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Carter carb replacment
My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a
carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock motor...the only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle WAY high...or so low it stalls. Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do I do with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to do with emissions. Any write ups would be great. Allen |
Re: Carter carb replacment
You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run like
crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are computer controlled. With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which clamps down on the mix and the timing advance. I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is tuned up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil and stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she will easily bury the spedo in 4th. Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for all carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will have any luck with any other carb either. Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in kits and kill the computers in the last couple months. Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are all needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. Mike 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock motor...the > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle WAY > high...or so low it stalls. > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do I do > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to do > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > Allen |
Re: Carter carb replacment
You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run like
crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are computer controlled. With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which clamps down on the mix and the timing advance. I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is tuned up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil and stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she will easily bury the spedo in 4th. Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for all carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will have any luck with any other carb either. Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in kits and kill the computers in the last couple months. Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are all needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. Mike 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock motor...the > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle WAY > high...or so low it stalls. > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do I do > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to do > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > Allen |
Re: Carter carb replacment
You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run like
crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are computer controlled. With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which clamps down on the mix and the timing advance. I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is tuned up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil and stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she will easily bury the spedo in 4th. Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for all carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will have any luck with any other carb either. Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in kits and kill the computers in the last couple months. Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are all needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. Mike 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock motor...the > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle WAY > high...or so low it stalls. > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do I do > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to do > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > Allen |
Re: Carter carb replacment
Have a look at this Allen:
http://www.off-road.com/jeep/tech/engine/carter.html This could fix your problem - it fixed mine. -- JimG 80' CJ-7 258 CID 35" BFG MT on 15x10 Centerlines D44 Rear, Dana 30 Front. SOA 4.56 Gears, LockRight F&R Dana 300 w/4:1 & Currie twin sticks Warn X8000i w/ dual batteries <ABanks5@columbus.rr.com> wrote in message news:BHZGb.34596$ms2.26308@fe2.columbus.rr.com... > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock motor...the > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle WAY > high...or so low it stalls. > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do I do > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to do > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > Allen > > |
Re: Carter carb replacment
Have a look at this Allen:
http://www.off-road.com/jeep/tech/engine/carter.html This could fix your problem - it fixed mine. -- JimG 80' CJ-7 258 CID 35" BFG MT on 15x10 Centerlines D44 Rear, Dana 30 Front. SOA 4.56 Gears, LockRight F&R Dana 300 w/4:1 & Currie twin sticks Warn X8000i w/ dual batteries <ABanks5@columbus.rr.com> wrote in message news:BHZGb.34596$ms2.26308@fe2.columbus.rr.com... > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock motor...the > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle WAY > high...or so low it stalls. > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do I do > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to do > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > Allen > > |
Re: Carter carb replacment
Have a look at this Allen:
http://www.off-road.com/jeep/tech/engine/carter.html This could fix your problem - it fixed mine. -- JimG 80' CJ-7 258 CID 35" BFG MT on 15x10 Centerlines D44 Rear, Dana 30 Front. SOA 4.56 Gears, LockRight F&R Dana 300 w/4:1 & Currie twin sticks Warn X8000i w/ dual batteries <ABanks5@columbus.rr.com> wrote in message news:BHZGb.34596$ms2.26308@fe2.columbus.rr.com... > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock motor...the > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle WAY > high...or so low it stalls. > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do I do > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to do > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > Allen > > |
Re: Carter carb replacment
Thanks Mike.
The funny thing is when I bought it in September...it idled excellent. I mean the thing ran great and I was so suprised because I've heard horror stories about the 258s. Now that the weather has gotten colder...the idle on this thing is crap...mostly runs WAY too high and on occasion will click down and run so low it'll stall. Even when it's completely warmed up...does the same thing. And doesn't the Weber replacement do away with the 02 sensor and computer?? Not sure on that one. I'm looking for the most simple swap possible..the MC2100 looks a bit troublesome for a guy who knows jack about carbs (ME!). Allen "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:3FEC73FA.84973ACA@sympatico.ca... > You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run like > crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. > > Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are > computer controlled. > > With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which clamps > down on the mix and the timing advance. > > I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so > you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. > > That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is tuned > up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil and > stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she > will easily bury the spedo in 4th. > > Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for all > carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will have > any luck with any other carb either. > > Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change > your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when > the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are > less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. > > Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in kits > and kill the computers in the last couple months. > > Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are all > needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. > > Mike > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock motor...the > > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to > > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the > > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle WAY > > high...or so low it stalls. > > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do I do > > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it > > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to do > > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > > Allen |
Re: Carter carb replacment
Thanks Mike.
The funny thing is when I bought it in September...it idled excellent. I mean the thing ran great and I was so suprised because I've heard horror stories about the 258s. Now that the weather has gotten colder...the idle on this thing is crap...mostly runs WAY too high and on occasion will click down and run so low it'll stall. Even when it's completely warmed up...does the same thing. And doesn't the Weber replacement do away with the 02 sensor and computer?? Not sure on that one. I'm looking for the most simple swap possible..the MC2100 looks a bit troublesome for a guy who knows jack about carbs (ME!). Allen "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:3FEC73FA.84973ACA@sympatico.ca... > You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run like > crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. > > Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are > computer controlled. > > With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which clamps > down on the mix and the timing advance. > > I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so > you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. > > That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is tuned > up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil and > stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she > will easily bury the spedo in 4th. > > Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for all > carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will have > any luck with any other carb either. > > Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change > your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when > the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are > less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. > > Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in kits > and kill the computers in the last couple months. > > Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are all > needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. > > Mike > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock motor...the > > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to > > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the > > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle WAY > > high...or so low it stalls. > > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do I do > > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it > > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to do > > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > > Allen |
Re: Carter carb replacment
Thanks Mike.
The funny thing is when I bought it in September...it idled excellent. I mean the thing ran great and I was so suprised because I've heard horror stories about the 258s. Now that the weather has gotten colder...the idle on this thing is crap...mostly runs WAY too high and on occasion will click down and run so low it'll stall. Even when it's completely warmed up...does the same thing. And doesn't the Weber replacement do away with the 02 sensor and computer?? Not sure on that one. I'm looking for the most simple swap possible..the MC2100 looks a bit troublesome for a guy who knows jack about carbs (ME!). Allen "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:3FEC73FA.84973ACA@sympatico.ca... > You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run like > crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. > > Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are > computer controlled. > > With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which clamps > down on the mix and the timing advance. > > I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so > you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. > > That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is tuned > up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil and > stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she > will easily bury the spedo in 4th. > > Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for all > carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will have > any luck with any other carb either. > > Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change > your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when > the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are > less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. > > Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in kits > and kill the computers in the last couple months. > > Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are all > needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. > > Mike > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock motor...the > > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to > > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the > > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle WAY > > high...or so low it stalls. > > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do I do > > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it > > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to do > > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > > Allen |
Re: Carter carb replacment
You are describing two different issues or 2 things messed up I think.
