Re: what exactly happened here?
 

Kate wrote:
>
> "JD Adams" <JDAdams@Softcom.Net> wrote
>
> :
> : Bill is admittedly controversial. But there is more admiration than
> : scorn; he has much knowledge that he is always willing to share, and he
> : has experience that few understand. And I admire his restraint. It
> : has been said that the greatest quality a leader can demonstrate is the
> : ability to ignore hatred. This is here for all to see.
>
> I'm not fesharing your opinion here JD.
> People can lose admiration and respect for someone, no matter what their
> knowledge base is, if they consistantly go out and bring trouble home with
> them. A lot of Bill's knowledge can be gained from other sources easily
> enough without all of the hooey that is going along with it lately.
>
> In this case, Bill made some waves in another group, or groups and then
> rather than quash it, he encouraged it to escalate and now it has landed
> here because he is so hammerheaded he will not let it go.
>
> I say he needs to stop it.
> I don't admire him for this sort of thing.
>
> The folks in here giving him ego strokes for his actions are not helping
> much either. I think Bill ---- in his own mess kit.
>
> : I don't mind trolls being miserable by themself. But if they insist on
> : ------ing their anger publically, it is wise to follow Bill's example.
>
> They wouldn't have been angry if Bill would have stopped poking through the
> bars with a stick.

The only thing I'd disagree with about what Kate said was that Bill's
tormentors are angry. They're not. They're having fun, and they're
having it at his expense (and at the expense of anyone else who takes it
marginally seriously).

To break it down:

* Bill's the one spending time and effort sifting through headers and
trying to track down the posts' origins.

* Bill's the one spending time and effort to report his findings to
providers who may/may not care about what's happening -- if they're
even the appropriate providers in the first place.

* Bill's the one spending time and effort to respond to each post.

And ultimately:

* Bill's naive enough to think that all his time and effort is going
to make a bit of difference because as quickly as he might be
able to get an account nuked, new ones are created.

* Bill keeps encouraging them to continue by obediently fetching every
stick that's thrown.

Unless Bill (and anyone else who's getting upset by what he brought
here) learns to simply ignore posts that offend/don't interest him/them,
it's going to continue...and probably escalate. Like it or not, there's
~25 years of usenet history to back that up.


~Ted (returning to lurker mode)


--
..

Re: what exactly happened here?
 

Kate wrote:
>
> "JD Adams" <JDAdams@Softcom.Net> wrote
>
> :
> : Bill is admittedly controversial. But there is more admiration than
> : scorn; he has much knowledge that he is always willing to share, and he
> : has experience that few understand. And I admire his restraint. It
> : has been said that the greatest quality a leader can demonstrate is the
> : ability to ignore hatred. This is here for all to see.
>
> I'm not fesharing your opinion here JD.
> People can lose admiration and respect for someone, no matter what their
> knowledge base is, if they consistantly go out and bring trouble home with
> them. A lot of Bill's knowledge can be gained from other sources easily
> enough without all of the hooey that is going along with it lately.
>
> In this case, Bill made some waves in another group, or groups and then
> rather than quash it, he encouraged it to escalate and now it has landed
> here because he is so hammerheaded he will not let it go.
>
> I say he needs to stop it.
> I don't admire him for this sort of thing.
>
> The folks in here giving him ego strokes for his actions are not helping
> much either. I think Bill ---- in his own mess kit.
>
> : I don't mind trolls being miserable by themself. But if they insist on
> : ------ing their anger publically, it is wise to follow Bill's example.
>
> They wouldn't have been angry if Bill would have stopped poking through the
> bars with a stick.

The only thing I'd disagree with about what Kate said was that Bill's
tormentors are angry. They're not. They're having fun, and they're
having it at his expense (and at the expense of anyone else who takes it
marginally seriously).

To break it down:

* Bill's the one spending time and effort sifting through headers and
trying to track down the posts' origins.

* Bill's the one spending time and effort to report his findings to
providers who may/may not care about what's happening -- if they're
even the appropriate providers in the first place.

* Bill's the one spending time and effort to respond to each post.

And ultimately:

* Bill's naive enough to think that all his time and effort is going
to make a bit of difference because as quickly as he might be
able to get an account nuked, new ones are created.

