>>>>Current model performance aside, Toyota is my first choice (miss my
>>>>4Runner) and they are truly competing with the Nissan Titan next year.
>>>>
>>>>I definitely see why you chose the 7/8ths Tundra for your needs. The new
>>>>Tacoma would probably work for you too, weaving around trees (a bit
>>>>larger than the tiny previous Taco...I was too tall to sit in the old
>>>>one). Styling goes to Toyota, I agree, but I think Nissan had to make a
>>>>splash with the first viable real workhorse Japanese pickup to gain
>>>>respect. To compete with the Dodge, Ford and Chevy in selling to the
>>>>"puffed up" US workman, they had to lose that under powered, too small,
>>>>'tin can' image. I believe they did that and Toyota seems to be
>>>>following suit. This is a good thing.
>>>>
>>>>I was just curious, thanks.
>>>>
>>>>tw
>>>>______________________________________
>>>>2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco
>>>>
>>>>"There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness'."
>>>>
>>>>Pronunciation: 'jEp Function: noun Date: 1940
>>>>
>>>>Etymology: from g. p. (G= 'Government' P= '80 inch wheelbase')
>>>>A small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80" wheelbase, 1/4-ton
>>>>capacity and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II.
>>>>______________________________________________ _______________________
>>>>
>>>>Jeff Olsen wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>in article 2KednevIf5yN_avZRVn-ug@comcast.com, twaldron at
>>>>>thomasOBVIOUS@rubicons.com wrote on 4/7/06 5:50 AM:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Jeff Olsen wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>in article CrfZf.12672$tN3.5182@newssvr27.news.prodigy.net, Jarod
>>>>>>>Sprauer at
>>>>>>>jsprauer2000@yahoo.com wrote on 4/6/06 2:08 PM:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>'06 190 hp @ 4600 rpm
>>>>>>>>'07 205 hp @ 5200 rpm
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>So who ever runs their 4.0L I6 at 4600 rpm? Things sound like the
>>>>>>>world is
>>>>>>>about to blow up revving that high. ROAR!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Where torque matters to me, in a jeep, is at or near idle. I had my
>>
>> TJ
>>
>>>>>>>(sniff) geared 4.10 with 31's and it felt like an electric motor or
>>>>>>>something at idle. With great engine braking.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>The 4.7L V8 in my new Tundra, OTOH, likes to REV! It this
>>>>>>>fancypants '07
>>>>>>>engine a V6 or V8? Or did they rework the 4.0L?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>-jeff
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Ah, don't listen to him. He's a used car salesman. They don't know the
>>>>>>difference between HP and Torque.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Hah! Gotcha.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>You must've been hiding under a rock to miss all the discussion on the
>>>>>>'new' to the Wrangler line, V6! :) One thing it did is cure my
>>>>>>Upgrade-itis as far as any SWB Jeeps go.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Nah... I traded my TJ a few months ago and have been very busy in the
>>>>>meantime. Not paying attention to Jeeps. I've been skiing my ass
>>>>>off on
>>>>>my days off! (thought of the day: big thigh muscles are like big
>>
>> tires;
>>
>>>>>they make the tough stuff soooo much easier!)
>>>>>
>>>>>One thing this V6 thing DOES do for me, is set a time limit on buying
>>
>> my
>>
>>>>>next TJ. I learned from the first one that I don't want one as a rig
>>>>>that
>>>>>sees much street time, or at least commuting or long trips, I don't
>>>>>want to
>>>>>tow a trailer with it unnecessarily, and I don't want to haul my kids
>>>>>around
>>>>>in it. In other words, I want it to be my toy. So... for what I
>>>>>want, a
