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bad brakes
ok my setup on my 1989 cherokee is;
all rotors turned front pads from carquest they look like raybestos like new rear pads motorcraft like new master cyl from 1979 f150 1 1/16" bore rear brakes from 1998 explorer 8.8" rear the proportion valve seems right, as front and rear braking seems pretty equal and rear is working enough to get hot. problem is there just isnt enough stopping force to lock the tires up if i wanted. brake pedal is really firm so i dont think theres air in the system. booster seems a little weak but that shouldnt effect stopping power, only stopping effort? Would stainless brake lines help? maybe a master cyl from a disk brake truck or car? |
Re: bad brakes
"Erik Litchy" <erty0@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:tAz5d.29407$He1.21873@attbi_s01... > ok my setup on my 1989 cherokee is; > > all rotors turned > front pads from carquest they look like raybestos like new > rear pads motorcraft like new > > master cyl from 1979 f150 1 1/16" bore > rear brakes from 1998 explorer 8.8" rear > > > the proportion valve seems right, as front and rear braking seems pretty > equal and rear is working enough to get hot. > > problem is there just isnt enough stopping force to lock the tires up if > i wanted. brake pedal is really firm so i dont think theres air in the > system. booster seems a little weak but that shouldnt effect stopping > power, only stopping effort? Start here, you need the booster to "boost". > > > Would stainless brake lines help? maybe a master cyl from a disk brake > truck or car? JoBo |
Re: bad brakes
"Erik Litchy" <erty0@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:tAz5d.29407$He1.21873@attbi_s01... > ok my setup on my 1989 cherokee is; > > all rotors turned > front pads from carquest they look like raybestos like new > rear pads motorcraft like new > > master cyl from 1979 f150 1 1/16" bore > rear brakes from 1998 explorer 8.8" rear > > > the proportion valve seems right, as front and rear braking seems pretty > equal and rear is working enough to get hot. > > problem is there just isnt enough stopping force to lock the tires up if > i wanted. brake pedal is really firm so i dont think theres air in the > system. booster seems a little weak but that shouldnt effect stopping > power, only stopping effort? Start here, you need the booster to "boost". > > > Would stainless brake lines help? maybe a master cyl from a disk brake > truck or car? JoBo |
Re: bad brakes
"Erik Litchy" <erty0@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:tAz5d.29407$He1.21873@attbi_s01... > ok my setup on my 1989 cherokee is; > > all rotors turned > front pads from carquest they look like raybestos like new > rear pads motorcraft like new > > master cyl from 1979 f150 1 1/16" bore > rear brakes from 1998 explorer 8.8" rear > > > the proportion valve seems right, as front and rear braking seems pretty > equal and rear is working enough to get hot. > > problem is there just isnt enough stopping force to lock the tires up if > i wanted. brake pedal is really firm so i dont think theres air in the > system. booster seems a little weak but that shouldnt effect stopping > power, only stopping effort? Start here, you need the booster to "boost". > > > Would stainless brake lines help? maybe a master cyl from a disk brake > truck or car? JoBo |
Re: bad brakes
Why try and make some unsafe bastardized brake system?
The Cherokee's have been stopping fine since 1984 with their 'stock' setup.... The best you can expect with stock is to lock up the front wheels. The rear wheel will not lock up unless you are almost stopped. The combination valve does that to prevent rear wheel lock so you don't do 360's down the road anytime you jam on the brakes. Mike 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's Erik Litchy wrote: > > ok my setup on my 1989 cherokee is; > > all rotors turned > front pads from carquest they look like raybestos like new > rear pads motorcraft like new > > master cyl from 1979 f150 1 1/16" bore > rear brakes from 1998 explorer 8.8" rear > > the proportion valve seems right, as front and rear braking seems pretty > equal and rear is working enough to get hot. > > problem is there just isnt enough stopping force to lock the tires up if > i wanted. brake pedal is really firm so i dont think theres air in the > system. booster seems a little weak but that shouldnt effect stopping > power, only stopping effort? > > Would stainless brake lines help? maybe a master cyl from a disk brake > truck or car? |
Re: bad brakes
Why try and make some unsafe bastardized brake system?