* Bill keeps encouraging them to continue by obediently fetching every
stick that's thrown.

Unless Bill (and anyone else who's getting upset by what he brought
here) learns to simply ignore posts that offend/don't interest him/them,
it's going to continue...and probably escalate. Like it or not, there's
~25 years of usenet history to back that up.


~Ted (returning to lurker mode)


--
..

Re: what exactly happened here?
 

Kate wrote:
>
> "JD Adams" <JDAdams@Softcom.Net> wrote
>
> :
> : Bill is admittedly controversial. But there is more admiration than
> : scorn; he has much knowledge that he is always willing to share, and he
> : has experience that few understand. And I admire his restraint. It
> : has been said that the greatest quality a leader can demonstrate is the
> : ability to ignore hatred. This is here for all to see.
>
> I'm not fesharing your opinion here JD.
> People can lose admiration and respect for someone, no matter what their
> knowledge base is, if they consistantly go out and bring trouble home with
> them. A lot of Bill's knowledge can be gained from other sources easily
> enough without all of the hooey that is going along with it lately.
>
> In this case, Bill made some waves in another group, or groups and then
> rather than quash it, he encouraged it to escalate and now it has landed
> here because he is so hammerheaded he will not let it go.
>
> I say he needs to stop it.
> I don't admire him for this sort of thing.
>
> The folks in here giving him ego strokes for his actions are not helping
> much either. I think Bill ---- in his own mess kit.
>
> : I don't mind trolls being miserable by themself. But if they insist on
> : ------ing their anger publically, it is wise to follow Bill's example.
>
> They wouldn't have been angry if Bill would have stopped poking through the
> bars with a stick.

The only thing I'd disagree with about what Kate said was that Bill's
tormentors are angry. They're not. They're having fun, and they're
having it at his expense (and at the expense of anyone else who takes it
marginally seriously).

To break it down:

* Bill's the one spending time and effort sifting through headers and
trying to track down the posts' origins.

* Bill's the one spending time and effort to report his findings to
providers who may/may not care about what's happening -- if they're
even the appropriate providers in the first place.

* Bill's the one spending time and effort to respond to each post.

And ultimately:

* Bill's naive enough to think that all his time and effort is going
to make a bit of difference because as quickly as he might be
able to get an account nuked, new ones are created.

* Bill keeps encouraging them to continue by obediently fetching every
stick that's thrown.

Unless Bill (and anyone else who's getting upset by what he brought
here) learns to simply ignore posts that offend/don't interest him/them,
it's going to continue...and probably escalate. Like it or not, there's
~25 years of usenet history to back that up.


~Ted (returning to lurker mode)


--
..

Re: what exactly happened here?
 

It's easy Billy Ray, I have that fool with the poser Jeep following me
through usenet spouting off 'blatant' lies because I pissed him off.
All you have to do is Google someone to find out where they post to
stalk them.

Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
(More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)

billy ray wrote:
>
> Bill,
> How did they follow you here? Are these cross posts showing up on all
> boards of which you are a member?
>
> "L.W.(Bill) ------ III" <----------@cox.net> wrote in message
> news:444B9293.BC8325E9@cox.net...
> > Are you so naive Kate, as to believe if no one turned them in that they
> > wouldn't spam this group, like big time with all the commercial
> > advertising?
> > God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
> > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> >
> > Kate wrote:
> >>
> >> Just what makes you so goddamn proud of pissing off people like this and
> >> then having them follow you from group to group posting their ilk and
> >> annoying everyone in all of the groups involved?
> >>
> >> Honestly Bill, you might try considering the consequences of your
> >> actions.
> >> Eventually even those that respect your knowledge and sense of humor may
> >> even turn the other way because of your 'fan club'.
> >> People have a low tolerance for --------, and that's what this is. I know
> >> that I am certainly sick to death of opening the group to see all of the
> >> posts about your supposed affection for barnyard animals.
> >>
> >> I suppose that this being the case I could leave, but unlike some people
> >> I
> >> am not normally one to be chased off by undesirables, I like to be the
> >> one
> >> to do the chasing.
> >>
> >> So, how about you try doing whatever it is you have to do to get these
> >> guys
> >> to leave you alone? Next time don't antagonize them.
> >> This all falls back on YOUR shoulders, you have to be the one to deal
> >> with
> >> it.
> >> It's time for you to clean up the mess that you tracked into the house
> >> Bill.
> >>
> >> Damn kids, dress them all up, wash behind their ears and they STILL
> >> embarrass you in front of rich Aunt Tillie.
> >>
> >> Kate

Re: what exactly happened here?
 