And no, the different carb just doesn't need the O2 or Computer, it doesn't do away with them, that damn computer is still trying to micro manage the timing advance and all the vacuum relays and it can't do it, so sets it at a predetermined 'base' setting so the Jeep can at least limp home. Folks can just put a carb on and set it the best it can get and the Jeep will run quite fine with a power compromise. The proper way is to dump the computer so you have full manual control on everything including the timing advance. You will get a 25% seat of the pants kick in power with no computer. 10 mph extra per gear at least. You are describing dirty parts on the choke fast idle linkage setup and you are describing dirt inside the carb plugging up the idle tubes. One gent that was over a couple weeks ago had that. We killed the computer, then took some WD40 and spray cleaned the choke linkage parts, concentrating on the plastic stepper thing. It then ran like crap at a low idle with the timing set up manually and the carb mix set manually. I had the air filter off and looked down the carb as it was running. I saw drips of gas coming down from one of the venturi nozzles. I upped the speed a bit by hand on the linkages and the drips got bigger and more. He said, 'oh no problem, it always idles like that'. LOL! He was so used to it, he thought it was normal. No way was I going to let him leave like that, so I pulled off the choke plate and undid the two screws holding the venturi cluster in the carb and wiggled the cluster out. One idle tube was blocked with a chunk of dirt. Cleaned it, put it back together and then it just purred..... We put our beers on the air filter and it didn't shake or bubble them when turning 750 rpm.... The Job took 1/2 an hour with me explaining to him what I was doing so he can do it himself if it happens again. On the trail I can have one cleaned and back on in 15 minutes flat. Here is a link on that low idle fix: http://www.off-road.com/jeep/tech/engine/carter.html But basically that carb is a really good one if treated right according to the 'book'. Clean it and put a kit in with every major tune or every set of plugs, change the gas filter every year and make sure it is in right side up. It has to be level with the center outlet going to the carb and the return line hooked to the top outlet. The return line has to be on top or gas will just syphon back to the tank making it not want to cold start. Mike ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > Thanks Mike. > The funny thing is when I bought it in September...it idled excellent. I > mean the thing ran great and I was so suprised because I've heard horror > stories about the 258s. Now that the weather has gotten colder...the idle on > this thing is crap...mostly runs WAY too high and on occasion will click > down and run so low it'll stall. Even when it's completely warmed up...does > the same thing. And doesn't the Weber replacement do away with the 02 sensor > and computer?? Not sure on that one. I'm looking for the most simple swap > possible..the MC2100 looks a bit troublesome for a guy who knows jack about > carbs (ME!). > Allen > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message > news:3FEC73FA.84973ACA@sympatico.ca... > > You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run like > > crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. > > > > Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are > > computer controlled. > > > > With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which clamps > > down on the mix and the timing advance. > > > > I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so > > you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. > > > > That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is tuned > > up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil and > > stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she > > will easily bury the spedo in 4th. > > > > Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for all > > carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will have > > any luck with any other carb either. > > > > Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change > > your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when > > the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are > > less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. > > > > Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in kits > > and kill the computers in the last couple months. > > > > Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are all > > needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. > > > > Mike > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > > > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > > > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock > motor...the > > > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > > > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to > > > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the > > > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle > WAY > > > high...or so low it stalls. > > > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do > I do > > > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it > > > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to > do > > > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > > > Allen |
Re: Carter carb replacment
You are describing two different issues or 2 things messed up I think.
And no, the different carb just doesn't need the O2 or Computer, it doesn't do away with them, that damn computer is still trying to micro manage the timing advance and all the vacuum relays and it can't do it, so sets it at a predetermined 'base' setting so the Jeep can at least limp home. Folks can just put a carb on and set it the best it can get and the Jeep will run quite fine with a power compromise. The proper way is to dump the computer so you have full manual control on everything including the timing advance. You will get a 25% seat of the pants kick in power with no computer. 10 mph extra per gear at least. You are describing dirty parts on the choke fast idle linkage setup and you are describing dirt inside the carb plugging up the idle tubes. One gent that was over a couple weeks ago had that. We killed the computer, then took some WD40 and spray cleaned the choke linkage parts, concentrating on the plastic stepper thing. It then ran like crap at a low idle with the timing set up manually and the carb mix set manually. I had the air filter off and looked down the carb as it was running. I saw drips of gas coming down from one of the venturi nozzles. I upped the speed a bit by hand on the linkages and the drips got bigger and more. He said, 'oh no problem, it always idles like that'. LOL! He was so used to it, he thought it was normal. No way was I going to let him leave like that, so I pulled off the choke plate and undid the two screws holding the venturi cluster in the carb and wiggled the cluster out. One idle tube was blocked with a chunk of dirt. Cleaned it, put it back together and then it just purred..... We put our beers on the air filter and it didn't shake or bubble them when turning 750 rpm.... The Job took 1/2 an hour with me explaining to him what I was doing so he can do it himself if it happens again. On the trail I can have one cleaned and back on in 15 minutes flat. Here is a link on that low idle fix: http://www.off-road.com/jeep/tech/engine/carter.html But basically that carb is a really good one if treated right according to the 'book'. Clean it and put a kit in with every major tune or every set of plugs, change the gas filter every year and make sure it is in right side up. It has to be level with the center outlet going to the carb and the return line hooked to the top outlet. The return line has to be on top or gas will just syphon back to the tank making it not want to cold start. Mike ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > Thanks Mike. > The funny thing is when I bought it in September...it idled excellent. I > mean the thing ran great and I was so suprised because I've heard horror > stories about the 258s. Now that the weather has gotten colder...the idle on > this thing is crap...mostly runs WAY too high and on occasion will click > down and run so low it'll stall. Even when it's completely warmed up...does > the same thing. And doesn't the Weber replacement do away with the 02 sensor > and computer?? Not sure on that one. I'm looking for the most simple swap > possible..the MC2100 looks a bit troublesome for a guy who knows jack about > carbs (ME!). > Allen > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message > news:3FEC73FA.84973ACA@sympatico.ca... > > You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run like > > crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. > > > > Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are > > computer controlled. > > > > With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which clamps > > down on the mix and the timing advance. > > > > I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so > > you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. > > > > That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is tuned > > up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil and > > stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she > > will easily bury the spedo in 4th. > > > > Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for all > > carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will have > > any luck with any other carb either. > > > > Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change > > your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when > > the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are > > less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. > > > > Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in kits > > and kill the computers in the last couple months. > > > > Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are all > > needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. > > > > Mike > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > > > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > > > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock > motor...the > > > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > > > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to > > > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the > > > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle > WAY > > > high...or so low it stalls. > > > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do > I do > > > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it > > > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to > do > > > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > > > Allen |
Re: Carter carb replacment
You are describing two different issues or 2 things messed up I think.