The Cherokee's have been stopping fine since 1984 with their 'stock' setup.... The best you can expect with stock is to lock up the front wheels. The rear wheel will not lock up unless you are almost stopped. The combination valve does that to prevent rear wheel lock so you don't do 360's down the road anytime you jam on the brakes. Mike 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's Erik Litchy wrote: > > ok my setup on my 1989 cherokee is; > > all rotors turned > front pads from carquest they look like raybestos like new > rear pads motorcraft like new > > master cyl from 1979 f150 1 1/16" bore > rear brakes from 1998 explorer 8.8" rear > > the proportion valve seems right, as front and rear braking seems pretty > equal and rear is working enough to get hot. > > problem is there just isnt enough stopping force to lock the tires up if > i wanted. brake pedal is really firm so i dont think theres air in the > system. booster seems a little weak but that shouldnt effect stopping > power, only stopping effort? > > Would stainless brake lines help? maybe a master cyl from a disk brake > truck or car? |
Re: bad brakes
Why try and make some unsafe bastardized brake system?
The Cherokee's have been stopping fine since 1984 with their 'stock' setup.... The best you can expect with stock is to lock up the front wheels. The rear wheel will not lock up unless you are almost stopped. The combination valve does that to prevent rear wheel lock so you don't do 360's down the road anytime you jam on the brakes. Mike 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's Erik Litchy wrote: > > ok my setup on my 1989 cherokee is; > > all rotors turned > front pads from carquest they look like raybestos like new > rear pads motorcraft like new > > master cyl from 1979 f150 1 1/16" bore > rear brakes from 1998 explorer 8.8" rear > > the proportion valve seems right, as front and rear braking seems pretty > equal and rear is working enough to get hot. > > problem is there just isnt enough stopping force to lock the tires up if > i wanted. brake pedal is really firm so i dont think theres air in the > system. booster seems a little weak but that shouldnt effect stopping > power, only stopping effort? > > Would stainless brake lines help? maybe a master cyl from a disk brake > truck or car? |
Re: bad brakes
I am thinking the '89 only had a single diaphram booster. If you could get a
double diaphram booster, from like a '95, then it should be a double diaphram. This will add about 400PSI to your brake system. The easy way to check for single diaphram/double diaphram is: single diaphram is about 4.25" from MC mounting surface to the back where the brakets are, double diaphram are about 6". --James "Erik Litchy" <erty0@netscape.net> wrote in message news:tAz5d.29407$He1.21873@attbi_s01... > ok my setup on my 1989 cherokee is; > > all rotors turned > front pads from carquest they look like raybestos like new > rear pads motorcraft like new > > master cyl from 1979 f150 1 1/16" bore > rear brakes from 1998 explorer 8.8" rear > > > the proportion valve seems right, as front and rear braking seems pretty > equal and rear is working enough to get hot. > > problem is there just isnt enough stopping force to lock the tires up if > i wanted. brake pedal is really firm so i dont think theres air in the > system. booster seems a little weak but that shouldnt effect stopping > power, only stopping effort? > > > Would stainless brake lines help? maybe a master cyl from a disk brake > truck or car? |
Re: bad brakes
I am thinking the '89 only had a single diaphram booster. If you could get a
double diaphram booster, from like a '95, then it should be a double diaphram. This will add about 400PSI to your brake system. The easy way to check for single diaphram/double diaphram is: single diaphram is about 4.25" from MC mounting surface to the back where the brakets are, double diaphram are about 6". --James "Erik Litchy" <erty0@netscape.net> wrote in message news:tAz5d.29407$He1.21873@attbi_s01... > ok my setup on my 1989 cherokee is; > > all rotors turned > front pads from carquest they look like raybestos like new > rear pads motorcraft like new > > master cyl from 1979 f150 1 1/16" bore > rear brakes from 1998 explorer 8.8" rear > > > the proportion valve seems right, as front and rear braking seems pretty > equal and rear is working enough to get hot. > > problem is there just isnt enough stopping force to lock the tires up if > i wanted. brake pedal is really firm so i dont think theres air in the > system. booster seems a little weak but that shouldnt effect stopping > power, only stopping effort? > > > Would stainless brake lines help? maybe a master cyl from a disk brake > truck or car? |
