Re: Speedo wrong, but is that all?
Live and learn. Here I've been thinking that the one piece axle came
in with the TJ - now I've got to revise my shopping list again, since I'm looking for a SWB ride now. Took the wife back in the hills to look at the leaves turning and she decided that both she and the dog would really like it if I got something to supplement the MJ. I guess we all win one sometime <g>. On Sat, 4 Oct 2003 02:05:20 UTC Mike Romain <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote: > Man, you aren't going to be a happy camper when you open that front up. > > The 94's have a locked front axle setup, no vacuum or anything else to > turn it on. You spin one wheel in the air, the driveshaft must turn.... > > Mike > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > The Hurdy Gurdy Man wrote: > > > > I have what is clearly the world's worst news feed being that none of the > > replies to my original post have shown up yet, but I can see on Google that > > there have been quite a few. Thanks to all that have replied! Here's what > > I've done and discovered so far, but it's raised a few more questions as a > > result (isn't that always the way?). > > > > I put one rear tire up in the air, shifted into neutral, marked a spot on > > the tire, spun it twice and counted the number of turns of the driveshaft. > > This gave me about 3.08 ~ 3.10 turns for two tire rotations... accounting > > for any slop in the process, I'm guessing this means I have 3.07 gears on > > the rear. It's a 1994 with a 4.0L engine and a five speed manual > > transmission, which I'm assuming is reasonable. So then I tried this same > > procedure with the front, but... nothing. With one tire on the ground, one > > in the air, and the various gear selectors moved into all kinds of different > > positions (in gear, neutral, 2WD, 4WD, etc.) I couldn't get the driveshaft > > to move while I turned the wheel. I don't see any sort of locking mechanism > > on the wheel hubs, and the only tube running into the front differential > > that seems like it migh control something on the inside seems to only be a > > vent tube that runs up by the radiator, so I'm not sure what I'm missing > > here... sometimes you can turn the driveshaft by hand and get a very slight > > bit of movement in the wheel, but definitely nothing solid and absolutely > > not the other way around. Is there some different trick I should be trying > > here? I'm a stranger to the ways of 4WD, and my shop manual is still four > > days out, so I'm at a loss for what to try next. It seems to me the lgoic > > behind the procedure is sound, but then I could very well be overlooking > > something critical. > > > > The speedometer is most decidedly an electronic one and not cable driven, > > and presumably has been since the day it was born as the gauges have never > > been changed. The tires are slightly larger than the originals, but that > > was the case before the accident and the speedo offset due to that was a > > fairly minor one. Certainly not the 15 or so MPH it's reading off now. I > > see that quadratec.com sells a recalibration box, plus there's a bevy of > > potential speedometer gear changes that can be done, so once I figure out > > exactly why it's incorrect I'll make my next move. It is possible that some > > portion of the drivetrain was swapped out during the repair, especially > > considering how much cleaner the transmission is than various other parts of > > the car... but that information is only suggestive of what happened, and not > > conclusive. > > > > I'll get under there this weekend and pop out the current speedo gear to see > > what it is. I don't want to pop open the front differential cover and > > actually count gear teeth, but if that's the only solution then I will. > > It's probably overdue for a fluid change anyhow. There's also a temptation > > to just put the thing up on four stands and put it in gear to see what > > happens... might be a faster way of figuring out what's up with the front > > differential! > > > > Thanks again to everyone who has helped on this rather perplexing problem, > > hopefully I'll be to the bottom of it soon. > > > > Bryan -- Will Honea |
Re: Speedo wrong, but is that all?