>>>>>used one is fine and one with about 70k miles would be perfectly
>>>>>serviceable, and half price. So... that means I've got about six
>>>>>years to
>>>>>buy a nice clean '06 with records and low miles AND THE I6 ENGINE!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> One question on the Tundra,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>they are coming out with a new one to actually compete with the Titan
>>>>>>next year, why didn't you wait for THAT one? The reason I ask is that
>>
>> I
>>
>>>>>>passed on the Toyota in favor of the Titan in '04. With the '07
>>>>>>improvements on the Toyota, I'd have gone with it instead.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Aren't they just making it bigger? That's not better as far as I'm
>>>>>concerned. For me, it was between the Taco and Tundra. The Tundra
>>>>>was on
>>>>>the large side of what I needed. And I was not after the ultimate
>>>>>heavy-duty truck to pull a large boat over mountain passes at 80 mph or
>>>>>anything. I do use it as a truck; at 3000 miles it has several dents
>>>>>in the
>>>>>bed and I was down to bare metal in a couple bad scrapes (but I got a
>>>>>bedliner sprayed on yesterday)... got it stuck for the first and second
>>>>>times last week hauling firewood out of my woods... etc. The hardest
>>>>>this
>>>>>truck will work is big loads of firewood (4 cords so far this year) and
>>>>>gravel, and hauling a bunch of stuff and a small trailer full of oak
>>>>>firewood to elk camp every year. My Wrangler did OK with that the
>>>>>last few
>>>>>years and I hope the Tundra will do better. Other than that I wanted
>>
>> a
>>
>>>>>pleasant commute 3-4 days a week into town a half hour each way. The
>>>>>Tundra
>>>>>and XM radio fit the bill!! Smooth, crazy quiet, fun to drive, great
>>>>>power
>>>>>when I get an excuse to pass somebody on the country roads...
>>>>>
>>>>>But to directly answer your question, the styling on the Nissan ruled
>>>>>it out
>>>>>for me. I'm not a chest-pounding kind of guy. I don't even know why
>>
>> the
>>
>>>>>Nissan is supposed to be better? More power? The Tundra hauls ASS
>>>>>and that
>>>>>4.7L engine is a marvel. More payload? Tundra is the biggest truck
>>
>> I've
>>
>>>>>ever had (my third) and hauls more than I care to load/unload.
>>>>>Looks? See
>>>>>above. Towing? Anything my Tundra won't tow I don't want any part
>>
>> of.
>>
>>>>>I think also the whole... I dunno.. the whole "Toyota" thing bears on
>>
>> the
>>
>>>>>decision too. We have a '95 Land Cruiser that is just an amazing
>>>>>vehicle.
>>>>>Talk about a capable, dependable, confindence-inspiring vehicle.
>>>>>Everyone i
>>>>>know with Toyota's loves them. My last truck was an '86 Nissan that I
>>>>>bought with 45k miles on it and it died at 177k miles (and still has
>>>>>more in
>>>>>it if anyone wants to put an engine in it) and I used it HARD. I have
>>
>> no
>>
>>>>>beef with Nissan; if the Titan wasn't trying to look so tough-guy
>>>>>puffed-up
>>>>>I would've considered one. But it's hard to argue against a Toyota.
>>>>>
>>>>>-jeff
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>tw
>>>>>>____________________________________________ _________________________
>>>>>>2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness'."
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Pronunciation: 'jEp Function: noun Date: 1940
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Etymology: from g. p. (G= 'Government' P= '80 inch wheelbase')
>>>>>>A small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80" wheelbase, 1/4-ton
>>>>>>capacity and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II.
>>>>>>____________________________________________ _________________________
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>--
>>>Jerry Bransford
>>>PP-ASEL N6TAY
>>>See the Geezer Jeep at
>>>http://members.cox.net/jerrypb/
>>
>>