And no, the different carb just doesn't need the O2 or Computer, it doesn't do away with them, that damn computer is still trying to micro manage the timing advance and all the vacuum relays and it can't do it, so sets it at a predetermined 'base' setting so the Jeep can at least limp home. Folks can just put a carb on and set it the best it can get and the Jeep will run quite fine with a power compromise. The proper way is to dump the computer so you have full manual control on everything including the timing advance. You will get a 25% seat of the pants kick in power with no computer. 10 mph extra per gear at least. You are describing dirty parts on the choke fast idle linkage setup and you are describing dirt inside the carb plugging up the idle tubes. One gent that was over a couple weeks ago had that. We killed the computer, then took some WD40 and spray cleaned the choke linkage parts, concentrating on the plastic stepper thing. It then ran like crap at a low idle with the timing set up manually and the carb mix set manually. I had the air filter off and looked down the carb as it was running. I saw drips of gas coming down from one of the venturi nozzles. I upped the speed a bit by hand on the linkages and the drips got bigger and more. He said, 'oh no problem, it always idles like that'. LOL! He was so used to it, he thought it was normal. No way was I going to let him leave like that, so I pulled off the choke plate and undid the two screws holding the venturi cluster in the carb and wiggled the cluster out. One idle tube was blocked with a chunk of dirt. Cleaned it, put it back together and then it just purred..... We put our beers on the air filter and it didn't shake or bubble them when turning 750 rpm.... The Job took 1/2 an hour with me explaining to him what I was doing so he can do it himself if it happens again. On the trail I can have one cleaned and back on in 15 minutes flat. Here is a link on that low idle fix: http://www.off-road.com/jeep/tech/engine/carter.html But basically that carb is a really good one if treated right according to the 'book'. Clean it and put a kit in with every major tune or every set of plugs, change the gas filter every year and make sure it is in right side up. It has to be level with the center outlet going to the carb and the return line hooked to the top outlet. The return line has to be on top or gas will just syphon back to the tank making it not want to cold start. Mike ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > Thanks Mike. > The funny thing is when I bought it in September...it idled excellent. I > mean the thing ran great and I was so suprised because I've heard horror > stories about the 258s. Now that the weather has gotten colder...the idle on > this thing is crap...mostly runs WAY too high and on occasion will click > down and run so low it'll stall. Even when it's completely warmed up...does > the same thing. And doesn't the Weber replacement do away with the 02 sensor > and computer?? Not sure on that one. I'm looking for the most simple swap > possible..the MC2100 looks a bit troublesome for a guy who knows jack about > carbs (ME!). > Allen > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message > news:3FEC73FA.84973ACA@sympatico.ca... > > You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run like > > crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. > > > > Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are > > computer controlled. > > > > With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which clamps > > down on the mix and the timing advance. > > > > I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so > > you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. > > > > That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is tuned > > up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil and > > stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she > > will easily bury the spedo in 4th. > > > > Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for all > > carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will have > > any luck with any other carb either. > > > > Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change > > your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when > > the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are > > less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. > > > > Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in kits > > and kill the computers in the last couple months. > > > > Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are all > > needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. > > > > Mike > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > > > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > > > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock > motor...the > > > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > > > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to > > > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the > > > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle > WAY > > > high...or so low it stalls. > > > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do > I do > > > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it > > > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to > do > > > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > > > Allen |
Re: Carter carb replacment
"Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:3FEC8E20.DB1D8ADC@sympatico.ca... > ..... We put our beers on the air > filter and it didn't shake or bubble them when turning 750 rpm.... Excellent scientific test!!! > > Clean it and put a kit in with every major tune or every set of plugs, > change the gas filter every year and make sure it is in right side up. > It has to be level with the center outlet going to the carb and the > return line hooked to the top outlet. The return line has to be on top > or gas will just syphon back to the tank making it not want to cold > start. What kit are you referring to Mike? And is that something Autozone will carry? I'm getting ready to do that procedure you refered to this afternoon. You don't have a schematic of the carb do you? I'm trying to picture this choke linkage and what side of the carb it's on. Says something about drilling out a rivet...and without removing the carb I take it that it is on the driver's side. Thanks again! Allen >> > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > Thanks Mike. > > The funny thing is when I bought it in September...it idled excellent. I > > mean the thing ran great and I was so suprised because I've heard horror > > stories about the 258s. Now that the weather has gotten colder...the idle on > > this thing is crap...mostly runs WAY too high and on occasion will click > > down and run so low it'll stall. Even when it's completely warmed up...does > > the same thing. And doesn't the Weber replacement do away with the 02 sensor > > and computer?? Not sure on that one. I'm looking for the most simple swap > > possible..the MC2100 looks a bit troublesome for a guy who knows jack about > > carbs (ME!). > > Allen > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message > > news:3FEC73FA.84973ACA@sympatico.ca... > > > You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run like > > > crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. > > > > > > Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are > > > computer controlled. > > > > > > With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which clamps > > > down on the mix and the timing advance. > > > > > > I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so > > > you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. > > > > > > That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is tuned > > > up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil and > > > stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she > > > will easily bury the spedo in 4th. > > > > > > Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for all > > > carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will have > > > any luck with any other carb either. > > > > > > Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change > > > your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when > > > the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are > > > less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. > > > > > > Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in kits > > > and kill the computers in the last couple months. > > > > > > Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are all > > > needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. > > > > > > Mike > > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > > > > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > > > > > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > > > > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock > > motor...the > > > > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > > > > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to > > > > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the > > > > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle > > WAY > > > > high...or so low it stalls. > > > > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do > > I do > > > > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it > > > > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to > > do > > > > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > > > > Allen |
Re: Carter carb replacment
"Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:3FEC8E20.DB1D8ADC@sympatico.ca... > ..... We put our beers on the air > filter and it didn't shake or bubble them when turning 750 rpm.... Excellent scientific test!!! > > Clean it and put a kit in with every major tune or every set of plugs, > change the gas filter every year and make sure it is in right side up. > It has to be level with the center outlet going to the carb and the > return line hooked to the top outlet. The return line has to be on top > or gas will just syphon back to the tank making it not want to cold > start. What kit are you referring to Mike? And is that something Autozone will carry? I'm getting ready to do that procedure you refered to this afternoon. You don't have a schematic of the carb do you? I'm trying to picture this choke linkage and what side of the carb it's on. Says something about drilling out a rivet...and without removing the carb I take it that it is on the driver's side. Thanks again! Allen >> > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > Thanks Mike. > > The funny thing is when I bought it in September...it idled excellent. I > > mean the thing ran great and I was so suprised because I've heard horror > > stories about the 258s. Now that the weather has gotten colder...the idle on > > this thing is crap...mostly runs WAY too high and on occasion will click > > down and run so low it'll stall. Even when it's completely warmed up...does > > the same thing. And doesn't the Weber replacement do away with the 02 sensor > > and computer?? Not sure on that one. I'm looking for the most simple swap > > possible..the MC2100 looks a bit troublesome for a guy who knows jack about > > carbs (ME!). > > Allen > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message > > news:3FEC73FA.84973ACA@sympatico.ca... > > > You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run like > > > crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. > > > > > > Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are > > > computer controlled. > > > > > > With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which clamps > > > down on the mix and the timing advance. > > > > > > I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so > > > you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. > > > > > > That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is tuned > > > up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil and > > > stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she > > > will easily bury the spedo in 4th. > > > > > > Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for all > > > carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will have > > > any luck with any other carb either. > > > > > > Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change > > > your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when > > > the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are > > > less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. > > > > > > Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in kits > > > and kill the computers in the last couple months. > > > > > > Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are all > > > needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. > > > > > > Mike > > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > > > > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > > > > > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > > > > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock > > motor...the > > > > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > > > > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to > > > > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the > > > > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle > > WAY > > > > high...or so low it stalls. > > > > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do > > I do > > > > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it > > > > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to > > do > > > > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > > > > Allen |