Live and learn. Here I've been thinking that the one piece axle came
in with the TJ - now I've got to revise my shopping list again, since I'm looking for a SWB ride now. Took the wife back in the hills to look at the leaves turning and she decided that both she and the dog would really like it if I got something to supplement the MJ. I guess we all win one sometime <g>. On Sat, 4 Oct 2003 02:05:20 UTC Mike Romain <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote: > Man, you aren't going to be a happy camper when you open that front up. > > The 94's have a locked front axle setup, no vacuum or anything else to > turn it on. You spin one wheel in the air, the driveshaft must turn.... > > Mike > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > The Hurdy Gurdy Man wrote: > > > > I have what is clearly the world's worst news feed being that none of the > > replies to my original post have shown up yet, but I can see on Google that > > there have been quite a few. Thanks to all that have replied! Here's what > > I've done and discovered so far, but it's raised a few more questions as a > > result (isn't that always the way?). > > > > I put one rear tire up in the air, shifted into neutral, marked a spot on > > the tire, spun it twice and counted the number of turns of the driveshaft. > > This gave me about 3.08 ~ 3.10 turns for two tire rotations... accounting > > for any slop in the process, I'm guessing this means I have 3.07 gears on > > the rear. It's a 1994 with a 4.0L engine and a five speed manual > > transmission, which I'm assuming is reasonable. So then I tried this same > > procedure with the front, but... nothing. With one tire on the ground, one > > in the air, and the various gear selectors moved into all kinds of different > > positions (in gear, neutral, 2WD, 4WD, etc.) I couldn't get the driveshaft > > to move while I turned the wheel. I don't see any sort of locking mechanism > > on the wheel hubs, and the only tube running into the front differential > > that seems like it migh control something on the inside seems to only be a > > vent tube that runs up by the radiator, so I'm not sure what I'm missing > > here... sometimes you can turn the driveshaft by hand and get a very slight > > bit of movement in the wheel, but definitely nothing solid and absolutely > > not the other way around. Is there some different trick I should be trying > > here? I'm a stranger to the ways of 4WD, and my shop manual is still four > > days out, so I'm at a loss for what to try next. It seems to me the lgoic > > behind the procedure is sound, but then I could very well be overlooking > > something critical. > > > > The speedometer is most decidedly an electronic one and not cable driven, > > and presumably has been since the day it was born as the gauges have never > > been changed. The tires are slightly larger than the originals, but that > > was the case before the accident and the speedo offset due to that was a > > fairly minor one. Certainly not the 15 or so MPH it's reading off now. I > > see that quadratec.com sells a recalibration box, plus there's a bevy of > > potential speedometer gear changes that can be done, so once I figure out > > exactly why it's incorrect I'll make my next move. It is possible that some > > portion of the drivetrain was swapped out during the repair, especially > > considering how much cleaner the transmission is than various other parts of > > the car... but that information is only suggestive of what happened, and not > > conclusive. > > > > I'll get under there this weekend and pop out the current speedo gear to see > > what it is. I don't want to pop open the front differential cover and > > actually count gear teeth, but if that's the only solution then I will. > > It's probably overdue for a fluid change anyhow. There's also a temptation > > to just put the thing up on four stands and put it in gear to see what > > happens... might be a faster way of figuring out what's up with the front > > differential! > > > > Thanks again to everyone who has helped on this rather perplexing problem, > > hopefully I'll be to the bottom of it soon. > > > > Bryan -- Will Honea |
Re: Speedo wrong, but is that all?