Re: 07 vs. 06 Wrangler torque curves?
 

With the profits going to Japan.

"twaldron" <thomasOBVIOUS@rubicons.com> wrote in message
news:-ZmdnYqHyd-LsqTZnZ2dnUVZ_tOdnZ2d@comcast.com...
> Mfg'd in good ole USA, employing thousands of Americans.
>
> tw
> __________________________________________________ ___________________
> 2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco
>
> "There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness'."
>
> Pronunciation: 'jEp Function: noun Date: 1940
>
> Etymology: from g. p. (G= 'Government' P= '80 inch wheelbase')
> A small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80" wheelbase, 1/4-ton
> capacity and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II.
> __________________________________________________ ___________________
>
>
> Earle Horton wrote:
>> Jerry,
>>
>> A channel frame isn't any better or worse than a boxed frame of the same
>> same stiffness. You might consider the fact that over the road trucks,
>> like
>> the one that will haul your Titan to the dealership, use channel frames.
>> Boxed frames have the weaknesses that they can rust from the inside,
>> there
>> is no way to rust proof or even clean the rust out of them, and that big
>> rust flakes can even block the drain holes. This can never happen with a
>> channel frame.
>>
>> What are you thinking anyway, a truck of foreign manufacture?
>>
>> Earle
>>
>> "Jerry Bransford" <jerrypb@cox.net> wrote in message
>> news:vB9_f.168$bm6.46@fed1read04...
>>
>>>Just FYI, the Titan's tow rating is up to 9,500 lbs. It has a really
>>>strong boxed frame (the Toyota's frame is c-channel) and its 5.6L engine
>>>has more torque than any other truck in its class. When I buy a truck,
>>>it's going to be a Titan. :)
>>>
>>>Jerry
>>>
>>>twaldron wrote:
>>>
>>>>I think you're on the right track for your next TJ. The I6 in the 97-06
>>>>seems to suit your needs better. You just can't fault it for offroad
>>
>> fun.
>>
>>>>As far as the Titan/Tundra thing...yes, I was refering to
>>>>bigger/stronger as to being "better", that depends on how you use the
>>>>truck, of course. My needs/thoughts were different than yours, so I
>>>>leaned toward the Titan (towing 6000#+, carrying gear & passengers).
>>>>Current model performance aside, Toyota is my first choice (miss my
>>>>4Runner) and they are truly competing with the Nissan Titan next year.
>>>>
>>>>I definitely see why you chose the 7/8ths Tundra for your needs. The new
>>>>Tacoma would probably work for you too, weaving around trees (a bit
>>>>larger than the tiny previous Taco...I was too tall to sit in the old
>>>>one). Styling goes to Toyota, I agree, but I think Nissan had to make a
>>>>splash with the first viable real workhorse Japanese pickup to gain
>>>>respect. To compete with the Dodge, Ford and Chevy in selling to the
>>>>"puffed up" US workman, they had to lose that under powered, too small,
>>>>'tin can' image. I believe they did that and Toyota seems to be
>>>>following suit. This is a good thing.
>>>>
>>>>I was just curious, thanks.
>>>>
>>>>tw
>>>>______________________________________
>>>>2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco
>>>>
>>>>"There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness'."
>>>>
>>>>Pronunciation: 'jEp Function: noun Date: 1940
>>>>
>>>>Etymology: from g. p. (G= 'Government' P= '80 inch wheelbase')
>>>>A small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80" wheelbase, 1/4-ton
>>>>capacity and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II.
>>>>______________________________________________ _______________________
>>>>
>>>>Jeff Olsen wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>in article 2KednevIf5yN_avZRVn-ug@comcast.com, twaldron at
>>>>>thomasOBVIOUS@rubicons.com wrote on 4/7/06 5:50 AM:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Jeff Olsen wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>in article CrfZf.12672$tN3.5182@newssvr27.news.prodigy.net, Jarod
>>>>>>>Sprauer at
>>>>>>>jsprauer2000@yahoo.com wrote on 4/6/06 2:08 PM:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>'06 190 hp @ 4600 rpm
>>>>>>>>'07 205 hp @ 5200 rpm
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>So who ever runs their 4.0L I6 at 4600 rpm? Things sound like the
>>>>>>>world is
>>>>>>>about to blow up revving that high. ROAR!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Where torque matters to me, in a jeep, is at or near idle. I had my
>>
>> TJ
>>
>>>>>>>(sniff) geared 4.10 with 31's and it felt like an electric motor or
>>>>>>>something at idle. With great engine braking.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>The 4.7L V8 in my new Tundra, OTOH, likes to REV! It this
>>>>>>>fancypants '07
>>>>>>>engine a V6 or V8? Or did they rework the 4.0L?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>-jeff
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Ah, don't listen to him. He's a used car salesman. They don't know the