Re: Carter carb replacment
"Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:3FEC8E20.DB1D8ADC@sympatico.ca... > ..... We put our beers on the air > filter and it didn't shake or bubble them when turning 750 rpm.... Excellent scientific test!!! > > Clean it and put a kit in with every major tune or every set of plugs, > change the gas filter every year and make sure it is in right side up. > It has to be level with the center outlet going to the carb and the > return line hooked to the top outlet. The return line has to be on top > or gas will just syphon back to the tank making it not want to cold > start. What kit are you referring to Mike? And is that something Autozone will carry? I'm getting ready to do that procedure you refered to this afternoon. You don't have a schematic of the carb do you? I'm trying to picture this choke linkage and what side of the carb it's on. Says something about drilling out a rivet...and without removing the carb I take it that it is on the driver's side. Thanks again! Allen >> > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > Thanks Mike. > > The funny thing is when I bought it in September...it idled excellent. I > > mean the thing ran great and I was so suprised because I've heard horror > > stories about the 258s. Now that the weather has gotten colder...the idle on > > this thing is crap...mostly runs WAY too high and on occasion will click > > down and run so low it'll stall. Even when it's completely warmed up...does > > the same thing. And doesn't the Weber replacement do away with the 02 sensor > > and computer?? Not sure on that one. I'm looking for the most simple swap > > possible..the MC2100 looks a bit troublesome for a guy who knows jack about > > carbs (ME!). > > Allen > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message > > news:3FEC73FA.84973ACA@sympatico.ca... > > > You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run like > > > crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. > > > > > > Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are > > > computer controlled. > > > > > > With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which clamps > > > down on the mix and the timing advance. > > > > > > I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so > > > you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. > > > > > > That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is tuned > > > up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil and > > > stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she > > > will easily bury the spedo in 4th. > > > > > > Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for all > > > carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will have > > > any luck with any other carb either. > > > > > > Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change > > > your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when > > > the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are > > > less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. > > > > > > Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in kits > > > and kill the computers in the last couple months. > > > > > > Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are all > > > needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. > > > > > > Mike > > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > > > > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > > > > > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > > > > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock > > motor...the > > > > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > > > > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to > > > > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the > > > > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle > > WAY > > > > high...or so low it stalls. > > > > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do > > I do > > > > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it > > > > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to > > do > > > > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > > > > Allen |
Re: Carter carb replacment
Almost sounds like the choke is not opening all the way and sometimes
you are stuck on the high idle cam and when it comes off the cam it drops too curb idle which might be set low. I would also take a look at the solvac and see what it is doing during these idle problems. Just a guess ...... experts here correct me if wrong. On Fri, 26 Dec 2003 18:26:36 GMT, <ABanks5@columbus.rr.com> wrote: >Thanks Mike. >The funny thing is when I bought it in September...it idled excellent. I >mean the thing ran great and I was so suprised because I've heard horror >stories about the 258s. Now that the weather has gotten colder...the idle on >this thing is crap...mostly runs WAY too high and on occasion will click >down and run so low it'll stall. Even when it's completely warmed up...does >the same thing. And doesn't the Weber replacement do away with the 02 sensor >and computer?? Not sure on that one. I'm looking for the most simple swap >possible..the MC2100 looks a bit troublesome for a guy who knows jack about >carbs (ME!). >Allen > >"Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message >news:3FEC73FA.84973ACA@sympatico.ca... >> You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run like >> crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. >> >> Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are >> computer controlled. >> >> With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which clamps >> down on the mix and the timing advance. >> >> I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so >> you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. >> >> That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is tuned >> up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil and >> stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she >> will easily bury the spedo in 4th. >> >> Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for all >> carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will have >> any luck with any other carb either. >> >> Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change >> your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when >> the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are >> less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. >> >> Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in kits >> and kill the computers in the last couple months. >> >> Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are all >> needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. >> >> Mike >> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 >> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's >> >> ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: >> > >> > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a >> > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock >motor...the >> > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub >> > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to >> > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the >> > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle >WAY >> > high...or so low it stalls. >> > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do >I do >> > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it >> > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to >do >> > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. >> > Allen > |
Re: Carter carb replacment
Almost sounds like the choke is not opening all the way and sometimes
you are stuck on the high idle cam and when it comes off the cam it drops too curb idle which might be set low. I would also take a look at the solvac and see what it is doing during these idle problems. Just a guess ...... experts here correct me if wrong. On Fri, 26 Dec 2003 18:26:36 GMT, <ABanks5@columbus.rr.com> wrote: >Thanks Mike. >The funny thing is when I bought it in September...it idled excellent. I >mean the thing ran great and I was so suprised because I've heard horror >stories about the 258s. Now that the weather has gotten colder...the idle on >this thing is crap...mostly runs WAY too high and on occasion will click >down and run so low it'll stall. Even when it's completely warmed up...does >the same thing. And doesn't the Weber replacement do away with the 02 sensor >and computer?? Not sure on that one. I'm looking for the most simple swap >possible..the MC2100 looks a bit troublesome for a guy who knows jack about >carbs (ME!). >Allen > >"Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message >news:3FEC73FA.84973ACA@sympatico.ca... >> You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run like >> crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. >> >> Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are >> computer controlled. >> >> With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which clamps >> down on the mix and the timing advance. >> >> I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so >> you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. >> >> That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is tuned >> up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil and >> stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she >> will easily bury the spedo in 4th. >> >> Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for all >> carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will have >> any luck with any other carb either. >> >> Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change >> your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when >> the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are >> less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. >> >> Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in kits >> and kill the computers in the last couple months. >> >> Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are all >> needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. >> >> Mike >> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 >> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's >> >> ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: >> > >> > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a >> > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock >motor...the >> > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub >> > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to >> > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the >> > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle >WAY >> > high...or so low it stalls. >> > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do >I do >> > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it >> > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to >do >> > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. >> > Allen > |