It's easy Billy Ray, I have that fool with the poser Jeep following me
through usenet spouting off 'blatant' lies because I pissed him off.
All you have to do is Google someone to find out where they post to
stalk them.

Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
(More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)

billy ray wrote:
>
> Bill,
> How did they follow you here? Are these cross posts showing up on all
> boards of which you are a member?
>
> "L.W.(Bill) ------ III" <----------@cox.net> wrote in message
> news:444B9293.BC8325E9@cox.net...
> > Are you so naive Kate, as to believe if no one turned them in that they
> > wouldn't spam this group, like big time with all the commercial
> > advertising?
> > God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
> > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> >
> > Kate wrote:
> >>
> >> Just what makes you so goddamn proud of pissing off people like this and
> >> then having them follow you from group to group posting their ilk and
> >> annoying everyone in all of the groups involved?
> >>
> >> Honestly Bill, you might try considering the consequences of your
> >> actions.
> >> Eventually even those that respect your knowledge and sense of humor may
> >> even turn the other way because of your 'fan club'.
> >> People have a low tolerance for --------, and that's what this is. I know
> >> that I am certainly sick to death of opening the group to see all of the
> >> posts about your supposed affection for barnyard animals.
> >>
> >> I suppose that this being the case I could leave, but unlike some people
> >> I
> >> am not normally one to be chased off by undesirables, I like to be the
> >> one
> >> to do the chasing.
> >>
> >> So, how about you try doing whatever it is you have to do to get these
> >> guys
> >> to leave you alone? Next time don't antagonize them.
> >> This all falls back on YOUR shoulders, you have to be the one to deal
> >> with
> >> it.
> >> It's time for you to clean up the mess that you tracked into the house
> >> Bill.
> >>
> >> Damn kids, dress them all up, wash behind their ears and they STILL
> >> embarrass you in front of rich Aunt Tillie.
> >>
> >> Kate

Re: what exactly happened here?
 

It's easy Billy Ray, I have that fool with the poser Jeep following me
through usenet spouting off 'blatant' lies because I pissed him off.
All you have to do is Google someone to find out where they post to
stalk them.

Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view!
Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...?id=2115147590
(More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)

billy ray wrote:
>
> Bill,
> How did they follow you here? Are these cross posts showing up on all
> boards of which you are a member?
>
> "L.W.(Bill) ------ III" <----------@cox.net> wrote in message
> news:444B9293.BC8325E9@cox.net...
> > Are you so naive Kate, as to believe if no one turned them in that they
> > wouldn't spam this group, like big time with all the commercial
> > advertising?
> > God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O
> > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/
> >
> > Kate wrote:
> >>
> >> Just what makes you so goddamn proud of pissing off people like this and
> >> then having them follow you from group to group posting their ilk and
> >> annoying everyone in all of the groups involved?
> >>
> >> Honestly Bill, you might try considering the consequences of your
> >> actions.
> >> Eventually even those that respect your knowledge and sense of humor may
> >> even turn the other way because of your 'fan club'.
> >> People have a low tolerance for --------, and that's what this is. I know
> >> that I am certainly sick to death of opening the group to see all of the
> >> posts about your supposed affection for barnyard animals.
> >>
> >> I suppose that this being the case I could leave, but unlike some people
> >> I
> >> am not normally one to be chased off by undesirables, I like to be the
> >> one
> >> to do the chasing.
> >>
> >> So, how about you try doing whatever it is you have to do to get these
> >> guys
> >> to leave you alone? Next time don't antagonize them.
> >> This all falls back on YOUR shoulders, you have to be the one to deal
> >> with
> >> it.
> >> It's time for you to clean up the mess that you tracked into the house
> >> Bill.
> >>
> >> Damn kids, dress them all up, wash behind their ears and they STILL
> >> embarrass you in front of rich Aunt Tillie.
> >>
> >> Kate

Re: what exactly happened here?
 