Re: bad brakes
I am thinking the '89 only had a single diaphram booster. If you could get a
double diaphram booster, from like a '95, then it should be a double diaphram. This will add about 400PSI to your brake system. The easy way to check for single diaphram/double diaphram is: single diaphram is about 4.25" from MC mounting surface to the back where the brakets are, double diaphram are about 6". --James "Erik Litchy" <erty0@netscape.net> wrote in message news:tAz5d.29407$He1.21873@attbi_s01... > ok my setup on my 1989 cherokee is; > > all rotors turned > front pads from carquest they look like raybestos like new > rear pads motorcraft like new > > master cyl from 1979 f150 1 1/16" bore > rear brakes from 1998 explorer 8.8" rear > > > the proportion valve seems right, as front and rear braking seems pretty > equal and rear is working enough to get hot. > > problem is there just isnt enough stopping force to lock the tires up if > i wanted. brake pedal is really firm so i dont think theres air in the > system. booster seems a little weak but that shouldnt effect stopping > power, only stopping effort? > > > Would stainless brake lines help? maybe a master cyl from a disk brake > truck or car? |
Re: bad brakes
You want a smaller bore in your master cylinder.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ Erik Litchy wrote: > > ok my setup on my 1989 cherokee is; > > all rotors turned > front pads from carquest they look like raybestos like new > rear pads motorcraft like new > > master cyl from 1979 f150 1 1/16" bore > rear brakes from 1998 explorer 8.8" rear > > the proportion valve seems right, as front and rear braking seems pretty > equal and rear is working enough to get hot. > > problem is there just isnt enough stopping force to lock the tires up if > i wanted. brake pedal is really firm so i dont think theres air in the > system. booster seems a little weak but that shouldnt effect stopping > power, only stopping effort? > > Would stainless brake lines help? maybe a master cyl from a disk brake > truck or car? |
Re: bad brakes
You want a smaller bore in your master cylinder.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ Erik Litchy wrote: > > ok my setup on my 1989 cherokee is; > > all rotors turned > front pads from carquest they look like raybestos like new > rear pads motorcraft like new > > master cyl from 1979 f150 1 1/16" bore > rear brakes from 1998 explorer 8.8" rear > > the proportion valve seems right, as front and rear braking seems pretty > equal and rear is working enough to get hot. > > problem is there just isnt enough stopping force to lock the tires up if > i wanted. brake pedal is really firm so i dont think theres air in the > system. booster seems a little weak but that shouldnt effect stopping > power, only stopping effort? > > Would stainless brake lines help? maybe a master cyl from a disk brake > truck or car? |
Re: bad brakes
You want a smaller bore in your master cylinder.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ Erik Litchy wrote: > > ok my setup on my 1989 cherokee is; > > all rotors turned > front pads from carquest they look like raybestos like new > rear pads motorcraft like new > > master cyl from 1979 f150 1 1/16" bore > rear brakes from 1998 explorer 8.8" rear > > the proportion valve seems right, as front and rear braking seems pretty > equal and rear is working enough to get hot. > > problem is there just isnt enough stopping force to lock the tires up if > i wanted. brake pedal is really firm so i dont think theres air in the > system. booster seems a little weak but that shouldnt effect stopping > power, only stopping effort? > > Would stainless brake lines help? maybe a master cyl from a disk brake > truck or car? |
Re: bad brakes
L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> You want a smaller bore in your master cylinder. > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O why? the pedal can hit the floor with enough effort without stopping that quickly. wouldnt a smaller bore master push less fluid into the system, making longer stopping distances? or am i confused? it does have a single diaphram booster. |
Re: bad brakes