Re: Carter carb replacment
Almost sounds like the choke is not opening all the way and sometimes
you are stuck on the high idle cam and when it comes off the cam it drops too curb idle which might be set low. I would also take a look at the solvac and see what it is doing during these idle problems. Just a guess ...... experts here correct me if wrong. On Fri, 26 Dec 2003 18:26:36 GMT, <ABanks5@columbus.rr.com> wrote: >Thanks Mike. >The funny thing is when I bought it in September...it idled excellent. I >mean the thing ran great and I was so suprised because I've heard horror >stories about the 258s. Now that the weather has gotten colder...the idle on >this thing is crap...mostly runs WAY too high and on occasion will click >down and run so low it'll stall. Even when it's completely warmed up...does >the same thing. And doesn't the Weber replacement do away with the 02 sensor >and computer?? Not sure on that one. I'm looking for the most simple swap >possible..the MC2100 looks a bit troublesome for a guy who knows jack about >carbs (ME!). >Allen > >"Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message >news:3FEC73FA.84973ACA@sympatico.ca... >> You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run like >> crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. >> >> Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are >> computer controlled. >> >> With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which clamps >> down on the mix and the timing advance. >> >> I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so >> you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. >> >> That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is tuned >> up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil and >> stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she >> will easily bury the spedo in 4th. >> >> Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for all >> carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will have >> any luck with any other carb either. >> >> Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change >> your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when >> the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are >> less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. >> >> Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in kits >> and kill the computers in the last couple months. >> >> Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are all >> needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. >> >> Mike >> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 >> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's >> >> ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: >> > >> > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a >> > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock >motor...the >> > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub >> > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to >> > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the >> > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle >WAY >> > high...or so low it stalls. >> > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do >I do >> > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it >> > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to >do >> > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. >> > Allen > |
Re: Carter carb replacment
ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message > news:3FEC8E20.DB1D8ADC@sympatico.ca... > > ..... We put our beers on the air > > filter and it didn't shake or bubble them when turning 750 rpm.... > > Excellent scientific test!!! Works every time! BUT! If I need to set it on for the emissions sniffer, I have to lean it enough that the beer will start growing bubbles on the side of the bottle for the sniffer to like it. The long 6 is supposed to be a bit of a 'thumper' engine. It needs bubbles in the beer to pass.... If it just purrs at 750 rpm, it will be running a bit too rich for the sniffer. > > > > > Clean it and put a kit in with every major tune or every set of plugs, > > change the gas filter every year and make sure it is in right side up. > > It has to be level with the center outlet going to the carb and the > > return line hooked to the top outlet. The return line has to be on top > > or gas will just syphon back to the tank making it not want to cold > > start. > > What kit are you referring to Mike? And is that something Autozone will > carry? I'm getting ready to do that procedure you refered to this afternoon. > You don't have a schematic of the carb do you? I'm trying to picture this > choke linkage and what side of the carb it's on. Says something about > drilling out a rivet...and without removing the carb I take it that it is on > the driver's side. > Thanks again! > Allen Yes autozone should have the kits. Just a basic Carb Kit. They come with all the gaskets and a new float needle and seat and a new accelerator pump. The linkage that gets sticky is the plastic step thingie that the choke uses for the fast idle. It just plain gets dirty on the pivot point. WD40 is a good cleaner, but a carb cleaner spray is better, the real cleaner doesn't leave junk behind to attract more dirt. If you don't have to unscrew some of the parts to clean them when installing a kit, then DON'T! A lot of the adjustments given in the instructions for the kit are not needed. Most of the carb can come apart without unscrewing settings just to clean it. Some things you must unscrew like the idle Jets, but you just count the turns as you screw all of them in tight 'before' screwing them all the way out. That way when you put it back, you just screw it all the way tight again and back off the screws the same as they were. As you commented, it worked great a year ago, now it is time for a clean and it will work great at the same settings as last time it was cleaned. Trying to mess with settings to make up for dirt is a big pain in the butt, it will never stay stable and isn't the right way to do it except for a trail fix to keep you running. I wouldn't mind trying to help you put a kit in it via email. I do have some photos here showing the parts and what not to mess with or I can take a digital photo of some directions I have here to refer to. Mike > > >> > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > > > Thanks Mike. > > > The funny thing is when I bought it in September...it idled excellent. I > > > mean the thing ran great and I was so suprised because I've heard horror > > > stories about the 258s. Now that the weather has gotten colder...the > idle on > > > this thing is crap...mostly runs WAY too high and on occasion will click > > > down and run so low it'll stall. Even when it's completely warmed > up...does > > > the same thing. And doesn't the Weber replacement do away with the 02 > sensor > > > and computer?? Not sure on that one. I'm looking for the most simple > swap > > > possible..the MC2100 looks a bit troublesome for a guy who knows jack > about > > > carbs (ME!). > > > Allen > > > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message > > > news:3FEC73FA.84973ACA@sympatico.ca... > > > > You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run > like > > > > crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. > > > > > > > > Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are > > > > computer controlled. > > > > > > > > With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which > clamps > > > > down on the mix and the timing advance. > > > > > > > > I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so > > > > you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. > > > > > > > > That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is > tuned > > > > up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil > and > > > > stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she > > > > will easily bury the spedo in 4th. > > > > > > > > Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for > all > > > > carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will > have > > > > any luck with any other carb either. > > > > > > > > Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change > > > > your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when > > > > the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are > > > > less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. > > > > > > > > Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in > kits > > > > and kill the computers in the last couple months. > > > > > > > > Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are > all > > > > needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. > > > > > > > > Mike > > > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > > > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > > > > > > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > > > > > > > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > > > > > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock > > > motor...the > > > > > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > > > > > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it > comes to > > > > > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down > the > > > > > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either > idle > > > WAY > > > > > high...or so low it stalls. > > > > > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what > do > > > I do > > > > > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does > it > > > > > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that > have to > > > do > > > > > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > > > > > Allen |
Re: Carter carb replacment
ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message > news:3FEC8E20.DB1D8ADC@sympatico.ca... > > ..... We put our beers on the air > > filter and it didn't shake or bubble them when turning 750 rpm.... > > Excellent scientific test!!! Works every time! BUT! If I need to set it on for the emissions sniffer, I have to lean it enough that the beer will start growing bubbles on the side of the bottle for the sniffer to like it. The long 6 is supposed to be a bit of a 'thumper' engine. It needs bubbles in the beer to pass.... If it just purrs at 750 rpm, it will be running a bit too rich for the sniffer. > > > > > Clean it and put a kit in with every major tune or every set of plugs, > > change the gas filter every year and make sure it is in right side up. > > It has to be level with the center outlet going to the carb and the > > return line hooked to the top outlet. The return line has to be on top > > or gas will just syphon back to the tank making it not want to cold > > start. > > What kit are you referring to Mike? And is that something Autozone will > carry? I'm getting ready to do that procedure you refered to this afternoon. > You don't have a schematic of the carb do you? I'm trying to picture this > choke linkage and what side of the carb it's on. Says something about > drilling out a rivet...and without removing the carb I take it that it is on > the driver's side. > Thanks again! > Allen Yes autozone should have the kits. Just a basic Carb Kit. They come with all the gaskets and a new float needle and seat and a new accelerator pump. The linkage that gets sticky is the plastic step thingie that the choke uses for the fast idle. It just plain gets dirty on the pivot point. WD40 is a good cleaner, but a carb cleaner spray is better, the real cleaner doesn't leave junk behind to attract more dirt. If you don't have to unscrew some of the parts to clean them when installing a kit, then DON'T! A lot of the adjustments given in the instructions for the kit are not needed. Most of the carb can come apart without unscrewing settings just to clean it. Some things you must unscrew like the idle Jets, but you just count the turns as you screw all of them in tight 'before' screwing them all the