"Earle Horton" <NurseBustersNoSpam@msn.com> wrote in message
news:444b98ec$0$24451$a82e2bb9@reader.athenanews.c om...
: Kate,
:
: I have seen newsgroups broken up by abusive posters and the conflicts they
: generate. Whatever Bill did, I am sure it was justified. It is like
: turning in a litterer on the highway, or a vehicle in the HOV lane, with
one
: occupant, or a child abuser, or calling 911 when you see a burglar break
: into your neighbor's house, or wolf poachers. Somebody has to do it.
:
: I had to turn in a prominent member of my community once, for breaking the
: law. I thought about it quite a while. I realized that there would be
some
: people who did not understand, who did not want to understand. I thought
: about the fact that the low life scum and his friends would try to libel
me,
: much as these cowards are libelling Bill, and that some people would
believe
: them. Several people asked me not to do it, because of the "damage" that
it
: would do to our community. Well, now I know who my real friends are.
:
: Not turning the scum in, is never an option.
:
: Earle
:

All perfectly valid points Earle but that is ASSUMING that what Bill did was
something good.
We all know what happens when we assume.

I remember his very first post to me was telling me to get a REAL Jeep. He
then proceeded to disrespect my brand new pride and joy for several posts,
because it was not HIS idea of a REAL Jeep. What a crock of ----.
It went about a yard up my ass. Face to face, I'd have given him a piece of
my mind.

He can be abrasive from the get-go and I am just saying that he may have
brought this on himself.

I'm not saying he DID but he could have.
Furthermore, I think he likes the attention.
He has successfully become the center of attention in this and other groups
simply because of his 'fan club'
It's like walking onto a grammar school play yard at times.

I have not been in this group long but I have been on Usenet for something
like 12 years - you remember, back in the day?
When you logged onto the server in a little black screen.

These are particularly crafty vile little trolls.
But I'm telling you, they didn't just choose him from the herd because he is
soft spoken, gentle natured, good old Bill.
He did something to piss them off. Note - THEM. More than one person even.

I think I may even have a fair idea of who one of them is and I'm betting
that no matter how hard Bill tried, if it is who I think it is, he will
NEVER get the guy.

If I had the time or interest I would google it to see where it started.
But I just don't care about it that much.

Ya'll can pat him on the back all you want. IN THIS CASE I'd like to put my
boot in his ass and tell him to grow the hell up.

On another note, it's in the 70's outside and my Jeep is calling to me.
Can you hear it?
"Katieeeeeee... come put the top down.... lets go for a drive!"

That means, I'm outta here :)

Kate

Re: what exactly happened here?
 

"Earle Horton" <NurseBustersNoSpam@msn.com> wrote in message
news:444b98ec$0$24451$a82e2bb9@reader.athenanews.c om...
: Kate,
:
: I have seen newsgroups broken up by abusive posters and the conflicts they
: generate. Whatever Bill did, I am sure it was justified. It is like
: turning in a litterer on the highway, or a vehicle in the HOV lane, with
one
: occupant, or a child abuser, or calling 911 when you see a burglar break
: into your neighbor's house, or wolf poachers. Somebody has to do it.
:
: I had to turn in a prominent member of my community once, for breaking the
: law. I thought about it quite a while. I realized that there would be
some
: people who did not understand, who did not want to understand. I thought
: about the fact that the low life scum and his friends would try to libel
me,
: much as these cowards are libelling Bill, and that some people would
believe
: them. Several people asked me not to do it, because of the "damage" that
it
: would do to our community. Well, now I know who my real friends are.
:
: Not turning the scum in, is never an option.
:
: Earle
:

All perfectly valid points Earle but that is ASSUMING that what Bill did was
something good.
We all know what happens when we assume.

I remember his very first post to me was telling me to get a REAL Jeep. He
then proceeded to disrespect my brand new pride and joy for several posts,
because it was not HIS idea of a REAL Jeep. What a crock of ----.
It went about a yard up my ass. Face to face, I'd have given him a piece of
my mind.

He can be abrasive from the get-go and I am just saying that he may have
brought this on himself.