L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> You want a smaller bore in your master cylinder. > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O why? the pedal can hit the floor with enough effort without stopping that quickly. wouldnt a smaller bore master push less fluid into the system, making longer stopping distances? or am i confused? it does have a single diaphram booster. |
Re: bad brakes
L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> You want a smaller bore in your master cylinder. > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O why? the pedal can hit the floor with enough effort without stopping that quickly. wouldnt a smaller bore master push less fluid into the system, making longer stopping distances? or am i confused? it does have a single diaphram booster. |
Re: bad brakes
I hated the drum brakes in back. the adjusters constantly froze up or
the cable would break or fall off. sand/dirt would get inside and make everything wear out twice as fast. that and I stripped the pinion gear on my dana 35. I dont miss it. it has a lot less brake dive and seems more stable under braking now. Mike Romain wrote: > Why try and make some unsafe bastardized brake system? > > The Cherokee's have been stopping fine since 1984 with their 'stock' > setup.... > > The best you can expect with stock is to lock up the front wheels. The > rear wheel will not lock up unless you are almost stopped. The > combination valve does that to prevent rear wheel lock so you don't do > 360's down the road anytime you jam on the brakes. > > Mike > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > |
Re: bad brakes
I hated the drum brakes in back. the adjusters constantly froze up or
the cable would break or fall off. sand/dirt would get inside and make everything wear out twice as fast. that and I stripped the pinion gear on my dana 35. I dont miss it. it has a lot less brake dive and seems more stable under braking now. Mike Romain wrote: > Why try and make some unsafe bastardized brake system? > > The Cherokee's have been stopping fine since 1984 with their 'stock' > setup.... > > The best you can expect with stock is to lock up the front wheels. The > rear wheel will not lock up unless you are almost stopped. The > combination valve does that to prevent rear wheel lock so you don't do > 360's down the road anytime you jam on the brakes. > > Mike > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > |
Re: bad brakes
I hated the drum brakes in back. the adjusters constantly froze up or
the cable would break or fall off. sand/dirt would get inside and make everything wear out twice as fast. that and I stripped the pinion gear on my dana 35. I dont miss it. it has a lot less brake dive and seems more stable under braking now. Mike Romain wrote: > Why try and make some unsafe bastardized brake system? > > The Cherokee's have been stopping fine since 1984 with their 'stock' > setup.... > > The best you can expect with stock is to lock up the front wheels. The > rear wheel will not lock up unless you are almost stopped. The > combination valve does that to prevent rear wheel lock so you don't do > 360's down the road anytime you jam on the brakes. > > Mike > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > |
Re: bad brakes
Ahh....
Maybe the MC doesn't have enough stroke? or the bore? or more likely the proportioning valve isn't right for dual disks. I would be trying to find out what the bore and stroke are for the rears. Also drum and disks have different MC's. There is a backflow valve or something in the one of them. The Jeep drum brake MC will not work on a disk brake setup. Mike 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's Erik Litchy wrote: > > I hated the drum brakes in back. the adjusters constantly froze up or > the cable would break or fall off. sand/dirt would get inside and make > everything wear out twice as fast. that and I stripped the pinion gear > on my dana 35. I dont miss it. it has a lot less brake dive and seems > more stable under braking now. > > Mike Romain wrote: > > > Why try and make some unsafe bastardized brake system? > > > > The Cherokee's have been stopping fine since 1984 with their 'stock' > > setup.... > > > > The best you can expect with stock is to lock up the front wheels. The > > rear wheel will not lock up unless you are almost stopped. The > > combination valve does that to prevent rear wheel lock so you don't do > > 360's down the road anytime you jam on the brakes. > > > > Mike > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > |
Re: bad brakes
Ahh....
