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Re: TJ not returning to center after turn
Ο "Spdloader" <askforit@nospam.triad.rr.com> έγραψε στο μήνυμα news:46d0b0e9$0$4037$4c368faf@roadrunner.com... > > "Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@verizon.net> wrote in message > news:Ji1Ai.159$hV.157@trnddc02... >>I wasn't very clear earlier. >> >> When you have sufficient negative caster, the weight of the vehicle >> settles into the steering geometry and literally forces the front tires >> to be straight ahead. If you've ever ridden a chopper, you probably >> noticed that the steering was very heavy to get off of center, this is >> because of the very steep Caster Angle that is a natural part of a >> chopper. Choppers go straight very easily, but it can be a chore to make >> them turn. >> >> When your Jeep has sufficient Caster Angle, the tires will prefer to be >> pointed straight ahead. If your Caster angle is almost right, you might >> notice that the wheel will spin almost by itself from a full lock turn >> back to center, or within about a 1/4 to 1/8th turn from center. It is >> not unusual that the steering will have a bit of slop on either side of >> center where you have to provide the input, but outside of the slop >> range, the wheel should return to the slop range pretty much by itself. >> The test I like is to mimic backing out of a parking space and turning >> the wheel nearly full lock -- the wheel should move towards the center >> when you go forward, and should require little more than a flick of the >> wrist if it needs that much. A U-turn should be self-centering too. >> >> I think you need to visit an alignment shop to have the caster angle >> adjusted more negative. There is a specifrication for this setting, and >> you are likely at the end closer to zero, but you need to be at the end >> closer to the max. range. Since they have to check it, you may as well >> have them physically make the change to the max setting. >> >> If the range is -0.1 to -0.7, then you are currently closer to -0.1, but >> want to be closer to -0.7. I don't know what the spec is, I just know you >> are not at the preferred setting. >> > > For the sake of discussion, Jeff, why would his caster suddenly be off? > Would a 2" spring lift be substantial enough to cause it? > Obviously, it would make the upper ball joint move slightly forward, but > would it be enough to cause his problem? > ....and did the problem start immediately after installing the spring > lift? > On the other hand,...... > Dry, worn ball joints won't allow the spindles to auto-return, they tend > to stick. > > Not for arguments sake, for discussions sake. > > Spdloader Whith a 2" lift the caster decreases from 7 to 5 degrees. Thats because the upper arm joint on the axle moves slightly forward when the axle drops, and the lower arm joint on the axle moves backwards. 5 degrees of caster is outside the 6-8 degrees range given by the manufacturer. But still not enough alone to prevent self centering. Another problem such as the balljoint failure must co-exist, that together with the reduced self-centering force has become apparent. Bill Spiliotopoulos, '96 XJ, '06 TJ. |
Re: TJ not returning to center after turn
Ο "Spdloader" <askforit@nospam.triad.rr.com> έγραψε στο μήνυμα news:46d0b0e9$0$4037$4c368faf@roadrunner.com... > > "Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@verizon.net> wrote in message > news:Ji1Ai.159$hV.157@trnddc02... >>I wasn't very clear earlier. >> >> When you have sufficient negative caster, the weight of the vehicle >> settles into the steering geometry and literally forces the front tires >> to be straight ahead. If you've ever ridden a chopper, you probably >> noticed that the steering was very heavy to get off of center, this is >> because of the very steep Caster Angle that is a natural part of a >> chopper. Choppers go straight very easily, but it can be a chore to make >> them turn. >> >> When your Jeep has sufficient Caster Angle, the tires will prefer to be >> pointed straight ahead. If your Caster angle is almost right, you might >> notice that the wheel will spin almost by itself from a full lock turn >> back to center, or within about a 1/4 to 1/8th turn from center. It is >> not unusual that the steering will have a bit of slop on either side of >> center where you have to provide the input, but outside of the slop >> range, the wheel should return to the slop range pretty much by itself. >> The test I like is to mimic backing out of a parking space and turning >> the wheel nearly full lock -- the wheel should move towards the center >> when you go forward, and should require little more than a flick of the >> wrist if it needs that much. A U-turn should be self-centering