>>>>>>difference between HP and Torque.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Hah! Gotcha.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>You must've been hiding under a rock to miss all the discussion on the
>>>>>>'new' to the Wrangler line, V6! :) One thing it did is cure my
>>>>>>Upgrade-itis as far as any SWB Jeeps go.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Nah... I traded my TJ a few months ago and have been very busy in the
>>>>>meantime. Not paying attention to Jeeps. I've been skiing my ass
>>>>>off on
>>>>>my days off! (thought of the day: big thigh muscles are like big
>>
>> tires;
>>
>>>>>they make the tough stuff soooo much easier!)
>>>>>
>>>>>One thing this V6 thing DOES do for me, is set a time limit on buying
>>
>> my
>>
>>>>>next TJ. I learned from the first one that I don't want one as a rig
>>>>>that
>>>>>sees much street time, or at least commuting or long trips, I don't
>>>>>want to
>>>>>tow a trailer with it unnecessarily, and I don't want to haul my kids
>>>>>around
>>>>>in it. In other words, I want it to be my toy. So... for what I
>>>>>want, a
>>>>>used one is fine and one with about 70k miles would be perfectly
>>>>>serviceable, and half price. So... that means I've got about six
>>>>>years to
>>>>>buy a nice clean '06 with records and low miles AND THE I6 ENGINE!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> One question on the Tundra,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>they are coming out with a new one to actually compete with the Titan
>>>>>>next year, why didn't you wait for THAT one? The reason I ask is that
>>
>> I
>>
>>>>>>passed on the Toyota in favor of the Titan in '04. With the '07
>>>>>>improvements on the Toyota, I'd have gone with it instead.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Aren't they just making it bigger? That's not better as far as I'm
>>>>>concerned. For me, it was between the Taco and Tundra. The Tundra
>>>>>was on
>>>>>the large side of what I needed. And I was not after the ultimate
>>>>>heavy-duty truck to pull a large boat over mountain passes at 80 mph or
>>>>>anything. I do use it as a truck; at 3000 miles it has several dents
>>>>>in the
>>>>>bed and I was down to bare metal in a couple bad scrapes (but I got a
>>>>>bedliner sprayed on yesterday)... got it stuck for the first and second
>>>>>times last week hauling firewood out of my woods... etc. The hardest
>>>>>this
>>>>>truck will work is big loads of firewood (4 cords so far this year) and
>>>>>gravel, and hauling a bunch of stuff and a small trailer full of oak
>>>>>firewood to elk camp every year. My Wrangler did OK with that the
>>>>>last few
>>>>>years and I hope the Tundra will do better. Other than that I wanted
>>
>> a
>>
>>>>>pleasant commute 3-4 days a week into town a half hour each way. The
>>>>>Tundra
>>>>>and XM radio fit the bill!! Smooth, crazy quiet, fun to drive, great
>>>>>power
>>>>>when I get an excuse to pass somebody on the country roads...
>>>>>
>>>>>But to directly answer your question, the styling on the Nissan ruled
>>>>>it out
>>>>>for me. I'm not a chest-pounding kind of guy. I don't even know why
>>
>> the
>>
>>>>>Nissan is supposed to be better? More power? The Tundra hauls ASS
>>>>>and that
>>>>>4.7L engine is a marvel. More payload? Tundra is the biggest truck
>>
>> I've
>>
>>>>>ever had (my third) and hauls more than I care to load/unload.
>>>>>Looks? See
>>>>>above. Towing? Anything my Tundra won't tow I don't want any part
>>
>> of.
>>
>>>>>I think also the whole... I dunno.. the whole "Toyota" thing bears on
>>
>> the
>>
>>>>>decision too. We have a '95 Land Cruiser that is just an amazing
>>>>>vehicle.
>>>>>Talk about a capable, dependable, confindence-inspiring vehicle.
>>>>>Everyone i
>>>>>know with Toyota's loves them. My last truck was an '86 Nissan that I
>>>>>bought with 45k miles on it and it died at 177k miles (and still has
>>>>>more in
>>>>>it if anyone wants to put an engine in it) and I used it HARD. I have
>>
>> no
>>
>>>>>beef with Nissan; if the Titan wasn't trying to look so tough-guy
>>>>>puffed-up
>>>>>I would've considered one. But it's hard to argue against a Toyota.
>>>>>
>>>>>-jeff
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>tw
>>>>>>____________________________________________ _________________________
>>>>>>2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness'."
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Pronunciation: 'jEp Function: noun Date: 1940
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Etymology: from g. p. (G= 'Government' P= '80 inch wheelbase')
>>>>>>A small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80" wheelbase, 1/4-ton
>>>>>>capacity and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II.
>>>>>>____________________________________________ _________________________
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>--
>>>Jerry Bransford
>>>PP-ASEL N6TAY
>>>See the Geezer Jeep at
>>>http://members.cox.net/jerrypb/
>>
>>

