Re: 89 Chero auto trans mods, steering?
Historical note: On CJs, YJs, FSJs and other vehicles with proper leaf
springs on the front, you had to have a drop pitman arm with a lift kit, because the link from the pitman arm to the knuckle is designed to be horizontal in the rest position. On your vehicles with wussy coil spring front suspensions, there is a different steering link design, where it is more important that the links be parallel. Here use of a drop pitman arm is contraindicated. From what I have read here, some of the manufacturers of lift kits for these vehicles include a drop pitman arm, because customers expect it, because they can charge markup on it, or for some other reason not related to sound engineering principles. Earle "Stupendous Man" <spam@trap.com> wrote in message news:4etjloF1gcphaU1@individual.net... > There we go, the King of Links has come thru again. Thanks Bill. > > > Matt, whatever you call it it oversteers on the curves. > I'm not sure what you mean here, the stock setup should have parellel rods, > right? > Since I have a 4 inch Skyjacker lift, your statement seems to say the > opposite. A drop pitman arm on a lift is a bad thing? > > >The drag > > link should be parallel to the track bar or you will get bumpsteer. If the > > DL and TB are parallel you it's a stock pitman and you should be OK. If > > not, whoever installed the lift installed a drop pitman arm, and that's > > not good for the front suspension on an XJ, TJ, WJ or MJ. > > -- > Stupendous Man, > Defender of Freedom, Advocate of Liberty > > -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com |
Re: 89 Chero auto trans mods, steering?
Historical note: On CJs, YJs, FSJs and other vehicles with proper leaf
springs on the front, you had to have a drop pitman arm with a lift kit, because the link from the pitman arm to the knuckle is designed to be horizontal in the rest position. On your vehicles with wussy coil spring front suspensions, there is a different steering link design, where it is more important that the links be parallel. Here use of a drop pitman arm is contraindicated. From what I have read here, some of the manufacturers of lift kits for these vehicles include a drop pitman arm, because customers expect it, because they can charge markup on it, or for some other reason not related to sound engineering principles. Earle "Stupendous Man" <spam@trap.com> wrote in message news:4etjloF1gcphaU1@individual.net... > There we go, the King of Links has come thru again. Thanks Bill. > > > Matt, whatever you call it it oversteers on the curves. > I'm not sure what you mean here, the stock setup should have parellel rods, > right? > Since I have a 4 inch Skyjacker lift, your statement seems to say the > opposite. A drop pitman arm on a lift is a bad thing? > > >The drag > > link should be parallel to the track bar or you will get bumpsteer. If the > > DL and TB are parallel you it's a stock pitman and you should be OK. If > > not, whoever installed the lift installed a drop pitman arm, and that's > > not good for the front suspension on an XJ, TJ, WJ or MJ. > > -- > Stupendous Man, > Defender of Freedom, Advocate of Liberty > > -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com |
Re: 89 Chero auto trans mods, steering?
Ok, if a drop pitman arm is not recommended, what is the solution to get the
arms parellel? lower the steering box? -- Stupendous Man, Defender of Freedom, Advocate of Liberty |
Re: 89 Chero auto trans mods, steering?
Ok, if a drop pitman arm is not recommended, what is the solution to get the
arms parellel? lower the steering box? -- Stupendous Man, Defender of Freedom, Advocate of Liberty |
Re: 89 Chero auto trans mods, steering?
Ok, if a drop pitman arm is not recommended, what is the solution to get the
arms parellel? lower the steering box? -- Stupendous Man, Defender of Freedom, Advocate of Liberty |
Re: 89 Chero auto trans mods, steering?
I looked at the diagram of the steering components in the TJ FSM, and I just
couldn't figure out, why the engineers would take a system that works, and is possible to understand, and morph it into something like that. After you look at it a while, it starts to make some sense. How it works that is, not why they use the newer system. The important thing is that the track bar and the drag link be parallel, or approximately so, in the steering neutral, straight ahead, suspension neutral position. If you look at one of these front ends, and imagine the axle or the vehicle bouncing up and down, then it looks as if the track bar and the drag link follow each other fairly closely, with respect to angle, for quite a bit of spring travel. For a mild lift kit, they stay parallel enough, that a drop pitman arm would not be needed at all. For a more radical lift, then a mild drop pitman may be needed. From the pictures, I am thinking half the drop, that would be required with a YJ for example. Lowering the steering box would not be practical, although theoretically it would work. I hope this is some help. I don't have this type of steering myself. I have seen Cherokees, where it looks almost as if the drag link and the tie rod are both pointing straight down, and I have thought, "That can't be right!" But you have to look at the alignment between the track bar and the drag link, if there are bump steer problems. As always, the steering should be aligned properly too. Dropping or raising the suspension affects that, in a way that is different from the YJ/CJ steering linkage. Earle "Stupendous Man" <spam@trap.com> wrote in message news:4ettsvF1glkq2U1@individual.net... > Ok, if a drop pitman arm is not recommended, what is the solution to get the > arms parellel? lower the steering box? > -- > Stupendous Man, > Defender of Freedom, Advocate of Liberty > > |
Re: 89 Chero auto trans mods, steering?