way out. That way when you put it back, you just screw it all the way tight again and back off the screws the same as they were. As you commented, it worked great a year ago, now it is time for a clean and it will work great at the same settings as last time it was cleaned. Trying to mess with settings to make up for dirt is a big pain in the butt, it will never stay stable and isn't the right way to do it except for a trail fix to keep you running. I wouldn't mind trying to help you put a kit in it via email. I do have some photos here showing the parts and what not to mess with or I can take a digital photo of some directions I have here to refer to. Mike > > >> > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > > > Thanks Mike. > > > The funny thing is when I bought it in September...it idled excellent. I > > > mean the thing ran great and I was so suprised because I've heard horror > > > stories about the 258s. Now that the weather has gotten colder...the > idle on > > > this thing is crap...mostly runs WAY too high and on occasion will click > > > down and run so low it'll stall. Even when it's completely warmed > up...does > > > the same thing. And doesn't the Weber replacement do away with the 02 > sensor > > > and computer?? Not sure on that one. I'm looking for the most simple > swap > > > possible..the MC2100 looks a bit troublesome for a guy who knows jack > about > > > carbs (ME!). > > > Allen > > > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message > > > news:3FEC73FA.84973ACA@sympatico.ca... > > > > You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run > like > > > > crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. > > > > > > > > Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are > > > > computer controlled. > > > > > > > > With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which > clamps > > > > down on the mix and the timing advance. > > > > > > > > I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so > > > > you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. > > > > > > > > That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is > tuned > > > > up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil > and > > > > stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she > > > > will easily bury the spedo in 4th. > > > > > > > > Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for > all > > > > carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will > have > > > > any luck with any other carb either. > > > > > > > > Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change > > > > your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when > > > > the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are > > > > less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. > > > > > > > > Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in > kits > > > > and kill the computers in the last couple months. > > > > > > > > Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are > all > > > > needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. > > > > > > > > Mike > > > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > > > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > > > > > > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > > > > > > > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > > > > > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock > > > motor...the > > > > > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > > > > > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it > comes to > > > > > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down > the > > > > > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either > idle > > > WAY > > > > > high...or so low it stalls. > > > > > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what > do > > > I do > > > > > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does > it > > > > > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that > have to > > > do > > > > > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > > > > > Allen |
Re: Carter carb replacment
ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message > news:3FEC8E20.DB1D8ADC@sympatico.ca... > > ..... We put our beers on the air > > filter and it didn't shake or bubble them when turning 750 rpm.... > > Excellent scientific test!!! Works every time! BUT! If I need to set it on for the emissions sniffer, I have to lean it enough that the beer will start growing bubbles on the side of the bottle for the sniffer to like it. The long 6 is supposed to be a bit of a 'thumper' engine. It needs bubbles in the beer to pass.... If it just purrs at 750 rpm, it will be running a bit too rich for the sniffer. > > > > > Clean it and put a kit in with every major tune or every set of plugs, > > change the gas filter every year and make sure it is in right side up. > > It has to be level with the center outlet going to the carb and the > > return line hooked to the top outlet. The return line has to be on top > > or gas will just syphon back to the tank making it not want to cold > > start. > > What kit are you referring to Mike? And is that something Autozone will > carry? I'm getting ready to do that procedure you refered to this afternoon. > You don't have a schematic of the carb do you? I'm trying to picture this > choke linkage and what side of the carb it's on. Says something about > drilling out a rivet...and without removing the carb I take it that it is on > the driver's side. > Thanks again! > Allen Yes autozone should have the kits. Just a basic Carb Kit. They come with all the gaskets and a new float needle and seat and a new accelerator pump. The linkage that gets sticky is the plastic step thingie that the choke uses for the fast idle. It just plain gets dirty on the pivot point. WD40 is a good cleaner, but a carb cleaner spray is better, the real cleaner doesn't leave junk behind to attract more dirt. If you don't have to unscrew some of the parts to clean them when installing a kit, then DON'T! A lot of the adjustments given in the instructions for the kit are not needed. Most of the carb can come apart without unscrewing settings just to clean it. Some things you must unscrew like the idle Jets, but you just count the turns as you screw all of them in tight 'before' screwing them all the way out. That way when you put it back, you just screw it all the way tight again and back off the screws the same as they were. As you commented, it worked great a year ago, now it is time for a clean and it will work great at the same settings as last time it was cleaned. Trying to mess with settings to make up for dirt is a big pain in the butt, it will never stay stable and isn't the right way to do it except for a trail fix to keep you running. I wouldn't mind trying to help you put a kit in it via email. I do have some photos here showing the parts and what not to mess with or I can take a digital photo of some directions I have here to refer to. Mike > > >> > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > > > Thanks Mike. > > > The funny thing is when I bought it in September...it idled excellent. I > > > mean the thing ran great and I was so suprised because I've heard horror > > > stories about the 258s. Now that the weather has gotten colder...the > idle on > > > this thing is crap...mostly runs WAY too high and on occasion will click > > > down and run so low it'll stall. Even when it's completely warmed > up...does > > > the same thing. And doesn't the Weber replacement do away with the 02 > sensor > > > and computer?? Not sure on that one. I'm looking for the most simple > swap > > > possible..the MC2100 looks a bit troublesome for a guy who knows jack > about > > > carbs (ME!). > > > Allen > > > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message > > > news:3FEC73FA.84973ACA@sympatico.ca... > > > > You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run > like > > > > crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. > > > > > > > > Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are > > > > computer controlled. > > > > > > > > With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which > clamps > > > > down on the mix and the timing advance. > > > > > > > > I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so > > > > you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. > > > > > > > > That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is > tuned > > > > up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil > and > > > > stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she > > > > will easily bury the spedo in 4th. > > > > > > > > Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for > all > > > > carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will > have > > > > any luck with any other carb either. > > > > > > > > Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change > > > > your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when > > > > the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are > > > > less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. > > > > > > > > Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in > kits > > > > and kill the computers in the last couple months. > > > > > > > > Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are > all > > > > needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. > > > > > > > > Mike > > > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > > > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > > > > > > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > > > > > > > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > > > > > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock > > > motor...the > > > > > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > > > > > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it > comes to > > > > > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down > the > > > > > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either > idle > > > WAY > > > > > high...or so low it stalls. > > > > > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what > do > > > I do > > > > > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does > it > > > > > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that > have to > > > do > > > > > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > > > > > Allen |
Re: Carter carb replacment
Okay Mike...just was out checking things out. There are no drops of fuel