Maybe the MC doesn't have enough stroke? or the bore? or more likely the proportioning valve isn't right for dual disks. I would be trying to find out what the bore and stroke are for the rears. Also drum and disks have different MC's. There is a backflow valve or something in the one of them. The Jeep drum brake MC will not work on a disk brake setup. Mike 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's Erik Litchy wrote: > > I hated the drum brakes in back. the adjusters constantly froze up or > the cable would break or fall off. sand/dirt would get inside and make > everything wear out twice as fast. that and I stripped the pinion gear > on my dana 35. I dont miss it. it has a lot less brake dive and seems > more stable under braking now. > > Mike Romain wrote: > > > Why try and make some unsafe bastardized brake system? > > > > The Cherokee's have been stopping fine since 1984 with their 'stock' > > setup.... > > > > The best you can expect with stock is to lock up the front wheels. The > > rear wheel will not lock up unless you are almost stopped. The > > combination valve does that to prevent rear wheel lock so you don't do > > 360's down the road anytime you jam on the brakes. > > > > Mike > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > |
Re: bad brakes
Ahh....
Maybe the MC doesn't have enough stroke? or the bore? or more likely the proportioning valve isn't right for dual disks. I would be trying to find out what the bore and stroke are for the rears. Also drum and disks have different MC's. There is a backflow valve or something in the one of them. The Jeep drum brake MC will not work on a disk brake setup. Mike 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's Erik Litchy wrote: > > I hated the drum brakes in back. the adjusters constantly froze up or > the cable would break or fall off. sand/dirt would get inside and make > everything wear out twice as fast. that and I stripped the pinion gear > on my dana 35. I dont miss it. it has a lot less brake dive and seems > more stable under braking now. > > Mike Romain wrote: > > > Why try and make some unsafe bastardized brake system? > > > > The Cherokee's have been stopping fine since 1984 with their 'stock' > > setup.... > > > > The best you can expect with stock is to lock up the front wheels. The > > rear wheel will not lock up unless you are almost stopped. The > > combination valve does that to prevent rear wheel lock so you don't do > > 360's down the road anytime you jam on the brakes. > > > > Mike > > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > > |
Re: bad brakes
Physics, booster power on a smaller area equals more pressure. You
didn't tell us the pedal hit the floor, you need to bleed. God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ Erik Litchy wrote: > > why? the pedal can hit the floor with enough effort without stopping > that quickly. wouldnt a smaller bore master push less fluid into the > system, making longer stopping distances? > > or am i confused? > > it does have a single diaphram booster. |
Re: bad brakes
Physics, booster power on a smaller area equals more pressure. You
didn't tell us the pedal hit the floor, you need to bleed. God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ Erik Litchy wrote: > > why? the pedal can hit the floor with enough effort without stopping > that quickly. wouldnt a smaller bore master push less fluid into the > system, making longer stopping distances? > > or am i confused? > > it does have a single diaphram booster. |
Re: bad brakes
Physics, booster power on a smaller area equals more pressure. You
didn't tell us the pedal hit the floor, you need to bleed. God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ Erik Litchy wrote: > > why? the pedal can hit the floor with enough effort without stopping > that quickly. wouldnt a smaller bore master push less fluid into the > system, making longer stopping distances? > > or am i confused? > > it does have a single diaphram booster. |
Re: bad brakes
L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> Physics, booster power on a smaller area equals more pressure. You > didn't tell us the pedal hit the floor, you need to bleed. > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ > > Erik Litchy wrote: > >>why? the pedal can hit the floor with enough effort without stopping >>that quickly. wouldnt a smaller bore master push less fluid into the >>system, making longer stopping distances? >> >>or am i confused? >> >>it does have a single diaphram booster. well it takes a LOT of force to make it hit the floor. |
Re: bad brakes
L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> Physics, booster power on a smaller area equals more pressure. You > didn't tell us the pedal hit the floor, you need to bleed. > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ > > Erik Litchy wrote: > >>why? the pedal can hit the floor with enough effort without stopping >>that quickly. wouldnt a smaller bore master push less fluid into the >>system, making longer stopping distances? >> >>or am i confused? >> >>it does have a single diaphram booster. well it takes a LOT of force to make it hit the floor. |