I looked at the diagram of the steering components in the TJ FSM, and I just
couldn't figure out, why the engineers would take a system that works, and is possible to understand, and morph it into something like that. After you look at it a while, it starts to make some sense. How it works that is, not why they use the newer system. The important thing is that the track bar and the drag link be parallel, or approximately so, in the steering neutral, straight ahead, suspension neutral position. If you look at one of these front ends, and imagine the axle or the vehicle bouncing up and down, then it looks as if the track bar and the drag link follow each other fairly closely, with respect to angle, for quite a bit of spring travel. For a mild lift kit, they stay parallel enough, that a drop pitman arm would not be needed at all. For a more radical lift, then a mild drop pitman may be needed. From the pictures, I am thinking half the drop, that would be required with a YJ for example. Lowering the steering box would not be practical, although theoretically it would work. I hope this is some help. I don't have this type of steering myself. I have seen Cherokees, where it looks almost as if the drag link and the tie rod are both pointing straight down, and I have thought, "That can't be right!" But you have to look at the alignment between the track bar and the drag link, if there are bump steer problems. As always, the steering should be aligned properly too. Dropping or raising the suspension affects that, in a way that is different from the YJ/CJ steering linkage. Earle "Stupendous Man" <spam@trap.com> wrote in message news:4ettsvF1glkq2U1@individual.net... > Ok, if a drop pitman arm is not recommended, what is the solution to get the > arms parellel? lower the steering box? > -- > Stupendous Man, > Defender of Freedom, Advocate of Liberty > > |
Re: 89 Chero auto trans mods, steering?
I looked at the diagram of the steering components in the TJ FSM, and I just
couldn't figure out, why the engineers would take a system that works, and is possible to understand, and morph it into something like that. After you look at it a while, it starts to make some sense. How it works that is, not why they use the newer system. The important thing is that the track bar and the drag link be parallel, or approximately so, in the steering neutral, straight ahead, suspension neutral position. If you look at one of these front ends, and imagine the axle or the vehicle bouncing up and down, then it looks as if the track bar and the drag link follow each other fairly closely, with respect to angle, for quite a bit of spring travel. For a mild lift kit, they stay parallel enough, that a drop pitman arm would not be needed at all. For a more radical lift, then a mild drop pitman may be needed. From the pictures, I am thinking half the drop, that would be required with a YJ for example. Lowering the steering box would not be practical, although theoretically it would work. I hope this is some help. I don't have this type of steering myself. I have seen Cherokees, where it looks almost as if the drag link and the tie rod are both pointing straight down, and I have thought, "That can't be right!" But you have to look at the alignment between the track bar and the drag link, if there are bump steer problems. As always, the steering should be aligned properly too. Dropping or raising the suspension affects that, in a way that is different from the YJ/CJ steering linkage. Earle "Stupendous Man" <spam@trap.com> wrote in message news:4ettsvF1glkq2U1@individual.net... > Ok, if a drop pitman arm is not recommended, what is the solution to get the > arms parellel? lower the steering box? > -- > Stupendous Man, > Defender of Freedom, Advocate of Liberty > > |
Re: 89 Chero auto trans mods, steering?
Hi Pete,
You're just loosing traction with the road, better shocks may solve your problem. Bump steer, you may notice when you brake hard and the Jeep noses down and turns right, and then back left upon release. Most of us just get used to it rather than lower the tie rods (drag link on wannabees) in harms way. God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ Pete Stolz wrote: > > By bumpsteer, do you mean that each time you go over a bump the thing wants > to pitch sideways? I have this problem with my '02 Durango when I go over a > particular set of bumpy railroad tracks on a curved road at about 45 mph. > The dealership said "huh?" > Pete |
Re: 89 Chero auto trans mods, steering?
Hi Pete,
You're just loosing traction with the road, better shocks may solve your problem. Bump steer, you may notice when you brake hard and the Jeep noses down and turns right, and then back left upon release. Most of us just get used to it rather than lower the tie rods (drag link on wannabees) in harms way. God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O mailto:-------------------- http://www.----------.com/ Pete Stolz wrote: > > By bumpsteer, do you mean that each time you go over a bump the thing wants > to pitch sideways? I have this problem with my '02 Durango when I go over a > particular set of bumpy railroad tracks on a curved road at about 45 mph. > The dealership said "huh?" > Pete |
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