Re: 07 vs. 06 Wrangler torque curves?
 

You mean like Jeep's profits go to Germany?

tw
__________________________________________________ ___________________
2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco

"There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness'."

Pronunciation: 'jEp Function: noun Date: 1940

Etymology: from g. p. (G= 'Government' P= '80 inch wheelbase')
A small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80" wheelbase, 1/4-ton
capacity and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II.
__________________________________________________ ___________________


Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> With the profits going to Japan.
>
> "twaldron" <thomasOBVIOUS@rubicons.com> wrote in message
> news:-ZmdnYqHyd-LsqTZnZ2dnUVZ_tOdnZ2d@comcast.com...
>
>>Mfg'd in good ole USA, employing thousands of Americans.
>>
>>tw
>>________________________________________________ _____________________
>>2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco

Re: 07 vs. 06 Wrangler torque curves?
 

You mean like Jeep's profits go to Germany?

tw
__________________________________________________ ___________________
2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco

"There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness'."

Pronunciation: 'jEp Function: noun Date: 1940

Etymology: from g. p. (G= 'Government' P= '80 inch wheelbase')
A small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80" wheelbase, 1/4-ton
capacity and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II.
__________________________________________________ ___________________


Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> With the profits going to Japan.
>
> "twaldron" <thomasOBVIOUS@rubicons.com> wrote in message
> news:-ZmdnYqHyd-LsqTZnZ2dnUVZ_tOdnZ2d@comcast.com...
>
>>Mfg'd in good ole USA, employing thousands of Americans.
>>
>>tw
>>________________________________________________ _____________________
>>2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco

Re: 07 vs. 06 Wrangler torque curves?
 

You mean like Jeep's profits go to Germany?

tw
__________________________________________________ ___________________
2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco

"There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness'."

Pronunciation: 'jEp Function: noun Date: 1940

Etymology: from g. p. (G= 'Government' P= '80 inch wheelbase')
A small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80" wheelbase, 1/4-ton
capacity and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II.
__________________________________________________ ___________________


Matt Macchiarolo wrote:
> With the profits going to Japan.
>
> "twaldron" <thomasOBVIOUS@rubicons.com> wrote in message
> news:-ZmdnYqHyd-LsqTZnZ2dnUVZ_tOdnZ2d@comcast.com...
>
>>Mfg'd in good ole USA, employing thousands of Americans.
>>
>>tw
>>________________________________________________ _____________________
>>2003 TJ Rubicon * 2001 XJ Sport * 1971 Bill Stroppe Baja Bronco