Re: bad brakes
L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote:
> Physics, booster power on a smaller area equals more pressure. You > didn't tell us the pedal hit the floor, you need to bleed. > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ > > Erik Litchy wrote: > >>why? the pedal can hit the floor with enough effort without stopping >>that quickly. wouldnt a smaller bore master push less fluid into the >>system, making longer stopping distances? >> >>or am i confused? >> >>it does have a single diaphram booster. well it takes a LOT of force to make it hit the floor. |
Re: bad brakes
DON'T DRIVE IT UNTIL YOU FIX IT! Redesign/adjust the pedal lever,
booster, and/or master combination! God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ Erik Litchy wrote: > > well it takes a LOT of force to make it hit the floor. |
Re: bad brakes
DON'T DRIVE IT UNTIL YOU FIX IT! Redesign/adjust the pedal lever,
booster, and/or master combination! God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ Erik Litchy wrote: > > well it takes a LOT of force to make it hit the floor. |
Re: bad brakes
DON'T DRIVE IT UNTIL YOU FIX IT! Redesign/adjust the pedal lever,
booster, and/or master combination! God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ Erik Litchy wrote: > > well it takes a LOT of force to make it hit the floor. |
Re: bad brakes
Erik Litchy wrote:
> > L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote: > > > Physics, booster power on a smaller area equals more pressure. You > > didn't tell us the pedal hit the floor, you need to bleed. > > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O > > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ > > > > Erik Litchy wrote: > > > >>why? the pedal can hit the floor with enough effort without stopping > >>that quickly. wouldnt a smaller bore master push less fluid into the > >>system, making longer stopping distances? > >> > >>or am i confused? > >> > >>it does have a single diaphram booster. > > well it takes a LOT of force to make it hit the floor. You have air or maybe dead wheel hoses that are ballooning. My bet is air. Did you bench bleed the MC? Was the proportioning valve ever empty of fluid? If so there is likely a pin in the end of it that needs to be held or pushed depending on version to lock the guts so you can bleed the air out. If you don't do this, that valve will never get the air out and work and you can compress the pedal down if you really push on her. Mike 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's |
Re: bad brakes
Erik Litchy wrote:
> > L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote: > > > Physics, booster power on a smaller area equals more pressure. You > > didn't tell us the pedal hit the floor, you need to bleed. > > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O > > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ > > > > Erik Litchy wrote: > > > >>why? the pedal can hit the floor with enough effort without stopping > >>that quickly. wouldnt a smaller bore master push less fluid into the > >>system, making longer stopping distances? > >> > >>or am i confused? > >> > >>it does have a single diaphram booster. > > well it takes a LOT of force to make it hit the floor. You have air or maybe dead wheel hoses that are ballooning. My bet is air. Did you bench bleed the MC? Was the proportioning valve ever empty of fluid? If so there is likely a pin in the end of it that needs to be held or pushed depending on version to lock the guts so you can bleed the air out. If you don't do this, that valve will never get the air out and work and you can compress the pedal down if you really push on her. Mike 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's |
Re: bad brakes
Erik Litchy wrote:
> > L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote: > > > Physics, booster power on a smaller area equals more pressure. You > > didn't tell us the pedal hit the floor, you need to bleed. > > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O > > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ > > > > Erik Litchy wrote: > > > >>why? the pedal can hit the floor with enough effort without stopping > >>that quickly. wouldnt a smaller bore master push less fluid into the > >>system, making longer stopping distances? > >> > >>or am i confused? > >> > >>it does have a single diaphram booster. > > well it takes a LOT of force to make it hit the floor. You have air or maybe dead wheel hoses that are ballooning. My bet is air. Did you bench bleed the MC? Was the proportioning valve ever empty of fluid? If so there is likely a pin in the end of it that needs to be held or pushed depending on version to lock the guts so you can bleed the air out. If you don't do this, that valve will never get the air out and work and you can compress the pedal down if you really push on her. Mike 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's |
Re: bad brakes
My Jeeps brake booster died with only 700km on her.