Live and learn. Here I've been thinking that the one piece axle came
in with the TJ - now I've got to revise my shopping list again, since I'm looking for a SWB ride now. Took the wife back in the hills to look at the leaves turning and she decided that both she and the dog would really like it if I got something to supplement the MJ. I guess we all win one sometime <g>. On Sat, 4 Oct 2003 02:05:20 UTC Mike Romain <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote: > Man, you aren't going to be a happy camper when you open that front up. > > The 94's have a locked front axle setup, no vacuum or anything else to > turn it on. You spin one wheel in the air, the driveshaft must turn.... > > Mike > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > The Hurdy Gurdy Man wrote: > > > > I have what is clearly the world's worst news feed being that none of the > > replies to my original post have shown up yet, but I can see on Google that > > there have been quite a few. Thanks to all that have replied! Here's what > > I've done and discovered so far, but it's raised a few more questions as a > > result (isn't that always the way?). > > > > I put one rear tire up in the air, shifted into neutral, marked a spot on > > the tire, spun it twice and counted the number of turns of the driveshaft. > > This gave me about 3.08 ~ 3.10 turns for two tire rotations... accounting > > for any slop in the process, I'm guessing this means I have 3.07 gears on > > the rear. It's a 1994 with a 4.0L engine and a five speed manual > > transmission, which I'm assuming is reasonable. So then I tried this same > > procedure with the front, but... nothing. With one tire on the ground, one > > in the air, and the various gear selectors moved into all kinds of different > > positions (in gear, neutral, 2WD, 4WD, etc.) I couldn't get the driveshaft > > to move while I turned the wheel. I don't see any sort of locking mechanism > > on the wheel hubs, and the only tube running into the front differential > > that seems like it migh control something on the inside seems to only be a > > vent tube that runs up by the radiator, so I'm not sure what I'm missing > > here... sometimes you can turn the driveshaft by hand and get a very slight > > bit of movement in the wheel, but definitely nothing solid and absolutely > > not the other way around. Is there some different trick I should be trying > > here? I'm a stranger to the ways of 4WD, and my shop manual is still four > > days out, so I'm at a loss for what to try next. It seems to me the lgoic > > behind the procedure is sound, but then I could very well be overlooking > > something critical. > > > > The speedometer is most decidedly an electronic one and not cable driven, > > and presumably has been since the day it was born as the gauges have never > > been changed. The tires are slightly larger than the originals, but that > > was the case before the accident and the speedo offset due to that was a > > fairly minor one. Certainly not the 15 or so MPH it's reading off now. I > > see that quadratec.com sells a recalibration box, plus there's a bevy of > > potential speedometer gear changes that can be done, so once I figure out > > exactly why it's incorrect I'll make my next move. It is possible that some > > portion of the drivetrain was swapped out during the repair, especially > > considering how much cleaner the transmission is than various other parts of > > the car... but that information is only suggestive of what happened, and not > > conclusive. > > > > I'll get under there this weekend and pop out the current speedo gear to see > > what it is. I don't want to pop open the front differential cover and > > actually count gear teeth, but if that's the only solution then I will. > > It's probably overdue for a fluid change anyhow. There's also a temptation > > to just put the thing up on four stands and put it in gear to see what > > happens... might be a faster way of figuring out what's up with the front > > differential! > > > > Thanks again to everyone who has helped on this rather perplexing problem, > > hopefully I'll be to the bottom of it soon. > > > > Bryan -- Will Honea |
Re: Speedo wrong, but is that all?
I think I was mistaken...
Mike Will Honea wrote: > > Live and learn. Here I've been thinking that the one piece axle came > in with the TJ - now I've got to revise my shopping list again, since > I'm looking for a SWB ride now. Took the wife back in the hills to > look at the leaves turning and she decided that both she and the dog > would really like it if I got something to supplement the MJ. I guess > we all win one sometime <g>. > > On Sat, 4 Oct 2003 02:05:20 UTC Mike Romain <romainm@sympatico.ca> > wrote: > > > Man, you aren't going to be a happy camper when you open that front up. > > > > The 94's have a locked front axle setup, no vacuum or anything else to > > turn it on. You spin one wheel in the air, the driveshaft must turn.... > > > > Mike > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > > > The Hurdy Gurdy Man wrote: > > > > > > I have what is clearly the world's worst news feed being that none of the > > > replies to my original post have shown up yet, but I can see on Google that > > > there have been quite a few. Thanks to all that have replied! Here's what > > > I've done and discovered so far, but it's raised a few more questions as a > > > result (isn't that always the way?). > > > > > > I put one rear tire up in the air, shifted into neutral, marked a spot on > > > the tire, spun it twice and counted the number of turns of the driveshaft. > > > This gave me about 3.08 ~ 3.10 turns for two tire rotations... accounting > > > for any slop in the process, I'm guessing this means I have 3.07 gears on > > > the rear. It's a 1994 with a 4.0L engine and a five speed manual > > > transmission, which I'm assuming is reasonable. So then I tried this same > > > procedure with the front, but... nothing. With one tire on the ground, one > > > in the air, and the various gear selectors moved into all kinds of different > > > positions (in gear, neutral, 2WD, 4WD, etc.) I couldn't get the driveshaft > > > to move while I turned the wheel. I don't see any sort of locking mechanism > > > on the wheel hubs, and the only tube running into the front differential > > > that seems like it migh control something on the inside seems to only be a > > > vent tube that runs up by the radiator, so I'm not sure what I'm missing > > > here... sometimes you can turn the driveshaft by hand and get a very slight > > > bit of movement in the wheel, but definitely nothing solid and absolutely > > > not the other way around. Is there some different trick I should be trying > > > here? I'm a stranger to the ways of 4WD, and my shop manual is still four > > > days out, so I'm at a loss for what to try next. It seems to me the lgoic > > > behind the procedure is sound, but then I could very well be overlooking > > > something critical. > > > > > > The speedometer is most decidedly an electronic one and not cable driven, > > > and presumably has been since the day it was born as the gauges have never > > > been changed. The tires are slightly larger than the originals, but that > > > was the case before the accident and the speedo offset due to that was a > > > fairly minor one. Certainly not the 15 or so MPH it's reading off now. I > > > see that quadratec.com sells a recalibration box, plus there's a bevy of > > > potential speedometer gear changes that can be done, so once I figure out > > > exactly why it's incorrect I'll make my next move. It is possible that some > > > portion of the drivetrain was swapped out during the repair, especially > > > considering how much cleaner the transmission is than various other parts of > > > the car... but that information is only suggestive of what happened, and not > > > conclusive. > > > > > > I'll get under there this weekend and pop out the current speedo gear to see > > > what it is. I don't want to pop open the front differential cover and > > > actually count gear teeth, but if that's the only solution then I will. > > > It's probably overdue for a fluid change anyhow. There's also a temptation > > > to just put the thing up on four stands and put it in gear to see what > > > happens... might be a faster way of figuring out what's up with the front > > > differential! > > > > > > Thanks again to everyone who has helped on this rather perplexing problem, > > > hopefully I'll be to the bottom of it soon. > > > > > > Bryan > > -- > Will Honea |
Re: Speedo wrong, but is that all?
I think I was mistaken...
Mike Will Honea wrote: > > Live and learn. Here I've been thinking that the one piece axle came > in with the TJ - now I've got to revise my shopping list again, since > I'm looking for a SWB ride now. Took the wife back in the hills to > look at the leaves turning and she decided that both she and the dog > would really like it if I got something to supplement the MJ. I guess > we all win one sometime <g>. > > On Sat, 4 Oct 2003 02:05:20 UTC Mike Romain <romainm@sympatico.ca> > wrote: > > > Man, you aren't going to be a happy camper when you open that front up. > > > > The 94's have a locked front axle setup, no vacuum or anything else to > > turn it on. You spin one wheel in the air, the driveshaft must turn.... > > > > Mike > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > > > The Hurdy Gurdy Man wrote: > > > > > > I have what is clearly the world's worst news feed being that none of the > > > replies to my original post have shown up yet, but I can see on Google that > > > there have been quite a few. Thanks to all that have replied! Here's what > > > I've done and discovered so far, but it's raised a few more questions as a > > > result (isn't that always the way?). > > > > > > I put one rear tire up in the air, shifted into neutral, marked a spot on > > > the tire, spun it twice and counted the number of turns of the driveshaft. > > > This gave me about 3.08 ~ 3.10 turns for two tire rotations... accounting > > > for any slop in the process, I'm guessing this means I have 3.07 gears on > > > the rear. It's a 1994 with a 4.0L engine and a five speed manual > > > transmission, which I'm assuming is reasonable. So then I tried this same > > > procedure with the front, but... nothing. With one tire on the ground, one > > > in the air, and the various gear selectors moved into all kinds of different > > > positions (in gear, neutral, 2WD, 4WD, etc.) I couldn't get the driveshaft > > > to move while I turned the wheel. I don't see any sort of locking mechanism > > > on the wheel hubs, and the only tube running into the front differential > > > that seems like it migh control something on the inside seems to only be a > > > vent tube that runs up by the radiator, so I'm not sure what I'm missing > > > here... sometimes you can turn the driveshaft by hand and get a very slight > > > bit of movement in the wheel, but definitely nothing solid and absolutely > > > not the other way around. Is there some different trick I should be trying > > > here? I'm a stranger to the ways of 4WD, and my shop manual is still four > > > days out, so I'm at a loss for what to try next. It seems to me the lgoic > > > behind the procedure is sound, but then I could very well be overlooking > > > something critical. > > > > > > The speedometer is most decidedly an electronic one and not cable driven, > > > and presumably has been since the day it was born as the gauges have never > > > been changed. The tires are slightly larger than the originals, but that > > > was the case before the accident and the speedo offset due to that was a > > > fairly minor one. Certainly not the 15 or so MPH it's reading off now. I > > > see that quadratec.com sells a recalibration box, plus there's a bevy of > > > potential speedometer gear changes that can be done, so once I figure out > > > exactly why it's incorrect I'll make my next move. It is possible that some > > > portion of the drivetrain was swapped out during the repair, especially > > > considering how much cleaner the transmission is than various other parts of > > > the car... but that information is only suggestive of what happened, and not > > > conclusive. > > > > > > I'll get under there this weekend and pop out the current speedo gear to see > > > what it is. I don't want to pop open the front differential cover and > > > actually count gear teeth, but if that's the only solution then I will. > > > It's probably overdue for a fluid change anyhow. There's also a temptation > > > to just put the thing up on four stands and put it in gear to see what > > > happens... might be a faster way of figuring out what's up with the front > > > differential! > > > > > > Thanks again to everyone who has helped on this rather perplexing problem, > > > hopefully I'll be to the bottom of it soon. > > > > > > Bryan > > -- > Will Honea |
Re: Speedo wrong, but is that all?
I think I was mistaken...
Mike Will Honea wrote: > > Live and learn. Here I've been thinking that the one piece axle came > in with the TJ - now I've got to revise my shopping list again, since > I'm looking for a SWB ride now. Took the wife back in the hills to > look at the leaves turning and she decided that both she and the dog > would really like it if I got something to supplement the MJ. I guess > we all win one sometime <g>. > > On Sat, 4 Oct 2003 02:05:20 UTC Mike Romain <romainm@sympatico.ca> > wrote: > > > Man, you aren't going to be a happy camper when you open that front up. > > > > The 94's have a locked front axle setup, no vacuum or anything else to > > turn it on. You spin one wheel in the air, the driveshaft must turn.... > > > > Mike > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > > > The Hurdy Gurdy Man wrote: > > > > > > I have what is clearly the world's worst news feed being that none of the > > > replies to my original post have shown up yet, but I can see on Google that > > > there have been quite a few. Thanks to all that have replied! Here's what > > > I've done and discovered so far, but it's raised a few more questions as a > > > result (isn't that always the way?). > > > > > > I put one rear tire up in the air, shifted into neutral, marked a spot on > > > the tire, spun it twice and counted the number of turns of the driveshaft. > > > This gave me about 3.08 ~ 3.10 turns for two tire rotations... accounting > > > for any slop in the process, I'm guessing this means I have 3.07 gears on > > > the rear. It's a 1994 with a 4.0L engine and a five speed manual > > > transmission, which I'm assuming is reasonable. So then I tried this same > > > procedure with the front, but... nothing. With one tire on the ground, one > > > in the air, and the various gear selectors moved into all kinds of different > > > positions (in gear, neutral, 2WD, 4WD, etc.) I couldn't get the driveshaft > > > to move while I turned the wheel. I don't see any sort of locking mechanism > > > on the