I'm not saying he DID but he could have.
Furthermore, I think he likes the attention.
He has successfully become the center of attention in this and other groups
simply because of his 'fan club'
It's like walking onto a grammar school play yard at times.

I have not been in this group long but I have been on Usenet for something
like 12 years - you remember, back in the day?
When you logged onto the server in a little black screen.

These are particularly crafty vile little trolls.
But I'm telling you, they didn't just choose him from the herd because he is
soft spoken, gentle natured, good old Bill.
He did something to piss them off. Note - THEM. More than one person even.

I think I may even have a fair idea of who one of them is and I'm betting
that no matter how hard Bill tried, if it is who I think it is, he will
NEVER get the guy.

If I had the time or interest I would google it to see where it started.
But I just don't care about it that much.

Ya'll can pat him on the back all you want. IN THIS CASE I'd like to put my
boot in his ass and tell him to grow the hell up.

On another note, it's in the 70's outside and my Jeep is calling to me.
Can you hear it?
"Katieeeeeee... come put the top down.... lets go for a drive!"

That means, I'm outta here :)

Kate

Re: what exactly happened here?
 

"Earle Horton" <NurseBustersNoSpam@msn.com> wrote in message
news:444b98ec$0$24451$a82e2bb9@reader.athenanews.c om...
: Kate,
:
: I have seen newsgroups broken up by abusive posters and the conflicts they
: generate. Whatever Bill did, I am sure it was justified. It is like
: turning in a litterer on the highway, or a vehicle in the HOV lane, with
one
: occupant, or a child abuser, or calling 911 when you see a burglar break
: into your neighbor's house, or wolf poachers. Somebody has to do it.
:
: I had to turn in a prominent member of my community once, for breaking the
: law. I thought about it quite a while. I realized that there would be
some
: people who did not understand, who did not want to understand. I thought
: about the fact that the low life scum and his friends would try to libel
me,
: much as these cowards are libelling Bill, and that some people would
believe
: them. Several people asked me not to do it, because of the "damage" that
it
: would do to our community. Well, now I know who my real friends are.
:
: Not turning the scum in, is never an option.
:
: Earle
:

All perfectly valid points Earle but that is ASSUMING that what Bill did was
something good.
We all know what happens when we assume.

I remember his very first post to me was telling me to get a REAL Jeep. He
then proceeded to disrespect my brand new pride and joy for several posts,
because it was not HIS idea of a REAL Jeep. What a crock of ----.
It went about a yard up my ass. Face to face, I'd have given him a piece of
my mind.

He can be abrasive from the get-go and I am just saying that he may have
brought this on himself.

I'm not saying he DID but he could have.
Furthermore, I think he likes the attention.
He has successfully become the center of attention in this and other groups
simply because of his 'fan club'
It's like walking onto a grammar school play yard at times.

I have not been in this group long but I have been on Usenet for something
like 12 years - you remember, back in the day?
When you logged onto the server in a little black screen.

These are particularly crafty vile little trolls.
But I'm telling you, they didn't just choose him from the herd because he is
soft spoken, gentle natured, good old Bill.
He did something to piss them off. Note - THEM. More than one person even.

I think I may even have a fair idea of who one of them is and I'm betting
that no matter how hard Bill tried, if it is who I think it is, he will
NEVER get the guy.

If I had the time or interest I would google it to see where it started.
But I just don't care about it that much.

Ya'll can pat him on the back all you want. IN THIS CASE I'd like to put my
boot in his ass and tell him to grow the hell up.

On another note, it's in the 70's outside and my Jeep is calling to me.
Can you hear it?
"Katieeeeeee... come put the top down.... lets go for a drive!"

That means, I'm outta here :)

Kate

Re: what exactly happened here?
 

"Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:444BA6B1.EFE06AE0@sympatico.ca...
: It's easy Billy Ray, I have that fool with the poser Jeep following me
: through usenet spouting off 'blatant' lies because I pissed him off.
: All you have to do is Google someone to find out where they post to
: stalk them.


By the way Mike - I owe you an apology.
I thought the guy might be genuine the first tiem he posted. You spotted him
from the get-go.

Sorry I defended him to you when you were right about him trolling for
votes.

Kate