Was heading out on my first camping trip (mountains in BC near Hope...awesome). Luckily I was stuck in a traffic jam on the highway and wasn't going faster than 15kph. First thing I noticed was my RPM's kickin up when I hit the brakes and found I was having trouble stopping. I actually had to pull myself down with the steering wheel and couldn't stop. Had to downshift and use the E-brake. Anyhow, I was close to a dealership and luckily the salesmen were still around (was 8pm or so). they were cool enough to give me the loner car for the w/e (damned frickin NEON car...got teased bad about that!). anyhow, they fixed it and it was covered, of course. the guy told me that it reverted to manual brakes....I kinda laughed. I've driven some manual brakes before and that wasn't what they reverted to....could've stopped better sticking my foot out the door! "Erik Litchy" <erty0@netscape.net> wrote in message news:7QF5d.57050$wV.49275@attbi_s54... > L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote: > > > Physics, booster power on a smaller area equals more pressure. You > > didn't tell us the pedal hit the floor, you need to bleed. > > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O > > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ > > > > Erik Litchy wrote: > > > >>why? the pedal can hit the floor with enough effort without stopping > >>that quickly. wouldnt a smaller bore master push less fluid into the > >>system, making longer stopping distances? > >> > >>or am i confused? > >> > >>it does have a single diaphram booster. > > > well it takes a LOT of force to make it hit the floor. |
Re: bad brakes
My Jeeps brake booster died with only 700km on her.
Was heading out on my first camping trip (mountains in BC near Hope...awesome). Luckily I was stuck in a traffic jam on the highway and wasn't going faster than 15kph. First thing I noticed was my RPM's kickin up when I hit the brakes and found I was having trouble stopping. I actually had to pull myself down with the steering wheel and couldn't stop. Had to downshift and use the E-brake. Anyhow, I was close to a dealership and luckily the salesmen were still around (was 8pm or so). they were cool enough to give me the loner car for the w/e (damned frickin NEON car...got teased bad about that!). anyhow, they fixed it and it was covered, of course. the guy told me that it reverted to manual brakes....I kinda laughed. I've driven some manual brakes before and that wasn't what they reverted to....could've stopped better sticking my foot out the door! "Erik Litchy" <erty0@netscape.net> wrote in message news:7QF5d.57050$wV.49275@attbi_s54... > L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote: > > > Physics, booster power on a smaller area equals more pressure. You > > didn't tell us the pedal hit the floor, you need to bleed. > > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O > > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ > > > > Erik Litchy wrote: > > > >>why? the pedal can hit the floor with enough effort without stopping > >>that quickly. wouldnt a smaller bore master push less fluid into the > >>system, making longer stopping distances? > >> > >>or am i confused? > >> > >>it does have a single diaphram booster. > > > well it takes a LOT of force to make it hit the floor. |
Re: bad brakes
My Jeeps brake booster died with only 700km on her.