wheel hubs, and the only tube running into the front differential > > > that seems like it migh control something on the inside seems to only be a > > > vent tube that runs up by the radiator, so I'm not sure what I'm missing > > > here... sometimes you can turn the driveshaft by hand and get a very slight > > > bit of movement in the wheel, but definitely nothing solid and absolutely > > > not the other way around. Is there some different trick I should be trying > > > here? I'm a stranger to the ways of 4WD, and my shop manual is still four > > > days out, so I'm at a loss for what to try next. It seems to me the lgoic > > > behind the procedure is sound, but then I could very well be overlooking > > > something critical. > > > > > > The speedometer is most decidedly an electronic one and not cable driven, > > > and presumably has been since the day it was born as the gauges have never > > > been changed. The tires are slightly larger than the originals, but that > > > was the case before the accident and the speedo offset due to that was a > > > fairly minor one. Certainly not the 15 or so MPH it's reading off now. I > > > see that quadratec.com sells a recalibration box, plus there's a bevy of > > > potential speedometer gear changes that can be done, so once I figure out > > > exactly why it's incorrect I'll make my next move. It is possible that some > > > portion of the drivetrain was swapped out during the repair, especially > > > considering how much cleaner the transmission is than various other parts of > > > the car... but that information is only suggestive of what happened, and not > > > conclusive. > > > > > > I'll get under there this weekend and pop out the current speedo gear to see > > > what it is. I don't want to pop open the front differential cover and > > > actually count gear teeth, but if that's the only solution then I will. > > > It's probably overdue for a fluid change anyhow. There's also a temptation > > > to just put the thing up on four stands and put it in gear to see what > > > happens... might be a faster way of figuring out what's up with the front > > > differential! > > > > > > Thanks again to everyone who has helped on this rather perplexing problem, > > > hopefully I'll be to the bottom of it soon. > > > > > > Bryan > > -- > Will Honea |
Re: Speedo wrong, but is that all?
And have the engine running while jacked up, which a lot people
would feel uneasy about. God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ Mike Romain wrote: > > Up to a 95 has the vacuum disconnect? > > Ok, he just needs to put it in 4x4 and drive it a couple feet to click > it in then first. > > Mike |
Re: Speedo wrong, but is that all?
And have the engine running while jacked up, which a lot people
would feel uneasy about. God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ Mike Romain wrote: > > Up to a 95 has the vacuum disconnect? > > Ok, he just needs to put it in 4x4 and drive it a couple feet to click > it in then first. > > Mike |
Re: Speedo wrong, but is that all?
And have the engine running while jacked up, which a lot people
would feel uneasy about. God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ Mike Romain wrote: > > Up to a 95 has the vacuum disconnect? > > Ok, he just needs to put it in 4x4 and drive it a couple feet to click > it in then first. > > Mike |
Re: Speedo wrong, but is that all?
L.W.(?ill) ------ III <----------@cox.net> wrote:
> You have a YJ and the axle is disconnected because there is no > vacuum in the diagram controlling that lever. Ah, that would explain it... I had been looking at the differential housing itself for a clue instead of outside on the axle tubes... plus I was looking from the front, so I didn't see that vacuum motor-ish thingy hiding away. So I jacked up one wheel, started the car, and put it into 4WD... this seemed to do the trick, I was able to spin the wheel and subsequently rotate the driveshaft. Two turns of the wheel and I got a 3.07 ratio, which is excellent news for me. Thanks again to everyone who helped me sort this out! I still need to yank the current speedo gear and see what's up with that, but if that's why it's wrong I have to wonder how the wrong gear got put in there. If they swapped in a new transfer case and/or transmission, I hope that isn't a recipe for disaster... like if they put in parts that were originally meant for a smaller engine Jeep if it's the kind of thing where they won't survive behind the 4.0L for very long. Hopefully that's not the case, but I suppose looking at the speedo gear might give a clue. Especially if it's a gear for one of the other factory ratios that were available, maybe the entire transfer case was swapped out including the old speedo sender and replaced with one originally in a smaller engine Jeep. Eventually I'll get to the bottom of this, but for now it's good to know that the 4WD functionality is still there. Thanks again, everyone! Bryan |
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