spilling over from the two venturi nozzles. I messed around with the high idle cam and curb idle screws (think that's the proper term for them) and finally got it to sit off the high idle cam and rest on the curb idle screw...set it correctly and everthing is great rpm wise. It still doesn't idle completely smooth....but foam won't roll out of a tall neck that's for sure! I'll have to wait until it's cold to see what she does now. It used to never want to jump off the cam to settle in the curb idle. The other thing I'd like to do eventually is get the O2 back in the loop but I have absolutely no idea where that thing hooks up to. There is a huge plug connector right off the O2 sensor that still remains but I can't locate the other wire that would have the other half of the connector on it. Any idea where this wire/connector comes from? Pictures would be great,...my Chiltons sucks @$$! Thanks again! Allen "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:3FEC9C76.203EFC7D@sympatico.ca... > > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message > > news:3FEC8E20.DB1D8ADC@sympatico.ca... > > > ..... We put our beers on the air > > > filter and it didn't shake or bubble them when turning 750 rpm.... > > > > Excellent scientific test!!! > > Works every time! > > BUT! If I need to set it on for the emissions sniffer, I have to lean > it enough that the beer will start growing bubbles on the side of the > bottle for the sniffer to like it. The long 6 is supposed to be a bit > of a 'thumper' engine. It needs bubbles in the beer to pass.... > > If it just purrs at 750 rpm, it will be running a bit too rich for the > sniffer. > > > > > > > > > Clean it and put a kit in with every major tune or every set of plugs, > > > change the gas filter every year and make sure it is in right side up. > > > It has to be level with the center outlet going to the carb and the > > > return line hooked to the top outlet. The return line has to be on top > > > or gas will just syphon back to the tank making it not want to cold > > > start. > > > > What kit are you referring to Mike? And is that something Autozone will > > carry? I'm getting ready to do that procedure you refered to this afternoon. > > You don't have a schematic of the carb do you? I'm trying to picture this > > choke linkage and what side of the carb it's on. Says something about > > drilling out a rivet...and without removing the carb I take it that it is on > > the driver's side. > > Thanks again! > > Allen > > Yes autozone should have the kits. Just a basic Carb Kit. They come > with all the gaskets and a new float needle and seat and a new > accelerator pump. > > The linkage that gets sticky is the plastic step thingie that the choke > uses for the fast idle. It just plain gets dirty on the pivot point. > WD40 is a good cleaner, but a carb cleaner spray is better, the real > cleaner doesn't leave junk behind to attract more dirt. > > If you don't have to unscrew some of the parts to clean them when > installing a kit, then DON'T! > > A lot of the adjustments given in the instructions for the kit are not > needed. Most of the carb can come apart without unscrewing settings > just to clean it. > > Some things you must unscrew like the idle Jets, but you just count the > turns as you screw all of them in tight 'before' screwing them all the > way out. That way when you put it back, you just screw it all the way > tight again and back off the screws the same as they were. > > As you commented, it worked great a year ago, now it is time for a clean > and it will work great at the same settings as last time it was cleaned. > > Trying to mess with settings to make up for dirt is a big pain in the > butt, it will never stay stable and isn't the right way to do it except > for a trail fix to keep you running. > > I wouldn't mind trying to help you put a kit in it via email. I do have > some photos here showing the parts and what not to mess with or I can > take a digital photo of some directions I have here to refer to. > > Mike > > > > > >> > > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > > > > > Thanks Mike. > > > > The funny thing is when I bought it in September...it idled excellent. I > > > > mean the thing ran great and I was so suprised because I've heard horror > > > > stories about the 258s. Now that the weather has gotten colder...the > > idle on > > > > this thing is crap...mostly runs WAY too high and on occasion will click > > > > down and run so low it'll stall. Even when it's completely warmed > > up...does > > > > the same thing. And doesn't the Weber replacement do away with the 02 > > sensor > > > > and computer?? Not sure on that one. I'm looking for the most simple > > swap > > > > possible..the MC2100 looks a bit troublesome for a guy who knows jack > > about > > > > carbs (ME!). > > > > Allen > > > > > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message > > > > news:3FEC73FA.84973ACA@sympatico.ca... > > > > > You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run > > like > > > > > crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. > > > > > > > > > > Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are > > > > > computer controlled. > > > > > > > > > > With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which > > clamps > > > > > down on the mix and the timing advance. > > > > > > > > > > I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so > > > > > you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. > > > > > > > > > > That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is > > tuned > > > > > up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil > > and > > > > > stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she > > > > > will easily bury the spedo in 4th. > > > > > > > > > > Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for > > all > > > > > carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will > > have > > > > > any luck with any other carb either. > > > > > > > > > > Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change > > > > > your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when > > > > > the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are > > > > > less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. > > > > > > > > > > Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in > > kits > > > > > and kill the computers in the last couple months. > > > > > > > > > > Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are > > all > > > > > needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. > > > > > > > > > > Mike > > > > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > > > > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > > > > > > > > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > > > > > > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock > > > > motor...the > > > > > > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > > > > > > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it > > comes to > > > > > > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down > > the > > > > > > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either > > idle > > > > WAY > > > > > > high...or so low it stalls. > > > > > > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what > > do > > > > I do > > > > > > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does > > it > > > > > > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that > > have to > > > > do > > > > > > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > > > > > > Allen |
Re: Carter carb replacment
Okay Mike...just was out checking things out. There are no drops of fuel
spilling over from the two venturi nozzles. I messed around with the high idle cam and curb idle screws (think that's the proper term for them) and finally got it to sit off the high idle cam and rest on the curb idle screw...set it correctly and everthing is great rpm wise. It still doesn't idle completely smooth....but foam won't roll out of a tall neck that's for sure! I'll have to wait until it's cold to see what she does now. It used to never want to jump off the cam to settle in the curb idle. The other thing I'd like to do eventually is get the O2 back in the loop but I have absolutely no idea where that thing hooks up to. There is a huge plug connector right off the O2 sensor that still remains but I can't locate the other wire that would have the other half of the connector on it. Any idea where this wire/connector comes from? Pictures would be great,...my Chiltons sucks @$$! Thanks again! Allen "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:3FEC9C76.203EFC7D@sympatico.ca... > > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message > > news:3FEC8E20.DB1D8ADC@sympatico.ca... > > > ..... We put our beers on the air > > > filter and it didn't shake or bubble them when turning 750 rpm.... > > > > Excellent scientific test!!! > > Works every time! > > BUT! If I need to set it on for the emissions sniffer, I have to lean > it enough that the beer will start growing bubbles on the side of the > bottle for the sniffer to like it. The long 6 is supposed to be a bit > of a 'thumper' engine. It needs bubbles in the beer to pass.... > > If it just purrs at 750 rpm, it will be running a bit too rich for the > sniffer. > > > > > > > > > Clean it and put a kit in with every major tune or every set of plugs, > > > change the gas filter every year and make sure it is in right side up. > > > It has to be level with the center outlet going to the carb and the > > > return line hooked to the top outlet. The return line has to be on top > > > or gas will just syphon back to the tank making it not want to cold > > > start. > > > > What kit are you referring to Mike? And is that something Autozone will > > carry? I'm getting ready to do that procedure you refered to this afternoon. > > You don't have a schematic of the carb do you? I'm trying to picture this > > choke linkage and what side of the carb it's on. Says something about > > drilling out a rivet...and without removing the carb I take it that it is on > > the driver's side. > > Thanks again! > > Allen > > Yes autozone should have the kits. Just a basic Carb Kit. They come > with all the gaskets and a new float needle and seat and a new > accelerator pump. > > The linkage that gets sticky is the plastic step thingie that the choke > uses for the fast idle. It just plain gets dirty on the pivot point. > WD40 is a good cleaner, but a carb cleaner spray is better, the real > cleaner doesn't leave junk behind to attract more dirt. > > If you don't have to unscrew some of the parts to clean them when > installing a kit, then DON'T! > > A lot of the adjustments given in the instructions for the kit are not > needed. Most of the carb can come apart without unscrewing settings > just to clean it. > > Some things you must unscrew like the idle Jets, but you just count the > turns as you screw all of them in tight 'before' screwing them all the > way out. That way when you put it back, you just screw it all the way > tight again and back off the screws the same as they were. > > As you commented, it worked great a year ago, now it is time for a clean > and it will work great at the same settings as last time it was cleaned. > > Trying to mess with settings to make up for dirt is a big pain in the > butt, it will never stay stable and isn't the right way to do it except > for a trail fix to keep you running. > > I wouldn't mind trying to help you put a kit in it via email. I do have > some photos here showing the parts and what not to mess with or I can > take a digital photo of some directions I have here to refer to. > > Mike > > > > > >> > > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > > > > > Thanks Mike. > > > > The funny thing is when I bought it in September...it idled excellent. I > > > > mean the thing ran great and I was so suprised because I've heard horror > > > > stories about the 258s. Now that the weather has gotten colder...the > > idle on > > > > this thing is crap...mostly runs WAY too high and on occasion will click > > > > down and run so low it'll stall. Even when it's completely warmed > > up...does > > > > the same thing. And doesn't the Weber replacement do away with the 02 > > sensor > > > > and computer?? Not sure on that one. I'm looking for the most simple > > swap > > > > possible..the MC2100 looks a bit troublesome for a guy who knows jack > > about > > > > carbs (ME!). > > > > Allen > > > > > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message > > > > news:3FEC73FA.84973ACA@sympatico.ca... > > > > > You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run > > like > > > > > crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. > > > > > > > > > > Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are > > > > > computer controlled. > > > > > > > > > > With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which > > clamps > > > > > down on the mix and the timing advance. > > > > > > > > > > I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so > > > > > you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. > > > > > > > > > > That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is > > tuned > > > > > up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil > > and > > > > > stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she > > > > > will easily bury the spedo in 4th. > > > > > > > > > > Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for > > all > > > > > carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will > > have > > > > > any luck with any other carb either. > > > > > > > > > > Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change > > > > > your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when > > > > > the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are > > > > > less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. > > > > > > > > > > Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in > > kits > > > > > and kill the computers in the last couple months. > > > > > > > > > > Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are > > all > > > > > needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. > > > > > > > > > > Mike > > > > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > > > > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > > > > > > > > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > > > > > > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock > > > > motor...the > > > > > > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > > > > > > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it > > comes to > > > > > > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down > > the > > > > > > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either > > idle > > > > WAY > > > > > > high...or so low it stalls. > > > > > > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what > > do > > > > I do > > > > > > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does > > it > > > > > > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that > > have to > > > > do > > > > > > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > > > > > > Allen |