Was heading out on my first camping trip (mountains in BC near Hope...awesome). Luckily I was stuck in a traffic jam on the highway and wasn't going faster than 15kph. First thing I noticed was my RPM's kickin up when I hit the brakes and found I was having trouble stopping. I actually had to pull myself down with the steering wheel and couldn't stop. Had to downshift and use the E-brake. Anyhow, I was close to a dealership and luckily the salesmen were still around (was 8pm or so). they were cool enough to give me the loner car for the w/e (damned frickin NEON car...got teased bad about that!). anyhow, they fixed it and it was covered, of course. the guy told me that it reverted to manual brakes....I kinda laughed. I've driven some manual brakes before and that wasn't what they reverted to....could've stopped better sticking my foot out the door! "Erik Litchy" <erty0@netscape.net> wrote in message news:7QF5d.57050$wV.49275@attbi_s54... > L.W.(ßill) ------ III wrote: > > > Physics, booster power on a smaller area equals more pressure. You > > didn't tell us the pedal hit the floor, you need to bleed. > > God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O > > mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ > > > > Erik Litchy wrote: > > > >>why? the pedal can hit the floor with enough effort without stopping > >>that quickly. wouldnt a smaller bore master push less fluid into the > >>system, making longer stopping distances? > >> > >>or am i confused? > >> > >>it does have a single diaphram booster. > > > well it takes a LOT of force to make it hit the floor. |
Re: bad brakes
Have a look at the MPI brakes site, some good info under thier Tech
Info section, lots more in thier catalog, you can download it as a PDF. http://www.mpbrakes.com/ Howard. On Sun, 26 Sep 2004 13:35:21 GMT, Erik Litchy <erty0@netscape.net> wrote: >ok my setup on my 1989 cherokee is; > >all rotors turned >front pads from carquest they look like raybestos like new >rear pads motorcraft like new > >master cyl from 1979 f150 1 1/16" bore >rear brakes from 1998 explorer 8.8" rear > > >the proportion valve seems right, as front and rear braking seems pretty >equal and rear is working enough to get hot. > >problem is there just isnt enough stopping force to lock the tires up if >i wanted. brake pedal is really firm so i dont think theres air in the >system. booster seems a little weak but that shouldnt effect stopping >power, only stopping effort? > > >Would stainless brake lines help? maybe a master cyl from a disk brake >truck or car? |
Re: bad brakes
Have a look at the MPI brakes site, some good info under thier Tech
Info section, lots more in thier catalog, you can download it as a PDF. http://www.mpbrakes.com/ Howard. On Sun, 26 Sep 2004 13:35:21 GMT, Erik Litchy <erty0@netscape.net> wrote: >ok my setup on my 1989 cherokee is; > >all rotors turned >front pads from carquest they look like raybestos like new >rear pads motorcraft like new > >master cyl from 1979 f150 1 1/16" bore >rear brakes from 1998 explorer 8.8" rear > > >the proportion valve seems right, as front and rear braking seems pretty >equal and rear is working enough to get hot. > >problem is there just isnt enough stopping force to lock the tires up if >i wanted. brake pedal is really firm so i dont think theres air in the >system. booster seems a little weak but that shouldnt effect stopping >power, only stopping effort? > > >Would stainless brake lines help? maybe a master cyl from a disk brake >truck or car? |
Re: bad brakes
Have a look at the MPI brakes site, some good info under thier Tech
Info section, lots more in thier catalog, you can download it as a PDF. http://www.mpbrakes.com/ Howard. On Sun, 26 Sep 2004 13:35:21 GMT, Erik Litchy <erty0@netscape.net> wrote: >ok my setup on my 1989 cherokee is; > >all rotors turned >front pads from carquest they look like raybestos like new >rear pads motorcraft like new > >master cyl from 1979 f150 1 1/16" bore >rear brakes from 1998 explorer 8.8" rear > > >the proportion valve seems right, as front and rear braking seems pretty >equal and rear is working enough to get hot. > >problem is there just isnt enough stopping force to lock the tires up if >i wanted. brake pedal is really firm so i dont think theres air in the >system. booster seems a little weak but that shouldnt effect stopping >power, only stopping effort? > > >Would stainless brake lines help? maybe a master cyl from a disk brake >truck or car? |
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