too. >> >> I think you need to visit an alignment shop to have the caster angle >> adjusted more negative. There is a specifrication for this setting, and >> you are likely at the end closer to zero, but you need to be at the end >> closer to the max. range. Since they have to check it, you may as well >> have them physically make the change to the max setting. >> >> If the range is -0.1 to -0.7, then you are currently closer to -0.1, but >> want to be closer to -0.7. I don't know what the spec is, I just know you >> are not at the preferred setting. >> > > For the sake of discussion, Jeff, why would his caster suddenly be off? > Would a 2" spring lift be substantial enough to cause it? > Obviously, it would make the upper ball joint move slightly forward, but > would it be enough to cause his problem? > ....and did the problem start immediately after installing the spring > lift? > On the other hand,...... > Dry, worn ball joints won't allow the spindles to auto-return, they tend > to stick. > > Not for arguments sake, for discussions sake. > > Spdloader Whith a 2" lift the caster decreases from 7 to 5 degrees. Thats because the upper arm joint on the axle moves slightly forward when the axle drops, and the lower arm joint on the axle moves backwards. 5 degrees of caster is outside the 6-8 degrees range given by the manufacturer. But still not enough alone to prevent self centering. Another problem such as the balljoint failure must co-exist, that together with the reduced self-centering force has become apparent. Bill Spiliotopoulos, '96 XJ, '06 TJ. |
Re: TJ not returning to center after turn
Ο "Spdloader" <askforit@nospam.triad.rr.com> έγραψε στο μήνυμα news:46d0b0e9$0$4037$4c368faf@roadrunner.com... > > "Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@verizon.net> wrote in message > news:Ji1Ai.159$hV.157@trnddc02... >>I wasn't very clear earlier. >> >> When you have sufficient negative caster, the weight of the vehicle >> settles into the steering geometry and literally forces the front tires >> to be straight ahead. If you've ever ridden a chopper, you probably >> noticed that the steering was very heavy to get off of center, this is >> because of the very steep Caster Angle that is a natural part of a >> chopper. Choppers go straight very easily, but it can be a chore to make >> them turn. >> >> When your Jeep has sufficient Caster Angle, the tires will prefer to be >> pointed straight ahead. If your Caster angle is almost right, you might >> notice that the wheel will spin almost by itself from a full lock turn >> back to center, or within about a 1/4 to 1/8th turn from center. It is >> not unusual that the steering will have a bit of slop on either side of >> center where you have to provide the input, but outside of the slop >> range, the wheel should return to the slop range pretty much by itself. >> The test I like is to mimic backing out of a parking space and turning >> the wheel nearly full lock -- the wheel should move towards the center >> when you go forward, and should require little more than a flick of the >> wrist if it needs that much. A U-turn should be self-centering too. >> >> I think you need to visit an alignment shop to have the caster angle >> adjusted more negative. There is a specifrication for this setting, and >> you are likely at the end closer to zero, but you need to be at the end >> closer to the max. range. Since they have to check it, you may as well >> have them physically make the change to the max setting. >> >> If the range is -0.1 to -0.7, then you are currently closer to -0.1, but >> want to be closer to -0.7. I don't know what the spec is, I just know you >> are not at the preferred setting. >> > > For the sake of discussion, Jeff, why would his caster suddenly be off? > Would a 2" spring lift be substantial enough to cause it? > Obviously, it would make the upper ball joint move slightly forward, but > would it be enough to cause his problem? > ....and did the problem start immediately after installing the spring > lift? > On the other hand,...... > Dry, worn ball joints won't allow the spindles to auto-return, they tend > to stick. > > Not for arguments sake, for discussions sake. > > Spdloader Whith a 2" lift the caster decreases from 7 to 5 degrees. Thats because the upper arm joint on the axle moves slightly forward when the axle drops, and the lower arm joint on the axle moves backwards. 5 degrees of caster is outside the 6-8 degrees range given by the manufacturer. But still not enough alone to prevent self centering. Another problem such as the balljoint failure must co-exist, that together with the reduced self-centering force has become apparent. Bill Spiliotopoulos, '96 XJ, '06 TJ. |
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