Re: Carter carb replacment
Okay Mike...just was out checking things out. There are no drops of fuel
spilling over from the two venturi nozzles. I messed around with the high idle cam and curb idle screws (think that's the proper term for them) and finally got it to sit off the high idle cam and rest on the curb idle screw...set it correctly and everthing is great rpm wise. It still doesn't idle completely smooth....but foam won't roll out of a tall neck that's for sure! I'll have to wait until it's cold to see what she does now. It used to never want to jump off the cam to settle in the curb idle. The other thing I'd like to do eventually is get the O2 back in the loop but I have absolutely no idea where that thing hooks up to. There is a huge plug connector right off the O2 sensor that still remains but I can't locate the other wire that would have the other half of the connector on it. Any idea where this wire/connector comes from? Pictures would be great,...my Chiltons sucks @$$! Thanks again! Allen "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:3FEC9C76.203EFC7D@sympatico.ca... > > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message > > news:3FEC8E20.DB1D8ADC@sympatico.ca... > > > ..... We put our beers on the air > > > filter and it didn't shake or bubble them when turning 750 rpm.... > > > > Excellent scientific test!!! > > Works every time! > > BUT! If I need to set it on for the emissions sniffer, I have to lean > it enough that the beer will start growing bubbles on the side of the > bottle for the sniffer to like it. The long 6 is supposed to be a bit > of a 'thumper' engine. It needs bubbles in the beer to pass.... > > If it just purrs at 750 rpm, it will be running a bit too rich for the > sniffer. > > > > > > > > > Clean it and put a kit in with every major tune or every set of plugs, > > > change the gas filter every year and make sure it is in right side up. > > > It has to be level with the center outlet going to the carb and the > > > return line hooked to the top outlet. The return line has to be on top > > > or gas will just syphon back to the tank making it not want to cold > > > start. > > > > What kit are you referring to Mike? And is that something Autozone will > > carry? I'm getting ready to do that procedure you refered to this afternoon. > > You don't have a schematic of the carb do you? I'm trying to picture this > > choke linkage and what side of the carb it's on. Says something about > > drilling out a rivet...and without removing the carb I take it that it is on > > the driver's side. > > Thanks again! > > Allen > > Yes autozone should have the kits. Just a basic Carb Kit. They come > with all the gaskets and a new float needle and seat and a new > accelerator pump. > > The linkage that gets sticky is the plastic step thingie that the choke > uses for the fast idle. It just plain gets dirty on the pivot point. > WD40 is a good cleaner, but a carb cleaner spray is better, the real > cleaner doesn't leave junk behind to attract more dirt. > > If you don't have to unscrew some of the parts to clean them when > installing a kit, then DON'T! > > A lot of the adjustments given in the instructions for the kit are not > needed. Most of the carb can come apart without unscrewing settings > just to clean it. > > Some things you must unscrew like the idle Jets, but you just count the > turns as you screw all of them in tight 'before' screwing them all the > way out. That way when you put it back, you just screw it all the way > tight again and back off the screws the same as they were. > > As you commented, it worked great a year ago, now it is time for a clean > and it will work great at the same settings as last time it was cleaned. > > Trying to mess with settings to make up for dirt is a big pain in the > butt, it will never stay stable and isn't the right way to do it except > for a trail fix to keep you running. > > I wouldn't mind trying to help you put a kit in it via email. I do have > some photos here showing the parts and what not to mess with or I can > take a digital photo of some directions I have here to refer to. > > Mike > > > > > >> > > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > > > > > Thanks Mike. > > > > The funny thing is when I bought it in September...it idled excellent. I > > > > mean the thing ran great and I was so suprised because I've heard horror > > > > stories about the 258s. Now that the weather has gotten colder...the > > idle on > > > > this thing is crap...mostly runs WAY too high and on occasion will click > > > > down and run so low it'll stall. Even when it's completely warmed > > up...does > > > > the same thing. And doesn't the Weber replacement do away with the 02 > > sensor > > > > and computer?? Not sure on that one. I'm looking for the most simple > > swap > > > > possible..the MC2100 looks a bit troublesome for a guy who knows jack > > about > > > > carbs (ME!). > > > > Allen > > > > > > > > "Mike Romain" <romainm@sympatico.ca> wrote in message > > > > news:3FEC73FA.84973ACA@sympatico.ca... > > > > > You have a butchered wiring and computer setup that is going to run > > like > > > > > crap until you get it sorted out no matter what carb is on it. > > > > > > > > > > Stock the idle mix and half those vacuum lines and solenoids are > > > > > computer controlled. > > > > > > > > > > With no O2 sensor, the computer is stuck in limp home mode which > > clamps > > > > > down on the mix and the timing advance. > > > > > > > > > > I would recommend you at least put the computer out of your misery so > > > > > you can start to make sense of the rest of the system. > > > > > > > > > > That Carter carb you have on there is a very nice carb when it is > > tuned > > > > > up and clean. Mine goes like a scalded cat with just an Accel coil > > and > > > > > stock everything else. (no computer) I get a nice 19 US mpg and she > > > > > will easily bury the spedo in 4th. > > > > > > > > > > Carbs do take some tweaking to get them to run right. That goes for > > all > > > > > carbs, so if you can't get the Carter running, not likely you will > > have > > > > > any luck with any other carb either. > > > > > > > > > > Carbs are also supposed to get a kit put in them every time you change > > > > > your spark plugs according to the CJ owners manual. Do you know when > > > > > the last kit went in yours or when the last plugs went in? Kits are > > > > > less than $20.00 and are easy to put in. > > > > > > > > > > Too bad you don't live close to me. I have helped 3 people put in > > kits > > > > > and kill the computers in the last couple months. > > > > > > > > > > Things like the charcoal canister, PCV, EGR and air filter flaps are > > all > > > > > needed parts you cannot take off. The rest is mostly junk. > > > > > > > > > > Mike > > > > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > > > > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > > > > > > > > > ABanks5@columbus.rr.com wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > > > > > > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock > > > > motor...the > > > > > > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > > > > > > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it > > comes to > > > > > > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down > > the > > > > > > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either > > idle > > > > WAY > > > > > > high...or so low it stalls. > > > > > > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what > > do > > > > I do > > > > > > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does > > it > > > > > > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that > > have to > > > > do > > > > > > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > > > > > > Allen |
Re: Carter carb replacment
I replaced the Carter carb. on my '90 YJ 258ci about five years ago....the
Weber carb. has run much better in my experiences. The vacuum lines that are no longer used simply get plugged, but I think I only did that to only one or two vacuum lines after my conversion. In fact, it was this very group that I found a seller, who just purchased the EFI kit, and let the barely used Weber go for almost 1/2 of retail cost. <ABanks5@columbus.rr.com> wrote in message news:BHZGb.34596$ms2.26308@fe2.columbus.rr.com... > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock motor...the > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle WAY > high...or so low it stalls. > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do I do > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to do > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > Allen > > > |
Re: Carter carb replacment
I replaced the Carter carb. on my '90 YJ 258ci about five years ago....the
Weber carb. has run much better in my experiences. The vacuum lines that are no longer used simply get plugged, but I think I only did that to only one or two vacuum lines after my conversion. In fact, it was this very group that I found a seller, who just purchased the EFI kit, and let the barely used Weber go for almost 1/2 of retail cost. <ABanks5@columbus.rr.com> wrote in message news:BHZGb.34596$ms2.26308@fe2.columbus.rr.com... > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock motor...the > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle WAY > high...or so low it stalls. > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do I do > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to do > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > Allen > > > |
Re: Carter carb replacment
I replaced the Carter carb. on my '90 YJ 258ci about five years ago....the
Weber carb. has run much better in my experiences. The vacuum lines that are no longer used simply get plugged, but I think I only did that to only one or two vacuum lines after my conversion. In fact, it was this very group that I found a seller, who just purchased the EFI kit, and let the barely used Weber go for almost 1/2 of retail cost. <ABanks5@columbus.rr.com> wrote in message news:BHZGb.34596$ms2.26308@fe2.columbus.rr.com... > My 83 CJ7 has given up the ghost on the carb. I'm pretty sure it's a > carter....anyway to definitively tell? Anyway..it's a 258 stock motor...the > only bad thing is the PO disconnected the 02 sensor during a YJ tub > swap..there are a few things I can't find at the moment when it comes to > wiring inside the engine bay. The motor runs great when tooling down the > road but I can't get it to idle right. The choke wants to either idle WAY > high...or so low it stalls. > Question is what carb would you recommend replacing it with and what do I do > with all this emissions crap like the charcoal canister....or does it > matter...I think there are a few hoses coming from the carb that have to do > with emissions. Any write ups would be great. > Allen > > > |
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